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chrischris
10-31-2011, 03:33 PM
What gets you going and makes you perform ?

The notion that you will be rewarded if you perfom well ? Or maybe the fear of punishment if you dont?

I have been thinking a bit about these things lately. What motivates people to do what they do..Hmm.

In our society it can be money that drives us to do work we dont really like all that much but if the rewards are there , well we bear down so to speak..
does that make our perfomances improve if we have an incentive such as a year end bonus?


Many questions. Do you guys have any idea and answers?

sureshs
10-31-2011, 03:37 PM
Fear............

angharad
10-31-2011, 04:08 PM
Being challenged. Not so much on the authority front, but being in a situation or confronted with a person that really makes me think through what I'm saying and why I believe or think what I do.

In an academic situation, for example, I always did best in the classes with teachers that everyone else considered tough or unsympathetic. The really laid-back instructors that pandered to their students never motivated me.

Agent Orynge
10-31-2011, 04:17 PM
Enjoying life. For some people that requires lots of money, for others not so much. I learned a while ago that I could be very happy if I make just enough to pay my bills, with a little bit extra for those few things that I'm passionate about (tennis, games, guns). That kind of realization required a fair amount of introspection, so it really should be no surprise that most other people are outward driven - that is, they're motivated by external forces that are probably not in alignment with whatever their true desire might be.

El Diablo
10-31-2011, 05:47 PM
"what drives you." See "pedantic high school writing exercise."

Clay lover
10-31-2011, 05:51 PM
Enjoying life. For some people that requires lots of money, for others not so much. I learned a while ago that I could be very happy if I make just enough to pay my bills, with a little bit extra for those few things that I'm passionate about (tennis, games, guns). That kind of realization required a fair amount of introspection, so it really should be no surprise that most other people are outward driven - that is, they're motivated by external forces that are probably not in alignment with whatever their true desire might be.

This sir is EPIC WIN.

Crazy man
10-31-2011, 05:53 PM
Being better than everyone. My ego drives me.

Agent Orynge
10-31-2011, 05:54 PM
Being better than everyone. My ego drives me.

So, if you can't be better than someone else do you quit like you do at CoD? :)

jmverdugo
10-31-2011, 05:55 PM
MONEY!!! lots of it...

sonicare
10-31-2011, 05:58 PM
survival and replication.. everything else is ********

Crazy man
10-31-2011, 05:59 PM
So, if you can't be better than someone else do you quit like you do at CoD? :)

Basically. But I don't 'major' in 'minor' things. I'm the best I know when it comes to I.T (specifically networking computer systems). I'd rather be able to build and subnet computer networks than kill someone online:).

OTMPut
10-31-2011, 05:59 PM
i don't know. i have done things that cannot be rationally explained. may be with some hideous connecting of the dots post fact.

Agent Orynge
10-31-2011, 06:04 PM
Basically. But I don't 'major' in 'minor' things. I'm the best I know when it comes to I.T (specifically networking computer systems). I'd rather be able to build and subnet computer networks than kill someone online:).

You can't teabag someone in real life. Well, you can, but it's generally frowned upon.

Crazy man
10-31-2011, 06:07 PM
You can't teabag someone in real life. Well, you can, but it's generally frowned upon.

That's another reason CoD sucks :). I would literally rage everytime I got teabagged. But yeah, unless it's woman on man, teabags aren't practical.

Tennishacker
10-31-2011, 07:01 PM
I'm closing in on 50, and have discovered some of the meaning of life.

1. choose wife carefully
2. have many kids (more than 2)
3. do things early in life, that will make you smile later in life
4. don't worry soo much about money, it comes and goes!

hollywood9826
11-01-2011, 08:46 AM
Im a slacker and nothing really drives me. Or I havent found it. I show up to work everyday and do a good job of not getting to attatched to it. Sometimes I wish I would just move somewhere and live like a bumb. But I couldnt take my parents through that. So I just go to work everyday and get my paycheck deposited twice a month. The world keeps spinning.

sureshs
11-01-2011, 09:00 AM
Im a slacker and nothing really drives me. Or I havent found it. I show up to work everyday and do a good job of not getting to attatched to it. Sometimes I wish I would just move somewhere and live like a bumb. But I couldnt take my parents through that. So I just go to work everyday and get my paycheck deposited twice a month. The world keeps spinning.

That is basically what most people do, without admitting it.

Larrysümmers
11-01-2011, 09:35 AM
pot and tennis for the most part.

thug the bunny
11-01-2011, 10:43 AM
That is basically what most people do, without admitting it.

"Hanging on in quiet desperation..."

I remember when I first heard that line at the age of 17, it really floored me.

Magic of tennis
11-01-2011, 10:55 AM
There are very few motivation for human to succeed: first, money second, fame, third woman or man which ever you prefer.
If I have a couple of millons $$, I will retire in my 40s for sure. I think most people except a few workaholics, would like to retire in their 40s if they have a couple of millons dollars.

Magic of tennis
11-01-2011, 11:00 AM
I'm closing in on 50, and have discovered some of the meaning of life.

1. choose wife carefully
2. have many kids (more than 2)
3. do things early in life, that will make you smile later in life
4. don't worry soo much about money, it comes and goes!

Why do you suggest to have many kids? I heard from my co-worker who has only one child and he was very regreting. So I'd like to have 2 kids if I can. I will be fine even one if that happens.

Crazy man
11-01-2011, 11:40 AM
pot and tennis for the most part.

Good man. Although I'd put education at the moment above playing sports. But the first choice is why I work.

Dedans Penthouse
11-01-2011, 11:48 AM
"what drives you." See "pedantic high school writing exercise."LMAO.

Kato.

http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/images/ezine/201103_GreenHornetKatoCAR.jpg

r2473
11-01-2011, 12:00 PM
In no particular order:

Wrath, greed, sloth, pride, lust, envy, and gluttony

chrischris
11-01-2011, 12:13 PM
Are year end bonuses a good way of getting people to perform their very very best?

mikeler
11-01-2011, 12:16 PM
Are year end bonuses a good way of getting people to perform their very very best?


When people have a stake in what they are working on, they tend to be more motivated.

sureshs
11-01-2011, 01:27 PM
In no particular order:

Wrath, greed, sloth, pride, lust, envy, and gluttony

Your friend Jiddu would say that ultimately the only motivation is fear.

Li Ching Yuen
11-01-2011, 01:45 PM
Finding a way to enjoy the process no matter how deep you have to dig.

The core of everything.

Seth
11-01-2011, 01:47 PM
Interesting thread.

chrischris
11-01-2011, 02:01 PM
When people have a stake in what they are working on, they tend to be more motivated.

So then they perform better and therefore bonuses are always a good method for getting them to perform at the top of their capacity?
Is it the case for any kind of job?

angharad
11-01-2011, 02:22 PM
So then they perform better and therefore bonuses are always a good method for getting them to perform at the top of their capacity?
Is it the case for any kind of job?

I don't think bonuses in the traditional sense are necessarily a good method. A company that's loyal to its employees will likely get better work from its employees. I really like how the grocery store Publix is structured - they don't hire for upper-level positions from outside, choosing instead to promote deserving employees, they reimburse employees for their education costs, only employees are able to purchase stock in the company, and associates can earn a bonus in the form of stock in the company in addition to outright purchasing it. All of those things could be considered "bonuses", but it shows that Publix is invested in its employees and it gives employees a stake in their employer. Every Publix I've been in has been well-kept and well-run, which I'd guess is a result of that work environment.

chrischris
11-01-2011, 02:37 PM
Yes , the more i think about this the more curious i get.
Form the outset , its taken for granted that the bigger the payback at the end of the year the better the effort ,seems bullet proof to an amateur like me.
But when i think of how people tend to get very tight when they know the stakes are high . Not so sure any more.

There's gotta be reliable stats and studies carried out on this.

sureshs
11-01-2011, 02:42 PM
So then they perform better and therefore bonuses are always a good method for getting them to perform at the top of their capacity?
Is it the case for any kind of job?

Not at all. In cutting edge jobs, bonus and stock options are the only way to keep good people. The supermarket example above is good for the kind of industry it is in, and the presence of unions in that industry (don't know about Publix in particular). The supermarket unions demand stable jobs, benefits and small wage increases, and a company which supplies that can avoid strikes or the unions themselves. In other industries, the good people stay only for money. Sure they will slog 18 hours a day in a start up for 2 years, but they do so only in the hope of the IPO or the sale of their company at a premium price to a big company. Heck, even devoted academicians jump to higher paying Universities or lucrative positions in the private sector, and they are supposedly in it for the passion.

Fuji
11-01-2011, 03:04 PM
In no particular order:

Wrath, greed, sloth, pride, lust, envy, and gluttony

That's in my order. ;)

-Fuji

chrischris
11-01-2011, 03:18 PM
Not at all. In cutting edge jobs, bonus and stock options are the only way to keep good people. The supermarket example above is good for the kind of industry it is in, and the presence of unions in that industry (don't know about Publix in particular). The supermarket unions demand stable jobs, benefits and small wage increases, and a company which supplies that can avoid strikes or the unions themselves. In other industries, the good people stay only for money. Sure they will slog 18 hours a day in a start up for 2 years, but they do so only in the hope of the IPO or the sale of their company at a premium price to a big company. Heck, even devoted academicians jump to higher paying Universities or lucrative positions in the private sector, and they are supposedly in it for the passion.



Ok , i can see that thats the way it currently works to keep people from moving to a competitor for some
.But the question i am asking isnt really that. The question is whether or not a bonus as an incentive at the end of the year is a way to maximize the staffs performance. :

Do they perform better due to having a personal bonus as a goal at the end of the year?

LuckyR
11-01-2011, 03:52 PM
Most efficient motivator: fear. Great but not very satisfying to live by, day to day.

For day to day, fulfilling your personal philosophy is reasonably efficient and much, much more pleasant.

LuckyR
11-01-2011, 03:54 PM
I'm closing in on 50, and have discovered some of the meaning of life.

1. choose wife carefully
2. have many kids (more than 2)
3. do things early in life, that will make you smile later in life
4. don't worry soo much about money, it comes and goes!

What does your eldest think about #2?

albino smurf
11-01-2011, 03:55 PM
We all must move forward

chrischris
11-01-2011, 03:56 PM
Most efficient motivator: fear. Great but not very satisfying to live by, day to day.

For day to day, fulfilling your personal philosophy is reasonably efficient and much, much more pleasant.


Really?
Fear makes all workers perform better? From Wall Street to Jack in the Box ?
I doubt it.

Have you read it or seen something that kinda supports this idea.?

LuckyR
11-01-2011, 04:05 PM
Really?
Fear makes all workers perform better? From Wall Street to Jack in the Box ?
I doubt it.

Have you read it or seen something that kinda supports this idea.?

I never said that. Fear is a very powerful motivator just as TNT is a powerful explosive. But I wouldn't use it to unclog my drain.

chrischris
11-01-2011, 04:12 PM
I never said that. Fear is a very powerful motivator just as TNT is a powerful explosive. But I wouldn't use it to unclog my drain.

Ok .
But what does then make people perform better in their professional lives?
Do bonuses make them more creative and skilled?

OTMPut
11-01-2011, 04:13 PM
So then they perform better and therefore bonuses are always a good method for getting them to perform at the top of their capacity?
Is it the case for any kind of job?

Not in all cases. Some times when incentives become asymmetric like that of wall street (i.e. get paid when you make money and nothing when you lose money), it ends up in unpleasant situations.

chrischris
11-01-2011, 04:14 PM
Not in all cases. Some times when incentives become asymmetric like that of wall street (i.e. get paid when you make money and nothing when you lose money), it ends up in unpleasant situations.

What do you mean here , what ends up in unpleasant places , the bonus or the perfomance or the worker on Wall St?

OTMPut
11-01-2011, 04:22 PM
What do you mean here , what ends up in unpleasant places , the bonus or the perfomance or the worker on Wall St?

The asymmetric incentive i was referring to usually results in increased risk taking (i.e. large risky bets).

If the bet comes through, the person laughs his way to bank and if it does not, it could lose money for the company. I have not known the case where employees are required to "compensate" the company where a bet goes wrong and they lose money.

chrischris
11-01-2011, 04:28 PM
The asymmetric incentive i was referring to usually results in increased risk taking (i.e. large risky bets).

If the bet comes through, the person laughs his way to bank and if it does not, it could lose money for the company. I have not known the case where employees are required to "compensate" the company where a bet goes wrong and they lose money.

Ok,i see what you mean.

Do you then think having an incentive of a year-end bonus in a place like this ( Wall St.) enhances the performance of the worker or not?

LuckyR
11-01-2011, 04:46 PM
Ok .
But what does then make people perform better in their professional lives?
Do bonuses make them more creative and skilled?

Oh, that is well known. Having a say in one's own destiny motivates best over the long haul. This can be unusual to come by in a lot of jobs, unfortunately.

OTMPut
11-01-2011, 05:12 PM
Ok,i see what you mean.

Do you then think having an incentive of a year-end bonus in a place like this ( Wall St.) enhances the performance of the worker or not?

it could, if it is properly desgined.

however, it is a controversial topic. you could come across wide ranging opinions. i am of the opinion that asymmetric compensation should not exist.

r2473
11-01-2011, 05:32 PM
Your friend Jiddu would say that ultimately the only motivation is fear.

Then Jiddu is a f'ing moron.

albino smurf
11-01-2011, 05:50 PM
chrischris, is your motivation is love of abuse? this place is a cesspool of hatred and bitterness, why do you keep stirring it up?

sureshs
11-01-2011, 06:37 PM
Then Jiddu is a f'ing moron.

And what about a guy who has him in the signature?

Ultimately it is all about fear. Fear of poverty, fear of falling sick, fear of loneliness, fear of losing one's freedoms, and finally, fear of death.

sureshs
11-01-2011, 06:40 PM
Ok , i can see that thats the way it currently works to keep people from moving to a competitor for some
.But the question i am asking isnt really that. The question is whether or not a bonus as an incentive at the end of the year is a way to maximize the staffs performance. :

Do they perform better due to having a personal bonus as a goal at the end of the year?

Yes. It is how sales people have functioned since ever. They make 2 to 5 times their salary through commissions, which are basically bonuses.

The fixed year end bonus for other workers is also a great motivator because people use it for vacations and so on. They plan their lives around the bonus.

dennis10is
11-01-2011, 07:12 PM
I'm motivated to have more money, specifically to be a multi-billionaire. I'm driven to help the government re-allocated money from the poor to the rich. I'm entitled to be even richer than I am now. I drive around and see families still living in their homes, not taking the bus but diriving their own car, it makes me livid.

My goal is to the reverse the illegal immigration trend, and give those Miexicans a taste of their own medicine. One day, I hope before I die, I want to see Americans by the millions, tens of millions, hundred of millions swarming across the border in Mexico, hoping for a better life.

OTMPut
11-01-2011, 07:20 PM
My goal is to the reverse the illegal immigration trend, and give those Miexicans a taste of their own medicine. One day, I hope before I die, I want to see Americans by the millions, tens of millions, hundred of millions swarming across the border in Mexico, hoping for a better life.

not so long ago, americans did it. they swarmed in to america.

Sentinel
11-02-2011, 02:34 AM
And what about a guy who has him in the signature?

Ultimately it is all about fear. Fear of poverty, fear of falling sick, fear of loneliness, fear of losing one's freedoms, and finally, fear of death.
That's tosh. You've picked that up from somewhere. Be original. Don't just swallow people's philosophies without first inspecting.

I'm motivated to have more money, specifically to be a multi-billionaire. I'm driven to help the government re-allocated money from the poor to the rich. I'm entitled to be even richer than I am now. I drive around and see families still living in their homes, not taking the bus but diriving their own car, it makes me livid.

My goal is to the reverse the illegal immigration trend, and give those Miexicans a taste of their own medicine. One day, I hope before I die, I want to see Americans by the millions, tens of millions, hundred of millions swarming across the border in Mexico, hoping for a better life.

Your Billie Gates recently said being a billionaire is "weird". I did not read the interview.

chrischris
11-02-2011, 05:34 AM
Thanks for all of your views and opinions and thoughts. I have done some thinking and since i could not come to any real insights despite trying kinda hard i gave up.
So i spent the last few hours doing some research on this topic.Looking at what evidence that can be carried out anywhere and shows itself to bring a statistic outcome worth
And specifically on whether a bonus at the end of the year makes for a better performance from the professionals aspiring to gain the bonus.
I am soon finished and will let you guys know what i have to offer.

sureshs
11-02-2011, 06:45 AM
That's tosh. You've picked that up from somewhere. Be original. Don't just swallow people's philosophies without first inspecting.



Your Billie Gates recently said being a billionaire is "weird". I did not read the interview.

What/who is tosh?

sureshs
11-02-2011, 06:46 AM
I'm motivated to have more money, specifically to be a multi-billionaire. I'm driven to help the government re-allocated money from the poor to the rich. I'm entitled to be even richer than I am now. I drive around and see families still living in their homes, not taking the bus but diriving their own car, it makes me livid.

My goal is to the reverse the illegal immigration trend, and give those Miexicans a taste of their own medicine. One day, I hope before I die, I want to see Americans by the millions, tens of millions, hundred of millions swarming across the border in Mexico, hoping for a better life.

Lots doing it already. Settling down after retirement in Mehico, for the cheaper cost. Or getting their medicines from there.

chrischris
11-02-2011, 07:20 AM
Guys, i cant not believe this , sounds so 'wrong'. To be quite honest its a kinda 'WTF-ish ' thing.

There are these studies carried out that seem to proven that
a motivator in the from of a year end bonus do NOT improve performance for a vast amount of very good and well paid jobs.
They say it actually acts in a way that lessens performance.
Unreal?

maleyoyo
11-02-2011, 07:21 AM
For me, the best self-motivation comes from trying to motivate others. Be a leader, not a follower.

chrischris
11-02-2011, 08:07 AM
Surprise!!

Bonuses as incentives are bogus apparently if intended to act as performance optimizers in jobs such as on Wall St, advertsing agencies , car design etc.

chrischris
11-02-2011, 10:55 AM
Surprise!!

Bonuses as incentives are bogus apparently if intended to act as performance optimizers in jobs with similarities to such as those on Wall St, advertising agencies , design , music and arts etc.

They appear to prevent the kind of creative inspired thinking that isnt automatic that these tasks benefit from.

I am baffled.

chrischris
11-02-2011, 10:56 AM
Double post ,sorry.

sureshs
11-02-2011, 01:35 PM
Surprise!!

Bonuses as incentives are bogus apparently if intended to act as performance optimizers in jobs such as on Wall St, advertsing agencies , car design etc.

I don't know where you got it from. In the heyday of Wall Street, people used to switch jobs in the New Year after receiving their Christmas bonus.

chrischris
11-02-2011, 02:15 PM
I don't know where you got it from. In the heyday of Wall Street, people used to switch jobs in the New Year after receiving their Christmas bonus.


I think you may be missing the point of what the studies show.
They show that having a bonus as an incentive doesnt make you a better performer unless your job is of a physical mechanical kind.It( the bonus) actually makes you worse at it.

Hard to believe , right ?

sureshs
11-02-2011, 03:26 PM
I think you may be missing the point of what the studies show.
They show that having a bonus as an incentive doesnt make you a better performer unless your job is of a physical mechanical kind.It( the bonus) actually makes you worse at it.

Hard to believe , right ?

Well, what is a "music" or a "design" job? A school teacher who teaches music would love a bonus, I am sure. For Michael Jackson, it may not have been important. A civil engineer who designs a building would love a bonus, but Frank Lloyd Wright would not have been motivated by it. There are degrees to everything. If the "creative" types are on their own, bonus is not relevant. If they are salaried, and the salary is enormous or they are also co-owners/equity stakeholders in a company, bonus is not important. But if they just get a regular salary, it is a performance enhancer compared to the work they would do otherwise (which might be 0 if they quit).

Rock Strongo
11-02-2011, 03:37 PM
That I can always get better, that's what drives me. There's always something I can improve, and though I'm probably the laziest person on the northern hemisphere I want to get things done, because though it's not noticeable at times, you improve at things every time you do them. Some times only slightly, and other times it's more significant. The thing that drives me right now is a girl at school. Even if I don't get her, I know that I've improved my communication/social skills and started working away my shyness toward girls.

chrischris
11-02-2011, 03:54 PM
Well, what is a "music" or a "design" job? A school teacher who teaches music would love a bonus, I am sure. For Michael Jackson, it may not have been important. A civil engineer who designs a building would love a bonus, but Frank Lloyd Wright would not have been motivated by it. There are degrees to everything. If the "creative" types are on their own, bonus is not relevant. If they are salaried, and the salary is enormous or they are also co-owners/equity stakeholders in a company, bonus is not important. But if they just get a regular salary, it is a performance enhancer compared to the work they would do otherwise (which might be 0 if they quit).

The key point here is that the studies carried out both at London Business Schools and here in the US at Princeton Sam Glucksberg show that
bonuses for Wall Street workers LESSENS their performances in the workplace.!


Think about that for a minute. It would actually mean that the money they were given as bail out emergency turned bonus had no influence at all on them doing their job better. Its kinda mindboggling right ?

This video shows how it works

http://vimeo.com/15488784 and this one
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rrkrvAUbU9Y

Sentinel
11-02-2011, 08:49 PM
What/who is tosh?
Your dictionary is your friend. Press F12 on your Mac and use the Dict widget.
Otherwise install surfraw or something. "brew install surfraw".

chrischris
11-03-2011, 08:19 AM
Anyone has some good opposing ideas and studies to the surprising study in post # 67?

Tennishacker
11-03-2011, 09:14 AM
Why do you suggest to have many kids? I heard from my co-worker who has only one child and he was very regreting. So I'd like to have 2 kids if I can. I will be fine even one if that happens.

My wife and I really enjoyed rasing them, but they grow too fast.

ollinger
11-03-2011, 09:14 AM
Extrapolating Glucksberg's work to Wall Street is naive and knuckleheaded. Glucksberg looked at the effect of monetary reward on people's motivation to do mostly simple mechanical tasks. It was similar to the famous studies of people on the street being asked to help load a couch into a truck, in which it was found that offering 20 bucks reduced the number of people willing to do it compared with those willing to do it for free, ostensibly because, the researchers speculate, people felt better about themselves doing it for free. In both Glucksberg's work and the couch study, the subjects were volunteers, people who by the very fact of being volunteers find motivation in non-financial psychological factors. Wall Street, you will note, is not made up of research study volunteers but rather of people who are there precisely because money is an important (THE most important?) motivator for them. So to suggest that financial professionals are not motivated by extra money because the volunteers in research studies did not seem overly motivated by money is foolish and surely incorrect. Where are the studies of Wall Street pros showing that they work less effectively when there are bonuses to be had?

Tennishacker
11-03-2011, 09:15 AM
What does your eldest think about #2?

My eldest is really great with kids, he would of enjoyed more siblings.

sureshs
11-03-2011, 09:21 AM
Your dictionary is your friend. Press F12 on your Mac and use the Dict widget.
Otherwise install surfraw or something. "brew install surfraw".

I rely on this forum for my education. Teach me these things.

sureshs
11-03-2011, 09:29 AM
Extrapolating Glucksberg's work to Wall Street is naive and knuckleheaded. Glucksberg looked at the effect of monetary reward on people's motivation to do mostly simple mechanical tasks. It was similar to the famous studies of people on the street being asked to help load a couch into a truck, in which it was found that offering 20 bucks reduced the number of people willing to do it compared with those willing to do it for free, ostensibly because, the researchers speculate, people felt better about themselves doing it for free. In both Glucksberg's work and the couch study, the subjects were volunteers, people who by the very fact of being volunteers find motivation in non-financial psychological factors. Wall Street, you will note, is not made up of research study volunteers but rather of people who are there precisely because money is an important (THE most important?) motivator for them. So to suggest that financial professionals are not motivated by extra money because the volunteers in research studies did not seem overly motivated by money is foolish and surely incorrect. Where are the studies of Wall Street pros showing that they work less effectively when there are bonuses to be had?

Yeah the survey subjects are important, as well as their motivations. Even if the subjects were relevant, the results may be skewed.

Good example is internal corporate surveys designed to get employee feedback. Some 91% will always say that they are overworked and don't have enough resources. Many of them will be lazy bums. Do you think anyone will admit he is a lazy bum at work?

If you ask people if bonus motivates them, they will say no, they do it for the love of the work. A year later you will find them doing some thing else for more money.

In the 80s when TV viewers were asked if they watched Married With Children, many said no, we don't allow such trash to be watched in our home. But when they were tricked by asking who was Bud's sister or something like that, they all knew the answer.

People decieve themselves and others all the time. That is why personality tests ask the same question is many different ways at many different points in the test to make it statistically impossible to cheat.

ollinger
11-03-2011, 10:53 AM
^^ Well said. The other problem with studies like Glucksberg's and the couch study is the amount of money. People may have felt put off by being offered 20 dollars to help with the couch, but if you offered them a million dollars I suspect they'd be motivated to help. The point is significant because Wall Street bonuses are frequently enormous, and enormous is a much bigger motivator than small amounts. As we saw in the NY area this week, people are not motivated to form long lines to buy lottery tickets when a few million is up for grabs, but when it's about 250 million, the line goes around the block.

sureshs
11-03-2011, 11:55 AM
^^ Well said. The other problem with studies like Glucksberg's and the couch study is the amount of money. People may have felt put off by being offered 20 dollars to help with the couch, but if you offered them a million dollars I suspect they'd be motivated to help. The point is significant because Wall Street bonuses are frequently enormous, and enormous is a much bigger motivator than small amounts. As we saw in the NY area this week, people are not motivated to form long lines to buy lottery tickets when a few million is up for grabs, but when it's about 250 million, the line goes around the block.

In the heyday, there were quants whose starting pay was $300K, and the Christmas bonus could almost equal that.

If it was 5%, the employee may start thinking of it as an entitlement and you could say it did not achieve its purpose. On the other hand, absence of that 5% will upset him. From my experience, it will not show up as a 5% decrease in productivity, but as water-cooler talk blaming the management, making fun of people, delaying giving information to other teams, and a kind of the-company-asked-for-it mentality. This will have a toll much larger than 5%.

r2473
11-03-2011, 12:14 PM
Gluckberg's study conincides with what I have heard from upper management more than once.

They tell me that I'm not motivated by money. That what really motivates me are pats on the back and "atta boy's". I've assured them that money would be a much better motivator and these "atta boys" are pretty patronizing, but they don't agree (though they do tell me that they respect my opinon, etc.).

Its actually sort of strange because money does seem to motivate them.

I have suggested an experiment whereby we reduce their salary and transfer it to me. At the same time, we reduce the number of "atta boy's" I receive while increasing their total "atta boy's", to see if their theory is correct. So far, they havn't agreed to try my experiment (though they did compliment me for "thinking outside the box").

pushing_wins
11-03-2011, 12:19 PM
getting reps on interent forums

like that arithemic thread. whats motivated breakpoint to go on and on for weeks?

and legs of female tennis players seems to be motivating on this forum

Hot Sauce
11-03-2011, 01:40 PM
Competition is my #1 motivator. Next would be internal attribution and then external attribution.

chrischris
11-03-2011, 02:28 PM
Extrapolating Glucksberg's work to Wall Street is naive and knuckleheaded. Glucksberg looked at the effect of monetary reward on people's motivation to do mostly simple mechanical tasks. It was similar to the famous studies of people on the street being asked to help load a couch into a truck, in which it was found that offering 20 bucks reduced the number of people willing to do it compared with those willing to do it for free, ostensibly because, the researchers speculate, people felt better about themselves doing it for free. In both Glucksberg's work and the couch study, the subjects were volunteers, people who by the very fact of being volunteers find motivation in non-financial psychological factors. Wall Street, you will note, is not made up of research study volunteers but rather of people who are there precisely because money is an important (THE most important?) motivator for them. So to suggest that financial professionals are not motivated by extra money because the volunteers in research studies did not seem overly motivated by money is foolish and surely incorrect. Where are the studies of Wall Street pros showing that they work less effectively when there are bonuses to be had?




Being called a knucklehead is kind of cute.. :)
The study seems to show that : For simple mechanical task , money make you perform better
BUT if you pay people enough to begin with they perform better than if they have
to fight for bonuses while doing more complicted kinds of work incl . what Wall streeters do,

have a look at the video and see if you can understrand it better that way.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u6XAPnuFjJc

ollinger
11-03-2011, 02:30 PM
They don't exist because large bonuses are doubtless very motivating.

chrischris
11-03-2011, 02:43 PM
Motivating perhaps and probably . But nevertheless it seems to be money quite wasted as actual performances , despite the motivation being high and likely overheating ,deteriorate.
Rewarding subpar performance sounds very absurd , dont you agree?

After all, its not who can win in terms of showing how motivated and amped up he or she is that should be rewarded. Its the best PERFORMER.

ollinger
11-03-2011, 03:54 PM
No, I don't agree with what part of your post I can understand. Some of it is incomprehensible. Try to be less concrete and not think of it as rewarding subpar performance but rather "there's a boatload of money here so we're going to pass it around to alot of people to buy their allegiance and their silence." You're trying, not that well, to think like an academician and apply it to business. Business is dirtier than that, far dirtier (usually) than academics.

chrischris
11-04-2011, 04:04 AM
Could one say that if bonuses act like you say "allegiance + silence" would you think that would be a good thing or something to consider to get rid of?

chrischris
11-04-2011, 01:21 PM
I think my motivators are my needs.