PDA

View Full Version : Is Murray the best player to only win one slam now?


papertank
09-11-2012, 06:13 PM
8 masters, Olympic gold, and had to deal with the strongest top 3 since the 80s, possibly ever. Can you think of anyone better?

Tennis_Maestro
09-11-2012, 06:15 PM
What's the point of discussing this when we all know it is only a matter of time before he wins another on a hardcourt?

MurrayMyInspiration
09-11-2012, 06:15 PM
Good question.No.Simple. No debate. Thread is finished.

Mustard
09-11-2012, 06:52 PM
It's Thomas Muster. Show me another 1 time major winner who won 44 career titles, including 21 titles in a 25 month prime? Muster also has 8 masters series titles.

MichaelNadal
09-11-2012, 06:55 PM
What about Roddick?

MurrayMyInspiration
09-11-2012, 06:55 PM
He won titles against mugs in a horrible era. You are the most knowledgable poster on this forum but you blind yourself with stats. Muster was a high tier journeyman winning tournaments nobody gave a rats arse about. Sorry truth hurts.

Mustard
09-11-2012, 06:58 PM
He won titles against mugs in a horrible era. You are the most knowledgable poster on this forum but you blind yourself with stats. Muster was a high tier journeyman winning tournaments nobody gave a rats arse about. Sorry truth hurts.

Muster won 3 Monte Carlos, 3 Romes, 1 Essen (an indoor carpet masters at the time), and 1 Miami. He won tournaments at all levels. During his 25 month prime, he won 6 masters series titles.

Mustard
09-11-2012, 07:01 PM
What about Roddick?

There's already a thread on that :)

MurrayMyInspiration
09-11-2012, 07:03 PM
Muster won 3 Monte Carlos, 3 Romes, 1 Essen (an indoor carpet masters at the time), and 1 Miami. He won tournaments at all levels. During his 25 month prime, he won 6 masters series titles.

Fails so hard at slams though.....1rd wimby gow many years in a row lol....Wins french...nobody really cares about french though....Fails everywhere else. Weak era, wins a couple of masters. He is a nothing compared to Murray, Roddick even beats him in this one (thanks to Brooklyn)

MichaelNadal
09-11-2012, 07:04 PM
There's already a thread on that :)

Ah just saw it. Hate that work has kept me from my forum time lately lol.

NadalAgassi
09-11-2012, 07:06 PM
It's Thomas Muster. Show me another 1 time major winner who won 44 career titles, including 21 titles in a 25 month prime? Muster also has 8 masters series titles.

Murray has 8 Masters titles just like Muster. After that Murray has Olympic Gold plus 3 500 titles vs Muster's 4 500 titles. Over 30 of Muster's career titles are 250 level or below, which are pretty much meaningless when talking about Slam Champions. Murray though has Olympic Gold and 5 slam finals. This gives him the edge over Muster who has much weaker slam performance. Plus surface to surface:

Clay: Muster >>>>>>>>>> Murray
Hard Courts: Murray >>> Muster. I know Muster did play some good hard court tennis and wasnt a bad hard court player, but this is still no contest.
Grass: Murray >>>>>>>>>>> Muster.
Indoors/Carpet: Murray >>> Muster. Muster did win that Essen event and had some decent matches at the WTF, but again no contest.

Outside off clay Murray dumps all over Muster.

MurrayMyInspiration
09-11-2012, 07:09 PM
Murray has 8 Masters titles just like Muster. Anything below a Masters level tournament is a meaningless rink de dink for slam champion caliber players when evaluating their careers. Murray though has Olympic Gold and 5 slam finals. This gives him the edge over Muster who has much weaker slam performance. Plus surface to surface:

Clay: Muster >>>>>>>>>> Murray
Hard Courts: Murray >>> Muster. I know Muster did play some good hard court tennis and wasnt a bad hard court player, but this is still no contest.
Grass: Murray >>>>>>>>>>> Muster.
Indoors/Carpet: Murray >>> Muster. Muster did win that Essen event and had some decent matches at the WTF, but again no contest.

Outside off clay Murray dumps all over Muster.

This. 10 huge scottish dumps all over Muster :)

SoBad
09-11-2012, 07:10 PM
8 masters, Olympic gold, and had to deal with the strongest top 3 since the 80s, possibly ever. Can you think of anyone better?

Without Nadal in the draw, I wouldn't even count this as a slam, considering the era and the intangibles of the tour.

Mustard
09-11-2012, 07:11 PM
But when has Murray had a period like Muster's prime, like going 65-2 on your best surface in a calendar year, and 111-5 over 2 calendar years?

MurrayMyInspiration
09-11-2012, 07:15 PM
But when has Murray had a period like Muster's prime, like going 65-2 on your best surface in a calendar year, and 111-5 over 2 calendar years?

10dumps on Muster's forehead. Goodnight sweet sweet Mustard!

NadalAgassi
09-11-2012, 07:15 PM
But when has Murray had a period like Muster's prime, like going 65-2 on your best surface in a calendar year, and 111-5 over 2 calendar years?

Tennis isnt just played on one surface. What surface other than clay is Muster even close to Murray? Yes he isnt a mug on other surfaces except grass, yes he is a great of the Open Era on clay, but there is only so far greatness on one surface, especialy one that resulted in only 1 slam and a dissapointing slam record on your pet surface, can take you. Seriously are you going to argue Muster is better than Courier too since his greatness on clay possibly exceeds Courier on any one surface (depsite Courier having 2 hard and 2 clay slams, this is possibly true). By this logic you could even try that, but of course that would be even more laughable.

Yeah Murray on hard courts has never dominated as much as Muster for a brief period on clay, but Murray's longevity as a top hard court performer also far surpasses Muster on clay, so it evens out, and Murray's achievements on hard courts definitely measure up to Muster's on clay. Anyway while Muster did face a strong clay field, he would not have dominated clay to that extent in 95/96 if he had to face the equivalent of Federer and Djokovic on hard courts on clay, heck he probably wouldnt have even dominated Federer and Djokovic on clay itself with ease at his peak of peaks like he did the field for a couple years, never mind their equivalents of hard courts which Murray had to face (plus Nadal as well). Then on their other surfaces it is no contest, even Murray on clay is way better than Muster on grass based on the brief pitiful sightings of him even playing competitively on the surface.

WhiskeyEE
09-11-2012, 07:17 PM
Muster never won a match at Wimbledon rofl.

Mustard
09-11-2012, 07:24 PM
10dumps on Muster's forehead. Goodnight sweet sweet Mustard!

LOL. You don't have an answer, do you? ;)

Tennis isnt just played on one surface. What surface other than clay is Muster even close to Murray? Yes he isnt a mug on other surfaces except grass, yes he is a great of the Open Era on clay, but there is only so far greatness on one surface, especialy one that resulted in only 1 slam and a dissapointing slam record on your pet surface, can take you. Seriously are you going to argue Muster is better than Courier too since his greatness on clay possibly exceeds Courier on any one surface (depsite Courier having 2 hard and 2 clay slams, this is possibly true). By this logic you could even try that, but of course that would be even more laughable.

Why bring Courier into this conversation? Courier won 4 majors, and we're discussing players with 1 major.

Yeah Murray on hard courts has never dominated as much as Muster for a brief period on clay, but Murray's longevity as a top hard court performer also far surpasses Muster on clay, so it evens out, and Murray's achievements on hard courts definitely measure up to Muster's on clay.

Murray has long term consistency at the top, but not the dominance of Muster at his peak on his strongest surface.

Muster never won a match at Wimbledon rofl.

Yes, I do know that. How exactly does this change the fact that Muster, a 1 time major winner, won 44 career titles including 8 masters series, and also 21 titles in his 25 month career peak?

NadalAgassi
09-11-2012, 07:31 PM
So 2 years of dominance on one surface, one which included a flop at the biggest event of the year on that surface, is enough to overcome HUGE superiority on the other 3 surfaces, much more longevity and consistency as a top player over the years, much better slam performances (even on their mutual best surface), and similar achievements as far as semi significant or above titles and wins even on the mutual pet surface all combined. Just no.

Mustard
09-11-2012, 07:37 PM
So 2 years of dominance on one surface, one which included a flop at the biggest event of the year on that surface, is enough to overcome HUGE superiority on the other 3 surfaces, more longevity as a top player, much better slam performances, and similar achievements even on the mutual pet surface. Just no.

Are we supposed to believe that Murray is better when he has never had an aura and dominance like peak Muster?

Mainad
09-11-2012, 07:40 PM
It's Thomas Muster. Show me another 1 time major winner who won 44 career titles, including 21 titles in a 25 month prime? Muster also has 8 masters series titles.

Ah but Muster never won Olympic gold! :wink:

Ginger ninja
09-11-2012, 07:44 PM
Um, let's compare when Murray retires and if this is the only slam he wins......which I very much doubt.

NadalAgassi
09-11-2012, 08:09 PM
Are we supposed to believe that Murray is better when he has never had an aura and dominance like peak Muster?

Muster only had an aura of dominance for a brief period on one surface- clay. Lets not pretend for a moment Muster had an aura of dominance over the overall tour for a brief period like say even Hewitt had. Lets not also pretend he was the overall dominant clay court of that era by a clear margin. Courier in his own peak had an easy time with Muster on clay, Bruguera won back to back French Opens, and Muster didnt began his own brief reign on clay until those two guys had fallen well off form, especialy Courier.

For whats its worth as well even while dominating so strongly on clay in 95/96 I dont think Muster had EVERYONE petrified. Courier and Agassi are two guys who would have loved a crack at Muster on clay even then I believe (I am not saying they would have neccessarily won but I dont think they would have bought into the aura of dominance either). Of course they didnt get far enough on any occasion those two years for that to happen, but that is aside the point.