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backhander
06-05-2012, 02:22 PM
Is it me or is Nadal's draw pretty easy. Seems like he's not really playing anybody dangerous till the Semi's, and that would be Murray. And let's face it, out of the Big 4, Murray is the one who is the cake walk.

Compared to Fed and Djokovic who had to play Del Potro and Tsonga, and then possibly each other to get to the final.

I thought you normally want the #1 seed for more favorable draws? Seems like Nadal's draw is just too easy relatively compared to the others, and it's not like he needs it considering his clay court prowess.

Clarky21
06-05-2012, 02:23 PM
It's just you.

Murrayfan31
06-05-2012, 02:24 PM
Almagro with the upset.

Hapless
06-05-2012, 02:30 PM
It's a draw i.e. other than the top seeds, players' spots are basically drawn randomly.

The only reason this was an "easy" draw for Nadal is because he's so insanely good on red clay.

Imagine Nadal's draw, only instead of RG, it's at Wimbledon or the US Open...Karlovic in the third round, Raonic in the fourth, Tipsarevic/Almagro in the quarters...all guys with huge serves. It would be a horrendous draw Nadal would be quite lucky to get through.

Point is, how hard a draw is all relative.

sillymonkey
06-05-2012, 02:32 PM
How many thread are there on Nadal's supposed easy draws? 20? 30? Give me a break already.

backhander
06-05-2012, 02:45 PM
How many thread are there on Nadal's supposed easy draws? 20? 30? Give me a break already.

silly me, i thought this was a discussion board.

Defcon
06-05-2012, 03:01 PM
It's always fun to see people defend Nadal's draw and somehow claim its not a joke. It doesn't really matter how it ended up this way, the fact is once again he faces virtually no one till Murray, and every single big hitter (Delpo, Tsonga, Berdych) who's a danger was in the other half.

FlashFlare11
06-05-2012, 03:04 PM
Does it really matter whether he gets tougher or easier draws at Roland Garros? He's going to make everyone look like an easy draw. If this were anywhere else, I might agree, but no one at RG is a difficult draw for Nadal.

Defcon
06-05-2012, 03:22 PM
Well then why don't we give him a bye to the finals?

okdude1992
06-05-2012, 03:26 PM
Actually i would say Djokovic had an easy draw at first glance.

no seeds until the 4th round, where he played Seppi who has never had much success at slams or against the top guys, then Tsonga in the quarters where he has never reached at the French, and on his worst surface.

Interesting how it didn't turn out easy at all

courtking
06-05-2012, 03:45 PM
The FO organizer already gave the trophy to Nadal on his birthday.. so the rest of the week just formality.. the FO2012 trophy was already sent back to marlloca..

marc45
06-05-2012, 04:22 PM
Is it me or is Nadal's draw pretty easy. Seems like he's not really playing anybody dangerous till the Semi's, and that would be Murray. And let's face it, out of the Big 4, Murray is the one who is the cake walk.

Compared to Fed and Djokovic who had to play Del Potro and Tsonga, and then possibly each other to get to the final.

I thought you normally want the #1 seed for more favorable draws? Seems like Nadal's draw is just too easy relatively compared to the others, and it's not like he needs it considering his clay court prowess.nadal no longer has clay court prowess (according to the greatest poster on here), he needs all the help he can get

marc45
06-05-2012, 04:23 PM
It's always fun to see people defend Nadal's draw and somehow claim its not a joke. It doesn't really matter how it ended up this way, the fact is once again he faces virtually no one till Murray, and every single big hitter (Delpo, Tsonga, Berdych) who's a danger was in the other half.

what's his records against those guys, clay and not?

marc45
06-05-2012, 04:24 PM
The FO organizer already gave the trophy to Nadal on his birthday.. so the rest of the week just formality.. the FO2012 trophy was already sent back to marlloca..the french hate nadal, why would they help him?

Coach Chad
06-05-2012, 04:26 PM
Is it me or is Nadal's draw pretty easy. Seems like he's not really playing anybody dangerous till the Semi's, and that would be Murray. And let's face it, out of the Big 4, Murray is the one who is the cake walk.

Compared to Fed and Djokovic who had to play Del Potro and Tsonga, and then possibly each other to get to the final.

I thought you normally want the #1 seed for more favorable draws? Seems like Nadal's draw is just too easy relatively compared to the others, and it's not like he needs it considering his clay court prowess.

Murray over Ferrer? Did I miss something???

Mainad
06-05-2012, 04:38 PM
Is it me or is Nadal's draw pretty easy. Seems like he's not really playing anybody dangerous till the Semi's, and that would be Murray. And let's face it, out of the Big 4, Murray is the one who is the cake walk.


Don't think it's cut and dried that Murray will be in the semis. He has to get past Ferrer first, a guy he has never beaten on clay and who is second only to Nadal in consistency on the red stuff. Of course, if Nadal does play Ferrer, one of his favourite pigeons, that makes his task even easier IMO.

forzamilan90
06-05-2012, 05:01 PM
Does it really matter whether he gets tougher or easier draws at Roland Garros? He's going to make everyone look like an easy draw. If this were anywhere else, I might agree, but no one at RG is a difficult draw for Nadal.

If Jan Kodeš was in today's field he'd wipe the floor with Nadal! That'd be a nightmare draw for him.

clayman2000
06-05-2012, 05:22 PM
Maybe its an easy draw.

But after 6 FO titles, its pretty irrelevant who he draws

nadal_slam_king
06-05-2012, 06:03 PM
Is it me or is Nadal's draw pretty easy. Seems like he's not really playing anybody dangerous till the Semi's, and that would be Murray. And let's face it, out of the Big 4, Murray is the one who is the cake walk.

Compared to Fed and Djokovic who had to play Del Potro and Tsonga, and then possibly each other to get to the final.

I thought you normally want the #1 seed for more favorable draws? Seems like Nadal's draw is just too easy relatively compared to the others, and it's not like he needs it considering his clay court prowess.

Nadal had the toughest 2nd Round of the top 4 seeds. World Number 43.

As for Nadal's QF, Almagro is the player who extended Nadal to 7-6 7-6 6-4, the toughest scoreline by far of his 2010 RG title. Imagine if Nadal had got Berdych QF instead, would be a laugher (Nadal has won his last 11 meetings vs Berdych).

Nadal's SF would be EASY if it was Federer. Instead its going to be a grinding affair with either Murray or Ferrer. Murray had 18 breakpoints on Nadal in last year's RG semi. Ferrer always makes Nadal work extremely hard.

So at the 2nd Round, QF, SF it's the toughest Nadal could have received.

Talk about an ironic thread!

mellowyellow
06-05-2012, 06:17 PM
Was it me or was all the good tennis from the 1st half of the draw ? Is that a coincidence or is that indicative thats where all the talent was?

pvaudio
06-05-2012, 06:21 PM
Nadal had the toughest 2nd Round of the top 4 seeds. World Number 43.

As for Nadal's QF, Almagro is the player who extended Nadal to 7-6 7-6 6-4, the toughest scoreline by far of his 2010 RG title. Imagine if Nadal had got Berdych QF instead, would be a laugher (Nadal has won his last 11 meetings vs Berdych).

Nadal's SF would be EASY if it was Federer. Instead its going to be a grinding affair with either Murray or Ferrer. Murray had 18 breakpoints on Nadal in last year's RG semi. Ferrer always makes Nadal work extremely hard.

So at the 2nd Round, QF, SF it's the toughest Nadal could have received.

Talk about an ironic thread!I can never tell if you're trolling or just are stupid.

nadal_slam_king
06-05-2012, 06:23 PM
Was it me or was all the good tennis from the 1st half of the draw ? Is that a coincidence or is that indicative thats where all the talent was?

In Nadal's case it is obvious no matter who he plays in the first 4 Rounds will be whooped, apart from 2011 and 2009 - those 2 years were the worst Nadal has ever played on clay. So those first 4 Rounds, no matter how talented they are, aren't going to look talented vs Nadal. I mean, Seppi would not have extended Nadal to 5 sets. Mahut would not have extended Nadal to 4 sets. Also don't forget, the top half has played their QFs. Nadal hasn't played his QF. Almagro might present a classic confrontation (in 2010 Nadal's most difficult match was vs Almagro). So Nadal's invincibility (during week one) makes it impossible for several players to look 'talented'. I also am sure Ferrer would not have been stretched to 5 sets by Seppi. Again, Ferrer hasn't played his QF opponent yet, and that is Murray, and that could go either way.

nadal_slam_king
06-05-2012, 06:26 PM
I can never tell if you're trolling or just are stupid.

If you want to ignore facts, then that is up to you. It is now on record that you are denying what I just said. Doesn't look good for you, given everything I posted is a fact.

pvaudio
06-05-2012, 06:36 PM
If you want to ignore facts, then that is up to you. It is now on record that you are denying what I just said. Doesn't look good for you, given everything I posted is a fact.You just said that Murray is a tougher matchup than Federer. No, you said it was "EASY".

mellowyellow
06-05-2012, 07:04 PM
What is obvious is that Nadal is being propped up because without him to contest these finals tennis will be boring ala Sampras/Fed domination. The guy is a fake and a product of TV pressure to make tennis more viewer friendly through slowdown. He is clearly a juicer, it just took Djoko to open everyone's eyes. His draws among others are clearly fixed. Your reality is not "facts" in the real world......

Clarky21
06-05-2012, 07:08 PM
What is obvious is that Nadal is being propped up because without him to contest these finals tennis will be boring ala Sampras/Fed domination. The guy is a fake and a product of TV pressure to make tennis more viewer friendly through slowdown. He is clearly a juicer, it just took Djoko to open everyone's eyes. His draws among others are clearly fixed. Your reality is not "facts" in the real world......


How so?

What does this even mean?


To what? That Rolaids is souped up as well?

Wolfman Jack
06-05-2012, 07:44 PM
What is obvious is that Nadal is being propped up because without him to contest these finals tennis will be boring ala Sampras/Fed domination. The guy is a fake and a product of TV pressure to make tennis more viewer friendly through slowdown. He is clearly a juicer, it just took Djoko to open everyone's eyes. His draws among others are clearly fixed. Your reality is not "facts" in the real world......
These are clearly the opinions of someone both mentally deficient (in a relative sense) and emotionally sour. Your last statement is teeming with irony.

OddJack
06-05-2012, 07:56 PM
I'm still ****ed at his draw.

Lucky martha ****er

mcenroefan
06-05-2012, 08:06 PM
For the top three, the main rounds that matter (i.e., the only place where there is a resonable possibility of an upset) are the opponents in the quarters and semis.

And, yes, as has been pointed out ad nauseum, Nadal is getting the easiest draw in these rounds to the point of statistical impossibility. (whereas Nole repeatedly seems to get the shaft)

So, the most likely explanation is that it isn't really a "draw" at all.

And, it is a probability that tennis has decided that it is best for the game to help Nadal win slams (probably to launch one more over-hyped and promotion of an imaginary "GOAT").

So, what do you expect any of us to do about it?

The tennis authorities are doing alot of things these days that I wish they would change but, odds are, they won't change.

Anyway, it is pretty clear from today's action which side of the draw you should watch if you want to see epic/memorable matches. If you want a snoozer, check out Nadal-Alamagro tomorrow.

Seth
06-05-2012, 08:18 PM
Nadal's draw is easy blah blah blah cakewalk blah blah blah

sbengte
06-05-2012, 10:02 PM
For the top three, the main rounds that matter (i.e., the only place where there is a resonable possibility of an upset) are the opponents in the quarters and semis.

And, yes, as has been pointed out ad nauseum, Nadal is getting the easiest draw in these rounds to the point of statistical impossibility. (whereas Nole repeatedly seems to get the shaft)

So, the most likely explanation is that it isn't really a "draw" at all.

And, it is a probability that tennis has decided that it is best for the game to help Nadal win slams (probably to launch one more over-hyped and promotion of an imaginary "GOAT").

So, what do you expect any of us to do about it?

The tennis authorities are doing alot of things these days that I wish they would change but, odds are, they won't change.

Anyway, it is pretty clear from today's action which side of the draw you should watch if you want to see epic/memorable matches. If you want a snoozer, check out Nadal-Alamagro tomorrow.

This. Obvious to anyone with a pair of eyes and has seen the last several GS draws.

mellowyellow
06-06-2012, 08:18 AM
The only thing I Am is annoyed, that a sport I love to play and watch that at 1 time had some integrity seperating it from most other sports has none. Due mostly to commercialism. Wimby and all white, yet advertising all over the place.... Any fool that thinks genetics/desire is the determinig factor in greatness need to open their eyes.

augustobt
06-06-2012, 08:22 AM
Every Nadal's draw is the same thing.

Fellow spainiards like Granollers, semi-retired players...

PetSounds
06-06-2012, 09:19 AM
There is definitely a Spanish conspiracy. Normally tough players like Miraclegro and Ferreri will just end up rolling over for their Spanish buddy.

backhander
06-06-2012, 02:04 PM
Well I dunno about conspiracies, since I'm not really familiar with how draws are selected. But in terms of the top 3 (or top 4) guys, I thought one of the reasons to want to be the top seed is for the more favorable semi's match ups. Typically I've seen it as #1 vs #4 in one semi, then #2 vs #3 in the other semi but it seems swapped this time, with #1 now having to beat the #3 and #2 seed in order to win the tourney.

Regardless, i think it's pretty evident that Nadal has an easy draw at this year's French Open. Who exactly has he played up to the final which can be considered a marquee match?

Bud
06-06-2012, 02:28 PM
How many clay titles have all four SF's previous 5 opponents won? That's a good indicator of who has/had the toughest draw.

It's clearly Nadal with the toughest draw based on his opponents' clay court results. Second is Federer then Ferrer and last Djokovic.

Nadal (35)
Almagro (12)
Monaco (5)
Total of his opponents: 17

Ferrer (8 )
Granollers (2)
Youzhny(2)
Total of his opponents: 4

Djokovic (7)
Seppi(1)
Total of his opponents: 1

Federer (10)
Delpo (4)
Total of his opponents: 4


If Almagro had Ferrer's draw, he'd most likely be into the SF round

Hitman
06-06-2012, 02:34 PM
How many grand slam champions, and grand slam finalists were in each half?

That should give an indication of the calibre of players that mentally have the ability to get to finals stages of a slam, since they have proven it in the past, and hence the tougher draw/route to the final.

Bud
06-06-2012, 02:45 PM
How many grand slam champions, and grand slam finalists were in each half?

That should give an indication of the calibre of players that mentally have the ability to get to finals stages of a slam, since they have proven it in the past, and hence the tougher draw/route to the final.

Clay court titles of each players' first 5-round opponents is a better indicator of the draw difficulty. Neither Murray nor Tsonga have won any clay court titles.

Hitman
06-06-2012, 02:54 PM
Clay court titles of each players' first 5-round opponents is a better indicator of the draw difficulty.

Gotcha to respond! :twisted:

I'll stick with what I stated. This is a grand slam, and few players have the mentality to play on the biggest stages and actually go deep in slam. I think we know which side of the draw most of the slam winners, and slam finalist were on. :)

We can agree to disagree though!

How many semi finals has Almagro ever made in a slam? Winning a couple of small tournies that the bigger players don't bother to show up for, doesn't make them better players on that surface. Playing in a slam, is the ultimate challenge, players proven to win best of five set matches, and the belief and mentality to go all the way. Tsonga has beaten all four of the top players in a slam. Del Potro has beaten Fedal to win a slam. Even Berdych has Wimbledon final to his name, with back to back wins over Federer and Djokovic. And now Federer and Djokovic, to multi slam winners go head to head in a much more even H2H than what is happening on the other side, with all due respect to Ferrer and his battle hardened heart.

Nadal easiest route. Almagro was not beating him. How many Masters titles does Almagro have again? How many finals in Masters 1000? Can someone please tell me. :)

Bud
06-06-2012, 03:00 PM
Gotcha to respond! :twisted:

I'll stick with what I stated. This is a grand slam, and few players have the mentality to play on the biggest stages and actually go deep in slam. I think we know which side of the draw most of the slam winners, and slam finalist were on. :)

We can agree to disagree though!

Why would I not respond to you?

Tsonga and Murray are GS finalists and both have zero clay titles. Their tennis talent can take them so far but it's difficult to compete with guys who have won multiple titles on this surface. I'd take Ferrer or Almagro over Tsonga or Murray any day on clay. Almagro has been the only person so far in this tournament to push Nadal to a TB.

Up to the SF, Nadal clearly had the most difficult draw.

kragster
06-06-2012, 03:14 PM
How many grand slam champions, and grand slam finalists were in each half?

That should give an indication of the calibre of players that mentally have the ability to get to finals stages of a slam, since they have proven it in the past, and hence the tougher draw/route to the final.

Clay court titles of each players' first 5-round opponents is a better indicator of the draw difficulty. Neither Murray nor Tsonga have won any clay court titles.

Why would it be one or the other. Logically it should be both - your proven ability on the surface and proven mentality to go deep in slams.

pvaudio
06-06-2012, 04:30 PM
Why would I not respond to you?

Tsonga and Murray are GS finalists and both have zero clay titles. Their tennis talent can take them so far but it's difficult to compete with guys who have won multiple titles on this surface. I'd take Ferrer or Almagro over Tsonga or Murray any day on clay. Almagro has been the only person so far in this tournament to push Nadal to a TB.

Up to the SF, Nadal clearly had the most difficult draw.
You people are joking, right?

Tony48
06-06-2012, 04:36 PM
How many clay titles have all four SF's previous 5 opponents won? That's a good indicator of who has/had the toughest draw.

It's clearly Nadal with the toughest draw based on his opponents' clay court results. Second is Federer then Ferrer and last Djokovic.

Nadal (35)
Almagro (12)
Monaco (5)
Total of his opponents: 17

Ferrer (8 )
Granollers (2)
Youzhny(2)
Total of his opponents: 4

Djokovic (7)
Seppi(1)
Total of his opponents: 1

Federer (10)
Delpo (4)
Total of his opponents: 4


If Almagro had Ferrer's draw, he'd most likely be into the SF round

LOL so if Djokovic had del Potro and Federer had Ferrer, then Federer's draw would be harder?

BigServer1
06-06-2012, 04:56 PM
None of their draws have been tough, let's be honest.

I don't think anyone would argue which Semi is harder...

Wolfman Jack
06-06-2012, 06:36 PM
The only thing I Am is annoyed, that a sport I love to play and watch that at 1 time had some integrity seperating it from most other sports has none. Due mostly to commercialism. Wimby and all white, yet advertising all over the place.... Any fool that thinks genetics/desire is the determinig factor in greatness need to open their eyes.
Yes, Federer and the rest of ATP players got the memo about the dire necessity for Nadal to win and they just rolled over. LMFAO.

Pay attention, if you look at virtually every Slam final where Nadal played, you can distinguish a grassy knoll somewhere in the stadium, behind which an anonymous shooter is throwing darts of apathy and failure to Nadal's opponent (mostly Federer.)

Wolfman Jack
06-06-2012, 06:38 PM
How many grand slam champions, and grand slam finalists were in each half?

That should give an indication of the calibre of players that mentally have the ability to get to finals stages of a slam, since they have proven it in the past, and hence the tougher draw/route to the final.
How about any grand slam finalist and champions that ACTUALLY has a relevant career in clay with any recent achievements to speak of? Uh... I guess none of them do because Nadal has ruled the surface for so long LOL.

Wolfman Jack
06-06-2012, 06:39 PM
How many clay titles have all four SF's previous 5 opponents won? That's a good indicator of who has/had the toughest draw.

It's clearly Nadal with the toughest draw based on his opponents' clay court results. Second is Federer then Ferrer and last Djokovic.

Nadal (35)
Almagro (12)
Monaco (5)
Total of his opponents: 17

Ferrer (8 )
Granollers (2)
Youzhny(2)
Total of his opponents: 4

Djokovic (7)
Seppi(1)
Total of his opponents: 1

Federer (10)
Delpo (4)
Total of his opponents: 4


If Almagro had Ferrer's draw, he'd most likely be into the SF round
Good analysis, thank you. But, as they say, "haters gonna hate." :)

Wolfman Jack
06-06-2012, 06:42 PM
You people are joking, right?
Not at all. The problem is that you are not comparing the draws objectively. You are looking at how each of the semifinalists did against his draw. Is Nadal to blame that Roger had such a tough time with a consumate clay specialist like Del Potro? Or that Seppi almost took Djoker out? And, who in their sane mind would have predicted Seppi's commendable performance against Djoker?

Cry me a river LOL

Towser83
06-06-2012, 07:03 PM
How many clay titles have all four SF's previous 5 opponents won? That's a good indicator of who has/had the toughest draw.

It's clearly Nadal with the toughest draw based on his opponents' clay court results. Second is Federer then Ferrer and last Djokovic.

Nadal (35)
Almagro (12)
Monaco (5)
Total of his opponents: 17

Ferrer (8 )
Granollers (2)
Youzhny(2)
Total of his opponents: 4

Djokovic (7)
Seppi(1)
Total of his opponents: 1

Federer (10)
Delpo (4)
Total of his opponents: 4


If Almagro had Ferrer's draw, he'd most likely be into the SF round

that's a good idea, but there is no way of determining what is a hard draw, as well as it being merely opinion, form also plays a big part and that changes day to day, even minute to minute.

Also someone like Almagro wins a lot of minor clay events because he plays a lot. Guys like Tsonga and Delpo don't win as much but they can beat top 4 players in SLAMS.

I mean Murray probably wins more hardcourt titles than nadal generally, but in a slam it's nadal who has the bigger chance of winning.

Towser83
06-06-2012, 07:11 PM
Not at all. The problem is that you are not comparing the draws objectively. You are looking at how each of the semifinalists did against his draw. Is Nadal to blame that Roger had such a tough time with a consumate clay specialist like Del Potro? Or that Seppi almost took Djoker out? And, who in their sane mind would have predicted Seppi's commendable performance against Djoker?

Cry me a river LOL

seppi is not a hard draw, but delpo is a good clay player and more than that, he is a player who at his best can cause nightmares for top guys. You can have all the almagros and monacos in the world who are very good clay "specialists", but it means jack because at the end of the day they don't have what it takes to knock out Federer or nadal or Djokovic in a slam on any surface. Delpo meanwhile gave Nadal big problems in Davis cup and even on grass at Wimbledon where he's a novice. Doesn't matter that he doesn't base his whole season on clay results at 250's and 500s because 1, he's very good on hardcourt and 2, he expects to go further in bigger events which means you don't have time for the tiny tournaments. He's won 2 Estoril titles in a row now that he's having to play smaller events, if he did that a lot he could destroy people like Almagro.

Hitman
06-07-2012, 03:50 AM
How about any grand slam finalist and champions that ACTUALLY has a relevant career in clay with any recent achievements to speak of? Uh... I guess none of them do because Nadal has ruled the surface for so long LOL.

And you point is, die hard defender of Nadal?

Yes, Nadal is truly dominant on the surface, but comparing Monaco and Almagro to proven big match players, who competed in slam finals, or have won slam titles, that have the mentality to get that far is a little far fetched in my eyes.

But, you hold your sword high and defend Nadal the best you can! You're doing a splendid job. :)

Hitman
06-07-2012, 03:52 AM
that's a good idea, but there is no way of determining what is a hard draw, as well as it being merely opinion, form also plays a big part and that changes day to day, even minute to minute.

Also someone like Almagro wins a lot of minor clay events because he plays a lot. Guys like Tsonga and Delpo don't win as much but they can beat top 4 players in SLAMS.

I mean Murray probably wins more hardcourt titles than nadal generally, but in a slam it's nadal who has the bigger chance of winning.

As always my friend, you post too much logic on these boards. Stop before you give people headaches here! :)

Feather
06-07-2012, 03:58 AM
that's a good idea, but there is no way of determining what is a hard draw, as well as it being merely opinion, form also plays a big part and that changes day to day, even minute to minute.

Also someone like Almagro wins a lot of minor clay events because he plays a lot. Guys like Tsonga and Delpo don't win as much but they can beat top 4 players in SLAMS.

I mean Murray probably wins more hardcourt titles than nadal generally, but in a slam it's nadal who has the bigger chance of winning.

very well said my friend :)

primetennis
06-07-2012, 04:17 AM
i wanna see nadal drawn with nalby(2R),raonic(3R), isner(4R),delpo/berdych(Q) n federer(Sf) in his half for once in a slam..
i wonder what sort of injury he would come up with at the press conference afterwards