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View Full Version : Question for Wilson PS 6.0 85 Re-issue Sampras


lendlmac
10-16-2012, 08:43 AM
Hi everyone,

real quick, just wondered, of those here who have the re-issue Wilson PS 6.0 85 Sampras, who has added lead tape to this frame? and why?

Does it play fine free of lead tape? or, have folks placed their lead tape ala Pete Sampras at 3 and 9, or ala Federer at 12 (11-1)?

I ask because I see Sampras always had his at 3-9, for stability, correct? 3 layers on each side....but I never saw any lead tape placement anywhere else, yet, Federer, uses lead tape at 12, for his own model, also three layers...

Is the PS 6.0 85 stable as is, so no lead tape needed? just curious who here puts lead tape on their PS 85, and why...

thanks. Oh, mine is strung with natural gut at 48lbs.... i love it and it feels great and wanted to tinker with lead tape for this frame, but didn't know who here, places their lead tape for this particular racquet......I know it will feel and play differently with lead tape, but this frame only, who has lead tape at 3-9 versus 12....

thanks!! :)

Bowtiesarecool
10-16-2012, 09:38 AM
The PS85 plays extremely well in stock form as long as you have the right technique and a good string setup that you like.

In stock form, it's best for serve and volleyers with a relatively high tension, (Let's say 55# and up).

For the modern spin game one would want the weight distributed more to the ends of a racquet, and generally a lower string tension, (less than 50#). Of the four PS85s I own, two are setup for spin. What I did was replace the leather grip wth a synthetic wilson that was 10g lighter, then ran 1/4" tape (both sides) around the top of the frame from perimiter weight to perimiter weight, (came out to be 7g) and added two 3g fishing weights inside the butcap. Taping the top of the hoop in this manner not only makes it easier to generate spin, but also moves the center of mass up which increases power. I have one with a full bed of MSV Focus Hex at 42 and the other with Prince Premier Attack mains at 47 with Signum Pro Poly Plasma crosses at 45.

The other two Prostaffs I own are setup for serve and volley, just a little heavier than stock because I like my racquets around the 13oz range for this style of play. Keeping the leather grip, I added two layers of 1/4" tape, 3 inches long, under the grommet at 3 and 9, plus 4g of lead under the grip, 6 1/2" from the end of the handle. I have one strung with full gut at 60lbs, and one with Prince Premiere Attack at 60lbs for when it gets a little wet outside.

lendlmac
10-16-2012, 11:21 AM
Thanks!

Dunlop MAx 200Gs - I currently have 6 Dunlop MAx 200G, a few I tried with lead tape on the sides and some on the top of the hoop, but in the end, I removed all the lead tape from the 200Gs as they don't need any lead tape at all, and they all play beautifully...so my Max 200Gs are lead tape free, each strung at 48 lbs. natural gut


Lendl Adidas GTX Pro T - I also play with two (2) Lendl Adidas GTX Pro T, with no lead tape, but tried as well on all areas, and it felt sluggish or flat...so removed the lead tape on those as well and those are strung at 55lbs with natural gut... and it has lots of power and very flexible...


Wilson PS 6.0 85 - my only Wilson PS 6.0 85, is 48 lbs., and it plays great! I was wondering if I added weight to the 3 and 9 area, if the racquet would not feel "lively" as opposed to not having any... since it's a brand new racqet for me, was just wondering if lead tape felt better at 12 as opposed to 3 and 9..

btw: how many layers do you have yours at 3 and 9? I saw sampras photos of his, and his layering is pretty thick, at least two layers on all four sides, but I think I see 3 layers on all four sides...

I will have to get some lead tape tonight and try it out...your method... I was going to add lead anyways to sample it, just wondered what the consensus was here for 3 and 9 versus 12 o'clock and the layering...

thanks! will post photos If I could.. LOL :)

Bowtiesarecool
10-16-2012, 04:34 PM
3 and 9 will make the torsional stability higher while slightly increasing swingweight. Lead at 12 will increase the swingweight the most efficienty and aid in spin generation but not torsional stability. The PS85 doesn't need any help with stability but more is always better in that regard. As far as "livelyness" is concerned, nothing i've done to mine have diminished the awesomeness of the racquet.

BreakPoint
10-16-2012, 05:39 PM
No lead tape on mine. Plays great as is stock. Very stable already in stock form. :)

Sander001
10-16-2012, 07:28 PM
Hate to be "that guy" but Sampras never used the 6.0.
ProStaff Midsize 85 ≠ ProStaff 6.0 85.

I find them to be similar racquets, but distinct in significant ways, enough so that the different designations are justified.

hrstrat57
10-16-2012, 07:48 PM
I have 2 PS 85's left, a St. Vincent and a China....I have about 4" of lead at 3/9 one layer only on each. Experimentation lead to determine this was best for me. Normally strung at 60# with gut, currently both recently strung with NXT tour. No overgrip Fairway only all the way!

100% agree on 200G never a drop of lead needed....play brilliantly right out of the box at 50# with gut.

Haven't had the pleasure of a hit with the new PS 85 yet....

sureshs
10-16-2012, 08:28 PM
Problem with the PS 85 is that once you get used to it, you cannot play with anything else. I tried the PK Redondo 93 and the BLX 6.1 90 and even they don't come close.

Bowtiesarecool
10-16-2012, 08:39 PM
Problem with the PS 85 is that once you get used to it, you cannot play with anything else. I tried the PK Redondo 93 and the BLX 6.1 90 and even they don't come close.

I'm in agreement here. I also demod the 6.1 90, Vcore 89, the current Prestige mid, Prince OG mid, as well as the Dunlop 4D 100, and while they're great sticks, There's just something about the 85 that everything else lacks.

NLBwell
10-16-2012, 08:46 PM
Played my PS 85 stock for many years.

Went to ProTour280 which is a different type of player's frame and was happy with that. Now playing with Microgel Prestige Pro with some weight added after my 280's died.

lendlmac
10-17-2012, 07:56 AM
Great posts!

Do folks here who play it stock, do you have plow through? Cause sampras at us open in 1990 was crushing agassi with heavy deep balls and serves yet he learly had leadtape at 3 and 9 and wanted to know anout plow through to push your oppponents back and deep

Edberg and courier had no leadtape and did not exactly blow by people and sampras with leadtape did....?

effortless
10-17-2012, 07:03 PM
For me the ps 6.0 85 (stock) is the epitome of plow through. I think it is because of the small head. In my opinion this racquet favours a low and deep trajectory. If you have a relatively linear motion on your groundies you will get plenty of plow through in stock. Obviously more lead on the head will give you even more plow through if thats what you want.

Seth
10-17-2012, 07:11 PM
For me the ps 6.0 85 (stock) is the epitome of plow through. I think it is because of the small head. In my opinion this racquet favours a low and deep trajectory. If you have a relatively linear motion on your groundies you will get plenty of plow through in stock. Obviously more lead on the head will give you even more plow through if thats what you want.

Exactly. I had a hit with one of the Chinese versions tonight. Effortless plow through. It seemed almost difficult to hit the ball short.

jorel
10-18-2012, 06:51 AM
i honestly do appreciate the reissue but i dont know why people dont just use the original wilson sting mid...
fraction of the cost and imo a better hit...they even have a couple with the PWS bumps

NLBwell
10-18-2012, 02:52 PM
I had a Sting. Never liked it and gave it away. Didn't think it was even a good backup racket for the Pro Staff. (However, the guy I gave it to liked it.)

sureshs
10-18-2012, 03:54 PM
I'm in agreement here. I also demod the 6.1 90, Vcore 89, the current Prestige mid, Prince OG mid, as well as the Dunlop 4D 100, and while they're great sticks, There's just something about the 85 that everything else lacks.

The PS 85 is not a competitive racket anymore, though. In a perverse twist, it is suitable for club players but not for juniors, college players or pros. I think the small head and lower SW of the PS 85 will be problems for returning serves, and if only for that, it cannot be used at higher levels. Next up, it will be a liability when facing heavy topspin because the small head permits little margin for error. That is why Federer ditched this frame.

effortless
10-18-2012, 04:48 PM
The PS 85 is not a competitive racket anymore, though. In a perverse twist, it is suitable for club players but not for juniors, college players or pros. I think the small head and lower SW of the PS 85 will be problems for returning serves, and if only for that, it cannot be used at higher levels. Next up, it will be a liability when facing heavy topspin because the small head permits little margin for error. That is why Federer ditched this frame.

Surely if you have used both the tour 90 and ps 85 you know that there is very little difference between the two. In my opinion, if the ps 6.0 85 is out dated so is the tour 90. I used the tour 90 for several years and then bought a ps 85 re issue just for fun and was amazed at how good it is. It is just as modern as the tour 90. You have to play a tiny bit more aggressive because its slightly better for hitting winners but slightly worse for baseline rallies.

The tour 90 was just Federer's personal preference.

sureshs
10-18-2012, 05:11 PM
Surely if you have used both the tour 90 and ps 85 you know that there is very little difference between the two. In my opinion, if the ps 6.0 85 is out dated so is the tour 90. I used the tour 90 for several years and then bought a ps 85 re issue just for fun and was amazed at how good it is. It is just as modern as the tour 90. You have to play a tiny bit more aggressive because its slightly better for hitting winners but slightly worse for baseline rallies.

The tour 90 was just Federer's personal preference.

I recently demoed the BLX 90 and it seemed to have much more margin for error. I am sure Federer could not have achieved what he has with the PS 85.

The PS 85 is just not competitive today at higher levels. Not a single pro, college player or junior is using it.

effortless
10-18-2012, 05:15 PM
I recently demoed the BLX 90 and it seemed to have much more margin for error. I am sure Federer could not have achieved what he has with the PS 85.

The PS 85 is just not competitive today at higher levels. Not a single pro, college player or junior is using it.

each to their own.

Just food for thought. Do you think more people would be using the ps 6.0 85 if it never went out of production. Do you think more people will start using the ps 6.0 85 now that its available? Seems like everyone is talking about it on these boards.

sureshs
10-18-2012, 05:30 PM
each to their own.

Just food for thought. Do you think more people would be using the ps 6.0 85 if it never went out of production. Do you think more people will start using the ps 6.0 85 now that its available? Seems like everyone is talking about it on these boards.

Not one guy I know or have heard of has purchased the PS 85. I have purchased 4 of them and stored 2 of them away for safety.

The PS 85 is not only not competitive, it is also not a suitable racket for someone who is learning tennis and wants to go beyond the 4.5 level. It is meant for a certain style of play which is no more, even though it produces a decent amount of spin.

Bowtiesarecool
10-18-2012, 05:39 PM
each to their own.

Just food for thought. Do you think more people would be using the ps 6.0 85 if it never went out of production. Do you think more people will start using the ps 6.0 85 now that its available? Seems like everyone is talking about it on these boards.

It went out of production because people quit using it in favor of larger frames. The current reissue isn't really targeted towards professionals. It's available mostly for nostalgic reasons, and people laud the P85 becase it was such a good frame in it's day. Like someone buying their favorite car from when they wre a kid. Even those top players who used the 85 don't use it now exept for maybe Edberg. They all say there's no reason to do so. I think it's the power and forgiveness of larger frames. It just doesn't seem terribly logical that anyone would use the excuse of not having enough area to hit a spin ball considering the difference in width betwwen an 85 and 100 is only about 1". Even connors gave up on his trusty 75" T2000 in the end, and said he should have made the switch sooner. When you're playing at the pro level, there insn't much a small frame has to offer over the modern 100

effortless
10-18-2012, 05:49 PM
Not one guy I know or have heard of has purchased the PS 85. I have purchased 4 of them and stored 2 of them away for safety.

The PS 85 is not only not competitive, it is also not a suitable racket for someone who is learning tennis and wants to go beyond the 4.5 level. It is meant for a certain style of play which is no more, even though it produces a decent amount of spin.

dude i'm 19 years old. I used the tour 90 when i was like 14 and now i'm a 5.0 player. I have only ever played like twice a week. You can't expect to become a good player with the ps 6.0 85 with a spin focussed consistency game. When that is what everyone else is, its worth being something else.

Your assumption that "a certain style of play" doesn't exist anymore is completely wrong.

My style of play is that which suits the ps 6.0 85. You are completely wrong in thinking there is a big difference between the 90 and the 85.

Out of curiosity have you used either of the racquets for a long period of time (more than a couple of hits)?

sureshs
10-18-2012, 06:01 PM
dude i'm 19 years old. I used the tour 90 when i was like 14 and now i'm a 5.0 player. I have only ever played like twice a week. You can't expect to become a good player with the ps 6.0 85 with a spin focussed consistency game. When that is what everyone else is, its worth being something else.

Your assumption that "a certain style of play" doesn't exist anymore is completely wrong.

My style of play is that which suits the ps 6.0 85. You are completely wrong in thinking there is a big difference between the 90 and the 85.

Out of curiosity have you used either of the racquets for a long period of time (more than a couple of hits)?

Yes I have tried many frames over the years.

You must be an exception as a junior to have used the 90. I have read here that there a few juniors like that.

Are you able to compete with the Babolat guys with your 90 in the baseline top spin game? Do you have a 1 handed BH? Does it withstand the bashing you get on that side? If so, hats off to you.

NLBwell
10-18-2012, 06:02 PM
It's really because of poly strings that the bigger rackets are more popular with better players these days. A big-headed racket with gut or even multis when hit very hard will lose control (trampoline). Now with the stiffer poly strings players can have more control coming off the stringbed and also get more spin. The smaller headsize of the mid doesn't give the spin advantage of the larger head, but with the poly strings, the larger headsizes (like 100sqin) don't have the disadvantages they used to.

(Agassi used to use kevlar in his oversize rackets in the pre-poly days)

sureshs
10-18-2012, 06:02 PM
It went out of production because people quit using it in favor of larger frames. The current reissue isn't really targeted towards professionals. It's available mostly for nostalgic reasons, and people laud the P85 becase it was such a good frame in it's day. Like someone buying their favorite car from when they wre a kid. Even those top players who used the 85 don't use it now exept for maybe Edberg. They all say there's no reason to do so. I think it's the power and forgiveness of larger frames. It just doesn't seem terribly logical that anyone would use the excuse of not having enough area to hit a spin ball considering the difference in width betwwen an 85 and 100 is only about 1". Even connors gave up on his trusty 75" T2000 in the end, and said he should have made the switch sooner. When you're playing at the pro level, there insn't much a small frame has to offer over the modern 100

The inch that changed tennis. Read that article.

effortless
10-18-2012, 06:31 PM
Yes I have tried many frames over the years.

You must be an exception as a junior to have used the 90. I have read here that there a few juniors like that.

Are you able to compete with the Babolat guys with your 90 in the baseline top spin game? Do you have a 1 handed BH? Does it withstand the bashing you get on that side? If so, hats off to you.

1. No usually i cannot withstand a baseline topspin game with babolats. I make sure that doesn't happen. I instinctively play less than 3 shot points 90% of the time and don't get into rallies.

2. Yes i have a one handed backhand.

3. I don't know why i would get a bashing on the backhand side. If you look at all of the 1hbh pros in the top 50, most of them have killer back hands (wawrinka, Gasquet, Haas, Federer). Also the slice back hand comes naturally to me due to the 1hbh.

4. You'll be surprised how many juniors are using the tour 90 where i live (Australia). I think there will be a new wave of pros coming through in the next 5 years who have emulated Federer's game and use similar equipment.

My message is, you can't play with a ps 6.0 85 like its a Babolat. You can however play effectively with it with the right type of play.

Also, why/how does Federer play with the 90? Is he just so much more talented than the rest of the players that he doesn't need a 100?

BreakPoint
10-18-2012, 06:35 PM
dude i'm 19 years old. I used the tour 90 when i was like 14 and now i'm a 5.0 player. I have only ever played like twice a week.
I find it a bit hard to believe that you became a 5.0 level player at the age of 19 by playing no more than twice a week.

effortless
10-18-2012, 07:13 PM
I find it a bit hard to believe that you became a 5.0 level player at the age of 19 by playing no more than twice a week.

It did vary. As a junior on tournament days we played 2 sets of singles, 1 set of doubles and heaps of hitting in between. So probably more play time then the average day of tennis.

But yeah i probably averaged 2 days a week. I also played other sports so i've always been really fit.

It is kinda strange now that i think about it.

effortless
10-18-2012, 07:20 PM
I've also been playing twice a week for almost my whole life - not since i was 14. I was about 3.5 when i switched to the tour 90 at 14.

BreakPoint
10-18-2012, 11:07 PM
Also, why/how does Federer play with the 90? Is he just so much more talented than the rest of the players that he doesn't need a 100?
Yes, he is. :)

I think Federer is so talented that he could play with anything.

jorel
10-19-2012, 05:59 AM
I had a Sting. Never liked it and gave it away. Didn't think it was even a good backup racket for the Pro Staff. (However, the guy I gave it to liked it.)
its uber flexy which migfhtnot apeal to some

Rabbit
10-19-2012, 06:14 AM
Yes, he is. :)

I think Federer is so talented that he could play with anything.

Anybody on the ATP world tour is talented enough to play with anything.

sureshs
10-19-2012, 07:32 AM
1. No usually i cannot withstand a baseline topspin game with babolats. I make sure that doesn't happen. I instinctively play less than 3 shot points 90% of the time and don't get into rallies.

2. Yes i have a one handed backhand.

3. I don't know why i would get a bashing on the backhand side. If you look at all of the 1hbh pros in the top 50, most of them have killer back hands (wawrinka, Gasquet, Haas, Federer). Also the slice back hand comes naturally to me due to the 1hbh.

4. You'll be surprised how many juniors are using the tour 90 where i live (Australia). I think there will be a new wave of pros coming through in the next 5 years who have emulated Federer's game and use similar equipment.

My message is, you can't play with a ps 6.0 85 like its a Babolat. You can however play effectively with it with the right type of play.

Also, why/how does Federer play with the 90? Is he just so much more talented than the rest of the players that he doesn't need a 100?

You will be the first junior in the world to play with a PS 85 :-)

nickarnold2000
10-19-2012, 08:34 AM
It's really because of poly strings that the bigger rackets are more popular with better players these days. A big-headed racket with gut or even multis when hit very hard will lose control (trampoline). Now with the stiffer poly strings players can have more control coming off the stringbed and also get more spin. The smaller headsize of the mid doesn't give the spin advantage of the larger head, but with the poly strings, the larger headsizes (like 100sqin) don't have the disadvantages they used to.

(Agassi used to use kevlar in his oversize rackets in the pre-poly days)

I agree with this. I play with a leaded up 100" tweener that has player racket weight but more power, forgiveness and control that wouldn't have been possible without using a poly in the mains.

BreakPoint
10-19-2012, 11:33 AM
Anybody on the ATP world tour is talented enough to play with anything.
I don't think Nadal would do too well with a Dunlop Maxply Fort woodie. :)

Mick
10-19-2012, 04:58 PM
I don't think Nadal would do too well with a Dunlop Maxply Fort woodie. :)

Rafael Nadal with a Dunlop Maxply Fort woodie :shock: :)
http://i40.tinypic.com/fvfvro.jpg

BreakPoint
10-19-2012, 07:34 PM
Rafael Nadal with a Dunlop Maxply Fort woodie :shock: :)
http://i40.tinypic.com/fvfvro.jpg

Yeah, I know. He played with it for about 5 minutes and gave up because he couldn't hit anything with it. He hated it.

Mick
10-19-2012, 08:58 PM
Yeah, I know. He played with it for about 5 minutes and gave up because he couldn't hit anything with it. He hated it.
for a long time, I thought Lendl couldn't play with a wood racquet then I saw this clip.

Skip to 5:32
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0H2emaQjiDw

Lendl played pretty well with wood too. I suspect Nadal could do the same, he would just change his strokes to make it work.

BreakPoint
10-19-2012, 10:15 PM
for a long time, I thought Lendl couldn't play with a wood racquet then I saw this clip.

Skip to 5:32
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0H2emaQjiDw

Lendl played pretty well with wood too. I suspect Nadal could do the same, he would just change his strokes to make it work.
Lendl hits flat and grew up using wood racquets. Nadal, OTOH, swings vertically and grew up using a big Babolat racquet. Night and day difference.

Mick
10-19-2012, 11:37 PM
Lendl hits flat and grew up using wood racquets. Nadal, OTOH, swings vertically and grew up using a big Babolat racquet. Night and day difference.

well, in my opinion, Nadal may not win a match against Federer when both are playing with wood racquets but I believe he could play very well with it.

On this board, some amateurs say they can play very well with the wood racquets. Nadal is not only a professional but a 10-time GS champion. It wouldn't make sense that the low level players could play well with wood racquets but a player of Nadal's caliber could not :)

BreakPoint
10-20-2012, 10:34 AM
well, in my opinion, Nadal may not win a match against Federer when both are playing with wood racquets but I believe he could play very well with it.

On this board, some amateurs say they can play very well with the wood racquets. Nadal is not only a professional but a 10-time GS champion. It wouldn't make sense that the low level players could play well with wood racquets but a player of Nadal's caliber could not :)
It depends on one's stroke and how one swings at the ball. I grew up using wood racquets so my stoke and swing is optimized for them. Even with graphite racquets today, I still swing horizontally and hit flat. Nadal grew up with big graphite racquets and spent his entire life swinging vertically - he's probably swung his racquet vertically over a billion times in his life. I doubt he's going to be able to pick up a wood racquet and immediately change everything he knows and is accustomed to doing when hitting a tennis ball when his vertical stroke is so ingrained into his DNA and muscle memory. If he used the same swing he usually does with a wood racquet, he would likely mishit every single ball.

effortless
10-21-2012, 07:28 PM
It depends on one's stroke and how one swings at the ball. I grew up using wood racquets so my stoke and swing is optimized for them. Even with graphite racquets today, I still swing horizontally and hit flat. Nadal grew up with big graphite racquets and spent his entire life swinging vertically - he's probably swung his racquet vertically over a billion times in his life. I doubt he's going to be able to pick up a wood racquet and immediately change everything he knows and is accustomed to doing when hitting a tennis ball when his vertical stroke is so ingrained into his DNA and muscle memory. If he used the same swing he usually does with a wood racquet, he would likely mishit every single ball.

Yeah compared to most pros he would find it hard due to the reasons you said. But he is obviously immensely talented and plays a hell of a lot of tennis. I think he would do a hell of a lot better with a wooden racquet than everyone here on these boards.