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Lindros13
05-21-2006, 08:44 AM
Do most serve and volleyers come in after the second serve as well? With a decent topspin second serve at a 4.5 level, is it a good thing in your opinion? Obviosly it depends upon how good your second serve is, and also how good of a s/v game you have.

What do most S/V's do?

AndyP
05-21-2006, 09:46 AM
The second serve gives you more time to approach the net, but it is also easier for your opponent to pass you. So it really depends on the player you are playing against.

Rickson
05-21-2006, 09:52 AM
Do most serve and volleyers come in after the second serve as well? With a decent topspin second serve at a 4.5 level, is it a good thing in your opinion? Obviosly it depends upon how good your second serve is, and also how good of a s/v game you have.

What do most S/V's do?
I don't, but most serve and volleyers in the ATP come in on their 2nd. Depth and pace are the keys for me so if I serve to the line and get decent pace, I'll come in on the 2nd, but if the ball lands in the middle of the box or shorter, I'll stay back.

theartoftennis
05-21-2006, 03:30 PM
Most better SVers at the 4.5 lvl can kick you up high on the backhand, which usually sets up an easy volley.

kevhen
05-22-2006, 05:17 AM
When I serve and volley which is maybe 10% of the time, I will also follow my second serve in, since I put alot of spin on it so it's similar to my first serve when serve and volleying. I figure if you are going to serve and volley you might as well go on your second as well since aren't expected to win as many points on your second serve and it puts pressure on the opponent to hit a good low return. I tend to S&V when up in the match and possibly up in the game too, so it's low risk and helps keep the opponent on edge and not knowing what I will be doing in the future so he may miss some future returns thinking that I might be coming in.

chess9
05-22-2006, 05:36 AM
It depends on the opposition. My second serve is only about 80 mph or so. I will usually kick it or slice it wide. But, with such a slow-paced serve, most players above about 3.5 can whack it by you pretty easily so I don't think it's a percentage play given this set of facts, even though my volleys are by far the strongest part of my game. However, I will, on occasion come in on a second serve when I've hit a hard kick to the opponent's backhand. I never will come in when I try to hit wide to the forehand or down the T to a right-hander because sometimes you just serve it in the slot and he kills the ball.

Good luck with that.

-Robert

nViATi
05-22-2006, 06:27 AM
It depends on the opposition. My second serve is only about 80 mph or so. I will usually kick it or slice it wide. But, with such a slow-paced serve, most players above about 3.5 can whack it by you pretty easily so I don't think it's a percentage play given this set of facts, even though my volleys are by far the strongest part of my game. However, I will, on occasion come in on a second serve when I've hit a hard kick to the opponent's backhand. I never will come in when I try to hit wide to the forehand or down the T to a right-hander because sometimes you just serve it in the slot and he kills the ball.

Good luck with that.

-Robert
80MPH is about as fast as a pro's second serve isn't it?

kevhen
05-22-2006, 06:33 AM
Well Agassi hits just over 90mph on his. Most pros hit over 100. The women hit about 80 on their seconds except for Hingis and Navritolova that hit more like 60-70mph.

My second is like 70-90mph depending on the amount of spin I add.

Bungalo Bill
05-22-2006, 07:13 AM
The women hit about 80 on their seconds except for Hingis and Navritolova that hit more like 60-70mph.

My second is like 70-90mph depending on the amount of spin I add.

So your second is like a woman's serve? LOL What a nut.

kevhen
05-22-2006, 07:18 AM
Yeah, it's like a pro woman's serve. It's not bad, tons of spin, either top or slice. No need for any putdowns, Bill. Why don't you video your serve for all to see?

I used a cheap digital camera to video these. You can do the same!
My 70mph Dementieva slice serve http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=12/35311054331.gif&s=x11
Flatter power serve (100-110mph) http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=12/35311040164.gif&s=x11

naturalgut
05-22-2006, 07:20 AM
Most of the S & V players now come in only on their 1st serve on most surfaces, apart from Taylor Dent who comes in on every serve. However, quite a few players S & V 100% on grass as it is traditionally a faster surface with a less predictable bounce. If I remember correctly, Pat Rafter in the early years of his career came in on every serve, but became more selective later on.

Bungalo Bill
05-22-2006, 08:16 AM
Yeah, it's like a pro woman's serve. It's not bad, tons of spin, either top or slice. No need for any putdowns,

Putdowns? LOL, spoken from the true putdown artist! More coming.

Bill. Why don't you video your serve for all to see?

Why? I have the lousiest serve in the world. I can't hit it worth a darn and it only goes about 30 mph. Why would I ever want to show that serve.

I used a cheap digital camera to video these. You can do the same!
My 70mph Dementieva slice serve http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=12/35311054331.gif&s=x11
Flatter power serve (100-110mph) http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=12/35311040164.gif&s=x11

Yikes, LOL, you do kind of have a woman's motion. I would say 3.5ish.

chess9
05-22-2006, 08:25 AM
So your second is like a woman's serve? LOL What a nut.

Hey! Are you talking about me? :)
I resemble that remark, sorry to say. But, at 63 I take what I can get....

-Robert

Bungalo Bill
05-22-2006, 08:30 AM
Hey! Are you talking about me? :)
I resemble that remark, sorry to say. But, at 63 I take what I can get....

-Robert

Hahaha, I bet your serve looks better than Kevhen', his needs some work. ;)

Andres
05-22-2006, 08:30 AM
Hey! Are you talking about me? :)
I resemble that remark, sorry to say. But, at 63 I take what I can get....

-Robert
We shouldn't be ashamed. The Williamses, Sharapova and Davenport can probably outserve me everytime :mrgreen:

Bungalo Bill
05-22-2006, 08:31 AM
We shouldn't be ashamed. The Williamses, Sharapova and Davenport can probably outserve me everytime :mrgreen:

LOL, good point! They also have the grunting I don't have! :(

Andres
05-22-2006, 08:39 AM
Why would you? The grunting it's annoying ;)
Last night I was training, and in the court next to us, there was this guy who grunted... mod. loudly ... but he screamed his *** off each time he commited an UE.

A huge voice from such a little guy. At one point (after the first hour and a half of practice), we were JUST about to go to that guy, and beat the crap out of him. At least, he would have a REASON to scream.

Eventually, he left the courts, and we could finish the hour and a half left of the practice.

Bungalo Bill
05-22-2006, 08:57 AM
Why would you? The grunting it's annoying ;)
Last night I was training, and in the court next to us, there was this guy who grunted... mod. loudly ... but he screamed his *** off each time he commited an UE.

A huge voice from such a little guy. At one point (after the first hour and a half of practice), we were JUST about to go to that guy, and beat the crap out of him. At least, he would have a REASON to scream.

Eventually, he left the courts, and we could finish the hour and a half left of the practice.

I knew a player that would say "HUT, HUT, HUT, HUT" on any ball he had to chase down. It was so funny it became distracting. I saw players falling down laughing. Quite a secret weapon the guy had. :)

Woodstock_Tennis
05-22-2006, 09:07 AM
lol there's this group of guys who are into thier 60's and always seem to be around, whenever they have to run a ball down they just start yelling out what seems to be names.

Ball goes cross court, runs after and yells JERRRRYYYY, other guy takes off and yells GARRRYYYYY. Yet to ask them what they are saying or why, but pretty funny to listen to.

Bungalo Bill
05-22-2006, 09:19 AM
lol there's this group of guys who are into thier 60's and always seem to be around, whenever they have to run a ball down they just start yelling out what seems to be names.

Ball goes cross court, runs after and yells JERRRRYYYY, other guy takes off and yells GARRRYYYYY. Yet to ask them what they are saying or why, but pretty funny to listen to.

LOL, amazing.

AngeloDS
05-22-2006, 09:37 AM
You need a well placed kicking serve to their backhands to come in and volley. A flat serve or a topspin serve might not be good since they're a bit easier to deal with and you can rip right through them (most people attack on the second serve). Plus, serve and volley a lot of people don't realize that it's a percentage game as well. You'll win and lose some, so you need to tactically know when you're going to come in and also know where the return might land and be there.

coach
05-22-2006, 09:58 AM
Kevhen----
great video--- with the 2nd "power serve" I noticed that your right leg come up a lot- but good for getting your weight into the court which is where you end up.
I have only seen my serve once on video-- it was quite an eyeopener-- in a depressing way!

you know most people are hung up on MPH of the serve. Like another poster noted about Agassi's serve, mixing it up, moving it around is also very affective. If a pitcher just threw 92mph fastballs for every pitch it wouldn't be as effective.

BTW, I noticed that both those courts looked like they were inside Kevhen.... (in Iowa huh?) Come visit us out west in CA.... sunny when you can get to the courts through the smog filled graffiti overpass gridlock traffic!

TennisAsAlways
05-22-2006, 10:49 AM
About Kevhen's serve, there are several things that could be pointed out for correction, but since this thread is not about him seeking advice for improvement, I will not go into detailed analysis.

Kevhen, one thing I'll point out on your flat serve is that you are not stretching up your tossing arm. It looks like you release the ball way before your left arm is fully extended, too, which is something that you should not be doing.

kevhen
05-22-2006, 11:17 AM
yeah I guess my 3.5 level serve, by Bill's standards, needs some work. My vollies need even more! Sorry, if I have ever put you down Bill.

I do hold about half my service games against 4.5 rated guys but only break about 20% against those same guys so my return must really suck!!!!

Putdowns? LOL, spoken from the true putdown artist! More coming.
I didn't know I was a putdown artist but I know I can be critical at times. Do you remember what I said when I put someone else down?

Bungalo Bill
05-22-2006, 11:26 AM
yeah I guess my 3.5 level serve by Bill's standards needs some work. My vollies need even more! Sorry if I have ever put you down Bill.

Sorry if I ever put you down? Man, dude, you are a weird one. Read your posts! You sound like the other cry baby that has me on "ignore" off and on.

Oh, sorry to say pal, but your serve does need work. What did you expect? lol

kevhen
05-22-2006, 11:29 AM
Isn't the goal to have a consistent ball toss? So would my toss be even more consistent by releasing when the arm is fully extended? I guess if my toss was inconsistent that would be something to look at changing. Otherwise it might just throw my timing off. I might have one bad toss in every 10-15 serves and can still sometimes get those to land in. Is that good or bad?

kevhen
05-22-2006, 11:31 AM
I don't remember putting you down, but just pointed out that 2 back in doubles when returning can and does work in modern tennis since most players have better baseline games than net games these days. I just argue my points as I see them, but when you feel threatened, you often resort to name calling and belittling rather than just stating the facts that you know and letting it go.

joe sch
05-22-2006, 11:34 AM
Bill. Why don't you video your serve for all to see?

I have seen the BB serve.
He is big lefty, has excellent form and gets some nasty lefty kick on it.
It puts the serve I saw on your video to shame in comparison.

kevhen
05-22-2006, 11:35 AM
It would be awesome to have some video of it so we could all try to emulate it!

joe sch
05-22-2006, 11:44 AM
It would be awesome to have some video of it so we could all try to emulate it!
People post videos because they realize they need help, well maybe some think they are showing off :) Its sounding like you just want him to post a video so you can attempt to put him down ? He knows what he is talking about and does not need video footage to back it up.

Mike Cottrill
05-22-2006, 12:09 PM
Kevhen,

Isn't the goal to have a consistent ball toss? So would my toss be even more consistent by releasing when the arm is fully extended

If you are getting the MPH and the spin on that serve, I can only imagine what you would get with some changes. The question you need to ask yourself is do you want to improve.

Bungalo Bill
05-22-2006, 12:36 PM
It would be awesome to have some video of it so we could all try to emulate it!

Kevhen,

About the only claim to fame I have is playing in college and passing the USPTA's serving test with flying colors. I know it doesn't sound like much and to me it sort of is and it isn't.

But why would you want to imitate my serve when there are professionals that serve way better than me? It sort of does sound like you want to do something negative with it.

Plus, Kevhen, I would rather coach than play. This old body is so banged up I cant even go for a 2 mile run without having a lot of pain the next day - and it isn't muscle pain. If your body allows you to play tennis, on an on-going basis, then shut the hell up and listen to those that have been there and done that.

I don't ever think I have asked Vic Braden or John Yandell to prove their serve, so I could poke fun at it when they offer their advice and insight on how to make other player's serves better than theirs.

You just don't make much sense.

kevhen
05-22-2006, 01:38 PM
So I should go straight from serving like a 3.5 to trying to serve like a professional? Or aren't there any gradual steps in between?

I guess I live too close to Missouri where they prefer people to show them rather than just tell them how to do things.

ta11geese3
05-22-2006, 03:16 PM
Just watched the clips... I have to say I am surprised... this whole time, Kevhen, I assumed you were a teenager because of your posts... o_O

Bungalo Bill
05-22-2006, 04:44 PM
So I should go straight from serving like a 3.5 to trying to serve like a professional? Or aren't there any gradual steps in between?

I guess I live too close to Missouri where they prefer people to show them rather than just tell them how to do things.

Yeah, and I woke up yesterday. I have demonstrated enough here and continue to demonstrate that I would rather coach than play. Did you have your football coach throw passes for you until you got it? Did you have your baseball coach pitch for you so you could "get it"? And really who cares about MY serve as the model?

Bottom-line: You are the very first person on this board over the years that I really don't care to help. :mrgreen:

I think you would be better off getting help from the others that post here. I am sure you will get good tips.

Gidday mate.

vinouspleasure
05-22-2006, 08:21 PM
are you really getting those speeds with that motion? I don`t have an axe to grind but it does look like a 3.5 serve.

Bungalo Bill
05-22-2006, 08:27 PM
are you really getting those speeds with that motion? I don`t have an axe to grind but it does look like a 3.5 serve.

It is a 3.5 serve, maybe 4.0 and no he is not getting those speeds. Maybe on occasion he will pop one, but that form has some issues. Oh, I always have an axe to grind. :mrgreen:

str33t
05-22-2006, 08:31 PM
you'd need a good kick serve to come into the net on a second.

Mike Cottrill
05-22-2006, 08:36 PM
It is a 3.5 serve, maybe 4.0 and no he is not getting those speeds. Maybe on occasion he will pop one, but that form has some issues. Oh, I always have an axe to grind. :mrgreen:
Bill,
I wonder too .,, but he is 6’4”. I’ll give a few mph for that :;

vinouspleasure
05-22-2006, 08:40 PM
It is a 3.5 serve, maybe 4.0 and no he is not getting those speeds. Maybe on occasion he will pop one, but that form has some issues. Oh, I always have an axe to grind. :mrgreen:

Its hard to imagine any consistency as well. not to pile on kehven, but I think you may have a foot fault problem too.

Hey, I remember way back when you didn`t have an axe to grind.

Bungalo Bill
05-22-2006, 08:47 PM
Hey, I remember way back when you didn`t have an axe to grind.

LOL, probably during a time I was hallucinating or something. There are only a few people I really don't care for here. I know it doesn't seem like that but it is true. ;)

Bungalo Bill
05-22-2006, 08:50 PM
Bill,
I wonder too .,, but he is 6’4”. I’ll give a few mph for that :;

Yeah but the problem is he is 6'4". I am 6' 2". He should be getting way more from his serve and I really dont see the arm speed or "crack" in the ball that makes me think - wow, that is a hard serve.

Players at 3.5 have that serve. I guess it would be difficult to determine his placement and consistency but his form is not that good and needs work.

It is not that I don't think he has potential to have a great serve, it is just this serve didn't show much.

travlerajm
05-22-2006, 09:19 PM
Most of the S & V players now come in only on their 1st serve on most surfaces, apart from Taylor Dent who comes in on every serve. However, quite a few players S & V 100% on grass as it is traditionally a faster surface with a less predictable bounce. If I remember correctly, Pat Rafter in the early years of his career came in on every serve, but became more selective later on.

Sampras went the other way late in his career - At first he would stay back on most 2nd serves on hard court, but he was serve-and-volleying on amost every serve the last two years.

kevhen
05-23-2006, 04:42 AM
I moved back a couple more inches so I don't think I footfault anymore as I pivot my left foot forward but I don't watch my foot when I am serving so I am not sure.

My consistency is roughly equal the percentage + speed = 150. So if I try to hit 110 then my consistency is about 40%. If I hit about 70mph then my consistency is about 80%.

My serve hold to break differential is about 30% (65/35 against an equal) so I think that would point to my serve being stronger than the rest of my game which is 4.0 rated.

I would still like to see Bill's serve on video to compare and see what good form looks like. If Bill's serve is not perfect then maybe he would like some pointers to help improve it unless he has already retired from the game at 46 and just likes to coach.

Bungalo Bill
05-23-2006, 05:57 AM
I would still like to see Bill's serve on video to compare and see what good form looks like.

Here is good form.

http://www.uspta.com/html/e-lesson-Flat%20serve.swf

Copy that.

If Bill's serve is not perfect then maybe he would like some pointers to help improve it unless he has already retired from the game at 46 and just likes to coach.

Now why would I like some pointers from you? LOL!!! That is the funniest thing I have ever heard!

If I want pointers, I would not go to you! I would send my film elsewhere.

But isnt that what I said? That I would rather coach now? Should I run to Vic Braden and tell him "unless you have perfect form and have it on film, I won't listen, cause I am a jackass." What a stupid response that would be? Much like your idiotic response.

Haven't I been saying this for YEARS!!!!!!! Do you see "FORMER USPTA PRO?" Haven't you read that I DONT ENTER TOURNAMENTS DUE TO FAMILY COMMITTMENTS? DONT YOU SEE THAT I DO KNOW WHAT I AM TALKING ABOUT? WHERE DO YOU THINK THE KNOWLEDGE COMES FROM?????

You have a 3.5 serve and it needs work. :cool:

Are you that much of a nit-wit to not understand that?

kevhen
05-23-2006, 06:05 AM
OK, sorry for being a nit-wit. Thanks for the video link.

equinox
05-23-2006, 07:12 AM
Who's serve is better? I'd say kevhen's. Because he makes better use of his whole body in his serve. Look at his long jumper stride! up up and away!

Kevhen:
http://x11.putfile.com.nyud.net:8090/12/35311040164.gif

ME:
http://home.iprimus.com.au.nyud.net:8090/jgallus/tennis/serve%20from%20side.gif
http://home.iprimus.com.au.nyud.net:8090/jgallus/tennis/serve%20from%20behind.gif

BTW i slowed the video down a touch to give a better view of my serve. My serves a little faster than shown. And was a pretty casual serve.

BB you should layoff Kevhen. Not everyone can reach the dizzying heights of college tennis or be a coach to the stars.

kevhen
05-23-2006, 07:16 AM
Thanks, do you play 3.5 matches, Equinox?

equinox
05-23-2006, 07:26 AM
I'm not sure about ntrp.
I just play local district grade.
I'm competitive at A Reserve district level.
A mate of mine plays grade 3 vic pennant and i can ocassionally take sets off him. We have fairly close matches.
I'd get beaten by most decent itn 4's, ntrp 5.0 probably 6-3.
I lost to 450th AR in my country 6-0,7-5 in open tourny.

I'm not that good, plenty of weaknesses in my game, especially 1hb and 2nd serve.

vinouspleasure
05-23-2006, 08:46 AM
>>My serve hold to break differential is about 30% (65/35 against an equal) so I >>think that would point to my serve being stronger than the rest of my game >>which is 4.0 rated.

- Well, someone said there are liars, damn liars and statisticians. Lets say the average pro holds 75% of the time (I have the actual statistic somewhere). Does that mean the average pro has a stronger serve than the rest of their game? No, it means the server has an advantage. Kehven if you're getting broken twice a set on average, I would argue your serve is weaker than your level, not stronger.

- when you say the rest of your game is 4.0 rated, what do you mean? typically, parts of your game are not rated individually. Is your nrtp computer rating 4.0?

bb, hard on the issues, soft on the person...

kevhen
05-23-2006, 08:54 AM
My NTRP is computer rated 4.0. Does a typical 4.0 hold serve way more often than break serve? I usually thought at the 3.5 level it was about 50/50 while at the 4.0 level the serve starts to improve so 4.0's on average maybe hold serve like 55% of the time.

Don't the pros on average just hold about 75% of the time? I guess it depends on surface but on hardcourt 75% sounds about right. Anyone know the exact numbers for all pros service game win %?

chess9
05-23-2006, 08:59 AM
>>My serve hold to break differential is about 30% (65/35 against an equal) so I >>think that would point to my serve being stronger than the rest of my game >>which is 4.0 rated.

- Well, someone said there are liars, damn liars and statisticians. Lets say the average pro holds 75% of the time (I have the actual statistic somewhere). Does that mean the average pro has a stronger serve than the rest of their game? No, it means the server has an advantage. Kehven if you're getting broken twice a set on average, I would argue your serve is weaker than your level, not stronger.

- when you say the rest of your game is 4.0 rated, what do you mean? typically, parts of your game are not rated individually. Is your nrtp computer rating 4.0?

bb, hard on the issues, soft on the person...

It depends why he is being broken. Is he double-faulting? Is he missing his ground strokes or volleys after return of serve? I'd have to see a charted analysis of his game. Maybe he should do that.

I don't think Kehven's serve is 4.0, btw, unless it is much harder than it appears. (It might be, because he looks to be about 6'1" tall.) The video angle isn't good though. I would understand why the rest of his game may be ragged because after the serve he demonstrates an inability to bend his knees and actually looks like he's thinking about something else. :)

-Robert

Woodstock_Tennis
05-23-2006, 09:18 AM
Serve seems very awkward to me, almost like you jump into the ball without bending your knees, I donít see that ball going 100+ but I could be wrong.

jamumafa
05-23-2006, 09:29 AM
I'm 16 and i hit a 100 MPH serve - with little to no weight training. Second goes in at about 60. So I think thats pretty good, no?

drakulie
05-23-2006, 09:33 AM
Kehven, although your "form" may not be beautiful and may need some "fine tuning", as others who have quickly put you down have posted..... I belive it is a very good serve for the level you play in. Forget about the way it looks and focus on the "end product". If your serve wins you free points and you are able to hold serve most of the time, then forget about the negativity. If your serve accomplishes these things then it is an effective serve no matter how it "looks".

Shen Shalken (not sure if I spelled that correctly), has one of the ugliest serves I have ever seen and yet he was a top pro.

The number 1 guy in the league I play in (4.5-5.0) has a "frying pan" serve. He hits about 40-50 mph with no spin. His sevre is simply a tool to start the point. He places it and that's it. Yet, the rest of his game is above and beyond everyone elses.

My point is, there is not one person on this board who is going to win the US Open or coach anyone who is going to win the US Open regardless of how "pretty" their serve looks.

Roddick The Beast
05-23-2006, 09:41 AM
Blah blah. . . You act like you are the good guy by acting like: "OO, everyone put you down, but me, I'm encouraging you." Blah blah. . .

Put a sock in in. :mrgreen:

Tell it like it IS. If he wants to get better, he needs to know what he lacks.

tennisplayer
05-23-2006, 01:29 PM
Hey Kevhen, if I may be so bold as to critique your serve... even though you may be serving faster/better than me... :-)

I think you are approaching the ball too square, almost as if you are serving with an eastern forehand grip. At 6'4" you can probably get a lot more action on the serve by staying sideways longer, and serving with a continental grip. In the trophy position, you should get the feeling of expanding/opening out your chest. It took a long time for me to get that feeling, and I finally got a feeling for the technique by looking at and emulating Edberg's serve. Edberg sticks out his right hand almost straight back in the trophy pose! I had to do that to finally get used to opening the chest, but the results were amazing. As the next step, I added some pronation (or "wrist snap", as some folks call it). I went from not being to hit the backfence on first bounce to always hitting it on first bounce, and sometimes up to four feet high. Spin also increased a lot. But I'm only 5'10" and 160lbs, so I definitely have limits that are way lower than a taller guy.

Good luck, man!

Roddick The Beast
05-23-2006, 04:04 PM
Hey Equinox, what's the deal with your serve? :mrgreen: . . . it doesn't look like you have a fully abbreviated takeback like Roddick, nor does it look like you have a full windmill takeback like Federer of Sampras. Am I right on this? Can someone please give me their opinion?. . . am I alone on this????

vinouspleasure
05-23-2006, 06:47 PM
My NTRP is computer rated 4.0. Does a typical 4.0 hold serve way more often than break serve? I usually thought at the 3.5 level it was about 50/50 while at the 4.0 level the serve starts to improve so 4.0's on average maybe hold serve like 55% of the time.


I don`t know what the statistics are like but my sense is that 4.0 players hold more than 55% of the time. I wouldn`t be totally surprised to see a number closer to the pros...the pros have better serves and better returns but it may be the same at every level.

Additionally, at the 4.0 level, a 100mph serve would be a huge weapon. I`m having a hard time putting your motion, hold pct and mph together...

equinox
05-23-2006, 11:03 PM
Hey Equinox, what's the deal with your serve? :mrgreen: . . . it doesn't look like you have a fully abbreviated takeback like Roddick, nor does it look like you have a full windmill takeback like Federer of Sampras. Am I right on this? Can someone please give me their opinion?. . . am I alone on this????
That's my old serve. It's generally really good or really horrible somedays.

I can't do the "windmill" cut the toes off takeback. I can't seem ti time it with the toss.

My current serve is very much simplfied. Bring racket up trophy position + turn side on., toss ball, hit ball. I'm still working on this serves finer details.
Jury's still out..

Bungalo Bill
05-24-2006, 06:14 AM
Hey Kevhen, if I may be so bold as to critique your serve... even though you may be serving faster/better than me... :-)

I think you are approaching the ball too square, almost as if you are serving with an eastern forehand grip.

Wow, Tennisplayer great insight. I will give you a hint, is the body going up and out? Or is it moving more parallel with the court.

Is the arm in the shoulder area able to completely relax? Can the arm during a continuous motion collapse behind the hitting shoulder of the player? If not, why? Is rotation and the non-dominant arm working to accelerate the arm or is it passive? What about the hip area? What's goin on there? Leg propulsion is it starting and then dissapting because of the hitch in the arm motion????

Is the ball really being cracked or is it kind of being pushed?

Bungalo Bill
05-24-2006, 06:19 AM
OK, sorry for being a nit-wit. Thanks for the video link.

That's okay we need nit-wit's in this world. :) You should never ever leave your wing man. ;)

kevhen
05-24-2006, 06:21 AM
I said my hold percent was 65% against equals which I consider strong 4.0s, other guys who play #1 for their club. Against a typical 4.0 it would be more like 75% with me breaking about 45% of the time as well.

Here are my winter results:
http://national.usta.com/leagues/Reports/TennisLinkReports.asp?Level=I&MemberID=DB007867E0D09036B584FB2A09783F7E1C&CYear=2006

joe sch
05-24-2006, 06:46 AM
I said my hold percent was 65% against equals which I consider strong 4.0s, other guys who play #1 for their club. Against a typical 4.0 it would be more like 75% with me breaking about 45% of the time as well.

Here are my winter results:
http://national.usta.com/leagues/Reports/TennisLinkReports.asp?Level=I&MemberID=DB007867E0D09036B584FB2A09783F7E1C&CYear=2006

Kevhen, Your trying to impress us all again.
This is frustrating because many knowledgable players/coaches on this board have attempted to give you sound advice and it appears you want to argue. I will not even bother with most of the post and request free advice players.

Sincerely, Joe

kevhen
05-24-2006, 06:54 AM
Thanks to all the good advice on here, I am still improving, and expect to be rated 4.5 by the end of next year if not this year, thanks all and keep hitting the courts!

Roddick The Beast
05-24-2006, 07:12 AM
That's my old serve. It's generally really good or really horrible somedays.

I can't do the "windmill" cut the toes off takeback. I can't seem ti time it with the toss.

My current serve is very much simplfied. Bring racket up trophy position + turn side on., toss ball, hit ball. I'm still working on this serves finer details.
Jury's still out..Thanks, but am I still right? Is it JUST me thinking that you have a "mixed" takeback?

Did anyone else notice that Equinox's takeback is neither "fully" abbreviated nor fully "wind"? So it's neither like Federer's nor Roddick's takeback? Anyone, please?


Just want to know IF I am alone on this. I don't thnk I am that crazy! :mrgreen:

Mike Cottrill
05-24-2006, 08:07 AM
Kevhen, Your trying to impress us all again.
This is frustrating because many knowledgable players/coaches on this board have attempted to give you sound advice and it appears you want to argue. I will not even bother with most of the post and request free advice players.

Sincerely, Joe

Kevin,
You have the height and body advantage. You have all that potential but you are not taking advantage of it. Is there a reason you do not want to make any changes?
Regards
Mike

kevhen
05-24-2006, 08:31 AM
My groundstrokes and volleys are weaker than my serve so I spend more time working on them. I guess no one on this forum except TCJackson has tried to return my serve. My serve, especially my second serve, has improved since playing him. No one I have ever played has ever said that I have a weak serve. My weaknesses are my forehand topspin and backhand volley.

Even with the best serve in the world and no groundstrokes to back it up, you are likely to lose most tiebreakers as Ivo Karlovic does.

Mike Cottrill
05-24-2006, 08:45 AM
My groundstrokes and volleys are weaker than my serve so I spend more time working on them. I guess no one on this forum except TCJackson has tried to return my serve. My serve, especially my second serve, has improved since playing him. No one I have ever played has ever said that I have a weak serve. My weaknesses are my forehand topspin and backhand volley.

Even with the best serve in the world and no groundstrokes to back it up, you are likely to lose most tiebreakers as Ivo Karlovic does.

wishing you the best of improvements.

vinouspleasure
05-24-2006, 10:14 AM
Kevhen, Your trying to impress us all again.


I'm impressed, thats a good record at 4.0...you must be doing something or other right.

I really think this is a bizarre place to ask for advice. Giving people the benefit of the doubt, perhaps 20% of the people here are qualified to give advice (and thats probably a gross overstatement). You don't know which is which. There is limited data (often can't see where ball lands, spin on ball, speed of ball, sound of ball on strings...).

I don't get it...

Bungalo Bill
05-24-2006, 10:52 AM
I'm impressed, thats a good record at 4.0...you must be doing something or other right.

I really think this is a bizarre place to ask for advice. Giving people the benefit of the doubt, perhaps 20% of the people here are qualified to give advice (and thats probably a gross overstatement). You don't know which is which. There is limited data (often can't see where ball lands, spin on ball, speed of ball, sound of ball on strings...).

I don't get it...

Then why are you here?

SAMPRAS
05-24-2006, 12:00 PM
SEE Max

http://images.google.bg/imgres?imgurl=http://www.aztenis.cz/foto/rozbor/m2.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.aztenis.cz/archiv/026.htm&h=300&w=400&sz=24&tbnid=UUrnDBovFwe4bM:&tbnh=90&tbnw=120&hl=bg&start=408&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dsampras%26start%3D400%26svnum%3D10%26 hl%3Dbg%26lr%3D%26sa%3DN

kevhen
05-24-2006, 12:16 PM
Max is the Beast!

http://www.aztenis.cz/foto/rozbor/m5.jpghttp://f5.putfile.com/5/14316350735.jpg
Max has a higher contact point than I do but I am farther into the court. We are both swinging down on the ball at contact. He is one inch taller than I am. He serves about 20mph faster than I do.

Anyone else have photos of themselves serving near contact point to compare?

Mike Cottrill
05-24-2006, 01:11 PM
Max is the Beast!

Anyone else have photos of themselves serving near contact point to compare?

Is it me or is your racquet pointed at the back wall on that freeze frame?

Max is using his height to the fullest.

What part of your body is further into the court?

kevhen
05-24-2006, 01:15 PM
Yes, my racquet is back but on it's way forward. My arm will extend straight on contact with the ball about 10' above the ground slightly in front of me. Max probably contacts 6 inches higher than I do as he jumps up more and is taller. I don't have a better photo closer to contact but I am already 2 feet inside the court while Max's feet only look about 6 inches over the baseline

Ash Doyle
05-24-2006, 01:54 PM
Yes, my racquet is back but on it's way forward. My arm will extend straight on contact with the ball about 10' above the ground slightly in front of me. Max probably contacts 6 inches higher than I do as he jumps up more and is taller. I don't have a better photo closer to contact but I am already 2 feet inside the court while Max's feet only look about 6 inches over the baseline

I'd like to hear more about this from others that know more than I, but it seems to me that "leap" into the court is excessive movement and possibly counter-productive. Also, the frame rate on the video may be obscuring this, but it appears you may be hitting the ball on the descent of your "leap". I say "leap" because it looks like you are consciously jumping, something that I've been told one shouldn't do.

Mike Cottrill
05-24-2006, 01:54 PM
Yes, my racquet is back but on it's way forward. My arm will extend straight on contact with the ball about 10' above the ground slightly in front of me. Max probably contacts 6 inches higher than I do as he jumps up more and is taller. I don't have a better photo closer to contact but I am already 2 feet inside the court while Max's feet only look about 6 inches over the baseline

He is like a spring up up into the ball. What about where the racquet is at contact is that further into the court than MAX? Look at the last photo, his momentum is forward and in a sprinters position.. You could get so much more if you would just try some changes.

Bungalo Bill
05-24-2006, 01:59 PM
Max is the Beast!

http://www.aztenis.cz/foto/rozbor/m5.jpghttp://f5.putfile.com/5/14316350735.jpg
Max has a higher contact point than I do but I am farther into the court. We are both swinging down on the ball at contact. He is one inch taller than I am. He serves about 20mph faster than I do.

Anyone else have photos of themselves serving near contact point to compare?
You may be further, but Max is still rotating into the ball. You are pretty much square with the net.

Kevhen, I think the biggest issue with you is you want to keep going around in circles and justify the problems in your stroke when others are pointing things out to help you.

vinouspleasure
05-24-2006, 02:16 PM
Then why are you here?

top of mind:
- for the sheer entertainment value
- for the badinage
- for the pleasure of your company

seriously, I don't post here often and it wasn't until very recently that I came to this conclusion. And its still a fun place since we all share a common interest.

Do you disagree with my original premise?

vinouspleasure
05-24-2006, 02:20 PM
Max is the Beast!

http://www.aztenis.cz/foto/rozbor/m5.jpghttp://f5.putfile.com/5/14316350735.jpg
Max has a higher contact point than I do but I am farther into the court. We are both swinging down on the ball at contact. He is one inch taller than I am. He serves about 20mph faster than I do.

Anyone else have photos of themselves serving near contact point to compare?

You are hitting down on the ball, Max is not.

Bungalo Bill
05-24-2006, 03:12 PM
top of mind:
- for the sheer entertainment value
- for the badinage
- for the pleasure of your company

seriously, I don't post here often and it wasn't until very recently that I came to this conclusion. And its still a fun place since we all share a common interest.

Do you disagree with my original premise?

Actually I think you're a nut. Why would you come here for pleasure and say their is no good advice?

Can you contribute and do better? Or are you just a nut?

Roddick The Beast
05-24-2006, 05:11 PM
Actually I think you're a nut. Why would you come here for pleasure and say their is no good advice?

Can you contribute and do better? Or are you just a nut?Don't worry too much. Yes, he is a nut. I thought we all knew knew this? Appearently not. :)

vinouspleasure
05-24-2006, 06:35 PM
Actually I think you're a nut. Why would you come here for pleasure and say their is no good advice?

Can you contribute and do better? Or are you just a nut?

a nut? I resemble that remark. Where did I say there is no good advice here? Personally, I think you give great advice. What I said is that, its hard to seperate the people giving good advice from the ones giving bad.

Example: Someone asks (for 10,000th time) `How do I hit a kick serve?`
- The first person to answer is a 3.0 player who read about how to do it.
- The second person is someone who hits it but is not good at explaining it.
- The third person is BB.
- The fourth person is someone who doesn`t know what a kick serve is.

How do you seperate the wheat from chaff? Additionally, think about how hard/time consuming it is to teach someone when they are on the court, when you can see them and they can see you. Here we have words and a couple of pictures. Tough teaching environment.

I first started thinking about this when I was looking to replace my racquet. I thought it would be good to filter advice so I said:
- when you reply, include your rating and if you serve and volley

oddly, no one would do it. Then I asked about string brand and tension. Thats when I realized what a stupid idea it was. Get recommendations for string without understanding my strokes, my strategy, surfaces, rating, racquet, etc. And how about understanding the same thing about the person making the recommendation.

I think it would be better if we had a way to rate replies and have people accrue ratings. And if we had profiles that described a little more about what type of tennis player we are.

Hey, I know, nutty stuff...

If you look over my posts, I think you`ll see I do try to contribute.

Bungalo Bill
05-24-2006, 06:42 PM
a nut? I resemble that remark.

Perfect, you're a nut. Now, how do you hit a kick serve? (Vinous goes blank). LOL

Roddick The Beast
05-24-2006, 06:47 PM
a nut? I resemble that remark. Where did I say there is no good advice here? Personally, I think you give great advice. What I said is that, its hard to seperate the people giving good advice from the ones giving bad.

Example: Someone asks (for 10,000th time) `How do I hit a kick serve?`
- The first person to answer is a 3.0 player who read about how to do it.
- The second person is someone who hits it but is not good at explaining it.
- The third person is BB.
- The fourth person is someone who doesn`t know what a kick serve is.

How do you seperate the wheat from chaff? Additionally, think about how hard/time consuming it is to teach someone when they are on the court, when you can see them and they can see you. Here we have words and a couple of pictures. Tough teaching environment.

I first started thinking about this when I was looking to replace my racquet. I thought it would be good to filter advice so I said:
- when you reply, include your rating and if you serve and volley

oddly, no one would do it. Then I asked about string brand and tension. Thats when I realized what a stupid idea it was. Get recommendations for string without understanding my strokes, my strategy, surfaces, rating, racquet, etc. And how about understanding the same thing about the person making the recommendation.

I think it would be better if we had a way to rate replies and have people accrue ratings. And if we had profiles that described a little more about what type of tennis player we are.

Hey, I know, nutty stuff...

If you look over my posts, I think you`ll see I do try to contribute.Haha, since 2004, you've ONLY had 140 something posts, + the "useless" post above ^^^. Hahah

Wait, I should have read it more clearly. You did say that you "try" to contribute. Hahhaa, at least you were accurate about that, you nut! :mrgreen:

vinouspleasure
05-24-2006, 07:02 PM
Haha, since 2004, you've ONLY had 140 something posts, + the "useless" post above ^^^. Hahah

Wait, I should have read it more clearly. You did say that you "try" to contribute. Hahhaa, at least you were accurate about that, you nut! :mrgreen:

Its now how many posts a person makes, its the quality of the post. I have a life and a family outside of the tennis warehouse message board.

But congrats on getting your post total so high with `quality posts` like this.

vinouspleasure
05-24-2006, 07:05 PM
Perfect, you're a nut. Now, how do you hit a kick serve? (Vinous goes blank). LOL

I`m sorry I`m a nut. Khevin is sorry he`s a nitwit.

wel done, bb.

Bungalo Bill
05-24-2006, 07:09 PM
I`m sorry I`m a nut. Khevin is sorry he`s a nitwit.

wel done, bb.

Dont be sorry, both of you can't help it. Now, how do you explain to someone about what it takes to hit a kick serve? Can you help someone here with their questions?

Roddick The Beast
05-24-2006, 07:13 PM
Its now how many posts a person makes, its the quality of the post. I have a life and a family outside of the tennis warehouse message board.

But congrats on getting your post total so high with `quality posts` like this.Thanks.

Roddick The Beast
05-24-2006, 07:15 PM
Dont be sorry, both of you can't help it. Now, how do you explain to someone about what it takes to hit a kick serve? Can you help someone here with their questions?You may be a little too harsh on the nut, BB. Nuts can explode at any moment. I don't think we'd want that now . . . or do we? :mrgreen:

Roddick The Beast
05-24-2006, 07:17 PM
BB, that nut is really nuts! I clicked on his profile and right now, he is reading a thread titled "how to hit a kick serve" !!! He is probably "stealing" info from there so that he can know what to say in order to answer your question. What a nut AND a nitwit AND a loser! :mrgreen:

Bungalo Bill
05-24-2006, 07:18 PM
"how to hit a kick serve" !!! He is probably "stealing" info from there so that he can know what to say in order to answer your question. What a nut AND a nitwit AND a loser! :mrgreen:

ROFLMAO!!!!! Can't wait!!!!

Roddick The Beast
05-24-2006, 07:19 PM
ROFLMAO!!!!! Can't wait!!!!Oh crap, he's replying to this thread right now! I'm running out of here now !!!!!! :shock:

vinouspleasure
05-24-2006, 07:23 PM
Dont be sorry, both of you can't help it. Now, how do you explain to someone about what it takes to hit a kick serve? Can you help someone here with their questions?

As time and desire permit, I have done so and will continue do so. And I was helping Khevin (rather than calling him names).

But why should you care how I participate in this community? How does it effect you?

Bungalo Bill
05-24-2006, 07:24 PM
As time and desire permit, I have done so and will continue do so. And I was helping Khevin (rather than calling him names).

But why should you care how I participate in this community? How does it effect you?

Well the question is, if you dont think this forum provides value to you, then why are you here?

vinouspleasure
05-24-2006, 07:24 PM
BB, that nut is really nuts! I clicked on his profile and right now, he is reading a thread titled "how to hit a kick serve" !!! He is probably "stealing" info from there so that he can know what to say in order to answer your question. What a nut AND a nitwit AND a loser! :mrgreen:

did you notice that I contributed to that thread? I was going to post a link to the thread. I noticed bb stated in the thread `this is not a good place to learn how to hit a kick serve`

vinouspleasure
05-24-2006, 07:25 PM
Well the question is, if you dont think this forum provides value to you, then why are you here?

Could you please add a quote where I stated this? And you havent answered my question. How does it effect you?

Roddick The Beast
05-24-2006, 07:31 PM
did you notice that I contributed to that thread? I was going to post a link to the thread. I noticed bb stated in the thread `this is not a good place to learn how to hit a kick serve`You got me there! **hides under a nutshell now** :D "Nut"

Bungalo Bill
05-24-2006, 07:32 PM
Could you please add a quote where I stated this? And you havent answered my question. How does it effect you?

Here you go!
Example: Someone asks (for 10,000th time) `How do I hit a kick serve?`
- The first person to answer is a 3.0 player who read about how to do it.
- The second person is someone who hits it but is not good at explaining it.
- The third person is BB.
- The fourth person is someone who doesn`t know what a kick serve is.

Do you have a problem with this? If you do, why are you here? Why would you even search? Why would you take the trouble to do so? Why not just leave and let those that do get value out of the tips offered here do what they want?

vinouspleasure
05-24-2006, 07:34 PM
You got me there! **hides under a nutshell now** :D "Nut"

well, at least you got your post total a little higher.

vinouspleasure
05-24-2006, 07:40 PM
Here you go!


Do you have a problem with this? If you do, why are you here? Why would you even search? Why would you take the trouble to do so? Why not just leave and let those that do get value out of the tips offered here do what they want?



My problem is that if I`m the one asking for advice, its hard to seperate the good advice from the bad. So I won`t be asking for much advice here.

Why would i search for my own posts on how to hit a kick serve? So I could objectively say `I have done this in the past`.

I`ve patiently answered all your questions but you haven`t answered mine. How does it effect you if I stay or go? Why do you care? And how am I effecting `those that do get value out of the tips offered here do what they want?`

Bungalo Bill
05-24-2006, 07:42 PM
My problem is that if I`m the one asking for advice, its hard to seperate the good advice from the bad. So I won`t be asking for much advice here.

Why would i search for my own posts on how to hit a kick serve? So I could objectively say `I have done this in the past`.

I`ve patiently answered all your questions but you haven`t answered mine. How does it effect you if I stay or go? Why do you care?

Why is it hard to seperate good advice from bad advice. When a person offers a tip, that is why I and certain others go to great lengths to explain what is and what it isn't. So why is it difficult?

vinouspleasure
05-24-2006, 07:54 PM
Why is it hard to seperate good advice from bad advice. When a person offers a tip, that is why I and certain others go to great lengths to explain what is and what it isn't. So why is it difficult?

ahhhhh...maybe I wasn`t being clear enough. I don`t have a problem with all those people giving advice. My problem is I can`t tell which is the 3.0 and which is the uspta certified pro because all we have are people`s names.

Think about that guy that was spouting the wrist should not be laid back on the forehand and you were saying it should be. How does someone know which of you is right? If I could know: gee this is advice from a pro, I`m going to try it or this is advice on how to hit an inside out forehand from a 2.5 player, I probably shouldnt pay too much attention to it.

But we dont know...all we know is the persons name...

anyhow, sleep time here...

Andres
05-24-2006, 07:55 PM
Anyone else have photos of themselves serving near contact point to compare?
This is a awful pic, from an awful serve, which is pretty much the only one I had on a digital camera, and it's rotated to the left, which costed me quita a long time to rotate, edit the frames, edit the brightness and contrast, but here it is.
http://f-mercury.com.ar/pics/sintitulo2p.jpg

If I remember the clip correctly, it's a slice 1st serve, but the camera moved too much to continue posting pics of the followthru, and me taking the net. There were 3 more frames to the sequence (the landing mostly), but those conditions kept me away from posting them. The last frame of the landing is rotated like 39º from the vertical axis :p

serveitup911
05-24-2006, 08:08 PM
Anyone else have photos of themselves serving near contact point to compare?

http://i3.tinypic.com/wisgab.jpgfile:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/DANIEL%7E1/LOCALS%7E1/TEMP/moz-screenshot.jpg

Bungalo Bill
05-24-2006, 08:09 PM
ahhhhh...maybe I wasn`t being clear enough. I don`t have a problem with all those people giving advice. My problem is I can`t tell which is the 3.0 and which is the uspta certified pro because all we have are people`s names.

Think about that guy that was spouting the wrist should not be laid back on the forehand and you were saying it should be. How does someone know which of you is right? If I could know: gee this is advice from a pro, I`m going to try it or this is advice on how to hit an inside out forehand from a 2.5 player, I probably shouldnt pay too much attention to it.

But we dont know...all we know is the persons name...

Well, geeee, I don't really think people have had a hard time seperating the wheat from the chaff.

I will agree with you that there is a lot of "mavericks" that somehow learned to play tennis that think they know how to teach. I am dealing with one right now.

Then you got the guy that finally made the 3.5 team that people look up to him that thinks he can now start teaching. Nevermind, his strokes are horrible.

Now, each coach has their style and beliefs but I can mention some good ones here on this board and this is not in any order just what if off the top of my head:

1. JCo87

2. John Yandell

3. Mahboob Kann

4. TennisMastery

5. FiveO

6. KK or Kaptain Karl

7. Bottle (NO JUST KIDDING!!!!)

8. Bungalo Bill

9. TennisAsAlways (is starting to come alive in coaching tips)

10. AngeloDS (a very good player and offers good advice)

These are some of the best here on the boards.

Andres
05-24-2006, 08:17 PM
Well, geeee, I don't really think people have had a hard time seperating the wheat from the chaff.

I will agree with you that there is a lot of "mavericks" that somehow learned to play tennis that think they know how to teach. I am dealing with one right now.

Then you got the guy that finally made the 3.5 team that people look up to him that thinks he can now start teaching. Nevermind, his strokes are horrible.

Now, each coach has their style and beliefs but I can mention some good ones here on this board and this is not in any order just what if off the top of my head:

1. JCo87

2. John Yandell

3. Mahboob Kann

4. TennisMastery

5. FiveO

6. KK or Kaptain Karl

7. Bottle (NO JUST KIDDING!!!!)

8. Bungalo Bill

9. TennisAsAlways (is starting to come alive in coaching tips)

10. AngeloDS (a very good player and offers good advice)

These are some of the best here on the boards.
Bill, you're forgetting wyutani!! How dare you! :mrgreen:
Anyway, check my last post in this thread, with the images. Any pointers to improve the serve, even if they're minimal? Everything helps :)

(Not saying that I'm thaaaat good and only need minimal adjustments, but... you know what I mean) :p

Roddick The Beast
05-24-2006, 08:20 PM
Bill, you're forgetting wyutani!! How dare you! :mrgreen:
Anyway, check my last post in this thread, with the images. Any pointers to improve the serve, even if they're minimal? Everything helps

(Not saying that I'm thaaaat good and only need minimal adjustments, but... you know what I mean) :p:) Wyutani!

ta11geese3
05-24-2006, 08:20 PM
Usually you can tell who is knowledgeble and trustworthy just by the info they post and the respect they get from others...

Mike Cottrill
05-25-2006, 05:07 AM
http://i3.tinypic.com/wisgab.jpgfile:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/DANIEL%7E1/LOCALS%7E1/TEMP/moz-screenshot.jpg

http://furmanpaladins.cstv.com/sports/m-tennis/mtt/knause_daniel00.html

Nice :) serve it up... Kevin, see the shoulders

Rep. Timothy Calhoun
05-25-2006, 11:02 AM
Well, geeee, I don't really think people have had a hard time seperating the wheat from the chaff.

I will agree with you that there is a lot of "mavericks" that somehow learned to play tennis that think they know how to teach. I am dealing with one right now.

Then you got the guy that finally made the 3.5 team that people look up to him that thinks he can now start teaching. Nevermind, his strokes are horrible.

Now, each coach has their style and beliefs but I can mention some good ones here on this board and this is not in any order just what if off the top of my head:

1. JCo87

2. John Yandell

3. Mahboob Kann

4. TennisMastery

5. FiveO

6. KK or Kaptain Karl

7. Bottle (NO JUST KIDDING!!!!)

8. Bungalo Bill

9. TennisAsAlways (is starting to come alive in coaching tips)

10. AngeloDS (a very good player and offers good advice)

These are some of the best here on the boards.I got that one! :D I saw "Bottle" on the list and was like: "really"? :D

vinouspleasure
05-25-2006, 02:56 PM
Well, geeee, I don't really think people have had a hard time seperating the wheat from the chaff.

These are some of the best here on the boards.

great, so now the readers of this thread have a list of people that you think add value. What about the people that haven`t read this thread? What about the people that join this community tomorrow?

I think the right idea is to create a knowledge marketplace which allows us to rate posts. A persons overall rating is displayed when they post. You could decide how much weight to give a persons advice based on their rating.

This would encourage people to post good content and might make people think twice before throwing around terms like nitwit, nut and loser. A person whose rating drops a pctg and/or raw amount could be prevented from posting a certain amount of time. This is also a little more democratic rather than having one person`s view.

serveitup911
05-25-2006, 04:53 PM
http://i4.tinypic.com/10pal8l.jpghttp://www.aztenis.cz/foto/rozbor/m5.jpg


Right at contact. I think I hit this one a bit high on the racket face.

Mike Cottrill
05-25-2006, 07:25 PM
Serve it up,
I tend to hit up top on my first serve sometimes too. When it happens, it feels like my legs give out. Maybe I just put to toss to far out?? Any ideas why it happens to you?
Thanks
Mike

serveitup911
05-25-2006, 07:51 PM
I hit up too high when I slightly mis-time my jump into the ball. If I jump too early and am not rising as I hit the ball, I make contact too high. Also, if I don't jump high enough, I can't get the sweetspot to the ball.

Bungalo Bill
05-25-2006, 07:53 PM
http://i4.tinypic.com/10pal8l.jpghttp://www.aztenis.cz/foto/rozbor/m5.jpg


Right at contact. I think I hit this one a bit high on the racket face.

Yeah just a tad, but I really like your non-dominant arm position and I can tell you are not afraid to really relax that shoulder. Good job!

Roddick The Beast
05-25-2006, 08:30 PM
Haha........