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Dutch-Guy
07-19-2010, 09:06 AM
Rank top 10 players on all surfaces

0-5 : mediocre
6-8: good
9-10: best


1. Nadal:
Clay: 10
Grass: 8
Hardcourt: 6
Average on all surfaces: 8

2. Djokovic
Clay: 6
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 6.6

3. Federer:
Clay: 7
Grass: 10
Hardcourt: 10
Average on all surfaces: 9

4. Murray
Clay: 5
Grass: 7
Harcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 6.6

5. Soderling
Clay: 7
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 6
Average on all surfaces: 6.6

6. Davydenko
Clay: 6
Grass: 4
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: 5.6

7. Del Potro
Clay: 6
Grass: 2
Hardcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 5.3


8. Berdych
Clay: 6
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 6
Average on all surfaces: 6

9. Roddick
Clay:3
Grass: 7
Hardcourt:8
Average on all surfaces: 6.

10. Verdasco:
Clay: 5
Grass: 3
Hardcourt: 6
Average on all surfaces: 4.6

Conclusion: TMF is the best on all surfaces followed by The Bull of Mallorca.

jones101
07-19-2010, 09:17 AM
Nadal is 8 on HC IMO, he is ine oh the most consistent performers on it and has a GS on it too. Id also put him 9 on grass, 4 finals in last 4 wimbys entered says it all.

Fed is higher on clay too, IMO.

Dutch-Guy
07-19-2010, 09:22 AM
Nadal is 8 on HC IMO, he is ine oh the most consistent performers on it and has a GS on it too.
I'd rank Djokovic higher than Rafa on HC: 1 Slam,1 slam final,5 masters to Rafa's 1 Slam and 4 masters.

Id also put him 9 on grass, 4 finals in last 4 wimbys entered says it all.
9=best,which 'd almost equal him to Fed who has 6 titles on that surface.

Fed is higher on clay too, IMO.
How high/low shoulf he be ranked?

vortex1
07-19-2010, 09:24 AM
I'd rank Djokovic higher than Rafa on HC: 1 Slam,1 slam final,5 masters to Rafa's 1 Slam and 4 masters.



Nadal also has olympic gold and he beat Djokovic on the way to it. Also Djokovic should be lower on clay, he hasn't made one RG final and has 0 wins against Nadal on clay.

tennisplayer666
07-19-2010, 09:28 AM
How could both Djoker and Fed be 7 on clay? One has 4 consecutive slams finals and one title. The other has nothing.

single_handed_champion
07-19-2010, 09:32 AM
Yeah, Nadal at 10+9+8 sounds correct, Roger at 8+10+10 (though could argue for 9 on clay, since he has been so consistent on it, numerous finals, 1 RG). Why is Verdasco 5 on clay? He has actually been more consistent at RG, though his best results have been at the HC slams.

akv89
07-19-2010, 09:32 AM
Rank top 10 players on all surfaces

0-5 : mediocre
6-8: good
9-10: best


1. Nadal:
Clay: 10
Grass: 8
Hardcourt: 6
Average on all surfaces: 8

2. Djokovic
Clay: 7
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 7

3. Federer:
Clay: 7
Grass: 10
Hardcourt: 10
Average on all surfaces: 9

4. Murray
Clay: 5
Grass: 7
Harcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 6.6

5. Soderling
Clay: 7
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 6
Average on all surfaces: 6.6

6. Davydenko
Clay: 6
Grass: 4
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: 5.6

7. Del Potro
Clay: 6
Grass: 2
Hardcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 5.3


8. Berdych
Clay: 6
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 6
Average on all surfaces: 6

9. Roddick
Clay:3
Grass: 7
Hardcourt:8
Average on all surfaces: 6.

10. Verdasco:
Clay: 5
Grass: 3
Hardcourt: 6
Average on all surfaces: 4.6

Conclusion: TMF is the best on all surfaces followed by The Bull of Mallorca.

Are we looking at their form right now or their peak form, or are we averaging their whole career?
If we look at their best, a rough approximation of these numbers would be 10x their win ratio over their best years. For example, Rafa has something like a 0.97 win ratio on clay (97%), which translates to a 9.7 on your scale.

JoelDali
07-19-2010, 09:32 AM
Do people really have this much time to talk the same topics everyday?

LOL

tennisplayer666
07-19-2010, 09:33 AM
Do people really have this much time to talk the same topics everyday?

LOL

What else you gonna do? Breathe?

muzza123
07-19-2010, 09:40 AM
Another thread where people can argue over the accuracy of numbers pulled out of their a55e5.

Keep up the good work boys! ;)

Dutch-Guy
07-19-2010, 09:40 AM
How could both Djoker and Fed be 7 on clay? One has 4 consecutive slams finals and one title. The other has nothing.

You're right.I fixed it.

LeoR
07-19-2010, 09:43 AM
1. Nadal:
Clay: 11
Grass: 9,5
Hardcourt: 9
Average on all surfaces: 9,5

2. Djokovic
Clay: 7,5
Grass: 8
Hardcourt: 9
Average on all surfaces: 8

3. Federer:
Clay: 8,5
Grass: 9.5
Hardcourt: 9,5
Average on all surfaces: 9

4. Murray
Clay: 5
Grass: 8
Harcourt: 9
Average on all surfaces: 8

5. Soderling
Clay: 6
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 6
Average on all surfaces: 6

6. Davydenko
Clay: 7,5
Grass: 4
Hardcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 7

7. Del Potro
Clay: 6
Grass: 4
Hardcourt: 9
Average on all surfaces: 6,5


8. Berdych
Clay: 6,5
Grass: 8
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: 7

9. Roddick
Clay:2
Grass: 8
Hardcourt:7
Average on all surfaces: 6,5

10. Verdasco:
Clay: 7,5
Grass: 3
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: 6,5


I did not calcul the average but rather gave an "overall" mark.

So, to me, Nadal is the best player of the top 10 (which is perfectly in agreement with the ATP rankings) and Soderling the weakest (which is not in agreement with the ATP rankings).

Dutch-Guy
07-19-2010, 09:43 AM
Are we looking at their form right now or their peak form, or are we averaging their whole career?
If we look at their best, a rough approximation of these numbers would be 10x their win ratio over their best years. For example, Rafa has something like a 0.97 win ratio on clay (97%), which translates to a 9.7 on your scale.

There you have it.
Btw this is my rankings,which is based on what each of them has achieved so far on any of those surfaces.

Semi-Pro
07-19-2010, 10:21 AM
1. Nadal:
Clay: 11
Grass: 9,5
Hardcourt: 9
Average on all surfaces: 9,5

2. Djokovic
Clay: 7,5
Grass: 8
Hardcourt: 9
Average on all surfaces: 8

3. Federer:
Clay: 8,5
Grass: 9.5
Hardcourt: 9,5
Average on all surfaces: 9

4. Murray
Clay: 5
Grass: 8
Harcourt: 9
Average on all surfaces: 8

5. Soderling
Clay: 6
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 6
Average on all surfaces: 6

6. Davydenko
Clay: 7,5
Grass: 4
Hardcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 7

7. Del Potro
Clay: 6
Grass: 4
Hardcourt: 9
Average on all surfaces: 6,5


8. Berdych
Clay: 6,5
Grass: 8
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: 7

9. Roddick
Clay:2
Grass: 8
Hardcourt:7
Average on all surfaces: 6,5

10. Verdasco:
Clay: 7,5
Grass: 3
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: 6,5


I did not calcul the average but rather gave an "overall" mark.

So, to me, Nadal is the best player of the top 10 (which is perfectly in agreement with the ATP rankings) and Soderling the weakest (which is not in agreement with the ATP rankings).

Your post is SPEWING of bias.

Nadal at 11 for clay? Cool, because I thought the scale we were looking at started from 1 and ended at 10.

You rank both Federer and Nadal on grass the same, I don't see how that adds up, mind if you expand on your reasoning for this one?...because I can't think of a logical answer. One has 2 Wimbledons, 3? grass titles and the other has 6 Wimbledons and 11 or so grass titles.

Soderling a 6 on clay? The guy made 2 consecutive FO finals. lol

Jchurch
07-19-2010, 10:28 AM
1. Nadal:
Clay: 11
Grass: 9,5
Hardcourt: 9
Average on all surfaces: 9,5

2. Djokovic
Clay: 7,5
Grass: 8
Hardcourt: 9
Average on all surfaces: 8

3. Federer:
Clay: 8,5
Grass: 9.5
Hardcourt: 9,5
Average on all surfaces: 9

4. Murray
Clay: 5
Grass: 8
Harcourt: 9
Average on all surfaces: 8

5. Soderling
Clay: 6
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 6
Average on all surfaces: 6

6. Davydenko
Clay: 7,5
Grass: 4
Hardcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 7

7. Del Potro
Clay: 6
Grass: 4
Hardcourt: 9
Average on all surfaces: 6,5


8. Berdych
Clay: 6,5
Grass: 8
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: 7

9. Roddick
Clay:2
Grass: 8
Hardcourt:7
Average on all surfaces: 6,5

10. Verdasco:
Clay: 7,5
Grass: 3
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: 6,5


I did not calcul the average but rather gave an "overall" mark.

So, to me, Nadal is the best player of the top 10 (which is perfectly in agreement with the ATP rankings) and Soderling the weakest (which is not in agreement with the ATP rankings).

I mean shouldn't Federer be a 11 on Hard Court also then? he has 9 Majors to Nadal's 1. Heck maybe even a 12. How do you justify the 9.5 on grass to both?

kishnabe
07-19-2010, 10:53 AM
1. Nadal:
Clay: 12
Grass: 8
Hardcourt: 6
Average on all surfaces: 8.6

2. Djokovic
Clay: 8
Grass: 5
Hardcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 7

3. Federer:
Clay: 8
Grass: 12
Hardcourt: 10
Average on all surfaces: 10

4. Murray
Clay: 4
Grass: 8
Harcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 6.6

5. Soderling
Clay: 8
Grass: 7
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: 7.33

6. Davydenko
Clay: 7
Grass: 2
Hardcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 5.6

7. Del Potro
Clay: 6
Grass: 2
Hardcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 5.3


8. Berdych
Clay: 6
Grass: 7
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: 6.66

9. Roddick
Clay:3
Grass: 9
Hardcourt:8
Average on all surfaces: 6.66

10. Verdasco:
Clay:7
Grass: 4
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: 6

dmt
07-19-2010, 11:13 AM
Rank top 10 players on all surfaces

0-5 : mediocre
6-8: good
9-10: best


1. Nadal:
Clay: 10
Grass: 8
Hardcourt: 6
Average on all surfaces: 8

2. Djokovic
Clay: 6
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 6.6

3. Federer:
Clay: 7
Grass: 10
Hardcourt: 10
Average on all surfaces: 9

4. Murray
Clay: 5
Grass: 7
Harcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 6.6

5. Soderling
Clay: 7
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 6
Average on all surfaces: 6.6

6. Davydenko
Clay: 6
Grass: 4
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: 5.6

7. Del Potro
Clay: 6
Grass: 2
Hardcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 5.3


8. Berdych
Clay: 6
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 6
Average on all surfaces: 6

9. Roddick
Clay:3
Grass: 7
Hardcourt:8
Average on all surfaces: 6.

10. Verdasco:
Clay: 5
Grass: 3
Hardcourt: 6
Average on all surfaces: 4.6

Conclusion: TMF is the best on all surfaces followed by The Bull of Mallorca.

1.Nadal

Clay:10
Grass:9
Hardcourt: 8

Average: 9

Ps anyone who gives Nadal a 6 on hard is either very biased or doesnt have a clue of what they are talking about. The guy is the third most successfull hardcourter of his generation behind Federer and Djokovic.

2. Djokovic

Clay: 7
Grass: 6
Hardcourts: 8.5

Average: 7.16.....

3. Federer

Clay: 8
Grass: 10
Hardcourts: 9.5

Average: 9.16

4. Murray

Clay: 5
Grass: 7
Hardcourt: 8

Average: 6. 66

5. Soderling

Clay: 7.5
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: ??

6. Davydenko

Clay: 7
Grass: 3
Hardcourts: 8

Average : 6

7. Del Potro

Clay: 6
Grass: 2
Hardcourts: 8

Average: 5.3

8. Berdych

Clay: 6
Grass: 6
Hard: 6

9. Roddick

Clay: 3
Grass: 8
Hardcourts: 7

Average: 6

10. Verdasco

Clay: 6
Grass: 3
Hardcourt: 6

Average: 5

mtr1
07-19-2010, 11:19 AM
Nadal
Clay:10
Grass:8
Hard:7
Average: 8.3

Djokovic
Clay:7
Grass:5
Hard:8
Average: 6.7

Federer
Clay:8
Grass:10
Hard:10
Average: 9.3

Murray
Clay:5
Grass:7
Hard:8
Average: 6.7

Soderling
Clay:7
Grass:5
Hard:6
Average: 6

Davydenko
Clay:6
Grass:5
Hard:8
Average: 6.3

Del Potro
Clay:6
Grass:4
Hard:8
Average: 6

Berdych
Clay:6
Grass:7
Hard:6
Average: 6.3

Roddick
Clay:3
Grass:8
Hard:7
Average: 6

Verdasco
Clay:6
Grass:4
Hard:6
Average: 5.3

dmt
07-19-2010, 11:28 AM
I wonder why Murray and Davydenko are getting 8s on hardcourts when neither of them actually has a slam on that surface, while Nadal does. Nadal should atleast get the same score as those two.

Li Ching Yuen
07-19-2010, 11:31 AM
What surfaces?

There's a major tournament taking place on grass while the trillion rest are being played on clay or hard court.

Really pointless thread.

Nadalfan89
07-19-2010, 11:37 AM
It's not fair for Nadal to be within 1-10 on clay because Federer is about a 9 on clay and Nadal completely destroys him on clay.

Nadal should get a 11 or 12 on clay, and if he can't, no one should be able to get hgiher than 8.

Mustard
07-19-2010, 11:47 AM
1. Rafael Nadal
Clay: 10
Grass: 9
Hardcourt: 8

Average: 9

2. Novak Djokovic
Clay: 7
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 8

Average: 7

3. Roger Federer
Clay: 9
Grass: 10
Hardcourt: 10

Average: 9.7

4. Andy Murray
Clay: 5
Grass: 7
Hardcourt: 8

Average: 6.7

5. Robin Soderling
Clay: 7
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 7

Average: 6.7

6. Nikolay Davydenko
Clay: 7
Grass: 4
Hardcourt: 7

Average: 6

7. Juan Martin del Potro
Clay: 6
Grass: 5
Hardcourt: 8

Average: 6.3

8. Tomas Berdych
Clay: 6
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 6

Average: 6

9. Andy Roddick
Clay: 3
Grass: 8
Hardcourt: 8

Average: 6.3

10. Fernando Verdasco
Clay: 6
Grass: 3
Hardcourt: 7

Average: 5.3

mtr1
07-19-2010, 11:50 AM
I wonder why Murray and Davydenko are getting 8s on hardcourts when neither of them actually has a slam on that surface, while Nadal does. Nadal should atleast get the same score as those two.

Looking at my list, I seem to have made that mistake. I would move Nadal up to an 8 if I were to do my list again.

P_Agony
07-19-2010, 11:56 AM
1. Nadal:
Clay: 10
Grass: 9
Hardcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 9

2. Djokovic
Clay: 8
Grass: 5
Hardcourt: 9
Average on all surfaces: 7.3

3. Federer:
Clay: 8
Grass: 10
Hardcourt: 10
Average on all surfaces: 9.3

4. Murray
Clay: 6
Grass: 8
Harcourt: 9
Average on all surfaces: 7.6

5. Soderling
Clay: 8
Grass: 7
Hardcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 7.6

6. Davydenko
Clay: 8
Grass: 4
Hardcourt: 9
Average on all surfaces: 7

7. Del Potro
Clay: 7
Grass: 0 (only because he's done nothing on the surface yet, can improve in the future though)
Hardcourt: 9
Average on all surfaces: 5.3


8. Berdych
Clay: 7
Grass: 7
Hardcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 7.3

9. Roddick
Clay: 6
Grass: 9
Hardcourt: 9
Average on all surfaces: 8.

10. Verdasco:
Clay: 7
Grass: 2
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: 5.3

Federer is the ultimate all surface player while Nadal is a close 2nd. Surprisngly, I think Roddick is a close 3rd considering he's awesome on grass and hard courts and he played some good clay matches as well (nothing great, but not as bad as people make him). Murray and Soderling share the 4th place, and Djoko and Berdych are 5th. DP shares a spot with Verdasco but only because DP has no ranking on grass since he barely won matches on that surface. Keep in mind I consider him a FAR greater player than Verdasco, who will leave the top 10 very soon IMO.

VGP
07-19-2010, 11:59 AM
All this thread does is remind me how homogenized the tour is now.

Makes me wish it were like it was in the late 80s to early 90s......when there were essentially six surfaces on tour.

red clay
har-tru
rebound ace
deco-turf II
carpet
grass

(slow to fast - not accounting for variations)

....no wonder Federer's got 16 majors and Nadal's got 8.

P_Agony
07-19-2010, 12:00 PM
It's not fair for Nadal to be within 1-10 on clay because Federer is about a 9 on clay and Nadal completely destroys him on clay.

Nadal should get a 11 or 12 on clay, and if he can't, no one should be able to get hgiher than 8.

Nadal only destroyed Federer once on clay (FO 08). Otherwise their matches on clay have been really close most of the time with Federer almost winning a few and even having MPs at the Rome 06 final. They almost always went the distance in sets as well. Nadal is amazing on clay but Fed also gave him tough matches and beat him twice as well. I don't think Fed deserves a 9 on clay (an 8 is more appropriate) but he does on grass. He won the freaking grass event for 6 times already!

P_Agony
07-19-2010, 12:05 PM
I wonder why Murray and Davydenko are getting 8s on hardcourts when neither of them actually has a slam on that surface, while Nadal does. Nadal should atleast get the same score as those two.

You have a point, but here's my explanation:

I think both Davy and Murray are superior HC players (not by much though) but Nadal is the FAR greater match player, especially in slams. In fact, if we add a "match player" category to this list, nobody would even come close to Fed and Nadal, they are far above everyone else on "that surface" :-)

Davy is one of the best HC players in recent years and have beaten Nadal 5 times on that surface, but he's a poor match player which is why he never even made a slam final (no matter the surface). He's shown an improvment in the last year but failed again against Federer at their AO match. Davy will only win a slam if he improves in that regard.

TMF
07-19-2010, 12:34 PM
You guys make me laugh by giving player a 10+ point when 10 is the maximum. I don’t believe any player deserve a 10 b/c it’s saying that player has NO flaw. Even gymnastics abandoned the “perfect 10” scoring system.

LeoR
07-19-2010, 01:02 PM
Your post is SPEWING of bias.



You have the right to disagree with me.

Nadal at 11 for clay? Cool, because I thought the scale we were looking at started from 1 and ended at 10.


Because he is really really good on clay. Best ever probably.

You rank both Federer and Nadal on grass the same, I don't see how that adds up, mind if you expand on your reasoning for this one?...because I can't think of a logical answer. One has 2 Wimbledons, 3? grass titles and the other has 6 Wimbledons and 11 or so grass titles.

I take account Federer prime and now, and since 2008, Nadal is the superior player on grass. So, with a mix of whole career and currently I put that rankings on both.

LeoR
07-19-2010, 01:04 PM
You have a point, but here's my explanation:

I think both Davy and Murray are superior HC players (not by much though) but Nadal is the FAR greater match player, especially in slams. In fact, if we add a "match player" category to this list, nobody would even come close to Fed and Nadal, they are far above everyone else on "that surface" :-)

Davy is one of the best HC players in recent years and have beaten Nadal 5 times on that surface, but he's a poor match player which is why he never even made a slam final (no matter the surface). He's shown an improvment in the last year but failed again against Federer at their AO match. Davy will only win a slam if he improves in that regard.


That's strange. How can you be a better hardcourt player by having inferior results during all your carreer?

Because Nadal is stronger on clay, they think he is not a great hardcourt player, but he is easily top 5 on that surface.

Cloudy
07-19-2010, 01:17 PM
how are these figures calculated. Performance over entire career (which surely is unfair because for example Federer is several years into his career whereas someone like Del Potro is at the start of his) or current form.

In any event, Nadal has won the last two consecutive wimbledons that he has played so surely he is at least a 9 on grass.

How are these points made up. For example Nadal has a hard court slam and Murray doesn't. Are the slams given more weight in this calculation?

Also if you are looking over entire career, someone like Kolya has several MS titles on hard and several quarter and semis in slams. Is this overall more consistent than someone like Del Potro who has a slam but not the same results in MS tournaments, but then he is a lot younger so hasn't had the opportunities yet.

If we are going on potential we could make up any figures. What is the meaning of this thread?

Federer doesn't do as well outside slams does this dumb down his performance overall and again there aren't many grass tournaments to play on other than wimbers it's likely if he played 2 or 3 grass events he might not win all of those if it reflects his performance in MS and lesser tournaments.

MethodTennis
07-19-2010, 01:30 PM
1. Nadal:
Clay: 1
Grass: 2
Hardcourt: 8
Carpet: IDK


2. Djokovic
Clay: 4
Grass: 7
Hardcourt: 7
Carpet: IDK

3. Federer:
Clay: 3
Grass: 1
Hardcourt: 1
Carpet: IDK

4. Murray
Clay: 5
Grass: 4
Harcourt: 2
Carpet: IDK

5. Soderling
Clay: 2
Grass: 5
Hardcourt: 5
Carpet: IDK

6. Davydenko
Clay: 6
Grass: 10
Hardcourt: 6
Carpet: 2

7. Del Potro
Clay: 7
Grass: 8
Hardcourt: 3
Carpet: IDK


8. Berdych
Clay: 8
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 9
Carpet: IDK

9. Roddick
Clay:10
Grass: 3
Hardcourt:4
Carpet: IDK


10. Verdasco:
Clay: 10
Grass: 9
Hardcourt: 9
Carpet: 1



Clay rankings

1. Nadal
2. Soderling
3. Federer
4. Djockovic
5. Murray
6. Davydenko
7. Delpotro
8. Berdych
9. Verdasco
10. Roddick





Grass rankings

1. Federer
2. Nadal
3. Roddick
4. Murray
5. Soderling
6. Berdych
7. Djockovic
8. Del Potro
9. Verdasco
10. Davydenko






Hard Court rankings

1. Federer
2. Murray
3. Del Potro
4. Roddick
5. Soderling
6. Davydenko
7. Djockovic
8. Nadal
9. Berdych
10. Verdasco
(rafa and djockovic are equall on hard court in my oppinion)

Personally on hardcourt I thinka ny match between top 10 players can go either way

sjam316
07-19-2010, 01:31 PM
1. Nadal:
Clay: 10
Grass: 9
Hardcourt: 8.5
Average on all surfaces: 9.2

2. Djokovic
Clay: 6
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 6.6

3. Federer:
Clay: 9
Grass: 10
Hardcourt: 9
Average on all surfaces: 9.3

4. Murray
Clay: 5
Grass: 7
Harcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 6.6

5. Soderling
Clay: 7
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 6
Average on all surfaces: 6.6

6. Davydenko
Clay: 6
Grass: 4
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: 5.6

7. Del Potro
Clay: 6
Grass: 2
Hardcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 5.3


8. Berdych
Clay: 6
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 6
Average on all surfaces: 6

9. Roddick
Clay:3
Grass: 8
Hardcourt:8
Average on all surfaces: 6.3

10. Verdasco:
Clay: 6
Grass: 3
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: 5.3

Nadal and Federer are probably the greatest players of all time on their respective surfaces (Nadal-clay, Federer-grass), I don't think there's any valid argument for why they shouldn't have 10s.

fed_rulz
07-19-2010, 02:09 PM
1. Nadal:
Clay: 10
Grass: 9
Hardcourt: 8.5
Average on all surfaces: 9.2

2. Djokovic
Clay: 6
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 6.6

3. Federer:
Clay: 9
Grass: 10
Hardcourt: 9
Average on all surfaces: 9.3

4. Murray
Clay: 5
Grass: 7
Harcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 6.6

5. Soderling
Clay: 7
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 6
Average on all surfaces: 6.6

6. Davydenko
Clay: 6
Grass: 4
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: 5.6

7. Del Potro
Clay: 6
Grass: 2
Hardcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 5.3


8. Berdych
Clay: 6
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 6
Average on all surfaces: 6

9. Roddick
Clay:3
Grass: 8
Hardcourt:8
Average on all surfaces: 6.3

10. Verdasco:
Clay: 6
Grass: 3
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: 5.3

Nadal and Federer are probably the greatest players of all time on their respective surfaces (Nadal-clay, Federer-grass), I don't think there's any valid argument for why they shouldn't have 10s.

why is the guy with ONE HC slam title a 8.5, while the other with 9 HC slam titles, 4 YEC master's championships rated at 9?

MethodTennis
07-19-2010, 02:55 PM
why is the guy with ONE HC slam title a 8.5, while the other with 9 HC slam titles, 4 YEC master's championships rated at 9?

erm ******* obviously, stupid question :P

petetheileet
07-19-2010, 03:07 PM
Feds on clay = 8

Nadal on hard = 7

otherwise spot on OP

petetheileet
07-19-2010, 03:09 PM
Feds maybe even 10 on HC....

honestly he would be the best ever on the surface... in Grand slams since 04 look whats it has taken to beat him on that surface....

mono and 3 of the greatest performances i have ever seen

Tony48
07-19-2010, 03:30 PM
Feds on clay = 8

Nadal on hard = 7

otherwise spot on OP

This.

10 chars

OKUSA
07-19-2010, 03:52 PM
Default
Nadal
Clay:10
Grass:8.5
Hard:7.5
Average: 8.67

Djokovic
Clay:7
Grass:4
Hard:8
Average: 6.3

Federer
Clay:9
Grass:10
Hard:10
Average: 9.67

Murray
Clay:5
Grass:7
Hard:7
Average: 6.3

Soderling
Clay:8
Grass:5
Hard:6.5
Average: 6.5

Davydenko
Clay:5
Grass:3
Hard:8
Average: 5.3

Del Potro
Clay:7
Grass:5
Hard:8.5
Average: 6.83

Berdych
Clay:6
Grass:7
Hard:7
Average: 6.67

Roddick
Clay:3
Grass:8
Hard:8
Average: 6.3

Verdasco
Clay:6
Grass:4
Hard:5
Average: 5

aldeayeah
07-19-2010, 05:40 PM
Are we looking at their form right now or their peak form, or are we averaging their whole career?
If we look at their best, a rough approximation of these numbers would be 10x their win ratio over their best years. For example, Rafa has something like a 0.97 win ratio on clay (97%), which translates to a 9.7 on your scale.
I'll do exactly that! (disclaimer: source is Wikipedia)

Nadal (2005-2010) Clay: 9.7 Grass: 8.4 Hard: 7.8
Djokovic (2007-2009) Clay: 7.8 Grass: 7.6 Hard: 8.0
Federer (2003-2009) Clay: 8.5 Grass: 9.9 Hard: 8.8
Murray (2008-2009) Clay: 6.8 Grass: 9.0 Hard: 8.5
Roddick (2003-2010) Clay: 6.2 Grass: 8.4 Hard: 8.0
Del Potro (2009) Clay: 7.5 Grass: 5.0 Hard: 7.9

...and because I know you guys love these things:

Peak Nadal Clay: 10.0 (2006, 2010) Grass: 10.0 (2008) Hard: 8.2 (2008)
Peak Djokovic Clay: 8.4 (2008) Grass: 8.0 (2009) Hard: 8.3 (2009)
Peak Federer Clay: 9.0 (2009) Grass: 10.0 (2003-2007, 2009) Hard: 9.8 (2005)
Peak Murray Clay: 7.5 (2009) Grass: 9.1 (2009) Hard: 9.0 (2009)
Peak Roddick Clay: 7.7 (2005) Grass: 9.2 (2004, 2005) Hard: 8.4 (2004)
Peak Del Potro Clay: 7.5 (2009) Grass: 5.0 (2009) Hard: 7.9 (2009)

...and just for the hell of it:

Hewitt (2001-2005) Clay: 7.1 Grass: 8.5 Hard: 8.2
Agassi (1988-1996, 1998-2005) Clay: 7.4 Grass: 7.6 Hard: 8.1
Sampras (1992-2000) Clay: 6.8 Grass: 9.1 Hard: 8.6
Edberg (1985-1992) Clay: 7.1 Grass: 8.5 Hard: 8.4
Wilander (1982-1988) Clay: 8.7 Grass: 8.0 Hard: 8.3

Peak Hewitt Clay: 7.4 (2001) Grass: 10.0 (2002) Hard: 8.3 (2001)
Peak Agassi: Clay: 9.1 (1988) Grass: 10.0 (1992) Hard: 9.5 (1995)
Peak Sampras: Clay: 8.6 (1994) Grass: 10.0 (1995, 1999) Hard: 9.3 (1994)
Peak Edberg: Clay: 8.8 (1989) Grass: 9.2 (1988) Hard: 8.9 (1987)
Peak Wilander Clay: 9.5 (1983) Grass: 9.2 (1983) Hard: 9.4 (1988)

Ranking by surface:

Clay: Nadal 9.7, Wilander 8.7, Federer 8.5, Djokovic 7.8, Del Potro 7.5, Agassi 7.4, Hewitt 7.1, Edberg 7.1, Sampras 6.8, Murray 6.8, Roddick 6.2
Grass: Federer 9.9, Sampras 9.1, Murray 9.0, Hewitt 8.5, Edberg 8.5, Nadal 8.4, Roddick 8.4, Wilander 8.0, Djokovic 7.6, Agassi 7.6, Del Potro 5.0
Hard: Federer 8.8, Sampras 8.6, Murray 8.5, Edberg 8.4, Wilander 8.3, Hewitt 8.2, Agassi 8.1, Djokovic 8.0, Roddick 8.0, Del Potro 7.9, Nadal 7.8
Average: Federer 9.1, Nadal 8.6, Wilander 8.3, Sampras 8.2, Murray 8.1, Edberg 8.0, Hewitt 7.9, Agassi 7.7, Djokovic 7.8, Roddick 7.5, Del Potro 6.8

Clay (Peak): Nadal 10.0 (2006/2010), Wilander 9.5 (1983), Agassi 9.1 (1988), Federer 9.0 (2009), Edberg 8.8 (1989), Sampras 8.6 (1994), Djokovic 8.4 (2008), Roddick 7.7 (2005), Murray 7.5 (2009), Del Potro 7.5 (2009), Hewitt 7.4 (2001)
Grass (Peak): Federer 10.0 (2003-2007, 2009), Sampras 10.0 (1995, 1999), Nadal 10.0 (2008), Hewitt 10.0 (2002), Agassi 10.0 (1992), Roddick 9.2 (2004, 2005), Edberg 9.2 (1988), Wilander 9.2 (1983), Murray 9.1 (2009), Djokovic 8.0 (2009), Del Potro 5.0 (2009)
Hard (Peak): Federer 9.8 (2005), Agassi 9.5 (1995), Wilander 9.4 (1988), Sampras 9.3 (1994), Murray 9.0 (2009), Edberg 8.9 (1987), Roddick 8.4 (2004), Djokovic 8.3 (2009), Hewitt 8.3 (2001), Nadal 8.2 (2008), Del Potro 7.9 (2009)
Average (Peak): Federer 9.6, Agassi 9.5, Nadal 9.4, Wilander 9.4, Sampras 9.3, Edberg 9.0, Hewitt 8.6, Murray 8.5, Roddick 8.4, Djokovic 8.2, Del Potro 6.8

I'm aware of the glaring defects this way of evaluating surface prowess has, but I'm sure future posters will point them out better than I would.

Falloutjr
07-19-2010, 05:51 PM
Default
Nadal
Clay:10
Grass:8.5
Hard:7
Average: 8.5

Djokovic
Clay:8
Grass:7.5
Hard:9
Average: 8.16

Federer
Clay:8.5
Grass:10
Hard:9.5
Average: 9.33

Murray
Clay:6.5
Grass:8
Hard:9
Average: 7.83

Soderling
Clay:9
Grass:5
Hard:7
Average: 7

Davydenko
Clay:6
Grass:4
Hard:8
Average: 6

Del Potro
Clay:8.5
Grass:5
Hard:9
Average: 7.5

Berdych
Clay:8
Grass:8
Hard:8
Average: 8

Roddick
Clay:4
Grass:8.5
Hard:8.5
Average: 7

Verdasco
Clay:7.5
Grass:6
Hard:7
Average: 6.67

Fixed 10char

OKUSA
07-19-2010, 06:09 PM
Either Djokovic is extremely overrated or Federer is underrated.

On Clay and Hard specifically, and not to mention Djokovic lost in the 2nd round to SAFIN in his peak on grass. So his grass is overrated as well

Falloutjr
07-19-2010, 06:48 PM
Either Djokovic is extremely overrated or Federer is underrated.

On Clay and Hard specifically, and not to mention Djokovic lost in the 2nd round to SAFIN in his peak on grass. So his grass is overrated as well

I think if you can make it to the semis of a slam, you must be pretty good on that surface. I don't think its a stretch to say he's one of the 10 best grass-court players in the game today.

OKUSA
07-19-2010, 06:54 PM
He might be, but the grass court competition includes Fed, Nadal, Murray, Roddick..........

single_handed_champion
07-19-2010, 06:58 PM
He might be, but the grass court competition includes Fed, Nadal, Murray, Roddick..........

... who are all... what? Mugs?

OKUSA
07-19-2010, 07:00 PM
He said top 10, so unless they each occupy more than 1 person, then there are 6 other people to fill it out.

Hell, you could make a case that Hewitt is in the top 10

TMF
07-19-2010, 08:42 PM
Serena
Clay: 6
Grass: 8
Hard: 9
Average: 7.7

Martina
Clay: 7.5
Grass: 9.5
Hard: 8.5
Average: 8.5

Steffi
Clay:8.5
Grass:9
Hard:9.5
Average: 9


Someone can do it for Seles and Henin b/c if I were to do it there will be trouble coming from the Serena obsession.

adimax8
07-20-2010, 03:19 AM
Djoker
Clay: 8
Grass: 7.5
Hard: 9
Average: 8.2

Federer
Clay: 8
Grass: 10
Hard: 9.5
Average: 9.2

Nadal
Clay: 10
Grass: 8.5
Hard: 8
Average: 8.8

Murray
Clay: 5
Grass: 7.5
Hard: 8.5
Average: 7

FlamEnemY
07-20-2010, 03:39 AM
Only the top 4 for now.

Nadal
Clay: 10
Grass: 8.5
HC: 8
Total: 8.8

Djokovic
Clay: 8
Grass: 7 (I might get hated for this)
HC: 9
Total: 8

Federer
Clay: 8.5
Grass: 10
HC: 10
Total: 9.5

Murray
Clay: 6 (some people underrate him)
Grass: 8
HC: 8.5
Total: 7.5

edit: changed Nadal - grass from 9 to 8.5, however I'm willing to rate him a 9.

MethodTennis
07-20-2010, 05:33 AM
Peak Nadal Clay: 10.0 (2006, 2010) Grass: 10.0 (2008) Hard: 8.2 (2008)
Peak Djokovic Clay: 8.4 (2008) Grass: 8.0 (2009) Hard: 8.3 (2009)
Peak Federer Clay: 9.0 (2009) Grass: 10.0 (2003-2007, 2009) Hard: 9.8 (2005)
Peak Murray Clay: 7.5 (2009) Grass: 9.1 (2009) Hard: 9.0 (2009)
Peak Roddick Clay: 7.7 (2005) Grass: 9.2 (2004, 2005) Hard: 8.4 (2004)
Peak Del Potro Clay: 7.5 (2009) Grass: 5.0 (2009) Hard: 7.9 (2009)


THIS IS SO BIAS TO RAFA

He is not a 10 on grass, roddick is a miles better grass player at his peak and peak del potro would crush a peak rafa on hardcourt.

Also a peak roddick would beat murray on hardcourt

aldeayeah
07-20-2010, 06:25 AM
...Did you even read the post?

"Peak Roddick" doesn't get a 10 in grass because he's never made a grass season sweep like Nadal did in 2008. That's arguable, of course, with the limited number of grass tournaments per season and all, but it's unbiased.

With the same criteria, Agassi has a 10 in grass too, and that is far more arguable. But I left it in precisely to be unbiased and thus show the flaws of the method!

On the other hand, you do reek of bias yourself.

Bud
07-20-2010, 06:39 AM
THIS IS SO BIAS TO RAFA

He is not a 10 on grass, roddick is a miles better grass player at his peak and peak del potro would crush a peak rafa on hardcourt.

Also a peak roddick would beat murray on hardcourt

Roddick a better grass player than Rafa? :lol:

Drop the crackpipe and step away from the computer :)

P_Agony
07-20-2010, 06:50 AM
That's strange. How can you be a better hardcourt player by having inferior results during all your carreer?

Because Nadal is stronger on clay, they think he is not a great hardcourt player, but he is easily top 5 on that surface.

I explained the inferior results - Nadal is a far better match player than both Murray and Davy. Especially Davy.

LeoR
07-20-2010, 06:52 AM
THIS IS SO BIAS TO RAFA

He is not a 10 on grass, roddick is a miles better grass player at his peak and peak del potro would crush a peak rafa on hardcourt.

Also a peak roddick would beat murray on hardcourt

Nadal is the best grass player since 2008. Deal with it.

I explained the inferior results - Nadal is a far better match player than both Murray and Davy. Especially Davy.

It does not make any sense.

Semi-Pro
07-20-2010, 07:19 AM
You have the right to disagree with me.



Because he is really really good on clay. Best ever probably.



I take account Federer prime and now, and since 2008, Nadal is the superior player on grass. So, with a mix of whole career and currently I put that rankings on both.

There careers thus far should be looked at as a whole. How is it fair for the other player when you to take a season such as Nadals (2008 ) and Federers worst (2008 ) and start a time line from there? I can just as easily say from 2007 to 2010 Federer was the better grass court player...

LeoR
07-20-2010, 07:23 AM
There careers thus far should be looked at as a whole. How is it fair for the other player when you to take a season such as Nadals (2008 ) and Federers worst (2008 ) and start a time line from there? I can just as easily say from 2007 to 2010 Federer was the better grass court player...

I just pointed that Nadal is the superior grass player since 2008, I did not begin at this point. Overall, Federer has had a better career than Nadal, but like I said, I mix it with the current state.

Semi-Pro
07-20-2010, 07:31 AM
I just pointed that Nadal is the superior grass player since 2008, I did not begin at this point. Overall, Federer has had a better career than Nadal, but like I said, I mix it with the current state.

Career = so far (example: so far in Nadals career he has won 8 major titles) 'to this date', which is July 20 2010 and until one retires. I don't know what you mean by 'current state'...

P_Agony
07-20-2010, 07:34 AM
Nadal is the best grass player since 2008. Deal with it.



It does not make any sense.

That's probably because you don't know what a "match player" is.

MethodTennis
07-20-2010, 07:35 AM
Roddick a better grass player than Rafa? :lol:

Drop the crackpipe and step away from the computer :)

miles may be a large exageration but personally I think he is a better grass courter

coloskier
07-20-2010, 12:34 PM
For the past three years Fed has been the 2nd best clay court player on tour, #2 on grass, and #1 on all other surfaces. Nadal has been the #1 clay court player, #1 on grass, and below the top ten on fast hard courts. All you have to do is look at his YEC record the past 3 years.

TMF
07-20-2010, 01:22 PM
Federer: 9.5
Laver: 9.2
Sampras: 9.0
Borg: 9.0
Lendl: 8.5
Mac: 8.3
Nadal: 8.3
Agassi: 8.0
Willander 8.0
Becker: 8.0
Edberg: 7.8

Cloudy
07-20-2010, 01:31 PM
For the past three years Fed has been the 2nd best clay court player on tour, #2 on grass, and #1 on all other surfaces. Nadal has been the #1 clay court player, #1 on grass, and below the top ten on fast hard courts. All you have to do is look at his YEC record the past 3 years.

that makes no sense. How can you only use YEC as a gauge of form on hard courts.

Also he was injured so didn't even play it in 08

The only player outside the top 8 that Rafa has lost to on hard this year is Ljubicic
In 2009 the only players that Nadal lost to outside the top 10 on hard were Monfils - who shortly after that victory entered the top 10
and I think Cilic. He won one hard court slam and lost in the semi finals to the eventual winner of the other

In 2008 - admittedly he started the year in far worse form but the only players he lost to outside the top 10 on hard were Youzhny, Tsonga in the AO semi and Tsonga also entered the top 10 shortly after this, and Seppi. He then went on to improve his form and won Toronto and the olympics.

I don't think Rafa has finished lower than a QF in a hard court MS event or a slam since 2007 so to say he is below top 10 on hard courts is ridiculous.

MurrayisBEAST
07-20-2010, 01:40 PM
1. Nadal:
Clay: 9
Grass: 7
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: 7.6

2. Federer
Clay: 7
Grass: 8
Hardcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 7.6

3. Djokovic:
Clay: 7
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: 7

4. Murray
Clay: 4
Grass: 7
Harcourt: 9
Average on all surfaces: 6.6

5. Roddick
Clay: 5
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: 6

6. Davydenko
Clay: 6
Grass: 5
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: 6

7. Soderling
Clay: 6
Grass: 4
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: 5.6


8. Del Potro
Clay: 5
Grass: 5
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: 5.6

9. Tsonga
Clay:6
Grass: 4
Hardcourt: 6
Average on all surfaces: 5.3

10. Lubicic:
Clay: 4
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 5
Average on all surfaces: 5

aldeayeah
07-21-2010, 03:01 AM
delete post

aldeayeah
07-21-2010, 03:06 AM
10. Lubicic:
Clay: 4
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 5
Average on all surfaces: 5
Hilarious.

All of the post is hilarious, but this is the single most blatant misrating.

KingOfTennis
07-21-2010, 04:48 AM
[QUOTE=Dutch-Guy;4879245]Rank top 10 players on all surfaces

0-5 : mediocre
6-8: good
9-10: best


1. Nadal:
Clay: 10
Grass: 9
Hardcourt: 7

2. Djokovic
Clay: 6
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 8

3. Federer:
Clay: 8
Grass: 10
Hardcourt: 9

4. Murray
Clay: 5
Grass: 7
Harcourt: 7

5. Soderling
Clay: 7
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 6

6. Davydenko
Clay: 6
Grass: 3
Hardcourt: 7

7. Del Potro
Clay: 7
Grass: 4
Hardcourt: 8

8. Berdych
Clay: 5
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 6

9. Roddick
Clay:3
Grass: 7
Hardcourt:7

10. Verdasco:
Clay: 5
Grass: 3
Hardcourt: 6

Commando Tennis Shorts
07-21-2010, 07:00 AM
These ratings are hilarious and completely pulled out of the behind.

I thought (from the thread title) that the format would be something like this:

Grass:
1) Federer
2) Nadal
3) Murray
4) Roddick
etc.

Hard:
1) Federer
2) Murray
3) Djokovic
4) Nadal
5) Soderling
6) Roddick

And the like.

Commando Tennis Shorts
07-21-2010, 07:01 AM
^^^Much more manageable and not completely pulled out the a** like arbitrary 1-10 ratings. haha

coloskier
07-21-2010, 09:16 AM
that makes no sense. How can you only use YEC as a gauge of form on hard courts.

Also he was injured so didn't even play it in 08

The only player outside the top 8 that Rafa has lost to on hard this year is Ljubicic
In 2009 the only players that Nadal lost to outside the top 10 on hard were Monfils - who shortly after that victory entered the top 10
and I think Cilic. He won one hard court slam and lost in the semi finals to the eventual winner of the other

In 2008 - admittedly he started the year in far worse form but the only players he lost to outside the top 10 on hard were Youzhny, Tsonga in the AO semi and Tsonga also entered the top 10 shortly after this, and Seppi. He then went on to improve his form and won Toronto and the olympics.

I don't think Rafa has finished lower than a QF in a hard court MS event or a slam since 2007 so to say he is below top 10 on hard courts is ridiculous.

I didn't say "hard courts", I said "FAST hard courts". Slow hard courts like Miami are basically "hard clay". He has no finals at YEC or USO, whereas a number of players have made it to the finals of either.

Ripster
07-21-2010, 11:56 AM
These ratings are hilarious and completely pulled out of the behind.

I thought (from the thread title) that the format would be something like this:

Grass:
1) Federer
2) Nadal
3) Murray
4) Roddick
etc.

Hard:
1) Federer
2) Murray
3) Djokovic
4) Nadal
5) Soderling
6) Roddick

And the like.

Yeah. This is what I thought the thread would be like before I opened it. This 1-10 stuff is ridiculous.

Also I've seen a lot of 6/10 for Djokovic on clay. If he's 6 out of 10 then I hate to see what the rest of the field is like because he's a top 5 clay courter.

Mojo Jojo
07-21-2010, 07:14 PM
nadal

clay 10
grass 9
hard 8

avg 9



djokovic

clay 7
grass 6
hard 8.5

avg 7.165



federer

clay 8
grass 9.5
hard 9.5

avg 9



murray

clay 5
grass 7
hard 8

avg 6.67


roddick

clay 4
grass 8
hard 8

avg 6.67


delpotro

clay 6
hard 9
grass 3

avg 6

Mustard
07-21-2010, 07:39 PM
Why post the 5-set records?

Serendipitous
07-21-2010, 07:45 PM
10 bars......

Mustard
07-21-2010, 07:45 PM
Im sorry. :cry: :( I took it down.

No worries. But why post them? :confused:

dmt
07-21-2010, 07:55 PM
I didn't say "hard courts", I said "FAST hard courts". Slow hard courts like Miami are basically "hard clay". He has no finals at YEC or USO, whereas a number of players have made it to the finals of either.

sorry but hardcourts are hardcourts. Miami isnt hard clay. If it was so slow, then Nadal would have never lost to roddick there.

TennisFan008
08-02-2010, 02:33 PM
Why are there two grades for best? :-? Redundant, no? :-? :neutral:

jamesblakefan#1
08-02-2010, 02:47 PM
1. Nadal - Clay: 10; Grass: 9; Hard: 8.5
2. Djokovic - Clay: 8; Grass: 5.5; Hard: 8.5
3. Federer - Clay: 9; Grass: 10; Hard: 9.5
4. Murray - Clay: 4; Grass: 8; Hard: 8
5. Soderling - Clay: 8; Grass: 6; Hard: 7
6. Davydenko - Clay: 8.5; Grass: 2; Hard: 8
7. Del Potro - Clay: 7; Grass: 1; Hard: 8.5
8. Berdych - Clay: 7; Grass: 7.5; Hard: 7
9. Roddick - Clay: 4; Grass: 8.5; Hard: 8
10. Verdasco (still top 10?) - Clay: 7; Grass: 6; Hard: 7

Based off their careers of course, not current form.

Anaconda
08-03-2010, 12:34 PM
Posters who have actually posted in this section have next to no clue at all. Apparently, Verdasco on grass is now better than Djokovic on grass. Murray on grass is only a little worse than Roddick on grass. Hmmmm. Davydenko being equal to Roddick on Murray on hard? Lol wut? MurrayISBeast apparently thinks Murray is a better hardcourter than Nadal.....Doubt it. 1 slam to 0 doesn't lie. Also, according to MurrayIsBeast, Federer is only a little bit better on grass than he is on clay. Interesting, to say the least.

jamesblakefan#1
08-03-2010, 12:51 PM
Posters who have actually posted in this section have next to no clue at all. Apparently, Verdasco on grass is now better than Djokovic on grass. Murray on grass is only a little worse than Roddick on grass. Hmmmm. Davydenko being equal to Roddick on Murray on hard? Lol wut? MurrayISBeast apparently thinks Murray is a better hardcourter than Nadal.....Doubt it. 1 slam to 0 doesn't lie. Also, according to MurrayIsBeast, Federer is only a little bit better on grass than he is on clay. Interesting, to say the least.

You gonna come here and be a d0uce to everyone who actually posted a list, or you gonna post a list of your own, oh Mr Safin is the best CCer never to win RG?

Anaconda
08-03-2010, 01:03 PM
You gonna come here and be a d0uce to everyone who actually posted a list, or you gonna post a list of your own, oh Mr Safin is the best CCer never to win RG?

Nadal - 9 on grass/8 on hard and 10 on clay
Federer - 10 on grass/10 on hard and 8 on clay
Djokovic - 7 on grass/8 on hard and 6.5 on clay
Murray - 7 on grass/7.5 on hard and 4 on clay
Davydenko - 1 on grass/7 on hard and 6.5 on clay
JMDP - 1 on grass/8 on hard and 7 on clay
Berdych - 7.5 on grass/5.5 on hard and 6 on clay
Soderling - 5.5 on grass/6.5 on hard and 7.5 on clay
Roddick - 8.5 on grass/8.5 on hard and 4 on clay
Verdasco - 5 on grass/5 on hard and 5.5 on clay

rovex
08-03-2010, 01:06 PM
Roddick - 8.5 on hard
Verdasco - 5 on hard

This huge gap yet your boy Roddick gets spanked the last time they met on a hard court! Oh yeah, did i forget to mention Roddick had one of the easiest draws this decade to win his lone slam? He would be slameless if not for that.

jamesblakefan#1
08-03-2010, 01:06 PM
Your overrating of Roddick and underrating of Murray/Verdasco are quite humorous, snaketroll. And expected. :roll:

Anaconda
08-03-2010, 01:16 PM
Your overrating of Roddick and underrating of Murray/Verdasco are quite humorous, snaketroll.

Roddick on Hard

1 slam
1 slam runner up
5 MS titles
4 MS runner ups


Roddick on grass

3 Wimbledon runner ups
1 Wimbledon semi
1 Wimbledon QF
4 Queens titles


Murray on Hard

2 slam Runner ups
4 MS titles
1 MS runner up

Murray on Grass

2 Wimbledon semi's
1 Wimbledon QF
1 Queens club title.



Ok, i was a little harsh on Murray for the Hard courts, if i were to say 'as of right now' then Murray would clearly be ahead. But you need to look deeper into things if you're going to go by 'success wise'. Lets give Roddick 8 and Muray 7.5 then (seeing there is really only a slam win as a difference).

As for grass, well. I don't think even you would suggest that Murray is overall a better grasscourt player. Indeed this year, he was the better grasscourt player. However we are going by success which Roddick, whether you like it or not has had more. Even if we compare ages.



Verdasco? Why the hell would i give him 7's and 8's on hard, grass and clay? You can't justify Verdasco being very good on any surface. He made one semifinal in AO. Fine i'll bump his hard court rating up to 6 then. Seeing as he's done next to nothing on that surface. I'm starting to believe that his slam semifinal was actually a fluke and will never happen again.




Now let me guess. I pulled all of that out of my arse right?

jamesblakefan#1
08-03-2010, 03:58 PM
I'll use the same argument you use for Rod on grass for Murray on HC - if it wasn't for running into the GOAT he'd have a USO and AO right now.

You know what - on 2nd evaluation, I will say Roddick is a 8.5 just like the other HC slam champs Nadal, DP, and Djoker, and Muzza's an 8.

How is Murray only a 7 on grass and Roddick an 8.5? I put Muz at 8 and Rod at 8.5. I know you like to act like Murray's a nothing, but he's a above average GCer and should be rated as such.

I'll bump Djok up to 6.5 on Grass even though he's had some of the luckiest draws in Wimby history....but ok. (BTW Djokovic only 6.5 on clay? WTH...)

And Verdasco - I don't hold him in high esteem either. But saying he's no better than 5 anywhere? That's a joke. On clay he won Barca and made MC final Rome SF just this season, that alone warrants a 7. On HC he's made USO QF and AO SF, and won San Jose beating Rod in the final. If not 7 he's at least a 6.5 on HC, but definitely not a 5 for Pete's sake.

On grass perhaps I did overrate him a bit slightly. He has been Wimby 4R 3x. I think 5.5-6 is fair enough there.

Sandwichman
08-03-2010, 05:24 PM
I figured out the top ten on each surface based on the current top ten and their winning percentages throughout their careers, but my browser crashed when I posted it. I think it went something like

Clay
1.Nadal
2.Federer
3.Djokovic
4.Del Potro/Roddick (they were tied)
6 Davydenko
7.Verdasco
8.Berdych
9.Soderling
10.Murray

Hard
1.Federer
2.Roddick
3.Djokovic/Murray
5.Nadal
6.Davydenko
7.Del Potro
8.Berdych
9.Soderling
10.Verdasco

Grass
1.Federer
2.Nadal
3.Roddick
4.Murray
5.Djokovic
6.Berdych
7.Soderling/Verdasco/Del Potro
10.Davydenko

Those are all accurate, except for the Hard standings form about 6-10.

Mojo Jojo
08-03-2010, 05:47 PM
I figured out the top ten on each surface based on the current top ten and their winning percentages throughout their careers, but my browser crashed when I posted it. I think it went something like

Clay
1.Nadal
2.Federer
3.Djokovic
4.Del Potro/Roddick (they were tied)
6 Davydenko
7.Verdasco
8.Berdych
9.Soderling
10.Murray

Hard
1.Federer
2.Roddick
3.Djokovic/Murray
5.Nadal
6.Davydenko
7.Del Potro
8.Berdych
9.Soderling
10.Verdasco

Grass
1.Federer
2.Nadal
3.Roddick
4.Murray
5.Djokovic
6.Berdych
7.Soderling/Verdasco/Del Potro
10.Davydenko

Those are all accurate, except for the Hard standings form about 6-10.

hahahahahahahahahaha rofl hahaha lol rofl haha you canot be serious
http://www.independent.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00024/mcenroe_24150t.jpg

Falloutjr
08-03-2010, 06:01 PM
Hard:

1. Federer
2. Murray
3. Del Potro
4. Djokovic/Roddick
6. Nadal
7. Davydenko
8. Berdych
9. Soderling
10. Verdasco

Clay:

1. Nadal
2. Federer
3. Soderling
4. Djokovic
5. Del Potro
6. Verdasco
7. Berdych
8. Davydenko
9. Murray
10. Roddick

Grass:

1. Federer
2. Nadal
3. Roddick
4. Murray
5. Berdych
6. Djokovic
7. Soderling
8. Del Potro
9. Verdasco
10. Davydenko

All my opinion, of course.

Oh yeah, I forgot I already posted in this thread. Silly me :rolleyes:

GorillaPeanuts
08-04-2010, 02:07 AM
1. Nadal:
Clay: 10
Grass: 9
Hardcourt: 7

2. Djokovic
Clay: 7
Grass: 7
Hardcourt: 9

3. Federer:
Clay: 9
Grass: 10
Hardcourt: 10

4. Murray
Clay: 7
Grass: 8
Harcourt: 9

5. Soderling
Clay: 8
Grass: 7
Hardcourt: 8

6. Davydenko
Clay: 8
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 8

7. Del Potro
Clay: 8
Grass: 5
Hardcourt: 9

8. Berdych
Clay: 7
Grass: 8
Hardcourt: 8

9. Roddick
Clay:5
Grass: 8
Hardcourt:9

10. Verdasco:
Clay: 7
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 8

My Opinion :o

vortex1
08-04-2010, 02:26 AM
Del Potro has done nothing on clay to deserve an 8, except pushing poorly playing Fed to 5 sets on one occasion. I swear the guy is the most overrated player on the forum. Djokovic would stomp him and he's 7? The only reason Djokovic hasn't won anything on clay is that he ALWAYS ran into Nadal and managed to push him on several occasions.

dmt
08-04-2010, 06:23 AM
Del Potro has done nothing on clay to deserve an 8, except pushing poorly playing Fed to 5 sets on one occasion. I swear the guy is the most overrated player on the forum. Djokovic would stomp him and he's 7? The only reason Djokovic hasn't won anything on clay is that he ALWAYS ran into Nadal and managed to push him on several occasions.

correction: Djokovic did stomp him in Rome. Its funny, Nadal gets a 7 on hc despite winning a major (aussie open) and 5 masters 1000 events on it, plus the OG. Yet Del Potro (who hasnt won or even reached the final of a single clay ms1000 event) somehow gets an 8 on it. Funny stuff :)

abmk
08-04-2010, 06:27 AM
Del Potro has done nothing on clay to deserve an 8, except pushing poorly playing Fed to 5 sets on one occasion. I swear the guy is the most overrated player on the forum. Djokovic would stomp him and he's 7? The only reason Djokovic hasn't won anything on clay is that he ALWAYS ran into Nadal and managed to push him on several occasions.

federer wasn't playing poorly , he played fairly decently , juan was just too good .... his peak level on clay exceeds that of djoker , though overall at present I'd rate djoker ahead of del potro because he's achieved more

LeoR
08-04-2010, 06:27 AM
1. Nadal:
Clay: 10
Grass: 9
Hardcourt: 7

2. Djokovic
Clay: 7
Grass: 7
Hardcourt: 9

3. Federer:
Clay: 9
Grass: 10
Hardcourt: 10

4. Murray
Clay: 7
Grass: 8
Harcourt: 9

5. Soderling
Clay: 8
Grass: 7
Hardcourt: 8

6. Davydenko
Clay: 8
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 8

7. Del Potro
Clay: 8
Grass: 5
Hardcourt: 9

8. Berdych
Clay: 7
Grass: 8
Hardcourt: 8

9. Roddick
Clay:5
Grass: 8
Hardcourt:9

10. Verdasco:
Clay: 7
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 8

My Opinion :o

So Nadal is behind Murray, Soderling , Del Potro, Davydenko, Berdych and Verdasco on hardcourt, despite having a much better palmares and is far behind Roddick and Djokovic despite having a similar resume (and much more recent that Roddick)?

dmt
08-04-2010, 06:37 AM
federer wasn't playing poorly , he played fairly decently , juan was just too good .... his peak level on clay exceeds that of djoker , though overall at present I'd rate djoker ahead of del potro because he's achieved more

Based on? I dont see it. An inform Djokovic might have even beaten the federer of last year at the fo

rovex
08-04-2010, 06:39 AM
Based on? I dont see it. An inform Djokovic might have even beaten the federer of last year at the fo

An "inform Djokovic" appears to be long gone.

vortex1
08-04-2010, 06:44 AM
federer wasn't playing poorly , he played fairly decently , juan was just too good .... his peak level on clay exceeds that of djoker , though overall at present I'd rate djoker ahead of del potro because he's achieved more

No chance...In RG 2008, when Nadal was routing everyone with bagels and breadsticks, Djoker was the only one who took him to a tie break. And made another set respectable. Are you saying Del Potro would do better? Please, Nadal would make him look like a clown on clay.

At his peak, Djokovic was second best clay courter in the world. I'd say in 2008 he'd beat Fed, if he drew him in SF, like I said earlier, during clay season Djokovic's luck with draws always runs out and he always met Nadal.

And in 2009, Federer was diabolically bad during RG. He was much better in 2010, it's just Soderling played lights out and didn't choke.

djokovicgonzalez2010
08-04-2010, 06:52 AM
Rank top 10 players on all surfaces

0-5 : mediocre
6-8: good
9-10: best


1. Nadal:
Clay: 10
Grass: 8
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: I

2. Djokovic
Clay: 7
Grass: 6
Hardcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: am

3. Federer:
Clay: 7
Grass: 10
Hardcourt: 9
Average on all surfaces: not

4. Murray
Clay: 4
Grass: 8
Harcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: even

5. Soderling
Clay: 8
Grass: 7
Hardcourt: 7
Average on all surfaces: going

6. Davydenko
Clay: 8
Grass: 1
Hardcourt: Indoors 10 Outdoors 7
Average on all surfaces: to

7. Del Potro
Clay: 8
Grass: 0
Hardcourt: 8
Average on all surfaces: consider


8. Berdych
Clay: 6
Grass: 7
Hardcourt: 6
Average on all surfaces: averaging

9. Roddick
Clay:2
Grass: 8
Hardcourt:6
Average on all surfaces: These

10. Verdasco:
Clay: 8
Grass: 4
Hardcourt: 5
Average on all surfaces: Numbers

Sandwichman
08-04-2010, 07:15 AM
Yeah sorry Mojo Jojo, it must have Roddick and Djokovic that tied. Still, you don't have to be a jerk about it. Like I said, my browser crashed and I didn't remember the exact numbers.

I do remember that Nadal won 93% on clay, 75% on hard, and 83% on grass.

Federer won I think 77% on clay, 83% on hard, and 88% on grass, or something in the mid-high 80's.

Roddick was I think 66% on clay (I was surprised too), 78% on hard, and 81% on grass.

Djokovic was about 75%, give or take 5%, on all of them.

Murray was I think 54% on clay, then high 70's on grass, and somewhere in the 70's on hard.

Davydenko was 70 something on clay, 35% on grass (uberfail), and 70 something on hard.

Soderling was 59% on clay, and in the 60's on the others.

Del potro was high 60's/low 70's on clay, 60% on grass, and 60's/70's on hard.

Berych was 60's on clay, i think 72% on grass, and high 60's/low 70's on hard.

Verdasco was 70's on clay, 60% on grass, and 60's on hard.

Again, those should be pretty accurate, but I'm not sure.

Anaconda
08-04-2010, 12:17 PM
(BTW Djokovic only 6.5 on clay? WTH...)

And Verdasco - I don't hold him in high esteem either. But saying he's no better than 5 anywhere? That's a joke. On clay he won Barca and made MC final Rome SF just this season, that alone warrants a 7. On HC he's made USO QF and AO SF, and won San Jose beating Rod in the final. If not 7 he's at least a 6.5 on HC, but definitely not a 5 for Pete's sake.

On grass perhaps I did overrate him a bit slightly. He has been Wimby 4R 3x. I think 5.5-6 is fair enough there.


Everything before that i agree with.

Yeah Djokovic 6.5 on clay does sound silly, i'll put him 7 at the least.


Verdasco. Best hard court win this year was Roddick who was clearly out of sorts and just came back from his shoulder injury he suffered in AO. It was an accomplishment that Roddick was able to make the final and very nearly win it.

Here's the link if you think i made up the injury part. Roddick isn't one to blame injury on losses.

http://tennisconnected.com/home/2010/02/17/roddick-still-not-100-percent-after-shoulder-injury/


Getting back to Verdasco, he's won a few 250 events. That doesn't warrant anything over 5.5. His fluke semifinal swangsong bumps him up to 6. That's it. He's done next to nothing on hard courts other than that.

Clay, well, he wasted 10 minutes of my life in Monte Carlo (That's how long the match lasted for actually) which was the best he's played on a clay court, he won a bit on clay this year so yeah, i'll give him 5.5 (he was nowhere to be seen at Roland Garros).

Grass. 4th round last few years. How on earth this guy is a top 10 player with his resume. Inexplicable losses to Ancic and Karlovic at Wimbledon in 08 and 09 respectively don't do him any favours. Hasn't won a grass tournament and hasn't beaten any above average grasscourt player. 4 IMO. I mean come on. I gave Roddick a 4 on clay, and Verdasco's record on grass is only a tad better than Roddick's record on clay and the French Open. I'll give him a 4.5.


__________________________________________________ ____




oh and by the way. I'm not talking surface ability. I'm talking achievements which overshine ability. Verdasco have 7's and 8's by his name on every surface if we are talking about his skillset/ability. Someone like Davydenko and Roddick with limited ability would be way, way lower.

jamesblakefan#1
08-04-2010, 01:21 PM
Everything before that i agree with.

Yeah Djokovic 6.5 on clay does sound silly, i'll put him 7 at the least.

Only 7 is still too low. Same as JMDP who only has that SF last year and not much else. Djoker has multiple QF and SF at RG - sorry he doesn't have a final because he lost to some guy named Nadal a few times there - been Nadal's toughest opponent on clay outside of Fed (some would say tougher than Fed) and has that Rome title in 08. At least he's an 8, some would even say he's an 8.5 - 9.

Verdasco. Best hard court win this year was Roddick who was clearly out of sorts and just came back from his shoulder injury he suffered in AO. It was an accomplishment that Roddick was able to make the final and very nearly win it.

Here's the link if you think i made up the injury part. Roddick isn't one to blame injury on losses.

http://tennisconnected.com/home/2010/02/17/roddick-still-not-100-percent-after-shoulder-injury/

Getting back to Verdasco, he's won a few 250 events. That doesn't warrant anything over 5.5. His fluke semifinal swangsong bumps him up to 6. That's it. He's done next to nothing on hard courts other than that.

Clay, well, he wasted 10 minutes of my life in Monte Carlo (That's how long the match lasted for actually) which was the best he's played on a clay court, he won a bit on clay this year so yeah, i'll give him 5.5 (he was nowhere to be seen at Roland Garros).

Grass. 4th round last few years. How on earth this guy is a top 10 player with his resume. Inexplicable losses to Ancic and Karlovic at Wimbledon in 08 and 09 respectively don't do him any favours. Hasn't won a grass tournament and hasn't beaten any above average grasscourt player. 4 IMO. I mean come on. I gave Roddick a 4 on clay, and Verdasco's record on grass is only a tad better than Roddick's record on clay and the French Open. I'll give him a 4.5.
__________________________________________________ ____
oh and by the way. I'm not talking surface ability. I'm talking achievements which overshine ability. Verdasco have 7's and 8's by his name on every surface if we are talking about his skillset/ability. Someone like Davydenko and Roddick with limited ability would be way, way lower.

Ancic and Karlovic aren't bad on grass last I checked.

But OK. Your scale is all kinds of messed up IMO, but it is what it is. Agree to disagree.

Anaconda
08-04-2010, 01:30 PM
Only 7 is still too low. Same as JMDP who only has that SF last year and not much else. Djoker has multiple QF and SF at RG - sorry he doesn't have a final because he lost to some guy named Nadal a few times there - been Nadal's toughest opponent on clay outside of Fed (some would say tougher than Fed) and has that Rome title in 08. At least he's an 8, some would even say he's an 8.5 - 9.



Ancic and Karlovic aren't bad on grass last I checked.

But OK. Your scale is all kinds of messed up IMO, but it is what it is. Agree to disagree.

I think Federer is tougher on clay for Nadal. Federer has actually beaten him twice and has came close many times before. Ok, i'll increase Djokovic's rating to 8. I would say that Djokovic is the second best player behind Soderling not to win the French Open in this era. (the notion that i actually said Safin was the best claycourter of this era not to win was actually twisted - i said Safin was the most talented player overall not to win the French from this era, that's all)


Ancic was in his worst state in 2007, and wasn't in the same kind of form which nearly saw him make the Wimbledon 2004 finals. For a player of Verdasco's ability, he has no business losing to Karlovic in a slam.



And i don't really like rating people 1-10. I prefer to just ranking them in order i see fit.............


Grass

1) Federer
2) Nadal
3) Hewitt
4) Roddick
5) Murray

Hard

1) Federer
2) Hewitt
3) Roddick and Nadal are tied IMO
4) Djokovic
5) Murray

Clay

1) Nadal
2) Federer
3) Ferrero
4) Moya
5) Soderling

Carpet

1) Federer
2) Nalbandian
3) Hewitt
4) Nadal
5) I actually have no clue.


That's going based on achievements.

ucrctennis
08-04-2010, 01:53 PM
Averaged win percentage surface to surface (according to the ATP):

Clay Grass Hard Carpet Average


Nadal 9.27 8.33 7.55 2.00* 6.79


Djokovic 7.32 7.38 7.69 7.14 7.38


Federer 7.67 8.73 8.19 7.25 7.96


Murray 5.42 7.84 7.71 7.27 7.06


Soderling 5.88 6.00 6.19 7.86 6.48


Davydenko 6.46 3.46 6.22 6.47 5.65


Del Potro 6.60 6.00 6.74 6.67 6.50


Berdych 6.15 7.21 5.95 7.37 6.67


Roddick 6.64 8.11 7.76 7.14 7.41


Verdasco 6.30 5.95 5.69 5.29 5.81



These aren't perfect, but they do give an idea of where each player stands on a surface to surface basis.




*Nadal's record on carpet (2-8) torches his average here. I debated whether or not to include it, but 10 matches is too much to ignore.

miyagi
08-04-2010, 02:01 PM
How some of you are putting Djoko/Murray/Roddick above Nadal above Nadal on hard is strange to me. He has a slam, olympic gold and as many masters as any of them.

Only person above Nadal on hard is Federer imo!

Jchurch
08-04-2010, 02:18 PM
How some of you are putting Djoko/Murray/Roddick above Nadal above Nadal on hard is strange to me. He has a slam, olympic gold and as many masters as any of them.

Only person above Nadal on hard is Federer imo!

Peter Korda is pretty darn close also then right? Since he has a slam.

The-Champ
08-04-2010, 02:40 PM
These ratings are hilarious and completely pulled out of the behind.

I thought (from the thread title) that the format would be something like this:

Grass:
1) Federer
2) Nadal
3) Murray
4) Roddick
etc.

Hard:
1) Federer
2) Murray
3) Djokovic
4) Nadal
5) Soderling
6) Roddick

And the like.

I like your method. However, I would base mine on credentials, and it looks like this:

Grass
1. Federer
2. Nadal
3. Roddick
4. Berdych
5. Djokovic

Clay
1. Nadal
2. Federer
3. Söderling
4. Djokovic
5. Verdasco

HC
1. Federer
2. Rodddick
3. Djokovic
4. Nadal
5. Del Potro

Jchurch
08-04-2010, 02:46 PM
I like your method. However, I would base mine on credentials, and it looks like this:

Grass
1. Federer
2. Nadal
3. Roddick
4. Berdych
5. Djokovic


Could I ask why you put Berdych on the list and left off Murray?

The-Champ
08-04-2010, 02:54 PM
Could I ask why you put Berdych on the list and left off Murray?


A slam final is better than slam semi-final and queens title. IMO

Jchurch
08-04-2010, 04:08 PM
A slam final is better than slam semi-final and queens title. IMO

Why not put Hewitt up there then? I guess I coud see Berdych there but Djokovich is pushing it since he has been very inconsistent on that surface and Murray only lost to an unbelievably in form Roddick and Nadal this year.

abmk
08-04-2010, 07:51 PM
No chance...In RG 2008, when Nadal was routing everyone with bagels and breadsticks, Djoker was the only one who took him to a tie break. And made another set respectable. Are you saying Del Potro would do better? Please, Nadal would make him look like a clown on clay.

belluci actually gave nadal as much trouble as djoker did. Oh and yeah, I think a zoning del potro would definitely have done better than what novak did

At his peak, Djokovic was second best clay courter in the world. I'd say in 2008 he'd beat Fed, if he drew him in SF, like I said earlier, during clay season Djokovic's luck with draws always runs out and he always met Nadal.

And in 2009, Federer was diabolically bad during RG. He was much better in 2010, it's just Soderling played lights out and didn't choke.

2008, he met fed in monte-carlo, was getting thrashed , hence retired due to sore throat ( :lol:)

yeah, he was in worse form at the FO, but the pressure of a GS might've gotten to djoker and federer might have raised his level seeing djoker on the other side on the net ..

2009 FO, federer was on and off, he played very well at times, and crappy at the other times

abmk
08-04-2010, 07:54 PM
Based on? I dont see it. An inform Djokovic might have even beaten the federer of last year at the fo

don't think so ... fed was fighting tooth and nail, he wouldn't have given up .... besides djoker got whipped by kohl in straights anyways ..

my opinion that delpo's peak on clay is better than novak's is based on his 2009 run at the FO ... he played unbelievable tennis ...

I haven't seen djoker play at that level , no not even hamburg 2008 or madrid 2009, although they were close

The-Champ
08-04-2010, 08:58 PM
Why not put Hewitt up there then? I guess I coud see Berdych there but Djokovich is pushing it since he has been very inconsistent on that surface and Murray only lost to an unbelievably in form Roddick and Nadal this year.


Hewitt is not in the top 10.

MethodTennis
08-05-2010, 04:45 AM
ohh sorry i ranked them :S but i guess you can work out how i would rate them out of 10