Video of a 4.5 and 5.0 player please

[Duzza]

Can someone please put in a video of a true 4.5 and 5.0 player? Please name the link for example 5.0 player - (link)

[VGP]

I hope he doesn't mind, but fellow TT user edberg505 describes himself as a 5.0

Links:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tskGzNnL93g
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JD6mimdee1s

There was a debate about these guys but they seem 5.0-5.5

Link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZgIsQ-flSEI&search=tennis

These guys seem like 5.5-6.0

Link:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6354574916122791363&q=bun&pl=true

[mrcapslock]

anybody have video of players 3.5 to 4.0 perferably in a match?

[Woodstock_Tennis]

How do you guys make those movies? I'd love to make one to see what everyone thinks, right now I'm playing doubles because my net game was complete trash, but when I played singles (will start again in summer) I played competitive at 5.0 (meaning I lost as much as I won).

[Bungalo Bill]

I hope he doesn't mind, but fellow TT user edberg505 describes himself as a 5.0

Links:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tskGzNnL93g
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JD6mimdee1s

There was a debate about these guys but they seem 5.0-5.5

Link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZgIsQ-flSEI&search=tennis

These guys seem like 5.5-6.0

Link:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6354574916122791363&q=bun&pl=true

All those guys in the videos are accomplished and advanced players.

But in the first video it sounded like the guy hittiing back the balls that you couldn't see had tack guns on his shoes.

[Rep. Timothy Calhoun]

I hope he doesn't mind, but fellow TT user edberg505 describes himself as a 5.0

Links:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tskGzNnL93g
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JD6mimdee1s

There was a debate about these guys but they seem 5.0-5.5

Link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZgIsQ-flSEI&search=tennis

These guys seem like 5.5-6.0

Link:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6354574916122791363&q=bun&pl=trueFirst, thanks for sharing.

I watched the video from link that you provided, the one in the middle, the 5.0-5.5 guys. No doubt that those guys are 'at the very least' 5.0-5.5.

After watching it, it makes me feel better, because my groundstrokes and serve have a much more pronounced pop than theirs did! I play out in the open too!

If I were to serve in a closed environment (like they were), it would crack a whole lot louder than those guys' serve (As it already is, it cracks and echos a lot more 'outdoors than theirs did 'indoors. I could only imagine how booming my strokes would be if I were to play indoors. I never had the chance to play inside.).

I might have the 'power' of a +5.5 player. Now don't get me wrong, I know that in competitive rallies, you don't go all out with power, but I'm sure that in the clip, there were some 1st serves recorded, and I did not notice anything special or pro-like (crazy pop and pace). It's risky to go all out on groundstrokes during competitive rallies, but that doesn't stop people from popping in first serves -- which I did not notice anything out-of-this-world.

Good to know. At least it's a 'rough' measure I could go by, as far as comparing my power.

[BeachTennis]

All those guys in the videos are accomplished and advanced players.

But in the first video it sounded like the guy hittiing back the balls that you couldn't see had tack guns on his shoes.


AK-47 is the tool

Straight outta Compton

[snoflewis]

on the first videos...edberg's not even trying (or at least it looks that way)...and if he is, well..he looks very calm lol

[Rep. Timothy Calhoun]

on the first videos...edberg's not even trying (or at least it looks that way)...and if he is, well..he looks very calm lolYeah. Looked like warm-up type strokes to me.

[tennis_nerd22]

is it just me or does edberg not have a complete step through into his volleys. he does what most of us do when we get lazy... he did it on his backhand side a lot more than on forehand side, from what i saw... any other opinions??

[VGP]

edberg505 posted a link to his videos in the picture thread. He said that the videos were shot at the end of his playing session for that day and he was tired by that point.

[shindemac]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XwxKxozLGPM&search=tennis

According to the comments, Marianne is rated a 4.5.

[jackson vile]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XwxKxozLGPM&search=tennis

According to the comments, Marianne is rated a 4.5.


That is good, the serve imo was not a 4.5, ground strokes looked great, room for improvement but you can't take anything away from it.


As for the mens, the first video is indeed just a simple messing around warmup, the second was good but did not look 5.0 to me.

Third video look 5.0 to me and they were great, although the other play was obviously scared or just something.

Watching those videos sure makes me feel good about my game:mrgreen:

[Rep. Timothy Calhoun]

^ I doubt you're a pro though (You never know who's on these boards though! . . . which is why I say 'doubt'.). The guys in the last link that VGP provided are real pros. They're not Federer, Roddick, Nadal, or Sampras material, but still, they're professionals.

[nViATi]

All those guys in the videos are accomplished and advanced players.

But in the first video it sounded like the guy hittiing back the balls that you couldn't see had tack guns on his shoes.
I bet the sound was from a skateboard.

[Rep. Timothy Calhoun]

I bet the sound was from a skateboard.Close. He's doing the new thing nowadays . . . he's wear tapping shoes on the court.

[AngeloDS]

All these players are incredibly solid, and their techniques are incredibly refined.

That girl Marianne is a very good tennis player. I'm pretty sure she can beat a lot of users here who self-rate.

It's not about strokes; it's about how you perform afterall. Strokes can be easily learned but tennis is so much more than just strokes. It's also about strategy, consistency, exploiting weaknesses and attacking them and other various things.

More than strokes look at their solid footwork. That's the foundation that seperates a lot of people from the 3.5 to the 4.0 level.

The gap between a 4.0 and 4.5 is large. 4.5 to 5.0 even larger. 5.0 and up the gap just widens more. 5.0 players beat 4.5 players in straight sets, maybe losing 1 game.

[Rep. Timothy Calhoun]

All these players are incredibly solid, and their techniques are incredibly refined.

That girl Marianna is a very good tennis player. I'm pretty sure she can beat a lot of users here who self-rate.

It's not about strokes; it's about how you perform afterall. Strokes can be easily learned but tennis is so much more than just strokes. It's also about strategy, consistency, exploiting weaknesses and attacking them and other various things.

The gap between a 4.0 and 4.5 is large. 4.5 to 5.0 even larger. 5.0 and up the gap just widens more. 5.0 players beat 4.5 players in straight sets, maybe losing 1 game.Even though there IS a big gap between 4.5 and 5.0, sometimes I will see a 4.5 have close 'numbers' when playing a match against a 5.0. The stats may be close (eg the 5.0 leading 7-6, 6,5), but in those cases, of those close stats in the match, there still IS a HUGE gap . . . the 5.0 has a huge mental advantage (and experience etc.) and is way ahead of the 4.5, even if the 'stats' make it 'appear' to be a close match!

You know what I'm saying?

[35ft6]

I hope he doesn't mind, but fellow TT user edberg505 describes himself as a 5.0

Links:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tskGzNnL93g
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JD6mimdee1s

There was a debate about these guys but they seem 5.0-5.5

Link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZgIsQ-flSEI&search=tennis

These guys seem like 5.5-6.0

Link:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6354574916122791363&q=bun&pl=true Edberg definitely looks to be around 5.0.

The guys playing in the 3rd link look like 5.5 players at least.

The Asian dudes are 6.0 at least. At least one of them is.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XwxKxozLGPM&search=tennis

According to the comments, Marianne is rated a 4.5. Marianne looks like a 5.5 for a woman. To me anyways. Like a solid d-3 or d-2 college player.

As far as power goes, most of us are too used to seeing Marat, Federer, and Nadal on TV, and can't accurately gauge how powerful "we" are compared to what we see on TV. Those guys playing in the linkds above hit with plenty of pace, but because they don't hit as hard as the ATP pros, we assume that we can hit harder then them. Tape yourself playing a match and you'll be shocked by how not powerful and slow you look. If you were watching those guys in person, from the side, you'd see that they're putting a lot of stuff on their shots.

[MTChong]

I can tell you that Marianne would easily beat me, I think; or rather, it looks like it.

[Bungalo Bill]

I bet the sound was from a skateboard.

Wow, hitting balls while skateboarding, that has to beat Federer by a mile. ;)

[BillyBee]

Tape yourself playing a match and you'll be shocked by how not powerful and slow you look. If you were watching those guys in person, from the side, you'd see that they're putting a lot of stuff on their shots.

This is so true. Most people will overrate themselves after watching these videos, thinking, "Oh, I can hit the ball like that, too."

Not!! I realized this after seeing James Blake play in person. Maybe more than any other sport, tennis loses a LOT on TV. You really have no idea how powerfully and precisely high-level players hit the ball until you see them in person . . . or see yourself on tape.

You are worse than you think. And they are better than you realize.

[La Bomba]

Marianne isn't very good at tennis, too big a backswing on volleys, mediocre serve, terrible groundstrokes, the only reason she is hitting those winners is because the oppenent she is versing is worse than her and it makes marianne look good

[mrcapslock]

so anybody have video of a legit 3.5 to 4.0 player?

[Rep. Timothy Calhoun]

Marianne is crap, too big a backswing on volleys, crap serve, terrible groundstrokes, the only reason she is hitting those winners is because the oppenent she is versing is worse than her and it makes marianne look goodWake up on the wrong side of the bed?

[snoflewis]

who exactly is marianne?

[Slazenger]

I love the part in the Marianne video where the video pauses for like 5 seconds on a short ball that she hits a winner on the line LOL!

Umm Marianne is definitely not crap. Can her game improve? Yes, whose can't?? But to say she has a crap serve and groundstrokes is just silly. Take the short ball that she hit x-court smack on the line. You think she did that by accident?
Those are the sort of things you look at when you watch someone play. Videos can be deceptive in terms of speed and related issues.
How many times have you watched a pro match and see a player net a ball that you thought they should have easily gotten back. If you were watching the match live, youwould have noticed that the shot of the opponent perhaps caused that error.

All the players in the video are very good. I totally agree with Angelo (he would know) it is more than strokes.
Look at one of the videos with the 2 asian guys playing. One hits a xcourt dropshot (at the right time with opponent behind baseline) and comes in behind it, knowing that his opponent has to hit upwards to clear the net. The opponent does and he simply volleys into the open court.

Those are the sort of things you look at to tell level of player. How many players have you seen that would hit that dropper and stay back?

[La Bomba]

Wake up on the wrong side of the bed?

Lol, nope i didn't, it just looks like she isn't very good at tennis thats all.

[Duzza]

Hm they are some good vids, thanks for sharing i'll hopefully have a link to my videos i'd say after watching them i'm around 4.5

[Rep. Timothy Calhoun]

I love the part in the Marianne video where the video pauses for like 5 seconds on a short ball that she hits a winner on the line LOL!

Umm Marianne is definitely not crap. Can her game improve? Yes, whose can't?? But to say she has a crap serve and groundstrokes is just silly. Take the short ball that she hit x-court smack on the line. You think she did that by accident?
Those are the sort of things you look at when you watch someone play. Videos can be deceptive in terms of speed and related issues.
How many times have you watched a pro match and see a player net a ball that you thought they should have easily gotten back. If you were watching the match live, youwould have noticed that the shot of the opponent perhaps caused that error.

All the players in the video are very good. I totally agree with Angelo (he would know) it is more than strokes.
Look at one of the videos with the 2 asian guys playing. One hits a xcourt dropshot (at the right time with opponent behind baseline) and comes in behind it, knowing that his opponent has to hit upwards to clear the net. The opponent does and he simply volleys into the open court.

Those are the sort of things you look at to tell level of player. How many players have you seen that would hit that dropper and stay back?Those are good points.

[jlui21]

This is so true. Most people will overrate themselves after watching these videos, thinking, "Oh, I can hit the ball like that, too."

Not!! I realized this after seeing James Blake play in person. Maybe more than any other sport, tennis loses a LOT on TV. You really have no idea how powerfully and precisely high-level players hit the ball until you see them in person . . . or see yourself on tape.

You are worse than you think. And they are better than you realize.

Although I can't say anything about seeing a real pro in action, seeing yourself on video changes a lot about how one should perceive him or herself. In nearly all cases, you and I are probably a lot lower in skill level. Sucks doesn't it...

[astra]

As if I saw myself on the first video. We do not have your NRTP ratings, based on descriptions on this forum, I estimated myself to be about 4.5.
It was correct.

[shindemac]

I think Marianne is a 4.5. If you read the comments and watch the video, she is a legit 4.5 playing in USTA tournaments in Chicago. So her opponents would also be 4.5, since she looks like she's playing matches in a tournament. But remember that a 4.5 women's equals a 4.0 men's.

The Chinese guys look really good, definitely better than the 2 college players. I can't give a rating to the guy being fed balls for his groundstrokes and volleys. His strokes look decent, but I would need to see him at least hitting with someone and being forced to hit on the run. Maybe others can see more from this video cause of his footwork and such.

However, I can tell bad when I see it. Weak, panhandle serves. Bad looking forehands. Bodies in weird contortions. I bring this up because many think they are better than they actually are. Many come in here after playing tennis for only a year, and say they're a 4.0. I don't know why, but a lot of people think it's easy to skip 3.0 or 3.5. Are you sure you don't look like one of these guys?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SEjAeJdHeVo&search=tennis%20video

[jackson vile]

I prefered this one http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yia7CbTn__4&search=tennis%20video:mrgreen:


Really though there is nothing like going out and playing pick up games, most tennis players are too afraid to do this but I found it very exciting.

And then people are always full of excuses.


I think that my idea of a 5.0 ect is too high, I haven't even been playing a year and have soundly put away a couple 3.5, I actually found them even easier to play against, it's hard to do anything with a powder puff ball than drop it or rip it sharp angle.

I would like to see some one like BB ect tell us what a 3.0-5.5 should be like?

[Rep. Timothy Calhoun]

I think Marianne is a 4.5. If you read the comments and watch the video, she is a legit 4.5 playing in USTA tournaments in Chicago. So her opponents would also be 4.5, since she looks like she's playing matches in a tournament. But remember that a 4.5 women's equals a 4.0 men's.

The Chinese guys look really good, definitely better than the 2 college players. I can't give a rating to the guy being fed balls for his groundstrokes and volleys. His strokes look decent, but I would need to see him at least hitting with someone and being forced to hit on the run. Maybe others can see more from this video cause of his footwork and such.

However, I can tell bad when I see it. Weak, panhandle serves. Bad looking forehands. Bodies in weird contortions. I bring this up because many think they are better than they actually are. Many come in here after playing tennis for only a year, and say they're a 4.0. I don't know why, but a lot of people think it's easy to skip 3.0 or 3.5. Are you sure you don't look like one of these guys?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SEjAeJdHeVo&search=tennis%20videoDoes the guy in that clip think he's Jimmi Hendrix? What's with the playing of the guitar upside down?

[Rep. Timothy Calhoun]

I prefered this one http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yia7CbTn__4&search=tennis%20video:mrgreen:


Really though there is nothing like going out and playing pick up games, most tennis players are too afraid to do this but I found it very exciting.

And then people are always full of excuses.


I think that my idea of a 5.0 ect is too high, I haven't even been playing a year and have soundly put away a couple 3.5, I actually found them even easier to play against, it's hard to do anything with a powder puff ball than drop it or rip it sharp angle.

I would like to see some one like BB ect tell us what a 3.0-5.5 should be like?Great flick!

[Bungalo Bill]

I prefered this one http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yia7CbTn__4&search=tennis%20video:mrgreen:


Really though there is nothing like going out and playing pick up games, most tennis players are too afraid to do this but I found it very exciting.

And then people are always full of excuses.


I think that my idea of a 5.0 ect is too high, I haven't even been playing a year and have soundly put away a couple 3.5, I actually found them even easier to play against, it's hard to do anything with a powder puff ball than drop it or rip it sharp angle.

I would like to see some one like BB ect tell us what a 3.0-5.5 should be like?

5.0 players

A 5.0 player is an accomplished player. It means that on nearly all strokes (unless they are purposely doing something with the ball) they have full strokes and can hit consistently through the ball. They can keep the ball in play with solid and powerful shots for at least 20 balls or more. In many ways it looks like a long ping pong rally.

These players can also field all kinds of spins and when given the opportunity will make very few mistakes in putting the ball away. They are proficient in moving the ball around, will play percentage tennis, and rarely will put themselves into situations were they make unforced errors.

Their serves are powerful, have mastered spin and control, and possess good placement with their serves.

They know how to strategize and are quick thinkers in tactical play. Their conditioning is usually top notch. Basically, they are past most training regarding their technique and are moving strongly into the mental and match preparation side of the game. They come with weapons.

In doubles, teamwork is very evident. Anywhere from play calling, serve calling, spin calling, and placement calling can be seen. They can use different formations with success and know when to use them at appropriate times depending on the teams style. These players know the net is the place to be but will play back if need be depending on the situation. Usually, they are accomplished volleyers and service returners that possess excellent footwork.


3.5's

A lot of pushers, careful and conservative tennis players, players with so-so to poor technique and unique ways in hitting the ball exist here. You can find out of shape, x-advanced tennis players paying a visit to the "minor" leagues trying to get their timing, conditioning, and game back. These players must move up and will move up when they get these things down.

3.5's usually show broken doubles play but manage to make the game of doubles competitive amongst themselves.. They do not possess good communication and play more individualistic then as a team. Usually there is no play calling and they use basic formations. Lobbing is a well used shot as they can catch many out of shape recreationalists out of position or with poor anticipation.

A lot of players will have good technique on one wing and weird to horrible technique on another wing. Basically, you see a hodge podge of different ways to hit a ball. Players are usually stationary and not moving their feet. They also don't bending their knees and you can see a lot of late reaction to the ball. You will also see a lot of pushers at this level.

3.5's have a hard time handling spin and pace. Although they can execute spin, they have a hard time at times receiving spin. Service returns range from frameballs, to lobs, to decent shots. Nearly all of them have trouble with massive spin serves especially if they twist. Usually, they can also have trouble getting used to a lefty.

[VGP]

I think that my idea of a 5.0 ect is too high, I haven't even been playing a year and have soundly put away a couple 3.5....


hmmmmmm........really?

[Caswell]

hmmmmmm........really?

Who knows. It's pointless to listen to someone self-rate themselves at the club, even more so on the internet. As was said in an earlier post, everyone thinks they're better than they really are.

Hell, I'm an former high school / academy player who still serves and volleys with a first serve percentage around 75%, I don't miss overheads, and I can hit winners all day long off my forehand side on return games. I self rated myself at 3.0 for my first USTA league. I figure if I'm better than that it won't take long to get kicked up.

I wonder about all of these self-proclaimed 4.0's and 4.5's with a year or two under their belts. Do they consider themselves that because they don't get utterly blown off the court by these guys, or are they actually forcing their game on their opponents? That's the true litmus test of where you rank, IMHO.

[tpe11etier]

I'd like to see La Bomba play Marianne. My moneys on Marianne.

[jackson vile]

hmmmmmm........really?


I don't even have a rating so let's just say I am 0, the 3.5's I've played against has very good consistent serves placement speed ect but no kick, at least not as high as mine.

Their forehands were great with lots of spin really fast and hard, but it was easier for me to spin their balls and hit them even harder.

This was much more fun than other people I have played against.

My wife uses a high degree of strategy, lots of angles and just knows what to do exactly when, all of her hits are flat and fast, serve placement where ever you want it.

I am starting with my strategy, just really don't need much of it as I have so much speed and spin, and just naturally really good at the net, my wife always get scared when I go to the net, I don't practice there at all, just feels so natural and I just let it happen.


Also the guys I have played play in tournaments and club tennis

[VGP]

jackson - good to see that you're finding people to hit with....

Also, your wife being a 4.5, you've always got a decent hitting partner nearby.....I'm so envious.....

My wife won't hit with me ever since I spun a slice serve into her belly, knocking the wind out of her......:(

I robbed another video from fellow TTer BeachTennis:

he describes this kid as a 5.0....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PxwALOiEdgc

[jackson vile]

jackson - good to see that you're finding people to hit with....

Also, your wife being a 4.5, you've always got a decent hitting partner nearby.....I'm so envious.....

My wife won't hit with me ever since I spun a slice serve into her belly, knocking the wind out of her......:(

I robbed another video from fellow TTer BeachTennis:

he describes this kid as a 5.0....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PxwALOiEdgc

Oh man it is the other way around for me, my wife trys to kill me when ever I go to the net:o


I don't know that guys does not look 5.0 to me, looks like he hit a heck of a lot of balls out:confused:

[tonysk83]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XwxKxozLGPM&search=tennis

According to the comments, Marianne is rated a 4.5.

That is definitely filmed at Naperville Tennis Club.

[Tezuka Kunimitsu]

I hope he doesn't mind, but fellow TT user edberg505 describes himself as a 5.0

Links:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tskGzNnL93g
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JD6mimdee1s

There was a debate about these guys but they seem 5.0-5.5

Link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZgIsQ-flSEI&search=tennis

These guys seem like 5.5-6.0

Link:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6354574916122791363&q=bun&pl=true

WOw, if they are 5.0 so am I! I am been to hard on myself :)

[35ft6]

I think Marianne is a 4.5. If you read the comments and watch the video, she is a legit 4.5 playing in USTA tournaments in Chicago. So her opponents would also be 4.5, since she looks like she's playing matches in a tournament. But remember that a 4.5 women's equals a 4.0 men's. To me she looks like a female 5.0 to 5.5. It's hard to tell because it's so heavily edited, but she looks as good as most of the girls who were on the varsity team at my university.

[Venetian]

I must say that it is hi-larious to listen to people on this board self-rate themselves. It never gets old. Please keep this post going.

Btw. In case you were wondering, I'm a 5.5 player with with a 4.5 2-handed backhand and no slice backhand, a 7.0 forehand, 5.0 volleys, and a 128mph bomb of a first serve. How do I beat a pusher? Oh, and what's a continental grip?

[shindemac]

Well, I'm not trying to underrate Marianne. She could be higher, I don't know. I saw a couple of videos of girl's hs varsity, and I was quite shocked at the level of play I saw. So it's easily plausible Marianne would be college-level.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-tKCglMIJL8&search=tennis%20video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9q8xE8PCLg&search=tennis%20video

I have a friend that would make mincemeat out of Marianne. She's a transplant from Cally. She has the typical straight take-back, flat forehand with tons of power. She was ranked top 10 or 15 juniors, and I would have to rate her 5.0-5.5.

To the people who think they're 4.5-5.0, do you look like this? This video of the Alabama men's tennis team has already been posted, but I like the perspective. It gives you a better sense of their speed and power rather than the overhead videos.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=db5dWe4l-10&search=tennis%20video

[La Bomba]

I'd like to see La Bomba play Marianne. My moneys on Marianne.
Your only saying that because you probably are Marianne. I would beat her easily.

[35ft6]

To the people who think they're 4.5-5.0, do you look like this? This video of the Alabama men's tennis team has already been posted, but I like the perspective. It gives you a better sense of their speed and power rather than the overhead videos.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=db5dWe4l-10&search=tennis%20video Guys at this level are all 5.5 to 6.0. Their number one could be around 6.5.

[35ft6]

Well, I'm not trying to underrate Marianne. She could be higher, I don't know. I saw a couple of videos of girl's hs varsity, and I was quite shocked at the level of play I saw. So it's easily plausible Marianne would be college-level.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-tKCglMIJL8&search=tennis%20video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9q8xE8PCLg&search=tennis%20video I wouldn't use some terrible high school team as the basis of what you think a college team will be like. There ARE some truly poop college team -- like teams where the number 1 is around 4.5 -- but statistically only the top 5% of high school players will make a college squad. I pulled that percentage out of thin air btw.

The girls team at my school would have absolutely destroyed the girls in those videos. I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't lose a single game.

The first video is hilarious. Heavy metal song + choppy editing to hide the incompetence of the players = funny.

[crosscourt]

In the original three videos, I think that the first guy is just practising, so it's diffcult to say how good he is. The two guys in the middle are clearly good players, but their games seem to lack something -- perhaps its penetration on the serve and variety in the shot making. Its hard to tell from short clips. Anyway, they look like good players and it helps me, who lives in the UK and doesn't understand this 4.0, 5.5 stuff to figure out what's what about rankings. Of the last two guys, the one in the red shirt looks like a really good player. Anticipation and variety built on good technical foundations are what mark him out in my eyes.

[Duzza]

Oh, and what's a continental grip?

i hope that was a joke because otherwise i doubt u have 5.0 volleys

[35ft6]

Anyway, they look like good players and it helps me, who lives in the UK and doesn't understand this 4.0, 5.5 stuff to figure out what's what about rankings. This isn't directed at just you, but these videos will mislead more people that watch them than give them a decent indication of where they stand. You'd have to play one of these guys to really know. The two dudes in the second video are probably way better than you think they are.Of the last two guys, the one in the red shirt looks like a really good player. Anticipation and variety built on good technical foundations are what mark him out in my eyes. Lefties always seem to play tennis with more creativity, greater instinct. Sigh.

[Duzza]

Anyone on this thread who said that people are mislead by the videos is completely correct. The first video posted by VGP most people will go "hmm he's not that good" but in reality, i believe he would be hitting a consistent, speedy deep groundstroke everytime. And he was 5.0, i would probably say i'm 4.0 even though the first time i watched him i would have said i'd beat him

[35ft6]

^ In general, I think people would be surprised by all sorts of stuff about themselves if it were recorded and played back for them. Their jumpshot probably doesn't look as graceful... their singing voice isn't as melodious... their walk isn't as studly... and forget about video taping sex. Yuck.

[astra]

The first video posted by VGP most people will go "hmm he's not that good" but in reality, i believe he would be hitting a consistent, speedy deep groundstroke everytime.
Sure, even if he is playing a little "loose and lazy", it is clear that his groundies are technically sound. I do not like his backhand volley too much, but he may play it better, if focused.
One thing is "artistic impression", other thing is effectiveness. I believe he can be effective, if focused. I think he could be an even opponent to me.

[equinox]

Lol, that girls team sucks!

There no better than B grade women!!#!

I'd send everyone of those lolipop shots back for winners.

[equinox]

Edbergs bh volley is average. Way too big a follow through.

The rest of his game seems ok, i could certainly believe he's 5.0.

[crosscourt]

35ft6 -- the guys in the second video are good players. They seem to have good groundstrokes, reliable serves and are athletic. I agree that the only way to find out how good they are is to play them. The only point I am kind of making is that when I look at someone's game, ususally an opponent, I look to discover what they don't do so well and then exploit it. So looking at two guys running around hitting hard fast strokes of a similar type, doesn't tell me that much about their overall game. At the level at which you hit the ball well so does everyone, so it's about much more than that.

As to how good you look on video, again that depends on how good the opponent is.

My overall thought about the guys in the second video, and the maligned Marianne, is that they all seem to be playing at a level at which tactics and awareness are very likely highly important to their chance of success. Obviously, this goes for averyone up to a point. Marianne may have deficiencies in the way she hits the ball, but if she plays cleverly to her opponents weaknesses, manages her game well, and has an edge in stamina, she may well beat many players who look better. Who knows? The guy in the red shirt in the third video is a different case and looks to be well on top of all aspects of the game, as opposed to being merely on top of the mechanics of the game. His anticipation and movement are very good. I think he looks to have the technique, tactical skill, and anticipation/movement of a very good player.

[35ft6]

^ For a while, in NYC, a teaching pro and I teamed up to start a business in which we made showcase videos for juniors looking to attract a college scholarship.

In general, what I learned, was that when people were being fed balls, it was easy to overestimate how good they were. And when they were playing matches, it was easy to underestimate them.

But mostly, video footage is deceiving because we're used to seeing only top ATP pros playing on TV, anything less seems relatable... if you watch the finals of the Easter Bowl on TV, it's easy for an adult to imagine themselves beating the top 14 year old player in the country, but unless they're a 6.0 level player, they're most likely sadly mistaken.

If you even watch a high level D-1 match, it's very easy to underestimate the shot quality of the players. Again, it really comes down to people watching too many ATP matches on TV. Just as the ATP guys are actually more impressive live in person, so are the guys in these videos. This message not directed at anybody in particular.

[crosscourt]

^ I agree with you. The only point that I am trying to add is that what makes someone a very good player is not just what they do very well, but how well they do the rest of the stuff. Do they have/cover their weaknesses?

[VGP]

Tennis is funny in the sense that spectators are more than willing to attend amateur level and college level sporting events like hockey, basketball, football, baseball, etc. Probably because those are team sports. It's not all on one player. There's a team to back up the deficiencies of any one player.

In tennis, singles, even in doubles, the abilities of the players are on full display.

Since many viewers are very familiar with the abilities of Federer et al. that lesser players (even guys ranked outside the top 50 or top 100) don't capture the attention of viewers.

Even at the lower levels of the pros, I attended the qualifying rounds of Cincinnati a few years ago. That was some of the most competitve tennis I've ever seen.

Me, I like to see people of almost any level play tennis. Just to check out what they do well, what they do not so well. Then turn it around on myself and see what I can take away and work on in my game.

[35ft6]

Even at the lower levels of the pros, I attended the qualifying rounds of Cincinnati a few years ago. That was some of the most competitve tennis I've ever seen. Me too. In fact, sometimes it's more fun to watch a lower level of tennis. The Kalamazoo tournament was great fun to watch. I also love mismatches, which is why I love the US Open qualifiers. It's awesome to see top college and junior players getting smoked by ATP journeymen. One of the funnest matches I ever saw was Jan Vacek ripping Alex Kim back in 2000 or 1999, almost despite himself. I think he felt bad for Alex so Jan started making faces, like really over-acting, trying to behave as if he was having the tennis day of his entire life.

[jamauss]

Who are the guys in the 2nd video - the ones playing on the indoor court? They look pretty darn good - high level college players at least - 5.5 to 6.0 in my book. I'd love to get the chance to hit with somebody of that caliber.

[snoflewis]

Who are the guys in the 2nd video - the ones playing on the indoor court? They look pretty darn good - high level college players at least - 5.5 to 6.0 in my book. I'd love to get the chance to hit with somebody of that caliber.

if you're talking about the one w/ the 2 chinese guys, one of them is in the ATP...i believe in the top 200 or so.

[jamauss]

nope - talking about the first two guys. The clip that runs about 7 minutes.

[Venetian]

Two freshmen from Washington I believe. There was a post about that video awhile back.

[AngeloDS]

Videos don't really say much. Watching it from the side, or seeing it in real life is a whole 'nother story. It's funny hearing how people say they can take on top pros just from watching them on TV and think they can play better :s.

I know the depth of tennis. Having seen pros play, having seen DI college play, playing against several DIII colleges, being in college tennis, seeing my coaches who are 5.0, 5.5 play and other various things.

It's not about the strokes but more about the matches. And many here, the complaint is "I have the best strokes but I lost to a pusher... I'm a 4.5."

Self-rating is usually never close to where you should be.

[shindemac]

Angelo, are you a 5.0 yet?

[Zeph]

he describes this kid as a 5.0....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PxwALOiEdgc

That guy is not 5.0

Sure some of his shots are out but a 5.0 would never spray the shots he did off of volley feeds.

[AngeloDS]

Shin, getting there slowly heh. Maybe 2-3 years down the road before I start doing very well in that level. During the summer I'll be heading to the UW camp hopefully, working with my coaches and doing a lot of physical training for next years season.

Uhh and that video ^^. A 5.0 has a lot more control, they can hit the same shot several times and be incredibly consistent from anywhere on the baseline and all their strokes look nearly identical. Even when they hit power shots, there's still have a lot of control. With feeds like that, you shouldn't miss one single ball or even hit outside the lines.

[damasta55]

That guy is not 5.0

Sure some of his shots are out but a 5.0 would never spray the shots he did off of volley feeds.

I' d say 4.3-4.5.

[35ft6]

That guy is not 5.0

Sure some of his shots are out but a 5.0 would never spray the shots he did off of volley feeds. Yeah, if he can't make 95% of his shots when they're being fed right to him... 4.0 or so. His game would completely fall apart if he had to hit on the move. He's barely getting them in under optimal conditions.

[jackabee]

I' d say 4.3-4.5.

4.0 - I think that his shots lack accuracy and that not much goes into each shot!

Do we know how old this geez is?

[Zeph]

his strokes seem kinda rushed, without much control.

[Duzza]

That guy is not 5.0

Sure some of his shots are out but a 5.0 would never spray the shots he did off of volley feeds.
If ratings were based on strokes this guy would be so high! He's damn consistent with them and they're seriously fast

[35ft6]

If ratings were based on strokes this guy would be so high! He's damn consistent with them and they're seriously fast He's not that good, dude. He's hitting as hard as he can and it's not that impressive. His accuracy and consistency is about 4.0 to low 4.5.

[metsjets]

that guy looks like he's just learning an open stance...you guys think he's a 4.5? i definitely think my strokes and footwork are much better than his...but i thought i was a 4.0 :)

[35ft6]

^ Would have to see him play. I have a feeling his strokes completely fall apart in a match. His forehand leads me to believe he can't handle pace at all, and his body suggests he can't move that well. Probably 4.0.

[Honestlybad]

It's easy to hit nice when someone is feeding you balls. Even though he is having balls fed to him, he still makes mitakes which is not a good sighn. Still you'd have to see him play a match to know for sure. He might be 5.0 but most likely isn't.

[35ft6]

No way he's 5.0.

[GuyClinch]

A big problem with videos is that some camera angles rob you of the feel of what is really going on, IMHO. I think the best angle is the one that kind of sits behind the player but at a lower angle - so you see the balls coming at him and such. You rarely see that on TV - though I don't know why.

If you watched that show "bragging rights" on the tennis channel they featured a 4.5 and a 5.0 going at it after some coaching from the 'greats.' These guys were very good players and you could tell from the video.. The 5.0 was the local texas 'club champion" BTW. So I mean 5.0 is a very good player..

Pete

[35ft6]

If you watched that show "bragging rights" on the tennis channel they featured a 4.5 and a 5.0 going at it after some coaching from the 'greats.' These guys were very good players and you could tell from the video.. The 5.0 was the local texas 'club champion" BTW. So I mean 5.0 is a very good player..

Pete Yo, they stole this idea from me!!! :mrgreen:

[guernica1]

No record of the Chinese players in any futures or satellite events from the itf website as far as I could tell. They could be collegiate players in China though; looks similar to high level D1 that I've seen. Overall fitness and physical attributes like height, weight, natural speed begins to make more of a big difference at at separating the higher levels, whereas general stroke mechanics are more of a difference at determining the lower level 3 - 3.5 - 4.0, just my take on it.

[pushing_wins]

I hope he doesn't mind, but fellow TT user edberg505 describes himself as a 5.0

Links:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tskGzNnL93g
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JD6mimdee1s

There was a debate about these guys but they seem 5.0-5.5

Link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZgIsQ-flSEI&search=tennis

These guys seem like 5.5-6.0

Link:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6354574916122791363&q=bun&pl=true

D1 player is only a 5.0

get out of town

[LowProfile]

D1 player is only a 5.0

get out of town

A D1 college player from a crappy D1 school playing #6 singles is a 5.0. Some of the better players (especially the number ones) from the higher ranked schools are at least 6.0's.

[dave333]

my parents have a friends whose daughter is supposedly "extremely good" I got to play her yesterday. i think that she is better than those in the video of the high school team of girls. her serve had some good movement and was very consistent but was very slow. she stood way too close to the service line to handle the pace or kick of my serve. her groundies were fairly solid on a few of my weak blocks on the run, but she can't handle high pace like on my backhand or serve or high spin on my forehand and kick. mentally not taht good either; i was winning 5-1, just quits. overall, i think facing a pusher is much more difficult, even if she was technically sound.

[kevhen]

Marianne does look like a 5.0 college women's player who would beat most 4.0 men but likely lose to most 4.5 guys. I would like to play her.

[fishuuuuu]

A D1 college player from a crappy D1 school playing #6 singles is a 5.0. Some of the better players (especially the number ones) from the higher ranked schools are at least 6.0's.

If you are talking about the second video then you should probably know that it was rumoured those two guys play for the UW team.

[bribeiro]

lol nevermind