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View Full Version : Returning serve w/ Forehand off AD sid in Doubles.


twocents
06-08-2005, 11:07 AM
Lately I'm having a very tough time returning serve from the AD COURT with my forehand in Doubles (4.0/4.5). My 2 handed backhand is very good. I've even tried setting up with a Forehand grip and Forehand stance. I normally hit with an Open Stance The returns either go long or wide.
Any feedback would be great. Thanks

kevhen
06-08-2005, 12:01 PM
Are you worried about the netman and then hitting harder and wider to avoid him? Play two back and you can hit up the middle and not worry about your partner becoming a target.

FREDDY
06-08-2005, 12:05 PM
or if all else fail try out the lob. its a mofo for your opponent.

twocents
06-08-2005, 12:07 PM
The netman is my Second concern. I can't return a forehand Period (from the Ad side). I've always had trouble hitting Inside-out w/ the Forehand. The 2 handed inside out backhand from the Deuce is not a problem.
Any suggestions.

FREDDY
06-08-2005, 12:11 PM
rally with a partner cross court from the ad side. it might help.

papa
06-08-2005, 02:09 PM
Well, you and I play the same doubles folks. At that level, lets face it, you're not going to get a lot of balls to your forehand - your not going to give them those nice easy shots so don't expect any yourself.

What can you do, several things. Work on your backhand so you can drive the ball deep back to the server feet and I don't mean just some wimpy floater or half-assed paced shot that lands around the service line. For some reason, and I don't have any proof, I think your probably tend to drift toward the alley trying to challenge the server to go down the middle because the backhand is questionable. Every time you do this, again I'm just quessing, you give the server reason to mix it up and go right down the middle - that what I do when I see the alley drift and boy does it force the errors. I also see them moving back a little, I like that too as I'm sure you do.

Another thing I'd suggest is worry about your own shot and forget about the net man. If he poaches once, fine, poaches twice go right at him or better still up the line - he'll stay put for awhile. When I say go at him, I mean it - right at him and the harder the better - he'll get it.

If you can't hit it back right or manage to otherwise to screw up the point, change sides - if you were my partner I'm not sure I'd leave the choice up to you but thats another point.

Also get a ball machine and set it up so you can return hundreds of balls from your receiving position - returning them right.

Not trying to be hard on you but doubles at this level should be very good and not just some picnic or walk in the park - you play hard, practice hard, and take this rather serious. If thats not you style, join the old guys (one myself so I can talk about them) at the club - many of them would be glad to have someone else to talk to. I'm sorry but 4.0 - 4.5 players should be able to consistently return service with a fair amount of sting.

kreative
06-08-2005, 03:11 PM
make sure you don't jam yourself. get in position, and setup early. aim down the center to give you the most margin of error. even if you hit it late, it won't go out wide. apply more topspin.

i believe there are some threads on "inside-out" forehand if you do a search through the archives.

bhaskart
06-08-2005, 03:21 PM
One thing that might help is to position yourself square to the server - in doubles, this will more than likely mean that you are facing your right net post. This helps in reducing the amount of upper body turn you need for an inside out forehand and could help in reducing your errors.

Kathy
06-08-2005, 04:31 PM
Hmm. Playing both-back is a last resort. Too high a price tag. Switching sides with your partner is another option.

I assume that you're right-handed. If you're getting a lot of forehands over there, they are centering the serve. Why? To poach the return and/or follow the serve to net? If not, is it because they recognize the weakness in your reverse-crosscourt forehand?

Can you get them to go for your backhand? If they recognise the trouble you're having, you won't be able to, of course.

Another option is to heavilly favor your forhand side so that you get more backhands. You can slide to the right after the service toss is in the air.

The reverse-crosscourt forehand isn't a difficult shot, but nobody ever practices it. I don't let team players miss a day of a hitting a few. I've seen high-school players learn the shot in just a few days of practicing a few minutes a day. So, I don't think you need to worry that much.

Nine-times-out-of-ten, when that shot goes south on somebody, it's because they aren't getting their right/back foot out of their way far enough. You must be aimed off to the right to hit the ball off to the right. So, make sure you're squaring all the way around to the server, not the net. This means you'll be turned a little to your right, with the left foot forward a bit.

Crosscourt shots are hit with a roundhouse swing, like a baseball batter pulling the ball. Reverse-crosscourt shots are like "hitting the other way" in baseball (toward right field). You need an almost straight swing. In fact, it's often called an "inside-out" swing, because the butt of the racket starts LATERALLY closer to the trunk of the body than it ends up. You thus usually get a little sidespin on the ball so that it curves outward.

So, make sure you're getting squared around far enough, and feel the straightness or curvature of your swing. It will help to sight the ball along your left arm. Point at it with your left arm. You should be able to see your free hand in your field of vision as you watch the ball approch.

The fellow who suggested just practicing a few reverse-crosscourt forehands with a friend was right. I bet that if you hit them for ten or fifteen minutes three days in a row, you'll be fine.

Doubles players MUST be able to volley and drive reverse-crosscourt. But most players practice 90% of their shots down-the-line or crosscourt, neglecting the reverse-crosscourt shot in practice completely.

twocents
06-09-2005, 05:40 AM
PAPA,
Thanks for not being too hard on me. I like the point you made about going right at the net player hard. I drilled him early. He only poached twice after that !!!
I AM an Old guy (52) too. Our Sr. team went to State finals in Cincy last year.I also play #2 (4.0) My record is 4-1. Open doubles and #3 (4.5). I won last night at Sr 4.0 at the #1 spot. I was rated 4.5 for 6 years but a couple years ago rated down to 4.0 where I've had a winning record each season.
THE ORIGIANL THREAD SAID:
"Lately I'm having a very tough time returning serve from the AD COURT with my forehand in Doubles (4.0/4.5). My 2 handed backhand is very good.
"LATELY" is the key word. I'm just trying to figure out why all of a sudden I'm having trouble with it. I should have made myself more clear.
KATHY,
Thanks for the suggestion about keeping the left foot forward. I set up that way when returing serve last night. I'm starting to think that was the problem.
I hit with an open stance and think maybe I wasn't getting the right leg out of the way and just arming it. With the left foot slightly forward I get more body into it.
bhaskart,
I never heard of facing the right net post but it makes sense. That way my stance isn't so open and I have the left foot slightly in front.
THANKS FOR ALL YOUR RESPONSES. ALL GREAT IDEAS.

papa
06-10-2005, 05:48 PM
PAPA,
Thanks for not being too hard on me. I like the point you made about going right at the net player hard. I drilled him early. He only poached twice after that !!!
I AM an Old guy (52) too. Our Sr. team went to State finals in Cincy last year.I also play #2 (4.0) My record is 4-1. Open doubles and #3 (4.5). I won last night at Sr 4.0 at the #1 spot. I was rated 4.5 for 6 years but a couple years ago rated down to 4.0 where I've had a winning record each season.
THE ORIGIANL THREAD SAID:
"Lately I'm having a very tough time returning serve from the AD COURT with my forehand in Doubles (4.0/4.5). My 2 handed backhand is very good.
"LATELY" is the key word. I'm just trying to figure out why all of a sudden I'm having trouble with it. I should have made myself more clear.
KATHY,
Thanks for the suggestion about keeping the left foot forward. I set up that way when returing serve last night. I'm starting to think that was the problem.
I hit with an open stance and think maybe I wasn't getting the right leg out of the way and just arming it. With the left foot slightly forward I get more body into it.
bhaskart,
I never heard of facing the right net post but it makes sense. That way my stance isn't so open and I have the left foot slightly in front.
THANKS FOR ALL YOUR RESPONSES. ALL GREAT IDEAS.

Every game has its good guys and bad guys - I can tell your one of the good guys. Tell the guy you play with that he has a good partner.

Kathy
06-11-2005, 12:26 AM
Yes, I can see where the open stance sets up the problem.

Long ago I experimented with stances and swings on my forehand. To my surprise, I found that I don't have to firmly adopt either an open or closed stance and either a roundhouse or straight swing. I can vary my stance and swing at will without any problem. In fact, learning to do this brought about a sea change in my forehand, making it a bona fide big shot.

So, when I want to roll a forehand sharply crosscourt for a winner, I use a pretty open stance and a roundhouse swing. At other times (e.g., to hit reverse-crosscourt), I use a closed stance and an inside-out swing.

BUT when I'm not playing well because my head is full of junk, I loose my "feel" for what I'm doing. I'm not aware of the stance and swing I'm using. Then I have trouble hitting reverse-crosscourt shots, because I am not getting that back leg out of my way. If you think about it, an open stance for a reverse-crosscourt forehand does point at the right net post.

Kathy K
www.operationdoubles.com

twocents
06-11-2005, 06:06 AM
KATHY K,
OPERATIONS DOUBLES is an awesome Website.
Thanks a lot.

Rickson
06-11-2005, 10:03 PM
Return from the deuce side. Problem solved.

twocents
06-12-2005, 10:06 AM
Rickson,
I didn't mention that's the way we played last year with me on the other side. From the Deuce I can hit the inside out 2handed back hand without a problem but have trouble when sent out into the alley with a slice. My partner has problem returning with his one hand backhand off the Ad but it seems we are more balanced that way. We are going back to basics with me on the Deuce. Tuesday night is 4.0 and Thurs. is 4.5 USTA night. We are 4-1 at (#2) 4.0 Doubles and lost in a 3rd set tie breaker at (#3) 4.5 Doubles. If it works I'll let you know IF THE PROBLEM IS SOLVED.

krnboijunsung
06-13-2005, 01:29 PM
Lately I'm having a very tough time returning serve from the AD COURT with my forehand in Doubles (4.0/4.5). My 2 handed backhand is very good. I've even tried setting up with a Forehand grip and Forehand stance. I normally hit with an Open Stance The returns either go long or wide.
Any feedback would be great. Thanks

Couldn't you just simply run around the forehand and hit with your backhand? set up more to your right (if you're right handed) and have you backhand ready to launch. Play with your strengths until your weaknesses are cured.