Del Potro doesn't pat the dog. check out his girly WTA push strokes.

Discussion in 'Tennis Tips/Instruction' started by FrisbeeFool, Oct 25, 2012.

  1. rkelley

    rkelley Hall of Fame

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    John, as always thanks. Love the data and the comparisons with some the greats from just a few years ago.
     
    #51
  2. LeeD

    LeeD Bionic Poster

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    Doubt anyone here thinks DelPo hits a ball anywhere near WTA levels.
    Not only does his shots go faster, but they have tons more topspin.
    Just not as much topspin for ball speed, as the Spanish contingent's.
     
    #52
  3. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    JY: are your spin numbers top spin + side spin, or only top spin?
     
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  4. LeeD

    LeeD Bionic Poster

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    Not John, of course.
    I thought we already established that most players hit most of their topspin shots with some amount of sidespin component, either a little, or a lot.
     
    #54
  5. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    What is the meaning of this post? Who is not John and why is that obvious?
     
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  6. LeeD

    LeeD Bionic Poster

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    I not John, or JY, of course, you know that.
    We just spent a bunch of threads talking about the sidespin component of most topspin strokes, didn't we?
    Wouldn't it be difficult to delineate sidespin from topspin, since most shots are a combination of both?
     
    #56
  7. JohnYandell

    JohnYandell Hall of Fame

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    Suresh, Lee,

    Yeah we would need basically 3 dimensional filming to truly separate out the sidespin component.

    The numbers are total revolutions, but the huge range of positions on the court from which the ball is struck plus angles of the shots combined with the angles of the cameras make it impossible to accurately see the ratios.

    We were able to do this on the serve because of the stationary position of the players and the relatively identical contact points from serve to serve.

    The highest topspin components we saw in the serves was 30%.

    I suspect it's probably the reverse on the topspin groundstrokes--very roughly something like 70% or more topspin. Occasionally when things line up just right it seems like virtually pure topspin and probably something close to that is possible. But it would be fascinating to see the differences say comparing inside out versus inside in, hooking crosscourt versus directly down the line, etc.

    And RK,

    Thank you. I know I can't be the only one out there that wants to understand this stuff...
     
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2012
    #57
  8. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    OK you are a couple of steps ahead of me. So you clarified that you were not John and referred to discussion in other threads.
     
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  9. LeeD

    LeeD Bionic Poster

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    No biggee. At least you didn't call me a "65 year old". I'll prolly be in my grave by then.
     
    #59
  10. 5263

    5263 G.O.A.T.

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    yep, well said.
     
    #60
  11. 5263

    5263 G.O.A.T.

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    So what does 30% or 70% refer to here? What type measurement is being
    referenced?
    % of what? Are we talking degrees in one direction?
     
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2012
    #61
  12. FrisbeeFool

    FrisbeeFool Rookie

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    Thank you.
     
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2012
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  13. 5263

    5263 G.O.A.T.

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    I think this discussion is mostly about trajectory, and not so much about spin revs.
     
    #63
  14. Jeff Salzenstein

    Jeff Salzenstein New User

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    I just jumped into TW today to see what has been written recently. I want to set the record straight on what was written by 5263. If we have spoken, maybe you can let me know who you are so we can chat again sometime.

    I want to point out that me mentioning various coaches I have worked with has nothing to do with being smart and everything to do with giving credit to those great coaches who have come before me. I am forever grateful for them helping me understand the game of tennis better.

    I want to be very clear that I have created my own systematic teaching system from ALL of the coaches and mentors that I have interacted with. I spent about 3 days in Florida with Oscar once and have also studied his material via videos and books. I have also studied with numerous other coaches for far longer periods of time.

    To say I have studied the modern game from Oscar is an inaccurate statement. He is one of many coaches that has helped shape my philosophy and I've learned a lot from many other coaches as well (Landsdorp, Baskin, Macci, Jones, O'Shaugnessy, O'Dwyer, Yandell, etc etc) I have also developed my philosophies from my own experimentation and video analysis.
     
    #64
  15. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    ........................
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2012
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  16. 5263

    5263 G.O.A.T.

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    Really?
    Some of this is just a matter of perspective Imo and of course you can see it
    how you like. I've seen some of your instruction where you credited Oscar
    directly along with your work with him as you mention again above. From my perspective
    those other coaches don't represent modern instruction for the most part
    as I use the term, but maybe your use of that term is more inline with "current"
    rather than what is properly termed "modern".

    My comments on your instruction being rooted in "modern Tennis" was more
    of an observation of what I saw in much of your instruction, while I also clearly
    saw some deviations as well. Maybe I should have been more clear on that, but
    either way, nothing I stated was inaccurate and think the 2 quotes
    above don't really jive that well. It seems you did study "modern Tennis" from
    & with Oscar, along with a lot of other tennis study with other top coaches.
    I never said you studied only or even mainly from Oscar. Personally I think it
    is "Smart" to give credit to the coaches who came before you, but again, you
    can see it differently.
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2012
    #66

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