Can you really train up a volleyer to win at the pro level?

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by Golden Retriever, Feb 22, 2009.

  1. Golden Retriever

    Golden Retriever Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2004
    Messages:
    1,950
    I really think volleying can't be trained. It is a touch shot and touch is something you either have it or you don't. Thats why there is so few S&Vers. On the other hand, baseline bashing can be trained so they can be mass produced.
     
    #1
  2. saram

    saram Legend

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2007
    Messages:
    5,371
    First things first--without a potent serve, the S&V is kinda only the &V....

    I think it can be trained (volleys) with continual work. Very few people though work on them continually.
     
    #2
  3. LanceStern

    LanceStern Professional

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2008
    Messages:
    1,332
    You need so much patience and determination to train volleys. Just about everything has to be right to win with S&V or volleys in general.

    It is possible, but man will it take effort. Plus you need a great serve
     
    #3
  4. Golden Retriever

    Golden Retriever Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2004
    Messages:
    1,950
    I play with this one guy who hardly trains at all but his volley is just incredible. Sharp angles and consistent at the same time. He can hit winner off shoestring volleys like it is nothing. On the other hand his groundstrokes are inconsistent due to lack of training.

    I train a lot more than him so my groundstrokes are much better but my volley is just not in the same league no matter how I train.
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2009
    #4
  5. snr

    snr Rookie

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2008
    Messages:
    278
    I think its possible and its not that - IMO - one is that much harder than the other (baseline versus volley), its the fact as someone nailed earlier that volleying requires, the S; the serve.

    While a baseliner can SURVIVE with just their game, but ultimately will be able to get their goals with having that strength, and some other traits (such as being fast, having stamina, strength etc.). An example is Nadal in his early stages; his serve was not as effective. a serve and volleyer would not even be competition and would never reach their goals if their serve was not as good.

    I think its just the fact that S&V requires two VERY TUNED skills while baseline requires one skill with a few other skills being mediocre.
     
    #5
  6. Max G.

    Max G. Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2004
    Messages:
    4,355
    Nonsense. Why would the volley be different in that respect?

    I was a baseliner for a while. Then I switched to a serve-volleyer, and after a few years I could do shoestring volleys and so on as well and impress everyone. Now that I'm playing less and not practicing as much I can't do them anymore.

    Sure, some players have some extra talent; you can't teach someone how to volley like John McEnroe unless they just "have it". But in general, it requires practice and hard work, just like any other shot.
     
    #6
  7. LanceStern

    LanceStern Professional

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2008
    Messages:
    1,332
    We agree with that, but a common statement is that these days, tennis is not suited for serve and volleyers. Would hard work and practice be enough at the PRO level. The top of the top?

    I could practice and practice all day to become an insane Pichu in Super Smash Bros. Melee. But would that be enough to beat the best in the world who are using top-tier characters like Fox, Falco, Marth and Peach?
     
    #7
  8. Noveson

    Noveson Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2006
    Messages:
    3,241
    In the same way Mcenroes touch cannot be trained, Nadal's insane racquet speed can't be trained. It goes both ways.
     
    #8
  9. phoenicks

    phoenicks Professional

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2008
    Messages:
    1,246
    Volleyer , no way in hell !!!

    Serve, and volleyer, yeah, possible, but it's gonna be a very very tough challenge., it requires 2 big skills with a lot of variety, finesse and timing in it, i.e 1st serve, Kick serve, slice serve, drop volley, shoelace volley... etc.
     
    #9
  10. Blinkism

    Blinkism Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2009
    Messages:
    8,598
    Personally, when I was starting out as a kid I had (and still do) a killer serve but never came into the net. However, my coach was really old school so he pushed me into S&V. It's never come to me as a natural instinct, though. I prefer to volley when i've hit something wide cross court or if i'm coming in from the baseline on a floater..... I guess you could called that being a "volleyer" seperate of being a serve and volleyer.

    In the big leagues, that kind of skill doesn't translate to a whole game though. Like has been said, you either need to do the serve and volley or you're sticking around at the baseline (90% of the time).
     
    #10
  11. tennis_hand

    tennis_hand Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2006
    Messages:
    4,427
    if u hit an average rally shot, u are still in the rally.

    if you hit an average volley, you are dead.

    if u try to hit every volley perfect, not possible or u make errors.

    that said, u need to be very good at volleys and approach shots and serves to win the game. anything mediocre is as bad as not having it.
     
    #11
  12. Golden Retriever

    Golden Retriever Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2004
    Messages:
    1,950
    Maybe Nadal's insane racquet speed can't be trained but you can certainly improve your racquet speed to a good level through training.

    I don't think you can improve your touch as much as you can improve your racquet speed through training.
     
    #12
  13. Ocean Drive

    Ocean Drive Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2007
    Messages:
    1,714
    I think everything can be trained to a certain level, but when it comes to 5 all in the fifth, break point down and your staring at a ball coming at your feet at 80mph I don't think much training will help.

    Racket speed can definitely be trained through explosive power as well as technique, whoever said that it can't is crazy.
     
    #13
  14. Max G.

    Max G. Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2004
    Messages:
    4,355
    Well, in the modern game it doesn't matter whether your touch is natural talent or practice, it won't get you to the top of the top.

    If tennis isn't suited for serve-volleyers, then it's equally unsuited for ones that got there through talent or not.
     
    #14
  15. coloskier

    coloskier Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2007
    Messages:
    5,487
    So, in other words, you can be a bad baseliner and still win, but if you are a bad volleyer you are toast.
     
    #15
  16. Blinkism

    Blinkism Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2009
    Messages:
    8,598
    You can be an average volleyer, but you need to have almost perfect footwork and stamina.... if you've got that then you can stand @ the net all day and just recover every passing shot attempt.

    There's ways to work around your weaknesses, but it's better to stick to improving your strengths.
     
    #16
  17. araghava

    araghava Rookie

    Joined:
    May 17, 2005
    Messages:
    390
    I think the problem is that you can't win in todays game without a really solid ground game. So if you want to be a great volleyer you need to take time away from training on the ground game. I don't think there's any pro who would trade proficiency in his ground game for a better volley.
     
    #17
  18. helloworld

    helloworld Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2006
    Messages:
    4,672
    That's because he's much more talented than you.
     
    #18
  19. boredone3456

    boredone3456 Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2007
    Messages:
    4,934
    Location:
    Massachusetts
    I thinks is possible, but Volleying is a skill that as some here have said, requires a lot of work. Many of the current women don't seem to want to put in the work to develop a multi-dimensional game. However, a strong serve and volleyer could probably make a few waves on the womens tour, as many women struggle to defend whenever someone gets up to the net.

    On the mens tour, its tough, the power in the mens game now I think would make it difficult to get up to net and set up after the serve, plus the way the men hit angled shots today it is in some instances almost impossible to get up to net. Its possible, but whether it will happen or not I can't honestly say.
     
    #19
  20. Noveson

    Noveson Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2006
    Messages:
    3,241
    And you can improve your touch to a good level also. Not to mention that touch alone isn't even that large of a part of a serve and volley game. Or that you are just guessing that you can train head speed more than you can touch.
     
    #20
  21. Tennis_Monk

    Tennis_Monk Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2005
    Messages:
    3,477
    No offense but was wondering what a Killer serve is.
     
    #21
  22. kevsaenz

    kevsaenz Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2008
    Messages:
    117
    Location:
    Orange County CA
    #22
  23. Tennis_Monk

    Tennis_Monk Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2005
    Messages:
    3,477
    #23

Share This Page