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Maui19
11-24-2012, 03:30 PM
I play a lot of doubles, and generally play the ad side. I find the DTL BH return to be especially challenging. Slice DTL is not that hard, although I find the slice spin sometimes taking the ball outside the line (I'm a righty). The topspin DTL return is quite a challenge for me. It seem like such a big redirection of the ball, and you need to take the ball so much later than a "normal" backhand return. I have a 1HBH.

Any advice for the DTL BH top return?

Say Chi Sin Lo
11-24-2012, 04:03 PM
My advice is to not attempt one unless you're up 0-40.

If you play a lot of doubles, why would you DTL anything, especially on a return? Not doubting your skills, but it's just not a smart play: the net is a bit higher, you don't have the angle, the court is not that big, anything less than a stellar shot will get eaten up by the net person. And if the server kicks it high to your backhand, it's a tougher shot to begin with.

But if you must go for the glory, you've got to take the return early, and catch it before it gets too high on your backhand. It's easier to control the shot as long as the ball stay beneath chest level. Once it gets high to say, the shoulders, forget it. You're better off chipping it back cross court. (You should really return everything cross court anyway in doubles)

Maui19
11-24-2012, 04:52 PM
My advice is to not attempt one unless you're up 0-40.

If you play a lot of doubles, why would you DTL anything, especially on a return? Not doubting your skills, but it's just not a smart play: the net is a bit higher, you don't have the angle, the court is not that big, anything less than a stellar shot will get eaten up by the net person. And if the server kicks it high to your backhand, it's a tougher shot to begin with.

But if you must go for the glory, you've got to take the return early, and catch it before it gets too high on your backhand. It's easier to control the shot as long as the ball stay beneath chest level. Once it gets high to say, the shoulders, forget it. You're better off chipping it back cross court. (You should really return everything cross court anyway in doubles)

Umm, well, yes, unless the net person is pinching the middle, then you need to keep them honest by going DTL (or lobbing). I find both these shots to be challenging but necessary. It's not a matter of glory at all, but one of keeping the net person from poaching your cross court returns.

I try to take all my returns early. The hard part about this shot is the amount of redirection required. I feel like I have to turn more and let the ball get significantly deeper to be able to redirect it down the all.

Anyone have any suggestions other than not to do it?

boramiNYC
11-24-2012, 05:20 PM
practice 1hbh for high balls. prep high the hand near the head. see gasquet or guga. and swing not low to high but much more flat. this doesn't mean flat shot. with the right wrist control and high racket head speed plenty topspin is possible but the contact point can be very high. shoulder level is no problem.

also the footwork must be precisely this. load completely on your left foot and coil the upperbody as far as you can. then as you swing step on the right foot as you kick back the left foot in the air. you might wanna practice this footwork a lot as you shadow swing so it becomes natural. it kinda feels like the running fh but for bh.

then practice direction. since the swing is very horizontal you change direction by minute adjustment of timing instead of lining up toward the target.

2ndServe
11-24-2012, 05:32 PM
don't open your shoulders up. Now you need to sort of roll the outside of the ball so you can get some topspin and tad bit of hook spin to bring a wide ball back to the court. Basically how you would hit a wide forehand from the deuce court is low to high but a tiny bit of hook spin to bring back to the alley since you're most likely hitting it from outside your own alley.

anantak2k
11-24-2012, 06:11 PM
My BH DTL return is better than any of my other return.

What I do on my BH return is take the ball very early with a rather short backswing. Similar to Agassi but a 4.5 version of it :P


Anyway, like others have mentioned before me, it is not a very smart play in doubles. High risk but low reward. You are hitting on the highest part of the net with very little margin for error and if you don't hit it absolutely perfect, any decent volleyer at the net can put your team in a bad position.

ramos77
11-24-2012, 11:53 PM
low percentage shot IMO, most times you will lose the point

unless the net player is poaching a lot, and he moves too early I wouldn't even try it.

the forehand however, no problem with it.

Maui19
11-25-2012, 06:13 AM
My BH DTL return is better than any of my other return.

What I do on my BH return is take the ball very early with a rather short backswing. Similar to Agassi but a 4.5 version of it :P


Anyway, like others have mentioned before me, it is not a very smart play in doubles. High risk but low reward. You are hitting on the highest part of the net with very little margin for error and if you don't hit it absolutely perfect, any decent volleyer at the net can put your team in a bad position.

As I have been trying to say, if you are hitting this shot it is because the net person has moved to the middle to cut off your cross court return. Then, if you don't have this shot, you lose the point. It is no different than needing to hit a FH DTL from the deuce court against an aggressive poacher.

Anyway, the challenge to me is how to redirect the ball at such a wide angle.

martini1
11-25-2012, 07:15 AM
This shot requires a lot of time on your side. IF I have a lot time to set up from a slow 2nd serve I could:
- top spin lob dtl to the doubles line area *deep*
- run around and I/O wide, my net partner can easily cut off the next shot

both options are better than a straight up dtl return unless you can laser beam it.

psv255
11-25-2012, 07:30 AM
Anyway, the challenge to me is how to redirect the ball at such a wide angle.

What helps me sometimes is thinking to hit the ball a bit left of center.
Odds are you're playing against decent servers, meaning that you'll be reacting later to the serves than your usual groundstroke. For me, thinking of hitting the left/outside part of the ball can do 2 things: redirect better and get some sidespin that can bring the ball back into the court (if you happen to misfire or go for a bit more).

Bagumbawalla
11-25-2012, 04:15 PM
1. Go to the paracice wall and set up a target above the net-line. Practice driving backhands to that point- over and over. This is sort of like hitting down the line. Do this until you become boringly good.

2. Now go to the courts with two practice partners. Have them in the opposite court and in opposite corners. They will hit balls only to your backhand, you will alternate balls to each of the players until both directions seem just as easy.

3. Next have someone hit serves to your backhand. Drive them down the line. You might mark off part of the court with masking tape, or have something out there to aim at.

NLBwell
11-25-2012, 06:43 PM
Just hit the ball that direction.

Do you have problems directing it down the line also in singles or is it that you don't feel that your regular DTL return is putting any pressure on the netman in doubles even if he is moving to the center of the court?
You don't have to hit a massive topspin return to pass a moving netman. A nice medium speed slice will do the job if you are anticipating correctly when he is likely to move. Moving up to take the serve return earlier reduces the netman's time to react, giving you more space going both crosscourt or down the line. Also, you need to do little more than block the ball if you are in close, simpliying your stroke.

Say Chi Sin Lo
11-25-2012, 07:08 PM
Just hit the ball that direction.



Wiser words have not been spoken, easily the best advice here.

psv255
11-25-2012, 07:34 PM
Slice DTL is not that hard, although I find the slice spin sometimes taking the ball outside the line (I'm a righty). The topspin DTL return is quite a challenge for me. It seem like such a big redirection of the ball, and you need to take the ball so much later than a "normal" backhand return. I have a 1HBH.

Just hit the ball that direction.

Do you have problems directing it down the line also in singles or is it that you don't feel that your regular DTL return is putting any pressure on the netman in doubles even if he is moving to the center of the court?
You don't have to hit a massive topspin return to pass a moving netman. A nice medium speed slice will do the job if you are anticipating correctly when he is likely to move. Moving up to take the serve return earlier reduces the netman's time to react, giving you more space going both crosscourt or down the line. Also, you need to do little more than block the ball if you are in close, simpliying your stroke.

This is great doubles advice NLB, but I think OP is citing a problem with 1hbh down-the-line returns in general, mostly focusing on coming over it. OP mentioned that his slice causes the ball to curve away from the court when he tries going down the line, so he'd rather try a topspin return.
So I'd try any of the following:
Mentally imagine hitting the left side of ball
Take it very early and use minimal shoulder/arm movement (a la Fed (http://www.youtube.com/watch?list=ULRN_fYtEikzI&v=RN_fYtEikzI&feature=player_detailpage#t=242s))
If above the shoulder, go crosscourt/lob/slice!

loci
11-26-2012, 02:10 AM
Use minimal backswing, take it early and have the racquet face travel out in front and toward the target and then break the plane of your shoulder. Do not open up your hips or move your right hip. keep your right hip still! That's the key. Good luck, Maui19.

Timbo's hopeless slice
11-26-2012, 01:31 PM
I played a match (5.0) last night where I made a couple of these and I thought of this thread (sad, eh?)

Anyway, I noticed I was on my toes and moving forward when I made contact inside the baseline. I was keeping my head really still and really hitting through the line.

I agree with Loci, get your feet/self into position and stay stable. BELIEVE in the shot, don't lift your head or pull off it, go through with the shot.

*note, I just hit the ball at the time, but thought about what I had done after the fact.

LeeD
11-26-2012, 02:35 PM
Decide before the server finish's bouncing the ball.
Visualize where the ball is going, from your racket to over the net down the alley, but not that wide (give the netman a chance at the low backhand volley). Do NOT look at the netman or the alley, instead, visualized where the ball is going.
Now, hit the return there no matter where the serve goes.