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MaxT
06-12-2006, 12:44 PM
Nadal was sometimes complemented for going into a tennis match like going into a boxing match. He took that to heart on Sunday. I was annoyed by his constant jumping and shadow boxing in the face of Federer, even during the coin toss.

Different sport has different etiquette. Whereas dunking is ok in basketball, hitting an overhead into your opponent in tennis is not, nor is taunting your opponent Mike Tyson style. "I will eat children…" Who wants to see that in tennis? Nadal is a likable kid, and he was probably following his uncles' script behaving this way, but it is a bad one.

PS. Fed will win someday. If good tennis cannot win, the game has a problem.

Slazenger
06-12-2006, 12:45 PM
Nadal was sometimes complemented for going into a tennis match like going into a boxing match. He took that to heart on Sunday. I was annoyed by his constant jumping and shadow boxing in the face of Federer, even during the coin toss.

Different sport has different etiquette. Whereas dunking is ok in basketball, hitting an overhead into your opponent in tennis is not, nor is taunting your opponent Mike Tyson style. "I will eat children…" Who wants to see that in tennis? Nadal is a likable kid, and he was probably following his uncles' script behaving this way, but it is a bad one.

PS. Fed will win someday. If good tennis cannot win, the game has a problem.

Get over yourself!

norcal
06-12-2006, 12:49 PM
PS. Fed will win someday. If good tennis cannot win, the game has a problem.
Shanking every other backhand is good tennis?

unjugon
06-12-2006, 12:50 PM
Federer definitely played "good tennis" in that final...

Moose Malloy
06-12-2006, 12:51 PM
I can't believe you compared Nadal to Tyson. Or compared dunking(a necessary part of the game) to hitting an overhead at your opponent. Yeah that Lebron James is scum, he should go for layups instead(which often give defenders time to block his shot) to make sure no one's feelings are hurt.

And people wonder why tennis isn't considered a real sport in the US. Tennis fans talk more about nonsense(eitquette?) unrelated to the actual game, than fans of other sports do. Tennis really is still in the country club.

You might have fainted had you seen Nastase, McEnroe, Connors play, if you really consider Nadal's behavior inappropriate.

dh003i
06-12-2006, 01:04 PM
Moose,

Yes, an those people should've been expelled from the game for their behaviour.

Tennis and golf should remain sports where the participants act like civilized people, not barbarians.

ChipNCharge
06-12-2006, 01:09 PM
I don't consider Nadal bouncing up and down at the coin flip and then sprinting back to the baseline to be "inappropriate". I think it looks amateurish, like something you'd see Joe Schmoe doing before the second round of the Schenectady Firecracker Open.

MaxT
06-12-2006, 01:09 PM
"You might have fainted had you seen Nastase, McEnroe, Connors play, if you really consider Nadal's behavior inappropriate."

McEnroe, Connors, great players, are very low as a person. They cheat and fake. I doubt they are even that tough in the streets.

I like Nadal, just not jumping like that.

The Pusher Terminator
06-12-2006, 01:10 PM
Nadal was sometimes complemented for going into a tennis match like going into a boxing match. He took that to heart on Sunday. I was annoyed by his constant jumping and shadow boxing in the face of Federer, even during the coin toss.

Different sport has different etiquette. Whereas dunking is ok in basketball, hitting an overhead into your opponent in tennis is not, nor is taunting your opponent Mike Tyson style. "I will eat children…" Who wants to see that in tennis? Nadal is a likable kid, and he was probably following his uncles' script behaving this way, but it is a bad one.

PS. Fed will win someday. If good tennis cannot win, the game has a problem.

What are you....some old fart! I LOVE Nadals fiery demeanor. Its great for tennis. I love Sampras but his demeanor sucked. He was always slouched over and sad looking. He made tennis look bad. Nadal has inspired the game! He is not quite as in your face as Hewitts "Come On". Although his spanish fist pumping "VAMOS" is awesome!

Amone
06-12-2006, 01:12 PM
McEnroe, Connors, great players, are very low as a person.

Max, you're really uneducated about JMac and Connors off court, aren't you? They're both very intelligent, civilized individuals, who are likely less keen on namecalling and mudslinging put together than you seem to be so eager to jump at. Watch your own actions when talking about other people's etiquette.

MaxT
06-12-2006, 01:24 PM
Amo,

They showed their true color when it counted, on court. Exactly because they are intelligent, they are not real. JMac is the best commentator, totally entertaining, but looked at the way he cheated and manipulated on court to benefit himself!

MaxT
06-12-2006, 01:25 PM
And you, The Pusher... Some Old Fart,

Nadal is far more pleasant than you.

exruda
06-12-2006, 01:40 PM
Nadal has inspired the game! He is not quite as in your face as Hewitts "Come On". Although his spanish fist pumping "VAMOS" is awesome!
:confused: You say that "Vamos" with the fist ang leg gesture jumping up 1m is not "in your face"?

Aykhan Mammadov
06-12-2006, 01:47 PM
I agree with u , MaxT. Not physical condition but tennis itself must win. Unfortunately, Fed was very nervous because he is extremely emotional. For him it was historical match so we can understand him - I'd be also very nervous in such a situation.

Luckily, not jumping monkey won the match, but Fed gave him the match without struggle. At least we saw that he was absent during set 2 and almost till the end of the set 4.

MaxT
06-12-2006, 01:48 PM
Web publishing really enabled a totally new class of people to become "authors."

For example, Dan007, he posted
"MaxT, You are an idiot."

What creativity, intelligence does this show. What does this add to anything? Where is the point, what is the point? Dan007? You are just wasting your own time, and everyone else's time in clicking your post. You idiot.

TacoBellBorderBowl1946
06-12-2006, 01:51 PM
your an idiot Max, the kid can do whatever he wants especially when hes reached a level that you will never reach in your life. I don't see Federer complaining, why are you?

federerhoogenbandfan
06-12-2006, 02:04 PM
I can't believe you compared Nadal to Tyson. Or compared dunking(a necessary part of the game) to hitting an overhead at your opponent. Yeah that Lebron James is scum, he should go for layups instead(which often give defenders time to block his shot) to make sure no one's feelings are hurt.

And people wonder why tennis isn't considered a real sport in the US. Tennis fans talk more about nonsense(eitquette?) unrelated to the actual game, than fans of other sports do. Tennis really is still in the country club.

You might have fainted had you seen Nastase, McEnroe, Connors play, if you really consider Nadal's behavior inappropriate.

You are right, it definitely seems what is considered "appropriate" in the last 6-8 years in tennis is much different then what used to be considered "appropriate". For some reason the powers that be decided to tighten the screws on "proper behavior" out there. Why players all acting like zombies out there is what they hope for only they know.

dh003i
06-12-2006, 02:18 PM
You are right, it definitely seems what is considered "appropriate" in the last 6-8 years in tennis is much different then what used to be considered "appropriate". For some reason the powers that be decided to tighten the screws on "proper behavior" out there. Why players all acting like zombies out there is what they hope for only they know.

Well, tennis is supposed to be a gentleman's game. A game that a good family can watch together. Unfortunately, Connors and McEnroe changed all of that. Monfils is the latest trend in disgrace.

Anything that changes this, I'm all for. I want to watch tennis, not some jerk fist-pumping or constantly dancing in celebration.

jackson vile
06-12-2006, 02:48 PM
Nadal was sometimes complemented for going into a tennis match like going into a boxing match. He took that to heart on Sunday. I was annoyed by his constant jumping and shadow boxing in the face of Federer, even during the coin toss.

Different sport has different etiquette. Whereas dunking is ok in basketball, hitting an overhead into your opponent in tennis is not, nor is taunting your opponent Mike Tyson style. "I will eat children…" Who wants to see that in tennis? Nadal is a likable kid, and he was probably following his uncles' script behaving this way, but it is a bad one.

PS. Fed will win someday. If good tennis cannot win, the game has a problem.

Moron alert:rolleyes:

thehustler
06-12-2006, 03:00 PM
Tennis is a gentleman's game? Geez no wonder nobody watches it in the US. We have basketball, football, baseball, soccer, hockey, all these other sports that have contact, fights, drama, personalities that people can relate to. I can relate to basketball players because I play it and because of the emotion involved. People can't say the same about tennis. If everyone they see on tv is just emotionless and hitting a ball how can they relate to the players? Relating to the players is a big thing for a lot of people. To the hardcore fans a lot of us would love to be calm in the face of danger and some would love to be pumped like Nadal or Hewitt. To the casual viewer you need something that draws them in. If they just see two guys hitting a ball back and forth then why should they care? If they see those 2 guys do the same thing and is pumped at the end of the point it can get them pumped and interested.

Tennis, like all sports needs all kinds of personalities. You need the hero, the bad guy, the antihero, etc. to make things interesting. If all sports were just played by robots none of us would watch or play. As long as tennis appears to be a gentleman's game then that's who will watch and play it...gentlemen. Sure 'punks' can 'ruin the game' but it makes it all the more interesting to watch. Hooray for Nadal. Hooray for Federer. They're two opposites that make this game interesting. They have a rivalry that's great for the sport. Just look at the commotion it causes on this site. How many of us truly act like gentlemen or ladies out there on the court? How many of us have never thrown a fit or pulled something like Nadal or Hewitt to get ourselves back into a match or pumped up for one? Very few I suppose. Tennis is a gentleman's game? Blah.

federerhoogenbandfan
06-12-2006, 03:13 PM
Tennis is a gentleman's game? Geez no wonder nobody watches it in the US. We have basketball, football, baseball, soccer, hockey, all these other sports that have contact, fights, drama, personalities that people can relate to. I can relate to basketball players because I play it and because of the emotion involved. People can't say the same about tennis. If everyone they see on tv is just emotionless and hitting a ball how can they relate to the players? Relating to the players is a big thing for a lot of people. To the hardcore fans a lot of us would love to be calm in the face of danger and some would love to be pumped like Nadal or Hewitt. To the casual viewer you need something that draws them in. If they just see two guys hitting a ball back and forth then why should they care? If they see those 2 guys do the same thing and is pumped at the end of the point it can get them pumped and interested.

Tennis, like all sports needs all kinds of personalities. You need the hero, the bad guy, the antihero, etc. to make things interesting. If all sports were just played by robots none of us would watch or play. As long as tennis appears to be a gentleman's game then that's who will watch and play it...gentlemen. Sure 'punks' can 'ruin the game' but it makes it all the more interesting to watch. Hooray for Nadal. Hooray for Federer. They're two opposites that make this game interesting. They have a rivalry that's great for the sport. Just look at the commotion it causes on this site. How many of us truly act like gentlemen or ladies out there on the court? How many of us have never thrown a fit or pulled something like Nadal or Hewitt to get ourselves back into a match or pumped up for one? Very few I suppose. Tennis is a gentleman's game? Blah.

Americans dont like hockey, even as a non-American I know that, the embarassing TV ratings, and attendance in NHL cities in the U.S speak to that. You are right on the other sports though, tennis needs to make itself more open to more action and demonstrativeness on court, all this "keep it very congenial, and show proper etiquette" is BS if tennis really wants to attract U.S viewers and the money that comes with them, especialy at a time where the U.S does not have as many top players as before.

dewey2110
06-12-2006, 03:33 PM
Nadal was sometimes complemented for going into a tennis match like going into a boxing match. He took that to heart on Sunday. I was annoyed by his constant jumping and shadow boxing in the face of Federer, even during the coin toss.

Different sport has different etiquette. Whereas dunking is ok in basketball, hitting an overhead into your opponent in tennis is not, nor is taunting your opponent Mike Tyson style. "I will eat children…" Who wants to see that in tennis? Nadal is a likable kid, and he was probably following his uncles' script behaving this way, but it is a bad one.

PS. Fed will win someday. If good tennis cannot win, the game has a problem.

And how do you define "good tennis"?
Ok, maybe Fed and you guys Fed fans play classic tennis-flat strokes-eastern,semi W grip and think that's the way it should be. Well, its not. Nadal is a talented kid. He plays with enthusiastism to bring out exciting games for the audiences. Whenever he loses, he just simply show some regrets on his face for a few seconds, never more. Fed, who's stayed on the #1 spot quite long, thinks he's the best. I've seen enough of his arrogant attitude. You guys (Fed fans) just simply dont want to see Fed goes down. Fed hasnt found a way to deal with that extreme topspin that Nadal creates in every shots. Thats why he's upset in games with Nadal. Have you ever seen Nadal throw or smash his racquet like Fed did? you ever seen him shows frustration like Fed did? Yes, he jumps around...so what? Do u just stand there and wait for the ball to come to you? He tries the bring the excitement to the audiences, he doesnt give up any points. Thats what sport is all about, excitements, fun...Iam not a Nadal fan, but he thinks hes a great competitor , and Fed, on the other hand, is losing my respect everyday. Argument about Nadal and Fed will never go anywhere, Fed's fans stay Fed's fans, Nadal's fans stay Nadal's fans...So why dont you just stop hating and go play some tennis, have some fun?

thehustler
06-12-2006, 03:35 PM
Yeah I was just picking random sports from the top of my head. I'm not really into hockey, nor do I understand all the rules, but when I watch it, especially during the playoffs I find it exciting. It just draws me in. Same with football. I've played football and just seeing what they do excites me. Tennis does need to market itself better. The only ads I see are Roddick for Lacoste, which shows him just practicing basically and the one for Wimbledon where it shows some action and I believe a little emotion from Serena. They need more ads like that, with emotion, heck just take some crazy point from a tournament, like yesterday w/Fed running around in that one game in the last set and have Nike market it. Sure they both wear Nike, but it would make a great ad. We also need to not worry about how many top pros there are in the US and instead just enjoy the tennis that we see. I figure as long as you bring it on the court I'll be entertained no matter where you're from. I just wish everyone else could see it that way.

simi
06-12-2006, 03:37 PM
Nadal was sometimes complemented for going into a tennis match like going into a boxing match. He took that to heart on Sunday. I was annoyed by his constant jumping and shadow boxing in the face of Federer, even during the coin toss.

MaxT,

I'm glad that I finally got the Tennis Channel and was able to watch a bunch of Nadal matches this spring. Best thing about TTC is that they showed the whole match, even the coin flip and warm-up. They used to do that in the old days on network broadcasts, but these days, that time is filled with commercials and meaningless commentary.

Anyway, Nadal is a very ritualistic person. He does the same for every match. He goes out to his chair, arranges his bags just right. The opponent goes out to center court with the umpire for the coin flip. Nadal takes a drink of whatever it is that he drinks. Places his two water bottles just so on the ground, always in the same spot in the same order, turning the labels just so. He then ingests something that comes in a little tub. Must be an energy gel or something. Only then does he go out to center court. His opponent and umpire are just waiting patiently.

After the coin flip, he always runs back to the baseline is his little "S" curved path, and starts the warm-up. It was a little strange the first time I saw it and looked amateurish. But, he does it every time. I see it as being a little "in your face", but without being overt or rude. He definitly has the upper hand, psychologically over his opponents.

It's just his ritual.

Slazenger
06-12-2006, 03:45 PM
MaxT,

I'm glad that I finally got the Tennis Channel and was able to watch a bunch of Nadal matches this spring. Best thing about TTC is that they showed the whole match, even the coin flip and warm-up. They used to do that in the old days on network broadcasts, but these days, that time is filled with commercials and meaningless commentary.

Anyway, Nadal is a very ritualistic person. He does the same for every match. He goes out to his chair, arranges his bags just right. The opponent goes out to center court with the umpire for the coin flip. Nadal takes a drink of whatever it is that he drinks. Places his two water bottles just so on the ground, always in the same spot in the same order, turning the labels just so. He then ingests something that comes in a little tub. Must be an energy gel or something. Only then does he go out to center court. His opponent and umpire are just waiting patiently.

After the coin flip, he always runs back to the baseline is his little "S" curved path, and starts the warm-up. It was a little strange the first time I saw it and looked amateurish. But, he does it every time. I see it as being a little "in your face", but without being overt or rude. He definitly has the upper hand, psychologically over his opponents.

It's just his ritual.

Even if it wasn't his ritual, who is MR. "Nobody" Max T to tell Nadal, defending FO champion playing the biggest match of his career to date against Federer going for the grandslam how to act?
He should act genteel so as not to ruffle gentleman Max T's feathers???

Like I said, get over yourself!

The Pusher Terminator
06-12-2006, 06:18 PM
If you guys had it your way everyone would act like Sampras. I love Pete but he always looked like he was either going to throw up or he was very depressed. He was always slouched over. It was a terrible image for tennis....VAMOS is far more exciting than boring old Pete.

The Golden age of tennis was the glory years when opposites like Mcenroe and Borg faced each other. Nadal vs. fed is great for tennis . The contrast in style in every sense of the word makes for awesome entertainment.

Breaker
06-12-2006, 06:27 PM
Well, tennis is supposed to be a gentleman's game. A game that a good family can watch together. Unfortunately, Connors and McEnroe changed all of that. Monfils is the latest trend in disgrace.

Anything that changes this, I'm all for. I want to watch tennis, not some jerk fist-pumping or constantly dancing in celebration.

Are you seriously comparing Monfils' on court demeanor to Conners and McEnroe?

tlm
06-12-2006, 07:09 PM
To dewey2110,You are exactly right,very well put.When i first saw nadal,i was not sure how to take him.I thought who is this guy with these goofy pants jumping all over the place.

But after watching him for a couple of years now,i dont know how anybody can deny the excitement+intensity that this kid brings to the court.His energy+will to win is hard to match.

You are also correct about the styles of play,these old schoolers hate the western grips + topspin baseline game of today.

They want to watch the old slomo tennis,that was the only way you could get a point back then was to come to the net.Nobody could hit the ball hard enough from the baseline.

You ever try watching some old matches?It looks like the ball is barely moving, i think that kind of tennis is boring.

mileslong
06-12-2006, 07:18 PM
another tim and pusher nadal circlejerk...geez...

dewey2110
06-12-2006, 07:27 PM
tlm, thank you for understanding...
Thats exactly what happened to me when I first saw Nadal too. When I first saw him couples of years ago, I thought who is this ugly kid wearing different clothes and stuff...hes gained my respect as time goes by because of his will to win, his effort in every shots, his concentration in the games. Tennis is such a great sport because it allows many styles of play. Thats what makes the game so exciting. I just think that we should be fair in judging these players by really looking into their games. The same thing always happen in every sport, when a player plays differently, he then is told that it's wrong, and the people who told him so is only upset cos they couldnt find a way to deal with it.

fastdunn
06-12-2006, 07:42 PM
I love Nadal's pre-match routine.
Tennis is boxing in disguise, anyway.
Agassi's dad was a boxer. It showed in Agassi's game.

Blue Drop
06-12-2006, 08:01 PM
Nadal looked like an idiot during the coin toss. Sorry. For him. Idiot.

And I don't really care whether or not tennis is a gentleman's sport or whatever. I prefer it not be, actually. But what I really prefer is that people don't embarass themselves like that. Especially if you're then going to play the first set like a J.V. girl. Puh-lease.

dewey2110
06-12-2006, 08:53 PM
some people just dont care about the subject matter and drop couples of meaningless, useless and yet offensive comments. P-A-T-H-E-T-I-C !

tlm
06-13-2006, 02:09 PM
hey blue drop,nadal played bad the first set+ then took fed out again.The one that was embarrassed was fed,in the 4th set he looked like he just gave up.

WayneCM
06-13-2006, 02:30 PM
firstly i'll stress i am neither "fan" nor "hater" of either player but after watching several of their encounters i've picked up a couple of things...
1. Nadal enrages federer: ie. Delaying serve, constantly fidgiting...
2. Federer goes for 2 much 2 soon and at the wrong times
3. Nadals key is consistancy
Look at the stats of his matches, a lot of the unforced errors by opponants make up the margin of victory...
4. Federer lacks patience and control because he is afraid to loose 2 nadal, which invariably he does.
5. Nadal has a game and personality that is exactly what federer does not want to play...

FedererUberAlles
06-13-2006, 03:04 PM
firstly i'll stress i am neither "fan" nor "hater" of either player but after watching several of their encounters i've picked up a couple of things...
1. Nadal enrages federer: ie. Delaying serve, constantly fidgiting...
2. Federer goes for 2 much 2 soon and at the wrong times
3. Nadals key is consistancy
Look at the stats of his matches, a lot of the unforced errors by opponants make up the margin of victory...
4. Federer lacks patience and control because he is afraid to loose 2 nadal, which invariably he does.
5. Nadal has a game and personality that is exactly what federer does not want to play...

If Federer wasn't patient, he would have shown emotion. It's not that he's impatient, it's that he's inconsistent.

oscar_2424
06-13-2006, 04:58 PM
Nadal was sometimes complemented for going into a tennis match like going into a boxing match. He took that to heart on Sunday. I was annoyed by his constant jumping and shadow boxing in the face of Federer, even during the coin toss.

Different sport has different etiquette. Whereas dunking is ok in basketball, hitting an overhead into your opponent in tennis is not, nor is taunting your opponent Mike Tyson style. "I will eat children…" Who wants to see that in tennis? Nadal is a likable kid, and he was probably following his uncles' script behaving this way, but it is a bad one.

PS. Fed will win someday. If good tennis cannot win, the game has a problem.
Another useless thread

diegaa
06-13-2006, 06:39 PM
Nadal was sometimes complemented for going into a tennis match like going into a boxing match. He took that to heart on Sunday. I was annoyed by his constant jumping and shadow boxing in the face of Federer, even during the coin toss.

Different sport has different etiquette. Whereas dunking is ok in basketball, hitting an overhead into your opponent in tennis is not, nor is taunting your opponent Mike Tyson style. "I will eat children…" Who wants to see that in tennis? Nadal is a likable kid, and he was probably following his uncles' script behaving this way, but it is a bad one.

PS. Fed will win someday. If good tennis cannot win, the game has a problem.


I agree 100%. Well, actually it would be 100% if u eliminate that PS.

The Pusher Terminator
06-13-2006, 07:08 PM
Do You know what this post is really about? The fact that Nadal has kicked Feds butt all year long has driven Fed fans crazy. So now they have to find some to put Nadal down. The truth however is that Nadal is a humble and talented kid with more fire in his pinky than Fed has in his entire body. Now stop behaving like a sore loser and give the new kid on th block the respect that he deserves.

Blue Drop
06-13-2006, 08:08 PM
hey blue drop,nadal played bad the first set+ then took fed out again.The one that was embarrassed was fed,in the 4th set he looked like he just gave up.

I don't disagree with this. I'm just saying, Nadal's antics at the opening made me cringe. A staredown? Sprinting back to the baseline? Only to fold like a blowup doll in the first set? C'mon. Grow up.

diegaa
06-14-2006, 05:21 AM
Do You know what this post is really about? The fact that Nadal has kicked Feds butt all year long has driven Fed fans crazy. So now they have to find some to put Nadal down. The truth however is that Nadal is a humble and talented kid with more fire in his pinky than Fed has in his entire body. Now stop behaving like a sore loser and give the new kid on th block the respect that he deserves.

I´ve been thinking of this since spain won the DC in 2004. I dont know "whats this post is really about" to the others, im speaking for me. And im no rafa or fed fan. Actually, it would be kinda nice if another player could win on a constant basis to these two.

Gilgamesh
06-14-2006, 05:36 AM
:rolleyes:

Dedans Penthouse
06-14-2006, 05:59 AM
I love Nadal's pre-match routine.
Tennis is boxing in disguise, anyway.
Agassi's dad was a boxer. It showed in Agassi's game.
Or as Bud Collins (who first was a boxing writer for the Boston Globe) described tennis:
"boxing without bloodshed."

As for "boxing," forget Nadal. Gimme Maria Sharapova instead; I would love to see her box.

Back to Nadal: (being picayune) did anyone notice that when Nadal raced back to the basline after the coin toss and the ballboy bounced a ball to him....that he snatched at the ball but "Bill Buckner" BRICKED it? Roberto "Hands of Stone" Duran could not have done it any better. Error Rafa.

Gilgamesh
06-14-2006, 06:14 AM
Gimme Maria Sharapova instead; I would love to see her box.


Why? It is not like her boxing skills are that rounded. In fact I would say her punches are pretty flat.

MR. 81
06-14-2006, 08:34 AM
People who criticise Nadal's acts of not provocation but self motivation are just loosers and hypocrites. If they ever won a point with half the quality of those which cause Rafa's fist pumping they would take out their shirts and swing them over their heads while they run around the court throwing kisses to the public. And the same for most of the pros on tour.

Of course that is never gonna happen.

One thing is clear: people who feel insulted by Nadal's behaviour will never be convinced that he is not doing wrong, no matter the argument we use. That's why it is called a feeling. But, believe it or not, Nadal is a respectful guy and a good person. You can feel that when he talks for spanish tv and newspapers. But of course the rest of the world has a narrower perspective. I'm not defending him because I'm spanish: let me tell you Fernando Alonso, spanish F1 world champion, is a full of himself, disrespectful arrogant b*stard... So please believe me, Rafa is a nice guy.

ps: Fed is able to win those points but he's just a little bit cold blooded...

dh003i
06-14-2006, 08:47 AM
81,

Well, Federer and Sampras win point of that "quality" all the time, and you very rarely see them engaging in fist-pumping and showmanship.

Dilettante
06-14-2006, 08:55 AM
believe it or not, Nadal is a respectful guy and a good person. You can feel that when he talks for spanish tv and newspapers. But of course the rest of the world has a narrower perspective. I'm not defending him because I'm spanish: let me tell you Fernando Alonso, spanish F1 world champion, is a full of himself, disrespectful arrogant b*stard... So please believe me, Rafa is a nice guy.

I have to agree with those points.

It's true that many people out of Spain has a narrow perspective of Nadal, but when one is used to hear Nadal Spanish interviews and so, well, one just can't say that Nadal is disrespectful. I think many of his fighting attitudes are misunderstood. He genuinely seems a good guy. Hope he won't change.

diegaa
06-14-2006, 09:00 AM
He is nice guy alright, nobody is arguing that, but his behaviour on court. I dont like it and of course, im not the only one. He´s really a bull out there and his wishes for glory r teh envy of many players, but he crosses the line with the celebration of opponents mistakes.

tennisjunkiela
06-14-2006, 09:43 AM
I love Nadal's pre-match routine.
Tennis is boxing in disguise, anyway.
Agassi's dad was a boxer. It showed in Agassi's game.

nadal backs up his pre-match routine with match intensity and wins so i hope he keeps doing whatever works for him

exruda
06-14-2006, 09:51 AM
You can have a guy walking around saying "I will kill you all" and being a nice person who would not hurt a fly at the same time. I don't think anyone says Nadal is not a nice guy. But, as others have stressed, his behavior on court looks excessively triumphant. Even for those who look and admire the manner in which he wins points.

MR. 81
06-14-2006, 10:01 AM
He is nice guy alright, nobody is arguing that, but his behaviour on court. I dont like it and of course, im not the only one. He´s really a bull out there and his wishes for glory r teh envy of many players, but he crosses the line with the celebration of opponents mistakes.

well...that only happens when he breaks their serve or sees a turning point in the match. Otherwise he won't do it.

But anyway I insist that everybody has the right to feel insulted or offended with his celebration. It goes with your culture or character. Not everybody sees or feels things the same way. In USA kissing a young girl is sexual harassment. In Belgium guys (not gays) kissed me when we were introduced to each other and I didn't like it, but it was normal for them. I imagine some other people would have beaten them hard. It's just a matter of perspective, understanding other people's behaviour even if you dislike it. And the counterpart is respect, if you tell them not to do it. Until now no other player has told Nadal not to behave like that.

Dilettante
06-14-2006, 10:20 AM
You can have a guy walking around saying "I will kill you all" and being a nice person who would not hurt a fly at the same time. I don't think anyone says Nadal is not a nice guy. But, as others have stressed, his behavior on court looks excessively triumphant. Even for those who look and admire the manner in which he wins points.

Yes, I understand your point.

Don't know, maybe I'm not truly objective because being a Spaniard and I don't realize that. But believe me, I'm trying to be objective and I think I am.

About his oncourt behaviour, I don't dislike it. Maybe the thing that I find more inappropiate is the excessive time he usually gets before serving, that I suspect goes longer than the legally allowed.

But about he being excessively triumphant, I guess many people could agree with you. I respect that point of view, but that's not my point of view: I like that fire on the court.

In D Zone
06-14-2006, 10:34 AM
Don't understand why some people are so critical when players do their ritual before a game to physed themselves up. This is what make each of us unique. Everyone of us different and we response in different ways!
Nadals boxers jog and fist pumping yelling out 'vamos' were considered outlandish! You are joking me! PRO- Tennis is Entertainment - BIG $$$ at stake. I am sure you will do your own wiggling and jiggling if you are in this position; you will do whatever it takes to put yourself in the groove. LOUD, absurd or just quietly assuming a yoga position -its all good ! As long the players don't yell profanity or throw tantrum towards another person.

Then there is issue about frowning for celebrating when your opponent made a mistake.... I thought that is what tennis is all about? The game is won by hitting winners, minimized your errors and simple forcing your opponent to make the mistakes (aka percentage tennis). Why can't you celebrate if you played your best in keeping your errors down thus forcing your opponent to make the error. If you don't understand this concept- don't play tennis!

So if a player retires in the middle of a champonship match due to injury or illness - you won't collect your winnings because its Un-Gentlemen like to win a game that was not technically completed.
How about let us throw stones at a player who smashed his/ her racquet because they are upset?
Let's talk about that too! And the list goes on and on......

Buttom line >>>
Its the PRO circuit, in an OPEN era ! This is not your friendly neighborhood or at an exclusive club matches. OPEN means everyone - You got game you are in! Players know what's at stake. Then you'll get one or more odd character that is charismatic; rocks the cradle!

I think this is GREAT! It's Refreshing! It's good for the game; attracts new audience! And it's good business (TV ratings has improved compared to last year!)

Change is good! But again there are those who don't like change - I respect that. Hoping the conservatives will reciprocate.

Let ATP and WTA do their jobs to regulate the game - if they did not complain so why should you?

exruda
06-14-2006, 10:39 AM
Don't know, maybe I'm not truly objective because being a Spaniard and I don't realize that. But believe me, I'm trying to be objective and I think I am.

I am by no means saying you are biased when describing the behavior of a spanish player.
I do not think anyone can be "objective" here, because it is a matter of opinion :D

It's just a question of percentages, I guess. Just nice to see there are more people than myself who say that they are troubled by Rafa's behavior.

exruda
06-14-2006, 10:43 AM
Then there is issue about frowning for celebrating when your opponent made a mistake.... I thought that is what tennis is all about? The game is won by hitting winners, minimized your errors and simple forcing your opponent to make the mistakes (aka percentage tennis). Why can't you celebrate if you played your best in keeping your errors down thus forcing your opponent to make the error. If you don't understand this concept- don't play tennis!

Then why do the players always make apologizing gestures when they hit a net cord? Even if they do not really feel too sad about it?

Tennis is not all about celebrating winning a point regardless of the manner it has been achieved; and the classy players do not think so, either.

In D Zone
06-14-2006, 11:00 AM
Then why do the players always make apologizing gestures when they hit a net cord? Even if they do not really feel too sad about it?

Tennis is not all about celebrating winning a point regardless of the manner it has been achieved; and the classy players do not think so, either.

Answer to your question - because it was done unintentionally. It not like you are doing a drop shot.

The word 'celebrating' can mean differently on each side of the net.... I am not going to parse you with semantics.
That is for you to interprete - loudly or quietly! ;)

exruda
06-14-2006, 11:10 AM
Answer to your question - because it was done unintentionally. It not like you are doing a drop shot.

OK, but let's say you do hit a drop shot, and let's say the opponent has enough time to get there, but he trips and falls down. Do you celebrate then? You forced him to make an error, didn't you?
So where's the line between "unintentional" and opponents unforced errors? You shouldn't triumph in any of these cases, IMO.

Dilettante
06-14-2006, 01:25 PM
I am by no means saying you are biased when describing the behavior of a spanish player.

I know, I know. I only wanted to separate myself from some "blind fans" or "blind bashers" that can be found on this board, and who are even beyond the Subjective Cosmos.

I do not think anyone can be "objective" here, because it is a matter of opinion :D

Lol, you're right.

K-kita
06-14-2006, 01:54 PM
PS. Fed will win someday. If good tennis cannot win, the game has a problem.
Probably you wanted to say: "Fed will win someday. If my idol cannot win, I have a problem"

K-kita
06-14-2006, 02:09 PM
Last milestone for Nadal's haters is his supposedly bad behaviour. That's a good new. Nadal's tennis is no more in question.
If Nadal would have Hewitt's or Coria's behaviour I'm sure that any moron will repeat Seles' tragedy. I can't understand those attitudes. To hate a guy because of his victories against your favourite player. It's just pathetic.

diegaa
06-14-2006, 04:59 PM
well...that only happens when he breaks their serve or sees a turning point in the match. Otherwise he won't do it.

But anyway I insist that everybody has the right to feel insulted or offended with his celebration. It goes with your culture or character. Not everybody sees or feels things the same way. In USA kissing a young girl is sexual harassment. In Belgium guys (not gays) kissed me when we were introduced to each other and I didn't like it, but it was normal for them. I imagine some other people would have beaten them hard. It's just a matter of perspective, understanding other people's behaviour even if you dislike it. And the counterpart is respect, if you tell them not to do it. Until now no other player has told Nadal not to behave like that.

Ok, sr.81, but u should see it the other way round. When u r a newbie in anything u should stick to the established rules. Otherwise you r an outsider or a revolutionary. So far, Nadal is an outsider concerning this matter.