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Davis937
05-25-2010, 12:43 AM
This will be an unusual question ... I'm positive that it has not yet been posed on this forum ... I was wondering if you ended up marrying the person (man or woman) that you loved the most in your life ... I'll start off by saying (... good thing this is anonymous ... hope it is!) that I did not ... I've had four serious relationships in my life ... the lady I loved the most was, oddly enough, the partner that I had the most difficult /challenging relationship problems with (a long list) ... I ended up marrying someone else ... so, how about you ... my contention is that most of us, for a variety of reasons, do not end up marrying that person that we have the most love for ...

Davis937
05-25-2010, 09:22 AM
Hmmm ... maybe I'm in the minority after all ... any feedback/comments are welcome!

drakulie
05-25-2010, 09:33 AM
Hmmmm. intersting question. How does one truly define or put a value on love? I believe I undertand your point, though, and definitely undertand your point about "the one you loved most, you also had the most difficulty with". This is most likely because there was a lot of passion involved in this relationship, that made the feelings that much more intense.

I myself could easily say I have truly "loved" or been "in love" with 2 lovely ladies. Each of these relationships (good and bad) taught me things that made my next relationship better/easier, and without so much headache. Now I'm on my 3rd "love", and thankfully, I have the memories and lessons of the other two to guide me thru this one, which has been very smooth, and as a result, am getting married in about two weeks. :) I no longer make the same mistakes, and am a more rounded person, less selfish, and easier to talk to. I am also more comfortable in my skin because of the two past relationships. I thank all the lovely ladies who helped make drak who he is today. :)

can I truly say I love this one more than the other two?? Not really, but what I can say is my understanding of the word and what it means in my relationship makes this relationship much better, and to a degree, makes me value her much more. So in a way, Yes, I love her more fully, and completely. Hope that makes sense.

rommil
05-25-2010, 09:36 AM
Hey Drak, congrats!

drakulie
05-25-2010, 09:39 AM
Many thanks!! :)

although I will probably miss the FO semis because of the wedding. Damn!!! anyways, perhaps I'll post some photos.

Chris Rizutto
05-25-2010, 09:47 AM
I bet you didn't marry the one you loved most because she didn't feel the same way or she was a massive pain in the azz. High maintenance women are not worth the time, money or effort.

rommil
05-25-2010, 09:47 AM
You have a good reason for missing it. After you say "I do" just do the Nadal fistpump and yell "vamos". It will feel like you didnt miss anything at all. Nike bandana is optional lol.
Have fun and again congrats!

Kevin T
05-25-2010, 09:52 AM
This will be an unusual question ... I'm positive that it has not yet been posed on this forum ... I was wondering if you ended up marrying the person (man or woman) that you loved the most in your life ... I'll start off by saying (... good thing this is anonymous ... hope it is!) that I did not ... I've had four serious relationships in my life ... the lady I loved the most was, oddly enough, the partner that I had the most difficult /challenging relationship problems with (a long list) ... I ended up marrying someone else ... so, how about you ... my contention is that most of us, for a variety of reasons, do not end up marrying that person that we have the most love for ...

I hope your wife doesn't read this!! :) Good topic. Prior to my wife, I was in a 10 year relationship with someone I thought I would be with forever. We had similar interests, loved the same music, played tennis together, loved to cook, enjoyed fine food/drinks. Physical parts of the relationship were other-worldly. :) But she was dishonest about deep-seated psych issues with me that only surfaced years into the relationship. I did my best to help out, got appointments with the best docs/specialists. She could be happy one minute, then virtually suicidal the next. She gave new meaning to the term jealousy, even with totally plutonic female friends from college, etc. One day she just came in and said " I don't want this anymore" and left, no ifs, ands or buts. No chance of counseling, etc. Just gone. I took it hard for a year or so but soon realized all the good was really outweighed by the bad. We fought a lot and she could get batsh*t crazy. :) Our relationship was eighter a 10 or a 1, no in between.

But everything with my wife is soooo easy. We never fight. We have a number of different interests but plenty similar. She's cool as a cucumber. Her attitude is the same as my favorite girlfriend from college...I know who you're coming home with. Women can flirt with me when I'm out (I bartended in college, so it was a daily thing), though I don't return the favor (usually :)), but she knows where my bread is buttered. She's so confident/sure of herself. Pretty much every day is pleasant. Do we have that explosive connection that I had with girl #1? Maybe not but it's very close. And I appreciate every other aspect of life so much that I couldn't be happier. Like Drakulie said, you live and learn. If girl #1 was still in my life, we would be totally miserable. She was good for my 20's but not my 30's. I try to look at things like that. Every relationship happened for a reason and lead me to this point in life. I literally would nevr have met my wife without dating #1 because at the time, she convinced me to move somewhere I was against. But it worked out great for me! My wife is who I was meant to be with and someone I can imagine growing old with. Good luck.

drakulie
05-25-2010, 10:01 AM
You have a good reason for missing it. After you say "I do" just do the Nadal fistpump and yell "vamos". It will feel like you didnt miss anything at all. Nike bandana is optional lol.
Have fun and again congrats!


LOL. This is actually pretty funny because we are having a tennis theme wedding. She chose this them since we both play tennis, and met on the courts. We were actually very close to being married in tennis clothes, so the bandana and "vamos" would have been fitting. In the end, we decided to go more traditional with the suit/dress, but are still being Wed on a tennis court, and still have the tennis theme going. We actually named all the tables for the reception after some of the all time greats, and will have a buffet, rather than meal served, which will include food from each of the slams.

rommil
05-25-2010, 10:04 AM
^^^^Niiiice. How cool is that? Make sure you post pics here when you come back.



PS....Don't you feel lucky you have a tennis playing spouse?

drakulie
05-25-2010, 10:12 AM
^^not when she is returning my serve. :) She was an extremly high level player, so is VERY good.

But yes, I feel very lucky she plays and loves tennis as much as I do, but more importantly, that we get along so well. I'll post some photos, and thanks for the well-wishes.

sureshs
05-25-2010, 11:35 AM
Hmmmm. intersting question. How does one truly define or put a value on love? I believe I undertand your point, though, and definitely undertand your point about "the one you loved most, you also had the most difficulty with". This is most likely because there was a lot of passion involved in this relationship, that made the feelings that much more intense.

I myself could easily say I have truly "loved" or been "in love" with 2 lovely ladies. Each of these relationships (good and bad) taught me things that made my next relationship better/easier, and without so much headache. Now I'm on my 3rd "love", and thankfully, I have the memories and lessons of the other two to guide me thru this one, which has been very smooth, and as a result, am getting married in about two weeks. :) I no longer make the same mistakes, and am a more rounded person, less selfish, and easier to talk to. I am also more comfortable in my skin because of the two past relationships. I thank all the lovely ladies who helped make drak who he is today. :)

can I truly say I love this one more than the other two?? Not really, but what I can say is my understanding of the word and what it means in my relationship makes this relationship much better, and to a degree, makes me value her much more. So in a way, Yes, I love her more fully, and completely. Hope that makes sense.

Congrats! May you be able to continue to play tennis (and more importantly, post here) after the marriage.

sureshs
05-25-2010, 11:38 AM
We actually named all the tables for the reception after some of the all time greats, and will have a buffet, rather than meal served, which will include food from each of the slams.

A Nadal tapas table?

Rockitdog
05-25-2010, 12:29 PM
I can honestly say I did not love the person I love(ed) the most. I wish I could say that but cannot. I've never felt the same way about anyone as I felt for my first love - 15 years later (married for 7). I don't think this is as unusal as the OP might suspect.

r2473
05-25-2010, 01:01 PM
I get my relationship / marriage advice from Woody Allen:

From the movie
Love and Death

-Love is everything, Boris.
I wanna meet some man
and scale the heights of passion
Some man who embodies
the three great aspects of love.
Intellectual, spiritual and sensual.

-Well, there's not too many of us
around, but it can be done.

- So many women settle cheaply.
- I know. Poor things.

- They marry for money.
- Money! Well, money.

-But I feel as though
my life would be wasted
if I didn't love deeply
with a man whose mind I respected,
whose spirituality equalled mine,
and who had the same lustful appetite
for sensual passion that drives me insane.

-You're an incredibly complex woman.

-I guess you could say
I'm half saint, half wh0re.

-Here's hoping I get the half that eats.

goran_ace
05-25-2010, 01:04 PM
A Nadal tapas table?

Federer fondue?

drakulie
05-25-2010, 02:09 PM
A Nadal tapas table?

Yes, one of the tables is named after Nadal .

Cindysphinx
05-25-2010, 02:15 PM
Re OP:

The things that you love love love about a person may in fact be things that aren't good for you personally or relationship-wise.

I think the type of love that works best for marriage is when the person you love brings out the best in you.

To Drakulie:

Best wishes!!!!!!!

sureshs
05-25-2010, 02:32 PM
Yes, one of the tables is named after Nadal .

Is it for "finger food?" LOL that was a great joke.

sureshs
05-25-2010, 02:32 PM
Re OP:

The things that you love love love about a person may in fact be things that aren't good for you personally or relationship-wise.

I think the type of love that works best for marriage is when the person you love brings out the best in you.

To Drakulie:

Best wishes!!!!!!!

I have a separate thread for the wishes

cucio
05-25-2010, 02:34 PM
She gave new meaning to the term jealousy, even with totally plutonic female friends from college, etc.

You know what they say about those plutonic chicks... they are da bomb (rimshot) :)

Yes, one of the tables is named after Nadal .

Are you serving roids to your guests? Not cool, bro. BTW, any available seats in the Gasquet table? :)

r2473
05-25-2010, 02:55 PM
You know what they say about those plutonic chicks... they are da bomb (rimshot) :)

That was actually pretty funny.

Kevin T
05-25-2010, 03:07 PM
[QUOTE=cucio;4687417]You know what they say about those plutonic chicks... they are da bomb (rimshot) :)


Nice!! I was listening to The Gap Band's "You dropped the bomb on me" while writing that line. :) Err....ummm.....platonic...not plutonic/radioactive.

albino smurf
05-25-2010, 03:33 PM
Yes. I am a lucky man.

Talker
05-25-2010, 05:08 PM
Married people are not with the best person for them generally.
Everyone has about 20-50 opposite sex people to chose from and will usually pick one of those. It's just the best fit from a very small pool.
No matter what pool your chosing from you'll most likely find that "special" person.
There's probably millions of better mates around the world but who has time to meet them all.

Davis937
05-25-2010, 05:18 PM
Hmmmm. intersting question. How does one truly define or put a value on love? I believe I undertand your point, though, and definitely undertand your point about "the one you loved most, you also had the most difficulty with". This is most likely because there was a lot of passion involved in this relationship, that made the feelings that much more intense.

I myself could easily say I have truly "loved" or been "in love" with 2 lovely ladies. Each of these relationships (good and bad) taught me things that made my next relationship better/easier, and without so much headache. Now I'm on my 3rd "love", and thankfully, I have the memories and lessons of the other two to guide me thru this one, which has been very smooth, and as a result, am getting married in about two weeks. :) I no longer make the same mistakes, and am a more rounded person, less selfish, and easier to talk to. I am also more comfortable in my skin because of the two past relationships. I thank all the lovely ladies who helped make drak who he is today. :)

can I truly say I love this one more than the other two?? Not really, but what I can say is my understanding of the word and what it means in my relationship makes this relationship much better, and to a degree, makes me value her much more. So in a way, Yes, I love her more fully, and completely. Hope that makes sense.

Hey, drak ... I hear you and that's an excellent point that you brought up ... yes, I definitely learned much and benefitted from all of my relationships ... and, yes, I know I "grew up" a little with each of the wonderful ladies I was with ... in retrospect, I know that I was truly not worthy of their love ... I'm definitely older and wiser now ... and ... wistfully remember my good ... and also not so good times with these ladies ... hey, congratulations to you ... the very best to the both of you!

Davis937
05-25-2010, 05:23 PM
I bet you didn't marry the one you loved most because she didn't feel the same way or she was a massive pain in the azz. High maintenance women are not worth the time, money or effort.

Hey, Chris ... sounds like you've had some first hand experience ** smile ** ... feel free to share!

Davis937
05-25-2010, 05:29 PM
I hope your wife doesn't read this!! :) Good topic. Prior to my wife, I was in a 10 year relationship with someone I thought I would be with forever. We had similar interests, loved the same music, played tennis together, loved to cook, enjoyed fine food/drinks. Physical parts of the relationship were other-worldly. :) But she was dishonest about deep-seated psych issues with me that only surfaced years into the relationship. I did my best to help out, got appointments with the best docs/specialists. She could be happy one minute, then virtually suicidal the next. She gave new meaning to the term jealousy, even with totally plutonic female friends from college, etc. One day she just came in and said " I don't want this anymore" and left, no ifs, ands or buts. No chance of counseling, etc. Just gone. I took it hard for a year or so but soon realized all the good was really outweighed by the bad. We fought a lot and she could get batsh*t crazy. :) Our relationship was eighter a 10 or a 1, no in between.

But everything with my wife is soooo easy. We never fight. We have a number of different interests but plenty similar. She's cool as a cucumber. Her attitude is the same as my favorite girlfriend from college...I know who you're coming home with. Women can flirt with me when I'm out (I bartended in college, so it was a daily thing), though I don't return the favor (usually :)), but she knows where my bread is buttered. She's so confident/sure of herself. Pretty much every day is pleasant. Do we have that explosive connection that I had with girl #1? Maybe not but it's very close. And I appreciate every other aspect of life so much that I couldn't be happier. Like Drakulie said, you live and learn. If girl #1 was still in my life, we would be totally miserable. She was good for my 20's but not my 30's. I try to look at things like that. Every relationship happened for a reason and lead me to this point in life. I literally would nevr have met my wife without dating #1 because at the time, she convinced me to move somewhere I was against. But it worked out great for me! My wife is who I was meant to be with and someone I can imagine growing old with. Good luck.

Hey Kevin ... thanks so much for taking the time to post ... and a very detailed post at that ... appreciate your sharing ... I'm glad things worked out for you ... I used the word "wistful" for my past relationships ... my love was probably the "hottest" with the woman I had the most difficulty with ... but, there was plenty of passion ... both positive and negative ... also, my sexual relationship with her has been unparalleled ... can't quite figure out why ... hmmm, there was definitely a wild side to our relationship ... very edgy ... I suppose that made things interesting (... and also very difficult) for the two of us ... I still miss her (although I'm with a wonderful woman now ... probably, undeservedly so) ...

r2473
05-25-2010, 05:33 PM
Married people are not with the best person for them generally.
Everyone has about 20-50 opposite sex people to chose from and will usually pick one of those. It's just the best fit from a very small pool.
No matter what pool your chosing from you'll most likely find that "special" person.
There's probably millions of better mates around the world but who has time to meet them all.

This is funny because its true.

Davis937
05-25-2010, 05:34 PM
I can honestly say I did not love the person I love(ed) the most. I wish I could say that but cannot. I've never felt the same way about anyone as I felt for my first love - 15 years later (married for 7). I don't think this is as unusal as the OP might suspect.

Hey, Rockit ... not quite sure what you meant by that first sentence ... I'm interested so please explain ... thanks!

Davis937
05-25-2010, 05:38 PM
I get my relationship / marriage advice from Woody Allen:

From the movie
Love and Death

-Love is everything, Boris.
I wanna meet some man
and scale the heights of passion
Some man who embodies
the three great aspects of love.
Intellectual, spiritual and sensual.

-Well, there's not too many of us
around, but it can be done.

- So many women settle cheaply.
- I know. Poor things.

- They marry for money.
- Money! Well, money.

-But I feel as though
my life would be wasted
if I didn't love deeply
with a man whose mind I respected,
whose spirituality equalled mine,
and who had the same lustful appetite
for sensual passion that drives me insane.

-You're an incredibly complex woman.

-I guess you could say
I'm half saint, half wh0re.

-Here's hoping I get the half that eats.

Thanks r2473 ... it was good to get the female perspective on this ... anecdotal comments seem to say that the guys here have had had maybe three or four serious relationships ... how about the women ... about the same number or are the ladies a bit more discerning and selective (... and careful with their emotions) ... please comment, thanks!

Davis937
05-25-2010, 05:44 PM
Re OP:

The things that you love love love about a person may in fact be things that aren't good for you personally or relationship-wise.
I think the type of love that works best for marriage is when the person you love brings out the best in you.

To Drakulie:

Best wishes!!!!!!!

Hey Cindy ... you're so very right ... and I know I have too often been attracted to those things in my partner that maybe haven't led to much stability in the relationship ... most of us will "grow up" ... or see some of these ... hmmm ... destructive or dangerous aspects of our personalities ... things eventually get "less fun" but maybe more stable and lasting ... does there always have to be a trade off ... so tell us, Cindy ... did you finally end up with the one you loved the most ... or did that not work out ... as we know, there are definitely no guarantees!

grimmbomb21
05-25-2010, 06:03 PM
This will be an unusual question ... I'm positive that it has not yet been posed on this forum ... I was wondering if you ended up marrying the person (man or woman) that you loved the most in your life ... I'll start off by saying (... good thing this is anonymous ... hope it is!) that I did not ... I've had four serious relationships in my life ... the lady I loved the most was, oddly enough, the partner that I had the most difficult /challenging relationship problems with (a long list) ... I ended up marrying someone else ... so, how about you ... my contention is that most of us, for a variety of reasons, do not end up marrying that person that we have the most love for ...

*raises hand*

Let's see. Rushed into a relationship with the wrong person. Nothing but drama from the get go. Absolutely nothing in common. We have two kids or I would be talking about this marriage in the past tense. But we do have an honest relationship. She openly admits that she is here because she doesn't have to work. Don't get married when you're twenty years old I guess. See buddy, someone's always got it worse. :lol:

Davis937
05-25-2010, 06:09 PM
*raises hand*

Let's see. Rushed into a relationship with the wrong person. Nothing but drama from the get go. Absolutely nothing in common. We have two kids or I would be talking about this marriage in the past tense. But we do have an honest relationship. She openly admits that she is here because she doesn't have to work. Don't get married when you're twenty years old I guess. See buddy, someone's always got it worse. :lol:

Hey, GB21 ... thanks for sharing ... it's a d*** scary feeling ... to wake up in the morning ... look at the lady lying down next to you ... and thinking ... now how the hell did I end up in this relationship ... you know, it's not too late (... I know, even with the kids) ... you need to make some difficult decisions ... if you don't ... it will be another 10 years down the road ... and is that fair to you .. and to her ... and to your children? Good luck to you ...

grimmbomb21
05-25-2010, 06:29 PM
Hey, GB21 ... thanks for sharing ... it's a d*** scary feeling ... to wake up in the morning ... look at the lady lying down next to you ... and thinking ... now how the hell did I end up in this relationship ... you know, it's not too late (... I know, even with the kids) ... you need to make some difficult decisions ... if you don't ... it will be another 10 years down the road ... and is that fair to you .. and to her ... and to your children? Good luck to you ...

My wife actually told my oldest(only 11) we were getting divorced a few months back to just to **** me off. I had a long talk with him and decided to tough it out, fake the smile and move on. Sure I may be burning some good years, but hopefully I will look back and be able to say my kids were better off for it. Or they may be shooting at people with AK-47s from building tops cursing my not so good name. (See Parenthood movie) :)

raiden031
05-25-2010, 07:02 PM
My wife actually told my oldest(only 11) we were getting divorced a few months back to just to **** me off. I had a long talk with him and decided to tough it out, fake the smile and move on. Sure I may be burning some good years, but hopefully I will look back and be able to say my kids were better off for it. Or they may be shooting at people with AK-47s from building tops cursing my not so good name. (See Parenthood movie) :)

I think it depends on how you portray your relationship in front of your kids. It can be worse for them to stay together if you are fighting and belittling each other all the time. My parents did just that and weren't concerned about how their dysfunctional relationship might affect their 3 kids. If you can hide your problems from your kids then maybe its better to stay together, but I think we only get to live life once and should strive to be happy. If you care about your kids then you can still be good parents while apart.

Davis937
05-25-2010, 08:02 PM
I think it depends on how you portray your relationship in front of your kids. It can be worse for them to stay together if you are fighting and belittling each other all the time. My parents did just that and weren't concerned about how their dysfunctional relationship might affect their 3 kids. If you can hide your problems from your kids then maybe its better to stay together, but I think we only get to live life once and should strive to be happy. If you care about your kids then you can still be good parents while apart.

Hey raiden ... yes, I agree with the general tenor of your comments -- some good points ... also, I think we tend to underestimate the perceptiveness of our children ... it's amazing how much they can "pick up" various signals from us parents ... even when we try to "hide" things from them!

Tina
05-25-2010, 08:07 PM
Hey Davis, I am a bit concerned about this thread here at TTW. You have some personal issues with your current wife? I hope everything is well. Take Cares. -Tina

cucio
05-25-2010, 11:16 PM
You guys make it sound as if a perfect match was already out there and you just have to find it. That's a cool story for a Holywood romantic comedy, but I don't think it works like that in real life.

You begin with a good match and build up from there. If you are willing to make your relationship work out you mold each other, make small concessions, and eventually grow to be that fabled perfect match, as much as you can.

Whether it works out or not depends on whether the satisfactions of that come out of belonging to a happy couple compensate the small adjustments you have to make in your own personality.

In my case I can say that those adjustments have not only brought me immense happiness and a companion whom I can trust with everything and that will put my well-being in front of hers (as I will do for her, which can lead to sweet, silly conflicts of interest, let me tell you :-) ), but made me a better person, one I am prouder of being.

So, wrapping up: a successful long-term relationship takes work, be it a marriage, a friendship or a business venture. You have to nurture it.

Davis937
05-26-2010, 12:48 AM
Hey Davis, I am a bit concerned about this thread here at TTW. You have some personal issues with your current wife? I hope everything is well. Take Cares. -Tina

Hey, tina ... thanks for your concern ... but ... I'm all good ... thanks again *smile*

Kevin T
05-26-2010, 07:26 AM
Hey Kevin ... thanks so much for taking the time to post ... and a very detailed post at that ... appreciate your sharing ... I'm glad things worked out for you ... I used the word "wistful" for my past relationships ... my love was probably the "hottest" with the woman I had the most difficulty with ... but, there was plenty of passion ... both positive and negative ... also, my sexual relationship with her has been unparalleled ... can't quite figure out why ... hmmm, there was definitely a wild side to our relationship ... very edgy ... I suppose that made things interesting (... and also very difficult) for the two of us ... I still miss her (although I'm with a wonderful woman now ... probably, undeservedly so) ...

No problem. It's actually nice to see a topic like this on TTW (vs. the old negative stuff). I know exactly how you feel. I think about "those" aspects with my ex fairly often...then all the negative stuff comes seeping back in and I come to my senses. I think a lot of it has to do with sentimentality. I always look back fondly on past cities I've lived in, jobs I've had, etc....even when I was borderline miserable at the time. I tend to push out the bad and keep the good. That's why every time I look back at those times with fondness, I give myself a nice, hard 'Godsmack' to bring me back to reality. :) I know I'm with the best woman I can get (to be honest, not sure I really believe in only one 'soulmate, etc.-other than my kids) and that's good enough for me. Both people have to be willing to put in the work because a good marriage requires effort in all areas. I have a co-worker who has been married 40 years (since he was 17!!) and his best comment on marriage is "you're gonna have good years and bad years, you just have to make sure there's a lot more good than bad".

And speaking of getting married early...worst thing anyone can do, IMHO. I'm going to do my best to talk my kids into waiting until at least their late 20's. I think it's good to go out and travel, see as much as you can and meet as many people as you can before you take the plunge.

Cindysphinx
05-26-2010, 07:32 AM
Hey Cindy ... you're so very right ... and I know I have too often been attracted to those things in my partner that maybe haven't led to much stability in the relationship ... most of us will "grow up" ... or see some of these ... hmmm ... destructive or dangerous aspects of our personalities ... things eventually get "less fun" but maybe more stable and lasting ... does there always have to be a trade off ... so tell us, Cindy ... did you finally end up with the one you loved the most ... or did that not work out ... as we know, there are definitely no guarantees!

20th anniversary is this fall, so I'd say we've done OK.

The thing I have noticed is that marriages have peaks and valleys. The valleys can be huge, and when you're in the middle of one it doesn't feel so good.

I'm very glad I hung in there through the valleys. Then again, I married a guy who values the same things I do. When we are in the valley, we have managed not to sink as low of either of us might have wanted to, and we haven't said things to each other that can't be taken back.

I'd say if you're in a valley -- and someday you will be if you hang around long enough -- try to gut it out. It's hard to put your energies in being nice to That Person who did you wrong or won't be reasonable or won't whatever-it-is, but it is possible to find the next peak.

r2473
05-26-2010, 07:40 AM
Married people are not with the best person for them generally.
Everyone has about 20-50 opposite sex people to chose from and will usually pick one of those. It's just the best fit from a very small pool.
No matter what pool your chosing from you'll most likely find that "special" person.
There's probably millions of better mates around the world but who has time to meet them all.


You guys make it sound as if a perfect match was already out there and you just have to find it. That's a cool story for a Holywood romantic comedy, but I don't think it works like that in real life.

You begin with a good match and build up from there. If you are willing to make your relationship work out you mold each other, make small concessions, and eventually grow to be that fabled perfect match, as much as you can.

Whether it works out or not depends on whether the satisfactions of that come out of belonging to a happy couple compensate the small adjustments you have to make in your own personality.

In my case I can say that those adjustments have not only brought me immense happiness and a companion whom I can trust with everything and that will put my well-being in front of hers (as I will do for her, which can lead to sweet, silly conflicts of interest, let me tell you :-) ), but made me a better person, one I am prouder of being.

So, wrapping up: a successful long-term relationship takes work, be it a marriage, a friendship or a business venture. You have to nurture it.

Two good posts that compliment each other well.

Davis937
05-26-2010, 10:05 AM
No problem. It's actually nice to see a topic like this on TTW (vs. the old negative stuff). I know exactly how you feel. I think about "those" aspects with my ex fairly often...then all the negative stuff comes seeping back in and I come to my senses. I think a lot of it has to do with sentimentality. I always look back fondly on past cities I've lived in, jobs I've had, etc....even when I was borderline miserable at the time. I tend to push out the bad and keep the good. That's why every time I look back at those times with fondness, I give myself a nice, hard 'Godsmack' to bring me back to reality. :) I know I'm with the best woman I can get (to be honest, not sure I really believe in only one 'soulmate, etc.-other than my kids) and that's good enough for me. Both people have to be willing to put in the work because a good marriage requires effort in all areas. I have a co-worker who has been married 40 years (since he was 17!!) and his best comment on marriage is "you're gonna have good years and bad years, you just have to make sure there's a lot more good than bad".

And speaking of getting married early...worst thing anyone can do, IMHO. I'm going to do my best to talk my kids into waiting until at least their late 20's. I think it's good to go out and travel, see as much as you can and meet as many people as you can before you take the plunge.

Thanks, Kev ... an excellent post ... and, yes, I've also been guilty of looking back fondly on some past relationships (... tendency to over emphasize some of the positives ... a few ... and forgetting about all of the strife ... human nature, I suppose) ... I too have been fortunate and am in probably the best relationship of my life ... we started off as friends ... and things grew and developed from there ... she's the only woman that I've allowed myself to be "me" ... with all of my quirkiness and dysfunctionalities ... talk about unconditional acceptance ... she has made me a better ... hmmm ... not just man ... made me a better person (and my children are constantly thanking her for that)! I also agree about marrying late (... I was 32 when I got married ... unfortunately, my immaturity and selfishness was not due solely to my chronological age) ... unfortunately, my 22 yr old daughter is thinking seriously about marrying ... I've talked with her, but she will likely end up making her own mind about this (... at least she just graduated from college and has a job).

Davis937
05-26-2010, 02:01 PM
20th anniversary is this fall, so I'd say we've done OK.

The thing I have noticed is that marriages have peaks and valleys. The valleys can be huge, and when you're in the middle of one it doesn't feel so good.

I'm very glad I hung in there through the valleys. Then again, I married a guy who values the same things I do. When we are in the valley, we have managed not to sink as low of either of us might have wanted to, and we haven't said things to each other that can't be taken back.

I'd say if you're in a valley -- and someday you will be if you hang around long enough -- try to gut it out. It's hard to put your energies in being nice to That Person who did you wrong or won't be reasonable or won't whatever-it-is, but it is possible to find the next peak.


Hey Cindy ... thanks for the post ... looks like you've discovered one of the secrets of a successful marriage ... yes, it takes a lot of WORK and COMMITMENT ... two simple things yet something many people are unwilling to invest in!

Dedans Penthouse
05-26-2010, 02:36 PM
Being in love...mmmmm....a given..

It's 'being in like' as well: SUCCESS

sureshs
05-26-2010, 02:52 PM
Hey Cindy ... thanks for the post ... looks like you've discovered one of the secrets of a successful marriage ... yes, it takes a lot of WORK and COMMITMENT ... two simple things yet something many people are unwilling to invest in!

No it doesn't. Marriage has been around for a very long time and has survived many challenges. It should not require work and commitment. Commitment should be a given, and work should be looked upon as a duty. The main commitment and work goes towards the children, and that is the main reason for the institution of marriage to exist in the first place - to provide a safe and loving sanctuary for kids. But again, doing the best for the children is a matter of duty, not choice.

In summary, one should not work to make a marriage successful - one should simply do his/her duty. In that process, some friction may arise, but sticking together is also to be viewed as duty, not work.

Problem comes when people view marriage as being something for pleasure or enjoyment. Soon the pleasure will wear off, and the couple is going to get old no matter what. Self-fulfilment as a goal also doesn't pan out, as most people end up as under-achievers no matter what for various reasons. If you are in marriage for these things, it is going to end up as a disappointment. It should be looked upon as sort of a duty to further the human race, and maybe to give some meaning to life also.

Cindysphinx
05-26-2010, 03:18 PM
^It takes work to do your duty.

Ask anyone in the armed services.

Cindysphinx
05-26-2010, 03:20 PM
Oh, and I am not in my marriage to further the human race or give meaning to my life.

I am in it for lots of more Cindy-centric reasons. Love. Habit. Obligation. Lack of better options. The benefits of teamwork v. going it alone. Personal fulfillment. Fear.

And the small matter that I verbally pledged to stick it out in front of pretty much every friend and relative I had.

Davis937
05-26-2010, 03:29 PM
^It takes work to do your duty.

Ask anyone in the armed services.

... well, stated Ms. Cindy!

sureshs
05-26-2010, 03:30 PM
^It takes work to do your duty.

Ask anyone in the armed services.

It takes work to do your duty in all professions. But the idea that you have to "work" at something implies you would otherwise not do it. You can leave the armed forces after a certain number of years and join a private security firm, as many do, but that is not the way you should look at marriage. If you need to work at something, it means the relationship is artificial and strained, and you are putting up a show, afraid that the relationship will break up otherwise. What you need is to know that no matter what (barring extreme cases like violence, infidelity, drugs etc), you will be together. Then no work is needed. But that attitude went out decades ago.

raiden031
05-26-2010, 03:56 PM
It takes work to do your duty in all professions. But the idea that you have to "work" at something implies you would otherwise not do it. You can leave the armed forces after a certain number of years and join a private security firm, as many do, but that is not the way you should look at marriage. If you need to work at something, it means the relationship is artificial and strained, and you are putting up a show, afraid that the relationship will break up otherwise. What you need is to know that no matter what (barring extreme cases like violence, infidelity, drugs etc), you will be together. Then no work is needed. But that attitude went out decades ago.

Are you even married? I don't know what you are even talking about. If two people are married and don't 'work' to keep the marriage strong, then they will end up drifting apart emotionally to the point where there is no passion, no attraction, and no love. That is not a good marriage even if the kids are taken care of.

r2473
05-26-2010, 04:22 PM
If two people are married and don't 'work' to keep the marriage strong, then they will end up drifting apart

You need to ask surshs how he defines the term "work" as he is using it.

I suspect that will clear up his "oh so" philosophic post.

grimmbomb21
05-26-2010, 04:24 PM
No it doesn't. Marriage has been around for a very long time and has survived many challenges. It should not require work and commitment. Commitment should be a given, and work should be looked upon as a duty. The main commitment and work goes towards the children, and that is the main reason for the institution of marriage to exist in the first place - to provide a safe and loving sanctuary for kids. But again, doing the best for the children is a matter of duty, not choice.

In summary, one should not work to make a marriage successful - one should simply do his/her duty. In that process, some friction may arise, but sticking together is also to be viewed as duty, not work.

Problem comes when people view marriage as being something for pleasure or enjoyment. Soon the pleasure will wear off, and the couple is going to get old no matter what. Self-fulfilment as a goal also doesn't pan out, as most people end up as under-achievers no matter what for various reasons. If you are in marriage for these things, it is going to end up as a disappointment. It should be looked upon as sort of a duty to further the human race, and maybe to give some meaning to life also.

Wow. That is probably the most depressing take on marriage I have ever heard.

Davis937
05-26-2010, 05:43 PM
Wow. That is probably the most depressing take on marriage I have ever heard.

yes, that is somewhat of a harsh and passionless view of marriage ... makes living in a monastery look like an escapade on the Riviera *smile* ... or, don't they allow smiles in those marriages ... heaven help us if we some how manage to have a little fun in our partnership ...

Cindysphinx
05-26-2010, 05:53 PM
Yes, it does matter how one defines "work."

I say marriage takes work because it is work to take someone else's feelings and interests and opinions into account when your natural instinct is me me me me me me me.

The simple act of reaching a compromise is work -- witness the legions of negotiators, mediators and attorneys who do nothing else but help people reach compromise. In marriage, hardly a week goes by when you don't have to compromise about *something.*

Marriage takes work because you have to do a *lot* of things you don't want to do. This encompasses everything from sharing money to cleaning the house to suffering through your husband's company picnic.

Marriage takes work in that it is an economic partnership. If you are single and you want to change jobs, cut your hours, call in sick . . . go for it. If you are married, you have to work to hold up your end of the economic partnership, and you may have to work a lot harder than you would if you were single.

To me, the opposite of work is fun and games. Play. Relaxation. A hobby. Free time. Freedom.

Anyone who thinks marriage is any of those things will not be married for very long.

grimmbomb21
05-26-2010, 05:54 PM
yes, that is somewhat of a harsh and passionless view of marriage ... makes living in a monastery look like an escapade on the Riviera *smile* ... or, don't they allow smiles in those marriages ... heaven help us if we some how manage to have a little fun in our partnership ...

Damn it man, focus!! The human race. It's all that matters!





:mrgreen:

Steady Eddy
05-26-2010, 05:56 PM
Marriage takes work because you have to do a *lot* of things you don't want to do. This encompasses everything from sharing money to cleaning the house to suffering through your husband's company picnic.

Oh no! Not the company picnic! :eek:

West Coast Ace
05-26-2010, 06:00 PM
You have a good reason for missing it. After you say "I do" just do the Nadal fistpump and yell "vamos". Just don't hit your new 'old lady' in the face with the $425,000 watch... :)

Cindysphinx
05-26-2010, 06:10 PM
Oh no! Not the company picnic! :eek:

Yeah. I have to stand there for *hours* sucking in my stomach so his co-workers don't start asking each other, "What did he ever see in her?"

It's a lot of pressure, man.

Davis937
05-26-2010, 06:32 PM
Damn it man, focus!! The human race. It's all that matters!

:mrgreen:

... sorry, you're right ... don't quite know what got into me ... yes, for mankind ... procreate ... duty ... honor ... country ... and what's the prevailing color at the US Military Academy ... you're right ... it's GRAY! Yes, quite colorless and depressing ...

Davis937
05-26-2010, 06:43 PM
You know ... I start reading some of these descriptions of marriage ... posters use such words as "duty" for the good of "mankind" ... and ... I start to think about "Brave New World" and all of its wonderful implications ... just a little too scary and dark for me ... forgive me if I'm wrong ... but ... I happen to enjoy light, laughter, and hmmm (... what the hell begins with the letter "L") ... liberty, no ... latitude, no ... and, oh, stupid me, of course ... and love! If those elements don't belong in a marriage ... well then ...

Davis937
05-26-2010, 11:53 PM
In my case, I did not end up marrying that lady that I was most deeply in love with (... for a variety of reasons) ... how about you, out of all of your relationships, did you end up marrying that person that you were most deeply in love with ... I'm thinking that you probably did not ...

fed_the_savior
05-27-2010, 12:15 AM
In my case, I did not end up marrying that lady that I was most deeply in love with (... for a variety of reasons) ... how about you, out of all of your relationships, did you end up marrying that person that you were most deeply in love with ... I'm thinking that you probably did not ...

do you regret it?

origmarm
05-27-2010, 01:02 AM
In my case, I did not end up marrying that lady that I was most deeply in love with (... for a variety of reasons) ... how about you, out of all of your relationships, did you end up marrying that person that you were most deeply in love with ... I'm thinking that you probably did not ...

The short answer to your question is yes I did...couldn't be happier :). I now have a lovely little girl too so things just keep getting better!

Davis937
05-27-2010, 11:01 AM
do you regret it?

An excellent question ... and ... I do look back at her wistfully ... she was one of those ladies, the only one, where I loved her voice, how she walked/moved, her smile, her laugh, etc. ... she was the prettiest woman I've been with ... and our physical relationship was the best of anyone I've ever been with ... BUT ... are "down" moments were pretty bad ... it wasn't an abusive relationship but a destructive one ... I am in a loving relationship now ... less "fire" but much more stable ... and definitely much healthier ... thanks for asking, fed ... and, yes, I miss her and still do love her ... my father once told me: "Love is not enough ..." You know, the b****** was right!

Davis937
05-27-2010, 11:03 AM
The short answer to your question is yes I did...couldn't be happier :). I now have a lovely little girl too so things just keep getting better!

Thanks for the response, origmarm ... you're one of the lucky ones ... good for you!

cucio
05-27-2010, 11:37 PM
When I talk about a relationship needing work, it has nothing to do with a chore or duty. It is the small price you pay to reap big benefits, but it is peanuts compared with what you get in return. For those of you into engineering, it is the small feedback you provide to the system so it keeps resonating.

The best analogy I can come up with is a swing. For the most part you don't have to do anything to keep the swing going back and forth, gravity (the mutual attraction, the things you share, the routine) takes care of it. But every now and then, at the right moment, you have to thrust a bit to keep it going, so the friction (the boredom, the problems, the daily wear and tear) doesn't end up stopping it.

Think of a relationship as a swing for two people: if you want it to keep swinging (big if) you have to pay close attention and thrust when it is your time to do it.

A bit less ludic and more exhausting, a rowboat with two oars is also a good analogy, especially of the most pragmatic aspects of a successful partnership.

Davis937
05-28-2010, 02:10 AM
When I talk about a relationship needing work, it has nothing to do with a chore or duty. It is the small price you pay to reap big benefits, but it is peanuts compared with what you get in return. For those of you into engineering, it is the small feedback you provide to the system so it keeps resonating.

The best analogy I can come up with is a swing. For the most part you don't have to do anything to keep the swing going back and forth, gravity (the mutual attraction, the things you share, the routine) takes care of it. But every now and then, at the right moment, you have to thrust a bit to keep it going, so the friction (the boredom, the problems, the daily wear and tear) doesn't end up stopping it.

Think of a relationship as a swing for two people: if you want it to keep swinging (big if) you have to pay close attention and thrust when it is your time to do it.

A bit less ludic and more exhausting, a rowboat with two oars is also a good analogy, especially of the most pragmatic aspects of a successful partnership.

Hey, cucio ... not the most romantic of analogies ... but I hear you and agree ... thanks for posting!

Tina
05-30-2010, 06:05 PM
Hey Maid of Honer, please send my regards to your wife and family members. Hopefully, she doesn't read this thread ^_^.

Davis937
05-31-2010, 03:39 AM
Hey Maid of Honer, please send my regards to your wife and family members. Hopefully, she doesn't read this thread ^_^.

Hey sweet Tina ... thanks for your best wishes and kind regards ... very thoughtful of you ... was wondering if the rabbit (part of your profile) has any special significance ... were you born in the year of the rabbit ... if no, what year were you born (Chinese calendar) ... I'm the year of the boar ...

bezs
05-31-2010, 04:28 AM
Hmm, year of the boar there's no year of the boar might be ox you're referring to.

Tina
05-31-2010, 06:16 AM
Hey sweet Tina ... thanks for your best wishes and kind regards ... very thoughtful of you ... was wondering if the rabbit (part of your profile) has any special significance ... were you born in the year of the rabbit ... if no, what year were you born (Chinese calendar) ... I'm the year of the boar ...

Yes, I am:)

Tina
05-31-2010, 06:17 AM
Hmm, year of the boar there's no year of the boar might be ox you're referring to.

boar=a year of pig

Davis937
05-31-2010, 12:46 PM
boar=a year of pig

Hey Tina ... sorry ... my bad ... yes, the year of the pig ... so, tell me, are pigs and rabbits compatible ...

Tina
05-31-2010, 01:05 PM
Hey Tina ... sorry ... my bad ... yes, the year of the pig ... so, tell me, are pigs and rabbits compatible ...

I have no idea about this, my maid of honor. Tina is getting along with everyone:)

decades
05-31-2010, 01:29 PM
You may Not have loved the "problem child" more than the others or even the person you are with now. Let me explain. You had a symbiotic hand-in-glove kind of relationship where she had things about her that tapped into your neediness and you had things about you that allowed her to tap into her neediness. It was dysfunctional probably. So what you felt with her was absence of boredom. You felt the ups and downs of a roller coaster ride and that may not have been perfect but it was certainly never boring. So what you are feeling with your current spouse is probably more boring, but it's also way more stable predictable and more of a partnership. That is better than what you had.

Davis937
05-31-2010, 05:47 PM
You may Not have loved the "problem child" more than the others or even the person you are with now. Let me explain. You had a symbiotic hand-in-glove kind of relationship where she had things about her that tapped into your neediness and you had things about you that allowed her to tap into her neediness. It was dysfunctional probably. So what you felt with her was absence of boredom. You felt the ups and downs of a roller coaster ride and that may not have been perfect but it was certainly never boring. So what you are feeling with your current spouse is probably more boring, but it's also way more stable predictable and more of a partnership. That is better than what you had.

Interesing perspective ... it certainly wasn't a boring relationship ... never quite knew which Jamie (pseudonym) was going to show up ... never quite knew which Davis was going to show up either ... but, it was all quite exciting ... and we're not talking about several weeks or months ... we were together for three years ...