Are Federer's Masters Seriest Tournaments Won Worth More Than Nadal's 21

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by McEnroeisanartist, Oct 22, 2012.

  1. McEnroeisanartist

    McEnroeisanartist Hall of Fame

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    In his 21 Masters Series tournament wins, Federer had to win 8 three out of five set finals. Whereas, Nadal had to win 5 three out of five set finals. I would weight Federer's tournaments wins as more than Nadal's. Just as I weight Lendl's 5 ATP World Tour Finals (Masters) as more than Federer's 6, because Lendl had to win 5 three out of 5 set finals compared to only 3 for Federer.
     
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  2. zam88

    zam88 Professional

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    eh.. you can only win in the format that's available.

    they should've never had 5 set finals... just harder on the guys that are already playing a lot more tennis than their peers who donk out in the QF's.
     
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  3. RF20Lennon

    RF20Lennon Legend

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    They're worth the same but federers is more diverse
     
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  4. Towser83

    Towser83 Legend

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    Nadal will overtake federer anyway so it doesn't really matter, but best of 5 is more prestigious no doubt.
     
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  5. cknobman

    cknobman Legend

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    This.

    Federer has a much more diverse portfolio of titles.
     
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  6. NDFM

    NDFM Rookie

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    Federer has the more diverse set of masters that's true, i always wondered why they changed the best of five format in the finals to best of three, does anyone know why????
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2012
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  7. McEnroeisanartist

    McEnroeisanartist Hall of Fame

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    Mostly because Federer and Nadal played an epic 5 set final in Rome 2006 and then didn't play Hamburg. I think most of the players, except for Federer, don't have the grace, stamina and toughness to player 3 out of 5 over the course of a year.
     
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  8. Seventeen

    Seventeen Rookie

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    Good point - it's hard to disagree with this.
     
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  9. Clarky21

    Clarky21 Banned

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    More *******ism,I see. Fed's masters wins are not "worth more" than Nadal's. Nadal does not make the rules and had zero say over how many sets the finals he played had. It is what it is and nothing more.


    Also,we could say that Nadal's are worth more since he is 5 years younger than Fed,and has the same amount of masters titles,winning several of them against the GOAT and the Baby Goat. Nadal actually made it to 21 before Fed did. How about that,OP?
     
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  10. tennisaddict

    tennisaddict G.O.A.T.

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    Could someone post the breakup of Hard, clay, Indoor breakup ?
     
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  11. NDFM

    NDFM Rookie

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    Exactly, the ATP must have had their reasons to change the finals format. And if the reason was because players felt tired and skipped other masters then reducing it to the best of three format was made to benefit the whole tour.
     
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  12. Agassifan

    Agassifan Hall of Fame

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    LOL at this thread. Give it up.
     
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  13. DoubleDeuce

    DoubleDeuce Hall of Fame

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    8 monte carlo is a joke. It should be a 250
     
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  14. McEnroeisanartist

    McEnroeisanartist Hall of Fame

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    How is it *******ism when I just said that Federer's 6 ATP Tour Finals aren't worth as much to me as Lendl's 5 ,because all of Lendl's were 3 out of 5 set finals, where as Federer "only" won 3 3 out of 5 set finals. At least, I am consistent.
     
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  15. tacou

    tacou Legend

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    slightly OT, but does anyone think the number 1, in some scenarios, can be larger than the number 2?
     
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  16. NadalAgassi

    NadalAgassi Guest

    LOL the real joke is Federer's Hamburg titles. Hamburg now actually is a 250 event. Monte Carlo, one of the oldest and most prestigious non Slams in tennis, being demoted in favor of the crappy Madrid clay event is the other joke.
     
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  17. kalyan4fedever

    kalyan4fedever Hall of Fame

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    Maybe due to lack of grass masters ;)
     
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  18. RF20Lennon

    RF20Lennon Legend

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    Nadal didn't get a say of how the final should be played lol. Fed has more diverse MS1000 but their worth the same :)
     
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  19. kishnabe

    kishnabe G.O.A.T.

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    21 Masters Series=21 Master Series.

    Nadal is clay inflated while Federer is hardcourt inflated.
     
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  20. Clarky21

    Clarky21 Banned

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    No he doesn't. Fed has 6 clay masters with the rest being on hardcourts. Nadal has 5 hardcourt masters,with the rest being on clay. Sounds about even to me.
     
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  21. McEnroeisanartist

    McEnroeisanartist Hall of Fame

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    Federer's would be even more inflated if there were more grass court Masters Series tournaments.
     
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  22. 6-1 6-3 6-0

    6-1 6-3 6-0 Banned

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    Not at all. It's not a question of whether or not Federer's are worth more than Nadal's, but how much more Nadal's are worth than Federer's. And Federer's are worth far less.
     
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  23. zam88

    zam88 Professional

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    it's a damn shame there isn't ONE grass masters and one less hard court masters
     
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  24. Gonzo_style

    Gonzo_style Hall of Fame

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    If we had 6 masters on clay and 3 on hard court, how many title would have Nadal?
     
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  25. Agassifan

    Agassifan Hall of Fame

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    If most players were clay court specialists instead of hard court specialists, how many titles would Nadal have?
     
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  26. McEnroeisanartist

    McEnroeisanartist Hall of Fame

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    if we had 3 masters on clay, 3 on hard court, and 3 on grass. How many titles would Federer have?
     
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  27. merlinpinpin

    merlinpinpin Hall of Fame

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    Here we go again, yet another funny post which is about as far from the truth as it is entertaining. You're talking about two jokes, so I guess you were refering to your post:
    - Hamburg is certainly not at ATP250
    - In fact, it's even older than Monte Carlo

    Oh well. Nice try, I guess. :roll:
     
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  28. smash hit

    smash hit Semi-Pro

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    What lengths Federer fans will go to in order to discredit Nadal. There are claims that Federers' are more valid because they are more diverse, which is nonsense, a masters title is a masters title.

    Federer has won 15 masters title on hard court and 5 on clay

    Nadal has won 16 masters on clay and 5 on hard.

    What is surprising is that they are equal in number of masters titles, when Federer has twice as many opportunities on his favoured surface.
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2012
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  29. Hood_Man

    Hood_Man Legend

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    If we had 2 Masters on Clay, 3 on Hard Court, 2 on Grass and 2 on Carpet, would it make a sound?
     
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  30. Gonzo_style

    Gonzo_style Hall of Fame

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    It's impossible to have 3 masters on grass...
     
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  31. sunof tennis

    sunof tennis Professional

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    Only to you...
     
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  32. Gonzo_style

    Gonzo_style Hall of Fame

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    In this case we have two tournaments on slow surfaces and 7 tournaments on fast surfaces. Is that right? :???:
     
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  33. merlinpinpin

    merlinpinpin Hall of Fame

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    Yet another point you might make for this "case" is that Nadal's last four MC titles are non-mandatoty M1000's with depleted fields. This is pretty shaky ground, however, as they are counted as legit by the ATP (Lendl's 22 equivalent tournaments aren't, though, which is more of a problem as far as I'm concerned), and in the end, a win is a win is a win.
     
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  34. Agassifan

    Agassifan Hall of Fame

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    unless the masters title is Monte carlo, which is non-mandatory.
     
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  35. RF20Lennon

    RF20Lennon Legend

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    MC isn't mandatory is it ?
     
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  36. Gonzo_style

    Gonzo_style Hall of Fame

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    Until 2009 it was...
     
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  37. RF20Lennon

    RF20Lennon Legend

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    No I don't think cause fed was considering pulling out that year but then took a wild card
     
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  38. Clarky21

    Clarky21 Banned

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    2009 was the first year MC wasn't mandatory. It is still recognized as a masters tournie(much to the chagrin of the Fedites around here),and therefore counts every bit as much as any other masters does.
     
    #38
  39. Gonzo_style

    Gonzo_style Hall of Fame

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    Check it, but I think I'm right...
     
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  40. Agassifan

    Agassifan Hall of Fame

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    MC has been a non-mandatory event for the past 4 years.
     
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  41. Aneto

    Aneto Semi-Pro

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    Win against Federer and Djokovic in several matches/finals is a joke?
     
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  42. Gonzo_style

    Gonzo_style Hall of Fame

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    In top 10 we have Nadal, Ferrer, Monaco and Almagro...:???::???:
     
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  43. RF20Lennon

    RF20Lennon Legend

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    Of course it counts!! But I was Just checking
     
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  44. Agassifan

    Agassifan Hall of Fame

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    So will Rafa win 4 more mandatory masters to overtake Fed's record of 21 mandatory masters shields?
     
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  45. Gonzo_style

    Gonzo_style Hall of Fame

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    Remains to be seen, no one can predict it! Lendl have a record, 22 tournaments...
     
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  46. Clarky21

    Clarky21 Banned

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    Ridiculous question. Too bad for you all of Nadal's masters wins count,and that includes each and every single one of his MC titles.
     
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  47. Agassifan

    Agassifan Hall of Fame

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    If Madrid keeps its fast surface, then Rafa may not get there since only Rome will be automatic.
     
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  48. Gonzo_style

    Gonzo_style Hall of Fame

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    Next year Madrid will be on red clay...
     
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  49. Agassifan

    Agassifan Hall of Fame

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    yeah.. but Rafa never did well (by his clay standards) on the madrid courts. Red or Blue.
     
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  50. Gonzo_style

    Gonzo_style Hall of Fame

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    I don't know, he played 3 consecutive finals, losing to Federer after longest match in open era, next year he beat Federer and lost vs GodNovak last year! But i agree, Madrid is faster than MC or Rome...
     
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