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View Full Version : Did Nadal and Federer ruin tennis?


Mike Sams
09-28-2012, 08:31 AM
Everybody notice that after the Federer/Nadal matchups in 2006 onward and the long grinding rallies they had on clay and at Wimbledon, organizers across all events everywhere began slowing down their surfaces because they discovered that long grinding taxing matches was much more exciting to the live crowd and television viewers.
And now, all surfaces play the same and organizers are also slowing down what were once fast courts including the USO.:confused:
And now we have those long grinding affairs like AO 2012 with Nadal/Djokovic and Murray/Djokovic at USO which go on for hours and hours and basically the fittest player on the day wins the match.

Polvorin
09-28-2012, 08:38 AM
Did *Nadal* ruin tennis? It depends on your point of view. Federer had nothing to do with it. He prefers to play quick strike, aggressive tennis. He only got in those long rallies because it is/was difficult to attack the Nadal moonballs and because the guy is a human backboard.

slowfox
09-28-2012, 08:46 AM
I don't pretend to have any great insight on the matter. And while I agree that the trend towards homogenous surfaces has changed tennis, and is perhaps *bad* for the sport, I also sometimes feel it may have been necessary.

If modern racquets and strings are making it easier to hit balls that carry immense speed/spin, maybe slowing the courts down gives the players a better chance to get to the ball. Technology has changed, but human bodies are pretty much the same. (Yes, athletes do train harder and are fitter now, but biologically they are still the same i.e. humans haven't evolved to handle harsh polys yet. Look at all the wrist injuries out there. And do our eyes see any faster than 30 years ago?)

Again, I dunno. I'm no expert. But I do remember that the 88 US Open final lasted nearly 5 hours.

Clarky21
09-28-2012, 08:50 AM
Another pointless and ridiculous thread started by Mike Shams. Fed and Nadal have helped tennis,and have certainly not ruined it. Dumb thread is D-U-M-B.

TMF
09-28-2012, 09:06 AM
Saying Fed/Nadal ruin tennis is like saying Chris/Martina or Borg/Mac ruin tennis.

so much nonsense flooding this forum lately.

smoledman
09-28-2012, 09:19 AM
Yes the butt sniffer, butt scratcher, butt picker ruined life.

Mike Sams
09-28-2012, 09:52 AM
Or we could say that Nadal ruined tennis because he trapped everybody into long grinding rallies where his best defense was moonballing and waiting for mistakes.

Mike Sams
09-28-2012, 09:52 AM
Another pointless and ridiculous thread started by Mike Shams. Fed and Nadal have helped tennis,and have certainly not ruined it. Dumb thread is D-U-M-B.

How exactly has Nadal helped tennis?

cknobman
09-28-2012, 10:27 AM
Nadal eats baby puppies.

http://blogs.smarter.com/blogs/guests/Baby%20Eating%20Puppy.JPG

Mustard
09-28-2012, 11:04 AM
How exactly has Nadal helped tennis?

Because he fights and competes, is very exciting to watch, makes tennis look as hard as it really is yet he still excels, which makes Nadal's game easier for us mere mortals to relate to. There's virtually nobody with a neutral opinion about Nadal, he is either loved or hated.

beast of mallorca
09-28-2012, 11:16 AM
How exactly has Nadal helped tennis?

It's either you're genuinely stupid or ridiculously dumb. Pity the fool. :twisted:

Prisoner of Birth
09-28-2012, 11:19 AM
Because he fights and competes, is very exciting to watch, makes tennis look as hard as it really is yet he still excels, which makes Nadal's game easier for us mere mortals to relate to. There's virtually nobody with a neutral opinion about Nadal, he is either loved or hated.

Not true. The majority of casual Tennis fans are neutral towards Nadal. It's only the ***** (Federer, Djokovic, Murray etc.) that hate him and his fans, ***** that love him.

augustobt
09-28-2012, 11:45 AM
The point is that Fedal's grindfests were displays of joy. Apart from that, almost all grindfests sucks. A lot.

Mike Sams
09-28-2012, 12:05 PM
Because he fights and competes, is very exciting to watch, makes tennis look as hard as it really is yet he still excels, which makes Nadal's game easier for us mere mortals to relate to. There's virtually nobody with a neutral opinion about Nadal, he is either loved or hated.

We've had plenty of those. Ever heard of David Ferrer for example? The small guy who finishes in the top 10?

Mike Sams
09-28-2012, 12:07 PM
It's either you're genuinely stupid or ridiculously dumb. Pity the fool. :twisted:

So how has Nadal helped tennis? Isn't he the one who wanted a 2 year ranking system, more clay court events and a raised net? :lol: All the while, wasting time between points, cheating through coaching, calling for bogus MTOs to get an advantage and bodychecking players he dislikes like Rosol. :lol:
How has Nadal helped tennis?

Mustard
09-28-2012, 12:18 PM
We've had plenty of those. Ever heard of David Ferrer for example? The small guy who finishes in the top 10?

Ferrer is not as explosive as Nadal, nor does he have as many weapons.

NDFM
09-28-2012, 12:18 PM
you asked this question as if you had no idea if they ruined tennis but clearly you have an opinion of who has ruined tennis so putting federer into your question was kinda strange. To answer your question, I think they haven't ruined tennis their rivalry alone brought more interest into tennis.

cluckcluck
09-28-2012, 12:35 PM
Wait, Nadal wants higher nets? Link to quote please!

Mike Sams
09-28-2012, 12:38 PM
Ferrer is not as explosive as Nadal, nor does he have as many weapons.

Nadal's main weapon is being a lefty.

Prisoner of Birth
09-28-2012, 12:44 PM
Wait, Nadal wants higher nets? Link to quote please!

Yes, link or it didn't happen.

TennisLovaLova
09-28-2012, 12:47 PM
Lots of people came back to tennis or started watching it because of federer and nadal.

winstonplum
09-28-2012, 12:54 PM
Lots of people came back to tennis or started watching it because of federer and nadal.

Truer words never spoken. Most of my friends got back into tennis because of Federer after years of not paying attention. I, on the other hand was never moved by Federer, but got back into tennis after watching Nadal, especially the 2007 Wimby final, which I found most striking because Nadal, while clearly the inferior player on that surface on that day in regards to talent, pushed that match to five sets on pure guts and determination. I was sold from that day on.

Mike Sams
09-28-2012, 01:01 PM
Truer words never spoken. Most of my friends got back into tennis because of Federer after years of not paying attention. I, on the other hand was never moved by Federer, but got back into tennis after watching Nadal, especially the 2007 Wimby final, which I found most striking because Nadal, while clearly the inferior player on that surface on that day in regards to talent, pushed that match to five sets on pure guts and determination. I was sold from that day on.

I wonder why Nadal looked so helpless when Nadal 2.0....uhm sorry...I meant Djokovic found his form and wiped Nadal out in their Wimbledon final in 2011.:neutral:

Wooly
09-28-2012, 02:48 PM
The CIA has something to do with it ... :)

90's Clay
09-28-2012, 04:09 PM
I would have hate to see how bad tennis would have been without them considering the talent has been some of the weakest since the early 00's present

Prisoner of Birth
09-28-2012, 04:17 PM
I would have hate to see how bad tennis would have been without them considering the talent has been some of the weakest since the early 00's present

I'm just curious, who are your favorite players? Name 5.

90's Clay
09-28-2012, 04:43 PM
I'm just curious, who are your favorite players? Name 5.

1. Nadal
2. Djoker
3. Berdych
4. Fed
5. Tsonga

Mustard
09-28-2012, 04:52 PM
I wonder why Nadal looked so helpless when Nadal 2.0....uhm sorry...I meant Djokovic found his form and wiped Nadal out in their Wimbledon final in 2011.:neutral:

Did the 2012 clay-court season not happen in your universe? :?

Tennis_Hands
09-28-2012, 04:59 PM
Did the 2012 clay-court season not happen in your universe? :?

Ah, Mustard at it again.

Which part of "at Wimbledon" did you not understand?

Prisoner of Birth
09-28-2012, 05:03 PM
1. Nadal
2. Djoker
3. Berdych
4. Fed
5. Tsonga

No Sampras? I see you criticizing the modern era a lot, I figured you wouldn't have any of them in your top 5.

Clarky21
09-28-2012, 05:05 PM
Ah, Mustard at it again.

Which part of "at Wimbledon" did you not understand?



And you're at it again as well. I think just about every single post you make is about Nadal,a guy you loathe and would like to see disappear. Why are so obsessed with him if you don't even like him?

TheMusicLover
09-28-2012, 05:14 PM
And you're at it again as well. I think just about every single post you make is about Nadal,a guy you loathe and would like to see disappear. Why are so obsessed with him if you don't even like him?

Can't help but comment that I've seen YOU 'loathe' - or at least harshly criticize - Rafa at tons of occasions as well. ;)

As for the discussion at hand, of course, a big NO.
Fed and Raf draw in TONS of new tennis fans in the past decade. I can just hope for some, or rather the most of them, to keep on hanging in there, once they're gone - something I hope will be away for at least a couple of years from now.

Sid_Vicious
09-28-2012, 05:21 PM
Nah, they were great for tennis.

However, the whole fedal craze is really annoying. There are people who seem to think that Federer and Nadal are the only pros on tour worthy of being watched. Some people think that Fedal matches are the benchmark for what good tennis is, when in reality, most of their matches have sucked.

Clarky21
09-28-2012, 05:23 PM
Can't help but comment that I've seen YOU 'loathe' - or at least harshly criticize - Rafa at tons of occasions as well. ;)As for the discussion at hand, of course, a big NO.
Fed and Raf draw in TONS of new tennis fans in the past decade. I can just hope for some, or rather the most of them, to keep on hanging in there, once they're gone - something I hope will be away for at least a couple of years from now.



Tennis Hands does nothing but jump on Nadal,and his fans on here with practically every single post he makes. It's all he ever posts about,and it's ridiculous. Especially when it seems he can't allow Nadal fans on here the right to like someone he doesn't,and someone that isn't named Roger Federer. He's obsessed,and I really wish he would find something or someone else to b*tch about.

TheMusicLover
09-28-2012, 05:35 PM
Tennis Hands does nothing but jump on Nadal,and his fans on here with practically every single post he makes. It's all he ever posts about,and it's ridiculous. Especially when it seems he can't allow Nadal fans on here the right to like someone he doesn't,and someone that isn't named Roger Federer. He's obsessed,and I really wish he would find something or someone else to b*tch about.

Hey Clarky, I admire you as someone who's at least being able to be critical to certain things Rafa does (poker??? wtf :shock:) and that's a good thing imho.
The only thing I vehemently disagree on with you, is your insinuations you often make about Rafa's private life, but that's just me. :)

NadalAgassi
09-28-2012, 06:07 PM
Everybody notice that after the Federer/Nadal matchups in 2006 onward and the long grinding rallies they had on clay and at Wimbledon, organizers across all events everywhere began slowing down their surfaces because they discovered that long grinding taxing matches was much more exciting to the live crowd and television viewers.
And now, all surfaces play the same and organizers are also slowing down what were once fast courts including the USO.:confused:
And now we have those long grinding affairs like AO 2012 with Nadal/Djokovic and Murray/Djokovic at USO which go on for hours and hours and basically the fittest player on the day wins the match.

Federer is a much more attacking style player than your boy Djokovic, and more than Nadal as well of course, so if your complaint is with grinding tennis your blaming Federer as having a part in ruining tennis in that regard is laugahble.

jukka1970
09-28-2012, 06:10 PM
Everybody notice that after the Federer/Nadal matchups in 2006 onward and the long grinding rallies they had on clay and at Wimbledon, organizers across all events everywhere began slowing down their surfaces because they discovered that long grinding taxing matches was much more exciting to the live crowd and television viewers.
And now, all surfaces play the same and organizers are also slowing down what were once fast courts including the USO.:confused:
And now we have those long grinding affairs like AO 2012 with Nadal/Djokovic and Murray/Djokovic at USO which go on for hours and hours and basically the fittest player on the day wins the match.

I personally think they saved Men's tennis. Sorry but I was getting sick of seeing matches go, Ace, Ace, Ace, Return/Return Winner. It was boring. And I hated watching Sampras. Federer caused everyone to go to a higher level. And Nadal brought a whole new way of playing especially to clay courts.

Paullaconte1
09-28-2012, 06:15 PM
Fed - Nad definitely ruined the tennis careers of the other players! lol

Paullaconte1
09-28-2012, 06:22 PM
I think this is the answer how Fed and Nad were harmful for tennis
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=94xyOpETYYs

ruerooo
09-28-2012, 06:34 PM
To answer your question, I think they haven't ruined tennis their rivalry alone brought more interest into tennis.

Well-spoken.

I still miss Marat too. And was sad when Feña and Juanquí retired, for that matter.

Why are people whining?

TheFifthSet
09-28-2012, 06:37 PM
So how has Nadal helped tennis? Isn't he the one who wanted a 2 year ranking system, more clay court events and a raised net? :lol: All the while, wasting time between points, cheating through coaching, calling for bogus MTOs to get an advantage and bodychecking players he dislikes like Rosol. :lol:
How has Nadal helped tennis?

Never heard that one before, source?

Sid_Vicious
09-28-2012, 06:39 PM
Never heard that one before, source?

It was actually Toni who said that.
http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=399403

MichaelNadal
09-28-2012, 07:04 PM
It was actually Toni who said that.
http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=399403

Lol im sure Rafa has no quarrels with the net height. Toni needs to sit down somewhere.

NadalAgassi
09-28-2012, 07:05 PM
if it werent for Federer and Nadal nobody would watch tennis today (except for when Serena plays). Even Djokovic isnt a big drawing card, my casual tennis fan friends in Canada dont give a twat about him, and TV ratings in matches or events he is in without atleast 1 of Fedal are way down there. The biggest drawing cards outside Fedal are Murray and Roddick (before his recent retirement) and that is almost 100% related to nationality.

Zarfot Z
09-28-2012, 07:38 PM
This is quite possibly the dumbest thread I have ever seen on any forum.

Sid_Vicious
09-28-2012, 07:39 PM
This is quite possibly the dumbest thread I have ever seen on any forum.

It does not top the one about Federer's career being "hollow".

RF20Lennon
09-28-2012, 08:28 PM
Fedal grindfests were the only grindfests i enjoyed watching :)

Metalica
09-29-2012, 07:12 AM
Nadal helped tennis by bringing more popularity to the sport. Federer was about as good an ambassador for the sport as can be but he needed a rival. There's no excitement if the same person win every slam. Nadal actually provided a challenge for Federer and their rivalry attracted many fans for the sport.

VPhuc tennis fan
09-29-2012, 08:30 AM
Nadal helped tennis by bringing more popularity to the sport. Federer was about as good an ambassador for the sport as can be but he needed a rival. There's no excitement if the same person win every slam. Nadal actually provided a challenge for Federer and their rivalry attracted many fans for the sport.
Good point. Quality can only be shown through competition. Although it hurts me to see Fed lose anytime, it's still good for the big picture of tennis as a sport. Besides, it gives Fed or Rafa some incentive to play better when facing the other guy.

tacou
09-29-2012, 08:31 AM
They ruined in that it will be a long, long time--if ever--before we are blessed with a rivalry of such a historic scale

VPhuc tennis fan
09-29-2012, 08:42 AM
In time, another rivalry will develop. Maybe it's already going on between Rafa, Djoker, and Murray, based on the last 2 year results.
For me personally, I just hope not only for another rivalry but a bit more variety in the way the games are playing. Not sure if I can stomach these extra-long matches. Good once a while but if it happens too often, it becomes stale.

Sabratha
09-30-2012, 09:41 AM
They made tennis better.

TennisLovaLova
09-30-2012, 12:52 PM
Lots of people said in the nineties that jordan ruined the nba and baskeball in general
How wrong were they?

90's Clay
09-30-2012, 01:13 PM
Lots of people said in the nineties that jordan ruined the nba and baskeball in general
How wrong were they?

Basketball was probably the most popular it had ever been in the 90s.

dangalak
09-30-2012, 01:19 PM
Basketball was probably the most popular it had ever been in the 90s.

Was probably more popular in the late 80s.

TMF
09-30-2012, 02:14 PM
Was probably more popular in the late 80s.

That's true. Magic/Bird in the 80s was a cut above Jordan in the 90s. The reason is because of the intense rivalry between Magic/Bird, and the love/hate between the Lakers/Celtics was reborn agains since it all started in the 60s. The Fed/Nadal rivalry is like the Bird/Magic in the NBA. They will be remember as one of the best rivarly of all time, until some rivalry proved ottherwise in the future.

TennisLovaLova
10-01-2012, 02:55 AM
When someones is so dominant in his sport (Jordan was really outstanding), the pro leagues face a arena filling and merchandising issues with the other minor teams.
You have one player and one team attracting all the attention while the other teams suffer
that's why they said he was ruining it for them
same can be said for Roger and Rafa
who watches a seppi vs andujar match really?

dje31
10-01-2012, 06:20 AM
Lots of people said in the nineties that jordan ruined the nba and baskeball in general
How wrong were they?

Well, it's been a progression---not because of Jordan, but cultural degradation in general---but basketball has devolved into thugball. It's starting to make hockey look good.

To paraphrase the old cliche: I went to a gang fight and a basketball game broke out.

TennisLovaLova
10-01-2012, 10:22 AM
Well, it's been a progression---not because of Jordan, but cultural degradation in general---but basketball has devolved into thugball. It's starting to make hockey look good.

To paraphrase the old cliche: I went to a gang fight and a basketball game broke out.

you're kidding right
the new nba rules with no handcheckrule and defense in zone made the game less physical than before