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View Full Version : Lead tape and plowthrough.


levy1
08-09-2011, 09:58 PM
I know if I place lead at 12 I get more plow through. If I place the same amount under the butt cap have I increased the plow through even more?

What if I put 1 gram at 12, one gram at 3 and 9 for a total of 3 grams and then put 3 grams in the butt cap. Do I still have the same amount of plow through?

pyrokid
08-09-2011, 10:10 PM
Plow really only comes from lead in the head. Lead in the handle is just to counterbalance the racquet and allow more lead in the head.

levy1
08-09-2011, 10:17 PM
Plow really only comes from lead in the head. Lead in the handle is just to counterbalance the racquet and allow more lead in the head.
OK I understand but which setup gives more plow through?

Bud
08-09-2011, 10:21 PM
I know if I place lead at 12 I get more plow through. If I place the same amount under the butt cap have I increased the plow through even more?

What if I put 1 gram at 12, one gram at 3 and 9 for a total of 3 grams and then put 3 grams in the butt cap. Do I still have the same amount of plow through?

IMO, you achieve more stability and plowthrough (overall) when you place lead at 3/9. It also doesn't increase the swingweight to the same degree as adding weight at 12.

To answer your second question, any lead added above the balance point will increase the swingweight (and thus plowthrough). As Pyro stated, adding lead to the handle area just counterbalances weight added above the balance point.

For example, if your frame is 12 oz. and 6 pts. HL and you add weight to the head and tail (handle) while maintaining the same balance then your frame will definitely offer more plowthrough without becoming unwieldy.

It's a good idea to make the frame a bit more headlight as you increase the weight. One of the most amazing frames ever is the PS Classic 6.1 which is about 12.5 oz. and 10-11 pts. HL. That frame hits an amazing heavy ball. It's too bad it's so stiff and is an arm-breaker.

- -

On a different note, I modified a 2009 PST tonight. I added 4g of lead total to 3/9 o'clock. I then added 0.5 oz. of silicone in the handle. The frame is now 12.5 oz. and 11 pts. HL (similar to the PS Classic). I strung it up with Gosen Micro 18 mains and Isospeed Baseline 17 crosses.

^^ my goal with the frame was to slightly increase the stability (weight at 3/9) while making it quite a bit more HL (versus stock) for doubles net play. It should now have more plowthrough for baseline play while offering more stability and maneuverability at net. I'll give it a whirl tomorrow ;)

levy1
08-09-2011, 10:42 PM
IMO, you achieve more stability and plowthrough (overall) when you place lead at 3/9. It also doesn't increase the swingweight to the same degree as adding weight at 12.

To answer your second question, any lead added above the balance point will increase the swingweight (and thus plowthrough). As Pyro stated, adding lead to the handle area just counterbalances weight added above the balance point.

For example, if your frame is 12 oz. and 6 pts. HL and you add weight to the head and tail (handle) while maintaining the same balance then your frame will definitely offer more plowthrough without becoming unwieldy.

It's a good idea to make the frame a bit more headlight as you increase the weight. One of the most amazing frames ever is the PS Classic 6.1 which is about 12.5 oz. and 10-11 pts. HL. That frame hits an amazing heavy ball. It's too bad it's so stiff and is an arm-breaker.

- -

On a different note, I modified a 2009 PST tonight. I added 4g of lead total to 3/9 o'clock. I then added 0.5 oz. of silicone in the handle. The frame is now 12.5 oz. and 11 pts. HL (similar to the PS Classic). I strung it up with Gosen Micro 18 mains and Isospeed Baseline 17 crosses.

^^ my goal with the frame was to slightly increase the stability (weight at 3/9) while making it quite a bit more HL (versus stock) for doubles net play. It should now have more plowthrough for baseline play while offering more stability and maneuverability at net. I'll give it a whirl tomorrow ;)

Thanks. generally I have been adding a few grams more to the butt then the hoop. I was thinking if I made it more head light for doubles and maneuverability I was taking away from the plow through. I see you don't add to the 12 position. So if I am looking for enhancement in plow through and stability, more wip to the serve and maneuverability (head light) and using 4 grams in the head with 6 grams in the butt cap you would place all 4 grams in the hoop at 3 and 9 with none in the hoop?

Darn Bud. 26K posts and living in my old town of San Diego! You must have a place overlooking Pacific Beach, sitting at your computer all day with a cool drink in your hand!

Bud
08-09-2011, 10:52 PM
Thanks. generally I have been adding a few grams more to the butt then the hoop. I was thinking if I made it more head light for doubles and maneuverability I was taking away from the plow through. I see you don't add to the 12 position. So if I am looking for enhancement in plow through and stability, more wip to the serve and maneuverability (head light) and using 4 grams in the head with 6 grams in the butt cap you would place all 4 grams in the hoop at 3 and 9 with none in the hoop?

I don't usually add lead to 12, unless I want to drastically increase the swingweight while minimizing any increase in static weight. I will also do it if I'm fine tuning frames to match one another.

I like your 2:3 ratio of Hoop:Handle with the additional hoop weight at 3/9. I always like to increase the balance toward more HL if adding additional weight to a frame, as well.

TennisCJC
08-10-2011, 06:50 AM
3/9 give more plow and torsional stability.

12 gives more SW but it does increase plow and stability a little too.

I personally like most weigth at 3/9 with a little under the bumper to raise the sweetspot a bit. Most rackets get a bit dead high in the stringbed. I find that adding weight under the bumper at 10:30, 12, and 1:30 (1 gram each) gives more power and stability high in the stringbed. Currently have 3 grams under bumper as described earlier and 3 grams at 3 and 3 grams at 9. Counter this with weight under the grip to make racket 5 pts hl.

For doubles, I think 3/9 is the way to go as it seems best for slices, volleys, and blocking returns. Personally, I like 3/9 with a little at 12 for singles too. But, if you want a whippy topspin high swing speed demon of a racket, it may be better to go with weight at 12 and counter weight at the end of the butt. This 12 and end of butt polarized approach allows you to increase SW with the least amount of static weight, and some believe it lends itself to higher swing speeds - lighter static weight and whip effect from weight at tip (12).

I think polarized has less variety but may be best for Nadal type bashers. 3/9 is lends itself to more variety and is good for all court singles players and doubles players. Djoko has tons of weight at 3/9 (not sure about other locations). Some say Fed is polarized and he does put 3-5 grams under bumper but his racket has the perimeter weighting system built into the stock frame with weight at 3/9 to widen sweetspot and add stability/power.

levy1
08-10-2011, 06:52 AM
3/9 give more plow and torsional stability.

12 gives more SW but it does increase plow and stability a little too.

I personally like most weigth at 3/9 with a little under the bumper to raise the sweetspot a bit. Most rackets get a bit dead high in the stringbed. I find that adding weight under the bumper at 10:30, 12, and 1:30 (1 gram each) gives more power and stability high in the stringbed. Currently have 3 grams under bumper as described earlier and 3 grams at 3 and 3 grams at 9. Counter this with weight under the grip to make racket 5 pts hl.

For doubles, I think 3/9 is the way to go as it seems best for slices, volleys, and blocking returns. Personally, I like 3/9 with a little at 12 for singles too. But, if you want a whippy topspin high swing speed demon of a racket, it may be better to go with weight at 12 and counter weight at the end of the butt. This 12 and end of butt polarized approach allows you to increase SW with the least amount of static weight, and some believe it lends itself to higher swing speeds - lighter static weight and whip effect from weight at tip (12).

I think polarized has less variety but may be best for Nadal type bashers. 3/9 is lends itself to more variety and is good for all court singles players and doubles players. Djoko has tons of weight at 3/9 (not sure about other locations). Some say Fed is polarized and he does put 3-5 grams under bumper but his racket has the perimeter weighting system built into the stock frame with weight at 3/9 to widen sweetspot and add stability/power.
Great info, thank you

ben123
08-10-2011, 08:25 AM
3/9 give more plow and torsional stability.

12 gives more SW but it does increase plow and stability a little too.

I personally like most weigth at 3/9 with a little under the bumper to raise the sweetspot a bit. Most rackets get a bit dead high in the stringbed. I find that adding weight under the bumper at 10:30, 12, and 1:30 (1 gram each) gives more power and stability high in the stringbed. Currently have 3 grams under bumper as described earlier and 3 grams at 3 and 3 grams at 9. Counter this with weight under the grip to make racket 5 pts hl.

For doubles, I think 3/9 is the way to go as it seems best for slices, volleys, and blocking returns. Personally, I like 3/9 with a little at 12 for singles too. But, if you want a whippy topspin high swing speed demon of a racket, it may be better to go with weight at 12 and counter weight at the end of the butt. This 12 and end of butt polarized approach allows you to increase SW with the least amount of static weight, and some believe it lends itself to higher swing speeds - lighter static weight and whip effect from weight at tip (12).

I think polarized has less variety but may be best for Nadal type bashers. 3/9 is lends itself to more variety and is good for all court singles players and doubles players. Djoko has tons of weight at 3/9 (not sure about other locations). Some say Fed is polarized and he does put 3-5 grams under bumper but his racket has the perimeter weighting system built into the stock frame with weight at 3/9 to widen sweetspot and add stability/power.

fabfed bought djokos frame. his leadplacement was similar to yours: long lead stripes at a bit under 9 + 3 and lead stripes at 10 + 2 under the bumper

Power Player
08-10-2011, 09:29 AM
If you want plow you need a heavier racquet. Your posts indicate that you want a light racquet under 11.5 or so.

You can't have it all..I have a racquet at 11.9 and SW of 330 and I prefer to lead 12 until it hits 12.1 oz to get the plow I want.

The only sticks you may be able to do this with are racquets like the Pure Drive and the Aero Pro Drive since they come out of the box with higher SWs than normal and are still real light.

You MAY be able to do this with one of the PKs you are trying out, but IMO real Plow comes from a racquet that has a big SW or static weight in the 12s.

levy1
08-10-2011, 10:44 AM
If you want plow you need a heavier racquet. Your posts indicate that you want a light racquet under 11.5 or so.

You can't have it all..I have a racquet at 11.9 and SW of 330 and I prefer to lead 12 until it hits 12.1 oz to get the plow I want.

The only sticks you may be able to do this with are racquets like the Pure Drive and the Aero Pro Drive since they come out of the box with higher SWs than normal and are still real light.

You MAY be able to do this with one of the PKs you are trying out, but IMO real Plow comes from a racquet that has a big SW or static weight in the 12s.

Thank you. I am a old eastern forehand Flatt hitter. I noticed when using the lighter sticks I have the time to set up a semi western grip and put some topspin on the ball. I am unable to do that with my over 12oz sticks. I also have a very slow swing and with the lighter sticks I am able to generate a faster swing which is producing a faster ball. I will lead up to 11.5 on anything I wind up with.

Power Player
08-11-2011, 07:20 AM
Ok, yeah with a slower swing and a lighter racquet, you will never get much plow, so don't worry about that too much.

What you can get is a lot of placement and spin and honestly that probably wins more matches most of the time on the club level anyway.

levy1
08-11-2011, 08:39 AM
Ok, yeah with a slower swing and a lighter racquet, you will never get much plow, so don't worry about that too much.

What you can get is a lot of placement and spin and honestly that probably wins more matches most of the time on the club level anyway.

I think I can be happy with placement and spin. As far as plow through I guess I could could say I will get a little more which is fine at my level. I may not need it with more spin and placement! Thanks for all your help.

levy1
08-11-2011, 08:41 AM
If you want plow you need a heavier racquet. Your posts indicate that you want a light racquet under 11.5 or so.

You can't have it all..I have a racquet at 11.9 and SW of 330 and I prefer to lead 12 until it hits 12.1 oz to get the plow I want.

The only sticks you may be able to do this with are racquets like the Pure Drive and the Aero Pro Drive since they come out of the box with higher SWs than normal and are still real light.

You MAY be able to do this with one of the PKs you are trying out, but IMO real Plow comes from a racquet that has a big SW or static weight in the 12s.

Since I have to use a lighter racket do you like the above lead recommendations?

Power Player
08-11-2011, 09:01 AM
Is it the Destiny?

I'd add about 18 grams to it. I'd put 6 grams at 12 and 12 in the handle. That's me personally. It would raise the swingweight up nice and high and bring the balance more Head Light.

The SW may get to high for you there, so for you I'd put 4 grams at 12 and 10 in the handle.

The weight should be 11.3 strung and 11.5 with dampener and over grip.

SW would be very Pure Drive -ish at 330 or so. Balance should be right around 5 pts head light.

You may have something real nice then.

11.5 strung with OG/Damp
Balance -5 pts HL
Swing weight - 330

levy1
08-11-2011, 09:06 AM
Is it the Destiny?

I'd add about 18 grams to it. I'd put 6 grams at 12 and 12 in the handle. That's me personally. It would raise the swingweight up nice and high and bring the balance more Head Light.

The SW may get to high for you there, so for you I'd put 4 grams at 12 and 10 in the handle.

The weight should be 11.3 strung and 11.5 with dampener and over grip.

SW would be very Pure Drive -ish at 330 or so. Balance should be right around 5 pts head light.

You may have something real nice then.


11.5 strung with OG/Damp
Balance -5 pts HL
Swing weight - 330


I have never used that amount of lead before and I think I like a lower SW for maneuverability. The weight will be right for me. I will try it.

Power Player
08-11-2011, 09:13 AM
Yeah that setup should still be easy to swing..it is basically a stock pure drive that will feel far more comfortable. Since you wanted a little plow, I feel this would be perfect...see how it goes.

If SW is too high, you just remove the lead at 12 and will be good to go with a better balanced stick that will be around 11.4

levy1
08-11-2011, 09:33 AM
Yeah that setup should still be easy to swing..it is basically a stock pure drive that will feel far more comfortable. Since you wanted a little plow, I feel this would be perfect...see how it goes.

If SW is too high, you just remove the lead at 12 and will be good to go with a better balanced stick that will be around 11.4

OK I will do it. Stick should be here tomorrow. Just to understand, why no weight at 9 and 3?

Power Player
08-11-2011, 09:43 AM
You could do that as well, but I prefer polarized setups (lead at each pole...12 and the buttend). They crank the Swingweight up so you get more plow and do not have to add as much lead. This keeps your static weight lighter.

levy1
08-11-2011, 06:49 PM
You could do that as well, but I prefer polarized setups (lead at each pole...12 and the buttend). They crank the Swingweight up so you get more plow and do not have to add as much lead. This keeps your static weight lighter.

Power Player
So I had to practice tonight. My new destiny will be here tomorrow. I used a stick I do not like tonight which is a prince blue 110. I had 4 grams at 3 and 9 and I moved them to 12. I have 6 in the handle. The difference was amazing. Not a huge amount on FH and BH but on serves I was killing. Won most of my serves 40 love. The power, kick and spin difference was incredible unless it was just in my mind but I am sure it was moving the lead to 12. I even tried a kick serve which I cannot due for some reason (practice and a 3.5) and that ball jumped wicked over the receivers head. Brings up something I am thinking about. Is it better to take a lighter weight racket and mod it with lead or just buy a heaver racket with no lead like the BB London, Head instinct and Volkl X8 I am going to demo which at that weight would leave me no room for lead if I want to stay under 12oz.

pyrokid
08-11-2011, 07:00 PM
If you want a really polarized setup, your best bet is to buy something super light and lead it. Otherwise you won't have much room to customize within the weight range.

Power Player
08-11-2011, 07:21 PM
It's better to go lighter and mod up.

TennisCJC
08-12-2011, 10:38 AM
Thank you. I am a old eastern forehand Flatt hitter. I noticed when using the lighter sticks I have the time to set up a semi western grip and put some topspin on the ball. I am unable to do that with my over 12oz sticks. I also have a very slow swing and with the lighter sticks I am able to generate a faster swing which is producing a faster ball. I will lead up to 11.5 on anything I wind up with.

If you like thin beam more flexible rackets with classic feel, try Dunlop Bio 300, or Dunlop 4d 300, or Volkl O295, or BB London with customization.

Or, the blx blade 98 in stock form which comes in under 11.5 oz with SW around 335. No customization needed.

If you like thicker beam, stiffer more modern rackets, try the Pure Drives or Wilson Pro Open, or Volkl O8, or the new Volkl O8 315.

If you have a slow swing speed, I don't think a polarized setup is best for you. I think polarized is best for topspin whippers. I got significantly more spin when I added lead at 3/9 o'clock and I feel I get easier power. Just take a smooth swing with a good follow-thru and the ball really pops off the frame.

levy1
08-12-2011, 02:58 PM
If you like thin beam more flexible rackets with classic feel, try Dunlop Bio 300, or Dunlop 4d 300, or Volkl O295, or BB London with customization.

Or, the blx blade 98 in stock form which comes in under 11.5 oz with SW around 335. No customization needed.

If you like thicker beam, stiffer more modern rackets, try the Pure Drives or Wilson Pro Open, or Volkl O8, or the new Volkl O8 315.

If you have a slow swing speed, I don't think a polarized setup is best for you. I think polarized is best for topspin whippers. I got significantly more spin when I added lead at 3/9 o'clock and I feel I get easier power. Just take a smooth swing with a good follow-thru and the ball really pops off the frame.
Thank you for the information. Are you saying you only add lead in the hoop and not in the handle?

TennisCJC
08-13-2011, 01:02 PM
Thank you for the information. Are you saying you only add lead in the hoop and not in the handle?

On an 11 oz volkl organix 295, here's the setup I have:

- 1 g at hi-noon
- 1 g at 10:30 under bumper
- 1 g at 1:30 under bumper
- 3 g at 3 inside frame
- 3 g at 9 inside frame
- 8 g wrapped around grip pallet between 1" - 3" from butt end
- 4 g wrapped around grip pallet between 6" - 7" from butt end
- bab skin feel grip
- gamma sumpreme overgrip
- volkl dampener
- LaserFibre Supreme Multi Mains 55/SigPro Tornado Poly 52 cross

The handle weight only increase SW about 1/2 gram and it primarily move the racket to a more HL balance. Racket is now about 12 oz, 338 SW, and 5+ points HL. Add handle weight for HL balance to counter head weight. I play all court tennis singles and doubles.

levy1
08-13-2011, 03:08 PM
On an 11 oz volkl organix 295, here's the setup I have:

- 1 g at hi-noon
- 1 g at 10:30 under bumper
- 1 g at 1:30 under bumper
- 3 g at 3 inside frame
- 3 g at 9 inside frame
- 8 g wrapped around grip pallet between 1" - 3" from butt end
- 4 g wrapped around grip pallet between 6" - 7" from butt end
- bab skin feel grip
- gamma sumpreme overgrip
- volkl dampener
- LaserFibre Supreme Multi Mains 55/SigPro Tornado Poly 52 cross

The handle weight only increase SW about 1/2 gram and it primarily move the racket to a more HL balance. Racket is now about 12 oz, 338 SW, and 5+ points HL. Add handle weight for HL balance to counter head weight. I play all court tennis singles and doubles.

Thank you
How is everyone figuring out the SW?

levy1
08-13-2011, 03:09 PM
If you like thin beam more flexible rackets with classic feel, try Dunlop Bio 300, or Dunlop 4d 300, or Volkl O295, or BB London with customization.

Or, the blx blade 98 in stock form which comes in under 11.5 oz with SW around 335. No customization needed.

If you like thicker beam, stiffer more modern rackets, try the Pure Drives or Wilson Pro Open, or Volkl O8, or the new Volkl O8 315.

If you have a slow swing speed, I don't think a polarized setup is best for you. I think polarized is best for topspin whippers. I got significantly more spin when I added lead at 3/9 o'clock and I feel I get easier power. Just take a smooth swing with a good follow-thru and the ball really pops off the frame.

BB London and Volkl 8 (300) on the way for demo.

levy1
08-13-2011, 03:24 PM
Is it the Destiny?

I'd add about 18 grams to it. I'd put 6 grams at 12 and 12 in the handle. That's me personally. It would raise the swingweight up nice and high and bring the balance more Head Light.

The SW may get to high for you there, so for you I'd put 4 grams at 12 and 10 in the handle.

The weight should be 11.3 strung and 11.5 with dampener and over grip.

SW would be very Pure Drive -ish at 330 or so. Balance should be right around 5 pts head light.

You may have something real nice then.

11.5 strung with OG/Damp
Balance -5 pts HL
Swing weight - 330

Played today with my new destiny.

Added 4g to 12 and 10g to butt. weight is 11.5 with over grip and head tape.
Serves: 9/10 smashing both with spin and flat
control: 9/10 perfect for me
Volly: 8/10 need more time with it
Returns: 9/10 Low and nasty with eastern, deep with top spin.

My game changed from a lot of short balls to deep in the court. A lot of action on the serve although I do not think I am hitting it as fast as before the weight added. Handle feels heavy but no problem for 1.5 hours of play.

Only thing I did not like was loosing the ball pocketing. I just returned the TW demo and it had good pocketing with 16ga whatever synthetic string strung at 56lbs and very used.

Since I know a electronic stringing machine will be about 2lbs tighter then my Klippermate and I was told if I want more ball pocketing to use the same string in the racket and drop the crosses 2lbs. ( usually string with Klip nat gut legend 18ga and Head rip control 17 crosses at the same tension.) So since this stringing was free I asked them to string at 54mains and 52 crosses. They used Prince 17ga and it felt very stiff, and no pocketing and a unusual ping noise. I don't know if I should rip out the new string and restring with Klip natl gut 18ga at 56/54 to try and get the pocketing back. Need help on this one.

dannymck
08-16-2011, 06:39 PM
Thanks for the info. I am about to modify my Dunlop Biomimetic 500 tour at 11 oz, 2pts HL. Want 12oz and 8pts HL

levy1
08-16-2011, 08:12 PM
New setup has settled down and I just don't think I can play any better! I will try some full gut.

dannymck
08-16-2011, 11:21 PM
IMO, you achieve more stability and plowthrough (overall) when you place lead at 3/9. It also doesn't increase the swingweight to the same degree as adding weight at 12.

To answer your second question, any lead added above the balance point will increase the swingweight (and thus plowthrough). As Pyro stated, adding lead to the handle area just counterbalances weight added above the balance point.

For example, if your frame is 12 oz. and 6 pts. HL and you add weight to the head and tail (handle) while maintaining the same balance then your frame will definitely offer more plowthrough without becoming unwieldy.

It's a good idea to make the frame a bit more headlight as you increase the weight. One of the most amazing frames ever is the PS Classic 6.1 which is about 12.5 oz. and 10-11 pts. HL. That frame hits an amazing heavy ball. It's too bad it's so stiff and is an arm-breaker.

- -

On a different note, I modified a 2009 PST tonight. I added 4g of lead total to 3/9 o'clock. I then added 0.5 oz. of silicone in the handle. The frame is now 12.5 oz. and 11 pts. HL (similar to the PS Classic). I strung it up with Gosen Micro 18 mains and Isospeed Baseline 17 crosses.

^^ my goal with the frame was to slightly increase the stability (weight at 3/9) while making it quite a bit more HL (versus stock) for doubles net play. It should now have more plowthrough for baseline play while offering more stability and maneuverability at net. I'll give it a whirl tomorrow ;)

Howd the modified racquet work out. I am wanting to do the same with my Dunlop Biomimetic 500 Tour. Howd the 11pts HL work out? I want 12-12.5 oz and was thinking around 8pts HL. Let me know what you found out?