380pistol
Banned
I tend to agree. I inclinded to give the overall forehand edge to Federer. But running forehand it's not even close.... Pistol all day.
Best running forehand ever?
- Thread starter Cesc Fabregas
- Start date
I tend to agree. I inclinded to give the overall forehand edge to Federer. But running forehand it's not even close.... Pistol all day.
The-Champ
Legend
Running forehand cross court goes to Pete. Running forehand DTL definitely goes to Nadal...wouldn't you agree?
Pete's was a great shot but I think it's overrated by some....It had some limitations. He hit some screamers with it and could turn the point around in one hit, but people seem to forget how many he missed. Against Agassi, for example, He probably hit 1 good/great (which everyone remembers from the highlight reel) one then followed it up with about 4 or 5 that were either way long or into the bottom of the net (which people selectively forget). I was and still am a massive Sampras fan and it was frustrating as hell to see how many unforced errors he made off that side. He did use it well though...He wasn't as good as traditional baseliners from the back of the court so he figured his best chance to win the point was to go for the outright win rather than continuing with the rally. Federer on the other hand, can't really end the point outright with it but he uses it to get back into the point and neutralise an opponents agressive play. He gets a tonne of them back into a neutral position with plenty of spin and misses a lot less than Pete does. His limitation is that he tends to make a lot of errors on it when he goes for it too much (when he gets desperate)...can't flatten it out and hit it as hard as Sampras.
okdude1992
Hall of Fame
agreed. nadal gets so much ridiculous spin while the power sampras generated was incredible. but apparently i need to find some lendl clips due to the high marks he is receiving in this area
380pistol
Banned
Nah. Don't get me wrong Nadal has an excellent running forehand, but Pete with his long arms along with his eastern grip were more conducive for hitting running forehands. Also Sampras' penchant for hitting a flatter ball helps. I've seen Sampras go down the line too many times to outright give it to Rafa, though like I said Nadal has a fine one himself.
380pistol
Banned
I guess you misunderstood the question. He said running forehand!!!!
Dark Victory
Rookie
Keen observation. I think it has to do with the lateral weight transfer, angle and torque that an eastern grip can give to a forehand on the run. Federer has to square up a bit to hit his running forehand with the semi-western. He often manages to do so because his footwork and anticipation is so great. But on the occasions when he can't get into just the right position, he stutter steps and the shot looks awkward.
volleynets
Hall of Fame
I am surprised at the few times Nadal has been picked. I think Nadal has to have the best running forehand. He hits passing winners off of it almost every time when the opponent is at the net.
Datacipher
Banned
I'd go along with this, but it's very very close. I MIGHT Lendl over Nadal in terms of the actual shot, Lendl could blast it through better...but Nadal is faster at actually getting to the ball.
Datacipher
Banned
Yes, that was just a SILLY assertion. Sampras DID NOT hit winner after winner, year after year, on the running forehand with it being readable.
In fact, tour players, are so fast, and have such good anticipation, that no matter how hard you hit a shot on the run, if it's readable, you're going to be in trouble 8 of 10 times. If it's readable, they'll cover it most of the time, and all they have to do is redirect it into your wide open court to put you in a world of hurt, and that's something every one of them can do if they can just get to it. What made Sampras' forehand great (and the others mentioned here), was his ability to whip the racquet up at the last second and drive it down the line OR deep crosscourt or even buggy whip a short angle, without the opponent getting a good read on it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMQKjhEpTiA&feature=related
Yes, so readable. Too bad he was only playing schmucks who for SOME reason couldn't read it.
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What convinced me about Lendl having the best ever running forehand
In the late 80's Ivan Lendl was playing Edberg at the Sydney Indoor tournament. In those days that was a big tournament. I saw this on TV, but what I recall is that Edberg hit an extremely wide shot to Ivan's Forehand side. There was no way in heaven and earth that he was even going to reach the ball -but he did reach it, he was nearly in the crowd by the time he hit it and hit it he did for a winner. The acceleration, control and power he showed was extraordinary. It was such a spectacular shot it was shown on regular TV replays I recall.
I watched Sampras many times, and yes his running forehand was impressive, but I just don't think he had the reach that Ivan did.
Lendl had extraordinary power off it as well. The ball would come back to opponents who were sometimes waiting for it but couldn't control it because of the depth and power.
In the late 80's Ivan Lendl was playing Edberg at the Sydney Indoor tournament. In those days that was a big tournament. I saw this on TV, but what I recall is that Edberg hit an extremely wide shot to Ivan's Forehand side. There was no way in heaven and earth that he was even going to reach the ball -but he did reach it, he was nearly in the crowd by the time he hit it and hit it he did for a winner. The acceleration, control and power he showed was extraordinary. It was such a spectacular shot it was shown on regular TV replays I recall.
I watched Sampras many times, and yes his running forehand was impressive, but I just don't think he had the reach that Ivan did.
Lendl had extraordinary power off it as well. The ball would come back to opponents who were sometimes waiting for it but couldn't control it because of the depth and power.
Datacipher
Banned
Actually it's your sexism that is disgusting. Showing favoritism simply because she is a woman is sickening and condesending. An insult to both her and her competition. Yes, she "can't help" it that's she a woman. No, she doesn't need you to pretend he forehand is on par with the men. Those who say "for a woman" are simply acknowledging a truthful fact that allows them to give her credit, nor false credit. Grow up and drop the sexism.
You go too far by accusing people of sexism just because they only want to acknowledge Steffi has the best running forehand in women's game instead of asserting hers is the best overall in tennis history.
You can argue Graf has the best overall but you have to listen to and understand the arguments who favour Pete or Ivan Lendl or Nadal as the best as well.
To me both positions are defensible depending on different perspectives.
From the viewpoint of the degree of dominance and the damage it caused to opponents, Steffi's running forehand is probably the best in tennis history.
Her opponents are probably more vulnarable to her running forehand than Pete or Ivan's opponent are to their running forehand.
Sampras' and Lendl's running forehand, however, seem more powerful than Steffi's, and Lendl's running forehand is as consistent as Steffi's,so it is also legitimate to claim powerwise Pete or Lendl has better running forehand than Graf.
Personnally I think Steffi's running forehand is as good as Pete's. Her excellent footwork and court speed allow her to execute this shot with power, accuracy and consistency, which is an amazing combination. However I definitely can see the point those people who argue for Lendl or Sampras as the best ever. I think it is insane to call them sexism.
Acctually I think you yourself make you look more like a sexist, a sexist agaisnt man who does not allow people contend that some male players have better running forehand than Graf.
BounceHitBounceHit
Legend
Federer, Sampras, Lendl, Graf..........yep. BHBH 
(oh, and Agassi's didn't stink either)
(oh, and Agassi's didn't stink either)I do understand the arguments for each player's forehand. They are all well thought out. I'm not speaking out against THOSE arguments.
I did not choose Steffi just because she is a woman. I am talking objectively about her forehand vs. Sampras and the others you mentioned. IN MY OPINION, it was the most dominant vs. her competition.
When I said certain speech in here was sexist, I was talking about people who say that her forehand is good "for a woman". That term is sexist. When people contend that Sampras has a better running forehand, they have excellent reasoning and it could be true. When SOME dismiss Steffi from the entire thread because she is a woman and her forehand wouldn't be as effective against a man, that is what I'm calling sexist. All that matters is how she uses it against competition of her own sex. Same with Sampras, same with Lendl. Same with Nadal.
Winners or Errors
Legend
I'm not following. Why is it sexist to say that Steffi's forehand wouldn't hold a candle to the top 100 men's forehands in the same period? It's probably true. Against your competition is fine, but let's be realistic.
Since Steffi would not even have been competitive against the top 100 men of her own era, how is it sexist to leave her forehand off the list?
Maybe I'm just dense, but for the same reason Steffi can't play in the GOAT discussion I think she's out of this one.
Datacipher
Banned
Thanks for spelling out your ugly sexism once again. I suppose everyone who doesn't think Mal Washington was the greatest player of all time is a racist. And you ACCUSE others of racism? UGLY.
Datacipher
Banned
It's preposterous of course. My running forehand is one of my best shots. One could argue that against MY competition, it's arguably more effective than any pro's! But of course that's asinine.
And to the accuse anyone who would not subscribe to such a ridiculous methodolgy of measuring the "best" forehand of sexism? That's just ugly reverse sexism.
PS There's also no point in even trying to imagine Sampras's running forehand against Seles! LOL.
Sidestepping the sexism arguments, Steffi's forehand ( note I do not modify with 'running' ) may be the single most dominant weapon I have seen in the tennis sport, her entire game was built around using it as exclusively as possible. Almost every victory against any type of player, on any surface, she can credit her forehand for. Her speed allowed it , sometimes her serve set it up, and her backhand was a fortress but over and over again, even when players attacked her backhand wing, the forehand ended up forcing errors or claiming outright winners. Lendl's forehand is the best among the guys. The running part just confuses this up IMO
TnsGuru
Professional
I did read somewhere that he actually shaded the backhand side to cover his backhand weakness and to purposely bait his opponent into thinking he was out of position and he would anticipate the open court and the rest is history.
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Limpinhitter
G.O.A.T.
There have been many great running forehands, but, in my view, the greatest running forehands are those of Sampras, Laver and Nadal, all of whom were also among the fastest players of all time. Lendl had a great running forehand, but, not the speed of these three. I've seen video of Hoad hitting some great forehands on the stretch, but, not enough to have a solid opinion about his running forehand.
As for running backhands, there is only one who stands in a class by himself, by a wide margin, The Rocket!
As for running backhands, there is only one who stands in a class by himself, by a wide margin, The Rocket!
pc1
G.O.A.T.
I have seen opponents hit a perfect lob against Laver right into Laver's backhand corner. Laver would run back so smoothly and hit a perfectly timed topspin backhand winner going backwards at great speed pass his opponents. I believe Julius Heldman wrote that players feared this shot so much at they often preferred to let Laver hit a backhand overhead.
pc1
G.O.A.T.
Newcombe's great forehand is forgotten by many nowadays but I'll never forget how fearsome it was.
Limpinhitter
G.O.A.T.
pc1
G.O.A.T.
He wasn't fast but he had a great running forehand.
pc1
G.O.A.T.
Some other great running backhands were those of Connors and Borg.
Check Connors' backhand at the 47 second mark.
Check out the passing shot from the backhand around the 9:50 mark.
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Limpinhitter
G.O.A.T.
NonP
Legend
Among the guys there are really three serious contenders in the past 30-40 years:
Sampras
Lendl
Nadal
And yes, that's my order. I'll quote this post of mine in full here cuz it says pretty much everything I have to say on this topic:
Better footspeed doesn't necessary mean better running FH, though. Speaking of which....
Add in Becker and Krajicek on the men's side. Neither was the fastest cat around, but you didn't want them hitting that FH on the stretch.
Sampras
Lendl
Nadal
And yes, that's my order. I'll quote this post of mine in full here cuz it says pretty much everything I have to say on this topic:
Better footspeed doesn't necessary mean better running FH, though. Speaking of which....
Add in Becker and Krajicek on the men's side. Neither was the fastest cat around, but you didn't want them hitting that FH on the stretch.
Limpinhitter
G.O.A.T.
That's not the issue. The issue is who had the best running forehand ever, which, in my view, requires great speed.
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Limpinhitter
G.O.A.T.
Check out Laver's running backhand pass attempt, point beginning at about 17:20. I only wish I could post video of some of the amazing shots I've actually seen when Laver was still the best player in the World. Here, Laver is only a shell of his former self, but, he sure surprised Borg with this get on the dead run, from completely off of the court:
capellano
New User
Sampras finished the rally off with his running forehand more than anyone. The comparison with Lendl has some validity. However 19 years old Pete was out running Lendl in 1990. Pete was the best athlete for so many years. Sampras hit the RF from a lower ball than Nadal. The grass courts during the Nadal era at Wimbledon are bouncier and not so different from a hard court. That suits Nadal. My opinion is that Nadal would have struggled to wrap his bigger racket around the ball from a flatter hit, lower ball. Sampras from standstill to full pelt subjectively seems more explosive than say a Nadal who tends to hit the RF then break immediately (knee wear) . Sampras flows into the shot for a winner and it seems to be more natural for him.
THUNDERVOLLEY
G.O.A.T.
Sort of a tough one. Lendl arguably had more variety, but Sampras probably had the better wrist to achieve wicked directions with that shot. Ironically enough, a young Sampras once said he modeled his running forehand on Lendl's.
flanker2000fr
Hall of Fame
Both Lendl and Federer have overall a better forehand than Sampras (variety, consistency, spin), but Sampras had the best running forehand I have ever seen.
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