PDA

View Full Version : The most important factor for power?


hpark927
04-14-2006, 06:04 AM
What do you guys think the most important factor for power department is - especially in groundstroke? Is that a spin? Pace? Or the weight behind the ball?

Also, I'd "ROUGHLY" categorize racket types as following. Then, which group of racquets does a good job in which factor?

Group1: 18*20, around 12.0oz, 7 or more head light - Volkl DNX10, Head prestige
Group2: 18*20, 11.1-11.5oz, 3-5 head light - Volkl 9VE, Head radical
Group3: 16*19, around 12.0oz, 7 or more head light - Volkl C10, 10 Gen II, 10VE, and Head flexpoint radical tour
Group4: 16*19, around 11.5oz - Yonex RDX500/RDS001, Prince O3 tour, Volkl 9VE
Group5: 16*19, around 11.0oz, thick/stiff beam - Volkl DNX8, Yonex RDX300/RDS003, Head instinct, Prince O3 white, Babolat PD/APD

Midlife crisis
04-14-2006, 06:52 AM
Racquet head speed.

hpark927
04-14-2006, 07:02 AM
Racquet head speed.

Seems to me like an absolute answer. But what if somebody can generate the same head speed using different racquets? Let say, flextpoint prestige and flextpoint radical tour - both are about 12oz but with different string type.

AndrewD
04-14-2006, 07:23 AM
YOU are the most important factor when it comes to generating power, the racquet is secondary.

hpark927
04-14-2006, 07:43 AM
YOU are the most important factor when it comes to generating power, the racquet is secondary.

Of course you're absolutely right. I couldn't agree more.

But the answers I was looking for were somewhat different. I guess I didn't ask the question clear enough. Let's put it this way then.

"Which shot do you think is most powerful? A shot with more spin? heavier weight? or better pace?"

I personally prefer weight to spin and pace.

Fumoffu
04-14-2006, 08:08 AM
Well, some people aren't going to agree with me, but what I've noticed is that theres a "maximum swing speed" you can reach with your body, no matter what kind of racket you're using. The heaviest racket that you can use that will reach the "maximum swing speed" with will produce the most power. I don't know how true this is, but thats how I like to think about it.

wyutani
04-14-2006, 08:14 AM
the bigger the racquet head, the bigger the power

Kevo
04-14-2006, 10:43 AM
Body weight = power. Move forward when hitting the ball and get your own weight into the shot and it will have plenty of power. Of course everything else has to work right too. If you arm it at the last second that movement forward won't help.

As for pace, spin, weight, etc. Every ball has some pace and some level of spin even if it's basically zero. It's the combination of pace and spin and trajectory that can make a ball hard to handle. For me, the most effective thing to do is mix it up. A couple hard flat shots and then a big dipping, jumping spinner will do the trick 7-8 times out of 10.

Midlife crisis
04-14-2006, 11:04 AM
Of course you're absolutely right. I couldn't agree more.

But the answers I was looking for were somewhat different. I guess I didn't ask the question clear enough. Let's put it this way then.

"Which shot do you think is most powerful? A shot with more spin? heavier weight? or better pace?"

I personally prefer weight to spin and pace.

Any time you hit with any kind of spin, you are losing ball speed, both in rebound speed off the racquet and in how much the ball slows down as it travels through the air.

I still don't think that's what your asking. I think you're asking what is the most effective shot against your opponent. If so, then it again depends on the opponent. I don't buy this "heavy shot" stuff, because any kind of topspin shot, once it hits the ground, will have the same amount of topspin for the the forward speed and bounce trajectory as another topspin shot. The ground neutralizes changes in topspin amount. However, shots with different pre-bounce spins will bounce differently, and balls with lots of topspin may bounce faster than expected. I think this is what people refer to as a heavy ball - it is one they mis-time because they don't know how to play against a shot with that kind of spin.

Practically any fast topspin groundstroke has more topspin on it than can be generated by a person swinging a racquet, up to very high skill levels. In other words, you'll always see more topspin on a fast groundstroke than you will see trying to hit a volley.

So, if you're playing someone who knows how to time shots with lots of spin, it probably works better to try and overwhelm them with ball speed and ball placement. For someone who has a hard time with timing spinny shots, it's is less risky (at least for me) to hit slower, spinnier shots.

Pomeranian
04-14-2006, 01:57 PM
Of course you're absolutely right. I couldn't agree more.

But the answers I was looking for were somewhat different. I guess I didn't ask the question clear enough. Let's put it this way then.

"Which shot do you think is most powerful? A shot with more spin? heavier weight? or better pace?"

I personally prefer weight to spin and pace.

More powerful is always pace. Having more spin and having the same pace is also more powerful to me. A heavier racquet doesn't translate into a heavier ball. The ball never weighs more. Anways lots of spin is great but it takes pace off the ball. But some people don't deal well with lots of spin. Try to have different combinations of spin/pace. It's always nice to be able to change up your shots.

Define heavy shot please.

I also agree with Midlife crisis that a heavy ball doesn't really exist. I think it just feels that way from lack of hitting the sweetspot, hitting the ball well, using your body ect. That's what I think creates the effect of your racquet being pushed back or twisting. Imagine a guy who played with who's hit your a "heavy" shot before. Now imagine if that guy played Roger Federer, would Federer feel that shot was heavy? That's exaggerating but there is some truth in that a heavy ball is different from person to person because of their skill level. It takes a lot more skill, preperation, anticipation, and speed to return a 100+ mph serve than a 70 mph serve. (excluding spin in this analogy) Because I'm sure you at least once remembered how a shot used to feel "heavy" suddenly didn't anymore after improving.

Racquets affect spin so very little, I agrue unnoticable. What a racquet can do for spin though is be lighter, creating more head racquet speed since you swing easier thus more spin. Or a less powerful racquet, and you make up for the lack of depth with more head racquet speed to create more spin also. Choosing a racquet based on it's spin potential is useless.

Choosing a racquet based on power potential is useful, but everyone has their own weight preferences. A heavier racquet will be more powerful all things being equal. But can you swing that racquet the same speed?

The most important factor for power department is especially in groundstroke is you. That answer may not be the one you want , I know, but it is so relevant that it makes everything else irrelevant. Racquet won't give you more spin. Racquets won't give you heavier shots. They can give you more head racquet speed and power, but spin and weight is completely irrelevant to racquets. Unless you really want 30 more RPM in a stroke you produce 1K to even 3K RPM. You can try different racquets to see which one is a weight and power range you like but don't spend too much time. That time could be easily invested into making yourself better.

Again sorry if it's not the answer you want. Of course do as you wish but I urge you not to use a racquet in search of heavy balls or spin. You can search for more head racquet speed and power, but racquets will not solely make a noticable difference in spin or the heavyness of the ball. It would be a product of more head racquet speed and rebound velocity.

Kevo
04-14-2006, 04:31 PM
The thing about a heavy ball is that it has spin on it. Period. There is no way you can hit the ball REALLY hard and keep it in the court without spin. The spin makes it drop in and with heavy spin a ball with carry more after the bounce than it does without the spin. At least that's my theory. Of course the end result is speed of the ball. The trick is to have the most speed -after- the bounce.

dmastous
04-14-2006, 04:37 PM
The heavier racquet will give you more inherent power, all other factors being equal. Also, tighters string pattern will be more powerfull than an open one.
I would say group one would give you the most inherent power. However racquet head speed does factor into the equation. So if you can generate enough racquet head speed with the heavier racquet than the heavier racquet would be most powerful
But power isn't the most important thing in success on a tennis court.

AndrewD
04-14-2006, 07:06 PM
hpark927,
Yeah, I know you were looking for a bit more detailed answer but I kept it brief because it is relatively simple. You're just confusing yourself by talking about pace and weight as if they exist independent of each other but, in reality, you can't generate one without the other.

In order to generate weight you need forward momentum but that wont guarantee a foreful shot unless you hit the ball hard. You can get good depth with a softly hit shot but without applying pace to the shot (or deflected from the speed of your opponents shot) it wont have any real penetration through/off the court.

Marius_Hancu
04-14-2006, 07:42 PM
the technique (including timing)

Federer: using the entire stringbed (super slo-mo)
http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=85619

Also, check the Sticky (topmost thread) in Tips

hpark927
04-16-2006, 05:53 PM
First of all, thank you all for sharing your priceless insights with me. Really appreciate it.

Summarizing all of your opinions, I would say:
1. The most "desirable" racquet seems to be the heaviest one of all racquets that allows me to reach the maximum head speed.
2. Maximum head speed then makes it possible to generate good spin.
3. Finally, more spin would account for faster speed after the bounce hence result in a heavy shot.

However, how much spin can be generated is solely up to me: swing mechanism, body strength, and so on which is what I have to really focus on.

Do I understand correctly? Thank you again.