Banned from watching WTA?!

Discussion in 'Tennis Tips/Instruction' started by Relinquis, Feb 18, 2013.

  1. Relinquis

    Relinquis Hall of Fame

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    One of my friends has a new coach, let's call him 'George', who has forbidden him from watching any WTA matches. Is this fair?!

    He says he doesn't want my friend to pick up any bad habits: complaining, negativity, bad body language, choking or ball bashing.

    Coach George is big on being stoic and having a show-no-emotions mentality to tennis and wants my friend to develop a more consistent style of tennis. He has him watching Gilles Simon, Ferrer, Murray and Novak matches to focus on grinding and defense and has asked my friend to have Simon and Ferrer as role models. He wants high % tennis and good movement at the baseline.

    My friend is a big WTA fan. He goes to tournaments and knows all the player names and stats. He really misses watching on TV or streaming on his computer.

    Key focus during matchplay and point-play practice with the new coach is to not make any mistakes, no unforced errors allowed. I rallied with the coach for a bit and he gave me a smirk when one of my down the line shots went long, he turned around and said "i don't hit balls 'out'". I hit the next winner down the line, but it was as if it didn't matter...

    I have to admit my friend has become a lot tougher to play against. A lot more pressure playing him as he seems to get to nearly every ball, if not get it back. Fewer free points as well. He misses the girls though...

    What should my friend do?
     
  2. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    What are coach "George's" credentials?
     
  3. slowfox

    slowfox Professional

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    Why do so many coaches have the "my way or highway" mentality? What kind of game does your friend want to develop? If deep down he wants to be an attacker (I don't know him, just using this as a hypothetical), then learning to be a grinder will probably not work out for the best in the long run.

    Plus isn't WTA mostly baseline grinders anyway?
     
  4. Say Chi Sin Lo

    Say Chi Sin Lo Legend

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    Yeah those are bad coaches in my opinion. Although he's right about all the negativity with WTA, he should be breaking down the matches and telling the student why such and such behavior is bad and etc. It's important to be familiar with the goods and the bads.
     
  5. tennis_balla

    tennis_balla Hall of Fame

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    I will let Bruce Lee answer this question with a quote from him;

    " A good teacher can never be fixed in a routine... each moment requires a sensitive mind that is constantly changing and constantly adapting.
    A teacher must never impose this student to fit his favourite pattern; a good teacher functions as a pointer, exposing his student's vulnerability (and) causing him to explore both internally and finally integrating himself with his being."
     
  6. pvaudio

    pvaudio Legend

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    ^^^Why did I read that in my mind hearing Bruce Lee's voice?

    And the coach is a fool. The fact that he thinks your friend is such a cheap sponge should be insulting.
     
  7. kopfan

    kopfan Rookie

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    Cannot believe that someone would actually banned someone from watching WTA and someone would actually follow the order.
     
  8. Say Chi Sin Lo

    Say Chi Sin Lo Legend

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    Dumb and dumber?
     
  9. slowfox

    slowfox Professional

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    Me too. Accent and everything... LOL :) Awesome!
     
  10. Venetian

    Venetian Professional

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    Why doesn't your friend just, oh I don't know, not listen to this windbag? And why doesn't he stop going to this "coach" that apparently thinks he gets to determine how his students live their lives.
     
  11. Bobby Jr

    Bobby Jr Legend

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    We know that viewing/watching things can have an influence on a person's own way of doing something so it stands to reason that not watching WTA tennis is good advice for young tennis players. The amount of poor habits and lessons which could inadvertently be ingested from it are significant.

    If we're happy to tell people to look at Sampras or Federer for key pointers when learning to serve then it makes equal sense to tell them not to watch most WTA players for the same reason.

    Whether this coach is competent or not, or just quirky, the advice he's given in some ways is not all that bad imo.
     
  12. Bobby Jr

    Bobby Jr Legend

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    They could be the same as Richard Williams, Mike Agassi or Toni Nadal - none worth noting. The results however...
     
  13. McLovin

    McLovin Hall of Fame

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    Could not agree more. Let the player decide what type of game they want to play, then tailor their strokes around that style. If they have no opinion, then as a coach it is your job to asses the player's greatest strength, then work on how to play that to their advantage.
     
  14. goober

    goober Legend

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    Exactly how is this coach going to enforce such a ban? Unless the coach is living in the same house, it would be impossible.

    ATP players can have bad body language, complain, ball bash and choke too. If you don't want to have certain habits, don't do them. It is not like watching WTA is going to brainwash you into a Maria or Azarenka clone. The whole premise is absurd.
     
  15. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    There are some coaches who are probably a 4.0 themselves who go around talking trash about the WTA and identifying with Federer. In reality, they would lose to a teenage girl. Perhaps there is some deep problem with this "coach."

    At least WTA players don't quit like Tanko Retiravich.
     
  16. marosmith

    marosmith Professional

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    He should be able to watch Sharapova- the exception to the WTA rule.
     
  17. WildVolley

    WildVolley Legend

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    I support this ban on watching WTA tennis. Spend your time watching ATP tennis or practicing.

    I just wish ESPN would also follow this advice and stop endlessly replaying Williams sisters matches when there are two or three close ATP tiebreakers going on!
     
  18. BevelDevil

    BevelDevil Hall of Fame

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    Murray/Djokovic don't show emotions?

    And, of course, no one hurts their game trying to emulate Federer's strokes...


    Instead of an outright ban, this coach should just tell your friend to write down the bad habits he sees when he watches a WTA match (or any match, really). That way he can have fun and learn at the same time.
     
  19. rodrigoamaral

    rodrigoamaral Hall of Fame

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    Lucky guy... nothing he learn from WTA other than grunting and staring at their legs rather than footwork
     
  20. slowfox

    slowfox Professional

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    Jerzy Janowicz... How many times! Yup, watch that.

    I gotta stop watching porn.
     
  21. zapvor

    zapvor Legend

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    serious though.......why does anyone watch WTA.....hah
     
  22. kopfan

    kopfan Rookie

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    WTA do have amazing grunting... :x:mad:
     
  23. spperry

    spperry Rookie

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    Simon and Ferrer are good role models but not GS champions and will never be.

    The ability to go for shots and hitting winners is fundamental to any really successful game.

    It is ridiculous to ban watching the entire WTA, not every player is the same. Your friend needs to be his own person and make up his own mind.
     
  24. ace_pace

    ace_pace Rookie

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    Coach doesn't sound that smart IMO. Its not like negative stuff only happens in the WTA.

    I agree with Bruce Lee, the best coaches are the coaches that flex and learn with the student.
     
  25. Mahboob Khan

    Mahboob Khan Hall of Fame

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    Go and watch the girls! Serena Williams and some other girls on the Tour are awesome hitters. One always learns a thing or two from them.

    Tennis is a game of errors. It's not a crime to commit an error; it's crime not to learn from it.

    I have been to several World Wide Coaches Workshops and I have never heard a coach stopping players from watching WTA matches.
     
  26. Jay_The_Nomad

    Jay_The_Nomad Professional

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    Admit it. That friend is you.
     
  27. pvaudio

    pvaudio Legend

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    I assume that whenever someone makes a thread on the internet about their friend that it is implied by the obvious they mean themselves.
     
  28. slowfox

    slowfox Professional

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    I meant, my friend needs to stop watching porn. :)
     
  29. zapvor

    zapvor Legend

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    not really.........
     
  30. Relinquis

    Relinquis Hall of Fame

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    this is quite sad... my friend is watching the Simon match in marseille (great 1st set by the way) and is constantly checking the scores on what the women are doing in dubai...

    i played him again today. he is improving a lot, i feel like i have to win every point... few gifts.

    He really misses the girls. haha! I told him to have a chat with the coach about it. I'm not sure he meant it literally, but my friend is convinced.

    Do you guys think he should talk to the coach about the ban?
     
  31. luvforty

    luvforty Banned

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    i think he and the coach are in a fallacy... there is no cause-effect relationship between the ban and his improvement.

    this is like wearing white shoes to practice everyday, and thinking hitting better is due to the white shoes.
     
  32. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    What does he really miss about the girls? How old is he?
     
  33. pvaudio

    pvaudio Legend

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    Is this thread even supposed to be serious? My trolldar is on a weak setting now.
     
  34. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    I think relinquis took us for a nice ride
     
  35. slowfox

    slowfox Professional

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    If he's gonna troll, at least do it with the flair of say... TTMR. Master craftsman of the troll post.
     
  36. Timbo's hopeless slice

    Timbo's hopeless slice Hall of Fame

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    ye, surely trolling..

    WTA is such awesome tennis, especially live.

    I do find all these armchair idiots in the 'General Pro Discussion' section hilarious.

    'oh, a 4.5 could take games off Wozniacki..' ye, right, lol!!!

    we just had a WTA event in our town, standard of play was fantastic and this was just a 10K event...
     
  37. Relinquis

    Relinquis Hall of Fame

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    lol.. if only i was so creative*!

    anyway, to answer your questions my friend** is in grad-school, late 20s, always a fan of tennis (graf, aggassi in the past, now Azarenka/Goerges and delpo/Nadal), has played on and off, but is now taking it seriously given he is not in the working world for the time being. he'll do "anything to get good" as he says.

    He told me he'll probably have a chat with coach george to understand a bit more his philosophy*** and what his plan is to develop his tennis. i think it's important to have a dialogue with your coach, not to simply follow instructions and soldier on. he was really looking forward to watch dubai wta though.

    You have to admit, WTA tennis is a little different in terms of strategy from Simon and Ferrer's styles of play (did you see Simon's match today? tres cool). Are there comparables on WTA?

    Will hit with him, my friend not the coach, in a day or two. will update then...


    * banning WTA, sometimes life really is stranger than fiction!
    ** I've shown him this thread to give him some perspective.
    *** Personally, i think he want to help him develop more consistency and ability to play high percentage tennis.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2013
  38. EP1998

    EP1998 Semi-Pro

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    Serena is good to watch because she has such fantastic preparation. Everyone can improve on that.
     
  39. pvaudio

    pvaudio Legend

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    How do you not see how stupid this sounds? It's like super conservative parents telling their kids not to read certain books because the fiction disagrees with the Bible. Difference is, this isn't about upbringing and moral values. It's about a STYLE of tennis. If women's tennis graces his eyes, he's automatically going to try what he sees on TV, according to "coach George". That's why this thread is absurd.
     
  40. comeback

    comeback Professional

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    To be honest i usually tape all TV tennis so i can fast forward when i want. For WTA matches i usually FF to 4-4 if it comes to that..If it's a route i didn't waste any time..I do prefer WTA doubles over ATP doubles as the rallies are better.
     
  41. Tafmatch

    Tafmatch Rookie

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    It's ridiculous. Watching WTA besides your 'role models' Simon and Ferrer should do no harm at all to your training. If anything it will probably improve your game because you see the differences more clearly.

    It seems to me the coach just thinks it's cool or Lendl-like to say things like that to his students. It's silly.

    If his game is improving just continue with the coach but watch WTA as well.
     
  42. TennisCJC

    TennisCJC Legend

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    Too bad you're banned from watching WTA. I would think a young guy would be interested in analyzing the service return ready stance of several WTA players. As an old guy, I still find that stance quite attactive at times.

    Watching WTA is not going to ruin your game - that's silly. There are huge differences in ATP technique. Federer and Nadal hit straight arm forehands and Murray and Djoko have bent arm forehands. Federer uses platform stance on serve, Murray pinpoint. Bellucci is a great player but frequently has his elbow tucked into is side at contact - literally almost touching his side with severe bend in the elbow - bent elbow FH is seen a lot on WTA but also frequently on ATP.

    I think I would ignore your coach but not tell him. It is fun to rebel against authority from time to time. As Mick Jagger once said "enjoy the secret pleasure of doing something wrong".
     
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2013
  43. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    I have an academic interest in how the frequency of side-to-side oscillation increases as the server gets closer and closer to serving. But sometimes there are pauses and adjustments before the oscillation resumes which makes the study quite difficult.
     
  44. slowfox

    slowfox Professional

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    And the sweaty kiss at the end of WTA matches too.
     
  45. pvaudio

    pvaudio Legend

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    This is an area of great research interest to many males. The vertical component of the preparation velocity is also quite nice to watch ;)
     
  46. NTexas

    NTexas New User

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    I bet Coach George got beat by a girl...
     
  47. pvaudio

    pvaudio Legend

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    Maybe she was a pusher too, so he doesn't want students to get beaten so embarrassingly too :shock:
     
  48. Pickle9

    Pickle9 Semi-Pro

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    GmofoPOAT

    That is all.
     
  49. slowfox

    slowfox Professional

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    Perhaps gets/got rejected a lot too.
     
  50. Fugazi

    Fugazi Professional

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    Your friend can watch porn instead. Nuff said... ;) Seriously I doubt watching the WTA will have a big negative effect...
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2013

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