As older you get, Problem with Return of Serves ?

[Nostradamus]

Not sure if everybody is same way. but as I get older, I am finding out that I am having more and more trouble handling the big serves. I am having problems even if it is right in my power zone. I am not seeing the ball as well as I used to on these big bombs. I don't want to compare myself to Roger Federer but he seem to be having the same issues. Is this normal as you get older ?
and HOW do you adjust ? Is there a good or better way to return serves as you get older ?

 

[Power Player]

How old are you?

 

[Muppet]

I saw some older men playing while I was waiting for my clinic to start last winter. On serve return when he was getting jammed, one of them would start his motion by stepping away from the incoming path of the ball with his outside foot. This created more space for his stroke. There was no split step of any kind, just a step away to create space.

I've always gotten on my toes and moved forward to the flight of the ball. Now that I'm 47, moving away and opening up my motion may help with jamming serves. Was someone supposed to tell me about this technique at some point?

 

[ollinger]

1) yes, normal as you get older.
2) you adjust by adjusting your expectations.

 

[Nostradamus]

I saw some older men playing while I was waiting for my clinic to start last winter. On serve return when he was getting jammed, one of them would start his motion by stepping away from the incoming path of the ball with his outside foot. This created more space for his stroke. There was no split step of any kind, just a step away to create space.

I've always gotten on my toes and moved forward to the flight of the ball. Now that I'm 47, moving away and opening up my motion may help with jamming serves. Was someone supposed to tell me about this technique at some point?

nobody told me. Stay on your toes, that is a good tip. With really big serves, like around 100 mph, I am finding it is easier to chip that return back now. but in doubles, you can't always do that.
Also high bouncing serves, I have lots of trouble with as well. it is tough to take these on the rise due to speed of the ball.

 

[Nostradamus]

1) yes, normal as you get older.
2) you adjust by adjusting your expectations.

adjusting your expectations ? you mean like think I can return it ? is that like power of positive thinking or something like that ?

 

[sureshs]

Not sure if everybody is same way. but as I get older, I am finding out that I am having more and more trouble handling the big serves. I am having problems even if it is right in my power zone. I am not seeing the ball as well as I used to on these big bombs. I don't want to compare myself to Roger Federer but he seem to be having the same issues. Is this normal as you get older ?
and HOW do you adjust ? Is there a good or better way to return serves as you get older ?

Why don't you want to compare yourself with Roger Federer?

 

[Muppet]

nobody told me. Stay on your toes, that is a good tip. With really big serves, like around 100 mph, I am finding it is easier to chip that return back now. but in doubles, you can't always do that.
Also high bouncing serves, I have lots of trouble with as well. it is tough to take these on the rise due to speed of the ball.

100 MPH? I'm not facing that kind of heat. Either you're facing younger competition (you're younger) or you're at a higher level than I am or both. I think this step away trick is going to help me in the coming years.

 

[LeeD]

That's why you switched from 65 sq in wood rackets to 110 granny sticks.
Bigger, lighter!

 

[rkelley]

I'm prep-ing better and changed my grip(s), so I'm actually returning the hard stuff better now than ever. I actually need to work on pounding the weaker stuff and not just putting it into play.

 

[Nostradamus]

I'm prep-ing better and changed my grip(s), so I'm actually returning the hard stuff better now than ever. I actually need to work on pounding the weaker stuff and not just putting it into play.

This could be the best advice here. can you elaborate on Preping better and changed your grip ? What do you mean exactly ? Thank you

 

[Muppet]

I think I keep posting on this thread because there's something I need here. When I split step, I go up on my toes and continue down to the balls of my feet, then I continue sinking a little further moving in the direction I want to go as I begin bending my knees. It sounds like I need to stomp on my feet to activate my muscles, then spring in the direction I want to go. Does this sound like the switch I need to make? Is there anything I'm missing that anyone could fill in?

 

[rkelley]

This could be the best advice here. can you elaborate on Preping better and changed your grip ? What do you mean exactly ? Thank you

On the prep:

I do kind of the Murray thing. I start with one foot back (left for me but it's not important I think) and one forward. As my opponent tosses I step in one step and then hop to land in a split step. I land on the split just as ball is leaving my opponent's racquet, so there's a little bit of timing involved. As I land on the split I want to have already decided which way, left or right, I'm going. As I land I will preferentially land with the weight on the opposite foot so that I can push off from that foot

 

[rkelley]

This could be the best advice here. can you elaborate on Preping better and changed your grip ? What do you mean exactly ? Thank you

On the prep:

I do kind of the Murray thing. I start with one foot back (left for me but it's not important I think) and one forward. As my opponent tosses I step in one step and then hop to land in a split step. I land on the split just as ball is leaving my opponent's racquet, so there's a little bit of timing involved. As I land on the split I want to have already decided which way, left or right, I'm going. As I land I will preferentially land with the weight on the opposite foot so that I can push off from that foot. The racquet is in front of me, pointing at my opponent - pretty typical.

On the grip:

I normally use a 2hbh (cont/SW) and an almost SW on my fh. For returning serve I have my right hand in my fh grip and my left in the SW grip I use for my bh. I keep my grip tighter on my left hand and loose with my right. If it's a fh I just let go with left hand my right hand naturally takes over. Because my fh grip isn't too Western I can punch the ball over if that's all I have time for, including stretching for really wide ones, or I can take a more normal swing on a slower serve. If it's a bh then my left hand is already controlling the racquet (tighter grip). I take the racquet back with my left hand and my right hand will naturally start to change grips to a continental. Again I can punch/block it back if that's all I have time for, take a fuller swing on slower balls, and let go with my left hand and just stretch for it one handed if I need to.

I could probably do this grip thing all of the time in a rally, but even in a hard hitting rally I find that I have plenty of time to switch grips, so it's not really an issue. The only other time I use it is if someone's going to hit an overhead on me and I'm at the baseline.

 

[MurrayMyInspiration]

^^^rkelley is giving advice on textbook returning.

There is not much you can do as you get older. You still try and do what the pros do but you do it worse.

 

[LeeD]

MMI, that is the PERFECT discription of returning serves as we get older.
I started returning 5.5 level serves when I was around 27.
Now fully 64, I don't begin to think of returning those serves, even with 30+ years more knowledge and experience.

 

[Nostradamus]

Know HOW to read your Opponent's serve

^^^rkelley is giving advice on textbook returning.

There is not much you can do as you get older. You still try and do what the pros do but you do it worse.

You are forgetting one very important thing. HOW TO READ YOUR OPPONENT's Serves. Knowing where they are going to serve before they hit the ball will give you big advantage. Older the Wiser, right ?

Lets share some TIPS on how to read your opponent's serve

 

[cjs]

Knowing where they are going to serve before they hit the ball will give you big advantage.

Lets share some TIPS on how to read your opponent's serve

I thought you could see the future Nostradamus? Why would you need tips?

 

[NLBwell]

I thought you could see the future Nostradamus? Why would you need tips?

I think Nostradamus should only be allowed to post in quatrains. Then we can all try to interpret what he means.

 

[NLBwell]

Yes. I can't push off hard from my left leg (knee) or right leg (Achilles), so serve return is a problem. With groundstrokes I have time to anticipate where to move to. Not so with serve returns. Eyes are worse, as is reaction time.
One thing that you can do is anticipate, either by trying to pick up something the server does with position or motion or by patterns in his serving. Sometimes, you just have to outright guess. You only have to guess right 4 out of 6 times once a set to win it with one service break.
Physically, I'd say to build up your legs, especially your quads so that you can move explosively to the ball.

 

[rkelley]

^^^rkelley is giving advice on textbook returning.

There is not much you can do as you get older. You still try and do what the pros do but you do it worse.

I've said it before, but there very few of us here who have ever maxed out their performance potential in their prime, so this idea that turning 35 or 40 is going to cause this big decrease in your game, much less preclude that you can improve, I just don't think is valid. Fed cannot be a better player at 40 than he is now, that's unlikely to be true for the rest of us.

 

[cjs]

One main problem I see at rec level is that so many players refuse to chip/block a serve back, but instead will take a huge swipe at the ball, making return error after return error. Learning to block/chip a serve back should be a skill every rec player learns.

 

[Nostradamus]

I thought you could see the future Nostradamus? Why would you need tips?

No, I meant reading the serve. BY how their body is setup, Where they toss the ball, or maybe they give it away by staring at the spot where they are going to serve. That type of reading.:???:

 

[Nostradamus]

One main problem I see at rec level is that so many players refuse to chip/block a serve back, but instead will take a huge swipe at the ball, making return error after return error. Learning to block/chip a serve back should be a skill every rec player learns.

With big serves around 90 mph, it works well with chip return. but in doubles, if you don't hit it just perfect, it doesn't work so well because that chip return gets cut off by netguy and volleyed away for a winner.

 

[Bobby Jr]

Not sure if everybody is same way. but as I get older, I am finding out that I am having more and more trouble handling the big serves. I am having problems even if it is right in my power zone. I am not seeing the ball as well as I used to on these big bombs...

..HOW do you adjust ? Is there a good or better way to return serves as you get older ?

Get into a serve return routine which you do all the time:
> Stand a little further back
> make sure you are ready and primed
> move forward as the ball is struck and split step
> think "short stroke, through the ball, direction not power"

Some of these seem obvious but you'd be amazed how few people actually bother to do them every time.

Watch some David Ferrer returns for inspiration.

And, if possible, pay closer attention to the angles the server likes to hit, how often they go each direction and, which ones they hit best. You might find that you need to stand 1m further one way or the other to remove their favourite serve. Accept you'll get aced the other way a few times but know that you're getting their worse serve more often than not (unless they just serve bombs straight at you)

Lastly, keep this in mind. Returning is one area of tennis that has a huge age/experience-acquired component to it. Up to a point you returns should improve long after much of your game has plateaued.

...Roger Federer but he seem to be having the same issues. Is this normal as you get older ?

Yes, but there's not a **** show in hell his issues have come from 18 months of ageing. These guys are all at the very top end of the curve (both in selection and in so much skill-honing across their lifetime) so what might apply to the average joe probably wont be reflected the same way with a top sportsperson at the same age.

 

[andreh]

To OPs original question, reaction time and eye sight deteriorate as you age. When exactly it becomes a noticable factor is probablt highly individual.

I would like to emphasize that people should pratice return of serve. Rec players usually don't hit any returns except in matches.

 

[dman72]

I asked my eye doctor about this...I got my eyes checked, and my prescription has not changed (I'm near sighted), but I feel that I'm seeing the ball far worse.

You start to lose the ability to focus as quickly as you age. I'm 41 so that's usually when it starts.

 

[cjs]

With big serves around 90 mph, it works well with chip return. but in doubles, if you don't hit it just perfect, it doesn't work so well because that chip return gets cut off by netguy and volleyed away for a winner.

Obviously. I was talking about singles.

 

[Muppet]

When I was in my 20s, I kept my reaction time for returns tuned up by hitting against a wall. Between each hit, I would do a slit step, then I would always take it on one bounce. I practiced reading the direction of the ball even though I knew where it was going. And my body got a lot of repetitions for preparing quickly for the incoming shot.

 

[Nostradamus]

I asked my eye doctor about this...I got my eyes checked, and my prescription has not changed (I'm near sighted), but I feel that I'm seeing the ball far worse.

You start to lose the ability to focus as quickly as you age. I'm 41 so that's usually when it starts.

Agree, it seems like your Brain telling your arm and hands to do something is slower, thus harder to return very powerful fast serves and time it.

 

[Nostradamus]

To OPs original question, reaction time and eye sight deteriorate as you age. When exactly it becomes a noticable factor is probablt highly individual.

I would like to emphasize that people should pratice return of serve. Rec players usually don't hit any returns except in matches.

Also Agree. We should practice return of serves more and practice serves more too. With serves, it is easy, just take bucket of balls and hit serves for 20-30 minutes.
but with return of serves, it is not so easy. You have to pay the pro $80 per hour and have him hit serves to you. Not too many of us can do this often.:???:

 

[LeeD]

Why not practice serves and returns with your normal hitting buds? Designate 15 minutes of serve and return time, so each player get's the chances.

 

[Nostradamus]

Why not practice serves and returns with your normal hitting buds? Designate 15 minutes of serve and return time, so each player get's the chances.

What if your normal hitting bud is 5 foot 5 inches and has Nerf ball for the serves ?

 

[LeeD]

Enter the local tournament.
Find the biggest server there.
Ask him if he wants to work on his serves and you can return, or he can return your serves. Supply 6 new balls if he's better than you.

 

[Nostradamus]

Enter the local tournament.
Find the biggest server there.
Ask him if he wants to work on his serves and you can return, or he can return your serves. Supply 6 new balls if he's better than you.

Then he will quickly become suspicious and think you are trying to get used to his serves so next time you can beat him. and will tell you to go jump in the lake.

 

[LeeD]

I see you never tried.
I asked some A level player to practice serves with me, while I was technically a C player with a big lefty serve. Never got refused, and some became practice partners the following years.
You have to fit their time schedules, you have to supply new balls and courtime, of course.
When some A level women asked me to serve to them, THEY supplied court time and tennis balls.