Ashaway 100% Zyex monofilament

Discussion in 'Strings' started by corners, Feb 22, 2012.

  1. corners

    corners Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2008
    Messages:
    5,441
    Cool. Please let us know how it plays for you. And, given some of the reports we've got so far, it might be worth considering using it in the crosses paired with a bitey copoly main. But that's up to you.
     
  2. Boricua

    Boricua Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2011
    Messages:
    3,086
    What copoly would you suggest with zyez cross?ybe Scorpion?
     
  3. corners

    corners Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2008
    Messages:
    5,441
    Well, I don't know. If you go up and read Torres' post on trying ZX main/copoly cross, he felt that the poly he chose may have been too stiff. ZX is very flexible so maybe trying a more flexible poly with it might be a good idea. On the other hand, Travlerajm is planning on using ZX as a cross with kevlar mains, so maybe a stiffer copoly is a better idea. But I would think that something like Tourbite might be a good bet. Do you have anything on hand?
     
  4. Boricua

    Boricua Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2011
    Messages:
    3,086
    Dont have Tourbite. What was the main problem that Torres encountered with full zyex? I will read the posts later. I want a not stiff stringbed.
     
  5. Boricua

    Boricua Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2011
    Messages:
    3,086
    Torres: what is the negative and positive of zyex fuu bed? How about polybplama mains or scorpion mains zyex crosses? What tesion?
     
  6. travlerajm

    travlerajm Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2006
    Messages:
    4,443
    To clarify: I did not do fast pulls. I carefully adjusted the dropweight until it settled in the horizontal, then removed the clamp, and then waited 10 seconds for the string to elongate and the dropweight to settle (which it did do more than most strings). The problem was, with most strings, the step of removing the clamp doesn't cause the dropweight to drop much farther. But with the ZX, removing the clamp causes the dropweight to fall another 20-30 degrees. I supposed I could have held on to the dropweight with my other hand while removing the clamp, but I'm not used to having to do that.
     
  7. travlerajm

    travlerajm Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2006
    Messages:
    4,443
    I just strung up my Blade 98 with Kevlar 18 mains & ZX Red crosses, 49 lbs. No unusual stringing observations this time, other than I broke the knot on final tie-off (luckily I had already pulled tension on the first half of the knot, and it looks like it will hold).

    Interesting that I used less than 15 feet of string for the 20 crosses - the weight of bed with 16-gauge ZX came in only 0.25g heavier than the bed I took out w/ 17-gauge SPPP crosses (14.7g vs 14.45). Racquet length ~1mm shorter than unstrung length (nothing unusual).

    The kevlar does not slide quite as well over the ZX as it does over a smooth poly like SPPP, but it does snap back. Taking it out for a test against the wall now.

    My hope is that the kevlar/ZX will behave similarly to kevlar/poly when fresh, but will have more stable playing characteristics over time.

    Edit: the frame lost 0.5mm in length in the 10 minutes since I measured the length the first time, suggesting the ZX is creeping faster than the kevlar.
     
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2013
  8. Torres

    Torres Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2011
    Messages:
    4,766
    Stringing with this string is a pain, stringbed consistency post stringing is a pain, its tension sensitivity is a pain (doesn't work well if the tension is too low IMO), having to let the string settle AND break in with some hitting post stringing is (a bit of) a pain, its eventual drop off in spin as it wears is a pain...this is the most high maintenance string in terms of requirements that I have ever used.

    However, from what I've experienced, get all the various factors right including stringing, tension and racquet (and probably the position of the planets relative to the Earth, the moon and the sun), and it plays absolutely beautifully for a time with a combination of plushness, feel, crispness, power, control, confidence, comfort and some spin that blends characteristics of a poly, a multi and a natural gut all in one string. That (smallish?) window of performance and combination of characertistics provides satisfaction like no other single string I've tried. Get one or more factors wrong and it can play like dog.

    Were it not for that, I would have ended my interest in this string a long time ago. I've gone though 4 full beds now in two different racquets (with another 2 red, and another 2 natural set ie 8 sets in total, currently being assessed) and its not been the easiest to replicate those peak performance characteristics from one string job to another, though admittedly, I've been experimenting with different tension setups and stringing methods. This is easily the most expensive test of a string I have ever done.
     
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2013
  9. travlerajm

    travlerajm Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2006
    Messages:
    4,443
    I'm quite certain I have never imparted so much total energy into a tennis ball before.

    Just got back from the wall session with the kevlar/ZX in my Blade. It was not what I expected. I expected it to play similarly to kevlar/poly - in some ways it did, but in other ways it didn't.

    Spin: This setup bites the ball like no other. Thinking about it there are 3 main mechanisms you can take advantage of to get more spin from a string bed:
    1. Lateral stretching of the crosses.
    2. Lateral sliding/snapback of the mains.
    3. Increased stiffness (for more ball compression).

    Full poly uses #2. Kevlar/gut uses 1 and 3. Kevlar/poly uses 2 & 3. But only kevlar/ZX truly takes advantage of all 3. There didn't seem to be any limit to how much spin I could produce - almost incredible.



    Power: Surprisingly, this a quite a powerful setup. I bruised my thumb trying to catch the ball after serving it against the racquetball wall - never happened to me before. Then I bruised my index finger the next time. No joke. After that I stopped trying to catch the ball with my hand off the rebound like I usually do. Part of the reason I hurt my fingers was that the ball also had so much rpm it was impossible to catch. It practically gave me burns.

    Control: It bites the ball predictably, but because it's so powerful, I might be losing a little control compared to my usual low-powered kevlar/poly. The jury is still out until I get some time on a full tennis court and see how it goes. But this string setup really has my interest piqued. Should at least make serving more interesting.

    Not sure if you would get the same results without the high swingweight I use.

    The stringbed is a little softer than I expected - could probably go a couple lbs tighter next time.
     
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2013
  10. Boricua

    Boricua Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2011
    Messages:
    3,086
    Its meant to be used full bed I guess. Maybe you need to find the right racket for this string.
     
  11. Boricua

    Boricua Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2011
    Messages:
    3,086
    What tension and what racket did you use
     
  12. Boricua

    Boricua Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2011
    Messages:
    3,086
    you are the only guy that has used this string that hates it.:shock:
     
  13. travlerajm

    travlerajm Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2006
    Messages:
    4,443
    Hated it as full bed - mains were too slippery and response too unpredictable - but see my posts on using it as cross with kevlar mains... unique and impressive combo. If I were to name a string setup after me, this might be it.
     
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2013
  14. Boricua

    Boricua Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2011
    Messages:
    3,086
    questions for Julian

    Julian, what tension would you recommend me to string zyex monogut if I string a soft copoly like Polyfibre TCS at 50.

    Also, based on your experience with this string with what type of racket would it blend better in terms of stiffness rating of the racket, head size and string pattern for example.
     
  15. travlerajm

    travlerajm Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2006
    Messages:
    4,443
    Anyone know if there is any difference in surface lubricity or hardness between the red and natural versions?

    I just read up on the Ashaway site - didn't realize that Zyex was PEEK. PEEK is high-quality engineering plastic - I use it for a lot of things due to its temp resistance and chemical resistance.

    If it holds tension as advertised, this seems like it could be the biggest advance in string technology since poly became a hit 10 years ago.
     
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2013
  16. chapmag

    chapmag New User

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2013
    Messages:
    18
    Pro Kennex Ki 5

    50 lbs both cross and main
     
  17. scotus

    scotus Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2005
    Messages:
    7,711
    Have you thought about using a smooth aramid string in the mains instead of the rough Ashaway?
     
  18. Torres

    Torres Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2011
    Messages:
    4,766
    You hit with a full bed for what, half an hour? During one hitting session?
     
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2013
  19. julianashaway

    julianashaway Rookie

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2013
    Messages:
    145
    If you string poly at 50, don't string Monogut ZX any higher. I would say 50 or few lbs less.

    Racket/ string combos are such a personnal thing. When deciding which racket to use, keep in mind that the string is not poly - not at all. It is not stiff and very powerful. It should also be easier on your arm. Natural gut is the closest in playability characteristics to ZX. Try a racket that you like to use with natural gut.
     
  20. Boricua

    Boricua Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2011
    Messages:
    3,086
    What racket are you using? Got good comfort as kevlar is stiff for what ive heard? I have elbow problems so kevlar is something that could affect me,
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2013
  21. Boricua

    Boricua Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2011
    Messages:
    3,086
    Ill string a Pro Kennex Q5 295 at 47 lbs. Lets see how it goes
     
  22. corners

    corners Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2008
    Messages:
    5,441
    He uses an extremely heavy/high-swingweight racquet, so shock is not much of an issue regardless of what strings he uses. I would not recommend kevlar for you. Bitey copoly/ZX should play similar, however.
     
  23. Boricua

    Boricua Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2011
    Messages:
    3,086
    I will try zyex at 47 and maybe at 50 later on. I could try Turbo Twist mains. Zyex crosses also.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2013
  24. travlerajm

    travlerajm Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2006
    Messages:
    4,443
    Played 3 sets of singles on slow indoor court with my Blade. Really impressed with what the kevlar/ZX stringbed can do.

    My serve was outright electric tonight. I was crushing my serve harder than I have in years. 110mph topspin blasts that hit the curtain still rising - same serve for my 2nd since the spin was so nice - man that "hammer feeling" felt good tonight. Twist serves really biting and jumping sideways. And the occasional flat bullet. It's possible that the slightly higher swingweight than I have been regularly using helped, but I think the main difference was the ZX in the crosses seemed to add some extra explosiveness. The ball just leapt off the court.

    What seemed remarkable about the stringbed is that the serve was the only shot that seemed unusually powerful. Other shots like blocked returns seemed measured and controlled power-wise. I could really add some nice rpm on sidespin slices too. The stringbed seems to be staying firm, volleys were still precise. Maybe the stringbed stays stiffer on lower-speed impacts, but higher-speed impact of the serve somehow unlocks the power? It was different than anything I've used before - very unique in a good way.

    My opponent tonight was a big hitter, but inconsistent. So I didn't get much opportunity to take full cuts on groundies. I was either playing D on his serve with stabs and blocks, or serving bombs that rarely came back on my serve.

    I had some issues on my forehand today, but that was more do to my racquet not being tuned quite right, as I was having a little trouble controlling the racquet face when I took full stroke on fh - can't blame the stringbed. I came home and measured the specs more carefully: 13.92 oz., 12.49", 375 SW. This puts my MgR/I too low, so I'll tweak it back up to 21.0 where I usually like it next time. Normally I would have switched to one of my better-tuned frames, but I was having so much fun serving that I stuck with my Blade.

    I'm looking forward to getting my weighting tweaked and getting back on the court with these strings. These ZX strings seem to be just what I've been looking for for years to replace my poly crosses.
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2013
  25. fgs

    fgs Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2007
    Messages:
    3,419
    Location:
    Vienna, Austria
    travlerajm,

    how much time do you get out of the 18g kevlar mains usually. my up to now only encounter with kevlar was last summer when i playtested polyfibre thinergy, a pre-packed hybrid with 1.10 kevlar mains and multi crosses, where i went through the mains in slightly less than 4 hours (on both sets i got for testing). possibly that due to the multi crosses there was almost no snapback of the mains and this was one of the most annoying experiences i had for a long time fixing strings after each and every rally (and i am not ocd about stringmovement at all,but this was pretty extreme even for me:))
     
  26. travlerajm

    travlerajm Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2006
    Messages:
    4,443
    When I played Ashaway Crossfire with the syn gut that came in the package, I usually stuck with the 16g because I broke the thinner gauges too fast (about 4h for 18g, 10h for 17g, 30-40h for 16g).

    But with poly crosses, the limiting factor for the stringbed lifetime was when the poly loses too much tension. So I found that there was no point in using the thicker kevlar with poly cross. When I use 18g kevlar with silverstring crosses, the 18g kevlar breaks after about 10 hours of play, which roughly coincides with the playable lifetime of the silverstring cross. The kevlar lasts longer with poly cross than with syn gut cross because the low friction doesn't notch it as fast.

    With this ZX cross (which is almost as slick as poly), I suspect that the stringbed will remain playable for much longer than with poly crosses (one reason I'm so interested in it). I am hopeful that it will remain playable until the kevlar breaks. If that turns out to be the case, I might go back up to 17g or even 16g kevlar mains to see if I can stretch the playable lifetime longer.

    Honestly, I've never really noticed much difference in playing characteristics between different gauges of kevlar - the only significant difference is the weight.
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2013
  27. newyorkstadium

    newyorkstadium Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2012
    Messages:
    585
    Why do you think the ZX will remain playable for longer? The tension loss is similar to poly's. Do you think the improvement in your serve was perhaps because your mgr/i was lower, so the racket was more head heavy.

    Off topic, how did tuning to optimal MgR/I impact your serve? You then re-tuned MgR/i for your 2hb. How did that impact your serve?
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2013
  28. Torres

    Torres Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2011
    Messages:
    4,766
    Tension maintenance is much better than poly. In fact, once the string breaks in and settles down, I didn't notice any tension loss during the 10-11 hours that I played with a set. If anything the string felt as if it was tightening up and eventually going slightly dead with a drop off in spin, string sliding (the coating wears) and snap back ability.
     
  29. jason586

    jason586 Rookie

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2011
    Messages:
    225
    I've been watching and this cross with Kevlar mains sounds really good except for the higher price tag vs $2-3 syn gut cross.

    I have been playing with Kevlar mains on and off, and after reading your post I thought - what about a poly that turns into a trampoline/rocket launcher as it goes dead for a cross in which the Kevlar which would still keep it in check vs. a poly that stiffens up when it dies. I would think that this would give longer life since the added trampolining would still be playable with Kevlar mains (plus could use a thicker gauge Kevlar) with maybe a little extra power as the poly dies with the trampolining - but at a lower cost?

    I know you've tried many polys as crosses, so how did polys that turn into trampolines work as a cross with Kevlar mains?

     
  30. newyorkstadium

    newyorkstadium Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2012
    Messages:
    585
    Look at the TWU String Performance Database. It is right in the middle of the poly's for tension loss.

    Maybe the COF of Monogut ZX change in different way's to a poly.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2013
  31. Torres

    Torres Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2011
    Messages:
    4,766
    OMG, Black Magic 17 / Red ZX 1.27mm @ 52/53 CP right off the stringer it plays SO well (well, after about 15mins of hitting). The ZX just seems to have added pop, feel and forgiveness to the string bed. Sweet spot seems to have turned into the size of a watermelon. The stringbed just gives sooo much confidence. If this performance continues, this could be string nirvana...
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2013
  32. scotus

    scotus Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2005
    Messages:
    7,711
    So ZX/poly is not recommended, but Poly/ZX is golden. Is that about right?
     
  33. corners

    corners Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2008
    Messages:
    5,441
    Yeah, sounds that way. Another poster upthread, a professional stringer, also said poly mains/ZX crosses was very good.
     
  34. corners

    corners Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2008
    Messages:
    5,441
    Awesome. Hope it holds steady!
     
  35. Torres

    Torres Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2011
    Messages:
    4,766
    Definitely. I have to admit I was bit skeptical when Corners suggested it but having played with both combinations now, poly mains / ZX crosses is just so much better than the reverse combination. I played for about 1 hour this evening and it was just submline (2 hours after it was strung, both M/Cs at 100% pull speeds on a Biardo).

    The poly mains seem to provide more spin and help with control (which doesn't seem to be the case when poly crosses are used with ZX mains). The ZX crosses add power, comfort and forgiveness to the stringbed, as well as increasing the sweetspot (compared to a full poly bed). The nice thing about ZX is that I know from my testing that it doesn't lose tension in the same way that a nylon cross would. My only concern now is what happens to the stringbed when Black Magic starts going dead. In a full bed, Black Magic is pretty much dead for me after 5-6 hours.

    Got a league match tomorrow and I'm going to give this combination another outing.
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2013
  36. PBODY99

    PBODY99 Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2005
    Messages:
    3,222
    It holds steady tension for my use.
     
  37. corners

    corners Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2008
    Messages:
    5,441
    Good to hear. Thanks PBody. Have you noticed any dropoff in spin after 6-8 hours as Torres has with full beds of ZX?
     
  38. corners

    corners Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2008
    Messages:
    5,441
    Torres, have you read the TW Professor's new paper on "Going Dead"? It's looking like it may not mean what most people have thought it means. There's a thread on the paper going right now in this forum. Do you still have any full beds of ZX around? I would be very interested to hear what a little lotion applied to those strings would do.
     
  39. Torres

    Torres Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2011
    Messages:
    4,766
    I had an initial browse of that article but started losing interest when all those scientific formulas and graphs started to appear... what type of lotion am I supposed to use?

    Got 2 sets of Natural and 1 set of Red left. Both 1.27mm.
     
  40. corners

    corners Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2008
    Messages:
    5,441
    LOL. Seems like ordinary hand lotion is just fine, judging by some recent threads I've read. Doesn't seem to mark up the ball. The gist of the paper is that resilience loss is unlikely to be a major factor in going dead. Simple tension loss combined with string scuffing, denting and notching seems to be the problem. If that's the case, and ZX isn't losing tension, some lotion should restore their motion. :)

    Nothing already strung though? If not, it looks like you should save this stuff for poly/ZX hybrids.
     
  41. Boricua

    Boricua Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2011
    Messages:
    3,086
    I still have not ordered my racket, so I can still change from full zyex at 47 to a poly/zyex. I am curious on how full zyex plays though, Black magic is not sold by TW so what string sold by TW plays similar to try as a main?
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2013
  42. Torres

    Torres Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2011
    Messages:
    4,766
    Hand lotion just sounds weird!....Teflon spray I could undertand but hand lotion? I don't mind giving it a go though. I think it might be a pain the ass though applying it to the string intersections (that's where the ZX wears) - there must be over 250 string intersections...
     
  43. Buford T Justice

    Buford T Justice Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2011
    Messages:
    424
    Just put a 1/2" diameter dab on your finger and rub it around the string bed on both sides. It is simple and it works.
     
  44. Buford T Justice

    Buford T Justice Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2011
    Messages:
    424
    Yes.....I think this testing shows that things are not as complicated as we have made them to be.
     
  45. Boricua

    Boricua Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2011
    Messages:
    3,086
    So, how does Black Magic/Zyex compare with full Zyex? Any advantage of full zyex over this black magic/zyex hybrid? Does full zyex last longer in terms of playability?I suppose you need more hours with black magic / zyez to answer about life in terms of playability and the stringbed going dead.
     
  46. Boricua

    Boricua Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2011
    Messages:
    3,086
    Hand lotions are diverse. Any specific brand or ingredients?
     
  47. Buford T Justice

    Buford T Justice Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2011
    Messages:
    424
    I honestly don't think it matters much. I just used some cheap stuff from Walmart.

    Now, if one was using natural gut strings, it would seem logical to avoid any lotions which had water in their ingredient list, and use something like baby oil.
     
  48. corners

    corners Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2008
    Messages:
    5,441
    I followed the Sheriff's suggestion today and grabbed whatever was in the bathroom. Just rubbed it all over, both sides, then "strummed" each main, flipped the frame and strummed them again. Done. An old gut/syngut job now sliding and snapping nicely.
     
  49. travlerajm

    travlerajm Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2006
    Messages:
    4,443
    How much weight did that add?

    For me, even half a gram difference is enough to throw off the timing of a well-tuned frame and frustrate me. I would guess that the lotion treatment adds at least a gram, so I'm not that tempted by this approach.
     
  50. corners

    corners Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2008
    Messages:
    5,441
    LOL, I wish I'd weighed it! I could have entered it into my trivial but possibly useful tennis equipment log. Next time.
     

Share This Page