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View Full Version : Serena's record and why she was not THE favorite


NLBwell
05-31-2012, 03:05 PM
Serena Williams had one win in 10 years on European Clay. That was on an odd court with very fast conditions (at altitude) at Madrid. For someone to make her THE OVERWHELMING FAVORITE like the ESPN announcers keep saying was just silly. Federer won Madrid and has much better clay-court credentials than Serena Williams and no one is calling him THE OVERWHELMING FAVORITE. The announcers are going on and on two days later about how shocking it is that Serena lost. It isn't really very surprising at all. She pulled out of the Italian Open so her health was in question to begin with. Also, she has lost to people such as Schnyder, Cornet, Srebotnik, and Zakapalova on clay. She just lost to Makarova in Australia. These are people no better than Razzano. She has gone out in the first round several times. Back in 2003 and 2004, it took a contender to take out Serena, but not since then. This was not all that unexpected.

Here is her European Clay record:
Serena Williams on European Clay:
2012
French Open: Lost to Razzano (1st)
Italian: Withdrawn (S)
Madrid : Won
Fed Cup – Ukraine: Won two matches

2011
Did not play

2010
French: Lost to Stosur (Q)
Madrid: Lost to Petrova (3rd)
Rome: Lost to Jankovic (S)

2009
French: Lost to Kuznetsova (Q)
Madrid: Lost to Schiavone (1st)
Rome: Lost to Schnyder (2nd – 1st Match)
Marbella: Lost to Zakapalova (1st)

2008
French: Lost to Srebotnik (3rd)
Rome: Lost to Cornet (Q)
Berlin: Lost to Safina (Q)

2007
French: Lost to Henin (Q)
Rome: Lost to Schnyder (Q)

2006
Did not play

2005
Rome: Lost to Schiavone (2nd – 1st match)

2004
French: Lost to Capriati (Q)
Rome: Lost to Capriati (S)

2003
French: Lost to Henin (S)
Rome: Lost to Mauresmo (S)

Ico
05-31-2012, 03:27 PM
I have to disagree. You don't base favorites based on how they performed up to a decade ago. In the months leading up to the tournament, it was clear no one could touch her.

Regarding your Federer example, no one's calling him the favorite because he never dealt with other favorites such as Nadal and Djokovic the way Serena swept aside Maria and Vika.

She delivered smackdowns to established top players and there was no question she was on a higher level of her own. Something in Paris just didn't click and Razzano hung tough to put Serena away. Serena was still certainly the favorite, which makes the upset all the more... upsetting. I will admit that the pull-out from Rome should have raised more questions, but she looked fine all week so most thought it was just precautionary.

cluckcluck
05-31-2012, 04:34 PM
For the love of tennis! LET IT GO. She lost. Stop trying to find excuses or reasons. She played a terrible match, and there were some questionable calls. At the end of the day she lost.

drakulie
05-31-2012, 05:20 PM
I agree.

What is pathetic is that the commentators have lost sight of the real story----------razzano's unbelievable win.

Carillo, evert, Fernandez, shiver, davenport, etc need to pull their tongues out of serenas butt cheeks and retire. They are an embarrassment to the game.

volleyandfun
05-31-2012, 05:57 PM
. I will admit that the pull-out from Rome should have raised more questions, but she looked fine all week so most thought it was just precautionary.

that, and also the fact that Serena is very cocky, she had not lost on clay this season, so why the heck she should spend her precious time and energy on Rome? as far she as was concerned, she already had won RG before it even started

volleyandfun
05-31-2012, 05:59 PM
I agree.

What is pathetic is that the commentators have lost sight of the real story----------razzano's unbelievable win.

Carillo, evert, Fernandez, shiver, davenport, etc need to pull their tongues out of serenas butt cheeks and retire. They are an embarrassment to the game.

how wouldn't they? who is the queen after all, not Razzano!

NadalAgassi
05-31-2012, 06:22 PM
Serena was called the favorite since she spanked all the leading contenders and won both clay tournaments she completed leading into Roland Garros. Who should have been called the favorite. Maria who was spanked by Serena on clay this spring, has not beaten Serena since the dinosaurs roamed earth, and who has been spanked in all her recent big finals. Azarenka who has been spanked by Serena 3 times since her comeback including clay this spring. Kvitova who under the weight of newfound expectations has been sucking it up all year.

Federer is not called the favorite since even in his peak years he was owned by a young Nadal on clay, and currently there are 2 men clearly above him on clay and in general, Nadal and Djokovic. He did not come into Roland Garros unbeaten on clay this year, having spanked all the other main contenders. It isnt the same thing at all.

drakulie
05-31-2012, 08:16 PM
Federer is not called the favorite since even in his peak years he was owned by a young Nadal on clay, and currently there are 2 men clearly above him on clay and in general, Nadal and Djokovic. He did not come into Roland Garros unbeaten on clay this year, having spanked all the other main contenders. It isnt the same thing at all.

uhmm, Federer won a masters 1000 on clay>>> joker hasn't.

additionally, all three (federer, joker, and nadal) are coming into the French with losses.

In other words, as usual, you have no clue.

cc0509
05-31-2012, 08:56 PM
Serena was called the favorite since she spanked all the leading contenders and won both clay tournaments she completed leading into Roland Garros. Who should have been called the favorite. Maria who was spanked by Serena on clay this spring, has not beaten Serena since the dinosaurs roamed earth, and who has been spanked in all her recent big finals. Azarenka who has been spanked by Serena 3 times since her comeback including clay this spring. Kvitova who under the weight of newfound expectations has been sucking it up all year.

Federer is not called the favorite since even in his peak years he was owned by a young Nadal on clay, and currently there are 2 men clearly above him on clay and in general, Nadal and Djokovic. He did not come into Roland Garros unbeaten on clay this year, having spanked all the other main contenders. It isnt the same thing at all.

Serena was the favorite to win I agree, but with this first round loss it seems pretty clear that Serena is aging and is showing the classic age-related sign of inconsistent play similar to Federer. Serena may win a slam or two more if she can remain focused and fit enough but her days of complete dominance and winning multiple slams easily are over imo.

1970CRBase
05-31-2012, 09:01 PM
Serena was called the favorite since she spanked all the leading contenders and won both clay tournaments she completed leading into Roland Garros. Who should have been called the favorite. Maria who was spanked by Serena on clay this spring, has not beaten Serena since the dinosaurs roamed earth, and who has been spanked in all her recent big finals. Azarenka who has been spanked by Serena 3 times since her comeback including clay this spring. Kvitova who under the weight of newfound expectations has been sucking it up all year.

Federer is not called the favorite since even in his peak years he was owned by a young Nadal on clay, and currently there are 2 men clearly above him on clay and in general, Nadal and Djokovic. He did not come into Roland Garros unbeaten on clay this year, having spanked all the other main contenders. It isnt the same thing at all.

Dirty tricks with the scheduling because she was THE favourite. No way to prove it.

Jack Romeo
05-31-2012, 09:24 PM
uhmm, Federer won a masters 1000 on clay>>> joker hasn't.


but when they met in rome, joker beat fed. i think that's one of the reasons why people are picking joker ahead of fed when they're handicapping the field.

NadalAgassi
05-31-2012, 10:44 PM
uhmm, Federer won a masters 1000 on clay>>> joker hasn't.

additionally, all three (federer, joker, and nadal) are coming into the French with losses.

In other words, as usual, you have no clue.

So by your usually absurd logic Serena was an even bigger favorite to win the French than Nadal is (and we all know Nadal is the overwhelming favorite to win the French, especialy from someone who ranks his only threat Djokovic below even Federer, lol) as she was unbeaten on clay, while Nadal wasnt. There you have it.

drakulie
06-01-2012, 04:45 AM
So by your usually absurd logic Serena was an even bigger favorite to win the French than Nadal is

No you momo. Try using your brain every once in a while.

zagor
06-01-2012, 05:10 AM
Serena Williams had one win in 10 years on European Clay. That was on an odd court with very fast conditions (at altitude) at Madrid. For someone to make her THE OVERWHELMING FAVORITE like the ESPN announcers keep saying was just silly. Federer won Madrid and has much better clay-court credentials than Serena Williams and no one is calling him THE OVERWHELMING FAVORITE. The announcers are going on and on two days later about how shocking it is that Serena lost. It isn't really very surprising at all. She pulled out of the Italian Open so her health was in question to begin with. Also, she has lost to people such as Schnyder, Cornet, Srebotnik, and Zakapalova on clay. She just lost to Makarova in Australia. These are people no better than Razzano. She has gone out in the first round several times. Back in 2003 and 2004, it took a contender to take out Serena, but not since then. This was not all that unexpected.

Here is her European Clay record:
Serena Williams on European Clay:
2012
French Open: Lost to Razzano (1st)
Italian: Withdrawn (S)
Madrid : Won
Fed Cup Ukraine: Won two matches

2011
Did not play

2010
French: Lost to Stosur (Q)
Madrid: Lost to Petrova (3rd)
Rome: Lost to Jankovic (S)

2009
French: Lost to Kuznetsova (Q)
Madrid: Lost to Schiavone (1st)
Rome: Lost to Schnyder (2nd 1st Match)
Marbella: Lost to Zakapalova (1st)

2008
French: Lost to Srebotnik (3rd)
Rome: Lost to Cornet (Q)
Berlin: Lost to Safina (Q)

2007
French: Lost to Henin (Q)
Rome: Lost to Schnyder (Q)

2006
Did not play

2005
Rome: Lost to Schiavone (2nd 1st match)

2004
French: Lost to Capriati (Q)
Rome: Lost to Capriati (S)

2003
French: Lost to Henin (S)
Rome: Lost to Mauresmo (S)

You know, this thread would have had a bit more weight if you made it BEFORE Serena lost.

As it is now, well I don't know if you're familiar with the saying-"After a battle, everyone is a general".

There were valid reasons to consider Serena the main favourite for FO.

NLBwell
06-01-2012, 07:45 AM
There were valid reasons to consider Serena A favorite for the French. She did win Madrid and none of the top players is all that great on clay. That should put her in the top five favorites. I didn't have a problem with someone picking her to win. I just got sick of the ESPN announcers saying over and over again that her loss was such a shock when it was forseeable (though not sure to happen). If you look at my posts since the US Open (I don't really expect you do spend your time doing that) they have been very consistent about Serena's physical problems and how that will lead to unexpected losses like against Makarova.

TMF
06-01-2012, 08:50 AM
It's laughable to put serena as a clear favorite when the last time she made the FO final was 10 years ago. Serena is old, other players including low ranked players(i.e. #111) don't fear her anymore. It's would be remarkable for her to even complete a 7 matches event.