Bruguera talks about Nadal

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by Xuxa Kuerten, May 21, 2009.

  1. Xuxa Kuerten

    Xuxa Kuerten Rookie

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    Hello. Spaniard Sergi Bruguera, RG champion in 1993 and 1994, talked today here in São Paulo about his countryman, Rafael Nadal. He's one of the seniors players that are competing in ATP Champions Tour. Among other things, he said about Rafa's performance on clay (my translation):

    – Nowadays Rafa is really the best. I don't see opponents that are good enough to beat him in slow courts.

    – When asked if Nadal would have the same success had he played during Bruguera's age, he said that Rafa would be one of the best, but wouldn't win as easy as he does currently. Against Guga, for instance, he would win one match, then lose another, and so on. It would always be a tough match.

    – When asked if would he had a chance against Rafa, he jokingly said: "I feel worthwhile" (I'm sorry, that's the best expression I've found, I don't know if it's the most correct). He then said tha probably Rafa would win more matches, but he for sure had the capacity of defeating him once in a while.



    That's the interview in portuguese: http://revistatenis.uol.com.br/Edic...guera-sobre-hipotetico-confronto-139233-1.asp
     
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  2. TheTruth

    TheTruth G.O.A.T.

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    Nice article. We hadn't heard from Brugera. Very interesting!
     
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  3. Blinkism

    Blinkism Legend

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    I think Nadal would be top clay-courter at any given point for clay courters from the late 80's to today. Doubtful that he'd get 4 FO titles in a row, but he'd still be chasing records on clay.

    Now, if he was playing in the 70's and early 80's with Vilas and Borg, that'd be a different story.

    Good to hear Brugera's opinion on current tennis, though. I wonder what Kuerten, Medvedev, Gomez, and Chang think?
     
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  4. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Agreed. Can you imagine Nadal trying to beat Borg or Vilas with a wood racquet? He'd be shanking every other ball with that reverse vertical lasso forehand of his. :shock:
     
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  5. Blinkism

    Blinkism Legend

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    Haha, I wouldn't take it that far. What I meant is that he'd probably be in a fierce rivalry with them, instead of being the top guy.

    Shanking every ball? Lol!!
     
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  6. BobFL

    BobFL Hall of Fame

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    You are not serious with this, are you?
     
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  7. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    There's a good reason why people refer to the reverse forehand as the "modern forehand".


    Nadal does it pretty well with his modern 100 sq. in., 11 oz. racquet strung with poly. I'd like to see him try it with a 65 sq. in., 14 oz. wood racquet with zero power.
     
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  8. nfor304

    nfor304 Banned

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    Its amazing, and pretty lucky, how 2 of the best claycourters from the years just before Rafas, Ferrero and Coria, just lost all their form all of a sudden and basically disappeared from the top.
     
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  9. matchmaker

    matchmaker Hall of Fame

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    I am sure Nadal could play with any racquet in any era. Nadal is a freak of nature, especially because of his competitive attitude. He would probably have played just like Borg, had he played in that era.
     
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  10. Dilettante

    Dilettante Hall of Fame

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    You need to chill out about Nadal. Seriously. You could end having paranoid thoughts like "Uncle Toni is in my closet and he's watching me while I sleep!!"
     
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  11. Datacipher

    Datacipher Banned

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    I would pick Nadal as, at least, a slight favorite against any of the greatest clay courters in history, but I also have no doubt, that Guga and Bruguera would win some matches from him. Guga's had shotmaking beyond any of the 3 and Bruguera is the one guy who could match topspin with Nadal. Would be quite a battle.
     
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  12. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    We never heard a peep out of Borg when he hit the ball.
     
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  13. Dilettante

    Dilettante Hall of Fame

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    Great reasoning, as always.





    ..in case you don't get it: just irony.
     
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  14. Cyan

    Cyan Hall of Fame

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    With a prime young Sampras around, or a prime young McEnroe around, Fed would not be winning any Wimbledons or USOs either... Duh.
     
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  15. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    Why do you assume he would have played then as he plays today?
     
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  16. GameSampras

    GameSampras Banned

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    Prime Bruguera would give Nadal a crapload of fits on clay. There isnt a player who today who can touch Bruguera on clay outside of Rafa. Djoker is close but not quite
     
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  17. l_gonzalez

    l_gonzalez Professional

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    Exactly. It's a completely pointless argument. Had Nadal grown up around that time his technique wouldn't be what it is today.
     
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  18. ksbh

    ksbh Banned

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    Spot on, Cyan!

     
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  19. mandy01

    mandy01 G.O.A.T.

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    Class A bullsh*t..coulda,woulda,shoulda..yeah right :roll:
     
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  20. bolo

    bolo G.O.A.T.

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    lol. 10 char.
     
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  21. JohnS

    JohnS Semi-Pro

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    I like how this conversation quickly turned into a Nadal-Fed thread by line 14. :)
     
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  22. 35ft6

    35ft6 Legend

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    He won the French in 93 and 94, lets see who he lost to on clay during those years:

    1993
    - Muster
    - Haarhuis (on everybody's list of great clay court players of the 90's)
    - Berasetegui
    - Jim Courier
    - Stefan Edberg
    - Medvedev
    - Haarhuis again
    - Mark Koevermans (who is this guy?)

    1994
    - Franco Davin (?)
    - Michael Stich
    - Thomas Muster
    - Medvedev
    - Richard Kraijeck
    - Albert Costa (he retired)

    Come on, he's not even in the same league as Nadal. Yes, he is definitely one of the best clay courters of past 20 years, but that's still a bit away from Rafa. By the way, he was 3-12 against lefty Muster.
     
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  23. 35ft6

    35ft6 Legend

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    Which is basically what the guys who love the old guys say about, for example, Borg, that if he played today his technique would be different but he would still have championship qualities. Fair enough, but yeah, I notice it never works both ways. Their favorites would adapt, but the guys of today like Nadal, no way their attributes could translate favorably to the game of the 70's.
     
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  24. fednad

    fednad Hall of Fame

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    What i can imagine is that nadal plays borg - 159 shots rally and then nadal takes 78 seconds between the points to serve.
    Every match scheduled for saturday and would finish on sunday
     
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  25. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    Because how he plays now is the reason why he wins.
     
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  26. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    And, thus, he wouldn't be nearly as dominant. It's the way he hits the ball today that has won him so many matches.
     
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  27. matchmaker

    matchmaker Hall of Fame

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    An illustration of the aforementioned theory by 35ft6...

    I think that both a prime Borg now and Nadal back then would do very good in any field.

    They have a competitive spirit if they grew up in any age they would find a way to master the then technique and playing style.

    If I am sure of anything concerning Rafael Nadal, it's that he wins most matches despite the way he hits the ball.

    He wins because of metal strength.
     
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  28. Gorecki

    Gorecki G.O.A.T.

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    i see.. Bruguera is a Nadal Hater....

    wait until Nadatards find about this thread....


    ps: OH wait.. Delirante and Bolinhol already did...
     
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  29. P_Agony

    P_Agony Banned

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    Well, with a prime, young, Federer around, Nadal would not be winning any Wimbledons or AOs either...
    Duh.
     
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  30. Dilettante

    Dilettante Hall of Fame

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    Yes, it's always like that.
     
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  31. bluegrasser

    bluegrasser Hall of Fame

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    In BP's defense , Nadal would have to change his strokes, no question about that. Playing with wood is a whole different ball game + a racquet face that's 40% smaller. He couldn't hit those same shots with a wood stick - trust me on that.
     
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  32. Dilettante

    Dilettante Hall of Fame

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    On the other hand, if old claycourters played today, they would've to change their games also. You can't go out with wooden racquet techiques (even holding a modern racquet) against today's players or you would've crushed. It takes a life to develop a successful tennis style adapted to your time. What makes you guys think that old players could be so successful with new material against people who were born and grew up with that material.

    To compare different era's players in terms of "who would win" is very difficult. But I don't get the usual theory on these boards that says: older player would win. That doesn't happen in any sport.
     
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  33. bluegrasser

    bluegrasser Hall of Fame

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    Uh..yes, but that's not what WE'RE TALKING ABOUT ! - I could be wrong, but I smell ' Nationalism"- another ' Nadal is God! " thread..geesh ! & the way you talk about " you old guys" like anybody over 40 is irrelevant ( is that a word?) Just keep voting *Yes* for euthanasia (s?) & soon you'll be rid of all us *old* guys - only a matter of time.:)
     
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  34. Dilettante

    Dilettante Hall of Fame

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    WTF

    Sergi Bruguera is a Spaniard too, mate. So is, for example, JCF, who is Spanish and whose game I like MORE than Nadal's. But it happens that Nadal's game is just better. Nationalism my @ss.

    I'm just saying that sports evolve for better, and being difficult to compare between eras, there's no actual reason to think that players from older eras are intrinsically superior. If something, it would be just the contrary.

    You call it "nationalism", I call it "evolution".
     
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  35. boris becker 1

    boris becker 1 Rookie

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    Bruguera doesnt hate him at all. He isnt jealous of his sucess either. Bruguera won 2 of them and should have won a third as well.

    As for calling a Catalan(Bruguera,Nadal,Costa,Ferrer,Corretja) spanish they dont like that too much.
     
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  36. boris becker 1

    boris becker 1 Rookie

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    and Bruguera in his prime would have challenged Nadal in best of 5 on clay. I think Bruguera was fitter than Nadal is now for a start
     
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  37. boris becker 1

    boris becker 1 Rookie

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    and nadal against the in the prime Becker even on this grass Becker would win
     
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  38. bluegrasser

    bluegrasser Hall of Fame

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    Evolution...true, the game if different, no question, but beauty is in the eyes of the beholder, & today's game( IMO) in most cases is boring, at least to this cat. I've never said nor breakpoint that players from the wooden era are superior, just that Nadal would have a difficult time playing with wood frames the way he strokes the ball. Choose your poison I guess...
     
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  39. Dilettante

    Dilettante Hall of Fame

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    Oh no, not that Catalan Vs. Spanish nationalist thing again.

    OK, it's not like I care much but I'll explain to you: Sergi's father was captain of Spanish Davis Cup team and Bruguera himself played for Spain.

    The same for Costa and Bruguera. Can't tell about Costa political feelings, but Corretja is a Spanish TV commentator and he is far from being a Catalan nationalist or anything like that (he always roots for Spanish players but in a calm and elegant way, being very respectful to rivals). You can say exactly the same for Emilio Sanchez-Vicario. Maybe other Catalan players have nationalistic feelings, I don't know and I really can't think of anyone. If some Catalan player has those feelings, he didn't say anything a-la-Murray.

    On a side note, Nadal is not Catalan, he's Majorcan, and he carried the Spanish flag sometimes: when he won Wimbledon, for instance.

    Ferrer is not Catalan either, he's from Valencian Autonomous Community -just like me- and you can tell most Valencians aren't that happy if called "Catalans". Just like that Clint Eastwood's movie where everyone asked him "you're from Texas, right?" and he was always pissed and saying "I'm from Arizona!"

    But don't want to start a political/geographic talk here, that would be very boring. There's another subforum for such a matter. We could go there if you want to go on with the subject and get some information.

    One of the best things about tennis in Spain is that, unlike football (soccer) the political/nationalistic stuff has nothing to do with this sport and no one in Spanish tennis gives a f**k about that. Football teams use politics to get supporters, as it unfortunately happens often in Europe, but Spanish Tennis is a far more intelligent, sportsman and educated world than the depressing Football world and more depressing Football journalists.

    So let's keep it that way, please.

    Thank you.
     
    #39
  40. thalivest

    thalivest Banned

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    Yeah I agree. The only 90s players superior on clay to Federer or Djokovic today are 95-96 Muster and 91-93 Courier. I would take either Federer or Djokovic over Bruguera anyday.
     
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  41. Dilettante

    Dilettante Hall of Fame

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    Oh, I can't argue with that. If you find modern game "boring", it's up to you, and I totally respect that opinion. A game being aesthetically better is just a matter of taste, so can't really say nothing against that. Perfect to me.

    I think it works both ways, that's why I find so har to compare players from different eras. But yes, choose your poison...
     
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  42. Nadal_Freak

    Nadal_Freak Banned

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    Nadal is strong and fit as anyone back in the day. I'm sure he would have no problem learning to hit flatter as that would be the only style that he would know of. Breakpoint hijacking another thread with his junk once again.
     
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  43. Pirao

    Pirao Semi-Pro

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    I suggest you don't talk about things you obviously have no clue about ;).
     
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  44. kraggy

    kraggy Banned

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    Yet another hater post by a Brugeratard.
     
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  45. Nadal_Freak

    Nadal_Freak Banned

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    Bruguera is a Gugatard. lol
     
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  46. Xuxa Kuerten

    Xuxa Kuerten Rookie

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    I don't know if you're referring particularly to Dilettante, to anyone else or to me. I've created this thread with absolutely no intention of putting any player on "god mode". I thought that the fans would think that was interesting to read the opinions of a RG champion, specialy because the interview was given to the brazilian press (so it's not available to everyone, as almost anyone here reads portuguese). And this is not a "nationalist" thread, for obvious reasons.
     
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  47. Xuxa Kuerten

    Xuxa Kuerten Rookie

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    If you're talking about matchups (and not results alone), young Kuerten and Medvedev were players talented enough to defeat Roger and Novak (but obviously he may still improve). Medvedev was like a mental midget version on clay of Ivanisevic on grass. He was one of those few guys that seemed unbeatable on a given day. Unfortunately he never lived up to the expectations.
     
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  48. thalivest

    thalivest Banned

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    Well like you said Medvedev was a mental midget. Talent wise he could atleast beat Federer or Djokovic on clay but I doubt he would have often if ever for the reasons you said. Even in his prime he underperformed at the French (as well as other slams) with high expectations. Then the way he threw away that 1999 final to Agassi, gifted on a silver platter pretty much after badly outclassing him for 2 and a half sets, pretty much typified his career. The earlier the round or the less important the match, the better chance he would have of an upset. He seemed to perform best when he felt no pressure (eg- the 99 French Open quarters).

    2004 Kuerten after hip surgery had an big upset in lopsided fashion to boot over Federer at the French, so of course 1997 Kuerten which was still better than 2004 would have some shot. One does not to keep context though the 2004 result was a huge upset at that point in time though, if the same match was played 10 times on clay between them in 2004 the result is probably only that way 1 time out of 10. 1997 Kuerten of course would have an even bigger likelihood than 2004, but the 1999-2001 Kuerten is the one I would heavily favor over Federer or Djokovic on clay and who could challenge Nadal on clay. 1997 was very good, but not the same as 1999-2001, although still very dangerous of course.
     
    Last edited: May 22, 2009
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  49. Xuxa Kuerten

    Xuxa Kuerten Rookie

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    I agree with everything you've said. I just don't know if Roger would win most of the hipothetical matches versus Guga in 2004 because I honestly think he actually didn't play bad at all that day. Kuerten wasn't that spectacular either, but was able to impose his agressive game despite his very poor conditions. The thing is that at that point the brazilian needed to win his matches in three sets or he would most probably lose it in five. So I guess that had they met again, Roger would need to find a way to tire Guga (specialy by using crosscourt forehands), and maybe to serve and volley more often. Even on those conditions, I guess the match would still be tough. 2006, 2007 versions of Federer would have the edge against 2004 Kuerten, I think.

    About Medvedev, he was outstanding on those QF and SF and even during the first half of the final. Everything Kuerten, Meligeni (who was playing the best tennis of his life) and Agassi threw at him, he returned it better, with more pace, angled or deeper that usual. After that final match, he simply dissapeared (I guess he was 23, 24) and retired 2 years later. What a shame.
     
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  50. BreakPoint

    BreakPoint Bionic Poster

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    It is universally accepted that wood racquets were MUCH, MUCH harder to play with than today's modern racquets. If that were not the case, everyone would be still playing with wood racquets.
     
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