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View Full Version : Would Federer play better now if he had 13 or less Slam titles won?


tennis_pro
04-19-2011, 05:51 PM
Just wondering if a guy who's still good and needs to win 1-2 more Slams to be considered the best of all time would play better than if he already had most majors won already?

Just look at Sampras. He broke the record at Wimbledon in 2000 and went 2 years slamless, had a perfect draw at the 2002 US Open when he avoided both Safin, Hewitt and had Agassi in the final against whom he had a huge mental advantage.

Is Federer going the same pattern? After he won Wimbledon in 2009 (thus breaking the record), he only won 1 Slam in favorable conditions. I mean, he's playing ok at the moment in Slams but he might just need that extra pre-2009 motiation to win another big title.

BigForehand
04-19-2011, 06:20 PM
yeah Fed seems like he don't give a F### after July 2009

mcr619619
04-19-2011, 06:31 PM
yup, i observed the energy and soul was much much less than before...but he's still my fave, i miss his fist pumping...

kishnabe
04-19-2011, 06:57 PM
Fed maybe needs one more slam to hit off a reel of more slams.....just need to remember he is still at the top. I don't know.

Well he would be in more pressure to answer for the 14th slam so he would worse to be honest.

DjokerIsTheBest
04-19-2011, 06:58 PM
Nope, I would say Federer would have played worse with fewer slams now. Too much pressure. He plays better when he's up. Same goes for slams. The reason he isn't winning now is he's just too old relatively speaking.

MichaelNadal
04-19-2011, 07:07 PM
I don't think lack of motivation is his problem at all.

cc0509
04-19-2011, 07:21 PM
yeah Fed seems like he don't give a F### after July 2009

How could he possibly be as motivated now? He beat Sampras' record slam count and he won that elusive FO title. After that, what is left for him really? An Olympic gold medal? I don't care how motivated he tells us he is in the press, it is simply not possible for him to be as motivated now as he has gone beyond his wildest dreams in terms of what he has accomplished. On top of that, he has a family now. That changes your perspective.

jones101
04-20-2011, 08:28 AM
How could he possibly be as motivated now? He beat Sampras' record slam count and he won that elusive FO title. After that, what is left for him really? An Olympic gold medal? I don't care how motivated he tells us he is in the press, it is simply not possible for him to be as motivated now as he has gone beyond his wildest dreams in terms of what he has accomplished. On top of that, he has a family now. That changes your perspective.

Have you been in the same position as him? Otherwise its just speculation.

http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTp5cQe0QMAftCFf0SqerC15FtaA9Qyt zUhFYQ9Z-XK-rGPc36QBFaYNdkNWA

Pwned
04-20-2011, 09:29 AM
Not motivated?

http://answers.bettor.com/images/Articles/thumbs/extralarge/2011-Australian-Open-Roger-Federer-survives-scare-against-Gilles-Simon-53342.jpg

http://www.tennisperspective.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/Australian-Open-Roger-Federer-d-Gilles-Simon.jpg

tenis1
04-20-2011, 09:33 AM
Nope, I would say Federer would have played worse with fewer slams now. Too much pressure. He plays better when he's up. Same goes for slams. The reason he isn't winning now is he's just too old relatively speaking.

This. He would feel too much pressure. Imagine if he is still chasing Sampras, no FO and the last slam he won was USO 2008.

cc0509
04-20-2011, 04:20 PM
Have you been in the same position as him? Otherwise its just speculation.

http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTp5cQe0QMAftCFf0SqerC15FtaA9Qyt zUhFYQ9Z-XK-rGPc36QBFaYNdkNWA

Of course I am not in his position and I am not Roger Federer(I am not delusional.) I am just saying that after all of the things he has accomplished it would "seem to me" that it would be difficult to be as hungry and motivated as you were when you were in your prime. On top of that his priorities have changed with a family, etc. That is my opinion. He does not look as motivated to me out there on the court lately that is for sure.

TMF
04-20-2011, 04:27 PM
Had Sampras won 18 slams, Fed would still be motivated as ever. Now, he has nothing more to prove.

cc0509
04-20-2011, 04:44 PM
Had Sampras won 18 slams, Fed would still be motivated as ever. Now, he has nothing more to prove.

Exactly. That is what I said as well. After he won 16 slams beating Sampras' slam record by two and then winning the FO which he had been chasing forever, I think he became noticeably less motivated to me. Sure he can still be motivated but as motivated as before, I don't see it. I think he probably wants to try to win another slam or two (?) and the gold medal at the Olympic Games and that will be pretty much it for him. Of course I don't know this for sure as I am not Federer (duh!) but that is what I think right now.

tenis1
04-20-2011, 04:47 PM
Exactly. That is what I said as well. After he won 16 slams beating Sampras' slam record by two and then winning the FO which he had been chasing forever, I think he became noticeably less motivated to me. Sure he can still be motivated but as motivated as before, I don't see it. I think he probably wants to try to win another slam or two (?) and the gold medal at the Olympic Games and that will be pretty much it for him. Of course I don't know this for sure as I am not Federer (duh!) but that is what I think right now.

So you speculate. ;)

cc0509
04-20-2011, 04:49 PM
So you speculate. ;)

LOL! Yes, I certainly do! :)

DjokerIsTheBest
04-20-2011, 05:12 PM
LOL! Yes, I certainly do! :)

By why speculate, it's not going to change the facts :)

hoodjem
04-20-2011, 05:24 PM
Certainly yes. Rodg would not want to remain forever one behind Pete.
(That would motivate the heck out of him.)




You know what else might motivate him still? When Rafa gets 15.

ninman
04-20-2011, 05:38 PM
I don't think that Rafa's slam count matters at all, it's all a factor of time. The amount of work and effort that's required is phenomenal. When you're young, early 20's that's fine, but after doing it year after year, it starts to get tiring. Plus he has a family now, and his career is winding down.

cc0509
04-20-2011, 06:00 PM
By why speculate, it's not going to change the facts :)

LOL, you are on my case too huh? Ha, ha. I never said I NEVER speculated. I just said in that Seles/Graf thread what is the point of speculating about what would have happened if Seles was not stabbed.

cc0509
04-20-2011, 06:03 PM
Certainly yes. Rodg would not want to remain forever one behind Pete.
(That would motivate the heck out of him.)




You know what else might motivate him still? When Rafa gets 15.

When Rafa gets 15? I don't think Fed will still be playing at that time "if" that ever happens, which to be honest, is a long shot.

DjokerIsTheBest
04-20-2011, 07:11 PM
LOL, you are on my case too huh? Ha, ha. I never said I NEVER speculated. I just said in that Seles/Graf thread what is the point of speculating about what would have happened if Seles was not stabbed.

Well you are wrong about not speculating for the graf/seles case. We should speculate. There is no point to anything. So why not do it?

cc0509
04-20-2011, 07:26 PM
Well you are wrong about not speculating for the graf/seles case. We should speculate. There is no point to anything. So why not do it?

Speculate all you want. I never said you or anybody else should not speculate just like you should not tell me that I am wrong if I think speculation on that topic is stupid. Also, I did speculate on the Seles/Graf thing. I said, it is my opinion that regardless of whether Seles was stabbed or not, Graf would still have more slams. OK?

DjokerIsTheBest
04-20-2011, 07:30 PM
Speculate all you want. I never said you or anybody else should not speculate just like you should not tell me that I am wrong if I think speculation on that topic is stupid. Also, I did speculate on the Seles/Graf thing. I said, it is my opinion that regardless of whether Seles was stabbed or not, Graf would still have more slams. OK?

Well if you can say speculation is stupid on graf/seles, then you can't tell me that I should not tell you are wrong about it :)

I know you speculated on the graf/seles thing even after you said it was stupid. Does that make you stupid?

cc0509
04-20-2011, 07:59 PM
Well if you can say speculation is stupid on graf/seles, then you can't tell me that I should not tell you are wrong about it :)

I know you speculated on the graf/seles thing even after you said it was stupid. Does that make you stupid?

I only speculated on the Graf/Seles thing to shut you up. But obviously that did not work. :)

tennis_pro
04-20-2011, 10:50 PM
Certainly yes. Rodg would not want to remain forever one behind Pete.
(That would motivate the heck out of him.)




You know what else might motivate him still? When Rafa gets 15.

by the time Nadal gets to 15 (if he does at all), Federer will be 32-33 years old

TMF
04-21-2011, 07:10 AM
By why speculate, it's not going to change the facts :)

You can speculate but have something to back it up and that's what cc0509 did. Roger at 16 slams today was completely different player when he was chasing Sampras's 14. Pressure got all started after 2004 when he won 3 slams in that year. People expected to catch and even surpass Samras. It carry on until he finally accomplished his goal. And RG was another weigh on his shoulder. He was constantly being ask about his chance or if he will ever win the FO, which would complete the career slam. The 2009 was the year that finally set him free when he got everything out of his shoulder. Would the media being on his case had he still stuck at 12 slams? Hell yeah.

Hitman
04-21-2011, 07:26 AM
You can speculate but have something to back it up and that's what cc0509 did. Roger at 16 slams today was completely different player when he was chasing Sampras's 14. Pressure got all started after 2004 when he won 3 slams in that year. People expected to catch and even surpass Samras. It carry on until he finally accomplished his goal. And RG was another weigh on his shoulder. He was constantly being ask about his chance or if he will ever win the FO, which would complete the career slam. The 2009 was the year that finally set him free when he got everything out of his shoulder. Would the media being on his case had he still stuck at 12 slams? Hell yeah.

I agree with this completely.

DjokerIsTheBest
04-21-2011, 07:52 AM
You can speculate but have something to back it up and that's what cc0509 did. Roger at 16 slams today was completely different player when he was chasing Sampras's 14. Pressure got all started after 2004 when he won 3 slams in that year. People expected to catch and even surpass Samras. It carry on until he finally accomplished his goal. And RG was another weigh on his shoulder. He was constantly being ask about his chance or if he will ever win the FO, which would complete the career slam. The 2009 was the year that finally set him free when he got everything out of his shoulder. Would the media being on his case had he still stuck at 12 slams? Hell yeah.

My response to CC was an inside joke from another thread. I was being sarcastic.

sbengte
04-21-2011, 10:23 PM
yeah Fed seems like he don't give a F### after July 2009

Something else changed immediately after he broke Pete's record : the birth of his kids. That is the real difference between Fed of 2009 and now , not lack of motivation from having 16 instead of 14 slams. It looks realistic now that Rafa may overtake Fed in the slam count in just a few years. Isn't that motivation enough to win more slams and secure his legacy? He did make the next two slam finals after getting to no.15, what motivated him then ?
Fed was on a streak of 18/19 slam finals when he failed to make the next four slam finals in a row. It cannot simply be attributed to sudden aging,decline in skills,field getting stronger all at the same time. It has got to be lack of focus or mental fatigue from all the off court distraction and stress of suddenly going from being carefree to being responsible for two kids and taking care of them.Surely something's got to give ? This may have made a difference to how fast Fed bounced back from his injuries,lung infection etc and the prolonged bad form resulting in some bad losses hit his confidence while giving the rest of the field the belief that he is beatable. Eventually it started affecting his slam results.

Why would he put himself through all this (dropping down in rankings, worsening his H2H, losing semifinals and finals and in a way hurting his legacy) if he wasn't motivated or didn't care ? It's not like he needs the money.

A lot of people say Fed looks disinterested and shows negative body language on court. I think he looks plain fatigued and tentative. Having a family is just stated as one of the secondary reasons i.e "and moreover he now has a family" while it seems like the single most important reason for his lack of focus and energy on court which reflects in his ranking and slam results. He did put together a string of good results in the second half of last year but he seems to have a problem doing that consistently and at the slams. Professional tennis requires single minded focus and it is not without a reason that there is only one man (Connors) who has won multiple majors after being a father. Based on their personal experience, most former pros like Becker and McEnroe had expressed their skepticism about Fed winning more slams after the birth of his twins. It looked like Fed would prove them all wrong when he won AO 2010 but it was just the huge wave of momentum he was riding from the previous record breaking year that helped him sail through that one.

lemon
04-21-2011, 11:56 PM
Definitely.

Rogie has lost any motivation now that he has become for-ever GOAT winning history max slams.

ibbi
04-22-2011, 02:41 PM
It's another excuse people make for him, but you know, he looked far more impressive in the summer of 2009 than he did in the summer of 2008, and he had a slam more under his belt.

TheTruth
04-22-2011, 03:10 PM
You can speculate but have something to back it up and that's what cc0509 did. Roger at 16 slams today was completely different player when he was chasing Sampras's 14. Pressure got all started after 2004 when he won 3 slams in that year. People expected to catch and even surpass Samras. It carry on until he finally accomplished his goal. And RG was another weigh on his shoulder. He was constantly being ask about his chance or if he will ever win the FO, which would complete the career slam. The 2009 was the year that finally set him free when he got everything out of his shoulder. Would the media being on his case had he still stuck at 12 slams? Hell yeah.

This is true.

The weight of expectations is always heavy. Now Federer is playing with house money. He can even afford these dips and inconsistency, because there's always those moments where everything clicks (voila moments, if you will).

I have no idea why Federer fans are getting so agitated. Once a winner, always a winner.

TheTruth
04-22-2011, 03:20 PM
Something else changed immediately after he broke Pete's record : the birth of his kids. That is the real difference between Fed of 2009 and now , not lack of motivation from having 16 instead of 14 slams. It looks realistic now that Rafa may overtake Fed in the slam count in just a few years. Isn't that motivation enough to win more slams and secure his legacy? He did make the next two slam finals after getting to no.15, what motivated him then ?
Fed was on a streak of 18/19 slam finals when he failed to make the next four slam finals in a row. It cannot simply be attributed to sudden aging,decline in skills,field getting stronger all at the same time. It has got to be lack of focus or mental fatigue from all the off court distraction and stress of suddenly going from being carefree to being responsible for two kids and taking care of them.Surely something's got to give ? This may have made a difference to how fast Fed bounced back from his injuries,lung infection etc and the prolonged bad form resulting in some bad losses hit his confidence while giving the rest of the field the belief that he is beatable. Eventually it started affecting his slam results.

Why would he put himself through all this (dropping down in rankings, worsening his H2H, losing semifinals and finals and in a way hurting his legacy) if he wasn't motivated or didn't care ? It's not like he needs the money.

A lot of people say Fed looks disinterested and shows negative body language on court. I think he looks plain fatigued and tentative. Having a family is just stated as one of the secondary reasons i.e "and moreover he now has a family" while it seems like the single most important reason for his lack of focus and energy on court which reflects in his ranking and slam results. He did put together a string of good results in the second half of last year but he seems to have a problem doing that consistently and at the slams. Professional tennis requires single minded focus and it is not without a reason that there is only one man (Connors) who has won multiple majors after being a father. Based on their personal experience, most former pros like Becker and McEnroe had expressed their skepticism about Fed winning more slams after the birth of his twins. It looked like Fed would prove them all wrong when he won AO 2010 but it was just the huge wave of momentum he was riding from the previous record breaking year that helped him sail through that one.

I think that every stone you throw into the water has some sort of ripple effect. During the last couple of years Fed had to deal with reaching the record, surpassing the record, and conquering the French.

He did all that.

So, what does the average person do after achieving such lofty goals? They exhale, or plateau, while they re-energize for the next battle.

Everything has to sink in and he has to make sense of it. Now, new hurdles have cropped up. Will Nadal equal or pass him? Will Djokovic remain consistent and affect the past duopoly? And what of the motivated youngsters, Raonic, Dologopolov, and as yet unnamed players?

It takes time to sort things out and arrive at a reasonable conclusion and plan a new attack. IMO, Federer's simply in a waiting period. It may take a few months to sort things out, but he's dealing with more things than we can even imagine.

I still think he's playing pretty good, so there's no need to worry at this point, imo.