Armstrong drops fight against doping charges

Discussion in 'Odds & Ends' started by Bartelby, Aug 23, 2012.

  1. TennisLovaLova

    TennisLovaLova Hall of Fame

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    The uci kept the secret for 10 years
    What a shame really
     
  2. chrischris

    chrischris Hall of Fame

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    Yeah its a balls up anyhow for LA.
     
  3. MAXXply

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    I was kinda hoping the ravishing and delectable Francesca Rossi would get a few more opportunities to speak during the media conference, but McQuaid spoke the most, understandably.
     
  4. TennisLovaLova

    TennisLovaLova Hall of Fame

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    it's a real shame for the other pro cyclists who did nothing wrong and never used ped's
    LA cheated and now all the sport is under suspicion, less sponsors, less everything
    a shame
    imagine if that happened in tennis...
     
  5. NadalAgassi

    NadalAgassi Guest

    if there were any of those any of those years I would be amazed. Doping in cycling was at an all time high, teams were found with human growth syndrome flooding out of their team vans.
     
  6. pushing_wins

    pushing_wins Hall of Fame

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    i applaud the resolve and good work of all those involved in arriving at this decision
     
  7. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    UCI accepting USADA decision doesn't mean the allegations are true.

    If civil cases are filed, let us see if the courts accept this evidence. I don't think the "evidence" can stand judicial scrutiny, both from the forensic science point of view and the lack of due process.
     
  8. NadalAgassi

    NadalAgassi Guest

    Lance has dropped fighting the case so there wont be any civil cases filed. He has already thrown up the white flag and surrendered. As for allegations being true 95% already viewed them true years ago anyway.
     
  9. r2473

    r2473 Legend

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    I don't think Neil Armstrong was doping, but I'm pretty sure the moon landings were faked.
     
  10. FastFreddy

    FastFreddy Semi-Pro

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    So glad the UCI stripped away all 7 TDF wins. Next take away his medal at the games for 3rd place. Oakley dropped him today I think that makes 9 companies. Anyone see the ESPN show on Ben Johnson? Carl Lewis was juiced on HGH ie needing braces at 27 and tested postive for meth and two other drugs. Wonder if Ben's doc gave him the cheap winstrol -v or did Carl's buddy put it in Ben's drink maybe both?
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2012
  11. Tennishacker

    Tennishacker Professional

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    What are the best solutions to doping problem in pro cycling?

    Doping is a cat and mouse game, there's gotta be a better solution to doping issues.

    I personally feel that doping is similar to pot, just legalize it.
     
  12. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    Civil cases are being filed by people who contributed to his charities. If the claim is that he misled them, then to prove that it has to be shown that the evidence can stand up in court, since he has denied the charges.
     
  13. adventure

    adventure Banned

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    Santa Clause is p----- right now because people don't believe in him. Santa's joining the tooth fairy, the easter bunny, the loch ness monster, and sasquatch in filing defamation and libel suits against people who have LIED and said they don't exist.

    The war is on.
     
  14. adventure

    adventure Banned

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  15. pushing_wins

    pushing_wins Hall of Fame

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    the reverse is also true.

    a non-conviction doesnt mean he is not guilty
     
  16. chrischris

    chrischris Hall of Fame

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    Why would they do that? Are they clean?
     
  17. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    It does, actually. Otherwise, you are guilty of murder (because you have not been convicted).
     
  18. Mustard

    Mustard Talk Tennis Guru

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    It means that the UCI have caved in to outside pressure.

    Except that it's supposed to be innocent until proven guilty, not the other way round. Armstrong shouldn't have to prove his innocence. The USADA case is based on plea bargains, people with grudges, and all sorts of purely circumstantial stuff. They say that Armstrong is some sort of drugs mule and everyone is just supposed to believe it.
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2012
  19. db379

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    ...and 7 Tour de France.
     
  20. db379

    db379 Hall of Fame

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    :confused:

    hello??? Ground control to major ....
     
  21. Dream_On

    Dream_On Rookie

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    ... and taking PEDS
     
  22. jerriy

    jerriy Hall of Fame

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    Interesting that Armstrong is finally hanging but not because he got caught (by drug test or something) but by the sheer weight of eyewitness testimony.

    Let's see if this method of catching becomes a new precedent and adopted in busting others - by "other" meaning both other cyclists and athletes in other sports. At the moment it seems merely a one-off symbolic effort to take down the big man Armstrong, for an apparent purpose of making an example out of him (in other words just a token gesture)
    .
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2012
  23. fundrazer

    fundrazer Hall of Fame

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    Yeah, Pat McQuack caved in to the mounting pressure that he could very well lose his job. There are a lot of cycling journalists who want him totally out of the sport. He's partially responsible for the mess that cycling became.
     
  24. JoelDali

    JoelDali G.O.A.T.

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    Imagine if Gasquet knarked on Rafa and it creates a chain reaction and Rafur loses his FO titles.
     
  25. Bartelby

    Bartelby G.O.A.T.

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    McQuaid reveals that his real enemy is those that blow the whistle on drugs in sport:


    But McQuaid, who said he would not resign despite the scale of the doping scandals which have been uncovered, then launched personal attacks on two former teammates of Armstrong's - Tyler Hamilton and Floyd Landis - whose testimonies were crucial in exposing his use of banned substances and blood transfusions. Both have written books about their experiences evading the UCI's drug testers alongside Armstrong at the US Postal and Discovery Channel teams. Despite praising them earlier in the day for coming forward, McQuaid could not conceal his contempt for both men and other riders, who have been fiercely critical of the UCI.
     
  26. Bartelby

    Bartelby G.O.A.T.

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    Calls Landis and Hamilton scumbags - time to go!, McQuaid:



    "Another thing that annoys me is that Landis and Hamilton are being made out to be heroes. They are as far from heroes as night and day. They are not heroes. They are scumbags. All they have done is damage to the sport." McQuaid sought to retract the word "scumbags" but his anger was barely concealed as he spoke at the end of a day in which he admitted the sport was facing its biggest crisis.
     
  27. NadalAgassi

    NadalAgassi Guest

    Hamilton and Landis indeed are cowards and lowlifes I agree. They are jealous of Lance who unlike them while doped up to the eyeballs himself did not get caught by the testers as they did, and who obviously is far richer, far more successful in cycling, and has invested themeselves in many more worthy avenues away from cyling than they did. While I am in part glad Lance is being stripped and those Tour de France victories left vacant, just to send a message to cycling, and to expose that whole crooked era for what it was, I do think the motives of Landis and Hamilton were purely jealousy and jadedness. I respect someone like Hincapie who was a loyal friend to Lance, and clearly testified only out of honesty, alot more.
     
  28. Bartelby

    Bartelby G.O.A.T.

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    McQuaid allowed Armstrong's return to cycling without full vetting:


    Under McQuaid's presidency, Anne Gripper, an Australian, was appointed head of the UCI's anti-doping programme. Gripper made significant headway, inroducing of the biological passport in 2008 as a means of identifying suspicious activity by cyclists year-round. Gripper left the UCI in 2010. Last week, Gripper made critical remarks about how the UCI had bent the rules to allow Armstrong to compete without full anti-doping vetting on his comeback in 2009. About McQuaid, Gripper said specifically: "I know his commitment to this was very strong while I was there. It may have wavered a bit."
     
  29. Bartelby

    Bartelby G.O.A.T.

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    Whatever motivation you may choose to attribute to individuals, they were all saying the same thing.




     
  30. hollywood9826

    hollywood9826 Semi-Pro

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    I think he was just such an a-hole to everybody that it just took a couple people to make a little pinhole. Then it opened up as everybody then could pile on.

    Thats a huge difference between Lance and Bonds. Bonds seems to have been loyal enough to his friends and teammates that nobody ever came forward and said anything. His trainer/best friend and possible supplier actually served jailtime to not testify.


    Im sure there was a little payback to be had as well. Landis and Hamilton may have thought Lance could have done a little more to help them. But Lance is selfish and idnt do anything but keep cheating and winning and making money. When the time was right they were more than happy to get him. Hincapie seems loyal, but again Greg Anderson (Bonds' friend) did jail time to not testify. That tells me Hincapie knew this thing was on way to big of a scale and Lance was going down regardless.
     
  31. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    Imagine if Wawrinka knarked on Federer and he lost all his titles
     
  32. fundrazer

    fundrazer Hall of Fame

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    You can't just go out and call Tyler out as a coward. It takes a lot of guts to come forward and tell the story he did...And if some of the things in his book regarding Lance are true, you would understand why Tyler may feel the way he does about Lance.

    According to Tyler, as long as you were within Lance's inner circle, he was maybe one of the best friends to have. Do anything to cross him, even unintentionally, and he'd toss you out like yesterday's garbage. Tyler mentions that while training with Ferrari, at one point he had beaten Lance's previous record up a climb. Lance viewed this as a threat, and that's when he began to shun Tyler from the group.

    Say what you want about Hincapie, he's one of the nicest guys in the peleton, but he still lied and cheated for years. He knew where his paycheck was coming.
     
  33. fundrazer

    fundrazer Hall of Fame

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  34. FastFreddy

    FastFreddy Semi-Pro

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    Armstrong appeals to cancer supporters as some donors ask for their money back


    could to support Livestrong, raising tens of thousands of dollars for the cancer charity founded by cyclist Lance Armstrong.

    "It all started when Lance's first book came out," Connie Roddy said, referring to the 2001 publication of "It's Not About the Bike: My Journey Back to Life," which details Armstrong's bout with testicular cancer. "I read it cover to cover. I was just so taken by who he said he was."

    The Roddys, who live in Santa Monica, California, say they initially gave $50,000 to the foundation. In 2003, Connie Roddy said, she helped organize an event for the foundation at a health club that raised an additional $150,000.

    Now they want their money back.

    "I feel we were really fooled. We were really hoodwinked," she said
     
  35. chrischris

    chrischris Hall of Fame

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  36. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    How were they fooled? Did they just discover that the cancer patients were lying?
     
  37. r2473

    r2473 Legend

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    I'd imagine a $$$$$$ payoff buys lots of loyalty. And if the group is small enough, the payoffs are possible.

    In Lance's case, he'd have been paying lots of people lots of money for the rest of his life. That probably ain't gonna work.
     
  38. chrischris

    chrischris Hall of Fame

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    Ok that sounds probable... Say you made the bigtime in tennis.
    Would you feel comfortable seeing an umpire that is closely related to your opponent be in charge of your lifes most important match?
     
  39. jerriy

    jerriy Hall of Fame

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    I think money might be the only reason why Lance is not admitting anything himself (cuz otherwise he'll be inundated with "I want my money bacjk" notices from all sides)

    Right now the only ones demanding money back are entities that have already been quarreling with him for a while
    .
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2012
  40. FastFreddy

    FastFreddy Semi-Pro

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    Fraud, cheater and loser!!

    In criminal law, a fraud is an intentional deception made for personal gain or to damage another individual; the related adjective is fraudulent. The specific legal definition varies by legal jurisdiction. Fraud is a crime, and also a civil law violation. Defrauding people or entities of money or valuables is a common purpose of fraud.

    A hoax also involves deception, but without the intention of gain or of damaging or depriving the victim

    Lance riding dirty!!
     
  41. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    Here there seems to be no personal financial gain
     
  42. Underhand

    Underhand Legend

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    It's time for the FINA to start "Operation Phelps".
     
  43. jerriy

    jerriy Hall of Fame

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    I'm suspicious of USADA's motives.

    Cycling is not a major sport in the US so it's kinda too easy for them to jump on Armstrong without ruffling a lot of feathers.

    The fact remains that the USADA has dun diddly squat ZERO nada NOTHING against the MLB, the NFL, NBA, NHL, athletics, swimming and so forth. Yet they DO have the authority to swoop on them just as much.

    Until they do that I have no choice but lump them with the UCI and all the other sports authorities who do things only in order to brush their own rep and not really to wipe out doping.
     
  44. JoelDali

    JoelDali G.O.A.T.

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    There is no doping in any other sport. Just bicycle riders do it. Look at how fast they pedal. I can't pedal that fast and I'm a 4.5.
     
  45. TennisLovaLova

    TennisLovaLova Hall of Fame

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    Did armstrong really have cancer?
    Or is it part of the hero story?
    Just askin...
    It wouldnt be a surprise as they managed to build the perfect sport fraud based on doping lies. The cancer could also be big lie...
    I'm amazed when you watch armstrong's interviews and how the guy is lying, arrogant attitude...
     
  46. hollywood9826

    hollywood9826 Semi-Pro

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    He had ball cancer for sure. Im sure thats when he started taking drugs to help with recovery then just went full blown roidin mode.
     
  47. fundrazer

    fundrazer Hall of Fame

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    Well, some believe that delving into PED's and other doping methods is what brought upon the cancer in the first place. There's that alleged conversation where he in his hospital bed when he was asked if he was doping/taking PED's. According to the witness, Lance answered "yes."
     
  48. TennisLovaLova

    TennisLovaLova Hall of Fame

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  49. jonnythan

    jonnythan Professional

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  50. FastFreddy

    FastFreddy Semi-Pro

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    more good news!!



    Lance Armstrong results in peril


    Updated: October 24, 2012, 1:48 PM ET
    ESPN.com news services


    NEW YORK -- Lance Armstrong's results erased from the record books will likely include his 2006 and 2007 New York City Marathon results as well as his 2008 Boston Marathon result, according to reports.

    Marathon organizer New York Road Runners said in a statement Wednesday it expected to wipe out his times once any potential appeals play out, since the race follows USADA rulings, according to a Runner's World report. Tom Grilk, executive director of the Boston Athletic Association, told Runner's World the Boston Marathon would act similarly.

    "We understand from USA Track & Field that they and we are required to follow the rulings of USADA in this area," read the statement.

    Paced by running greats Alberto Salazar, Joan Benoit *******on and Hicham El Guerrouj, Armstrong finished in 2 hours, 59 minutes, 36 seconds in his first marathon. After training more the following year, he completed the 26.2 miles in 2:46:43 to place 232nd in 2007.

    NYRR says cancer foundation Livestrong will still be a part of the marathon "and we will always remember the support and encouragement Lance gave to (nine-time NYC Marathon champ) Grete Waitz through her courageous five-year fight against this hideous illness."
     

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