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timnz
06-11-2011, 03:22 PM
To have a similar clay court record as Sampras AND a much better h2h record against nadal (since he wouldn't be meeting him in all those clay court finals)

or

His actual clay achievement and actual h2h against nadal

Bud
06-11-2011, 03:29 PM
How many more of these threads must we suffer? Federer fans appear to have a serious inferiority complex.

The guy has won 16 GS titles, so get off his back.

(who'd ever thought they'd see Bud defending Federer??) :shock:

kishnabe
06-11-2011, 05:56 PM
How many more of these threads must we suffer? Federer fans appear to have a serious inferiority complex.

The guy has won 16 GS titles, so get off his back.

(who'd ever thought they'd see Bud defending Federer??) :shock:


You would dfend or do anything for the glory of nadal :)

His actual clay achievement and actual h2h against nadal Rather have this....at least he can rub in sampras face. Everyone knows that Federer is damm good claycourter....it just isn't his fault to play one of the greatest clay courters in this era.

Bobby Jr
06-11-2011, 06:38 PM
What would Sampras rather have: 1 less slam and a winning h2h over the all-time GROAT* contender Hewitt

or

His current slam count and losing record to Hewitt

(*GROAT - greatest rabbit of all time)

On that note... would Safin chose to reduce his 2-7 losing record against Santoro in exchange for one of his slams?

Tennis_Monk
06-11-2011, 06:57 PM
Federer is happy with what he achieved. He stated that publicly and privately several times. He definitely has the Nadal H2H in his mind (and hence his losses to Nadal) and want to correct it a bit but not his #1 priority.

Like it or not, Sampras is not even in consideration for the Top tier of GOAT. At this point comparing Sampras to Federer is a honour to Sampras and purely academic.

PCXL-Fan
06-11-2011, 07:15 PM
We'll yes Agassi - Sampras head2head cannot be compared with Nadal - Federer.

Completely different scenario.

If Agassi met Sampras on clay, he would win 8-9 out of 10 times.

Simply Sampras wasn't good enough to get routinely deep into clay tournaments to chance many encounters with Agassi.

Hood_Man
06-11-2011, 07:28 PM
When Federer looks at his trophy cabinet (or in his trophy room!) he'll see 6 Wimbledon trophies, 5 US Open Trophies, 4 Australian Open Trophies, and one French Open trophy.

I think he's pretty happy with the way things have gone.

It's not like he's given some wobbly-headed Nadal-shaped novelty trophy every time he loses to Nadal.

fed_rulz
06-11-2011, 07:29 PM
Federer is happy with what he achieved. He stated that publicly and privately several times. He definitely has the Nadal H2H in his mind (and hence his losses to Nadal) and want to correct it a bit but not his #1 priority.

Like it or not, Sampras is not even in consideration for the Top tier of GOAT. At this point comparing Sampras to Federer is a honour to Sampras and purely academic.

You're right, especially after the nadal career slam. If nadal keeps his pace, it will be one among Laver, Federer and Nadal.

TheNatural
06-11-2011, 07:54 PM
To have a similar clay court record as Sampras AND a much better h2h record against nadal (since he wouldn't be meeting him in all those clay court finals)

or

His actual clay achievement and actual h2h against nadal

That's a good question. But if he had a dominant slam final h2h record vs Nadal this would give him a pile more slams and Nadal a pile less slams and Nadal would never catch up, so ofcourse he'd prefer if Nadal had many less slams now. SO the answer is he'd prefer Sampras' clay record, if that also gave him a bunch more slams and deleted a bunch of Nadals.This would give him a much stronger chance of ending up the best of his era by a mile, like Sampras did.

If we somehow magically we assume that having a dominant slam final record v Nadal didn't increase his slam count and reduce Nadal's count, then he'd only prefer Sampras' clay record, and a dominant slam final h2h domination v Nadal if he was also guaranteed to be the WImbledon goat, AND if Nadal was about 30 instead of 25, and if he was guaranteed there would be daylight between his final slam tally and the final tally of the next best in the era( Nadal's).

tennis_pro
06-11-2011, 08:45 PM
That's a good question. But if he had a dominant slam final h2h record vs Nadal this would give him a pile more slams and Nadal a pile less slams and Nadal would never catch up, so ofcourse he'd prefer if Nadal had many less slams now. SO the answer is he'd prefer Sampras' clay record, if that also gave him a bunch more slams and deleted a bunch of Nadals.This would give him a much stronger chance of ending up the best of his era by a mile, like Sampras did.

If we somehow magically we assume that having a dominant slam final record v Nadal didn't increase his slam count and reduce Nadal's count, then he'd only prefer Sampras' clay record, and a dominant slam final h2h domination v Nadal if he was also guaranteed to be the WImbledon goat, AND if Nadal was about 30 instead of 25, and if he was guaranteed there would be daylight between his final slam tally and the final tally of the next best in the era( Nadal's).

Lolwut? Seriously LOLWUT?

Sentinel
06-11-2011, 08:52 PM
Why do the Nadal fans have such an inferiority complex ?

TheNatural
06-11-2011, 09:02 PM
Lolwut? Seriously LOLWUT?


In summary Fed would take 1 less Fo, if he was given a 6-2 record in slam finals v Nadal and was guaranteed Nadal would never catch him in slams and if he was guaranteed to be WImbledon Goat. Ie if he was as dominant in his era as Sampras was. Otherwise he won't trade his 1 FO. :)

TheNatural
06-11-2011, 09:06 PM
You're right, especially after the nadal career slam. If nadal keeps his pace, it will be one among Laver, Federer and Nadal.

If Nadal keeps this up he will relegate Fed to 2nd best of the era and therefore to 2nd tier behind the best players of other eras.

Bobby Jr
06-12-2011, 01:03 AM
When Federer looks at his trophy cabinet (or in his trophy room!) he'll see 6 Wimbledon trophies, 5 US Open Trophies, 4 Australian Open Trophies, and one French Open trophy.

I think he's pretty happy with the way things have gone.
Ha ha... exactly.

In the future, alongside all those shiny trophies will be a framed printout of a screen grab from a tennis forum reminding him of his h2h record with Nadal. Just to remind himself what could have been if he'd just dedicated himself a bit more to being a great tennis player. :lol:

stringertom
06-12-2011, 10:39 AM
Ha ha... exactly.

In the future, alongside all those shiny trophies will be a framed printout of a screen grab from a tennis forum reminding him of his h2h record with Nadal. Just to remind himself what could have been if he'd just dedicated himself a bit more to being a great tennis player. :lol:

Just how does one appear in 10 consecutive major finals w/o dedication? I won't bore you with the list of his other accomplishments...suffice to say, you don't have a chance to succeed as long as Fed has w/o a total commitment to work hard & smart, train even harder & smarter and compete with the heart of a lion! Even w/o his huge successes, the matter of staying relatively injury-free this long displays his dedication to preparation and training.

It boggles my mind how dissatified TT'ers can get...with the emergence of Djokovic (I'm not too far out on the limb to claim he's not gonna go away, am I), we are possibly witnessing an unprecendented triumverate of tennis elites. 70's/80's tennis was very competitive but only Borg (especially if he hadn't retired so early) approached the level of iconic status. By his peak, Connors had waned a bit, Vilas was Borg Lite, JMac was on the rise, and LenLander were just coming on the horizon. Let's face it...we have three guys at or near their absolute best, duking it out every major and the ***** have to try and shoot holes in the armor of the best in the business. Just relax and enjoy the show!

World Beater
06-12-2011, 03:02 PM
LOL.

federer is a champ..he isnt scared to face his nemesis in the finals on his least preferred surface.

Federer doesnt give up even though he most likely will lose.

What did Nadal do when he lost in the french open to soderling - he didnt even try at wimbledon.

After losing for a few years at the french open, sampras gave up and just concentrated at wimbledon.

What makes fed a champ is his ability to keep coming back up even though you get knocked down - even when the odds are stacked against you.

Federer has been nailed 5 times at the french by nadal...you think he's gonna give up next year at the french...nope.

Its easy to be mentally tough when you are on your favorite surface and have the tactical and game advantage over your opponents.

Put sampras on clay, his mental toughness goes to the trashcan.

lets what nadal can do at the usopen...a couple of defeats by djokovic, del potro and murray will test his resolve there.

powerangle
06-12-2011, 04:13 PM
federer is a champ..he isnt scared to face his nemesis in the finals on his least preferred surface.

Federer doesnt give up even though he most likely will lose.



At this point Federer will never even up his h2h against Nadal (has been true for a few years now, but it is gradually getting more lopsided). Every chance Fed and Rafa plays is a chance for Fed to win. If Fed loses, it's business as usual. If he wins (miraculously), then more power to him. If he wins in a slam final over Rafa, then it just adds even more to his legacy (another slam title, etc)

At this point, playing Nadal won't hurt him...he can only benefit from it. 8-17....8-23...all negative anyway.

Bobby Jr
06-12-2011, 04:23 PM
Just how does one appear in 10 consecutive major finals w/o dedication? I won't bore you with the list of his other accomplishments.....
I think you misread the quite blatant sarcasm in my post. He is perhaps the most accomplished tennis player in history.. that's why I said "alongside all those shiny trophies will be a framed printout of a screen grab from a tennis forum..".

The h2h has no significant clout in overall lifetime achievement compared to the trophy cabinet. It only matter only to partisan forum bunnies - most of whom know about 1/4 as much as they think they do and who's idea of articulating their opinion is insults, selective use of statistics and trolling.