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View Full Version : Why can't Wilson just make a true PS 6.0 90 and be done?


BreakPoint
07-05-2004, 10:56 AM
OK, I've tried them all: PS 6.0 85, PS 6.0 95, HPS 6.0 95 Tour, Tour 90, Tour 95, PSC 6.1 95, HPS 6.1 95, nSix-One Tour, and nSix-One 95.

I've decided what I REALLY want is a PS 6.0 90. The same feel and everything as the PS 6.0 85/95 but in a more convenient 90 sq. in. head size. The 85 is a bit too small and the 95 is a bit too big, so a 90 would be perfect IMHO. I mean even Dunlop made a MW200G with a 90 sq. in. head at one time.

There's been quite a bit of speculation on these boards that what Roger Federer is really using is indeed a custom made PS 6.0 90 under all of that nSix-One and Tour 90 paint. If Wilson can make a few hundred of these racquets for Federer, why can't they just turn up the production and make a few hundred thousand for the rest of us? :? :roll:

My perfect specs would be:

Head size: 90 sq. in.
Strung weight: 12.3 oz.
Swingweight: 320
Balance: 10 points HL
Length: 27 in.
Beam width: 18mm
Grip: Leather
String pattern: 16 X 18
Composition: 80% Braided Graphite/ 20% Kevlar (no HyperCarbon nor nCode)

How about it Wilson? Could you please make a few hundred thousand of these (see above) for the rest of us? Perhaps one of us could become as good as Federer using this racquet and sign a contract with you to promote the Wlslon brand. You never know. :wink: :D :shock:

Thanks in advance. :D

Cigo
07-05-2004, 11:47 AM
Having played with Original, Tour90 and n90 I find that nSixOne actually feels like an Original with a 90sq in head, the feel is there so is the control, it has more power though, but that can be tamed with strings. What's laking in nSixOne for you? A friend of mine prefers the 6.0 just because it has less power, then again he uses polyester strings in his Original(that's sick :shock: ).

Craig Clark
07-05-2004, 11:49 AM
That's a great idea! Funny, your specs are just about IDENTICAL to those I'd imagine for myself.

I wonder if anyone on these boards has in fact strung Federer's frames? If so, what are the specs?

Lacking our 'dream frame' (at least for now, eh Wilson??!!) for a close approximation, how about the Volkl Tour 10 mid?

And Don, can you and the TW staff 'commission' frames like these if enough of us pre-pay for them?

CC

Craig Clark
07-05-2004, 11:57 AM
One need only read my gushing review of the nCode 6.1 Tour 90 to see how much I love it. However, if there is 'something missing' relative to the original PS 6.0 85 it would be in the the ephemeral realm of the 'feel' and touch that the original frame provides, especially at net. I played a practice set today w/ the 6.0 85 (for purposes of comparison in my ongoing review of the nCode SixOne Tour on these boards) and was VERY impressed w/ just how remarkably versatile this 20+ year old design remains. I still SLIGHTLY preferred the nCode. At my age (42yo) the extra 'pop' and forgiveness on off center hits was welcome, but NOTHING can beat the sensation of a well struck volley w/ the 6.0 85. Well, at least nothing that can happen legally on a tennis court. :D
CC

BreakPoint
07-05-2004, 12:14 PM
What's lacking for me with the nSix-One Tour is exactly what Craig just mentioned above. The incredible feel that the PS 6.0 has. I found the feel of the nSix-One Tour to be a little too muted, so much so that I couldn't get a good feel for the ball on serves, and sometimes, not exactly sure how the ball was coming off the strings on groundstrokes. Perhaps different strings and/or tension may solve this problem, but I've already returned the demo racquet. I guess, for now, I just like the crisp feel and more headlight feel of the PS 6.0 over the muted feel of the nSix-One Tour.

Another thing I don't quite understand is why Wilson, having found the right recipe (as evidenced by the popularity and millions of PS 6.0s sold), wanted to tinker with the recipe anyway? Instead of making the Tour 90, if they had just made a PS 6.0 with a 90 sq. in. head, I think most current PS 6.0 85 users would have been a lot happier.

brijoel
07-05-2004, 12:37 PM
what you all seem to forget is they still make the 6.0 85, none of these frames actually has replaced the original in all actuality. to be perfectly honest, i think it may have been an abomination to make ps 6.0 90 with the original 85 platform, thus wilson made a whole new frame which i dont exactly blame them for considering their marketing they have gotten out of it. the n6.1 tour seems to be from the exact same mold as a tour 90, which means wilson was able to make yet another new frame cheaply. i think you all are forgeting the fact that the n6.1 isnt even supposed to be compared to the 6.0 85. maybe it does play similiar to an original 6.0, the fact is they are two totally different frames and personally i thought the tour 90 sucked when i demoed it, if you guys love the 6.0 85 that much i just never understood the point of trying to change it if nothing else has the feel you want, lol. but thats just me.

AAAA
07-05-2004, 01:36 PM
Intuitively most amateurs like myself will think a 90" head will be better for our games than an 85". So some people will search for a 90" version of a PS 6.0 85". Some people have switched from the PS 6.0 to an Estusa Pro Braided and are very happy. Maybe people should consider another brand. My 2 cents.

Oh, they sell more racquets by tinkering with a winning formula because people read about the technical changes and wonder if it is an improvement so they start buying.

big ted
07-05-2004, 03:25 PM
why do u want one cuz federer uses one ?

Swan Song
07-05-2004, 04:52 PM
Perfect Wilson 6.0

90 sqin
St. Vincent style braiding-tighter, stiffer, heavier
18mm.
traditional paintjob(none of this and that all you need is "Pro Staff", "midsize", the stripes and you're done)

Craig Clark
07-05-2004, 05:21 PM
LOL!

For my part, the journey is at least as important as the destination. I've really enjoyed hitting a bunch of different player's frames and 'getting to know them'. This board provides a forum to learn and share insights w/ others who also have a keen interest.

Undoubtedly, Wilson profits by 'tinkering' w/ good designs and 'reinventing the wheel' by the 're-introduction' of well designed frames w/ minor differences in cosmetics and/or playabiity. That's the business side of the game.

Specific to this discussion, I just enjoy the discourse generated by reflecting on our mutual experiences with frames and trying to use these experiences to come up w/ the 'perfect racquet'. By definition, this frame will exist only in our minds!

As for the Wilson PS line, including the 6.0 85/95, HPS 6.0 Tour 95, Tour 90/95, PS Classic 6.1, HPS 6.1 and HPS 6.1 Tour (w/ the 18x20 string pattern) and now the nCode Tour 90, they are IMHO ALL great frames. Amongst the very best ever made. For now I'll be playing the nCode Tour 90-it is the best compromise for me. But if it could be modified to play as well while adding just a touch better feel..............

Hey, guess what? I broke a string last night.....maybe a more tightly strung frame w/ natural gut all around.....?????

CC

lelopez
07-05-2004, 05:23 PM
I have to disagree.....I used the PS 6.0 85 for 12+ years, then the Tour 90 for a short time and now the nSix-One. I must say that the playing with the nSix-One is almost identical to playing with the PS 6.0, yet I had a better feel of the ball with it on EVERY stroke with the nCode. Specially at net, the racquet felt solid yet provided excellent feel for "touch" shots.

I agree that the Tour 90 sucked, the balance of the racquet was all over the place, the racquet felt like a wood log, and the sweetspot was very difficult to find the sweetspot.....I even hurt my shoulder with it.

The nSix-One Tour 90 has excellent weight balance, just like the original 6.0, but I even find it easier to swing that the original. I've played with it now for four days straight, playing hard, and my shoulder does not feel a thing.

I think even if Wilson put out a PS 6.0 version with a 90 sq in head, it still would not feel the same as an 85 sq in. Remember, whenever you vary ANY spec of a racquet, it will feel different no matter what, but of course we'll never know that.

I feel that the nSix-One is the closest thing Wilson has put out to compare with the original 6.0 and I think players that love the 6.0 looking for a larger head size will love the nSix-One. Most people on this board that consider the PS 6.0 the last Coca-Cola in the middle of the desert are TOO biased towards it and will always find something wrong when trying a new racquet. I was one of those people, but after serious playing time, I think the new nCode is as good or BETTER than the original.

if you've had limited time with the nCode, try it again.......if you still like the original better, then so be it, not EVERYONE is going to change, but I bet the majority of people that used to play with the original will switch to the new racquet..........

........and that is why Wilson will not make a PS 6.0 90 sq in.

just my opinion, L.

roundiesee
07-05-2004, 05:27 PM
BreakPoint, you didn't include the St Vincents in your list. Have you tried the original St Vincents as well? To me this stick is the ultimate in terms of "Feel". Cheers! PS- Hope the Wilson reps are listening/reading this.

BreakPoint
07-05-2004, 05:27 PM
why do u want one cuz federer uses one ?

Absolutely not!!! I don't care what pro uses a racquet in making my racquet choices. I just look for the racquet that works best for my game, feels the best, and is not going to permanently damage any of my body parts. Who cares what the pros use? I'm certainly not going to switch to some oversized Prince racquet just because Sharapova used one to win Wimbledon with. Most of the top pros use paintjobs anyway, so what does it matter? We don't really know what they are using nor the extent of their customization anyway. And believe me, Federer didn't win Wimbledon because of his choice of racquet.

BTW, I'm not saying that Wilson should replace the PS 6.0 85 with a PS 6.0 90. There are lots of people who like the PS 6.0 85 exactly the way it is, and that's fine. It's just a bit too heavy and the headsize a bit too small for me to call it the quintessential perfect racquet for me. I do love the feel, however.

I mean Dunlop made the MW200G in both the 90 and 95 headsizes at the same time so there's no reason why Wilson can't make a 85 and 90 at the same time (along with the 95, too). BTW, a local pro shop informed me that their Wilson rep told them that Wilson has stopped making the PS 6.0 85 and any inventory they still had of it is already in its distribution channels, thus, they told me they couldn't get any more of them for their store. Don't know if this is true or not as it's still on the Wilson website, but I wouldn't be surprised now that the nSix-One Tour is out. Might be time to stock up.

Craig Clark
07-05-2004, 05:56 PM
I guess LeLopez and I agree-ultimately the nCode SixOne bests the 6.0 85 FOR OUR GAME.

That having been said, the fact that it's a SMALL difference is remarkable, given the age of the design.

LeLopez-I wonder if you are getting better feel b/c of lower string tension or perhaps string type? I may have my next one strung radically different than the first, just for the sake of comparison. The sense of diminished feel truly was my one gripe with the nCode, even though I, like you, intend to make the switch.

CC

BreakPoint
07-05-2004, 06:00 PM
I think even if Wilson put out a PS 6.0 version with a 90 sq in head, it still would not feel the same as an 85 sq in. Remember, whenever you vary ANY spec of a racquet, it will feel different no matter what, but of course we'll never know that.


Yes, I understand that. But my current regular stick is the PS 6.0 95 and I like the feel of it as much as that of the PS 6.0 85 (perhpas even a little more so). However, I seem to serve better (harder and more accurately) with the smaller headsize and the higher weight. But the 95 is more maneuverable at the net and on groundstrokes and easier to generate topspin and slice with. Thus, what I want is a stick that combines the best qualities of both. I believe a PS 6.0 90 should retain a similar feel to that of the PS 6.0 85/95 as long as the composition is the same and also uses a box beam.

BTW, another reason I shy away from using the PS 6.0 85 exclusively is: as an aging 42 year old (just like Craig!), 4.5, mostly serve & volley player who started playing tennis with a wood racquet (Dunlop Maxply Fort), and has been playing on and off for almost 30 years, the weight of the PS 6.0 85 is just getting harder for me to handle. I'm not in as good of shape as I was when I was younger and I feel the 85 puts a lot of stress on my shoulder during extended play, especially hitting lots of serves. Thus, I want similar feel is a slightly lighter, a little more forgiving (larger sweetspot) package. It just seems that a PS 6.0 90 would be the right solution.

BTW, I guess I'm at that age in which my game has stopped improving and will be heading downhill from here on out, so I need all the help I can get. :( :)

Steve Huff
07-05-2004, 11:05 PM
I can't see Wilson being at fault here at all. They make more 90 sq in frames than anyone. They make a 93 in frame (ROK). They make several 95 in frames, 100 in frames, etc... Too many at each head size, all standard length frames, all "players" frames. Where can you get more choice than that? Too many would create confusion among buyers. Lelopez, your comments were very good. As Craig mentioned, changing string and tension may be the only thing needed.

baseliner
07-06-2004, 05:51 AM
My two cents. As a former PS 6.0 85 user. I loved the 85 but found I did not like the 95. If the 85 was solid and crisp the 95 was mushy. Could have been the string job. Only hit with the 95 a few times. I eventually switched to the PS 5.0 and then the HPS 6.1. The HPS 6.1 is a good racket but not quite the PS 6.0 85. After reading Craig's review of the n-code 6.1 Tour 90, guess I'm on the demo trail again--and that's why Wilson keeps changing rackets. It is profitable for them.

lelopez
07-06-2004, 07:52 AM
Craig-

I don't know if string type/tension will make a huge difference, I never played with a poly hybrid with my old PS 6.0's so I don't know what that felt like. I always played with some sort of synthetic when I had my old 6.0's. However, while playing with the Tour 90's I decided to switch to a hybrid poly/synth. string job and I will not go back to regular all synthetic. Now with the nCodes, this string job provides me with great feel and control.....much more than with the old Tour 90's so I know that a lot of it is b/c of the new racquet.

One of the things I'm learning that I truly love about the nSix-One over my old PS 6.0 is the larger sweetspot. I remember that if I didn't hit the ball square in the center of the racquet with the old 6.0 the ball would be shanked pretty easily. This is not the case with the nCode. I can control off center shots a lot better than I ever did in 12+ years with the 6.0.

Another thing is manuverability. Either my game got better by learning to play with the un-manuverable Tour 90 (I doubt it), or the nCode is just a LOT easier to swing than any of the other two while still feeling like a 12+ oz stick.

I play s & v quite a bit also, so comparing the feeling of the nCode at net was very important to me. Again, I felt that the nCode was as good as the 6.0 at net, but yet provided me with a little better "feel" in touch shots. It is hard to judge whether this is attributed to just the racquet, just the strings, or a combination of both. Maybe if I break my stringjob I'll string it with all synthetic for comparison purposes. I think comparing apples to apples is the best way to rule differences out.

will keep you posted on what new things I find about the nCode......so far the larger sweetspot, higher manuverability, and the fact that my shoulder does not feel a thing are the main reasons I love it....

L.

Craig Clark
07-06-2004, 08:34 AM
Thanks for the thoughtful reply, LeLopez. I'm having my nCode SixOne re-strung today w/ gut at 70#. Will f/u w/ a new post regarding any changes. CC

CliffH
07-06-2004, 02:45 PM
Craig clark, breakPoint, baseliner, lelopez: Thanks for the work on the ncode raquets. I've read all of your stuff. Dead on. I tried to post on another thread (n90vsn95) my take, referring to you guys. Please comment.

Excuse my typing. I'm 44 and 4.5ish. I have played with all of the 6.1 style wilson frames. I got one of the first ps85s in around 1984 in Canada. Last year, I tried to like the tour90, but couldn't.

Unfortunately, I think I'm a little like Craig's friend, Tim: I'm 5'8" tall and the n90 is probably not the smartest racquet for me to swing. I guess that's why I've been using the ps6.1 classic again,strung with a gut hybrid, waiting for the ncodes. But the n90 does feel great, finally.

Both ncodes are sure nice on the arm & shoulder. The n95 doesn't even feel like a 12oz racquet. Maybe some weight and gut strings would make it feel firmer and crisper. Then again, I think it is the box design of the n90 that makes it feel so much better. For a smaller person like myself, maybe a 17g gut hybrid and 1/2'' longer will make up on the serve what you guys already have (like Grosjean does), and practise, technique and perserverence, or get a clue and just deal with the n95 as a platform. Comments please.
For sure, the n90 needs strings tighter than the demo 55' 16g syn gut, that it had. I bet 17g tighter would increase the feel and a hybrid would tame the increase in power. Sounds familiar.

Maybe Wilson made this frame so muted and with extra power to deal with the new harsher poly strings, that we didn't have back then. As so many pros are using poly now, it would make sense. :shock:

Thanks for any replies, give my regards to Tim, Craig as we might have to switch to the H4 to keep up with you big guys :)

CliffH
07-06-2004, 02:55 PM
Craig clark, breakPoint, baseliner, lelopez: Thanks for the work on the ncode raquets. I've read all of your stuff. Dead on. I tried to post on another thread (n90vsn95) my take, referring to you guys. Please comment.

Excuse my typing. I'm 44 and 4.5ish. I have played with all of the 6.1 style wilson frames. I got one of the first ps85s in around 1984 in Canada. Last year, I tried to like the tour90, but couldn't.

Unfortunately, I think I'm a little like Craig's friend, Tim: I'm 5'8" tall and the n90 is probably not the smartest racquet for me to swing. I guess that's why I've been using the ps6.1 classic again,strung with a gut hybrid, waiting for the ncodes. But the n90 does feel great, finally.

Both ncodes are sure nice on the arm & shoulder. The n95 doesn't even feel like a 12oz racquet. Maybe some weight and gut strings would make it feel firmer and crisper. Then again, I think it is the box design of the n90 that we like. For a smaller person like myself, maybe a 17ggut hybrid and 1/2'' longer will make up on the serve what you guys already have( like Grosjean does), or get a clue and just deal
with the n95 as a platform. Comments please.

For sure the n90 needs strings tighter than the demo 55' 16g syn gut, that it had. I bet 17g tighter would increase the feel and a hybrid would tame the increase in power. Sounds familiar.

Maybe Wilson made this frame so muted and with extra power to deal with the new harsher poly strings, that we didn't have back then. As so many pros are using poly now, it would make sense. :shock:

Thanks for any replies, give my regards to Tim, Craig as we might have to switch to the H4 to keep up with you big guys :)

Craig Clark
07-06-2004, 05:50 PM
Hi Cliff,

Thanks for your insights on the nCodes.

I'll be picking up my nCode SixOne 90 from the stringer in the AM, and then I'm off for more demo time. I had it strung MUCH more tightly this time in an effort to tame power and enhance feel. I will let you know the results via the board.

Oh, and if you haven't hit a HPS 6.1 'Tour', the 18x20 Euro version of the HPS 6.1, you might want to give one a try. They weigh about 12.7oz stock and have a 12point hl balance w/ a MUCH less stiff feel. They feel stiff in the throat but very flexible in the head. Just a thought....

CC

netman
07-06-2004, 06:01 PM
Based on all of the before posted love for the PS 6.0, rumor has it Wilson will release a new version before year end. Included in the purchase price will be a year of study and meditation at the Nepalese Temple of the Glorious Overhead Smash where the purchasers will learn the Zen of playing with a club sporting a dime-sized sweetspot. Those deemed worthy will walk across hot coals and grasp a buring braizer with both forearms, receiving a Pro Staff brand on the left and a 6.0 85 on the right. Those deemed not worthy will receive a Hyper Hammer 2.0 and will suffer the constant ridicule of their fellow "player's frame" friends.

brijoel
07-06-2004, 06:28 PM
Based on all of the before posted love for the PS 6.0, rumor has it Wilson will release a new version before year end. Included in the purchase price will be a year of study and meditation at the Nepalese Temple of the Glorious Overhead Smash where the purchasers will learn the Zen of playing with a club sporting a dime-sized sweetspot. Those deemed worthy will walk across hot coals and grasp a buring braizer with both forearms, receiving a Pro Staff brand on the left and a 6.0 85 on the right. Those deemed not worthy will receive a Hyper Hammer 2.0 and will suffer the constant ridicule of their fellow "player's frame" friends.


IM SOOO THERE! :lol: :roll: :wink:

Swan Song
07-07-2004, 01:32 PM
90 or not, if Wilson would make it the old way then we wouldn't be arguing right now. It's like asking Coca Cola to make Coke the original way with pure cane sugar instead of adding high fructose corn syrup. Majority of the racquet companies are adding too much "high fructose corn syrup" to their racquets.

lelopez
07-07-2004, 03:05 PM
CliffH,

Don't be discouraged.....I'm a little dude too (5'8", 155 lbs) and feel the nCode feels great for me. Although, I always played with the PS 6.0 and later the Tour 90, so I may be used to that type of racquet.

CliffH
07-07-2004, 10:22 PM
Thanks a lot for the support, I really like the n90.

I kept the n95 demo to see if I can try to like it.

I returned the n90 demo today and will try the pogmid for a bit and maybe hit with my pro tomorrow if i can get another n90 demo.This ends my list of trial racquets.

If my pro thinks I hit better with one or the other of the racquets, or good enough with the n90, I will probably demo it for a longer time. Other than that, back to the demo board....

If the n90 is a go, I will bug u about string, heh heh :)

Thanks again.

tt2003
10-01-2004, 11:16 AM
Wilson does not make PS 90, since it is in business (profit) point of view. How many tennis players will enjoy the feel of PS 85 or 90 you guys just describe rather than new ncode paintjob? If Wilson makes a racket like PS 85 or 90 which only can be controlled by 4.0 or up players, Wilson may think this strategy will lose money. I have not played ncode 90, from your opinions; it is not as demanding as PS 85. So, more recreational tennis players can play with it. Then Wilson earns more money. But Roger may be playing his so called ncode 90 (maybe PS 90) and winning a couple of titles. Then Wilson change ncode paintjob again, and earns more money again.

BreakPoint
10-01-2004, 11:12 PM
Well, I think there are a lot of experienced tennis players out there that will NOT buy a nSix-One Tour 90 but WILL buy a PS 6.0 90, like me. I'm sure I'm not the only one. There's a huge installed base of users out there that use the PS 6.0 85 or 95. Many of these people may be interested in buying a PS 6.0 90 (at least one to try out). Thus, I think Wilson can make a lot of money by putting out a PS 6.0 90, especially since the PS 6.0 85 and 95 are now discontinued and will soon no longer be available.

It's a lot easier to sell an upgrade to a huge user base than to sell a new customer a new piece of software. Why do you think Microsoft makes so much money (and why Bill Gates is the richest man in the world)?

bcaz
10-02-2004, 12:13 AM
BP, Wilson will always have the molds, and when and if they find it profitable to revive the original PS sticks, they will. I too wish they would build an original PS 90, ostensibly combining the characteristcs of the 85 and the 95. I only disagree with your assessment of a "huge" base of users out there. I've only been playing the last six years, but I play a lot and I see a lot of players and I see very, very few original PS's. I have a 95, one guy at my club (at least 40-50 4.5-5.0+ players) plays a 6.0 95, and my pro, who owns 46-47 USTA titles, plays the HPS 6.1 95. One of my hitting buddies has two 85s he doesn't use anymore, having switched to the i.Prestige, even though it's discontinued. In fact, I see at least 25 Prestiges for every original PS I see. No wonder Head keeps pouring new stuff into those molds.

stormholloway
09-08-2008, 03:27 PM
Don't know about a 12.3 oz strung weight--seems a bit light for a Tour racquet. The weight of the K90 is fine, just shift the weight and change the paint--done.

BreakPoint
09-08-2008, 03:33 PM
Don't know about a 12.3 oz strung weight--seems a bit light for a Tour racquet. The weight of the K90 is fine, just shift the weight and change the paint--done.
But I'm not asking for a Tour racquet. I'm asking for a retail racquet for recreational players - specifically, me. :)

roundiesee
09-09-2008, 12:24 AM
But didn't Wilson make a "PS 6.0 90" for Pete? He used it in his most recent exhibition matches right? I guess we'll have to wait till this particular model goes into production.

rosewall4ever
09-09-2008, 03:43 AM
i see problem with this is that specs for a PS 6.0 90 differ from person to person. What does 'true' mean ? is it just taking the 85 specs and just have a 90 frame or tweaking some part to compensate for the 90 frame to retain the 'feel'. Its subjective and difficult to qualify.

jorel
09-09-2008, 10:22 AM
cuz it makes too much sense....

wheres that Sampras racquet that was used to tease us back in March???

shavenyak
09-09-2008, 10:31 AM
Would a vantage with those specs be similar? Just curious. I miss my old PS 85s too sometimes. But not enough to pay the (insert big auction site name here) markups.

Oh, and this thread got a MAJOR resurrection LOL.

BreakPoint
09-09-2008, 01:56 PM
i see problem with this is that specs for a PS 6.0 90 differ from person to person. What does 'true' mean ? is it just taking the 85 specs and just have a 90 frame or tweaking some part to compensate for the 90 frame to retain the 'feel'. Its subjective and difficult to qualify.
Well, 90 is exactly hafway between 85 and 95, right? So what I would like is for ALL of the other specs to be exactly halfway in between the specs for the PS 6.0 85 and the specs for the PS 6.0 95, so in addition to the headsize, this would include the static weight, the swingweight, the balance, the beam width, the stiffness, etc. Things that are identical in both remain the same, such as the 16x18 string pattern. IMO, that's what a "true" PS 6.0 90 should be. :)

quest01
09-09-2008, 02:19 PM
But I'm not asking for a Tour racquet. I'm asking for a retail racquet for recreational players - specifically, me. :)

Technically beginners in essence should not be using mid size racquets.

rosewall4ever
09-09-2008, 02:27 PM
Well, 90 is exactly hafway between 85 and 95, right? So what I would like is for ALL of the other specs to be exactly halfway in between the specs for the PS 6.0 85 and the specs for the PS 6.0 95, so in addition to the headsize, this would include the static weight, the swingweight, the balance, the beam width, the stiffness, etc. Things that are identical in both remain the same, such as the 16x18 string pattern. IMO, that's what a "true" PS 6.0 90 should be. :)


k now i see where your coming from. thought they were just random numbers. my bad...:)

dsa202
09-09-2008, 03:26 PM
They did and its called the k90.

BreakPoint
09-10-2008, 01:47 AM
Technically beginners in essence should not be using mid size racquets.
Not all recreational players are beginners. Anyone who doesn't earn money playing tennis is a recreational player, including ex-college players and ex-juniors. Beginners are 1.0-2.0 level players. There are recreational players at the 5.0-6.0 level.

BreakPoint
09-10-2008, 01:51 AM
They did and its called the k90.
Nope. The specs of the K90 do not match the specs of the PS 6.0 90 I outlined in my OP. The biggest differences being the composition and the swingweight. Also the string pattern, static weight, balance, etc. are different.

joke-a-vich
09-10-2008, 02:28 AM
hey breakpoint, does this petition belong to you by chance? lol.
http://www.petitiononline.com/92845116/petition.html
i came across it while looking for a ps85.
haha, sorry btw if this has been brought up before.

BreakPoint
09-10-2008, 02:44 AM
hey breakpoint, does this petition belong to you by chance? lol.
http://www.petitiononline.com/92845116/petition.html
i came across it while looking for a ps85.
haha, sorry btw if this has been brought up before.
No, I did not start that petition. However, it was started after I made this thread over 4 years ago, so I think the person who started it got the idea from my posts. Kudos to the originator of that petition. I wonder if Wilson ever saw it?

joke-a-vich
09-10-2008, 03:28 AM
No, I did not start that petition. However, it was started after I made this thread over 4 years ago, so I think the person who started it got the idea from my posts. Kudos to the originator of that petition. I wonder if Wilson ever saw it?

haha, hey, maybe the new sampras racquet is just what your looking for?

StunLock
09-10-2008, 10:22 AM
Wilson can't make such racquet because they don't want to 'be done' with their customers.

volleys_tennis_master
09-10-2008, 11:14 AM
stunlock has stumbled upon the basis of marketing of "highly technological" (I say this VERY broadly) products. It highlights the conflict between engineering and marketing departments...
case example: intel. Intel has the engineering capability to make a processor that would absolutely blow everyone's mind. But why don't they? Cause the marketing department essentially runs the research and development of these processors, and consequentially limits the capabilities of new processors. They are saving their best for later so that they have something to sell later... same principle goes for tennis racquets, although its a little bit of a stretch...
Also you have to consider, how big would the market demand be for this kind of item? Lets be honest, I would guess offhand that an overwhelming majority of non-pro tennis players would not use such a stick...
That said, we can keep on fantasizing haha...

Cup8489
09-10-2008, 11:24 AM
stunlock has stumbled upon the basis of marketing of "highly technological" (I say this VERY broadly) products. It highlights the conflict between engineering and marketing departments...
case example: intel. Intel has the engineering capability to make a processor that would absolutely blow everyone's mind. But why don't they? Cause the marketing department essentially runs the research and development of these processors, and consequentially limits the capabilities of new processors. They are saving their best for later so that they have something to sell later... same principle goes for tennis racquets, although its a little bit of a stretch...
Also you have to consider, how big would the market demand be for this kind of item? Lets be honest, I would guess offhand that an overwhelming majority of non-pro tennis players would not use such a stick...
That said, we can keep on fantasizing haha...

i'd use it. it's the holy grail.

seriously, i'd buy 6 right off the bat.

PimpMyGame
09-10-2008, 11:32 AM
i'd use it. it's the holy grail.

seriously, i'd buy 6 right off the bat.

Unfortunately for one customer like you there are 20 who will make do with just one granny stick sold at 3 x the price. Plus we all know that Wilson QC isn't the best, but the light wide bodied frames are easier to manufacture than the more specialised dense frames. Which incidentally come under the most scrutiny by the more discerning players.

Therefore round up everyone with sub-270 gramme frames and shoot them :twisted:

sureshs
09-10-2008, 12:51 PM
OK, I've tried them all: PS 6.0 85, PS 6.0 95, HPS 6.0 95 Tour, Tour 90, Tour 95, PSC 6.1 95, HPS 6.1 95, nSix-One Tour, and nSix-One 95.


Why not the K95?

sureshs
09-10-2008, 12:52 PM
Why not the K95?

Oh it was an old thread. Never mind.

TonyB
09-10-2008, 01:17 PM
My perfect specs would be:

Head size: 90 sq. in.
Strung weight: 12.3 oz.
Swingweight: 320
Balance: 10 points HL
Length: 27 in.
Beam width: 18mm
Grip: Leather
String pattern: 16 X 18
Composition: 80% Braided Graphite/ 20% Kevlar (no HyperCarbon nor nCode)




I realize this is an old thread, but I'd buy that racquet in a heartbeat. That's EXACTLY what I'm looking for.

Looks very similar to an Asian K90, actually. I'd love to see a SW of 320 and 10 points HL balance (strung). That would kick some major ***.

I could let the beam width slide a bit, maybe to 19 or 20mm tops, but otherwise those racquet specs absolutely rock.

BreakPoint
09-10-2008, 01:20 PM
Wilson can't make such racquet because they don't want to 'be done' with their customers.
So you think Wilson's strategy is not to make a racquet that their customers really want to buy but rather just keep making racquets that we don't want to buy?

morten
09-10-2008, 01:20 PM
mee to, fingers crossed Breakpoint... :)

dsa202
09-10-2008, 01:22 PM
Nope. The specs of the K90 do not match the specs of the PS 6.0 90 I outlined in my OP. The biggest differences being the composition and the swingweight. Also the string pattern, static weight, balance, etc. are different.

Yeah, they never made a PS 6.0 90.

BreakPoint
09-10-2008, 01:23 PM
Why not the K95?

Oh it was an old thread. Never mind.
Yup, you've answered your own question. I started this thread in July 2004 and the K90 and K95 were introduced in 2007, so obviously I couldn't have played with them at the time.

BreakPoint
09-10-2008, 01:39 PM
I realize this is an old thread, but I'd buy that racquet in a heartbeat. That's EXACTLY what I'm looking for.

Looks very similar to an Asian K90, actually. I'd love to see a SW of 320 and 10 points HL balance (strung). That would kick some major ***.

I could let the beam width slide a bit, maybe to 19 or 20mm tops, but otherwise those racquet specs absolutely rock.
My specs for the PS 6.0 90 do indeed come somewhat close to that of the Asian K90. Of course, when I wrote those specs above, the AK90 did not exist (it came out about 3 years later).

However, there are still some differences. The AK90 uses nCoded graphite and I would prefer the non-nCoded graphite of the PS 6.0 85/95, meaning just plain old unadulterated graphite. The AK90 is 11.3 oz.(320g) unstrung, but I would like the PS 6.0 90 to be a bit heavier at about 11.7 oz.(330g) unstrung or about 12.3 oz.(348g) strung. The AK90 is about 7-8 pts. HL, but I would like the PS 6.0 90 to be a bit more headlight at about 10 pts. HL. Also, the AK90 has a 16x19 string pattern but I think the PS 6.0 90 should have the same 16x18 string pattern of the PS 6.0 85/95.

With all that said, it is true that the AK90 is the closest thing to the specs of my desired PS 6.0 90 that is currently available on the market (or not really since they have already stopped making them). I guess that's why I'm currently using the AK90. But I still think a PS 6.0 90 would be even better. Hopefully, Wilson will make it soon. :)

superstition
09-10-2008, 02:09 PM
My ideal specs:

Head size: 90 sq. in.
Strung weight: 13 oz.
Balance: 3 points HL
Length: 27 in.
Beam width: 18mm
Grip: Leather
String pattern: 16 X 18
Stiffness: 15% stiffer than PS 85
Composition: Braided Graphite with boron, plus Kevlar
available in 4 3/4 grip

BreakPoint
09-10-2008, 02:17 PM
My ideal specs:

Head size: 90 sq. in.
Strung weight: 13 oz.
Balance: 3 points HL
Length: 27 in.
Beam width: 18mm
Grip: Leather
String pattern: 16 X 18
Stiffness: 15% stiffer than PS 85
Composition: Braided Graphite with boron, plus Kevlar
available in 4 3/4 grip
You left out Swingweight. I hope you realize that based upon your static weight and balance that the Swingweight would likely be around 360+ or so, right? Also, a stiffness of 15% higher than the PS 6.0 85 would make it a RA of 77.

I could be wrong, but I don't think a racquet that's 13 oz., with a stiffness of RA 77, and with a swingweight of 360+ would be a big seller on the retail market. I think only pros can handle something like that and it would likely take the arms off of most recreational players that would be Wilson's target market for a mass produced racquet.

OleNole
09-10-2008, 05:20 PM
My ideal specs:

Head size: 90 sq. in.
Strung weight: 13 oz.
Balance: 3 points HL
Length: 27 in.
Beam width: 18mm
Grip: Leather
String pattern: 16 X 18
Stiffness: 15% stiffer than PS 85
Composition: Braided Graphite with boron, plus Kevlar
available in 4 3/4 grip

Sorry man, even Sampras couldn't play with that racquet.
Which makes me wonder, why wouldn't the new Sampras stick be a PS 6.0 90? Hasn't he said before that they basically took his old racquet and made it lighter (which would put it in the 12-13 ounce range) and with a 90 sq. in. head? That would be awfully close to BreakPoint's dream stats.

StunLock
09-10-2008, 06:35 PM
So you think Wilson's strategy is not to make a racquet that their customers really want to buy but rather just keep making racquets that we don't want to buy?

My specs for the PS 6.0 90 do indeed come somewhat close to that of the Asian K90. Of course, when I wrote those specs above, the AK90 did not exist (it came out about 3 years later).

However, there are still some differences. The AK90 uses nCoded graphite and I would prefer the non-nCoded graphite of the PS 6.0 85/95, meaning just plain old unadulterated graphite. The AK90 is 11.3 oz.(320g) unstrung, but I would like the PS 6.0 90 to be a bit heavier at about 11.7 oz.(330g) unstrung or about 12.3 oz.(348g) strung. The AK90 is about 7-8 pts. HL, but I would like the PS 6.0 90 to be a bit more headlight at about 10 pts. HL. Also, the AK90 has a 16x19 string pattern but I think the PS 6.0 90 should have the same 16x18 string pattern of the PS 6.0 85/95.

With all that said, it is true that the AK90 is the closest thing to the specs of my desired PS 6.0 90 that is currently available on the market (or not really since they have already stopped making them). I guess that's why I'm currently using the AK90. But I still think a PS 6.0 90 would be even better. Hopefully, Wilson will make it soon. :)

See you answered your own question there. They offer something reasonably good or close to the expectation, and then get your hope up for their latest and greatest 'next generation new technology'.

pmerk34
09-10-2008, 06:49 PM
So you think Wilson's strategy is not to make a racquet that their customers really want to buy but rather just keep making racquets that we don't want to buy?

Wilson is number one in tennis racquet sales by a mile. I'm sure they are aware of the demand on the demand on this board for a pro staff from 1984 and have concluded it's not worth it.