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View Full Version : Rafa in Doubles and his legacy


citybert
03-15-2012, 08:45 AM
So Rafa/Lopez is thru to the SF in IW. And he won IW with Lopez here in 2010. Rafa haters and fanbois please come out and comment on his somewhat mediocre success in doubles and what it means for his legacy. He and Murray are the only 2 out of the big four that have continued to play in doubles with success.

Yes it's obvious Murray only plays to be a good brother and Rafa stops playing once the clay court season with RG and Wimby and the Grand Slams going into full swing. But could these guys actually continue to play in doubles once they lose the physical part of their game in singles.

kishnabe
03-15-2012, 08:46 AM
Federer can play good doubles as well......though not Djokovic.

mattennis
03-15-2012, 08:58 AM
In my opinion, any of the top-4, if they did care about doubles, they would beat any "double specialist" more than not.

You put Nadal-Federer (after having played several times together, to get accustomed one to another) against Bryan brothers, or Knowles-Nestor, and I bet Federer-Nadal win 9 out of 10 times.

Simply they are THAT good.

zcarzach
03-15-2012, 09:03 AM
In my opinion, any of the top-4, if they did care about doubles, they would beat any "double specialist" more than not.

You put Nadal-Federer (after having played several times together, to get accustomed one to another) against Bryan brothers, or Knowles-Nestor, and I bet Federer-Nadal win 9 out of 10 times.

Simply they are THAT good.

I'm not sure I agree with this. In many respects, doubles is like a completely different game, one that bears only a passing resemblance to singles. A good serve and return of serve is vital of course, but baseline play gets you nowhere in doubles. Many doubles points are nothing more than lightning quick volley exchanges at net that would make Rafa cry. I think the current top singles players could have some success, but I don't think they would regularly dominate skilled doubles teams.

GasquetGOAT
03-15-2012, 09:10 AM
We need Volley Kings input on this. Nadal is clearly the best doubles player in the top 4 as well as the best singles volleyer in the top 4.

citybert
03-15-2012, 09:11 AM
Many doubles points are nothing more than lightning quick volley exchanges at net that would make Rafa cry.

Seven career doubles titles, would that really make him cry? ok actually i don't really know his style in doubles but I think he prob does have a decent doubles game with 7 ATP titles and one being IW.

Also i think it's safe to assume juicing doesn't help as much in doubles so juicer accusers can stay at bay here. But I guess one could say that it helps him play both singles and doubles in a tournament.

PSNELKE
03-15-2012, 09:11 AM
I see Fed as the best doubles player in the Top5, followed by Nadal and Murray.

Nadal should tank the doubles SF, though.

mattennis
03-15-2012, 09:16 AM
I don't know, Nadal winning M-1000 doubles tournaments (with different spanish mates like Robredo and Marc Lopez) even though he usually doesn't want to get tired, Federer winning doubles Olympics Gold the only time he really tried hard a double tournament, both players (Nadal and Federer) have won 7 or 8 doubles tournaments even though they have to save themselves for the singles....

In the 70s almost all the top-singles tennis players played doubles as well.

But today, the fact that the best singles tennis players rarely play doubles tournaments week in week out make it possible to have "great" doubles teams (Bryan brothers, Nestor-Zimonjic, Nestor-Knowles...) that possibly would not be that great if the top singles players played doubles all year long.

I would love to see Federer-Nadal coupling to take on Bryan brothers for a 10 match series.

Seriously, I think they (Nadal-Federer) would win almost always.

PSNELKE
03-15-2012, 09:19 AM
I don't know, Nadal winning M-1000 doubles tournaments (with different spanish mates like Robredo and Marc Lopez) even though he usually doesn't want to get tired, Federer winning doubles Olympics Gold the only time he really tried hard a double tournament, both players (Nadal and Federer) have won 7 or 8 doubles tournaments even though they have to save themselves for the singles....

In the 70s almost all the top-singles tennis players played doubles as well.

But today, the fact that the best singles tennis players rarely play doubles tournaments week in week out make it possible to have "great" doubles teams (Bryan brothers, Nestor-Zimonjic, Nestor-Knowles...) that possibly would not be that great if the top singles players played doubles all year long.

I would love to see Federer-Nadal coupling to take on Bryan brothers for a 10 match series.

Seriously, I think they (Nadal-Federer) would win almost always.

Very true, it's the lack of interest by the Top singles players, that opened the door for guys like the Bryan bros, Nestor-Zimonjic and the Indian troop in doubles.

Crisstti
03-15-2012, 09:27 AM
Seven career doubles titles, would that really make him cry? ok actually i don't really know his style in doubles but I think he prob does have a decent doubles game with 7 ATP titles and one being IW.


7 doubles titles :D That's more than most players have in singles.

Have they all been with Marc López?.

citybert
03-15-2012, 09:31 AM
Very true, it's the lack of interest by the Top singles players, that opened the door for guys like the Bryan bros, Nestor-Zimonjic and the Indian troop in doubles.

what about Flach and Seguso, they were ballin back in the 80s. And they didn't have much of a singles game to speak of.

Cormorant
03-15-2012, 09:32 AM
I'd like to see the best singles players enter the doubles draws in slams or the Olympics, but I can't conjure up any interest for the other events. Davis Cup doubles is often excellent, though.

Come the end of the event, more people will have seen the clip of that Nadal fan falling onto court at the end of a doubles match, than will have seen Nadal play with Lopez.

purge
03-15-2012, 09:42 AM
i always feel like it must be somewhat of a slap in the face for doubles specialist to have top singles players just randomly enter doubles events at times just for fun or to get some match play under their belts and regularly downing some of the top seeded doubles teams in 1st round matches while being unseeded oO

its true that doubles plays a whole lot different. and that the top teams harmonize so well that theyd be incredibly tough to beat for a team of top singles players but it still happens without the latter even taking it all too seriously. so if they really did start to play doubles to win theyd most likely sweep most of the titles there also. theyre just that much better

PSNELKE
03-15-2012, 09:43 AM
what about Flach and Seguso, they were ballin back in the 80s. And they didn't have much of a singles game to speak of.

That's a good example, but picking out an exception doesn't make my point wrong.
I respect the Bryan Brothers, but I would see em losing every single encounter if they played Nadal-Federer 10 times.

tennis_pro
03-15-2012, 09:46 AM
That's a good example, but picking out an exception doesn't make my point wrong.
I respect the Bryan Brothers, but I would see em losing every single encounter if they played Nadal-Federer 10 times.

It depends if Fedal really wanted it. Usually they only play doubles for fun, especially Fed who often bows out in 1st rounds...or maybe that's Allegro's fault?

citybert
03-15-2012, 09:50 AM
That's a good example, but picking out an exception doesn't make my point wrong.
I respect the Bryan Brothers, but I would see em losing every single encounter if they played Nadal-Federer 10 times.

I can't really argue that but I stand somewhere in-between. There is also Case and Masters and they were successful going up Connors, mcenroe, Nastase, etc in doubles in the 70s. And I don't think they had great singles careers

Crisstti
03-15-2012, 09:54 AM
i always feel like it must be somewhat of a slap in the face for doubles specialist to have top singles players just randomly enter doubles events at times just for fun or to get some match play under their belts and regularly downing some of the top seeded doubles teams in 1st round matches while being unseeded oO

its true that doubles plays a whole lot different. and that the top teams harmonize so well that theyd be incredibly tough to beat for a team of top singles players but it still happens without the latter even taking it all too seriously. so if they really did start to play doubles to win theyd most likely sweep most of the titles there also. theyre just that much better

Agree. Top players just don't have the time/interest.

PSNELKE
03-15-2012, 09:58 AM
It depends if Fedal really wanted it. Usually they only play doubles for fun, especially Fed who often bows out in 1st rounds...or maybe that's Allegro's fault?

Of course, I mean If they would show some real interest and really go for it, they should dominate.

citybert
03-15-2012, 09:58 AM
Gullikson brothers(RIP Tim) is another one and they were never in the top 30 in singles but top 5 in doubles and they went up against the top singles players who played doubles. They maybe a good barometer as they weren't dominant like the Bryan Bros but were able to be Top 5 and have a great doubles career.

phnx90
03-15-2012, 10:10 AM
Yeah, I'd really love to see Fedal do doubles, but the potential awesome factor may get too high for us mere mortals to handle...

jokinla
03-15-2012, 10:16 AM
Many of the top singles guys could compete well in doubles if they chose to, last year you had Malisse and Dog randomnly getting together to win IW, as far as them continuing after their singles career's are over, why would they, most quit because they are sick of it, the travel, etc., sticking around for doubles would be possible, but not something that is too realistical for a guy who has won it all.

The-Champ
03-15-2012, 03:29 PM
We need Volley Kings input on this. Nadal is clearly the best doubles player in the top 4 as well as the best singles volleyer in the top 4.

NO! Federer and Murray are better volleyers.

boredone3456
03-15-2012, 03:35 PM
Very true, it's the lack of interest by the Top singles players, that opened the door for guys like the Bryan bros, Nestor-Zimonjic and the Indian troop in doubles.

Just becaus you are good at singles doesnt mean you are naturally good at doubles and vice versa. They are two totally different animals in tennis. The Bryan Brothers are amazing doubles players and would give federer or nadal and any partner all they could handle on any surface. Nadal and Federer are competent doubles players and with regular partners would be a force....but not totally umstoppable by any means even if they played regularly

MichaelNadal
03-15-2012, 05:16 PM
^^Kudos on the avatar :)

Towser83
03-15-2012, 06:22 PM
Yeah, I'd really love to see Fedal do doubles, but the potential awesome factor may get too high for us mere mortals to handle...

Remember Djokovic and Nadal playing doubles together and promptly getting beaten? Might be an anti climax :lol: