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View Full Version : Most Telling Stat of Winning at ATP


OddJack
12-12-2011, 05:54 PM
First Vote


There are 3 choices there, that if you give points to players according to those 3 stats, the current rankings will be as follows:

1-Djoker
2-Nadal
3-Federer
4-Murray

Not bad.

Bobby Jr
12-12-2011, 06:00 PM
One of the most pointless articles ever written since he doesn't even show the charts/trending etc he's referring to. Bodo is just filling in his quota of articles probably.

OddJack
12-12-2011, 06:01 PM
One of the most pointless articles ever written since he doesn't even show the charts/trending etc he's referring to. Bodo is just filling in his quota of articles probably.

Ok, but you can still vote

akv89
12-12-2011, 06:08 PM
Winners/UE ratio is the best quantifiable measurement we have currently that describes quality of play, despite the subjectivity involved in determining UE's. Too bad the ATP doesn't keep track of these statistics.

ViscaB
12-12-2011, 06:13 PM
I would go for sets won;). The stats you mentioned need to be looked at in combination....

Timbo's hopeless slice
12-12-2011, 06:14 PM
Yes, I would agree with the above post. Winners vs UEs is probably the best measure, although I have no empirical data with which to support this whatsoever!

Leelord337
12-12-2011, 06:16 PM
I voted for 2nd serve points won because if you look at the top 2 greatest of all time (federer and sampras), they both have above par 2nd serves. also the saying "a player is only as good as his second serve"

Also voted for the positive winner to unforced error choice too because its an obvious stat that happens when a player is dominating another.

newton296
12-12-2011, 06:20 PM
I voted for 2nd serve points won because if you look at the top 2 greatest of all time (federer and sampras), they both have above par 2nd serves. also the saying "a player is only as good as his second serve"

Also voted for the positive winner to unforced error choice too because its an obvious stat that happens when a player is dominating another.

good point, but if you look at the 2 greatest of all time, they both are above par on all their shots! yes?

GOAT BAAH!!!
12-12-2011, 06:22 PM
for 2011 was definitely number of ball bounces prior to serve...

defrule
12-12-2011, 06:31 PM
I think second serve point won.

Second serve is where players usually get a look into service games. If you aren't winning many of these then you live or die by your first serve. On the other hand if you are comfortable winning points off second serve then getting cheap points with the first serve is a bonus.

mromato64
12-12-2011, 06:31 PM
You're only as good as how you play the point during the second serve

DjokovicForTheWin
12-12-2011, 06:53 PM
second serve points won % here too

tusharlovesrafa
12-12-2011, 09:33 PM
for 2011 was definitely number of ball bounces prior to serve...

hahahaha..:)

ATP100
12-13-2011, 04:01 AM
Break points converted.

OddJack
12-13-2011, 09:29 AM
Well, seems like most of you guys got it wrong.

How is that the Winner/UE is the most important stat that shows who is winning in ATP?

What's your supportive numbers for any player??

Bodo has looked at some numbers, I recommend reading this


http://blogs.tennis.com/tennisworld/2011/12/men-by-the-numbers.html

Lsmkenpo
12-13-2011, 11:06 AM
I quit reading when he said he excluded aces as a category, I have a feeling including aces as a category, changed the results amongst the top three players overall.

I think it is also pretty clear that Federer doesn't put as much effort into obtaining multiple breaks against his opponents every set like Nadal or Djokovic , I think Federer slacks off to conserve energy some matches if he has one break already.

BrooklynNY
12-13-2011, 11:31 AM
LOL at average net clearance

norbac
12-13-2011, 11:35 AM
Score would be my guess.

rossi46
12-13-2011, 05:10 PM
Whether or not a player ***** themselves on big points or big matches ie. Murray, Wozniacki, actually most of the women's tour

OddJack
12-13-2011, 05:14 PM
^^^^

You post some serious garbage rossi.

***** yourself and go away, little pest.

adamX012
12-13-2011, 06:15 PM
First Vote


There are 3 choices there, that if you give points to players according to those 3 stats, the current rankings will be as follows:

1-Djoker
2-Nadal
3-Federer
4-Murray

Not bad.

3=2, 1, 4 that's my answer.

vernonbc
12-13-2011, 06:53 PM
I voted for 2nd serve points won because if you look at the top 2 greatest of all time (federer and sampras), they both have above par 2nd serves. also the saying "a player is only as good as his second serve"


Two greatest of all time because of their 2nd serves? Federer's up there, just behind Rafa who is #1 all-time, but Sampras is down in 18th place. http://www.atpworldtour.com/Matchfacts/Matchfacts-List.aspx?c=3&s=0&y=0

The one who surprises me on that list is John Isner who is in fourth place.

purge
12-13-2011, 08:45 PM
Break points converted.
aquired AND converted. you need both

otherwise a guy whos had 5 BPs all season and taken all 5 would lead your ranking without having won a single match on tour

ATP100
12-14-2011, 04:05 AM
aquired AND converted. you need both

otherwise a guy whos had 5 BPs all season and taken all 5 would lead your ranking without having won a single match on tour

Hmmmmm, so a guy with 6 BPs converted all season wouldn't lead the guy with 5....interesting....I
don't see percentage anywhere in my post.

Netzroller
12-14-2011, 05:36 AM
Well, seems like most of you guys got it wrong.

How is that the Winner/UE is the most important stat that shows who is winning in ATP?

What's your supportive numbers for any player??

Bodo has looked at some numbers, I recommend reading this


http://blogs.tennis.com/tennisworld/2011/12/men-by-the-numbers.html
Interesting, thanks for sharing!

akv89
12-14-2011, 06:27 AM
Here's another way to rephrase the question being asked:

Suppose you have a match with two unidentified players and you are not told the outcome. You must guess who won the match and can choose to know how both players did with respect to any one statistic in order to do this. Which statistic would you pick?

This rephrasing assumes that the more someone wins individual matches, the more likely they are to be ranked higher (which is a pretty valid assumption).

In the above scenario, I feel like the winner/ue ratio gives me the most information to make a valid guess.

purge
12-14-2011, 06:55 AM
Hmmmmm, so a guy with 6 BPs converted all season wouldn't lead the guy with 5....interesting....I
don't see percentage anywhere in my post.
i know you didnt. but when people talk about BP conversion they usually mean percentage