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View Full Version : Calling all Dunlop or Slazenger racket users....


Racketdesign
06-30-2004, 04:20 PM
Hi, I would love to hear from any current Dunlop or Slazenger racket owners that are looking to replace or change their racket in the near future. Until the recent take over of Dunlop Slazenger,I held the position of Racket Design Manager and have been largely responsible for all of their current products. I would welcome the chance to discuss any issues or comments that you guys have about the rackets.

Thanks for your time

Matt H.
06-30-2004, 10:12 PM
I'm a 200g owner. 8)

I used to have the HM version, but i am now a MW version owner.

I have a couple of questions....

why YELLOW for the new 200g? :P

much like the Wilson HPS 6.1 where they offered 16x18 and 18x20 string patterns, how come Dunlop never offered a 16x20 string pattern for the 200g? I think that would have it an even better racquet.

Racketdesign
07-01-2004, 02:58 AM
Hi Mat,
Thanks for the post. To answer your questions... Yellow was chosen to be distinctive. As these frames are used on Tour we decided to choose colours that would be easily recognized. The HM range also launched the V template for dunlop that featured across all the models. The reason dunlop didn't offer different string patterns was down to restrictions on range size management. 1 racket in the range leads to ten models in the warehouse (5 grip sizes - strung and unstrung).
I have a quick question back to you... are you brand loyal, or would you be willing to try new rackets if they were developed by the same team as the dunlop rackets ?

tschevap
07-01-2004, 03:24 AM
Hi! Great to have somebody like you in here.

I used the 200G HM, too - had to change due to shoulder problems. The HM was a great stick - never played more precise!
Here in Germany most people asked me, why i switched to Völkl...the black/yellow color is somehow always connected with Völkl...
maybe you should switch back to the all black/grey design with green elemets, which have always been known as Dunlopcolors...
I liked the 18/20 stringbed...it offers much more control...a better player can produce a lot of spin with those racquets without loosing the control...
as the 200G was always directed to better players, you should keep this stringbed! For all others there is the 200GXL and 300G!
So i do not see any problem with your models...

What i most like with Dunlop, is that you keep your models a long time on the market...
not like Wilson, switching the top range every 10months...

Great work!

Racketdesign
07-01-2004, 03:29 AM
Hi tschevap,

Thanks for your compliments. As I mentioned in my original post, due to the change of owner almost all the original staff at DSG have left, including myself.. Im hoping to launch a new brand.. keep an eye on my posts here , or email me for more details

uk_skippy
07-01-2004, 04:38 AM
Hi Racketdesign,

so what went on with the take over at DSG? What do you think of someone like Sport/Soccer taking over a brand like Dunlop/Slazenger, are they gonna cheapen it like they have with Donnay?

ps If you need any testers for your frames I'd be willing to help.

dhsurg
07-01-2004, 04:54 AM
I was a long time Dunlop Max 200G (original) user who was forced to change to other brands because of the lack of player weighted rackets in your collection. I also loved the Slazenger Challenge Number 1 racket in the woodie era.
I would like to see a player's version of the Max 300G that weighs about 13 oz. strung, with a head light balance. I would also like to see better grips on the rackets, perhaps a slightly different handle shape (more like a Wilson or Babolat).
What can you tell me about the current Slazenger X-1. How does it compare to the current Max 200G? Is it modeled to hit similar to Wilson Prostaff 6.0 or 6.1?
Thanks.

jaap deboeck
07-01-2004, 04:55 AM
Why does Dunlop use a different standard for balance point than everyone else? If you ever read their useless literature you "learn" that the 200g, 300G, 400G, Pro Braided etc. are "even balanced". Really? Dunlop show the 700G to be head heavy even as meaurements by Tennis Warehouse show it to be 6 pts. head light!! Why must Dunlop waiver between head light and head heavy every few years like a drunken sailor lost on the way home? Friend, this is a joke and puts Dunlop in a very weak position. Who in R&D thinks that 10 ounce rackets balanced head light with strung swingweights below 300 will be of any use?? Now we see a few head heavy models creeping back like the 600 ICE and 800 ICE. Can Dunlop make up its mind?

atatu
07-01-2004, 07:36 AM
I'm one of the few players who uses the 300G oversize, and I love it, thanks to Dunlop for designing a frame with a 105 headsize. I'm surprised how much power this frame has, given the flexibility, how is that possible ?

Dennis Yeung
07-01-2004, 08:52 AM
Hi Racketdesign, thanks for opening this great opportunity for us to talk to someone like you who take care the racquet design issues. Yeah racquet design should always come first than those marketing hype and technolohgical names.

I started playing tennis at the Revelation 200G era, and I'm glad that I had my hands on the Revelation 200G 90 and Revelation Pro Mid (Mark P's frame), which are IMHO the best all around Dunlop racquet I ever played. So silly I sold them eventually because I wanna try something new. One thing that the Revelation 200G & Pro really impressed me is how smooth it swing, I mean it is smooth and natural. The overall weight distribution feels just great. If you ask people which frames would be good for bombing serve, I think no question there must be someone who will tell you try to get you hands on the 200Gs (the Slazenger ProBraided Black & White also). And I believe it is a result of great weight distribution. Also, I don't seem to find many player racquets that are in the 11.8 - 12 oz strung weight range and not so head light (around 5-6 pts which is what I like) but still swing very smooth + good stability.

The feel and control of these two racquets are top notch. Now I settle on the Super RD Tour 90, partly because the above two Revelations have been discontiuned, partly because I always wanted my Revelations to have a bit more power, so a open string pattern or a stiffer frame could be a solution. However, if you ask me now, I would say keep the unique flex & feel & string pattern of the Revelation 200G & Pro Mid, perhaps a bit (0.25 inch) increase in length or a bit bigger head size, e.g. 93 - 95sqi are what I would like to see.

One thing about the naming, the Revelation series really confuse me.

Finally, just wanna say what I would love to see in future's Dunlop catalog:

1. Bring either the Revelation 200G 90 or the Revelation Pro Mid
back (or both :lol: ) Or at the same time add an 0.25 inch in length.

2. A heavier version for both 300G & 200G XL, e.g. both at about 11.6 - 11.8 oz strung

3. Keep the Slazenger X1

4. Glossy or semi-glossy finish instead of the rubber sticky matt paint.

Thanks :) :)

ClemsonTennis9
07-01-2004, 01:29 PM
dear racquetdesign,
do you think in the near future that they will make the 300g stiff or make a racquet with the same specs but is stiff?

PugArePeopleToo
07-01-2004, 01:56 PM
An updated more aerodynamic 90 sq in original Max 200G would be great. The current 200G is just not the same.

BreakPoint
07-01-2004, 03:02 PM
dear racquetdesign,
do you think in the near future that they will make the 300g stiff or make a racquet with the same specs but is stiff?

I think most people already feel that the 300G is a very stiff racquet already. So stiff in fact that I gave it up fearing a relapse of tennis elbow.

Matt H.
07-01-2004, 05:19 PM
Hi Mat,

I have a quick question back to you... are you brand loyal, or would you be willing to try new rackets if they were developed by the same team as the dunlop rackets ?



To be honest, i'm living proof of why Companies use endorsements with sports superstars. I'm a big time Tommy Haas fan, and when i broke my old wilson racquet, i went straight for the 200g cuz that's what he uses. My tennis shoes (Nike Air Oscillates) are also because of seeing them on tv.

Though, i am brand loyal in a sense that if i have a good experience with a company's product, i will give them a serious look when/if they come out with something new. I can't answer your question with a straight yes or no.....because i'm not affraid of trying something new, and if i like it, i'll go back to that company again in the future.

bigserving
07-01-2004, 05:46 PM
RD I have had my best tourney results with Dunlop frames for years since the purplish blue colored Revelation Classic I think was the name.

I use the 200MW now, and like a couple of others would like to see this frame with a 16X19 string pattern.

Another question. First Tommy Haas, then Alexandra Stevenson, now John McEnroe and some other people on this thread have all are having shoulder problems with the new 200G. That is too much of a coincidence to say that is it not the frame.

Is that your design? That sounds like some kind of design, engineering, or production flaw. Have you discovered what it is, or have you even got feedback from them or others about this?

I would have more confidence in trying another frame once the problem with that frame has been acknowledged and eliminated.

Racketdesign
07-01-2004, 06:47 PM
Thanks for all the comments so far, don't forget, you can always email me for detailed questions if you need to. I will try and comment on some of the issues raised here...

UK skippy - difficult for me to comment, but the reduction of the development team to zero might give us all a clue for the future...

dhsurg - ProX1 is really just a more dampened version of the pro braided. Its not really comparable to the 200g. I guess the Wilson frame would be the closest competitor.

jaap deboeck - All good comments, and issues that I always had with the marketing department. The lightweight/headlight specs were to counter some of the sales we were loosing by everyone buying "titanium" rackets..

atatu - Flex power is an underrated feature these days. Imagine the power a trampoline gives you..compared with a solid stage.

Dennis Yeung - Thanks for the comments, sorry I wont be a position to help any of your suggestions into the Dunlop range... but look out for my own brand coming soon.....

ClemsonTennis9 - see above
PugArePeopleToo - see above

Matt H - Thank you for your comments. Its very interesting that you picked the 200g based on Tommy. With apparel its not such an issue, but for rackets, make sure that the frame style suits you, not that you like the pro that is promoting it.

bigserving- Interesting issue you posted... The HM 200g is my design, and there are 1000's out there doing no harm at all. The 3 players you mention are 3 players that required specific specs and features to their frames.. don't confuse the pro circuit with production.

yip kok kuin
07-01-2004, 08:26 PM
any chance of you working on the injection model like max 200g and bring it back from sleeping. bought and sold the hm200g. try it at the lowest of your recommended tension 50lbs. totally unusable. lower it to 42lbs much better but just cannot complete again the max 200g. I totally agree with you on trampoline/spring power. pls keep the 18X20 string bed. it is the only one that can sit a 42lbs tension. tks

Feńa14
07-08-2004, 08:11 AM
Nice, my favourite Dunlop was the Dunlop Tour Revelation MP (the Prestige red one). I wouldn't mind getting my hands on a couple of them actually.

And As UK_Skippy said, I also will be willing to help test out your new brand as we are both in England.

-Liam

SC in MA
07-08-2004, 10:57 AM
Racketdesign: Thanks for participating in the board. It's nice to have input from someone with true expertise.

I've not been a Dunlop or Slazenger user, but I have hit with a few of their players sticks over the years and have always held them in high regard, especially Dunlop which I was more exposed to. A good friend who plays at the highest amateur level has always been a Dunlop user throughout the years.

I have question related to racket design. I'm 54 and have always used a heavy, head-light racket (currently the Wilson HPS6.1). I'm not playing against the heavy hitters as much as I used to, so I'm wondering if it might make sense, from an overall endurance perspective, to have a lighter stick for the lighter hitters (where match endurance is important) and a heavier stick for the heavy hitters, where stability and plow thru capability are important.

I was thinking that the Dunlop 300g might be the racket for this purpose. I generally much prefer stock frames, but I was thinking of maybe using a stock Dunlop 300g for the light hitters and adding weight (but keeping the same balance) for the heavier hitters. I don't know if this idea makes any sense, but it is something I've been thinking about.

Anyway, here's my question. Would it be difficult to design a variable weighted player's racket that allow the balance to be maintained, even at various weights ? If the racket was designed by the manufacturer for this purpose, then someone like me would not have to experiment to get the added weight balanced properly.

This is probably not a practical idea, nor is there much of a market for a racket like this. But I was just wondering how difficult would it be to design a production racket like this ?

(I'm thinking out loud, but didn't Wilson try something like this a few years ago with different bumper guards ?)

Thanks for any input. I'm looking forward to hearing detail about your new racket company.

NLBwell
07-08-2004, 10:00 PM
I enjoyed the Revelation Tour Pro (or Pro Tour?) Red w/Black - 16 mains. I think it was the highest rated racket at TW for a while. A great players racket. Naming is important because no one could ever keep the Revelation model names straight.

Lineup of rackets to have:
Wilson 6.0 in 90-92 sq in head size
Revelation Tour Pro 95
Head TiRadical, but heavier
Dunlop 300g or Pure Drive/Surge
Head iS6
Weed !!!

Phil
07-08-2004, 10:13 PM
racquetdesign - Would it be possible to produce a racquet with the feel of the Dunlop Max 200G, only with a bit more pop to it? Or is this wishful thinking? I'm realistic about this, but I thought I should at least ask since you've given us the opportunity to chat with you. The Max was a classic and I realize that the reason classics are so labelled is because they really cannot be duplicated. Thanks.

Chanchai
07-09-2004, 08:12 AM
RD (Racketdesign), I wish you all the best on launching this new brand.

I am of the niche (don't know if it's really a niche now) that loves the 300G. I have to admit, I am surprised at how popular the racquet seems to be in my area as well (Oregon). A couple months after I got my set, I started seeing them all over the place at various locations and all the racquet stores in Portland have told me lately that they sell at least 5 a week easily for the last year or more.

Anyways, what I love about the racquet is that I feel I can use my full strokes with little or no compromise, and keep it under control while getting just the right pace I want. I guess I feel more control despite hitting like I would blast the ball off the court with many other racquets. I like the balance it offers by uniquely being a light racquet with a bit of power, but mainly control. Sure, my excessive efforts are how I end up controlling spin, but I personally like that a lot and feel I have a good grasp of spin control and placement. I mostly use the Luxilon Alu-Power (16L) and TiMO Banger (17) strings too (I can already hear some people cringing, but I swear it feels fine for me, maybe I'm hitting the sweet spot a lot, who knows).

What I would look for in a racquet to replace the 300G... I wouldn't want it to really go "Player racquet heavy" because I feel it really serves its niche being light and those that want more out of it would either be better suited going to another model or adding lead tape. Therefore, maybe a slight increase in weight, but not much. However, added weight might become mandatory for what I want improved.

The tradeoff so far as I can tell with going light weight and with the hotmelt process is that the racquet can feel either stiff or at least "unstable." I don't have too much problem with this, but it's most noticeable on serves and volleys. For me, a huge way for a racquet to be superior to a 300G while maintaining most of its attributes is to get the racquet to be a bit more flexible/stable on volleys. The light weight makes it good for volleys, but the lack of stability gives it a "stiff" and "control-lacking" feel at net. So if you could figure a way to modify a design similar to a 300G to maintain stability, at least in volleys, I think that would be huge. The "stiff" feel doesn't come up to me in serving unless I'm off a bit. I'm really happy with the types of serves I get with the 300G, but you definitely have to work harder for certain things and without modification, serves are generally going to be very light without so much weight--at least that's how I feel about it. But with the lightness and spin control, I'm happy with the variety I'm getting on the serves with slice, flat, kick, and a sort of flat serve with a lot of slice on it to give it a funky kick (which might have to do with the lightness-factor on the ball).

In fact, if you could design a racket that's practically a 300G with added flexibility and stability, that would be great. But I don't know much about racquet technology and I'm guessing it might be inherent in the lightweight nature of the racket. I would probably be asking the impossible if I stated the desire as: A 300G for the most part, but feeling like a lighter but just as "warm"/smooth Pro Staff Tour 90 at net (make that WAY LIGHTER lol).

In tennis years, I'm not an old timer... so I haven't had the wonderful experiences people have mentioned of older generation dunlop rackets. But maybe I represent a demographic you are interested in catering to.

Next to the 300G, I love the 200G Muscle Weave models--the feel was wonderful imo. I like the 200G HM as well, but I'll admit it's a racket I have to play with for at least 15 minutes to get the hang of (and yet I can go to almost any Pro Staff fairly quickly and be fine). The 200GXL was a cute racket, but not my fav... It's a racket I would recommend to friends who are intermediates and just starting to get truly serious with tennis--it's a fun racket to hit with and I thought it felt great--but for whatever reason, something held me back from loving it, but I certainly was carefree in hitting with it.

I hope that gives you another decent illustration of what some 300G devotees like in that sort of racket.

Again, best wishes on the new venture! I'll do my best to give the rackets a try if they are available to me (whether online or locally).

-Chanchai

netman
07-09-2004, 07:32 PM
racketdesign, the Slaz PBH seems like a stiffer version of the old Dunlop Revelation Pro Tour. Was this the case? Its a very nice frame. Hopefully someone will offer a new version of it.

carlosrothstein
07-09-2004, 11:59 PM
Will be nice to have back the Dunlop Revelation Pro 90 or an updated model with the same weight, balance, etc.

david aames
07-13-2004, 10:12 AM
Racketdesign,

I hope you won't mind a few questions...

On a subject we all love to bring here ;) What's your take on the paintjob issue? As a racquet designer, how do you communicate with the marketing people on the matter?

If you were to fill out the same position you held at Dunlop with another racquet company. Which one would it be and why.

Thanks!

abrowni
07-13-2004, 10:23 AM
hey racketdesign...i have been using the slazenger pro braided xtreme (black and white) since 1998, now i am 20 years old playing collegiate tennis and i can't seem to find a racket that i like enough to switch to. i hit with the pro braided henman/trinity and didn't like it and i haven't had a chance to hit with the new pro X1...do you have any suggestions?
thanks

email at abrowning_187@hotmail.com

ClemsonTennis9
07-13-2004, 11:36 AM
racquet design,
do you know if i collide racquets with a doubles partner and my racquet breaks, will dunlop replace that racquet?

Goalier95
07-14-2004, 01:25 PM
RD,

Glad you're here and hope everything goes well over at Dunlop racket sports. I've been using Dunlop line since Graf won her Golden Grand Slam and have also used the Revelation 200G, MuscleWeave 95, MW 100 Midplus and a HotMelt 400G. Of all of them, the MW 100 is one racket I will never part with, it just suits my game and i'm able to do things with the ball that I have never done with any other line or other manufacturer. Is it possible that Dunlop has any back stock of the MW100? ;) One other note, the finish of the 400G comes off way too easily; peeling/rubbing issues on the frame. Thanks again!