Green clay court

[highsierra]

I've never stepped on a green clay court, heck, any clay court, so I'm totally not sure what it is. I was watching the Family Circle final on TV and could see the players sliding but there's no dirt or dust kicked up and the lines stayed perfectly clean. What exactly is on the surface of the green clay court and right undernearth it? Some sort of checmical particles on a concrete slab?

[Bungalo Bill]

I've never stepped on a green clay court, heck, any clay court, so I'm totally not sure what it is. I was watching the Family Circle final on TV and could see the players sliding but there's no dirt or dust kicked up and the lines stayed perfectly clean. What exactly is on the surface of the green clay court and right undernearth it? Some sort of checmical particles on a concrete slab?

The biggest reason you see Har-tru courts (green clay) is it is far less costly to maintain and it has a more consistent surface. It is made of stone which gives it its durability.

The surface does not get your shoes as dirty as red clay so there is less dirt that kicks up because of the way the surface is derived. The lines do stay cleaner but they will get dirty. Players still need to clean their shoes on green clay but not as much as the red stuff.

There is a product called Lee's American Red Clay which tries to keep the good things about HAR-TRU but look like the red clay courts in Europe.

[Andres]

How much faster is than real red clay?

[nickybol]

Generally a bit faster, but there is red clay and there is red clay. Red clay can vary in speed very much. The courts here in the Netherlands are generally speaking much slower than the courts in Spain. A wet court is much slower than a dry court. The size of the clay particles also plays a role.

[danniflava]

The biggest reason you see Har-tru courts (green clay) is it is far less costly to maintain and it has a more consistent surface. It is made of stone which gives it its durability.

The surface does not get your shoes as dirty as red clay so there is less dirt that kicks up because of the way the surface is derived. The lines do stay cleaner but they will get dirty. Players still need to clean their shoes on green clay but not as much as the red stuff.

There is a product called Lee's American Red Clay which tries to keep the good things about HAR-TRU but look like the red clay courts in Europe.

Green clay courts aren't made of stone. If my assumption is correct, I believe it's made out of plastic and recycled stuff.

[Caswell]

From http://www.luckstone.com/divisions/tennis.php:

"HAR-TRU is made from billion year old Pre-Cambrian metabasalt found in the Blue Ridge Mountains of Virginia. This rock is crushed, screened, and mixed in the precise proportions necessary to produce a stable surface."

My club has match play almost exclusively on Har-Tru. The amount of sliding that can be done is very dependent on how wet the surface is - our courts are internally irrigated, and sliding is pretty much rare to nonexistant.

I'd rather play on a hard court, but I appreciate that I'm being easier on my joints before they start hurting me. The only real pisser is the lines - the bounce off the tape is dramatically lower than off the normal surface, so just about every shot that hits the tape (even dead center on the service line) results in an error.

Oh yeah, they tear up the paint on your racquets. Frame a ball and you can bet you've just added a chip to the paint on the inner hoop from a piece of stone stuck to the ball. Put a racquet on the court to get a low volley and kiss a large portion of the paint in that area goodbye.

[papa]

Green clay courts aren't made of stone. If my assumption is correct, I believe it's made out of plastic and recycled stuff.

NO, your incorrect and BB is right. Its possible (because I don't know for sure but have been told) that green dye is used to keep the color consistent. The material can cut/scrape you pretty good and its very adviseable to really scrub out the effected area or it will get infected.

[TENNIS_99]

hey, since you guys are talking about Har-tru, I have a question,

Is there any guideline how much this green clay should be applied to the court? I have played at one club the clay layer is so thin that the balls skid so fast, while at and the other club it was so thick that balls make dents and were very slow... :confused:

[Andres]

Green clay isn't really clay.

But you knew this?

Red clay isn't actually CLAY. It's made of brick dust (also known as 'polvo de ladrillo'). Little pieces of bricks beneath the surface, and tons of this brick dust :)

Clay and brick dust is actually different things. Clay is a material, who's often wet, and when it dries, it get hard.

(Damn, is actually difficult to explain it in english :p)

[jackson vile]

So this surface is like sand then?

Man I think this makes tennis so interesting, no other sports has so many variations from surface, to the balls being different, ect

[wyutani]

So this surface is like sand then?

Man I think this makes tennis so interesting, no other sports has so many variations from surface, to the balls being different, ect

So if i play tennis on the beach, can i assume that im playing on clay?:rolleyes:

[nickybol]

Green clay isn't really clay.

But you knew this?

Red clay isn't actually CLAY. It's made of brick dust (also known as 'polvo de ladrillo'). Little pieces of bricks beneath the surface, and tons of this brick dust :)

Clay and brick dust is actually different things. Clay is a material, who's often wet, and when it dries, it get hard.

(Damn, is actually difficult to explain it in english :p)
Why do those stupid English-speakers call it clay? In many languages there is a distinction between the red clay you play tennis on, and the clay that gets hard. But the English language isn`t that sophisticated I guess.

[lucky leprechaun]

I've heard red clay has a lot of additives in it from bovine sources.

[nickybol]

Where did you get that idea?

[Bungalo Bill]

Why do those stupid English-speakers call it clay? In many languages there is a distinction between the red clay you play tennis on, and the clay that gets hard. But the English language isn`t that sophisticated I guess.

Well thank goodness we have a quality descriptive word for people like you - IDIOT.

[Andres]

Well thank goodness we have a quality descriptive word for people like you - IDIOT.
Don't be harsh on him, Bill. He actually has a point. ;)
Clay courts aren't made of ACTUAL RED CLAY, but brick dust (I don't how any other name for it, you know? It's the powder/dust/dirt taken from a brick :p)

[Ripper]

Anyway, the red stuff is bad for tv. You can't see where the heck the ball's going. So, I wouldn't mind a Roland Garros with a green (better, blue) surface... Sorry for the sacriledge :neutral:

[papa]

Clay courts are actually made of several layers of crushed stone material including a surface dressing that is loose and brushed to give a uniform appearance. This surface material is about the consistency of course sand but "unlike" beach sand it has irrigular edges - beach sand particles are fairly well rounded.

If courts were in fact made out of clay, they would be difficult to drain and would get extremely hard. The surface material does have to be replaced every once in a while (almost turns to dust in well traveled areas of the court) and also rolled to compact the surface.

[Andres]

Clay courts are actually made of several layers of crushed stone material including a surface dressing that is loose and brushed to give a uniform appearance. This surface material is about the consistency of course sand but "unlike" beach sand it has irrigular edges - beach sand particles are fairly well rounded.

If courts were in fact made out of clay, they would be difficult to drain and would get extremely hard. The surface material does have to be replaced every once in a while (almost turns to dust in well traveled areas of the court) and also rolled to compact the surface.
Exactly ;) Thanks papa for the illumination :D
Kudos for you ;)

[Bungalo Bill]

Don't be harsh on him, Bill. He actually has a point. ;)
Clay courts aren't made of ACTUAL RED CLAY, but brick dust (I don't how any other name for it, you know? It's the powder/dust/dirt taken from a brick :p)

It is just clay to me whether it is green, blue, red, or purple. If it plays like clay, looks like clay, gets my shoes dirty like clay, it is clay.

I guess we should name each kind of hard court we play on instead of calling them all "hard courts." ;)

[Andres]

It is just clay to me whether it is green, blue, red, or purple. If it plays like clay, looks like clay, gets my shoes dirty like clay, it is clay.

I guess we should name each kind of hard court we play on instead of calling them all "hard courts." ;)
Yeah, but what you call clay, isn't actually CLAY. That's our point :)
It's like saying coke and red wine are the same thing, since they're both the same colour, they both gets things wet, and they can leave pretty nasty stains :)

[nickybol]

Let`s stop this pointless discussion ;)

[papa]

Yeah, but what you call clay, isn't actually CLAY. That's our point :)
It's like saying coke and red wine are the same thing, since they're both the same colour, they both gets things wet, and they can leave pretty nasty stains :)

Clay itself as a playing surface is not very good although it was used for a considerable period of time. "Clay" really became the generic term/reference for "soft" surfaces without grass.

So we basically have three major types of surfaces in use today "hard", "clay" and "grass". There are many varities of hard courts as you probably know - probably twenty or so, maybe more. Most clay courts are constructed in a fairly similiar manner now with some exceptions. There are very few grass courts although, believe it or not, they are making somewhat of a comeback. Grass and clay are popular because of less strain on the legs, heat buildup, etc. Unfortunately, both are rather labor entensive to maintain along with ongoing material expensives which are quite high (water, Har Tru, seed, etc).

Hard courts are popular because of the low maintenance cost and being able to adapt to just about every type of envoronment there is. The consistency is also easier to maintain from one location to another which certainly has its benefits. These types of surfaces used to be generally constructed of one or two layers of painted asphalt or concrete but now many "new" synthetic materials are being multi-layered to form these new "high tech" playing surface - in many instances the "hard courts" are considerably more expensive to construct than the clay or grass courts but as I mentioned before, maintenance becomes a factor.

The bottom line is that clay courts have little clay anymore but the name hung around - tradition?

Tennis courts are not cheap to build

[Bungalo Bill]

Yeah, but what you call clay, isn't actually CLAY. That's our point :)
It's like saying coke and red wine are the same thing, since they're both the same colour, they both gets things wet, and they can leave pretty nasty stains :)

Yeah you make a lot of sense. Another bitter foreigner. Why dont you start calling all the different hard courts by their real surface name. Don't say "hard court" anymore Einstein.

Clay is clay. Who cares.

[Andres]

Yeah you make a lot of sense. Another bitter foreigner. Why dont you start calling all the different hard courts by their real surface name. Don't say "hard court" anymore Einstein.

Clay is clay. Who cares.
Aha! So i'm a bitter foreigner now? When someone disagrees with you, you gotta use that macho attitude always?
It's nothing personal, Bill, because I really like you, but that attitude... hmmm... it won't work with me. ;)
You can say whatever you want, actually. Clay courts aren't made of clay, if you know what clay really is.
Although, I'm not proposing everyone to change its name, I was just commenting on a silly thing. I will continue calling them claycourts, since it's the standard name, and everyone calls it that way, and I like it how it sounds.

But they're not made of clay. Clay is a total different material, and as far as I know, it's not used anymore in any courts. There were claycourts before, but now those are made of 'polvo de ladrillo', or literally "dust from a brick", but the name prevailed.

Just making a point out of a silly thing, but heh, here in TW, everything gets out of proportion.

[Andres]

For more info, check papa's post, right before yours. ;)

[TennisAsAlways]

Ahh, a war of TERMINOLOGIES I see. *Stands along the sidelines*

[Bungalo Bill]

Aha! So i'm a bitter foreigner now? When someone disagrees with you, you gotta use that macho attitude always?
It's nothing personal, Bill, because I really like you, but that attitude... hmmm... it won't work with me. ;)
You can say whatever you want, actually. Clay courts aren't made of clay, if you know what clay really is.
Although, I'm not proposing everyone to change its name, I was just commenting on a silly thing. I will continue calling them claycourts, since it's the standard name, and everyone calls it that way, and I like it how it sounds.

But they're not made of clay. Clay is a total different material, and as far as I know, it's not used anymore in any courts. There were claycourts before, but now those are made of 'polvo de ladrillo', or literally "dust from a brick", but the name prevailed.

Just making a point out of a silly thing, but heh, here in TW, everything gets out of proportion.

It is stupid. It is also stupid to call a language incomplete. Every language will graviate to common language to describe something that is similar.

To say that it is the language that can' describe something is the dumbest thing I have ever heard.

If the technical term is HAR-TRU but the common language to describe it is green clay - who cares!!!! JUST HIT THE BALL!

[nickybol]

It is stupid. It is also stupid to call a language incomplete.
Why is that stupid?

[Mr.Groundstroke]

In the netherlands we call it crushed 'BAKSTEEN' ;) a.k.a 'GRAVEL'
Nickybol knows what i'm talking about;)
It's freakin slow, but if it's wet it's a lot faster(red clay)!

[nickybol]

Yes Mr. Groundstroke, I know what your talking about. We call it "gravel", but the English word actually means "klei", something totally different. The courts in the Netherlands are very slow, the courts in other countries like Spain have much faster clay.

[Bungalo Bill]

Why is that stupid?

Because you, myself, and anyone else does not know every single word available in ANY language. We simply get used to saying things that others also consider common language and meaning.

For example, if I said I needed a KLEENEX most people (except for the few here) would understand that I am in need of a tissue. KLEENEX is a brand name. Hence why it is stupid to say a language is at fault without considering the language does contain words that could be used alternatively.

People have simply accepted a "clay imitation" product as "clay". So it is stupid to say the language is incomplete.

Get it?

[TennisAsAlways]

Because you, myself, and anyone else does not know every single word available in ANY language. We simply get used to saying things that others also consider common language and meaning.

For example, if I said I needed a KLEENEX most people (except for the few here) would understand that I am in need of a tissue. KLEENEX is a brand name. Hence why it is stupid to say a language is at fault without considering the language does contain words that could be used alternatively.

People have simply accepted a "clay imitation" product as "clay". So it is stupid to say the language is incomplete.

Get it?I don't get it because I happen to be just an American.

[nickybol]

Because you, myself, and anyone else does not know every single word available in ANY language. We simply get used to saying things that others also consider common language and meaning.

For example, if I said I needed a KLEENEX most people (except for the few here) would understand that I am in need of a tissue. KLEENEX is a brand name. Hence why it is stupid to say a language is at fault without considering the language does contain words that could be used alternatively.

People have simply accepted a "clay imitation" product as "clay". So it is stupid to say the language is incomplete.

Get it?
Every language is kind of complete. When talking about snow, Dutch and English are very incomplete if comparing to the Inuit language, which has many many names for all different kinds of snow. But English has all kind of computer terms, I don`t think the Inuit language has so many.

To give another example. English has no difference between polite you and informal you. Most languages have the difference.

German: du - Sie
Dutch: jij - u
French: tu - vous
Spanish: tú - vos

The English word you comes from the French word vous. So English people are always very polite:D

And this is just an example. In every language you can find such examples. I don`t say English is incomplete. I think every language is incomplete in some areas.

But I guess this is a bit offtopic.