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sunnyIce
06-19-2011, 04:08 PM
Oh no he didn't. Why why oh why.

Found this from Andy, also a teaser from Nole. haha. we know who's side they are on. Youth Power!

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/latest/2011/06/19/nadal-is-the-best-murray-115875-23212726/

World number four Murray said: "Rafa for me is maybe the best. He's very young, he's got everything including a gold medal in the Olympics and the Davis Cup so that also is something that's very impressive."

He added: "He's won on all of the surfaces and his head-to-head record with Federer is very impressive, so I think he's got a very strong case for being the best player."

Djokovic was less willing to commit to either man but he feels Nadal's youth is an important factor. The Serb said: "Obviously results-wise it's Federer, he has won the most grand slams. He's still up there. But Nadal has been incredible the last couple of years.

"He has won the Olympics, he has won Davis Cup, he has won everything that a tennis player can imagine to win. So I think Nadal has maybe more years to play at the top of men's tennis."

TheMagicianOfPrecision
06-19-2011, 04:13 PM
By 2013 Nadal will be washed up and will fade away, i cant wait!!

Sid_Vicious
06-19-2011, 04:17 PM
By 2013 Nadal will be washed up and will fade away, i cant wait!!
It is okay, he will be the GOAT by then and the h2h would be 25-8.

als47
06-19-2011, 04:21 PM
Heh. I don't trust Murray's motives here.

bolo
06-19-2011, 04:22 PM
It is okay, he will be the GOAT by then and the h2h would be 25-8.

You are the Greatest Poster! :)

Tammo
06-19-2011, 04:24 PM
at least Murray knows something:):)

Nadalfan89
06-19-2011, 04:24 PM
Murray, the world number 4 who has played Nadal and Federer both on multiple occasions, vs fat neckbeards on TT.

rodrigoamaral
06-19-2011, 04:27 PM
By 2013 Nadal will be washed up and will fade away, i cant wait!!

doubt that would happen...

Rhino
06-19-2011, 04:29 PM
"...he's got everything including a gold medal in the Olympics and the Davis Cup so that also is something that's very impressive."


"He has won the Olympics, he has won Davis Cup, he has won everything that a tennis player can imagine to win."
[/COLOR][/LEFT]

I love the way they pretend that the World Tour Finals mean nothing.

TheNatural
06-19-2011, 05:06 PM
Oh no he didn't. Why why oh why.

Found this from Andy, also a teaser from Nole. haha. we know who's side they are on. Youth Power!

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/latest/2011/06/19/nadal-is-the-best-murray-115875-23212726/

World number four Murray said: "Rafa for me is maybe the best. He's very young, he's got everything including a gold medal in the Olympics and the Davis Cup so that also is something that's very impressive."

He added: "He's won on all of the surfaces and his head-to-head record with Federer is very impressive, so I think he's got a very strong case for being the best player."

Djokovic was less willing to commit to either man but he feels Nadal's youth is an important factor. The Serb said: "Obviously results-wise it's Federer, he has won the most grand slams. He's still up there. But Nadal has been incredible the last couple of years.

"He has won the Olympics, he has won Davis Cup, he has won everything that a tennis player can imagine to win. So I think Nadal has maybe more years to play at the top of men's tennis."


These guys just tell it how it is. There is no better judge than the strongest peers of Nadal and Fred.

March 2011:
Q. What was behind you saying to him in the trophy ceremony that you thought he was the best player ever?

NOVAK DJOKOVIC: Well, I think I have said what I needed to say. There is nothing behind. It's just what I think.

Q. So you think he's better all‑time than Roger?

NOVAK DJOKOVIC: I think he's the best ever because, even though he's 24, 25 years old, he has done so much already, you know. Many years in front of him to, you know, I think even to overtake Roger in the Grand Slam trophies.

sonicare
06-19-2011, 05:11 PM
Murray, the world number 4 who has played Nadal and Federer both on multiple occasions, vs fat neckbeards on TT.

actually..Murray who is 0-6 against the Maestro in slam finals.. on hard courts...supposedly his best surface..LMAO

TheNatural
06-19-2011, 05:15 PM
The judges have spoken, Nadal is GOAT

nikdom
06-19-2011, 05:16 PM
A 30 yr old p1ssing on their chances at GS events, what else do you think Murray and Djokovic are going to say?... LOL

Kissing up to Nadal is not going to buy Murray a big one. With that attitude of hero worship, in fact he can forget ever winning one if he ever has to face his buddy.

What a bunch of jokers. Like Roger cares what a guy with 2 slams and another with none thinks about him.

powerangle
06-19-2011, 05:16 PM
Of course Rafalito is the bestest ever. Vamos!

bolo
06-19-2011, 05:20 PM
It's safest to say that nadal's prodigicality has thrown the whole federer goat debate into total chaos. :) That's basically what happened at the USO last year and nadal keeps going with the FO this year.

Ofcourse you can't fault the young guys for getting a little excited and putting nadal ahead of federer already can we? Can we?!

TennisandMusic
06-19-2011, 05:23 PM
Nadal is the man of the hour once again. Maybe the best ever they say. Weeks ago Djokovic was literally unstoppable, now no one is talking about him at all. If Federer wins Wimbledon all of the talk will be how he is once again the best of all time.

The internet has made sports analysis pure insanity.

Mustard
06-19-2011, 05:25 PM
Murray has never made any secret of the fact that he's a big Nadal fan.

Tammo
06-19-2011, 05:27 PM
Did he say this recently?

Mustard
06-19-2011, 05:29 PM
Did he say this recently?

The Sunday Mirror article is from the 19th June 2011.

Rhino
06-19-2011, 05:38 PM
It will be hilarious if Federer beats Nadal in the final.

JustBob
06-19-2011, 05:46 PM
These guys just tell it how it is. There is no better judge than the strongest peers of Nadal and Fred.

March 2011:
Q. What was behind you saying to him in the trophy ceremony that you thought he was the best player ever?

NOVAK DJOKOVIC: Well, I think I have said what I needed to say. There is nothing behind. It's just what I think.

Q. So you think he's better all‑time than Roger?

NOVAK DJOKOVIC: I think he's the best ever because, even though he's 24, 25 years old, he has done so much already, you know. Many years in front of him to, you know, I think even to overtake Roger in the Grand Slam trophies.

And then proceeds to beat Nadal 4 times in a row and lose to Federer.

Soon enough, when both Djoker and Murray start piling up the Rafa beatdowns, they will both change their minds. :)

TheNatural
06-19-2011, 05:49 PM
And then proceeds to beat Nadal 4 times in a row and lose to Federer.

Soon enough, when both Djoker and Murray start piling up the Rafa beatdowns, they will both change their minds. :)

Nadal's FO win v Fred after Fred beat him probably reinforces his view that Nadal is the best ever.

TheNatural
06-19-2011, 05:54 PM
A 30 yr old p1ssing on their chances at GS events, what else do you think Murray and Djokovic are going to say?... LOL

Kissing up to Nadal is not going to buy Murray a big one. With that attitude of hero worship, in fact he can forget ever winning one if he ever has to face his buddy.

What a bunch of jokers. Like Roger cares what a guy with 2 slams and another with none thinks about him.

Maybe we should ask Max Mirnyi what he thinks instead. :oops:

JustBob
06-19-2011, 05:57 PM
Nadal's FO win v Fred after Fred beat him probably reinforces his view that Nadal is the best ever.

Yes of course. A 25 y/o Rafa beating a 29 y/o Fed on his best surface would reinforce that notion.


(In the brains of people with an IQ lower than their shoe size.)

TheNatural
06-19-2011, 06:11 PM
Yes of course. A 25 y/o Rafa beating a 29 y/o Fed on his best surface would reinforce that notion.


(In the brains of people with an IQ lower than their shoe size.)

so Nadal is less great now after thumping Fred again to win another slam. I see, Now I have heard it all.

nikdom
06-19-2011, 06:11 PM
Maybe we should ask Max Mirnyi what he thinks instead. :oops:

Who cares what Mirnyi thinks. It was folks like you and TheTruth who got their panties in a bunch.

RalphNYC
06-19-2011, 06:14 PM
By 2013 Nadal will be washed up and will fade away, i cant wait!!

Looking forward to this myself.

TheNatural
06-19-2011, 06:16 PM
Who cares what Mirnyi thinks. It was folks like you and TheTruth who got their panties in a bunch.

No. You are getting your scrunchies in a bunch about what Murray and Djokovic think. hypocite much.:oops:

AM95
06-19-2011, 06:18 PM
It will be hilarious if Federer beats Nadal in the final.

no.

it will be pure joy for me to see federer thrash murray in the final in 3 sets, more so than seeing a fedal final with federer winning. why? because he'll shut this pathetic excuse for a profesional tennis player up. until murray has a slam, he should keep his mouth shut and not weigh in on such opinions. he's a born loser who chokes in every big pressure moment, as seen in his 0-3 record in slam finals (2 of the losses coming to post-prime federer, and all 3 of these finals ending in three quick sets)

djokovic is doing well to keep his mouth shut after federer gave him a masterclass on clay..which is still unbelievable because thats federer's worst surface djokovic is like 6 years younger than him?

AM95
06-19-2011, 06:20 PM
so Nadal is less great now after thumping Fred again to win another slam. I see, Now I have heard it all.

i'd hardly call his performance "thumping". seems that you forgot about the gift federer gave to nadal by beating djokovic and then choking away the first set after being up 5-2.

sonicare
06-19-2011, 06:23 PM
Maybe we should ask Max Mirnyi what he thinks instead. :oops:

good point. both are major less. lol. at least max has a doubles slam

TheNatural
06-19-2011, 06:25 PM
good point. both are major less. lol. at least max has a doubles slam

Djokovic isnt majorless

illuminati
06-19-2011, 07:21 PM
murray and djokovic saying the obvious.

nadal is the best ever.

mandy01
06-19-2011, 07:26 PM
With Djokovic,it was an obvious dig (his reply during his interview was a dead giveaway) but I think Murray has always preferred Nadal and more importantly,Nadal's brand of tennis (I suppose he can relate to it in some ways).So it's fine.He's allowed to feel what he feels.

Sid_Vicious
06-19-2011, 07:33 PM
.......................

tenniselbow1
06-19-2011, 07:47 PM
"The judges have spoken, Nadal is GOAT"

Lol at Novak ever calling Nadal the GOAT over Rafa anytime soon after what happened in the French. He spoke way to soon at IW and said infact the opposite here at Wimbi. That was my first thought after Roger won actually, Novak will never be involved in this conversation again:) And thats what he's doing.

Murray (who also doesn't like Fed never has) just needs a good beating by Fed, its been too long:)

tenniselbow1
06-19-2011, 07:50 PM
That said if you poll the current ATP tour and all active players that have been on the tour with both Rafa and Roger in it. I'd guesstimate the number of players that would pick Fed at this moment are close to 85% or more. Fed's GOAT status is quite secure.

tenniselbow1
06-19-2011, 07:51 PM
The judges have spoken, Nadal is GOAT"

Lol at Novak ever calling Nadal the GOAT over FED anytime soon after what happened in the French. He spoke way to soon at IW and said infact the opposite here at Wimbi. That was my first thought after Roger won actually, Novak will never be involved in this conversation again:) And thats what he's doing.

Murray (who also doesn't like Fed never has) just needs a good beating by Fed, its been too long:)

Nicholas Warino
06-19-2011, 08:01 PM
According to this thread, the ability of someone at tennis perfectly correlates with their ability to judge the historical talents of other players' tennis abilities. Using this logic:

Murray and Novak say Nadal > Federer.

Nadal says Federer > Nadal.

Nadal > Murray and Novak.

Ergo, Federer > Nadal.

tenniselbow1
06-19-2011, 08:11 PM
That said if you poll the current ATP tour and all active players that have been on the tour with both Rafa and Roger in it. I'd guesstimate the number of players that would pick Fed at this moment are close to 85% or more. Fed's GOAT status is quite secure.

I change that the numbers would be over 90% close to 95% with just the "haters" like Murray saying differently. Murray needs a royal beat down from the Maestro soon:) Sampras, Agassi, Mats, Borg, and JMac have all picked a 29 yo 3rd seeded Roger to win at Wimbi.. Who do you think these legends have as the GOAT at the moment? :)

Nadalfan89
06-19-2011, 08:14 PM
According to this thread, the ability of someone at tennis perfectly correlates with their ability to judge the historical talents of other players' tennis abilities. Using this logic:

Murray and Novak say Nadal > Federer.

Nadal says Federer > Nadal.

Nadal > Murray and Novak.

Ergo, Federer > Nadal.

When you disregard the rest of your idiotic post, the bolded quote is actually correct.

pudelko
06-19-2011, 08:30 PM
To me it seems like Nadal is training hard to win. You can tell he probably trains twice as much as Federer just by his physique. He is at his peak and will probably continue winning slams for the next few years.

Federer seems to rely more on his raw talent rather then working harder to improve. Of course I could be wrong and he could train more then Nadal, but I dont think thats likely, especially now that he has a family.

Nadal definitely deserves to be considered GOAT if he manages to pass Fed in the Slam Count and if Federer doesnt win the gold medal next year. Not to mention the head to head.

Having said that I do cheer for Federer myself, just because I like his style of play more then Nadal's.

Omega_7000
06-19-2011, 08:38 PM
According to this thread, the ability of someone at tennis perfectly correlates with their ability to judge the historical talents of other players' tennis abilities. Using this logic:

Murray and Novak say Nadal > Federer.

Nadal says Federer > Nadal.

Nadal > Murray and Novak.

Ergo, Federer > Nadal.

+ 1

cc0509
06-19-2011, 08:42 PM
The bottom line is does it really matter what any of these players say? Everybody is entitled to his/her own opinion but who cares. It does not diminish in any way either Roger's or Rafa's achievements. It is all just extraneous noise really. Their achievements speak for themselves.

tenniselbow1
06-19-2011, 08:56 PM
To me it seems like Nadal is training hard to win. You can tell he probably trains twice as much as Federer just by his physique. He is at his peak and will probably continue winning slams for the next few years.

Federer seems to rely more on his raw talent rather then working harder to improve. Of course I could be wrong and he could train more then Nadal, but I dont think thats likely, especially now that he has a family.

Nadal definitely deserves to be considered GOAT if he manages to pass Fed in the Slam Count and if Federer doesnt win the gold medal next year. Not to mention the head to head.

Having said that I do cheer for Federer myself, just because I like his style of play more then Nadal's.

Read this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Olympic_medalists_in_tennis..

Now tell me WTH does the GOAT debate have to to with an Olympic Gold medal. How it can even be considered over even 1 WTF considering who has historically won it is beyond me. Agassi is the only player other than Rafa with over 2 slams to have won the thing! Preparation, conditioning, training for it is nowhere near as intensive for the top 10 players in the world at the moment and has not been in the past. Do you remember what happened last year with Rafa prior to his finals run in the WTF? He played to peak at the event as other players do as well (Much like a slam). This does not happen with the Olympics.

nadalbestclass
06-19-2011, 08:58 PM
Why does it bother people that Murray or Djoko push for Rafa? It's just their opinion...maybe they share a better relationship with Rafa. Maybe there is some hidden agenda. Who knows? It's not like God has spoken and declared Rafa greater than Fed!

Anyway, as Rafa said 6 is a lot and still very far away. Right now, it will be nice if he can equal Borg in the number of slams.

TheNatural
06-19-2011, 09:08 PM
The bottom line is does it really matter what any of these players say? Everybody is entitled to his/her own opinion but who cares. It does not diminish in any way either Roger's or Rafa's achievements. It is all just extraneous noise really. Their achievements speak for themselves.

yes, but its very noteworthy to know what the 2 best players outside of Fed and Nadal think and why they think it. Opinions are often debated in this forum, and the opinions of the top players hold infinitely more weight than that of forum members. Forum users can look to what the top players think so find out truths. Who cares if some forum members do not highly regard the davis cup or Gold in singles or favorable h2h just because these achievements don't favor their favorite player. Besides highlighting the current slam #s that Nadal has, the fact these top guys highlight these other achievements when they reason why Nadal is the greatest, shows how highly they regard them all. Guys like Sampras and Mcenroe also highlight these other achievements besides Nadal's growing slam # when they say Nadal has a strong arguement for already being regarded as the greatest ever.

mandy01
06-19-2011, 09:11 PM
Guys like Sampras and Mcenroe also highlight these other achievements besides Nadal's growing slam # when they say Nadal has a strong arguement for already being regarded as the greatest ever.
And yet,going by pure statistics,Nadal doesn't lead Federer anywhere except clay.But then we already knew how great he is on clay.

LetsGoRoddick
06-19-2011, 09:11 PM
We already know Murray is the biggest ********* on tour.

cc0509
06-19-2011, 09:24 PM
yes, but its very noteworthy to know what the 2 best players outside of Fed and Nadal think and why they think it. Opinions are often debated in this forum, and the opinions of the top players hold infinitely more weight than that of forum members. Forum users can look to what the top players think so find out truths. Who cares if some forum members do not highly regard the davis cup or Gold in singles or favorable h2h just because these achievements don't favor their favorite player. Besides highlighting the current slam #s that Nadal has, the fact these top guys highlight these other achievements when they reason why Nadal is the greatest, shows how highly they regard them all. Guys like Sampras and Mcenroe also highlight these other achievements besides Nadal's growing slam # when they say Nadal has a strong arguement for already being regarded as the greatest ever.

To me it seems you are too influenced by what Djokovic or Murray say at any given moment. Djokovic has said in the span of six months that both Roger and Rafa are the greatest. Djokovic would say the Devil is the greatest if he thought that was the thing to say at the time. Djokovic also did not say Nadal was the greatest in his most recent comment. He said in terms of achievements Roger is still the best and this is true. He went on to say Nadal is still young and can still achieve more which is also true, but at this point in time Nadal is not the greatest.

People like McEnroe and other commentators change their tunes every week it seems as well. You have to take what any of them say with a grain of salt imo. You have to realize most of these players or commentators that make comments about players usually have an agenda. The only thing that can determine who the greatest is right now is the overall achievements of a player. You can argue all night and all day, but, in terms of achievements Nadal is not the best, yet. He may well be at some point, but right at this very moment Roger is the best and I don't care if Laver, Borg, Lendl, and God him/herself comes out tomorrow and states Nadal is the best. It will not be so until Nadal surpasses Roger in all the pertinent tennis records. That is my opinion.

Magnus
06-19-2011, 09:25 PM
I respect Murray's opinion, although I am not sure if its truly his opinion or that he lets his issues with Roger get in the way. I don't think a "best player" exists, but Nadal is up there with the best. Funny to see all the *******s hailing Murray and each other as if this is some kind of a revelation.

Sentinel
06-19-2011, 09:25 PM
These guys just tell it how it is. There is no better judge than the strongest peers of Nadal and Fred.

Yet when other greats who have more slams than Murray, or seniors who have played over a decade such as Max say something for Roger then you guys club them mercilessly.

When someone praises Nasal, its the truth, if they praise Roger, the guy is a hater/delusional etc.

Good standards, bro. :)

p.s. and if Uncle Phoni says Fred is the best, then just sweep it under the carpet as PR, or psyching up little Nadal ;)

Magnus
06-19-2011, 09:25 PM
Nadal is the man of the hour once again. Maybe the best ever they say. Weeks ago Djokovic was literally unstoppable, now no one is talking about him at all. If Federer wins Wimbledon all of the talk will be how he is once again the best of all time.

The internet has made sports analysis pure insanity.

This is probably the one and only time I will ever agree with you.

cc0509
06-19-2011, 09:26 PM
And yet,going by pure statistics,Nadal doesn't lead Federer anywhere except clay.But then we already knew how great he is on clay.

Very true.

Magnus
06-19-2011, 09:29 PM
"The judges have spoken, Nadal is GOAT"

Lol at Novak ever calling Nadal the GOAT over Rafa anytime soon after what happened in the French. He spoke way to soon at IW and said infact the opposite here at Wimbi. That was my first thought after Roger won actually, Novak will never be involved in this conversation again:) And thats what he's doing.

Murray (who also doesn't like Fed never has) just needs a good beating by Fed, its been too long:)

I like Murray, but Fed beating him in another major final would be pretty sweet. Murray has proved he could beat Fed in the smaller events but Fed won where it counts most. Hasn't lost a set to Murray in slams in fact.

cc0509
06-19-2011, 09:30 PM
Yet when other greats who have more slams than Murray, or seniors who have played over a decade such as Max say something for Roger then you guys club them mercilessly.

When someone praises Nasal, its the truth, if they praise Roger, the guy is a hater/delusional etc.

Good standards, bro. :)

p.s. and if Uncle Phoni says Fred is the best, then just sweep it under the carpet as PR, or psyching up little Nadal ;)


LOLLLLLL! So true. It is so obvious and so transparent, don't these crazy *******s see it? Maybe it is too intellectually difficult for them and they are not able to grasp such a concept. :)

TheNatural
06-19-2011, 09:46 PM
To me it seems you are too influenced by what Djokovic or Murray say at any given moment. Djokovic has said in the span of six months that both Roger and Rafa are the greatest. Djokovic would say the Devil is the greatest if he thought that was the thing to say at the time. Djokovic also did not say Nadal was the greatest in his most recent comment. He said in terms of achievements Roger is still the best and this is true. He went on to say Nadal is still young and can still achieve more which is also true, but at this point in time Nadal is not the greatest.

People like McEnroe and other commentators change their tunes every week it seems as well. You have to take what any of them say with a grain of salt imo. You have to realize most of these players or commentators that make comments about players usually have an agenda. The only thing that can determine who the greatest is right now is the overall achievements of a player. You can argue all night and all day, but, in terms of achievements Nadal is not the best, yet. He may well be at some point, but right at this very moment Roger is the best and I don't care if Laver, Borg, Lendl, and God him/herself comes out tomorrow and states Nadal is the best. It will not be so until Nadal surpasses Roger in all the pertinent tennis records. That is my opinion.

I'm certainly not too influenced too much by What Djoker and Murray say. Im seeing it all unfold myself as well before they even commented on this, and have heard loads of expert commentators, greats and ex players say similar things. You said all the players and commentators continually change their minds which shows just how much the 'best of this era' tag, and by extension the 'best ever' tag is under contention. It's pretty normal for everyone to constantly change their minds about where Fed and Nadal stand, since they are active player, so every slam keeps changing the balance of the debate.

Sentinel
06-19-2011, 10:08 PM
And yet,going by pure statistics,Nadal doesn't lead Federer anywhere except clay.But then we already knew how great he is on clay.
yeah, were it not for Noel and John Isner, Nasal would be the undisputed King of Clay !

TheNatural
06-19-2011, 10:20 PM
And yet,going by pure statistics,Nadal doesn't lead Federer anywhere except clay.But then we already knew how great he is on clay.

If we want to talk about pure statistics,in the most prestigious events, the slams, Nadal leads Federer h2h on 2 surfaces and Fed leads Nadal on 1 surface. Furthermore Nadal has beaten Fed in the final of slams on 3 surfaces and Fed has beaten Nadal in the final of slams on only 1 surface. I'm sure you already knew these pure statistics. :oops:

TennisandMusic
06-19-2011, 10:26 PM
This is probably the one and only time I will ever agree with you.

I am honored, sir Magnus.

NadalAgassi
06-19-2011, 10:28 PM
The *******s dont like that Nadal is already being put in conversation and debate in history with Federer, and so keep calling everyone who does it, be it former greats, writers, analysts, fans or current top players, stupid and blind. Fact is while Federer probably rates above still career wise at this point, we have already reached the point Nadal can be compared, like it or not. The guy has already reached double digit slams and has only 6 fewer slams despite being a whopping 5 years younger. He also has more Masters titles, the Olympic singles gold, and Davis Cup titles. He owns Federer in head to head, both overall and where it really matters in slam finals. He has won multiple slams on all surfaces, which Federer will never manage. He has the French-Wimbledon-U.S Open triple which is arguably more prestigious than any of Federers best slam years. He has completed his career slam many years earlier than Federer did.

The talk is only going to heat up in coming years where Nadal undoubtably will only be closing more on all the statistical gaps Federer currently has. The whining from *******s wont change that. Nadal vs Federer is a legitimate question already and will only become more so in future years.

And it isnt a question of GOAT either. Federer isnt even the GOAT anyway. Laver is. Federer might not even be the Open Era GOAT over people like Sampras or Borg, depending on who you talk to. Nadals lopsided dominance of Federer has reopened even that question to many.

tenniselbow1
06-20-2011, 12:01 AM
I respect Murray's opinion, although I am not sure if its truly his opinion or that he lets his issues with Roger get in the way. I don't think a "best player" exists, but Nadal is up there with the best. Funny to see all the *******s hailing Murray and each other as if this is some kind of a revelation.

It was shocking to say the least:) "*******s" are a special breed:)

mandy01
06-20-2011, 12:12 AM
If we want to talk about pure statistics,in the most prestigious events, the slams, Nadal leads Federer h2h on 2 surfaces and Fed leads Nadal on 1 surface. Furthermore Nadal has beaten Fed in the final of slams on 3 surfaces and Fed has beaten Nadal in the final of slams on only 1 surface. I'm sure you already knew these pure statistics. :oops:This seems to be Nadal fans' last resort argument.And funnily enough,even here they tend to contradict themselves.At first,they talk up Nadal's all-surface credentials by citing his "H2H" with Federer.Then when you point to the humunguous difference in their their slam-count at all slams except the French,they backtrack to saying Nadal isn't 'at his best' on these surfaces. :lol:

TheNatural
06-20-2011, 12:26 AM
This seems to be Nadal fans' last resort argument.And funnily enough,even here they tend to contradict themselves.At first,they talk up Nadal's all-surface credentials by citing his "H2H" with Federer.Then when you point to the humunguous difference in their their slam-count at all slams except the French,they backtrack to saying Nadal isn't 'at his best' on these surfaces. :lol:



It is you that is contradictory, that is the funny part.

Firsty you emphasize that the slam count difference is humongous without acknowledging that it is because Fed has played in 20 more slams than Nadal, and then you try to ignore Nadal's h2h superiority over Fed on 2 slam surfaces :oops:

TheTruth
06-20-2011, 12:33 AM
Who cares what Mirnyi thinks. It was folks like you and TheTruth who got their panties in a bunch.

Heeeyyy!!

It wasn't us!

Comet Buster
06-20-2011, 12:34 AM
The *******s dont like that Nadal is already being put in conversation and debate in history with Federer, and so keep calling everyone who does it, be it former greats, writers, analysts, fans or current top players, stupid and blind. Fact is while Federer probably rates above still career wise at this point, we have already reached the point Nadal can be compared, like it or not. The guy has already reached double digit slams and has only 6 fewer slams despite being a whopping 5 years younger. He also has more Masters titles, the Olympic singles gold, and Davis Cup titles. He owns Federer in head to head, both overall and where it really matters in slam finals. He has the French-Wimbledon-U.S Open triple which is arguably more prestigious than any of Federers best slam years. He has completed his career slam many years earlier than Federer did.

Yep. 10 and 16 are so close to each other. Especially when you're comparing slams. I don't get how Nadal fans can either think about believing 10 slams is more than 16??


look.

16 -
10
= 6

So the difference in slam count is 6. There is no probably about it. Federer at this point has had the greater career.


He has won multiple slams on all surfaces, which Federer will never manage.

That's the most flawed logic I've ever read. Nadal's weakest surface is hard. On hard you get 2 chances at a slam a year. Federer's worst surface is clay where you've only got one shot at winning a slam a year. The probability of either one play winning a slam on their worst surface is Nadal seeing 50% of the grandslams played in a year are on hard courts thus giving him more chances to win. Federer only 25%. Think of that.



And it isnt a question of GOAT either. Federer isnt even the GOAT anyway. Laver is. Federer might not even be the Open Era GOAT over people like Sampras or Borg, depending on who you talk to. Nadals lopsided dominance of Federer has reopened even that question to many.

Gotta love people when they address opinions as fact. I hate GOAT arguements anyway. You can't compare generations. Too many variables.

mandy01
06-20-2011, 12:35 AM
[QUOTE]It is you that is contradictory, that is the funny part.Go 'google' the meaning of 'contradiction' since I doubt you can actually use a dictionary

Firsty you emphasize that the slam count difference is humongous without acknowledging that it is because Fed has played in 20 more slamsLOLWUT? First of all,don't give me a random stat of Roger contesting 20 more slams.LOL.Give me the breakdown as the '20' will also,in all likelihood include the French Open which I wasn't talking about.Also let me know why this particular stat is relevant.I'm sure some other guy out there will have contested some 10 or more slams than Roger.So?
And I'm kind of left wondering why,Nadal's great 'winning percentage' which Nadal fans so love to boast about hasn't translated into more slam victories for him outside of clay.

than Nadal, and then you try to ignore Nadal's h2h superiority over Fed on 2 slam surfaces :oops:If Nadal is so superior to Roger,why is he trailing by 15-4 at THREE of the four slams?Face it,Nadal hasn't yet proven to be superior to Roger anywhere except clay.

TheTruth
06-20-2011, 12:43 AM
The same people saying Max was right, and within his rights to say it, are now disputing similar comments when made by this era's top players.

Somehow, Max was more legit?

Gimme a break!

More hypocritical double standards.

TheMagicianOfPrecision
06-20-2011, 12:47 AM
Borg Edberg and Wilander says that Federer is clearly the GOAT.

Who are Djokovic and Murray compared to these guys??? NOTHING!

TheNatural
06-20-2011, 12:55 AM
[QUOTE=TheNatural;5759019]Go 'google' the meaning of 'contradiction' since I doubt you can actually use a dictionary

LOLWUT? First of all,don't give me a random stat of Roger contesting 20 more slams.LOL.Give me the breakdown as the '20' will also,in all likelihood include the French Open which I wasn't talking about.Also,I'm kind of left wondering why,Nadal's great 'winning percentage' which Nadal fans so love to boast about hasn't trasnslated into more slam victories for him outside of clay.

If Nadal is so superior to Roger,why is he trailing by 15-4 at THREE of the four slams?

20 more slams is not random. 48 slams contested by Fed and 28 slams contested by Nadal. It does not become a random stat just because you decide or because you can't subtract 28 from 48.

Why would anyone eliminate one of the slams that is least favorable to their favorite player and then make a comparison? Thats the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. It shows desperation.

mandy01
06-20-2011, 01:00 AM
[QUOTE=mandy01;5759027]

[QUOTE]20 more slams is not random. 48 slams contested by Fed and 28 slams contested by Nadal. It does not become a random stat just because you decide or because you can't subtract 28 from 48.Why don't you explain to us,how this is NOT a random stat since you brought it up? And like I said,some other guy has probably contested 10 or more slams than Roger.So?

Why would anyone eliminate one of the slams that is least favorable to their favorite player and then make a comparison? Thats the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. It shows desperation.Where have I eliminated a slam? Haven't I already acknowledged Nadal is better at the French Open?What is ridiculous then?What shows you any level of desperation? How is Nadal better than Federer when Federer is better so far at 3 of the four slams?

TheNatural
06-20-2011, 01:22 AM
Borg Edberg and Wilander says that Federer is clearly the GOAT.

Who are Djokovic and Murray compared to these guys??? NOTHING!

really

This is what they said in January 2011 about who is the greatest (video) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v9KayB3dJHE):

Wilander: Nadal
Edberg: 2 years ago I would say that Federer is probably the best player of all time. After the last year, Nadal has a chance.

Clearly it's very much in contention still and Murray and Djoker favor Nadal, and their opinions should be respected.

Sharpshooter
06-20-2011, 01:24 AM
That's the most flawed logic I've ever read. Nadal's weakest surface is hard. On hard you get 2 chances at a slam a year. Federer's worst surface is clay where you've only got one shot at winning a slam a year. The probability of either one play winning a slam on their worst surface is Nadal seeing 50% of the grandslams played in a year are on hard courts thus giving him more chances to win. Federer only 25%. Think of that.



Fed has had more of a chance to accumulate slams because the probability of playing and winning on their best surface is Rafa 25% and Fed 50%, thus giving Fed more chances to win. Think of that.

Tennisworld
06-20-2011, 01:27 AM
Apart from Paris Federer is clearly leading in all the other grand slams. Federer has managed to win at least 50 victories in every slam, besides the French Open. And there he could do it next year. This is unbelievable. It is as if he had reached the semis 10 times or he were the holder of 7 titels with one more win. This shows he has dominated the slams for years and not only one specific slam.

Nadal is very good, if he gets to a final. He has only reached two hardcourt finals and won both.
He has never lost the French Open.
Since 2008 he wins if he gets to a slam final. But Nadal has until now not the slam account of Roger, nor his impressive records. And he is clearly behind in the weeks as number one and has not triumphed at the end of year masters, where only the best players meet and where you surely can not profit from an easy draw.

KyomasaNTH
06-20-2011, 01:31 AM
Guys why can't we all just agree that at this moment in time no one can say. Federer might just get another slam or 2, and maybe Rafa will get to more slams, but ultimately no one can really debate this until both plays have retired and nomore extra factors can be made.

Sharpshooter
06-20-2011, 01:31 AM
Borg Edberg and Wilander says that Federer is clearly the GOAT.

Who are Djokovic and Murray compared to these guys??? NOTHING!

LOL you guys made a thread calling Mats, Mats Trollander because he questioned Fed's success and now you want to use him as a basis for your crappy argument. BTW if you watch the video TheNatural posted Mats clearly doesn't favor Fed.

Magnus
06-20-2011, 01:32 AM
really

This is what they said in January 2011 about who is the greatest (video) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v9KayB3dJHE):

Wilander: Nadal
Edberg: 2 years ago I would say that Federer is probably the best player of all time. After the last year, Nadal has a chance.

Clearly it's very much in contention still and Murray and Djoker favor Nadal, and their opinions should be respected.

Yeah, just like you and all the other *******s "repected" Max Myrni's opinion.

Anyway, everyone is entitled to his opinion. I don't think Roger cares a lot what anyone says. He didn't care back when they all kissed his *****, and he doesn't care today.
Wilander however, changes his mind daily, and tbh I think he's just a bit jealous of both Fed and Nadal. He said many times that Fed is GOAT and also has the most beautiful style, and said Nadal is GOAT as well. There were times he said none of them is the GOAT, so clearly the guy doesn't know what he wants from himself.

Aggro
06-20-2011, 01:34 AM
I wouldn't take anything The Mirror says seriously - usually either made up or quotes inserted out of context.

Magnus
06-20-2011, 01:38 AM
Watching the video, I have to agree with the last guy, it doesn't matter who ends up with more slams, titles, wins, you are never alone in the court, and it takes two for a great match. While I don't like the Fed/Nad matchup in specific, I have to agree that both of them create a level of play and consistency way above everyone else, and both contribute a lot to the game, each in his own way.

Magnus
06-20-2011, 01:39 AM
I wouldn't take anything The Mirror says seriously - usually either made up or quotes inserted out of context.

Does your nickname come from WOW?

Tennisworld
06-20-2011, 01:43 AM
Until now we can only say, that Federer is the most successfull tennisplayer regarding the slams and records there and the man with the most beautiful and skillful style.
I have not seen one listed goat statistic on the net or elswhere, where Nadal figured ahead of Sampras or Federer and was the declared goat. He is not there yet, this is for sure.

TheNatural
06-20-2011, 01:44 AM
[QUOTE=TheNatural;5759039][QUOTE=mandy01;5759027]

Why don't you explain to us,how this is NOT a random stat since you brought it up? And like I said,some other guy has probably contested 10 or more slams than Roger.So?

Where have I eliminated a slam? Haven't I already acknowledged Nadal is better at the French Open?What is ridiculous then?What shows you any level of desperation? How is Nadal better than Federer when Federer is better so far at 3 of the four slams?


So now you want me to explain why the fact that Fed has participated in 20 more slams is NOT a random number? LOL

Rather than eliminating Clay arbitrarily just because your favorite player didn't do so well there, we can just seperate the slams into natural surfaces and unatural surfaces and then make a comparison. On natural surfaces Nadal has won 8 slams and Fed only 7, and on artificial surfaces Nadal has won only 2 slams and Fed has won 9.

The conclusion is that Nadal is greater than Fed on Natural surfaces and Federer is greater on artificial surfaces.

mandy01
06-20-2011, 01:46 AM
So now you want me to explain why the fact that Fed has participated in 20 more slams is NOT a random number? LOLOf course.You brought it up right? Instead of LOLing away,tell us how it is relevant .

Rather than eliminating Clay arbitrarilyWhere have I eliminated clay? Do all Nadal fans suffer from Reading Comprehension problems? Read this again:
Where have I eliminated a slam? Haven't I already acknowledged Nadal is better at the French Open?What is ridiculous then?What shows you any level of desperation? How is Nadal better than Federer when Federer is better so far at 3 of the four slams?


The conclusion is that Nadal is greater than Fed on Natural surfaces Fed and Federer is greater on artificial surfaces....cool story.But then,why is it that Federer has a total of 11 titles on grass while Nadal has only 3? A total of 6 slams while Nadal has 2?

Hitman
06-20-2011, 02:01 AM
In 10 years there will be another GOAT. Or maybe another three.

zagor
06-20-2011, 02:11 AM
With Djokovic,it was an obvious dig (his reply during his interview was a dead giveaway) but I think Murray has always preferred Nadal and more importantly,Nadal's brand of tennis (I suppose he can relate to it in some ways).So it's fine.He's allowed to feel what he feels.

I also think Murray truly regards Nadal as the greatest ever which I think actually helps him play his best tennis against him as he goes in with a sort of "nothing to lose" "just enjoy it out there" mentality.He considers Nadal to be a truly better player than him while IMO(all a guess obviously)against Federer and even Djokovic he feels he should win which adds extra pressure(which Murray isn't very good at dealing with).The only tournament where I've seen Murray get tight against Nadal instead of just playing freely is Wimbledon but that's because there he faces more pressure than anywhere else.Some of the best tennis I've ever seen Murray play have come against Nadal more so than against any other top player.

I agree,he's entitled to his opinion.

TheNatural
06-20-2011, 02:19 AM
In 10 years there will be another GOAT. Or maybe another three.

That's why *******s are in such a desperate hurry to settle the debate immediately , before someone else like Nadal becomes GOAT:lol:

Magnus
06-20-2011, 02:20 AM
Of course.You brought it up right? Instead of LOLing away,tell us how it is relevant .

Where have I eliminated clay? Do all Nadal fans suffer from Reading Comprehension problems? Read this again:



...cool story.But then,why is it that Federer has a total of 11 titles on grass while Nadal has only 3? A total of 6 slams while Nadal has 2?

Calling it "Natural surfaces" fits TheNatural better because it puts Nadal in a better light. Truth is, until Nadal at least ties Fed's Wimbledon titles number, he cannot be considered better at Wimbly.

TheNatural
06-20-2011, 02:25 AM
Calling it "Natural surfaces" fits TheNatural better because it puts Nadal in a better light. Truth is, until Nadal at least ties Fed's Wimbledon titles number, he cannot be considered better at Wimbly.

I didn't say he was better at WImbly, but he's a better natural surface player than Fed as his 8 natural surface slams exceed Fed's 7.

He even won the battle of the surfaces. :)

I think Borg is the open era natural surface Goat with 11. Havn't done the tally yet!

Magnus
06-20-2011, 03:24 AM
I didn't say he was better at WImbly, but he's a better natural surface player than Fed as his 8 natural surface slams exceed Fed's 7.

He even won the battle of the surfaces. :)

I think Borg is the open era natural surface Goat with 11. Havn't done the tally yet!

He won the battle of the surfaces in SPAIN with Fed again choking on MPs if I recall.

Prime Fed on grass > Prime Nadal on grass, unless Nadal wins 4 more Wimblys (assuming Fed doesn't win any more).

In fact, Fed is better than Nadal (by a huge margin) in 3 of the 4 slams and Nadal's only saving grace is the French.

TheMagicianOfPrecision
06-20-2011, 03:32 AM
really

This is what they said in January 2011 about who is the greatest (video) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v9KayB3dJHE):

Wilander: Nadal
Edberg: 2 years ago I would say that Federer is probably the best player of all time. After the last year, Nadal has a chance.

Clearly it's very much in contention still and Murray and Djoker favor Nadal, and their opinions should be respected.

They have been interviewed about this approximately 50 times, i am not impressed that you managed to find ONE time they have stated otherwise than what I wrote

TheMagicianOfPrecision
06-20-2011, 03:33 AM
In fact, Fed is better than Nadal (by a huge margin) in 3 of the 4 slams and Nadal's only saving grace is the French.

Absolutely, THIS right here Magnus, is a huge factor imo, and obviously yours.

Edit: Nadal will never catch up to Federer in 3/4 GS.

sonicare
06-20-2011, 07:18 AM
Absolutely, THIS right here Magnus, is a huge factor imo, and obviously yours.

Edit: Nadal will never catch up to Federer in 3/4 GS.

and in his supposed best slam, he never won 5 in a row. fed has 5 in a row at TWO slams... thats a big negative for rafa.

ksbh
06-20-2011, 09:30 AM
TMOP needs medication. Reading the forum, this is what TMOP has been doing since the French Open final of 2010-

http://writtenbyinc.com/yahoo_site_admin/assets/images/Frustrated-Woman-computer.138171809_std.jpg

jackson vile
06-20-2011, 11:07 AM
I think that Federer is destined to win this Wim. You have to admit that Nadal has not been looking well at all.

Also, I think what Murray and Nole are saying is that Nada is 1) the best for the past couple years and 2) Nadal could be the B.o.B. in the future.

Nadal still needs more majors, win masters that he never has, more masters, and that will have to include a WTF at some point. He was close this year, but plain looked spent and Roger was in his God Mode.


Only time will tell, then a newer player will come along and make a true grand slam and both parties will be burnt. LOL

Legend of Borg
06-20-2011, 11:54 AM
Is this some stunt that's supposed to get him a set against Rafa in the semis?

You know, to save face before getting stomped by the Spaniard yet again.

fednad
06-20-2011, 12:01 PM
These guys just tell it how it is. There is no better judge than the strongest peers of Nadal and Fred.

March 2011:
Q. What was behind you saying to him in the trophy ceremony that you thought he was the best player ever?

NOVAK DJOKOVIC: Well, I think I have said what I needed to say. There is nothing behind. It's just what I think.

Q. So you think he's better all‑time than Roger?

NOVAK DJOKOVIC: I think he's the best ever because, even though he's 24, 25 years old, he has done so much already, you know. Many years in front of him to, you know, I think even to overtake Roger in the Grand Slam trophies.

I bought two bananas for you. Do eat one of them.

CDestroyer
06-20-2011, 12:18 PM
Borg Edberg and Wilander says that Federer is clearly the GOAT.

Who are Djokovic and Murray compared to these guys??? NOTHING!

Djokovic and Murray are both butthurt by multiple beatdowns by Federer.

You can't ask a person to give a goat endorsement to someone they clearly dislike.

Screw Wilander but I respect what Borg and Edberg say.

Aggro
06-20-2011, 01:23 PM
Does your nickname come from WOW?

It does not

Legend of Borg
06-20-2011, 01:29 PM
Does your nickname come from WOW?

lol

That was suitable. :lol:

Sentinel
06-21-2011, 12:55 AM
I bought two bananas for you. Do eat one of them.
I hope the subtleties aren't lost on Au Naturele.

Magnus
06-21-2011, 01:35 AM
It does not

lol

That was suitable. :lol:

And here I thought I found one of the best tanks in the game today. :(

christinamaniac7
06-21-2011, 07:06 AM
Murray, Spot on!

jackson vile
06-21-2011, 08:33 AM
In 10 years there will be another GOAT. Or maybe another three.

Their legacies are becoming shorter and shorter for sure.

bms2011
06-21-2011, 08:49 AM
Wait, now everybody listens to Murray?

zagor
06-21-2011, 11:50 AM
I think that Federer is destined to win this Wim. You have to admit that Nadal has not been looking well at all.

Also, I think what Murray and Nole are saying is that Nada is 1) the best for the past couple years and 2) Nadal could be the B.o.B. in the future.

Nadal still needs more majors, win masters that he never has, more masters, and that will have to include a WTF at some point. He was close this year, but plain looked spent and Roger was in his God Mode.


Only time will tell, then a newer player will come along and make a true grand slam and both parties will be burnt. LOL

So Nadal was...exhausted?

Sentinel
06-22-2011, 08:18 AM
So Nadal was...exhausted?
You were not here when that happened, right ? WTF was declared as a cheesy event, lol. There were some classic threads about it by the bitter Nadal fans.

jackson vile
06-22-2011, 10:39 AM
So Nadal was...exhausted?

Are you that stupid? Wait..... LOL


Nadal lost, you will have to deal with it. Roger was fresh, he took off winning the rest of the majors, good strategy!

zagor
06-22-2011, 11:17 AM
Are you that stupid? Wait..... LOL

Kindergarden level insults? I expected better from you Nardie! Nah, just yokin.

Nadal lost, you will have to deal with it. Roger was fresh, he took off winning the rest of the majors, good strategy!

I have to deal with the fact that Nadal lost? Eh, I'm not a ****, you and your ilk have to deal with it(it being Nadal losing to an old man), not me.So let me repeat the question, was Nadal exhausted? I'll add a few more questions as well:

-Who played more in the month leading to WTF,Fed or Nadal?

-Was Fed tired at 2006 and 2007 TMC? He won 3 slams in those years just like Nadal did last year.Not to mention that some of masters finals were still best of five in 2006.

zagor
06-22-2011, 11:19 AM
You were not here when that happened, right ? WTF was declared as a cheesy event, lol. There were some classic threads about it by the bitter Nadal fans.

There were? Shame I missed the fun, but I'm sure there will be plenty of more gems from Nadal TW fanbase in the future so I don't regret it that much.

jackson vile
06-22-2011, 11:50 AM
Kindergarden level insults? I expected better from you Nardie! Nah, just yokin.



I have to deal with the fact that Nadal lost? Eh, I'm not a ****, you and your ilk have to deal with it(it being Nadal losing to an old man), not me.So let me repeat the question, was Nadal exhausted? I'll add a few more questions as well:

-Who played more in the month leading to WTF,Fed or Nadal?

-Was Fed tired at 2006 and 2007 TMC? He won 3 slams in those years just like Nadal did last year.Not to mention that some of masters finals were still best of five in 2006.


Again this is what I said. But you are seriously incompetent? As I said, Nadal lost deal with it!

I think that Federer is destined to win this Wim. You have to admit that Nadal has not been looking well at all.

Also, I think what Murray and Nole are saying is that Nada is 1) the best for the past couple years and 2) Nadal could be the B.o.B. in the future.

Nadal still needs more majors, win masters that he never has, more masters, and that will have to include a WTF at some point. He was close this year, but plain looked spent and Roger was in his God Mode.


Only time will tell, then a newer player will come along and make a true grand slam and both parties will be burnt. LOL

DjokovicForTheWin
06-22-2011, 07:51 PM
Again this is what I said. But you are seriously incompetent? As I said, Nadal lost deal with it!



If Nadal lost and you say deal with it, then why do you make excuses for him in your original post by saying Nadal looked spent? i.e. exhausted. Is there no possibility that both Nadal and Fed were in God-mode and Federer simply won? Or do you insist on using excuses all the time?

zagor
06-23-2011, 12:16 AM
Again this is what I said. But you are seriously incompetent? As I said, Nadal lost deal with it!

I think that Federer is destined to win this Wim. You have to admit that Nadal has not been looking well at all.

Also, I think what Murray and Nole are saying is that Nada is 1) the best for the past couple years and 2) Nadal could be the B.o.B. in the future.

Nadal still needs more majors, win masters that he never has, more masters, and that will have to include a WTF at some point. He was close this year, but plain looked spent and Roger was in his God Mode.


Only time will tell, then a newer player will come along and make a true grand slam and both parties will be burnt. LOL

So basically Rafa was tired when he lost to the old man at WTF?

Just checking, since you claim to can't stand when people make excuses for top players.

****.

Sentinel
06-23-2011, 02:46 AM
Again this is what I said. But you are seriously incompetent? As I said, Nadal lost deal with it!

I think that Federer is destined to win this Wim. You have to admit that Nadal has not been looking well at all.

Aren't you the person who was declaring Federer would win FO, thread after thread, post after post, and also that Federer fans were afraid etc. I think you even started a thread about Fed winning FO.

Just looks like you like to prepare excuses in advance just in case Muscles Malone loses.

jackson vile
06-23-2011, 07:37 AM
If Nadal lost and you say deal with it, then why do you make excuses for him in your original post by saying Nadal looked spent? i.e. exhausted. Is there no possibility that both Nadal and Fed were in God-mode and Federer simply won? Or do you insist on using excuses all the time?

Ok, since there is zero intelligence here. The point is that Federer was the better player that day. Nadal has been looking spent even at the FO, and he won that. That is his fault do to not taking breaks a usual. Get over it.

You are making excuses, I am making observations. Also I am stating the better that day player won, period. So, get over it!

jackson vile
06-23-2011, 07:40 AM
Aren't you the person who was declaring Federer would win FO, thread after thread, post after post, and also that Federer fans were afraid etc. I think you even started a thread about Fed winning FO.

Just looks like you like to prepare excuses in advance just in case Muscles Malone loses.



This is the closets Federer "tactically" ever looked to winning the FO. He was on his way to convincingly winning the first set. Let's look at the truth here, Federer was insanely close to taking the FO this year and also Nadal looked subpar from having his butt kicked from Novak non-stop.

I enjoy Nadal's play, but I also enjoy watching Federer play. I like Federer fans I just don't like ****s.

Don't mix them all up.

zagor
06-23-2011, 07:59 AM
You are making excuses, I am making observations.

Ah, now this clears it all up, I'm sorry I ever doubted your objectivity. You weren't making excuses for Nadal's loss to the old man, you were merely making "observations".

jackson vile
06-23-2011, 08:03 AM
Ah, now this clears it all up, I'm sorry I ever doubted your objectivity. You weren't making excuses for Nadal's loss to the old man, you were merely making "observations".

You need to grow up, I have never "excused" Nadal from a loss. Just like when Soderling ended his run at the FO, or when Novak beat him 4 times. Nadal lost to the better player period.

You have to quit with the self pity thing and get over yourself.

I enjoy seeing great matches and/or potentially so.

zagor
06-23-2011, 08:09 AM
I have never "excused" Nadal from a loss.

Of course not, you just make an "observation" that he's exhausted which doesn't take anything away from the opponent's win of course and can not be in any way or shape considered an excuse.

DjokovicForTheWin
06-23-2011, 08:18 AM
Ok, since there is zero intelligence here. The point is that Federer was the better player that day. Nadal has been looking spent even at the FO, and he won that. That is his fault do to not taking breaks a usual. Get over it.

You are making excuses, I am making observations. Also I am stating the better that day player won, period. So, get over it!

Please do tell me what excuse I am making. Seems to me that implying someone lost because they were exhausted due to bad scheduling is in fact making an excuse, or perhaps you do not recognize your own hypocrisy when it comes to your own fanboy dreams?

jackson vile
06-23-2011, 08:45 AM
You need to grow up, I have never "excused" Nadal from a loss. Just like when Soderling ended his run at the FO, or when Novak beat him 4 times. Nadal lost to the better player period.

You have to quit with the self pity thing and get over yourself.

I enjoy seeing great matches and/or potentially so.

DjokovicForTheWin
06-23-2011, 09:01 AM
You need to grow up, I have never "excused" Nadal from a loss. Just like when Soderling ended his run at the FO, or when Novak beat him 4 times. Nadal lost to the better player period.

You have to quit with the self pity thing and get over yourself.

I enjoy seeing great matches and/or potentially so.

So then what's the value in making your so-called 'observation' that Federer was in God-mode (i.e. better than normal) and Nadal was 'spent' (i.e. worse than normal)? Seems to me that excuses are such an ingrained part of your psychology that you don't even recognize them in yourself as such and they appear to you as run-of-the-mill observations which otherwise have no purpose for laying out the fact that Roger beat Rafa at WTF. Period. No lead in adjectives necessary.

Marius_Hancu
06-23-2011, 09:01 AM
I guess Nadal practices more with Murray than Federer.
So Murray felt the need to be grateful, yeah?

zagor
06-23-2011, 10:56 AM
You need to grow up, I have never "excused" Nadal from a loss.

Yes, we already covered that. You don't make excuses, you make "observations" which is an entirely different thing. No need to repeat the same post ad nauseum.

zagor
06-23-2011, 11:39 AM
You have to...

Now that's where you're wrong already, I don't have to do anything. Now go back to coming up with new "observations" for Nadal's losses,use your vivid imagination!

sureshs
06-23-2011, 12:12 PM
World number four Murray said: "Rafa for me is maybe the best. He's very young, he's got everything including a gold medal in the Olympics and the Davis Cup so that also is something that's very impressive."

He added: "He's won on all of the surfaces and his head-to-head record with Federer is very impressive, so I think he's got a very strong case for being the best player."


That is what I have been saying for a long time. Olympics, DC and H2H clinch the GOAT argument in favor of Rafa. Now, top pros are in agreement.

jackson vile
06-23-2011, 01:23 PM
Now that's where you're wrong already, I don't have to do anything. Now go back to coming up with new "observations" for Nadal's losses,use your vivid imagination!

You have to quit with the self pity thing and get over yourself.

CMM
06-12-2012, 02:30 AM
:confused:

http://twitter.com/andy_murray/status/212442300025016320