Annual flu shot bashing thread - 2012

Discussion in 'Health & Fitness' started by sureshs, Sep 21, 2012.

  1. LuckyR

    LuckyR Legend

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    I happen to believe you CAN teach an old dog new tricks...
     
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  2. LeeD

    LeeD Bionic Poster

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    Look, you genuis's....
    Studies are used to promote the stuff they're trying to use on you, so they can make even MORE money.
    Studies can be manipulated to achieve any result they want.
    For once, try using your brains.
    Say you have 500 antibodies working for you right now. For an elderly person, who might be sick, he has maybe 300 of 'em.
    Now introduce your vaccination shot, and it takes 100 of 'em to fight it, figure it out, do whatever is needed... meanwhile, only 200 to fight off other diseases, sicknesses, whatever is already wrong thru age.
    Maybe YOU can afford 100 to deal with the vaccination shot, but old farts only have 200 left, not enough to deal with everyday problems.
    You might be great with books, with research, but you don't know logic and living.
     
    #52
  3. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    I don't think it is a zero sum game
     
    #53
  4. LuckyR

    LuckyR Legend

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    If your bolded statement was correct, then I certainly hope you are not arguing that random citizens without specialty training in the subject involved have superior expertise when compared to those who do. Or to put it another way, whatever the bias involved in University research, and I agree with you that it is not zero, certainly the bias/error of random Tennis Warehouse posters is at least an order of magnitude greater.

    As to the rest of your post, I'll use your nomenclature:

    If you have 500 antibodies available to you right now, it is because of the 900 total antibodies you have, 400 are being used for various random antigens that enter your body all day, every single day from an infinite number of sources. True, you could use 5 of the 500 to deal with your flu shot (and increase the number being used to 405), but the benefit that the corrupt and money-driven evil Pharma Empire tricks us into thinking exists is felt to be worth that limited drop. Remember antibodies by their nature are extremely specific, that's why it is ridiculous to suppose that some high percentage of your antibodies would respond to a single exposure. For example, your chickenpox antibodies don't care if you are exposed to a cold sore, different virus, different antibodies.
     
    #54
  5. clutch21

    clutch21 Rookie

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    To add to this, antibodies are not even produced until T&B cells contact the foreign antigen. Theoretically, for every antigen there is a T cell and a B cell that fit it like a lock & key.

    Once an antigen (say the flu vaccine) enters your body and matches up with the correct T&B cell then an immune response is mounted. One aspect of that immune response among others is the production of antibodies by B cells. Thus antibodies are not even produced until exposure to that given antigen.

    As LuckyR said, an antibody is specific to a given antigen. That is, a certain antibody can't be used to fight anything else besides the antigen that led to its production. Therefore, at least in theory, the flu vaccine doesn't hinder an individuals immune response to other antigens.
     
    #55
  6. Talker

    Talker Hall of Fame

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    This guy among others have a strong viewpoint.


    Confirmed! Flu Vaccine INCREASES Risk of Serious Pandemic Flu Illness


    And the article: :)

    http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2012/09/18/flu-shot-increases-flu-illness.aspx
     
    #56
  7. Cindysphinx

    Cindysphinx G.O.A.T.

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    No flu shot for me, now or ever. Sureshs, you can have my dose.

    You're welcome!
     
    #57
  8. SoBad

    SoBad Legend

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    I'd rather get medical advice from a lawyer than a doctor. No vaccines for me unless required by law. Or should I fight the required ones?
     
    #58
  9. Soul

    Soul Rookie

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    I've had good luck at avoiding a cold by taking vitamin D3 for several years at this point, keeping a testing level of around 50ng/ml. For that I have not felt a need for the flu shot. Don't believe the flu shot a bad idea. Do sometimes wonder how well it works from my observation of those that receive the shot. Seems many still come down with a cold over winter. But found what works well for me, and pleased about that.

    I've read others reporting the same with D3.

    "Unique vitamin D observations"

    http://blog.trackyourplaque.com/2009/02/unique-vitamin-d-observations.html

    From the article:

     
    #59
  10. XFactorer

    XFactorer Hall of Fame

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    Gawd, I love how distrust in science, especially in science-based medicine, is showing its ugly head in this thread! :)
     
    #60
  11. LeeD

    LeeD Bionic Poster

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    No no no...
    We totally trust science.
    It's the marketeers, the guys who PROFIT from making something happen, THOSE are the guys we don't trust.
    And we don't trust people who catagorically say..." THIS IS SO".... like I just did.
     
    #61
  12. XFactorer

    XFactorer Hall of Fame

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    Elaborate, will you? Why no vaccines?
     
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  13. XFactorer

    XFactorer Hall of Fame

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    What do you do to prevent contracting the flu or having flu-like symptoms from showing up?
     
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  14. LeeD

    LeeD Bionic Poster

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    I know, let's introduce, by tiny doses, EVERY known virus and bacteria known to manking. The we will be immume to any disease!!!!
    Let's take the Hantavirus, then a bit of Ecoli from Germany, maybe add that with some little known MidEast/FarWesternAsia viruses, and some stuff from the jungles of Borneo while we're at it.
    Maybe we can be Superman after taking all that crap. Or maybe we'll just be in our deathbeds sick as a crapper, one half step from 6' under.
     
    #64
  15. XFactorer

    XFactorer Hall of Fame

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    Hmm. You don't seem to have a basic understanding of how vaccinations work.
     
    #65
  16. LeeD

    LeeD Bionic Poster

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    Is it MY lack of knowledge, or is it YOU believing the marketeers who promote doing things so THEY can make tons of money off us?
    Are we sure about that? Just where did YOU get you concepts from? Did you read a "scientific research paper", or did you read a marketeers version of the same? Are you sure?
    Remember, your scientists insisted on tossing that 107 year old freshwater sturgeon into the salt water SanFranciscoBay. They said the sturgeon cannot live in fresh water. So it died the very NEXT day, one day after being tossed into the salt water. Every SierraClub activist said the sturgeon lived for 107 years in fresh water, so leave it there. Your scientists had the backing of the local gendarmes.
    **** Germany published hundreds of "scientific data" that Jews were inferior people, polluting Germany, and must now be terminated. Did you believe that one too?
     
    #66
  17. XFactorer

    XFactorer Hall of Fame

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    So, you see there's a difference between good, scientific work and the nonsense people try to pass off as science, right? Well, that's step one.
     
    #67
  18. LeeD

    LeeD Bionic Poster

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    yes, step one is to make the decision yourself, for yourself, and responsible for yourself.....
     
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  19. r2473

    r2473 Legend

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    How's your dog doing?
     
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  20. SoBad

    SoBad Legend

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    Vaccination is an invasive medical procedure that injects you with a virus.
     
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  21. Sentinel

    Sentinel Bionic Poster

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    He's just discovering that 'old habits die hard'.

    In my lingo there's a saying that a dog's tail can never be straightened.
     
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  22. ollinger

    ollinger Legend

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    Vaccination is an invasive procedure that injects you with a virus? So, for the most part, is intercourse. HPV alone is prevalent now in about a third of women, not to mention lots of other nasties. Better avoid that too!!!
     
    #72
  23. r2473

    r2473 Legend

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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48DRmVVk5N8&feature=related
     
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  24. r2473

    r2473 Legend

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    Strange. In my my lingo we say that

    Vaccination is an invasive procedure that injects you with a virus, so, for the most part, is intercourse.

    Toe-May-Toe, Toe-Ma-Toe I guess.
     
    #74
  25. LuckyR

    LuckyR Legend

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    Well, I never said it was easy...
     
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  26. LuckyR

    LuckyR Legend

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    Well, at least the flu virus uses dead vitus, IC uses live virus, sounds scary, whooooo...
     
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