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View Full Version : Priority One: Waste of money or Necessary?


Overdrive
01-26-2013, 10:16 PM
For those that you don't know what Priority One is, it is a company that strings racquets for players ranging from recreational players to professionals in WTA/ATP.

This is a quote from a link on one their website: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702304520804576343300235154610.html
It stated that:
"Priority One has 14 "gold service" clients, including Mr. Djokovic, Roger Federer, Andy Murray and Robin Soderling. For $40,000 a year, the company cares for its clients' rackets at the four Grand Slam and eight other mandatory tournaments. (Additional tournaments cost extra.)" This article is from 2011 so the number of clients has increased to players including Li Na, Azarenka, Wawrinka, etc.

I know I'm not on tour, but are the prices for the "bronze" and "silver" services near hundreds to thousands of dollars? This seems to target consumers who have a huge wallet. There's people on here that can string their own racquets for free... :confused: Also, there isn't any priority one shops anywhere here.. I guess you have to ship them or something.. :-|

One can assume that P1 customers either: don't have a stringing machine, too busy to string their own racquets, too lazy to string their racquets, or have money to spend.

bosssauce
01-27-2013, 07:44 AM
For those that you don't know what Priority One is, it is a company that strings racquets for players ranging from recreational players to professionals in WTA/ATP.

This is a quote from a link on one their website: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702304520804576343300235154610.html
It stated that:
"Priority One has 14 "gold service" clients, including Mr. Djokovic, Roger Federer, Andy Murray and Robin Soderling. For $40,000 a year, the company cares for its clients' rackets at the four Grand Slam and eight other mandatory tournaments. (Additional tournaments cost extra.)" This article is from 2011 so the number of clients has increased to players including Li Na, Azarenka, Wawrinka, etc.

I know I'm not on tour, but are the prices for the "bronze" and "silver" services near hundreds to thousands of dollars? This seems to target consumers who have a huge wallet. There's people on here that can string their own racquets for free... :confused: Also, there isn't any priority one shops anywhere here.. I guess you have to ship them or something.. :-|

One can assume that P1 customers either: don't have a stringing machine, too busy to string their own racquets, too lazy to string their racquets, or have money to spend.

It is for customizing rackets and they travel with the pros regular people dont just send in rackets

THESEXPISTOL
01-27-2013, 07:59 AM
If you are pro yes, is necessary. 40.000$ is not enough money to pay someone their salary and cover travel expenses. Plus you need to pay a sh*tload of money on airports extra baggage for the stringing machine.
And there's few pros that can afford 40.000$ year to someone to take care of their racquets, and P1 are best, so thinking wisely P1 has a great performance/cost relation.

Overdrive
01-27-2013, 11:31 AM
If you are pro yes, is necessary. 40.000$ is not enough money to pay someone their salary and cover travel expenses. Plus you need to pay a sh*tload of money on airports extra baggage for the stringing machine.
And there's few pros that can afford 40.000$ year to someone to take care of their racquets, and P1 are best, so thinking wisely P1 has a great performance/cost relation.

You say that $40,000 is not even enough to cover salary and travel expenses? Wow.
I know that P1 is the best out there for exclusive stringing, but I won't get any racquets strung from them anytime soon... :-|

novak.20v
01-27-2013, 11:42 AM
For those that you don't know what Priority One is, it is a company that strings racquets for players ranging from recreational players to professionals in WTA/ATP.

This is a quote from a link on one their website: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702304520804576343300235154610.html
It stated that:
"Priority One has 14 "gold service" clients, including Mr. Djokovic, Roger Federer, Andy Murray and Robin Soderling. For $40,000 a year, the company cares for its clients' rackets at the four Grand Slam and eight other mandatory tournaments. (Additional tournaments cost extra.)" This article is from 2011 so the number of clients has increased to players including Li Na, Azarenka, Wawrinka, etc.

I know I'm not on tour, but are the prices for the "bronze" and "silver" services near hundreds to thousands of dollars? This seems to target consumers who have a huge wallet. There's people on here that can string their own racquets for free... :confused: Also, there isn't any priority one shops anywhere here.. I guess you have to ship them or something.. :-|

One can assume that P1 customers either: don't have a stringing machine, too busy to string their own racquets, too lazy to string their racquets, or have money to spend.

They don't just string racquets.

Devilito
01-27-2013, 11:48 AM
You say that $40,000 is not even enough to cover salary and travel expenses? Wow.
I know that P1 is the best out there for exclusive stringing, but I won't get any racquets strung from them anytime soon... :-|

you're comparing yourself to Fed or Djokovic? wow

i agree that $40k is actually quite low compared to the amount of stringing and racquet customization that happens on a daily basis when taking into account salary and expenses. Seems like a bargain

slowfox
01-27-2013, 12:08 PM
I suppose it's all relative. If you earn millions per year, what's 40K to ya? Heard Fed spent 800 bucks for a haircut in New York...

THESEXPISTOL
01-27-2013, 01:58 PM
I suppose it's all relative. If you earn millions per year, what's 40K to ya? Heard Fed spent 800 bucks for a haircut in New York...

USOpen 2008 if i remember correctly...

40.000/12=3333$

Overdrive, forgetting about the travel expenses you'd have, would you travel the world and stay in a hotel room stringing racquets almost everyday, away from your family and friends, away from your home, for only 3333$? I don't know where are you from, but i know for instance in europe that's not a lot of money. I know guys that earn that with a racquet/stringing shop at their city, and it's not a big city...

Relinquis
01-27-2013, 03:55 PM
I wonder if the players who are sponsored by racquet companies get this service covered. I mean, they're getting paid to use those sticks anyway.

SteveI
01-27-2013, 04:11 PM
Some... regular folks here... like Jackb1 and TripleB spend $40,000 a year on frames and stringing... :-)

pvaudio
01-27-2013, 05:23 PM
40k/year is nothing. The only way you would even make a living wage off that amount doing what they do is if you have numerous clients. As said, imagine how far 40k goes for the average person. Then imagine your entire life is spent flying and shipping equipment around the world and being holed up in hotel rooms from Monte Carlo to Miami to Shanghai to London.

Overdrive
01-27-2013, 05:32 PM
you're comparing yourself to Fed or Djokovic? wow

i agree that $40k is actually quite low compared to the amount of stringing and racquet customization that happens on a daily basis when taking into account salary and expenses. Seems like a bargain

What? I never compared myself to those guys....
I don't know, but I would find no need to get the "Gold service" or even the "silver service" unless I'm a professional or something.

Overdrive
01-27-2013, 05:34 PM
I suppose it's all relative. If you earn millions per year, what's 40K to ya? Heard Fed spent 800 bucks for a haircut in New York...

He could have got a haircut that's exactly the same for around $30-$40 (which is still expensive for a haircut). I only pay $10 for mine or just let the lady cut it for me. :cool:

Overdrive
01-27-2013, 05:43 PM
USOpen 2008 if i remember correctly...

40.000/12=3333$

Overdrive, forgetting about the travel expenses you'd have, would you travel the world and stay in a hotel room stringing racquets almost everyday, away from your family and friends, away from your home, for only 3333$? I don't know where are you from, but i know for instance in europe that's not a lot of money. I know guys that earn that with a racquet/stringing shop at their city, and it's not a big city...

I'm not surprised that's not alot of money according to you as the Euro (EU) is imploding at the moment.


Well my city has been picked as #10 least expensive city in the USA.
Here's a link for proof: http://www.cnbc.com/id/45989628/page/2

My area is #50 on Forbes as well: http://www.forbes.com/2009/07/13/cheap-cities-property-lifestyle-real-estate-cheap-places-chart.html

So how much does the average guy earn from a racquet/stringing store?

Overdrive
01-27-2013, 05:46 PM
Some... regular folks here... like Jackb1 and TripleB spend $40,000 a year on frames and stringing... :-)

I love tennis and racquets and all of that jazz, but I because there's only 8 Boris Becker racquets that I would purchase, I don't have to spend that much on frames and stringing unless if I string them all with natural gut and/or adding weight (or if I purchase multiple frames). But they probably spend that much because they are involved in the business or something like that. :P

Overdrive
01-27-2013, 05:48 PM
40k/year is nothing. The only way you would even make a living wage off that amount doing what they do is if you have numerous clients. As said, imagine how far 40k goes for the average person. Then imagine your entire life is spent flying and shipping equipment around the world and being holed up in hotel rooms from Monte Carlo to Miami to Shanghai to London.

Yes, If I had a family, it would be really hard on them to miss me all different times of the year.

If I was single then I wouldn't mind actually... :cool:

JDMasFCK
01-27-2013, 05:48 PM
They custom the racquets, string, and travel with the pros and the level of consistency and professionalism that they do it justifies the price.

Overdrive
01-27-2013, 05:59 PM
They custom the racquets, string, and travel with the pros and the level of consistency and professionalism that they do it justifies the price.

What do you think the average pro goes through a racquet in a year? The guys at P1 said that some of the pros go through 60 racquets a year..

:shock:

Chotobaka
01-27-2013, 06:06 PM
14 clients at $40,000.00 = $560,000.00. I think they manage to budget expenses and still turn a profit for their services. Plus the PR and media exposure has added value.

Larrysümmers
01-27-2013, 06:14 PM
this isnt for the average rec player. its like needing a pit crew for your town car.

gmatheis
01-27-2013, 06:15 PM
If P1 service wasn't worth it to the people that use it they would be out of business.

If having your equipment professionally taken care of, modified, matched for tension/swing weight/weight etc helps you to win a match here and there it has already paid for itself.

Consider this .... at the Aussie open you get $27600 just for being in the first round. If you win and get to round 2 you get another 17900.

SO just by winning 1 match you gain almost half of P1's gold service cost.

And it goes up from there quickly. Win round 2 and you get another $25100. Win round 3 and get another $54000.

For the recreational player (and lets face it we are almost all recreational players ... I dont care if you're a 5.5) P1 is not for you. For a top pro ... it's a no brainer.

Overdrive
01-27-2013, 07:15 PM
If P1 service wasn't worth it to the people that use it they would be out of business.

If having your equipment professionally taken care of, modified, matched for tension/swing weight/weight etc helps you to win a match here and there it has already paid for itself.

Consider this .... at the Aussie open you get $27600 just for being in the first round. If you win and get to round 2 you get another 17900.

SO just by winning 1 match you gain almost half of P1's gold service cost.

And it goes up from there quickly. Win round 2 and you get another $25100. Win round 3 and get another $54000.

For the recreational player (and lets face it we are almost all recreational players ... I dont care if you're a 5.5) P1 is not for you. For a top pro ... it's a no brainer.

That's true about how P1 does it. So, it's basically a custom stringing service exclusively for pros? I just want to know how much is the "Bronze service"? I've seen a guy have his Pure Storm Tours strung from priority one. I think it was three of them.

You get $27,000 just for being in the first round? Hm, travel expenses and food would only cover that for around half a year if best. :|

vandre
01-27-2013, 07:20 PM
this isnt for the average rec player. its like needing a pit crew for your town car.

this. i'll just speak for myself here but i don't notice any different between any of my same (but not matched) frames and the way i rotate racquets, i restring about once a year so this would be like sending your 12 year old to eddie van halen for their first guitar lesson! :twisted:

Overdrive
01-27-2013, 07:30 PM
this. i'll just speak for myself here but i don't notice any different between any of my same (but not matched) frames and the way i rotate racquets, i restring about once a year so this would be like sending your 12 year old to eddie van halen for their first guitar lesson! :twisted:

Haha that's funny!

Would even a good D1/D2/D3 college player need P1? :confused:

nn
01-27-2013, 07:50 PM
hmm not all the pros are using P1 service but regular service provided at major or minor tournament.

I think P1 or any service figure out that clients are super rich and charge accordingly. I think either way they are expensive for sure.

Fuji
01-27-2013, 07:52 PM
Haha that's funny!

Would even a good D1/D2/D3 college player need P1? :confused:

Not when there are other services that provide similar skill sets for a lot less in price. (Let's face it, getting your sticks matched doesn't take a lot of effort if you have an RDC machine, or a bit of time on your hands! It probably won't be to the same level as P1, but I know that my mate that does all my matching for me does a bang up job and it's all I could ever really ask for.)

-Fuji

Overdrive
01-28-2013, 04:33 AM
Not when there are other services that provide similar skill sets for a lot less in price. (Let's face it, getting your sticks matched doesn't take a lot of effort if you have an RDC machine, or a bit of time on your hands! It probably won't be to the same level as P1, but I know that my mate that does all my matching for me does a bang up job and it's all I could ever really ask for.)

-Fuji

How much does a typical stringing machine and RDC machine cost? I know for sure that it's cheaper than P1. :|

mmk
01-28-2013, 04:44 AM
How much does a typical stringing machine and RDC machine cost? I know for sure that it's cheaper than P1. :|

A Gamma 3 in 1 Racquet Test Center lists for $1800 (but available for $1600), the most expensive Gamma stringer is $3400. Throw in a few other tools, and you are still well under $6K for top notch equipment. Using them as well as the guys at P1 is another matter. But, you can spend quite a bit less than $6K and still do a really good job.

Fuji
01-28-2013, 06:45 AM
A Gamma 3 in 1 Racquet Test Center lists for $1800 (but available for $1600), the most expensive Gamma stringer is $3400. Throw in a few other tools, and you are still well under $6K for top notch equipment. Using them as well as the guys at P1 is another matter. But, you can spend quite a bit less than $6K and still do a really good job.

I'll one up you here...

Alpha balance board, a kitchen scale, And a reel of quarter inch lead tape. Under 100$ and you can do fairly good matching right at home. If you have a smartphone with the SW app, you're going to have a simplified RDC right from home. :)

-Fuji

mmk
01-28-2013, 09:17 AM
I'll one up you here...

Alpha balance board, a kitchen scale, And a reel of quarter inch lead tape. Under 100$ and you can do fairly good matching right at home. If you have a smartphone with the SW app, you're going to have a simplified RDC right from home. :)

-Fuji

Plus you can get consistent stringing results with a Klippermate or Gamma X-2/Prog 200 for under $200. It's easy to understand why top pros use P1 or some other service, but doing it yourself isn't quantum chromodynamics.

sureshs
01-28-2013, 09:21 AM
It is not just stringing, it is customization, shipping, standing by ready for anything, etc.

dman72
01-28-2013, 09:28 AM
People who can afford it, pay for it. It's pretty simple.

Fuji
01-28-2013, 09:55 AM
Plus you can get consistent stringing results with a Klippermate or Gamma X-2/Prog 200 for under $200. It's easy to understand why top pros use P1 or some other service, but doing it yourself isn't quantum chromodynamics.

Oh for sure. I don't argue the fact that it is extremely useful for pro players, but for rec players I don't see why they wouldn't at least attempt to do it themselves. I love customising frames, but I don't do it nearly as well as the guy who does mine so I just leave it to him haha!

-Fuji

slowfox
01-28-2013, 10:03 AM
People who can afford it, pay for it. It's pretty simple.

Yup, like custom suits.

Marshredder
01-28-2013, 10:29 AM
Put it this way.

$12,803,737 was Djokovic's prize money in 2012. Thats just prize money, not including any additional income from endorsements and deals etc.

$40,000 is approximately 0.3% of his yearly prize earnings.

Now put in in comparison. Lets assume the average person here earns around $40,000.

The equivalent impact to that persons earnings each year is $120.

Don't know about you guys, but I would pay $120 ANYDAY to have someone string and customise all my racquets.

slowfox
01-28-2013, 11:19 AM
And how many in the 40K income range spent more than $120 in tennis equipment last year...?

Al Czervik
01-28-2013, 11:25 AM
To be honest, I think I might rather have a local guru at an event with a super high end electronic machine than that bucket of bolts Nate rolls out of the suitcase. That said, you know you're getting the same tension measurement from the same machine every time, so you have a consistent frame of reference on tension whereas you don't if you're always using the local stringers. The customization of everything else is where it's probably worth it.

THESEXPISTOL
01-28-2013, 12:24 PM
Put it this way.

$12,803,737 was Djokovic's prize money in 2012. Thats just prize money, not including any additional income from endorsements and deals etc.

$40,000 is approximately 0.3% of his yearly prize earnings.

Now put in in comparison. Lets assume the average person here earns around $40,000.

The equivalent impact to that persons earnings each year is $120.

Don't know about you guys, but I would pay $120 ANYDAY to have someone string and customise all my racquets.

Nice ideia, but you finished with a "wrong" conclusion. Pro's aren't wasting money, we are, because i bet most of the tennistalk members, who don't own a stringing machine, spend more than 120$ a year with stringjobs fees and racquet services (not including the string here).

lidoazndiabloboi
01-28-2013, 12:26 PM
They do more than just string and matching rackets. They also mold the handles for the players to their exact liking. Just look at Soderling's handle. It's a custom mold (foam?) handle with a lead pipe inserted inside it. There's a reason many of the top pros use their service. To be able to pick up their racket and not have to think about the differences between each one, I definitely think its a good investment for them.

Sure, there are other places that customize and match rackets. RPNY does customization for cheaper. Quality could be similar, i cant say. I also customize rackets for my friends (stringing, lead taping, silicone, extending rackets) but custom molding is something I cant do. So P1 has a certain expertise in this area.

Fearsome Forehand
01-28-2013, 12:28 PM
If you are an elite touring pro making a lot of money, you want consistent, matched rackets customized to your liking. In that case, P1 is well worth the cost. For a club player, it would be silly to spend that much.

I do all my own customization. Aside from molding my own grip pallets, I can do pretty much the same things the pro customizers do and I work a lot cheaper. :)

SteveI
01-28-2013, 02:42 PM
If you are an elite touring pro making a lot of money, you want consistent, matched rackets customized to your liking. In that case, P1 is well worth the cost. For a club player, it would be silly to spend that much.

I do all my own customization. Aside from molding my own grip pallets, I can do pretty much the same things the pro customizers do and I work a lot cheaper. :)

Well said.. along with what Fuji said. Most folks can do 99% of the custom work in thier family room. Take some time..be careful and be willing to make a few mistakes. TW has a wonderful area to address doing custom work.

http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/LC/customize.html

Overdrive
01-29-2013, 05:16 AM
Racquet customizing and stringing sounds very tedious to me (coming from someone who doesn't own a machine) .
What's the average time to string a racquet?

Fuji
01-29-2013, 07:54 AM
Racquet customizing and stringing sounds very tedious to me (coming from someone who doesn't own a machine) .
What's the average time to string a racquet?

The Guys that do my sticks, if they are doing it under time constraints, usually do them in around 15 minutes. :)

-Fuji

heninfan99
01-29-2013, 08:22 AM
Probably a waste for your average Joe or Jane but wouldn't it be cool to write on an included Post-It:
"String it like Roger's. Thanks"

Povl Carstensen
01-29-2013, 08:58 AM
I have not regretted using P1's Gold service. I have not used it, but I have not regretted it.

rqtguy
01-29-2013, 09:06 AM
I'll one up you here...

Alpha balance board, a kitchen scale, And a reel of quarter inch lead tape. Under 100$ and you can do fairly good matching right at home. If you have a smartphone with the SW app, you're going to have a simplified RDC right from home. :)

-Fuji

Fuji could you please identify which sofware app you are using / referring to?

Thanks.

Fuji
01-29-2013, 09:11 AM
Fuji could you please identify which sofware app you are using / referring to?

Thanks.

I just use Racquettune for the iPhone! :)

-Fuji

sureshs
01-29-2013, 09:31 AM
Do they have a Platinum service? I usually do not settle for Gold level service in any walk of life.

TennezSport
01-29-2013, 09:39 AM
As many have stated here in this thread, P1 is a lot more than just stringing. As they completely customize racquets to the personal specs of each player, they also maintain performance stats, create custom molds for individual players handles and match 60+ racquets a year for each player. Plus pros string every day and change racquets frequently (due to racquet fatigue[getting soft]) to maintain consistency.

Racquets for pro players are tool of the profession; their job. Just like tools a carpenter uses, race car or airline mechanic would use. I dont know of many home car or plane enthusiasts that have a 100k sun analyzer in their garage. Add in the travel and expertise and you see why the charges start at Gold, Silver, and Bronze levels for pro players. If the racquets are taken care of, pros can concentrate on court work outs, physical training, agility/reflex training, gym workouts and dietary measurements aerobic conditioning.

P1 also has services and prices for rec players also that are much more reasonable. So, as a rec you dont need anything like the services the pros require, especially if you are a 3.5 player or lower. However, you would learn and improve faster, if you did have a consistent performance from your tools.

Cheers, TennezSport :cool:

Overdrive
01-29-2013, 03:30 PM
As many have stated here in this thread, P1 is a lot more than just stringing. As they completely customize racquets to the personal specs of each player, they also maintain performance stats, create custom molds for individual players handles and match 60+ racquets a year for each player. Plus pros string every day and change racquets frequently (due to racquet fatigue[getting soft]) to maintain consistency.

Racquets for pro players are tool of the profession; their job. Just like tools a carpenter uses, race car or airline mechanic would use. I dont know of many home car or plane enthusiasts that have a 100k sun analyzer in their garage. Add in the travel and expertise and you see why the charges start at Gold, Silver, and Bronze levels for pro players. If the racquets are taken care of, pros can concentrate on court work outs, physical training, agility/reflex training, gym workouts and dietary measurements aerobic conditioning.

P1 also has services and prices for rec players also that are much more reasonable. So, as a rec you dont need anything like the services the pros require, especially if you are a 3.5 player or lower. However, you would learn and improve faster, if you did have a consistent performance from your tools.

Cheers, TennezSport :cool:

Basically, a racquet butler! :)

Bobby Jr
01-29-2013, 04:21 PM
i agree that $40k is actually quite low compared to the amount of stringing and racquet customization that happens on a daily basis when taking into account salary and expenses. Seems like a bargain
I agree. I actually can't see how Federer would get the service he does for $40k a year - the number seems too low in my opinion.

Let's say it's 13 tournaments (4 majors, 8 masters) only... a couple of grant per tournament would make up $40k right there... and there's no way the guys at P1 do this on the cheap - they have flights, excess baggage, hotels, transport, renting a room at tournament venues etc to pay for at every event - plus all the business running costs (rent, insurance etc) which add up quickly.

Even splitting their time amongst 10 high level (of service) players who all pay that amount it would be hard to make a good business out of it for $40k per top client - stringing is very labour intensive and there's only so many restrings you can do. Servicing Federer's frames alone would take up 4+ hours every day he plays during a tournament... Multiply that by only 8 or 9 top male players and you suddenly need 4-5 people to do the work/admin and also cater to lower demand clients. That's more flights, more hotels, more transport, more meals etc.

drakulie
01-29-2013, 04:44 PM
Interesting topic and discussion. Being that I have worked first hand with P1, I thought I'd share my thoughts.

Priority One, Stringing & Customizing, and The Hall Of Fame
http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=438964


40K a year is actually very little when one actually sees what is provided for players at tournaments. Take for example, Federer. He may give P1 5 or 6 frames to string for practice, then another 5 or 6 for the match later that day. At $25 per re-string, that's about $250 a day. Multiply that times 10 (if he makes the final), and that's over $2,500 for a tournament. If Fed plays all 4 majors, and then 8 masters, that's over $30,000 alone just for re-stringing his frames.

Now, there is the customizing of each and every one of his frames to exact specifications, which could be well over 40 frames a year. Additionally, over 40 frames a year which have custom molded handles.

Additionally, Federer doesn't have to worry about his equipment. P1 carries a lot of his equipment for him (racquets, strings, grips, overgrips, etc).

Add to that the fact that all his frames are being strung by the same guy, with the same machine, and he has a personal racquet technician traveling with him throughout the year.

In my opinion, it's peanuts, and I just barely gave you guys a glimpse of what is done for their Gold clients. Some of these players give them up to 20 frames a day to string.

Just food for thought.

Overdrive
01-29-2013, 04:51 PM
I agree. I actually can't see how Federer would get the service he does for $40k a year - the number seems too low in my opinion.

Let's say it's 13 tournaments (4 majors, 8 masters) only... a couple of grant per tournament would make up $40k right there... and there's no way the guys at P1 do this on the cheap - they have flights, excess baggage, hotels, transport, renting a room at tournament venues etc to pay for at every event - plus all the business running costs (rent, insurance etc) which add up quickly.

Even splitting their time amongst 10 high level (of service) players who all pay that amount it would be hard to make a good business out of it for $40k per top client - stringing is very labour intensive and there's only so many restrings you can do. Servicing Federer's frames alone would take up 4+ hours every day he plays during a tournament... Multiply that by only 8 or 9 top male players and you suddenly need 4-5 people to do the work/admin and also cater to lower demand clients. That's more flights, more hotels, more transport, more meals etc.

I think other people besides the professionals are getting the "gold service" for $40K a year.

Don't forget the wealthy people who play tennis. Those people go to tennis clubs that you can't even get a membership for. That business can just pay the "gold service" so everyone can get their racquets customized on just 1 account.
But there are people who pay for silver and bronze though. I think the company makes around $1-3 million a year (rough estimate). "/

aimr75
01-29-2013, 05:17 PM
Interesting topic and discussion. Being that I have worked first hand with P1, I thought I'd share my thoughts.

Priority One, Stringing & Customizing, and The Hall Of Fame
http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=438964


40K a year is actually very little when one actually sees what is provided for players at tournaments. Take for example, Federer. He may give P1 5 or 6 frames to string for practice, then another 5 or 6 for the match later that day. At $25 per re-string, that's about $250 a day. Multiply that times 10 (if he makes the final), and that's over $2,500 for a tournament. If Fed plays all 4 majors, and then 8 masters, that's over $30,000 alone just for re-stringing his frames.

Now, there is the customizing of each and every one of his frames to exact specifications, which could be well over 40 frames a year. Additionally, over 40 frames a year which have custom molded handles.

Additionally, Federer doesn't have to worry about his equipment. P1 carries a lot of his equipment for him (racquets, strings, grips, overgrips, etc).

Add to that the fact that all his frames are being strung by the same guy, with the same machine, and he has a personal racquet technician traveling with him throughout the year.

In my opinion, it's peanuts, and I just barely gave you guys a glimpse of what is done for their Gold clients. Some of these players give them up to 20 frames a day to string.

Just food for thought.

It is very little given the amount of work they do, the hours, the travel.. its a hard slog from what youve described here and in past threads. Its great to have someone on this board (aside from Ron himself) who can give such insight to stringing/customisation at the top level

Curious, with the amount of turnover in frames each year for their clients, what do the players or P1 do with the superseded frames? Seems like given their service, P1 should keep the unused frames. Great way to fund their retirement after all the hard work ;)

Overdrive
01-29-2013, 05:22 PM
So you think their "gold service" should be MORE?

$60,000? $75,000?

MAX PLY
01-29-2013, 06:20 PM
Thanks for the good additional information, Drakulie. I must confess when I saw the $40k number, I thought it was too low. If Roger Federer is paying only $40k I would be shocked. I suspect it is significantly higher ( i.e., Roger is not a "mere Gold" customer).

Overdrive
01-29-2013, 06:35 PM
It is very little given the amount of work they do, the hours, the travel.. its a hard slog from what youve described here and in past threads. Its great to have someone on this board (aside from Ron himself) who can give such insight to stringing/customisation at the top level

Curious, with the amount of turnover in frames each year for their clients, what do the players or P1 do with the superseded frames? Seems like given their service, P1 should keep the unused frames. Great way to fund their retirement after all the hard work ;)

So, the guys at P1 enjoy their job but are constrained because of the traveling and hotels stays. Understandable.

Woah, the warehouse (or job atmosphere) is very lacking. But I do also understand that they have to focus and be professional in their stringing because watching TV while stringing can be a no-no. :)

Bartelby
01-29-2013, 06:40 PM
Do the pros get free restrings at tournaments? Or what does it cost?

Overdrive
01-29-2013, 06:45 PM
Do they have a Platinum service? I usually do not settle for Gold level service in any walk of life.

I wouldn't see a major difference between a Platinum service and a Gold service. Maybe just being able to string up to 100 frames at any time instead of the maximum of 60.

Overdrive
01-29-2013, 06:47 PM
Do the pros get free restrings at tournaments? Or what does it cost?

Yes because they are already under the "contract" from the beginning of the service to the expiration date.
If not, the racquet companies should actually pay for the players to use P1 because they are the ones that are sponsoring the players to use the racquets... But I guess it wouldn't make sense because they are already paying to use the racquets and paying the players for P1 is something that is miscellaneous or something.

Bobby Jr
01-29-2013, 07:56 PM
Thanks for the good additional information, Drakulie. I must confess when I saw the $40k number, I thought it was too low. If Roger Federer is paying only $40k I would be shocked. I suspect it is significantly higher ( i.e., Roger is not a "mere Gold" customer).
This... ^

They customise 12 frames for him 4 times a year - so that's 48 frames right there. Plus he'd likely also have any others supplied if/when any are damaged - even cosmetically... Let's just call is 50 frame total... For each one P1 would have to spend a couple of hours on average weighing, weighting/balancing, custom-gripping, overwrapping, checking frames for damage etc - that alone would be 100 hours minimum a year. At a nominal consultancy rate of $100/hr that's $10k gone and he hasn't even had a single restring yet.

$40k is way too low imo if the P1 guys care to make any profit at all. For what it's worth even $100k would be a great deal for someone like Federer to permanently have someone else make sure he always has the frame he wants without even thinking about it and to never have to bother ordering strings/grommets/grips or other parts.

Overdrive
01-29-2013, 08:36 PM
This... ^

They customise 12 frames for him 4 times a year - so that's 48 frames right there. Plus he'd likely also have any others supplied if/when any are damaged - even cosmetically... Let's just call is 50 frame total... For each one P1 would have to spend a couple of hours on average weighing, weighting/balancing, custom-gripping, overwrapping, checking frames for damage etc - that alone would be 100 hours minimum a year. At a nominal consultancy rate of $100/hr that's $10k gone and he hasn't even had a single restring yet.

$40k is way too low imo if the P1 guys care to make any profit at all. For what it's worth even $100k would be a great deal for someone like Federer to permanently have someone else make sure he always has the frame he wants without even thinking about it and to never have to bother ordering strings/grommets/grips or other parts.

You think a P1 gold service is $100,000? I don't know about that...
The more you increase the price in a product, the more restrictions the consumer partakes. Besides pro players, I think tennis clubs who make alot of money and have alot of players, tournaments, coaches, staff, etc. could just chip in for a P1 gold service so everyone can get their racquets strung and customized.

Drakulie should've addressed the P1 guys about pricing information and how did they agree to the number 40,000.

NLBwell
01-29-2013, 09:43 PM
I put lead, leather grip, overgrip, etc. on my 4 MG Prestige Pros. I matched them just by feeling the apparent weight and swinging it around. A couple months later I was able to check them out. I was within 1g on weight and 5 points on swingweight. So I can tell the difference between slight differences in weight.
However, I play with these rackets, my old Black Aces, a POG, an RDti70-88, and my Dad's oversize racket, and I don't play significantly better with the MGPPs than with all the totally different rackets. I generally play at least one set with one of the other rackets each time I play and there isn't a difference in results. (A string job will make a noticeable difference if it is strung too lose or if the poly is dead)
Mentally, it probably makes a difference to the pros to have each racket feel the same. It would bother them and hurt their confidence if a racket was different. I'm not sure that physically it would make a bit of difference if their rackets were identically matched or not.
For $40,000, which is pocket change to them, it is worth it to pay the $.

rqtguy
01-29-2013, 10:54 PM
I find it interesting how much debate overdrive has stirred up over this issue.
Keep swinging away DW!

Relinquis
01-30-2013, 12:22 AM
Some... regular folks here... like Jackb1 and TripleB spend $40,000 a year on frames and stringing... :-)

haha... imagine if they spent that much money on coaching and practice. they'd probably be awesome tennis players...

kkm
01-30-2013, 12:24 AM
This... ^

They customise 12 frames for him 4 times a year - so that's 48 frames right there. Plus he'd likely also have any others supplied if/when any are damaged - even cosmetically... Let's just call is 50 frame total...

Federer's total is at least 60 a year, 5 sets of 12.

Don't forger that 40K covers only majors and masters 1000 tournaments and that players pay extra for P1 to string for them at other tournaments. For example, the Basel tournament, which a number P1 clients play, is a 500-level tournament. They would also pay extra for Dubai.

Povl Carstensen
01-30-2013, 12:38 AM
I wouldn't see a major difference between a Platinum service and a Gold service. Maybe just being able to string up to 100 frames at any time instead of the maximum of 60.Platinum service includes not only making your own racket optimal, but also making the opponents less so.

star 5 15
01-30-2013, 08:49 AM
I'm about 99% sure the Gold service is ONLY for touring pros. Take it from someone who is a Bronze Client. This thread is actually pretty comical really. P1 is the best in the business, and if they had more hours in the day, they would utilize them. Time is money and their time is extremely valuable. And whether or not someone needs the service is subjective. That is a personal choice.

TennezSport
01-30-2013, 09:00 AM
Yes because they are already under the "contract" from the beginning of the service to the expiration date.
If not, the racquet companies should actually pay for the players to use P1 because they are the ones that are sponsoring the players to use the racquets... But I guess it wouldn't make sense because they are already paying to use the racquets and paying the players for P1 is something that is miscellaneous or something.

Remember that most pros use the in house string services that the event provides. Only the players that can afford it are signed to a company like P1 or RPNY. I believe that string may be provided by the contracted company if the player has a contact but stringing is done for approx $25 per racquet. If a player has to provide their own string it has to be dropped off with the stringers along with instructions.

Basically, a racquet butler! :)

Also I would not call it a butler service as they is a lot more engineering and expertise that goes into it, that rec players will never know.

Cheers, TennezSport :cool:

Overdrive
01-30-2013, 06:59 PM
Federer's total is at least 60 a year, 5 sets of 12.

Don't forger that 40K covers only majors and masters 1000 tournaments and that players pay extra for P1 to string for them at other tournaments. For example, the Basel tournament, which a number P1 clients play, is a 500-level tournament. They would also pay extra for Dubai.

Don't forget Grand Slams. I saw the P1 guys string Li's and Azarenka's racquets pre-match. :)

I don't understand paying extra for minors. They could just get more guys. :S

Overdrive
01-30-2013, 07:10 PM
I'm about 99% sure the Gold service is ONLY for touring pros. Take it from someone who is a Bronze Client. This thread is actually pretty comical really. P1 is the best in the business, and if they had more hours in the day, they would utilize them. Time is money and their time is extremely valuable. And whether or not someone needs the service is subjective. That is a personal choice.

But I don't believe that everyone on the ATP rankings can afford P1 Gold Service.

I'm not sure Male #578 can afford P1 Gold. :-|

A P1 guy can fully customize a Gold client's maximum amount of racquets (50) for less than $40,000.

For example:

Let's say Federer uses a 10 Wilson racquet bag and uses it only for his racquets (I don't know if he does or not).

Let's say on average, a P1 guy can customize a Federer racquet in around 25 minutes.

So, 50 x 25= 1250 minutes or 20 hours roughly 8-9 minutes. They could easily just have more than one guy string his racquets.

Federer's "people" can just place the rest of the racquets in 4 other 10-pack racquet bags and transfer it from place to place. Shipping and handling fees from traveling may stack up in price, but no where near $40,000.

I know for sure that this would not equal $40,000.

Chemist
01-30-2013, 07:11 PM
Don't forget Grand Slams. I saw the P1 guys string Li's and Azarenka's racquets pre-match. :)

I don't understand paying extra for minors. They could just get more guys. :S

In one of the post match interviews at AO, Li Na was asked what her husband's new role was. Li said that he prepared her drinks and strung her rackets.

Overdrive
01-30-2013, 07:12 PM
Remember that most pros use the in house string services that the event provides. Only the players that can afford it are signed to a company like P1 or RPNY. I believe that string may be provided by the contracted company if the player has a contact but stringing is done for approx $25 per racquet. If a player has to provide their own string it has to be dropped off with the stringers along with instructions.



Also I would not call it a butler service as they is a lot more engineering and expertise that goes into it, that rec players will never know.

Cheers, TennezSport :cool:

Really? I didn't know that. So #578 uses the in-house stringing?

I don't know, they seem to be experienced racquet butlers to me... :/

Overdrive
01-30-2013, 07:40 PM
In one of the post match interviews at AO, Li Na was asked what her husband's new role was. Li said that he prepared her drinks and strung her rackets.

Ha, that's funny :)

Well, it's cheaper than using P1!

kkm
01-31-2013, 01:34 AM
Don't forget Grand Slams. I saw the P1 guys string Li's and Azarenka's racquets pre-match. :)

I don't understand paying extra for minors. They could just get more guys. :S


majors = the Australian Open, French Open, Wimbledon, US Open

grand slam = winning all four majors in a year

You would have seen Wilson/RPNY stringing the WTA finalists' racquets before the Australian Open final.

The $40000 gold service fee is for customizing a player's racquets and stringing his racquets at the majors and masters 1000 tournaments, not just for customizing. The silver and bronze services are for clients who need customizing only, and probably cost quite a bit less.

Why would the P1 guys charge what it costs them in travel expenses and supply costs? Breaking even is the same as having a job that pays nothing. I'm guessing that they actually want to make a living. Being away from home much of the year, staying in hotels, getting up at odd hours to string while already jetlagged, not having home-cooked meals, finding time to sleep and eat, and otherwise passing time while their players are practicing and playing matches are no fun. Don't forget that racquet techs who do work for touring pros, including P1 and a few others, have specialized knowledge and capabilities, and that's part of what touring pros are paying for. $40000 is not so much for a successful singles player. Pros who sign up with traveling private stringers are also paying for the peace of mind that all they have to do is show of at the tournament and that there will be the same person to take care of their equipment needs. And the pros who have P1 just customize their racquets but not string for them probably believe it to be a decent value, otherwise would they sign with P1?

kkm
01-31-2013, 01:42 AM
And don't forget that flying to and staying in Melbourne, Indian Wells, Miami, Monte-Carlo, Madrid, Rome, Paris, Wimbledon, Montreal/Toronto, Cincinnati, New York, Shanghai, Paris again, and London (the WTF), when these tournaments are held, because so many want to go there, would probably mean that already pretty high airfare and accommodation could easily be even more expensive at tournament time. They do a few non-major non-masters 1000 tournaments and an occasional Davis Cup series, it adds up.

drakulie
01-31-2013, 05:00 AM
Don't forget Grand Slams. I saw the P1 guys string Li's and Azarenka's racquets pre-match. :)


That wasn't P1. That was the stringers for the wilson string team.

In one of the post match interviews at AO, Li Na was asked what her husband's new role was. Li said that he prepared her drinks and strung her rackets.

He doesn't string her frames. I believe what she meant, is that he takes the racquets to the stringers and then picks them up.

Rogael Naderer
01-31-2013, 08:05 AM
That wasn't P1. That was the stringers for the wilson string team.



He doesn't string her frames. I believe what she meant, is that he takes the racquets to the stringers and then picks them up.


Indeed, he's certainly been demoted!

Rogael Naderer
01-31-2013, 08:07 AM
Funny actually that someone noticed that at one of the tournament's where P1 were not offering their services to RF, his overgrip was wrapped noticeably differently and unevenly!

They really have an eye for detail that even my anal self can admire!

Povl Carstensen
01-31-2013, 09:58 AM
Besides pro players, I think tennis clubs who make alot of money and have alot of players, tournaments, coaches, staff, etc. could just chip in for a P1 gold service so everyone can get their racquets strung and customized.What makes you think P1 would take on a whole club, on one gold service? Rather out of touch with reality I would say.

PeterFig
01-31-2013, 01:51 PM
But I don't believe that everyone on the ATP rankings can afford P1 Gold Service.

I'm not sure Male #578 can afford P1 Gold. :-|

A P1 guy can fully customize a Gold client's maximum amount of racquets (50) for less than $40,000.

For example:

Let's say Federer uses a 10 Wilson racquet bag and uses it only for his racquets (I don't know if he does or not).

Let's say on average, a P1 guy can customize a Federer racquet in around 25 minutes.

So, 50 x 25= 1250 minutes or 20 hours roughly 8-9 minutes. They could easily just have more than one guy string his racquets.

Federer's "people" can just place the rest of the racquets in 4 other 10-pack racquet bags and transfer it from place to place. Shipping and handling fees from traveling may stack up in price, but no where near $40,000.

I know for sure that this would not equal $40,000.

I was going to try and actually write up an answer to your pretty comical (unintentionally so) post and it's logic. But instead I think I'll just: :rolleyes:

;)

star 5 15
01-31-2013, 02:11 PM
But I don't believe that everyone on the ATP rankings can afford P1 Gold Service.

I'm not sure Male #578 can afford P1 Gold. :-|

A P1 guy can fully customize a Gold client's maximum amount of racquets (50) for less than $40,000.

For example:

Let's say Federer uses a 10 Wilson racquet bag and uses it only for his racquets (I don't know if he does or not).

Let's say on average, a P1 guy can customize a Federer racquet in around 25 minutes.

So, 50 x 25= 1250 minutes or 20 hours roughly 8-9 minutes. They could easily just have more than one guy string his racquets.

Federer's "people" can just place the rest of the racquets in 4 other 10-pack racquet bags and transfer it from place to place. Shipping and handling fees from traveling may stack up in price, but no where near $40,000.

I know for sure that this would not equal $40,000.

The Gold Service only includes stringing for the 4 slams, masters series, year end championship, and in some situations davis cup ties. Therefore it would not make sense for "#578" to sign up for this service. They would go for the next step down Silver or even Bronze if they do not want a dedicated handle mold. I don't understand why you guys are dogging on P1 so hard. If they were overcharging for their services they wouldn't be servicing so many of the top guys in the world. There is a demand for their service and they charge accordingly. I've had conversations with Nate about customizing for myself, I play D1, and trust me, they are having no problem whatsoever finding clients. If anything they are struggling to keep up with the demand for their service.

Edit: I have also used P1, RPNY, and some no name services for my customizing and for an entire package of customer service, attention to detail, and quality of work, P1 wins in a LAND SLIDE. They are the best in the business plain and simple.

tennis_balla
02-01-2013, 02:46 AM
Oh My God.....

Overdrive
02-01-2013, 04:10 PM
The Gold Service only includes stringing for the 4 slams, masters series, year end championship, and in some situations davis cup ties. Therefore it would not make sense for "#578" to sign up for this service. They would go for the next step down Silver or even Bronze if they do not want a dedicated handle mold. I don't understand why you guys are dogging on P1 so hard. If they were overcharging for their services they wouldn't be servicing so many of the top guys in the world. There is a demand for their service and they charge accordingly. I've had conversations with Nate about customizing for myself, I play D1, and trust me, they are having no problem whatsoever finding clients. If anything they are struggling to keep up with the demand for their service.


Edit: I have also used P1, RPNY, and some no name services for my customizing and for an entire package of customer service, attention to detail, and quality of work, P1 wins in a LAND SLIDE. They are the best in the business plain and simple.

Okay, I didn't know that.
I have never said anything negative about P1's service and professionalism. It is just a conversation with other TT members on whether do they think it's worth the money or not.

Overdrive
02-01-2013, 04:11 PM
I was going to try and actually write up an answer to your pretty comical (unintentionally so) post and it's logic. But instead I think I'll just: :rolleyes:

;)

Well sorry, this sounds like something I would do (not being cheap, it just sounded like a good a idea to me).

To each his own.

Overdrive
02-01-2013, 04:16 PM
majors = the Australian Open, French Open, Wimbledon, US Open

grand slam = winning all four majors in a year

You would have seen Wilson/RPNY stringing the WTA finalists' racquets before the Australian Open final.

The $40000 gold service fee is for customizing a player's racquets and stringing his racquets at the majors and masters 1000 tournaments, not just for customizing. The silver and bronze services are for clients who need customizing only, and probably cost quite a bit less.

Why would the P1 guys charge what it costs them in travel expenses and supply costs? Breaking even is the same as having a job that pays nothing. I'm guessing that they actually want to make a living. Being away from home much of the year, staying in hotels, getting up at odd hours to string while already jetlagged, not having home-cooked meals, finding time to sleep and eat, and otherwise passing time while their players are practicing and playing matches are no fun. Don't forget that racquet techs who do work for touring pros, including P1 and a few others, have specialized knowledge and capabilities, and that's part of what touring pros are paying for. $40000 is not so much for a successful singles player. Pros who sign up with traveling private stringers are also paying for the peace of mind that all they have to do is show of at the tournament and that there will be the same person to take care of their equipment needs. And the pros who have P1 just customize their racquets but not string for them probably believe it to be a decent value, otherwise would they sign with P1?

Oh okay, the guys on ESPN were saying that P1 was stringing the players in the WTA final at the Autrailian Open.

I understand that P1 wants to make money. Isn't that the point of a business?

I don't know, I guess that stringing and customizing a number of racquets didn't sound expensive to me but traveling with them all year seems like they are having a second life. :(

Overdrive
02-01-2013, 04:17 PM
What makes you think P1 would take on a whole club, on one gold service? Rather out of touch with reality I would say.

Money talks. :cool:

Roger Wawrinka
03-03-2013, 09:29 PM
^ I do not think a company such as P1 would have enough hours in the day to do that. "money talks" maybe in some cases but I don't think P1 has to worry about Money either.

Rjtennis
03-03-2013, 10:05 PM
Money talks. :cool:

What the heck are you talking/posting about? Go look at their website again and see what they do and WHO they are marketing their services to. I know only a little about about P1, but I do have some common sense.

Overdrive
03-04-2013, 06:09 PM
What the heck are you talking/posting about? Go look at their website again and see what they do and WHO they are marketing their services to. I know only a little about about P1, but I do have some common sense.

I'm just wondering whether they actually make a substantial profit from this as the cost of travel, shipping expenses, miscellaneous, add up pretty quickly..

I wonder if the people that are around you think you have common sense as well...

Hao2Pro
03-04-2013, 06:36 PM
this isnt for the average rec player. its like needing a pit crew for your town car.

This response summed it all up.

Povl Carstensen
03-04-2013, 07:48 PM
I wonder if the people that are around you think you have common sense as well...More than you imho.

Overdrive
03-04-2013, 07:55 PM
More than you imho.

I believed that my thread was actually very interesting. Even drakulie even complented me on it. I'm not going to start disputes on here.

Overdrive
03-04-2013, 07:55 PM
This response summed it all up.

It did actually. I'm surprised this thread had revived, but only with a childish remark. Oh well.. :roll:

Povl Carstensen
03-04-2013, 08:06 PM
I believed that my thread was actually very interesting. Even drakulie even complented me on it. I'm not going to start disputes on here.I did not say that your thread was not interesting, just that to me Rjtennis seems to have more common sense than you.

Overdrive
03-04-2013, 08:12 PM
I did not say that your thread was not interesting, just that to me Rjtennis seems to have more common sense than you.

Yes, he does have more common sense than me.

Thud and blunder
03-05-2013, 05:35 AM
Why whould Fed et al pay anything? Do they pay Nike to wear their gear? Surely those monogrammed P1 bags are advertising gold dust, and the real money is made from hedge fund hackers?

kkm
03-05-2013, 08:32 AM
Why whould Fed et al pay anything? Do they pay Nike to wear their gear? Surely those monogrammed P1 bags are advertising gold dust, and the real money is made from hedge fund hackers?


P1 has a small number of gold clients. They have more silver and bronze clients, who pay for customization but not stringing. Of course there are non-pro clients for their bronze and silver services, but I don't think that P1 are looking for much retail/non-pro work. I can't and don't want to speak for them, but I don't think that hedge-fund hackers are their potentially largest, or target client base.

RPNY has fewer clients they travel to string for, but also quite a few customization-only pro clients. RPNY does look more for non-pro work since they have a retail location to maintain in midtown Manhattan.

3fees
03-05-2013, 08:54 AM
Humm , lots of things I could remark on, yet I won't.

Relinquis
03-05-2013, 08:57 AM
if you pay more for sticks then you to for training/coaching then you're doing it wrong.

sureshs
03-05-2013, 09:32 AM
Oh okay, the guys on ESPN were saying that P1 was stringing the players in the WTA final at the Autrailian Open.


So they are not exclusively for their clients? They do general tournament stringing too?

Overdrive
03-05-2013, 09:44 AM
So they are not exclusively for their clients? They do general tournament stringing too?

They can be, but I don't think they string racquets for players like Gulbis and Isner. They either get their racquets strung from somewhere else or something.

For the Average Joe? They really pay for the bronze or silver plan. I think lower-ranked players or players that play in the Futures do the silver plan.

gavna
03-05-2013, 10:01 AM
I would love to know exactly how many Gold clients they have today..........if they have 20 or more adding how many Silver ones I'm sure they make a nice solid living......also didn't the Gold service go up in price? I have heard it was closer to $50K now -

Bet they are not flying full fare Business or First Class (USA to Europe in First today will run you $10,000 or more RT).

kkm
03-05-2013, 10:13 AM
So they are not exclusively for their clients? They do general tournament stringing too?


P1 is the on-site official stringing service at Cincinnati. At the other tournies - the majors, masters 1000s, the WTF - they're off-site to string for their gold service clients only.

The Davis Cup teams (Swiss, Serbian) that have P1 string for them have them as their "official" stringer, working more or less on-site.

RPNY takes care of the US Davis Cup team.

TennezSport
03-05-2013, 12:45 PM
So they are not exclusively for their clients? They do general tournament stringing too?

Not at the Aust Open or US Open as the Wilson stringing team run by Ron Rocchi strings for those events. The French Open uses the Babolat stringing team and I believe Wimbledon uses Alpha or Babolat teams. Maybe UK Skippy can shed some light on Wimbly as he strings there yearly.

Cheers, TennezSport :cool:

Swan Song
03-05-2013, 04:49 PM
They can be, but I don't think they string racquets for players like Gulbis and Isner.
They do still string for Gulbis and Isner. Isner especially because he is high maintenance.

Overdrive
03-05-2013, 04:59 PM
They do still string for Gulbis and Isner. Isner especially because he is high maintenance.

Really? I didn't know they could even afford it to be honest... :|

Overdrive
03-05-2013, 05:01 PM
I would love to know exactly how many Gold clients they have today..........if they have 20 or more adding how many Silver ones I'm sure they make a nice solid living......also didn't the Gold service go up in price? I have heard it was closer to $50K now -

Bet they are not flying full fare Business or First Class (USA to Europe in First today will run you $10,000 or more RT).

Me too. But they wouldn't reveal that publicly.

Really? 50K? I bet people say that's still too low...

Wait, $10,000 to Europe Round Trip?

Hogwash...

kkm
03-05-2013, 05:25 PM
Apollo Leisure runs the Wimbledon stringing service.

axel89
03-05-2013, 05:29 PM
Really? I didn't know they could even afford it to be honest... :|

ernest gulbis's dad is one of the richest human in europe

Overdrive
03-05-2013, 05:56 PM
ernest gulbis's dad is one of the richest human in europe

Really?

You know, being wealthy gives a player an advantage to turn pro... to a degree.

gavna
03-05-2013, 09:01 PM
Wait, $10,000 to Europe Round Trip?

Hogwash...

You must not travel very much - as of today if you want to purchase one (1) FIRST Class seat from IAH or DFW to CDG (Paris) leaving mid May and returning mid June the fare is between $16,500 and $18,300. That's totally normal these days for First Class to Europe.

Flying from Tampa where many pros live and I believe P1 is based for the same dates to Paris is between $17,000 - $19,000 per ticket.

Business Class for the same flights is about $5200

I travel for a living and spend on avg $150,000 on airfares per year on international flights.

Overdrive
03-05-2013, 09:03 PM
You must not travel very much - as of today if you want to purchase one (1) FIRST Class seat from IAH or DFW to CDG (Paris) leaving mid May and returning mid June the fare is between $16,500 and $18,300. That's totally normal these days for First Class to Europe.

Flying from Tampa where many pros live and I believe P1 is based for the same dates to Paris is between $17,000 - $19,000 per ticket.

Business Class for the same flights is about $5200

I travel for a living and spend on avg $150,000 on airfares per year on international flights.

I do, but I only flew four times within the Continental United States.

Wow, that's a ridiculous amount of money.

I honestly couldn't spend that much on airfares. I guess you make it all back from you job correct?

DownTheLineWith90
03-05-2013, 09:37 PM
To sum it all up:
If you're a pro, it's probably a frugal decision.
If you're not, yes, it's a huge waste of money, unless you're willing to spend that much.

Relinquis
03-05-2013, 09:57 PM
business travel (first or business class) is always expensive nowadays.

if you are a student or travelling on your own dime, economy prices are good even on long flights.

TennezSport
03-06-2013, 08:21 AM
Apollo Leisure runs the Wimbledon stringing service.

Apollo was the company I could not remember and I misquoted Alpha. I had also heard that Babolat was trying to take over Wimbly, so didnt know if it had happened or not. Thanks KKM for the correction.

Cheers, TennezSport :cool:

insiderman
03-06-2013, 09:04 AM
BUT!!!!! Remember, that if a player reaches just one more round, that 'payday' is an easy argument for their having TOP-LEVEL / consistent service... Hey, if they pay, and are happy... what is the 'beef' here!?
Like anything in life... if you want the BEST... you need to pay for it - geez!

Overdrive
03-06-2013, 09:45 AM
BUT!!!!! Remember, that if a player reaches just one more round, that 'payday' is an easy argument for their having TOP-LEVEL / consistent service... Hey, if they pay, and are happy... what is the 'beef' here!?
Like anything in life... if you want the BEST... you need to pay for it - geez!

Use an actual word that's in the dicitionary instead of 'beef' like 'problem'..

Anyways, there is no problem; it's just a friendly conversation about P1.

sureshs
03-06-2013, 09:49 AM
They can be, but I don't think they string racquets for players like Gulbis and Isner. They either get their racquets strung from somewhere else or something.

For the Average Joe? They really pay for the bronze or silver plan. I think lower-ranked players or players that play in the Futures do the silver plan.

I mean do they ever do general stringing like Wilson does for tournaments?

Rabbit
03-06-2013, 09:55 AM
Me too. But they wouldn't reveal that publicly.

Really? 50K? I bet people say that's still too low...

Wait, $10,000 to Europe Round Trip?

Hogwash...

Use an actual word that's in the dicitionary instead of 'beef' like 'problem'..

Anyways, there is no problem; it's just a friendly conversation about P1.

It's called a colloquialism, much like hogwash. And last time I checked, "beef" was in the dictionary.

axel89
03-06-2013, 10:28 AM
Really?

You know, being wealthy gives a player an advantage to turn pro... to a degree.

yeah his dad sold a bunch of computers something like that heard it on espn when gulbis was playing a match :)

uk_skippy
03-06-2013, 11:20 AM
Not at the Aust Open or US Open as the Wilson stringing team run by Ron Rocchi strings for those events. The French Open uses the Babolat stringing team and I believe Wimbledon uses Alpha or Babolat teams. Maybe UK Skippy can shed some light on Wimbly as he strings there yearly.

Cheers, TennezSport :cool:

Apollo was the company I could not remember and I misquoted Alpha. I had also heard that Babolat was trying to take over Wimbly, so didnt know if it had happened or not. Thanks KKM for the correction.

Cheers, TennezSport :cool:

Yes, the Wimbledon stringing team is run by Apollo Leisure, which is a string distributor and machine service agent in the UK. Before Apollo it was Bow Brand. I'd think that all major companies (that can) would like to get the official service for Wimbledon; but the thing that makes Wimbledon, Wimbledon is the English way it is run. You can see that there is very little advertising around the ground. They also tend to keep things the same, which is why the stringing service went from a (relatively) small English company to another, and not a big corporate name. There is also little to no public exposure of the stringing area as its hidden away by the practice courts.

Regards

Paul

Moz
03-06-2013, 11:50 AM
It's called a colloquialism, much like hogwash. And last time I checked, "beef" was in the dictionary.

Overdrive was talking about a dicitionary not a dictionary.

mhj202
03-06-2013, 12:37 PM
You must not travel very much - as of today if you want to purchase one (1) FIRST Class seat from IAH or DFW to CDG (Paris) leaving mid May and returning mid June the fare is between $16,500 and $18,300. That's totally normal these days for First Class to Europe.

Flying from Tampa where many pros live and I believe P1 is based for the same dates to Paris is between $17,000 - $19,000 per ticket.

Business Class for the same flights is about $5200

I travel for a living and spend on avg $150,000 on airfares per year on international flights.

gavna-

you're dealing with a kid high school kid who has no idea about real-world costs, expenses, travel or much else for that matter.

mhj202
03-06-2013, 12:39 PM
Use an actual word that's in the dicitionary instead of 'beef' like 'problem'..

Anyways, there is no problem; it's just a friendly conversation about P1.

From dictionary.com:

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/beef?s=t

From Merriam Webster:

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/beef

Rabbit
03-06-2013, 12:39 PM
Overdrive was talking about a dicitionary not a dictionary.

I stand corrected. I don't have a masters degree and never had to use a dicitonary. Maybe one day I'll buy a dicitnary just for fun.

thanks for your oversight :)

Overdrive
03-06-2013, 12:44 PM
gavna-

you're dealing with a kid high school kid who has no idea about real-world costs, expenses, travel or much else for that matter.

Right, I'm a high school kid that has traveled through the country (for tennis tournaments and vactions) who has no idea what the value of a dollar is. There's alot of people here with poles up their rumps....

bluetrain4
03-06-2013, 01:25 PM
Players don't have to use such a service, do they? Don't all tournaments have stringing services - you always see those little segments at Slams and other tournaments where a stringer will be asked whose racquet he is doing and how long it takes. Granted, this may not be as great as Priority One, but I'd assume it's what most players do. And, at least at the bigger tournaments like Slams, is the stringing service paid for out of tournament coffers, or does each player pay for every frame strung?

Povl Carstensen
03-06-2013, 01:31 PM
Use an actual word that's in the dicitionary instead of 'beef' like 'problem'..

Anyways, there is no problem; it's just a friendly conversation about P1.You decide whether people can use the word "beef"?

uk_skippy
03-06-2013, 01:34 PM
Players don't have to use such a service, do they? Don't all tournaments have stringing services - you always see those little segments at Slams and other tournaments where a stringer will be asked whose racquet he is doing and how long it takes. Granted, this may not be as great as Priority One, but I'd assume it's what most players do. And, at least at the bigger tournaments like Slams, is the stringing service paid for out of tournament coffers, or does each player pay for every frame strung?

Players pay for their own stringing at tournaments. We do it for the love, but also for a living.

Regards

Paul

kkm
03-06-2013, 02:28 PM
Players don't have to use such a service, do they? Don't all tournaments have stringing services - you always see those little segments at Slams and other tournaments where a stringer will be asked whose racquet he is doing and how long it takes. Granted, this may not be as great as Priority One, but I'd assume it's what most players do. And, at least at the bigger tournaments like Slams, is the stringing service paid for out of tournament coffers, or does each player pay for every frame strung?


Most players use the on-site stringing service.

If a player is sponsored by Wilson, he usually gets free stringing at the tournaments that Wilson strings at, same for Babolat-sponsored players at the French, Tecnifibre at Monte-Carlo and so on. Otherwise players pay for on-site stringing service. Most tournaments deduct stringing fees from the player's prize money, though some don't and have players pay by cash or credit card.

uk_skippy
03-06-2013, 02:53 PM
Most tournaments deduct stringing fees from the player's prize money, though some don't and have players pay by cash or credit card.

And some try not to pay at all!!

andtapes
03-06-2013, 03:39 PM
And some try not to pay at all!!

It's sad but it is true!

Doubles
03-06-2013, 03:44 PM
And some try not to pay at all!!

Any offenders you can mention by name?

Overdrive
03-06-2013, 05:27 PM
And some try not to pay at all!!

Give up the names skippy!! :twisted:

kkm
03-06-2013, 11:12 PM
Any offenders you can mention by name?


It's probably better in the interest of discretion not to name names, but there are some big, big-name players on this list.

uk_skippy
03-07-2013, 02:41 AM
Any offenders you can mention by name?

Give up the names skippy!! :twisted:

It's probably better in the interest of discretion not to name names, but there are some big, big-name players on this list.

Sorry, as mentioned by KKM, I can't really divulge that information.

Hope you understand.

Regards

Paul

Overdrive
03-07-2013, 09:43 AM
Sorry, as mentioned by KKM, I can't really divulge that information.

Hope you understand.

Regards

Paul

Oh well, I'm not honestly surprised they tried to get away with a free stringing service anyways.. :|

It's cool that Benjamin Becker is on the IW draw. Is he still sponsored by BB?

TennezSport
03-07-2013, 10:24 AM
There is also little to no public exposure of the stringing area as its hidden away by the practice courts.

Regards, Paul

Thanks for the heads up Paul. Yes and I also could not believe how small the stringing area is, hope they make it a bit bigger in the future.

Cheers, TennezSport :cool:

Rabbit
03-07-2013, 10:30 AM
From a few years ago, a little birdie told me that Chang gang was notorious for not wanting to pay....

Doubles
03-07-2013, 10:49 AM
It's cool that Benjamin Becker is on the IW draw. Is he still sponsored by BB?

Obvious troll is obvious.

bluetrain4
03-07-2013, 11:54 AM
Players pay for their own stringing at tournaments. We do it for the love, but also for a living.

Regards

Paul

Surely. I never meant to suggest that the stringers aren't paid, just asking who exactly paid them.

Overdrive
03-07-2013, 05:34 PM
Obvious troll is obvious.

Holy crap, I was only asking a question..

Another person with a pole stuck up his rump.. It's funny that it's the same person who had nothing to say but negative nonsense in quite a few threads.

Doubles
03-07-2013, 05:54 PM
Holy crap, I was only asking a question..

Another person with a pole stuck up his rump.. It's funny that it's the same person who had nothing to say but negative nonsense in quite a few threads.

You can call it whatever you want, but you're still wrong.

lefty10spro
03-07-2013, 06:11 PM
I have strung at pro events and there is a very simple rule. Do NOT let them run a tab! Not EVER!

Overdrive
03-07-2013, 06:14 PM
I have strung at pro events and there is a very simple rule. Do NOT let them run a tab! Not EVER!

How come? Because they never pay? Is this similar to keeping tabs at a bar or something?

Overdrive
03-07-2013, 06:15 PM
You can call it whatever you want, but you're still wrong.

You can deny it whatever you want, but I'm still wrong.

drakulie
03-07-2013, 06:18 PM
And some try not to pay at all!!

Oh yes. Many try and sneak out without paying.

Overdrive
03-07-2013, 06:19 PM
Oh yes. Many try and sneak out without paying.

Ha, this reminds me of trying to steal candy from a candy store or something. :)

Povl Carstensen
03-08-2013, 02:50 AM
Is this similar to keeping tabs at a bar or something?Ha, this reminds me of trying to steal candy from a candy store or something. :)Interesting.

uk_skippy
03-08-2013, 03:10 AM
Surely. I never meant to suggest that the stringers aren't paid, just asking who exactly paid them.

I understand that, I was just saying that players do pay for the service. The 2nd sentence was just additional.

I have strung at pro events and there is a very simple rule. Do NOT let them run a tab! Not EVER!

I string at all levels of professional tournaments and for those where I'm in control/charge I do let them run tabs but usually with some collateral i.e. a reel of string. You do get to know who to trust, and failing that the tournament director will deduct any fees from the prize money.

Currently at Wimbledon players either pay in cash or leave a credit card number on file.

Regards

paul

monkey-ranch
03-14-2013, 06:13 PM
I have strung on different pro tournaments and we do the following: players pay cash on each stringjob delivery, put a CC on file(I have used the "square card swipe" on my cellphone and works great) or we make sure that whatever the player owes is deducted from the prize money.

Namaste.

Overdrive
03-14-2013, 06:22 PM
Couldn't they just have a 'personal stringer'? Just bring a Klippermate portable stringer with their stringer and don't have to pay every time.

I wonder if hiring a personal stringer is more or less expensive than stringing a racquet at a tournament. That depends on the racquet (if it's a Steam, than many string jobs) and the price. Here, it's $15 a racquet.

drakulie
03-14-2013, 06:37 PM
Couldn't they just have a 'personal stringer'? Just bring a Klippermate portable stringer with their stringer and don't have to pay every time.

I wonder if hiring a personal stringer is more or less expensive than stringing a racquet at a tournament. That depends on the racquet (if it's a Steam, than many string jobs) and the price. Here, it's $15 a racquet.

A personal stringer charging the player $15 per racquet, huh? Lets see.

The player has 10 racquets strung each day. That's $150 a day.

The hotel cost the stringer $200 a day.
The airfare cost the stringer $500 round trip.
Food cost the stringer $50 per day. \
etc,
etc,
etc,,,,,

Yeah, I could see where a personal stringer would take that job.

Dave M
03-15-2013, 03:15 AM
Couldn't they just have a 'personal stringer'? Just bring a Klippermate portable stringer with their stringer and don't have to pay every time.

I wonder if hiring a personal stringer is more or less expensive than stringing a racquet at a tournament. That depends on the racquet (if it's a Steam, than many string jobs) and the price. Here, it's $15 a racquet.

Yes and let's not forget that the klippermate is the no.1 string machine used on tour.
I'd imagine that the exe ss weight charges on a full on electronic machine to get it to the venue must be quite a bit each flight.Imagine being a stringer worrying how the machine was going to be if/when it finally gets off the plane.

Overdrive
03-15-2013, 07:15 AM
A personal stringer charging the player $15 per racquet, huh? Lets see.

The player has 10 racquets strung each day. That's $150 a day.

The hotel cost the stringer $200 a day.
The airfare cost the stringer $500 round trip.
Food cost the stringer $50 per day. \
etc,
etc,
etc,,,,,

Yeah, I could see where a personal stringer would take that job.

Yeah, plus as a player, you aren't traveling alone besides your coach and other players. I would feel like talking to someonebesides my coach every day... :roll:
However, things can happen with a coach as well.. but it would be awkward if something happens.. :|

Overdrive
03-15-2013, 07:16 AM
Yes and let's not forget that the klippermate is the no.1 string machine used on tour.
I'd imagine that the exe ss weight charges on a full on electronic machine to get it to the venue must be quite a bit each flight.Imagine being a stringer worrying how the machine was going to be if/when it finally gets off the plane.

After I scrounge some money, I'm getting a Klippermate and all of the necessary tools. I would post a thread about the list of everything for the stringer, but I could just search in the older threads. :) I'll first buy the basic machine first ($159) , then sell it and get the $245 one

I do believe that traveling with a portable Klippermate would be less expensive than a 50-75 pounds larger machine.

Rabbit
03-15-2013, 07:56 AM
After I scrounge some money, I'm getting a Klippermate and all of the necessary tools. I would post a thread about the list of everything for the stringer, but I could just search in the older threads. :) I'll first buy the basic machine first ($159) , then sell it and get the $245 one

I do believe that traveling with a portable Klippermate would be less expensive than a 50-75 pounds larger machine.

Yeah, walking would be less expensive than flying too.

Overdrive
03-15-2013, 07:59 AM
Yeah, walking would be less expensive than flying too.

Actually, not going at all is less expensive than both of them.

Rabbit
03-15-2013, 08:06 AM
Actually, not going at all is less expensive than both of them.

and quitting playing would be even cheaper

Overdrive
03-15-2013, 08:12 AM
and quitting playing would be even cheaper

and stop playing would be cheaper*

usta2050
03-15-2013, 10:00 AM
For those that you don't know what Priority One is, it is a company that strings racquets for players ranging from recreational players to professionals in WTA/ATP.

This is a quote from a link on one their website: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702304520804576343300235154610.html
It stated that:
"Priority One has 14 "gold service" clients, including Mr. Djokovic, Roger Federer, Andy Murray and Robin Soderling. For $40,000 a year, the company cares for its clients' rackets at the four Grand Slam and eight other mandatory tournaments. (Additional tournaments cost extra.)" .

5 rackets a day for 14 days for 12 tournaments = 840 string jobs.

40 k / 80 = 48 bucks per restringing.

Overdrive
03-15-2013, 10:13 AM
5 rackets a day for 14 days for 12 tournaments = 840 string jobs.

40 k / 80 = 48 bucks per restringing.

Nice math equation you did there. However, some players do string less or more than 5 racquets a day.

With this, I guess it is better to have a personal stringer and pay him by the hour and cover his/her travel expenses and such.

sureshs
03-15-2013, 10:29 AM
5 rackets a day for 14 days for 12 tournaments = 840 string jobs.

40 k / 80 = 48 bucks per restringing.

Doesn't the 40K also include matching the frames (customization)?

Dave M
03-15-2013, 10:43 AM
After I scrounge some money, I'm getting a Klippermate and all of the necessary tools. I would post a thread about the list of everything for the stringer, but I could just search in the older threads. :) I'll first buy the basic machine first ($159) , then sell it and get the $245 one

I do believe that traveling with a portable Klippermate would be less expensive than a 50-75 pounds larger machine.

Is it safe for me to presume you do not string? (NOthing against the klippermate, I have had one for 12 years.)
Is your plan to travel to tournaments and set up alongside the P1 people and undercut themIt's obvious with a klipper you'd be able to do that but at first i think i would start at local tournaments so as to not incur such travel costs.I expect when a few of the top players see you sitting at your picnic table with machine at the ready they're bound to think it's a good idea to save a few £ over the on site people.

Overdrive
03-15-2013, 10:50 AM
Is it safe for me to presume you do not string? (NOthing against the klippermate, I have had one for 12 years.)
Is your plan to travel to tournaments and set up alongside the P1 people and undercut themIt's obvious with a klipper you'd be able to do that but at first i think i would start at local tournaments so as to not incur such travel costs.I expect when a few of the top players see you sitting at your picnic table with machine at the ready they're bound to think it's a good idea to save a few £ over the on site people.

I do not string actually. I want to learn how to start stringing instead of wasting money. Maybe I'll make some money on the side. :)

Freelance stringing? That sounds cool haha. I don't know if I could string at Indian Wells if I wanted to though.. :oops:

(Sarcasm)

sureshs
03-15-2013, 11:56 AM
I am going to design a robot which can use a string machine. It will make stringers obsolete.

PureAlph4
03-15-2013, 12:17 PM
USD40k for GSs + 8 M1000s.

Does Fed get a rebate for Miami?

Did Nad carry out a cost / benefit analysis and decide not to sign up with P1 because he anticipated an injury plagued career, so it was better to 'pay as you go' at each tournament?

sureshs
03-15-2013, 12:26 PM
USD40k for GSs + 8 M1000s.

Does Fed get a rebate for Miami?

Did Nad carry out a cost / benefit analysis and decide not to sign up with P1 because he anticipated an injury plagued career, so it was better to 'pay as you go' at each tournament?

No, uncle Toni made him play with arbitrary frames when he was a junior. So he developed the skill to adapt his game to differences in racket specs. Over time, he may have become more picky, but the basic idea is that he is not fussy about exact specs and can win with anything.

Big_Dangerous
03-15-2013, 03:40 PM
No, uncle Toni made him play with arbitrary frames when he was a junior. So he developed the skill to adapt his game to differences in racket specs. Over time, he may have become more picky, but the basic idea is that he is not fussy about exact specs and can win with anything.

Yeah, which is why I like to do all the customization for my own rackets, save for stringing. I want to learn how to string a racket, but it seems very time consuming to learn, and then you have the high cost of a stringing machine. Plus seeing as how I make my string last about 4-6 months, it doesn't seem worth it to buy a stringing machine.

matchmaker
03-15-2013, 04:38 PM
Is it safe for me to presume you do not string? (NOthing against the klippermate, I have had one for 12 years.)
Is your plan to travel to tournaments and set up alongside the P1 people and undercut themIt's obvious with a klipper you'd be able to do that but at first i think i would start at local tournaments so as to not incur such travel costs.I expect when a few of the top players see you sitting at your picnic table with machine at the ready they're bound to think it's a good idea to save a few £ over the on site people.

Haha I like the understated tone of this, although I don't know if certain persons get it.