3.0 Benchmarked wanting to be 3.5

Discussion in 'Adult League & Tournament Talk' started by MRfStop, Dec 29, 2013.

  1. beernutz

    beernutz Hall of Fame

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    What about the current winter season? Does it not count towards NTRP in Southern?
     
    #51
  2. g4driver

    g4driver Hall of Fame

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    3.5 wasn't that strange to me- most 3.5s are better than most 3.0s and not as good as most 4.0s. Some 3.5s are clearly out of level - some too highly rated and others are rated too low.

    The is a big difference between the two 3.5s I posted about- one is better than nearly half the of 4.0 on my team. He was held back by another 3.5 with the mental game of a 2.0 - the other 3.5 who refused to play 3.5 lost more than half the matches he played at 3.5 - he is clearly a below average 3.5 .

    The better 3.5 doesn't want to play with the mental dwarf, and in reality he has no business at 3.5. He is dominate at 3.5 singles, but played only doubles on a 3.5 team. The other two singles players are horrible at doubles. He was clearly the best singles player and doubles player on his former team.

    So a below average 3.5 basically left a team with too few players to make the required. Just got an update. The very good 3.5 joined the team so they could at least get a few more weeks to get more players. He won't play on the team, but it gave the team a few more weeks and they got registered.

    Feeling you are better than vast majority players at one's level and actually being better than the vast majority is a chasm for many players.
    There are a lot of sandbagging 3.5 players and when you reach the State Champion or District Levels in most Southern States, you run into a lot of 3.5S rated players - I don't know one 3.5S that I looked at from the SC State Championship in 2013 who wasn't bumped to 4.0 or double bumped to 4.5.

    My point is this- unless you are winning the vast majority of your matches at your given level by lopsided scores, do the folks above you a favor and stick to your current level. The only saving grace I find in all these people playing up is generally they play at 3 doubles. I don't think I am alone in wanting competitive matches - There is no joy in scores with bagels and breadsticks- for either player.
     
    #52
  3. MRfStop

    MRfStop Rookie

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    G4 apology accepted. When I first started this thread, I wanted to make it clear I am not trying to play above my ability. I am not trying to get to a 3.5 or 4.0 rating just because I can say "I am a 4.0 player because my rating says I am". Which is something some people can't admit that they are infatuated with. I am just trying to get to the level that I believe I belong at right now. I believe that I can play 3.5 singles in my area and compete and then play doubles in my area and win majority of the team. I believe that I can play 4.0 doubles with a seasoned 4.0 partner and win. I have a terrible record at state yes and I did not play my best either. But that does not mean I want to continue to play 3.0 in Middle Georgia playing against the same guy every single week. There are a lot of 3.5s around my area that should be in 3.0 and if they were it would make the 3.0 level a lot more competitive and it would get the team who goes to state used to what they will see at state. I don't see the point playing in a league with only two teams, one team beats the other team every single week of the season. Then the team goes to state and gets slaughtered by people who are a lot better.

    I just wanted to know why is my rating benchmarked? when does my rating come off of being benchmarked? and how do I become a 3.5? and I believe I got my answer. Thank you everyone for responding.
     
    #53
  4. g4driver

    g4driver Hall of Fame

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    In SC the spring season starts in Jan in Charleston and runs through April and the state Championships for 18+ and 40+ are in May. The matches played Oct - Dec are called the Fall Season for us and those matches don't count, as there are no playoffs.

    Maybe some Southern states like Georgia start their season in Nov or Dec and call them Winter and finish in spring of 2014.
     
    #54
  5. MRfStop

    MRfStop Rookie

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    Ours is Oct-Nov.

    G4, do you play in the Banana Open in Hilton Head?
     
    #55
  6. g4driver

    g4driver Hall of Fame

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    Andrew, thanks for accepting the apology.

    My frustration came off at you and should have been directed at the 3.5 who let an entire team down at the 11th hour. The 3.5 who is too good for my friends - not.

    The benchmark will come off if you don't advance to State this spring. Until then, I would do everything you can to play against the best players who will hit with you and then play some tournaments in Atlanta-

    There should be should a few level 1 or 2 tournaments in Atlanta that might be a great chance to play this spring once you have hit with better players. If a level 1 Tournament is too far, try finding a level 2 tournament. Generally speaking the Level 1 tournaments will be the biggest tournaments.

    When I started hitting again in 2007, I was horrible. I blew out my back in Nov 2007, three months after I picked up a frame. The back injury wasn't tennis related. I had played three matches losing all of them badly that spring. Then I waited until the fall of 2009 to play again. Two years off with only three bad losses on my record in that 24 month time. I vowed to get my life back after the back surgeries. I never cared about my rating, but I wanted to get back on the court.

    I hit with anybody that would hit with me, from a 4.5 lefty friend, to feeble old men who couldn't move. I took every opportunity to play non USTA matches versus anyone who would hit. For every USTA match I played, I probably put in another 8 matches for practice. I hit on a ball machine. I hit 15 plus hours a week, then in 2010 something happened. I started winning more than losing, then I started winning quicker, then I began to crush a lot of 3.5s, except the 3.5S rated players. Then the 3.5S players started falling (except for one).

    When the unbeaten 3.5S players walked off courts with their first loss, and started to question my rating, I knew I had accomplished what I wanted- not to be a 4.0, but to be the best 3.5 I could be. To put wins on the board for a Captain at singles and doubles.

    Be the best 3.0B in Macon/Perry. Become the 3.0B that beats the 3.5 guys and then beat them worse.

    I see 3.0 guys with this drive and they are clearly better than many 3.5. And before long they will be beating 4.0s and then they will be bumped.

    I am from the middle Georgia area. When I come home sometime, maybe we can hit. If you come to Charleston, I will gladly hit with you and you can stay at my house with your wife/gf . We have guest rooms and I would actually like to apologize to you in person -

    Hope my posts makes my state of mind more clear- you are trying to get better and that is very respectable.
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2014
    #56
  7. MRfStop

    MRfStop Rookie

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    G4, not a problem. I understood where you were coming. It is frustrating to see someone talk about how they want to be a certain rating and they only have 3 wins out of 7 matches in a season at their rating.

    There are a lot of people in the Middle GA area that judge a persons ability solely on the fact that they are a certain rating and I am sure it is the same everywhere. The 3.5s here all wonder why I have not been bumped because they know that I am not a 3.0 and I have let my racket prove it and not my mouth.

    That is very nice of you. Thank you again.
     
    #57
  8. beernutz

    beernutz Hall of Fame

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    Here I am currently in:
    2014 Adult 18 & Over Men Winter which runs from 1/6/14 to 3/10/14

    Last year I played in:
    2013 USTA Adult 18 & Over Men Winter which ran from 1/8/13 to 3/4/13
    2013 USTA Adult 18 & Over Men Spring which ran from 4/2/13 to 5/14/13
    2013 USTA Adult 40 & Over Men Spring which ran from 2/19/13 to 3/19/13

    I also played in one 18+ and one 40+ Fall league.

    So our Winter leagues here tend to start in January and end in March at least the ones I've participated in and may still be ongoing when some of the Spring leagues start, as happened to me in 2013. I'm just curious if the Winter leagues here get lumped in with Spring or if they're excluded from our NTRP calculations (which seems stupid to do but hey, it is the USTA).
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2014
    #58
  9. beernutz

    beernutz Hall of Fame

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    If any self-rated player, unbeaten or otherwise, ever questioned my rating I would literally laugh in their face.
     
    #59
  10. g4driver

    g4driver Hall of Fame

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    Andrew, send me a pm -

    I'd gladly hit with you - doubles or singles-

    I am on the road quite a bit- but you have an open invite for a free place to stay in Charleston-

    I've never played the Banana Open in Hilton Head- when is the next one ?
     
    #60
  11. MRfStop

    MRfStop Rookie

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    G4, the banana open is held at several different places. There is one here in Macon and then one in Perry. Playing in a local Banana Open (or wherever they are held) that is earlier in the year can get you qualified for the Banana Open at Palmetto Dunes in Hilton Head. The one in HH is in October. Pretty cool event. Been going for the past few years. A lot of players from around the Southeast attend.
     
    #61
  12. MRfStop

    MRfStop Rookie

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    #62
  13. gmatheis

    gmatheis Hall of Fame

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    4-2 so far in 3.5 and your losses were competitive ... you'll probably get bumped at year end.

    Now to work towards 4.0 :)
     
    #63
  14. lgbalfa

    lgbalfa Professional

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    i doubt going 4-2 in 3.5 get's you bumped up.

    why do you think that?
     
    #64
  15. beernutz

    beernutz Hall of Fame

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    Because he is currently a 3.0?
     
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  16. lgbalfa

    lgbalfa Professional

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    he said:

    "I went 4-2 playing at the 3.5 level. I did not play at the 3.0 level."
     
    #66
  17. schmke

    schmke Professional

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    That implies he could have played 3.0 so must be a 3.0. But more importantly, in the first message in this thread he said:

    Last, if there is any doubt, he posted a link to his results on TennisLink where it shows him as a 3.0.

    Regarding whether he'll be bumped or not, my estimated dynamic NTRP ratings say he should be, this despite 4 losses in playoffs.

    --
    NTRP Ratings FAQ
     
    #67
  18. beernutz

    beernutz Hall of Fame

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    So where does he say he wasn't rated 3.0?
     
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  19. g4driver

    g4driver Hall of Fame

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    Congrats Andrew ! Looks like you had a great year -
     
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  20. gmatheis

    gmatheis Hall of Fame

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    OP is indeed a 3.0 playing up, and going 4-2 in 3.5 will likely get him bumped to 3.5 unless his opponents were extremely weak or 3.0's playing up as well.
     
    #70
  21. Mongolmike

    Mongolmike Professional

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    4-2???? Sandbagging. Definately sandbagging.


    j/k! ;-)
     
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  22. anubis

    anubis Hall of Fame

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    Personally, I think Andrew is getting bumped up. I'm sure Schmke can run his numbers if he'd like, but IMO he is most definitely moving up.

    If I were another 3.0 scouting him out for a potential match, I'd be afraid. Actually, as 3.5, I'd still be concerned. It's probably going to be tough match for me. He plays more matches than I do and may have more reliable, consistent strokes.
     
    #72
  23. schmke

    schmke Professional

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    I wrote a few days ago that I expected him to be bumped up.
     
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  24. MRfStop

    MRfStop Rookie

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    #74
  25. mishadude

    mishadude New User

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    mrfstop,
    What part of GA are you in? I'm moving to Augusta from Colorado in January and will be looking for places to play/people to hit with.
     
    #75
  26. MRfStop

    MRfStop Rookie

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    Never said I wasn't a 3.0

    Currently, I am a 3.0 playing a lot 3.5 level matches. I just played in the Banana Open in the Middle GA area and made it to the Men's 4.0 Doubles Final. Lost to a guy who played a lot of 4.5 but got bumped down recently and another legitimate 4.0 with a killer kick serve that no one at my level in my area possesses. My father and I lost 6-4 6-3. We had our chances to win but it just wasn't there.

    Mishadude,

    I live in the Middle Georgia area (Warner Robins/Macon). I am around 3 hours from Augusta. Augusta is Northeast of where I am. I have only been to Augusta twice and that was when state was held there. From what I gather there is a lot of tennis in that area with a lot of skilled players. Especially at the tennis facility that is close to the airport. If you can get used to it being humid year round that I think we will have fun playing tennis in Augusta :)
     
    #76
  27. MRfStop

    MRfStop Rookie

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    UPDATE: After 4 years of playing 3.0, the USTA finally decided to bump me up to 3.5 :razz:
     
    #77
  28. IA-SteveB

    IA-SteveB Professional

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    Congrats! I will bet that feels good.
     
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  29. beernutz

    beernutz Hall of Fame

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    Well congratulations but remember that a bump up in early start ratings does not necessarily mean you will get a year-end bump up. You probably will but it is not guaranteed.
     
    #79
  30. beernutz

    beernutz Hall of Fame

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    Benchmarked players can't appeal their ratings up or down. That is a disadvantage.

    What advantage does a player gain by being benchmarked?
     
    #80
  31. schmke

    schmke Professional

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    Well done. And your results do support it, I have your dynamic rating above 3.0 so agree with your early start bump. FWIW, I had you barely not being bumped at the end of 2013.

    It appears you took the "play only 3.5" route and despite a poor showing in playoffs, did well enough to improve your rating with a 5-2 record in the regular season. And since you were playing 3.5, the losses in playoffs were actually not so bad and the match tie-break loss was actually a pretty good result.

    --
    NTRP Ratings FAQ
     
    #81
  32. MRfStop

    MRfStop Rookie

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    So if I play as well as I did this past season at 3.5 I should be able to maintain the 3.5 rating?

    I plan to play 4.0 this coming season as well.
     
    #82
  33. beernutz

    beernutz Hall of Fame

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    I don't know why some people get an early start bump but then do not get the year end bump. I know it happens though because it happened to me last year and also to a couple of other players I know.

    I got an early start bump up this year too so I'm apparently still on the edge between ratings levels but I still have to wait until year end ratings are released to see if it will stick this time.
     
    #83
  34. schmke

    schmke Professional

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    See Q27 on my NTRP Rating FAQ for a discussion of how this can happen. But basically either additional league matches that count, tournaments if you section includes them, or year-end benchmark calculations can cause your rating to move from what it was for the early start snapshot.
     
    #84
  35. Bionic slice

    Bionic slice Semi-Pro

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    I think the goal is to improve and find challenging competition,right...
    MRfStop, Looks like you have done that,....wht not...play some singles, you might even try UltimateTennis.com 4.0 or LeagueTennis.com 4.0 singles or doubles if you are looking for a new challenge since you clearly winning in 3.5 doubles.
     
    #85
  36. BMRSNR27

    BMRSNR27 Rookie

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    My understanding is that the early start doesn't include any benchmark ratings and that's what causes the biggest changes. I also was bumped up early start and back down end of year last year. I expect I'll be a full-time 4.0 next year. It's time.
     
    #86
  37. MRfStop

    MRfStop Rookie

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    I won my first 3.5 singles match last night 4-6 7-6 6-2 and also won my first 4.0 doubles match last week.
     
    #87

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