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View Full Version : How did an injured Nadal do better in Madrid 2009 than Madrid 2011 against Djokovic?


Mike Sams
12-19-2011, 11:07 AM
Nadal was mentally distraught from his parents' divorce and his knees were in bad shape but he still fought for 4 hours to take the victory against a truly inspired Djokovic on Madrid clay in their epic 2009 semifinal match.

But 2 years later, Djokovic basically almost routinely crushed a Nadal on the exact same court and who was healthy (no knee problems whatsoever this time) and in good spirits (coming off Monte Carlo Masters win).

Nobody can possibly buy that Nadal 2009 was better, physically or mentally, than Nadal 2011. Nadal 2011 won Roland Garros and made Wimbledon final whereas Nadal 2009 lost in the Roland Garros in the 4th round and couldn't even play Wimbledon.

So what's the explanation? How did a physically poor version of Nadal in 2009 still beat Djokovic in Madrid but a physically superior version of Nadal in 2011 could not?

aphex
12-19-2011, 11:09 AM
It was before the bout of Soderlingitis he suffered a few weeks later.

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2009/05/31/article-1189866-0528B247000005DC-471_468x379.jpg

TheMusicLover
12-19-2011, 11:18 AM
Perhaps Djokovic's form at both occasions had something to do with it as well?

gramdacious
12-19-2011, 11:26 AM
because it doesn't have as much to do with Nadal as it does with the unbelievable rise of Djokovic's game this year.

DjokovicForTheWin
12-19-2011, 11:43 AM
Option 1: Nadal was never injured in 09. Fake as usual

Option 2: Nadal at his best in 2011 is no match for peak Djoker

kishnabe
12-19-2011, 12:01 PM
2011 Madrid Nadal was playing better and Djokovic 2.0 outclassed him.

2009 Nadal was injured but Djokovic 1.0 lost his mentallity in the end.

Tony48
12-19-2011, 01:57 PM
Better form from Djokovic this time around? He was on a huge winning streak after all, bageling people left and right.

Sid_Vicious
12-19-2011, 02:01 PM
Better form from Djokovic this time around? He was on a huge winning streak after all, bageling people left and right.

In Madrid? Djokovic was on the ropes against Belluci and Ferrer that week.

Tony48
12-19-2011, 02:13 PM
In Madrid? Djokovic was on the ropes against Belluci and Ferrer that week.

I'm just talking about his overall form from the beginning of the year to the match with Nadal.

Also, another explanation for Djokovic's elevated form against Nadal was the fact that he had already beaten him in 2 previous Masters finals. Belief goes a long way. As far as Djokovic was concerned, a final against Nadal was a guaranteed title and as far as Nadal was concerned, it was guaranteed runner-up trophy.

Back in 2009, Nadal had NEVER lost a final of any kind against Djokovic. Coming into the Madrid match, he was 0/2 in 2011 and Djokovic was under the impression that he couldn't lose to ANYONE, even to Nadal on clay. 2009 was close so why wouldn't it make sense for a more confident Djokovic to come out as the winner this time around?

Take a look at Djokovic's reaction after he crushed Nadal in the 3rd set at Indian Wells. After going up two breaks, the outcome was NID but Djokovic still loudly celebrated as if a huge monkey was lifted off of his back. He broke a mental barrier and at the same time, one was forming with Nadal.

"I can beat Nadal in a final. Maybe I can beat him other places, too."

john9
12-19-2011, 02:17 PM
I know how you feel.It's hard to say.http://goo.gl/HkjeP

Russeljones
12-19-2011, 02:20 PM
OP is troll, how could you fall for that.

MichaelNadal
12-19-2011, 06:52 PM
Nadal has been a mess all year, nothing to see here. He looked the least convincing he ever had on clay. Never seen his balls land shorter than they did this year not to mention he seemed much slower.

drakulie
12-19-2011, 06:54 PM
So what's the explanation? How did a physically poor version of Nadal in 2009 still beat Djokovic in Madrid but a physically superior version of Nadal in 2011 could not?

Becuase he was never injured. That's how.

GOAT BAAH!!!
12-19-2011, 06:56 PM
Nadal has been a mess all year, nothing to see here. He looked the least convincing he ever had on clay. Never seen his balls land shorter than they did this year not to mention he seemed much slower.

QFT. He also wanted to be Ken Rosewall and slice every backhand in the universe and lost his Tim Tebow clutch ability when in a pinch.

Clarky21
12-19-2011, 06:57 PM
Nadal has been a mess all year, nothing to see here. He looked the least convincing he ever had on clay. Never seen his balls land shorter than they did this year not to mention he seemed much slower.


Yep,and you better get used to it because what we are seeing is the beginning of a sharp decline. I dread next year because it's only going to get worse.

tennnnis
12-19-2011, 06:59 PM
I guess Nadal injured after that match. Therefore Federer and Soderling beat Nadal.

MichaelNadal
12-19-2011, 07:04 PM
Yep,and you better get used to it because what we are seeing is the beginning of a sharp decline. I dread next year because it's only going to get worse.

I fear ur right. Unless he comes out with the eye of the tiger again.

Clarky21
12-19-2011, 07:11 PM
I fear ur right. Unless he comes out with the eye of the tiger again.


I'm not holding my breath. He hasn't even been practicing,and is having knee problems again. I'm afraid he is going to fall out of the top 5 next year if he shows up in not only sad mental shape,but in sad physical shape as well. The burnout seems really bad with him,and I see no fight or fire in him anymore like there used to be. I think he has given up,unfortunately.

Mike Sams
12-19-2011, 07:16 PM
I fear ur right. Unless he comes out with the eye of the tiger again.

Nadal had the eye of the tiger in the first set of the Wimbledon Final and in the first 16 minutes of the US Open Final. Unfortunately Djokovic had the eye of the raging Tyrannosaur! :-|

tusharlovesrafa
12-19-2011, 08:18 PM
I'm not holding my breath. He hasn't even been practicing,and is having knee problems again. I'm afraid he is going to fall out of the top 5 next year if he shows up in not only sad mental shape,but in sad physical shape as well. The burnout seems really bad with him,and I see no fight or fire in him anymore like there used to be. I think he has given up,unfortunately.

For a change I agree with you.His time has come..10 slams and lods of MS titles ain't bad for him.I can go to the extent and say,he may fall out of top 10..Not much is left in his tank..Next year I will change my display name to tusharlovesraonic or tusharlovesyoung or tusharlovestomic..:)

Sentinel
12-19-2011, 08:35 PM
Perhaps Djokovic's form at both occasions had something to do with it as well?
You might have a point there.

monfed
12-19-2011, 11:34 PM
According to some Nadal experts, In 2011, Nadal lost his sense of humour which was present in 2009 apparently.

Hood_Man
12-19-2011, 11:53 PM
I wonder if perhaps the 2009 match was the straw that broke the camels back for Nadals remaining 2009 season? It's possible that he wouldn't have felt the effects during that match though, due to the adrenaline and the endorphins flowing through his veins keeping him going.

That and Djokovic's form too.

celoft
12-20-2011, 04:12 AM
Nole was still eating pizza in 2009.

Towser83
12-21-2011, 01:49 PM
I'm not holding my breath. He hasn't even been practicing,and is having knee problems again. I'm afraid he is going to fall out of the top 5 next year if he shows up in not only sad mental shape,but in sad physical shape as well. The burnout seems really bad with him,and I see no fight or fire in him anymore like there used to be. I think he has given up,unfortunately.

lol knee problems again, to go with the shoulder... and Djokovic is the one always crying injury...


Anyway I guess he was still playing better in 2009 and really Djokovic should have won that match possibly in straight sets but just didn't have the belief. Too timid on match points. he also had a dead net cord go against him in the 2nd set tie break, 1st point, Nadal ends up winning it 7-5. So maybe he'd have lost in straights there if it had drpped the other side, who knows.

Btw, serious question, when exactly DID Nadal get injured that year? Cos he wins in Australia, I think he won IW, in Miami has a terrible match against Delpo but wins MC and Rome, before that battle with Djokovic, comes out tired for the final, no surprise. Then looks fine at RG until he loses, then announces he's been injured. When did it happen?

Eternity
12-21-2011, 01:55 PM
^^ Is knee tendonitis an injury? I consider it something he has to manage throughout his career. I think he just overplayed and mismanaged it. He doesn't play tournaments like Rotterdam (where he did injure himself in 2009) and Dubai anymore and last year he had treatment after Wimbledon.