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View Full Version : Why should a player try hybrid strings?


Coach Reed
09-27-2006, 01:22 AM
Well, ball pocketing is extremely difficult to quantify, and there are almost certainly different pocketing profiles. For example, the pocketing produced by natural gut is going to be different at least in degree and time/distance than that produced by nylon. The consensus seems to be that natural gut offers more control than nylon, which means the pocketing works better, somehow.

On the other hand, with the stiffer polys, you get much less pocketing, which seems to lead to more control because with reduced string deflection, you are looking at more ball deflection on impact, which seems to be a more linear response than string deflection.

Hard hitting Players seeking durability, comfort, power, control and increased sweetspot size may want to consider a hybrid string combination of Polyester main strings and Multifilament crosses. The player's ability to generate moderate-excessive topspin is a key factor in the selecting of this type of hybrid.

Some other factors in selecting a combination of strings and tension that will compliment this player type include: Ball embedding potential; string gauge as it relates to string pattern density, tension loss, ball pocketing and feel. Achieving all of these optimal factors creates, what I call,
Maximum Controllable Power or MCP.

Because the polyester main strings embed into the ball so well, it is easier to control than a stringbed of all synthetic multifilament or natural multifilament (gut) strings. A stringbed composed of entirely polyester is very rigid and transmits an exhorbitant amount of frame shock to the player's arm and can be potentially damaging when strung at a high tension.

Greg Raven,
Although ball pocketing is difficult to quantify, Babolat has developed a method of measuring stringbed stiffness units with the Racquet Diagnostic Center or RDC machine (as you probably already know).
http://www.sandiaracquetservices.com/reference/tech-sheet.htm
The Klip X-plosive 17 gauge hybrid that I use loses about 21 RDC stringbed stiffness units over a period of about 6 weeks when initially strung at
mid + 2 (reference tension of 57 pounds). Initial stringbed stiffness measured 71 units. It steadily decreased to a resting point of 50 units.

Ball pocketing, in my opinion, appears to be an effectual factor in controlling the ball. Although you constantly hear that if you string above the mid point you will get more control, and below mid you get more power. In the case of Polyester main strings and soft cross string hybrids, control can be achieved at lower tensions due to the ball embedding properties of the polyester main strings, and dwell time.

At lower tensions the trampoline effect of the stringbed plunges the ball more deeply into the racquet face and launches it back with greater force than a stringbed strung at a higher tension. The ball stays in contact with the strings longer. In theory, as the racquet strikes from low to high and the polyester embeds into the ball, because the ball stays on the stringbed longer, it is carried toward a higher vertical point before leaving the stringbed. I discovered this phenomenon when I was trying to achieve maximum velocity while maintaining control. The string combination I used was Luxilon Big Banger ALU Rough 16L Mains and Babolat VS natural Gut 17. I started at the mid point (first stringing) then mid minus 1 (second stringing) mid minus 2 (third stringing) and finally mid minus 3 (fourth stringing). For my strokes, mid minus 3 was too powerful and difficult to control. I determined that mid minus 2 was the point of Maximum Controllable Power (with this hybrid and the racuet I was using at the time). The remarkable residual effect was the ability of this hybrid to create exceptional feel, comfort and control. I have been playing with these hybrids for about three years now, and have just recently determined that ball pocketing is one of the main factors in control. I now string at mid + 2 because I use a stiffer, more powerful racquet and allow for tension loss.

In addition, the RSI Sept/Oct 2005 issue is an excellent reference guide for tension loss and overall stringbed stiffness of all of the strings and (string gauges) that were on the market at that time. The stringbeds they measured and recorded weren't hybrids, but based on their results it is easy to theorize how different string combinations will respond with one another.

The only negative I have been able to find with this string hybrid combination is the tension loss, but due to the ball embedding and ball pocketing, it is easy for an advanced player to adapt to.

What do you think???
_________________
USPTA, USRSA MRT
Volkl DNX 10 Midplus (18x20) Customized to 12.4>>>327>>>9HL
Klip X-plosive 17 @ mid + 2 (M: Poly & X: Natty)
NEOS 1000

jackson vile
09-27-2006, 08:40 AM
I want to try that setup in reverse but how long did the alupower hold tension for?

gfdoto
09-27-2006, 09:24 AM
Thanks. This is a question that was on my mind.

Coach Reed
09-27-2006, 01:41 PM
I want to try that setup in reverse but how long did the alupower hold tension for?

Alu 16L holds it's tension a little better than the K-boom 17 (in the X-plosive) with a tension loss of 17.13 lbs (RSI Sept/Oct 2005) and the K-boom 17 loses
17.99 lbs. Alu rough 16L lost 18.98 lbs.

The Alu 16L hybrid will steadily lose tension over a 6 week period just like the X-plosive settling at a higher stringbed stiffness reading. The intial tension loss overnight is only about 2 RDC stringbed stiffness units, so the first hittinig session is extremely boardy at mid + 2 but after that it settles in pretty nicely. Because of the pronounce tension loss I've found that mid + 2 seems to come to a controllable resting point.

I've been told by a colleague that many of the ATP players that use this type of hybrid cut it out after a few weeks. At mid + 2, I have been able to adapt without any problems due to the excellent ball embedding of the Poly main. It may be a little different effect with the Gut in the mains but if it is good enough for Federer, it must work pretty well.

If you do reverse it, you may want to consider usinig string savers like elastocross to reduce frictional notching or you can blow through the Gut pretty fast...

Incidentally Babolat VS touch 16 measured 8.31 lbs tension loss
(all gut stringbed) Bab natty 17 lost 8.45 lbs
Klip Legend 17 lost 9.31 lbs & Klip legend 16 lost 8.77 lbs

Utilizing this information, you can try and select a combination that will have the best tension maintanence.

Incidentally, I found better tension maintenance with synthetic multifilament strings. In particular Klip Detonator 17
(18 gauge Poly main and 17 gauge synthetic multifilament crosses). It is less expensive than natty gut and seemed to work out pretty well during tennis season for ALL of my players at mid + 2.
_________________
USPTA, USRSA MRT
Volkl DNX 10 Midplus (18x20) Customized to 12.4>>>327>>>9HL
Klip X-plosive 17 @ mid + 2 (M: Poly & X: Natty)
NEOS 1000

steve s
09-27-2006, 07:21 PM
please name one ATP players that plays with the same poly strings for two weeks. Get real, AUL for 6 weeks, noway!!!

jackson vile
09-28-2006, 08:10 AM
I quoted you so you can't edit. Just...Wow.

What do you mean "Wow"? Are you that stupid? You elicit a reaction from him, being your regular moron self LOL:mrgreen: And you say wow when you get the reaction you were working for?:rolleyes:

Coach don't sweat it at all, most the the people on these boards are nobodies, can't play to save their families honor, and if you actually saw them practicing would most likely be emberassed for them LOL


That is why they talk the way they do here on the boards, their life sucks as they are treated like losers in the real world, they come here to be cool LOL:mrgreen:

You can't help but feel somewhat sorry for them

andrew_b
09-28-2006, 08:50 AM
Alu 16L holds it's tension a little better than the K-boom 17 (in the X-plosive) with a tension loss of 17.13 lbs (RSI Sept/Oct 2005) and the K-boom 17 loses
17.99 lbs. Alu rough 16L lost 18.98 lbs.

The Alu 16L hybrid will steadily lose tension over a 6 week period just like the X-plosive settling at a higher stringbed stiffness reading. The intial tension loss overnight is only about 2 RDC stringbed stiffness units, so the first hittinig session is extremely boardy at mid + 2 but after that it settles in pretty nicely. Because of the pronounce tension loss I've found that mid + 2 seems to come to a controllable resting point.

<snip>

Incidentally Babolat VS touch 16 measured 8.31 lbs tension loss
(all gut stringbed) Bab natty 17 lost 8.45 lbs
Klip Legend 17 lost 9.31 lbs & Klip legend 16 lost 8.77 lbs

Utilizing this information, you can try and select a combination that will have the best tension maintanence.

Incidentally, I found better tension maintenance with synthetic multifilament strings. In particular Klip Detonator 17
(18 gauge Poly main and 17 gauge synthetic multifilament crosses). It is less expensive than natty gut and seemed to work out pretty well during tennis season for ALL of my players at mid + 2.

hey Coach Reed,

I'm going to play around with some natural gut, both full sets and hybrids. I'm starting with Bab Tonic+ 16, then will try VS, Klip, BDE.

I currently string my frame at mid -0.5 (range is 55-62, string at 58 ) using Wilson NXT Tour 18 guage.

Two questions you might be able to help based on your experience:
At what tension should I string a full set of babolat Tonic+ based on my current setup? And at what tension should I string a hybrid made up of the Tonic+ 16g mains/NXT tour 18 cross? Side note, should I evenm bother with the hybrid, as I'm not a string breaker? (NXT is being used simply because that's what I've got laying around - have a set or 2 of NRG2 left as well, but it seems pretty similar to the NXT Tour).

Any thoughts appreciated.

play well,
Andrew

You cannot be serious !!!
09-28-2006, 08:06 PM
Hey guys - Coach has been banned, if you didn't notice

He did have some good info though..........

BigServer1
09-28-2006, 09:13 PM
Does anyone know why he was banned? I don't read everything on here...just wondering.

BaseLineBash
09-29-2006, 01:28 AM
What do you mean "Wow"? Are you that stupid? You elicit a reaction from him, being your regular moron self LOL:mrgreen: And you say wow when you get the reaction you were working for?:rolleyes:

Coach don't sweat it at all, most the the people on these boards are nobodies, can't play to save their families honor, and if you actually saw them practicing would most likely be emberassed for them LOL


That is why they talk the way they do here on the boards, their life sucks as they are treated like losers in the real world, they come here to be cool LOL:mrgreen:

You can't help but feel somewhat sorry for them
His post was insane. Do you work for the ACLU by any chance?

andrew_b
09-29-2006, 04:22 AM
OK, so any responses on my question?

thanks,
Andrew