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fireice
02-20-2011, 05:54 PM
I'm having trouble comprehending this. A tight end or any given player in the NFL can get a concussion and be back in time for next week, but if Justin Morneau gets a concussion in July, he's out for the season? And if Sidney Crosby goes down with one, it's good news if he's back five months after that?

What am I missing? Is the NFL just that far behind on head injuries, or are other sports overprotective? I just honestly don't get it...

ollinger
02-20-2011, 05:59 PM
Don't think of concussions as a single level of injury -- there are a whole range of severity. The rule is to resume normal activity when all symptoms have resolved. Can't imagine a 5 month hiatus, the usual being closer to what the NFL does.

retlod
02-20-2011, 06:09 PM
Damage from concussions is additive. That was not Morneau's first concussion.

Manus Domini
02-20-2011, 06:13 PM
Damage from concussions is additive.

QFT

plus we all know football isn't a sport you need a ton of brains for. Throw/catch ball and run lol

in all seriousness, football is so concussion prone half of (I guess it is NFL but I thought that was Lax lol) would be out for months if it was such a long time

fireice
02-20-2011, 06:14 PM
Thanks guys. I'm by no means a medical expert, I'm just confused when there are such time discrepancies...

Don't think of concussions as a single level of injury -- there are a whole range of severity. The rule is to resume normal activity when all symptoms have resolved. Can't imagine a 5 month hiatus, the usual being closer to what the NFL does.

Well, Crosby got hit, what, end of December? They're talking about him not being able to return this season, so assuming the Penguins make the playoffs, that'd be...four months.

heycal
02-20-2011, 06:22 PM
plus we all know football isn't a sport you need a ton of brains for. Throw/catch ball and run lo

Funny you mention this. To me, football seems like the the sport that requires a lot of brain power, with the most learning and memorization, with dozens of different plays and signals and formations, etc. Seems very daunting.

In most other sports -- like tennis -- you just go out there and hit the ball or whatever. There's none of this "we're running play 28 zebra X, guys, on the count of 6 with a silent snap and double back crossing pattern B with a wildcat fake and double end sweep! Y'all remember that one, right? Good, go!"

maverick66
02-20-2011, 06:32 PM
Thanks guys. I'm by no means a medical expert, I'm just confused when there are such time discrepancies...

Every concussion is different. As a bruin fan I just watched as Marc Savard struggled really hard with concussions only to possibly lose his career. They are a tricky thing and once you get one you become more susceptible to them and they get worse.

Thats why they are really looking to eliminate head shots or give players better helmets. The reason the NFL doesnt seem to lose players as often actually has me a little curious as well. I wouldnt be shocked to hear that a big % of their players are playing with them.

Manus Domini
02-20-2011, 06:41 PM
Funny you mention this. To me, football seems like the the sport that requires a lot of brain power, with the most learning and memorization, with dozens of different plays and signals and formations, etc. Seems very daunting.

In most other sports -- like tennis -- you just go out there and hit the ball or whatever. There's none of this "we're running play 28 zebra X, guys, on the count of 6 with a silent snap and double back crossing pattern B with a wildcat fake and double end sweep! Y'all remember that one, right? Good, go!"

Tennis has point construction though, anticipating how your opponent is going to react in a fraction of a second

heycal
02-20-2011, 06:45 PM
Tennis has point construction though, anticipating how your opponent is going to react in a fraction of a second

Football has tons of anticipation and split second decision making as well. But it seems like the one major sport that also requires a huge amount of "book learning" as well. The quarterbacks have friggin charts and graphs taped to their arms these days!

Manus Domini
02-20-2011, 06:55 PM
still don't see how football is that brainy, just seems like a brain-less sport imo

heycal
02-20-2011, 07:14 PM
still don't see how football is that brainy, just seems like a brain-less sport imo

Did you miss the part about having to memorize dozens of different plays and formations?

And look what the QBs and others are doing while on the sidelines in between series -- talking on headphones and studying more charts and photographs, as if they didn't already have enough info. to absorb!

Then go watch tennis players, baseball ball players, basketball players, etc. in-between play. Mostly just sitting there like bumps on logs waiting to get back in the game...

albino smurf
02-21-2011, 04:00 AM
most football players have been raised to ignore concussions. Only recently has the league even really paid any attention to them and as a kid I remember players getting knocked out being lauded as selfless when they wouldshake it off and return to the field.

Manus Domini
02-21-2011, 06:14 AM
Did you miss the part about having to memorize dozens of different plays and formations?

And look what the QBs and others are doing while on the sidelines in between series -- talking on headphones and studying more charts and photographs, as if they didn't already have enough info. to absorb!

Then go watch tennis players, baseball ball players, basketball players, etc. in-between play. Mostly just sitting there like bumps on logs waiting to get back in the game...

I didn't but those plays get drilled into them. If you run the same play 200 times under the same name, someone says the name and that play is drilled into you. You aren't thinking it up on the spot like in tennis

heycal
02-21-2011, 06:30 AM
I didn't but those plays get drilled into them. If you run the same play 200 times under the same name, someone says the name and that play is drilled into you. You aren't thinking it up on the spot like in tennis

Are you out of your mind? If anything, a football quarterback has to think of things on the spot more than a tennis player does. He's also dealing with the movements of 22 players, and in a much more chaotic environment -- not just facing one guy in shorts 50 feet across a net.

stanton warrior
02-21-2011, 06:34 AM
Are you out of your mind? If anything, a football quarterback has to think of things on the spot more than a tennis player does. He's also dealing with the movements of 22 players, and in a much more chaotic environment -- not just facing one guy in shorts 50 feet across a net.

You don't need to be a genius for either one. But at least tennis isn't as boring.

Manus Domini
02-21-2011, 06:37 AM
Are you out of your mind? If anything, a football quarterback has to think of things on the spot more than a tennis player does. He's also dealing with the movements of 22 players, and in a much more chaotic environment -- not just facing one guy in shorts 50 feet across a net.

how many times can the ball be thrown by one side again in American football?

heycal
02-21-2011, 06:39 AM
You don't need to be a genius for either one. But at least tennis isn't as boring.

Some would say tennis more boring. My gf hates watching both sports, but particularly tennis, and particularly during some endless backhand to backhand rally.

Manus Domini
02-21-2011, 06:40 AM
football: pick up ball, everyone scrambles, throw to open player, he runs

tennis: serve, place serve, if serve is returned, deal with return and move opponent into unfavorable position, rally

stanton warrior
02-21-2011, 06:43 AM
Some would say tennis more boring. My gf hates watching both sports, but particularly tennis, and particularly during some endless backhand to backhand rally.

Not sure how many outside the states would find tennis more boring. Anyway, isn't football like 80% commercials?

And why backhand to backhand rallies?

Manus Domini
02-21-2011, 07:31 AM
Not sure how many outside the states would find tennis more boring. Anyway, isn't football like 80% commercials?

And why backhand to backhand rallies?

I'm in the states and I find football boring. I'm not alone in this either.

American sports:

Football: run away from people trying to kill you
Baseball: stand around and do nothing
Basketball: the only "American" sport requiring skill, but scoring a point takes a thousand fouls and time-stops

goober
02-21-2011, 08:10 AM
I'm in the states and I find football boring. I'm not alone in this either.

American sports:

Football: run away from people trying to kill you
Baseball: stand around and do nothing
Basketball: the only "American" sport requiring skill, but scoring a point takes a thousand fouls and time-stops

You are not alone in this- Ok. I can pretty much assure you the numbers of people who think watching tennis is boring is 100x, if not more, than football (and I like watching tennis). The three major netoworks alone in the US are paying $20 billion dollars for the right to broadcast some of the NFL season matchups. How much do you think Television is paying to broadcast pro tennis? 1% of that?

Your analysis of football and baseball for that matter shows you have little understanding of the sport. If you don'y understand the sport you will find it boring.

stanton warrior
02-21-2011, 08:17 AM
You are not alone in this- Ok. I can pretty much assure you the numbers of people who think watching tennis is boring is 100x, if not more, than football (and I like watching tennis). The three major netoworks alone in the US are paying $20 billion dollars for the right to broadcast some of the NFL season matchups. How much do you think Television is paying to broadcast pro tennis? 1% of that?

Your analysis of football and baseball for that matter shows you have little understanding of the sport. If you don'y understand the sport you will find it boring.

I guess I don't understand sports like swimming, ski-jumping, curling and the likes either.

goober
02-21-2011, 08:55 AM
I guess I don't understand sports like swimming, ski-jumping, curling and the likes either.

Your argument does not make sense.

I said if you don't understand a sport you will find it boring. Of course it is entirely possible to find sports you do understand boring. Obviously the sports you do not understand only constitute a subset of sports that you find boring.

Your description of Football: run away from people trying to kill you
Baseball: stand around and do nothing

shows very superficial understanding of the sport. It would be like me watching a chess match for the first time and declaring:

Chess: moving pieces around a checkered board and declaring it boring when you actually don't have a clue what is the purpose of each piece and all the possible strategies, moves and countermoves that are being done in front of you.

Manus Domini
02-21-2011, 09:02 AM
You are not alone in this- Ok. I can pretty much assure you the numbers of people who think watching tennis is boring is 100x, if not more, than football (and I like watching tennis). The three major netoworks alone in the US are paying $20 billion dollars for the right to broadcast some of the NFL season matchups. How much do you think Television is paying to broadcast pro tennis? 1% of that?

Your analysis of football and baseball for that matter shows you have little understanding of the sport. If you don'y understand the sport you will find it boring.

No, I just would rather watch skill sports. Swimming takes more skill than football, for example.

angharad
02-21-2011, 09:22 AM
No, I just would rather watch skill sports. Swimming takes more skill than football, for example.

Swimming takes different skills than football. Not necessarily more. I was someone that looked down on football for most of my life despite having several relatives who played or are playing college football. I wound up getting into it a few years ago, and I was honestly amazed at how much training and thought goes into it. It's a lot like tennis, in that it looks quite easy unless you know anything about it.

maverick66
02-21-2011, 09:22 AM
No, I just would rather watch skill sports. Swimming takes more skill than football, for example.

Did you ever play football?

Dave M
02-21-2011, 02:27 PM
Chess: moving pieces around a checkered board and declaring it boring when you actually don't have a clue what is the purpose of each piece and all the possible strategies, moves and countermoves that are being done in front of you.

Chess is not a sport.
Is'nt the reason the QB's have them written down so they can have prompts in mind but dont need it all written down and there is plenty of time in between plays or possesions to read up again.
Why does American Football have an offensive and defensive team?Why not just have 11 players?

In rugby there was always an immediate 2 week ban with a concussion.At all levels from under 8's up if it ;ooked like you had taken a knock the ref would take the player to one side and often request their removal from the game.
It can get worse with each one you get and take longer to recover though, I saw a programe last night that claimed Chris benoit went a bit crazy because of repeated concussions.

dennis10is
02-21-2011, 06:05 PM
still don't see how football is that brainy, just seems like a brain-less sport imo

You have not seen a football playbook.

Manus Domini
02-21-2011, 06:42 PM
Chess is not a sport.
Is'nt the reason the QB's have them written down so they can have prompts in mind but dont need it all written down and there is plenty of time in between plays or possesions to read up again.
Why does American Football have an offensive and defensive team?Why not just have 11 players?

In rugby there was always an immediate 2 week ban with a concussion.At all levels from under 8's up if it ;ooked like you had taken a knock the ref would take the player to one side and often request their removal from the game.
It can get worse with each one you get and take longer to recover though, I saw a programe last night that claimed Chris benoit went a bit crazy because of repeated concussions.

Chess is a sport

A sport is an organized, competitive, entertaining, and skillful activity requiring commitment, strategy, and fair play, in which a winner can be defined by objective means. It is governed by a set of rules or customs. Activities such as card games and board games, are classified as "mind sports" and some are recognized as Olympic sports, requiring primarily mental skills and mental physical involvement. Non-competitive activities, for example as jogging or playing catch are usually classified as forms of recreation.

Manus Domini
02-21-2011, 06:43 PM
Did you ever play football?

yeah somewhat and it was one of the most boring and brainless things I ever did

maverick66
02-21-2011, 07:06 PM
You have not seen a football playbook.

yeah somewhat and it was one of the most boring and brainless things I ever did

I was talking organized High School football. Not backyard football. It is not as simple as you think. I dont wanna insult you but you are coming off as an elitist really bad right now.

Manus Domini
02-21-2011, 07:08 PM
I was talking organized High School football. Not backyard football. It is not as simple as you think. I dont wanna insult you but you are coming off as an elitist really bad right now.

yeah I'm an elitist, try not to be but I can't help it.

But so are you if you think I have a possibility of playing high school football

maverick66
02-21-2011, 07:19 PM
yeah I'm an elitist, try not to be but I can't help it.

But so are you if you think I have a possibility of playing high school football

Im an elitist for thinking you could play high school football? I am not following that logic at all.:-?

Manus Domini
02-21-2011, 07:21 PM
Im an elitist for thinking you could play high school football? I am not following that logic at all.:-?

my school doesn't have it plus an ADHD kid with hypotonia would get destroyed in it anyway

heycal
02-21-2011, 07:48 PM
Swimming takes more skill than football, for example.

Each statement you make is more asinine than the next... Swimming takes more skill than football? Talk about a brainless and 'skill-less' sport: "Jump in the water and swim as fast you can!"

I don't play any sports these days except tennis (and I swim and jog for exercise), so I look at this issue pretty objectively. And of all the major sports, football seems the most complicated and requires great amounts of study and memorization. Very daunting compared to most others. The only reason you seem to deny this is because of your complete ignorance of the game.

Steady Eddy
02-21-2011, 08:30 PM
yeah somewhat and it was one of the most boring and brainless things I ever didAt the pro level, the strategy can be very entertaining. If a defense blitzes, that works well against runs and long passes. It's weakness is short passes. Zone defenses allow different gaps. The defensive line can look for a run, or simply rush the passer. When they rush the passer, they're more susceptible running plays like the draw.

There's alot of this back and forth between pitcher and hitter in baseball too. But, as a spectator, it's hard to see what's going on. It's hard to see it in tennis also. The serve might have set up his ace by spinning serves into the receiver, and then going down the T, but it's hard to tell that from the stands. In football, you notice the blitzes, play-fakes, etc. The strategies and counter-strategies are visible from the stands, and that makes football one of the most entertaining sports, IMO.

But to enjoy this aspect you've got to have some knowledge of the game.

albino smurf
02-23-2011, 04:51 AM
I think if you never played it you probably won't enjoy watching it. Baseball is the same as is tennis. To appreciate the nuances you have to experienced the situations you are watching, otherwise it is a guy throwing a ball around or hitting a ball or catching a ball.

Manus Domini
02-23-2011, 06:28 AM
Each statement you make is more asinine than the next... Swimming takes more skill than football? Talk about a brainless and 'skill-less' sport: "Jump in the water and swim as fast you can!"

I don't play any sports these days except tennis (and I swim and jog for exercise), so I look at this issue pretty objectively. And of all the major sports, football seems the most complicated and requires great amounts of study and memorization. Very daunting compared to most others. The only reason you seem to deny this is because of your complete ignorance of the game.

There is a technique for each stroke, football it's just throwing a ball...

Yes, people like watching football but that doesn't mean I see what you are talking about in it; to me, it is just throw ball, catch ball, run. Maybe I don't know the game, and I don't pretend to, but I have my opinion...

dennis10is
02-23-2011, 01:51 PM
I was talking organized High School football. Not backyard football. It is not as simple as you think. I dont wanna insult you but you are coming off as an elitist really bad right now.

NO, I was saying that football is complicated. My tennis coach also coached football and he always tell the tennis players that you have it easy compared to the football players.

JohnnyCracker
02-23-2011, 04:03 PM
There is a technique for each stroke, football it's just throwing a ball...

Yes, people like watching football but that doesn't mean I see what you are talking about in it; to me, it is just throw ball, catch ball, run. Maybe I don't know the game, and I don't pretend to, but I have my opinion...

Come on, man. I know you're not that dumb but you're trying real hard to look dumb. :)

Manus Domini
02-23-2011, 04:14 PM
Come on, man. I know you're not that dumb but you're trying real hard to look dumb. :)

Ehh I could go about this one of two ways.

1] Agree with you and claim I am being controversial just for the sake of being controversial

2] Continue on looking like a complete, self-absorbed, ignorant @$$.

Pick a number, any number lol

heycal
02-23-2011, 05:02 PM
Ehh I could go about this one of two ways.

1] Agree with you and claim I am being controversial just for the sake of being controversial

2] Continue on looking like a complete, self-absorbed, ignorant @$$.

Pick a number, any number lol

You're gonna have a hard time selling number 1.

Manus Domini
02-23-2011, 05:19 PM
You're gonna have a hard time selling number 1.

I know, I'm leaning towards 2

Especially considering I'm now considered a Satanic, Pagan Atheist at school for playing devil's advocate too much lol

fruitytennis1
02-23-2011, 06:33 PM
Mutiple severities of concussions...
One guy i know got 1 and 2 days later he was like 100%
Another guy was loopey for like 2 weeks and made like 3-4 trips to the hospital.

Power Player
02-23-2011, 06:42 PM
"Football: run away from people trying to kill you"

Speak for yourself, a lot of us ran right at them, and it worked out pretty well sometimes..lol.

maverick66
02-23-2011, 06:46 PM
Speak for yourself, a lot of us ran right at them, and it worked out pretty well sometimes..lol.

I tried that as a 90lb freshman. I wound up in the hospital. It was all in good fun though. I made the tackle but I payed the price for it.