Djokovic 2011 would have destroyed Nadal tonight

Discussion in 'Pro Match Results and Discussion' started by Nadalgaenger, Sep 9, 2013.

  1. Nadalgaenger

    Nadalgaenger Professional

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    Honestly, I don't feel that Djokovic even approached his 2011 level tonight and he nevertheless could have easily won this match had he won just ONE of those break points late in the third set.

    I don't know what happened to Djokovic but perhaps this bitter loss will inspire him to make another run to dominance next year.

    The field is no doubt the weakest it has been since 2006. Wawrinka and Gasquet are not SF quality and yet...

    2014 will be the year of the Djoker again.

    Nadal will finish with 15 slams. No more. Fed's record is safe.
     
    #1
  2. monfed

    monfed Guest

    I appreciate that you acknowledge this cold hard reality and not feed us with some baloney like Ralph playing ultra-aggressive or Ralph being unbeatable like some other Nadulltards do. etc.

    BTW Novak had Ralph down at 0-40 at 4-4 in the third set, Novak of 2011 would've broken him in the first BP if not the second, this after outplaying him for most of the set.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 9, 2013
    #2
  3. Roger Wawrinka

    Roger Wawrinka Professional

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    You can't say that he would have won those break points, and you can't say that he would have beaten Nadal if he played like he did in 2011. Two different matches.
     
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  4. objectivity

    objectivity Banned

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    coulda, woulda, shoulda. the cycle continues.
     
    #4
  5. granddog29

    granddog29 Banned

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    Djokovic is not a dominant player. Sorry. 2011 will be his only ever dominant year. He might have another worthy #1 year he ends as best player in the World like 2012, but will never have another 2011.
     
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  6. Nadalgaenger

    Nadalgaenger Professional

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    I agree that 2011 has been his only dominant year. 2013 has been a huge disappointment.

    As it stands now, Djokovic will be placed alongside Agassi and McEnroe as a Tier 2 great, below the pantheon of Laver, Fed, Nadal, Sampras and Borg.
     
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  7. Mike Sams

    Mike Sams Legend

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    How can any player ever have a season like Djokovic's 2011? It's basically unheard of. :lol:
     
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  8. powerangle

    powerangle Legend

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    Well we saw flashes of Novak 2011 in today's match. The Novak of 2011 would have been just as aggressive as Novak was today (in set 2 and 3), but would have been way more consistent as well. Rafa (or any other player for that matter) would have been battered down. But one can't keep up with that consistency (almost inhuman).
     
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  9. Antonio Puente

    Antonio Puente Hall of Fame

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    Unfortunately, 2005-2010/2012-2013 Djoker finishes a loser.

    2011 Djoker was a mirage.
     
    #9
  10. aldeayeah

    aldeayeah Hall of Fame

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    Dunno, I'd have given set 1 Nadal a fair chance against 2011 Djokovic.
     
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  11. MichaelNadal

    MichaelNadal Talk Tennis Guru

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    Lol, gotta love the visible butthurt around here :) We don't careeeeeeee! #TeamRafa
     
    #11
  12. ViscaB

    ViscaB Hall of Fame

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    Not against Rafa version 9.9.3.1.2.
     
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  13. Michael Essien

    Michael Essien Semi-Pro

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    During sets 2 and 3, Djokovic WAS destoying Nadal, that forehand came to life big time for that period and he just started nailing winners with it and Rafa was really struggling. God knows how Rafa took that set but it should have been Djokovic's set, however happy I am that Rafa took it.
     
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  14. Chico

    Chico Banned

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    +1 Absolutely agree. 2011 Novak appeared for a set and a half and completely embarrassed Nadal yesterday, than Novak embarrassed himself with all those stupid UEs and gave the match away. Nothing Nadal did made the difference.

    Nadal is pretty much done winning slams, this is his swan song. It is clear after yesterday.
     
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  15. Rozroz

    Rozroz Legend

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    i'm afraid those 2011 days are over for good. don't expect him to be that good ever again.
     
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  16. MichaelNadal

    MichaelNadal Talk Tennis Guru

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    -1 Absolutely disagree. 2011 Novak appeared for a set and a half and couldn't keep up the level needed to deal with Rafa 2.0. Then Novak embarrassed himself trying to play outside of his abilities and Rafa refused to give in and took the match from him. Nothing Djokovic threw at him made a difference.

    Djokovic is pretty much done winning slams, that was his swan song. it is clear after yesterday. ;)
     
    #16
  17. aldeayeah

    aldeayeah Hall of Fame

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    Nadole 2011 vs Nadole 13

    - There was one pattern that allowed Djokovic to dominate both in 2011 and 2013, and it was the inside-out FH to Nadal's FH, often as a return of serve.

    - His other classic 2011 pattern, the DTL backhand to Nadal's backhand, didn't hurt Nadal at all in 2013, mainly because Nadal's backhand, or rather, his movement towards the backhand side, is at his best in years.

    - A kinda new 2013 pattern is Nadal's aggressive DTL forehand, which kept Djokovic honest and won the first set.
     
    #17
  18. ScentOfDefeat

    ScentOfDefeat Hall of Fame

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    This "2011 level" hype is questionable. You can't just single out a player's level of play without assessing his opponents' as well as the conditions. There's no "pure" level of play that ensures victory. Djokovic AND Nadal were both playing a brand of tennis in 2011 that made it possible for Djokovic to come out on top more often. In 2013, however, this has been reversed. Some people are putting too much emphasis on "level" rather than the way players adjust to each other. Every match is different, and the argument that "x level in 2011" beats "y level in 2013" can not be supported because you can only ever play in the present. Djokovic's 2011 "level" will never meet Nadal's 2013 "level". This idea that you should "go back to x level" is also ludicrous because the game is always evolving and you can only do as well as your adjustments to the present.
     
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  19. Backspin1183

    Backspin1183 Legend

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    Nadal wasn't playing his best tennis in the final but it was enough to beat Novak who tried hard. Nadal 2013 at his best would have destroyed Djokovic 2011 had they played. Nadal 2013 is invincible on the hardcourts, Djokovic 2011 wasn't;)
     
    #19
  20. oscar_2424

    oscar_2424 Legend

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    would have, could have... face reality NAdal is the champion!
     
    #20
  21. 6-1 6-3 6-0

    6-1 6-3 6-0 Banned

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    And if your aunt had bollocks, she'd be your uncle.
     
    #21
  22. Crose

    Crose Professional

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    2011 Djokovic at his absolute peak lost a set to the weakest version of Nadal in years. He wouldn't even be close to "destroying" this Nadal.
     
    #22
  23. Nathaniel_Near

    Nathaniel_Near G.O.A.T.

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    Relax folks, ...
    I don't believe that myself (regarding OP).
     
    #23
  24. Backspin1183

    Backspin1183 Legend

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    1969 Laver would have destroyed Federer, Nadal and Djokovic + Murray with his wooded racket.
     
    #24
  25. ViscaB

    ViscaB Hall of Fame

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    BreakPoint is that you:).
     
    #25
  26. NetNinja68

    NetNinja68 Rookie

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    Maybe Joker should lay out for 6+ months with "injured knees" and mysterious re-emerge miraculously healed, a year older, and literally win everything. It's like magic!!! Anyone know where I can get a bottle of that incredible elixr?
     
    #26
  27. clayqueen

    clayqueen Hall of Fame

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    Shame that 2011 Djokovic is now Resting in Peace. :cry::cry::cry:

    Djokovic 2011 is no longer with us.
     
    #27
  28. clayqueen

    clayqueen Hall of Fame

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    Djokovic 2011 took an overdose of gluten free diet and that did him in. His doctor tried everything to revive hm but nothing could be done, he had to let him go.
     
    #28
  29. Backspin1183

    Backspin1183 Legend

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    No, but it's true '69 Laver would have destroyed gluten free 2011 Djokovic, monoless Federer 2006 and rocket serving machine Nadal of 2010 USO.
     
    #29
  30. reytol

    reytol New User

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    You maybe right, but this kind of discussion belongs to the what ifs and will only result to a futile argument because there is no such thing as player of whatever year vs. player of this year. It's all up in the air, we can only dream. I would have wanted the best Rafa in clay vs. the best Borg in clay. It's a dream match for me anyway.
     
    #30
  31. Humble forehand

    Humble forehand New User

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    A clever poster in TW.... not all hope is lost. :)

    This is why I also reject the notions of "peak" <player> (be it "peak" Federer, "peak" Nadal, "peak" Emerson or whoever).

    What constitutes a valid frame of reference for Peak? Is this limited to a year? A Tourney? A clay/grass/HC season? Why not a match or a set or a game or even a point.

    Taking this to the extreme you could rationally say, no player in history could have beaten "peak" Karlovic and then go on to define "peak" Karlovic as exactly the set of elementary particles that scored a "160 mph ace in the 2011 Davis Cup". (got this from wikipedia... apparently this was a doubles match but I hope you get the idea).
     
    #31
  32. Mick

    Mick Legend

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    Lately, Djokovic 2011 was never around when his fans needed him.
     
    #32
  33. ViscaB

    ViscaB Hall of Fame

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    Djokovic 2001 is turning more and more into the sighting of a Yeti.
     
    #33
  34. fatichar

    fatichar Rookie

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    Destroy... as in straight sets? When was the last time Nadal got straight setted in a slam final? Not even 2011 Nadal got that.
    And when was the last time Djoker got straight setted in a slam final? Oh, just 2 months back :) And to whom!
     
    #34
  35. Backspin1183

    Backspin1183 Legend

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    Djokovic 2011 is overratted. The guy wouldn't even have won 3 slams if Roger had taken him down when he had the chance with 2 MPs on his serve. Maybe the thought of having to face Nadal in the final stopped him. And Rafa wasn't all clutch that year and too many distractions with his book and all. The big difference between the Rafa of 2011 and 2013 is that the latest version is a much better big point player.
     
    #35
  36. Clarky21

    Clarky21 Banned

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    One thing's for sure; Cvac cannot use his book as an excuse in this manner since it's a total bomb that has only sold 1500 copies since its release. :lol:

    http://deadspin.com/heres-what-led-rafa-nadal-to-his-second-u-s-open-titl-1281001710
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2013
    #36
  37. Backspin1183

    Backspin1183 Legend

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    #37
  38. Clarky21

    Clarky21 Banned

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    Yep, only 1500 copies of it have sold since its release according to Neilsen Bookscan. I knew this book would bomb and it has not disappointed.
     
    #38
  39. 6-1 6-3 6-0

    6-1 6-3 6-0 Banned

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    Only 1500? I would have thought that there were more gullible people than that in the world.
     
    #39
  40. PSNELKE

    PSNELKE Legend

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    People act like Djokovic was the only one playing crap on Monday. Nadal sucked just as much, his offensive play was absent the whole match, all he had to do was bringing the ball back and watch Novak self destruct.
     
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  41. Blinkism

    Blinkism Legend

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    Nadal's level dropped after the first set and this let Djokovic back in.
     
    #41
  42. ksbh

    ksbh Banned

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    The only thing Djokovic 2011 would have destroyed against Nadal tonight is a couple of tennis racquets.
     
    #42
  43. swizzy

    swizzy Semi-Pro

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    2011 novak beat almost everyone.. i'm pretty sure he was denied a run at all 4 that year,, ican't remember who stopped him in his tracks....
     
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  44. DRII

    DRII Legend

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    the hate is strong with this one...
     
    #44
  45. ScentOfDefeat

    ScentOfDefeat Hall of Fame

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    Exactly my point, but from a different perspective. I want to be your buddy.
     
    #45
  46. clayqueen

    clayqueen Hall of Fame

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    According to this, he needn't have bothered with the book, he should have concentrated on his tennis.

    "Poor Djokovic. He still has no. 1 ranking but he still hasn't recovered the magic from his 2011 campaign and came up short in his two biggest battles against Nadal this year. He came into this Open on a wave of nice publicity from a big New Yorker profile and the release of a new memoir-cum-diet book, Serve To Win. (That book, like Djokovic's performance in the fourth set, turned out to be really flat. Three weeks after its release, it's sold just 1,500 copies, according to Nielsen BookScan. A bomb.)"

    http://deadspin.com/heres-what-led-rafa ... 1281001710
     
    #46
  47. 6-1 6-3 6-0

    6-1 6-3 6-0 Banned

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    Now there's a phrase I didn't expect to see.
     
    #47
  48. JohnnyMac Fan!

    JohnnyMac Fan! Professional

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    Well this is ridiculous!

    Yes, Novak could have lowered the UE.
    Novak will work hard to do better in 2014 for certain. Now, lots of your arguments tend to sound nonsensical or are hard to take seriously due to your bias.

    **Chill out man and give credit where is due, and enjoy the games.

    Cheers bro!:)
     
    #48
  49. bullfan

    bullfan Legend

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    I have to say, that it seems Novak doesn't ramp up in the first set, and Nadal doesn't amp up in the 2nd set. There seems to be a pattern for both. Maybe, they each are conserving energy for a long haul match. That seems to be how they play.
     
    #49
  50. Finesse4sum

    Finesse4sum Semi-Pro

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    I think Nadal got it done in 4 different ways.

    His serve was the biggest load of poop in 2011. Not the case in 2013 for his standards. Nadal held up phenomenally to Novak's attacks.

    Djokovic patterns simply did not work against Nadal. Djoker seemed to have more cards to play with between the DTL FH, CC FH, and a good amount of DTL BH in 2011. Not too much seen in 2013.

    The slices actually worked well against Djoker. Goes to show why Fed beat Djoker all those years.

    Those extreme angled shots really hurt djoker as well.


    I think Djoker is the most sound player of the other 4 based on balance of shots but Nadal has such a spider web like range of where he can put the ball and from what location on court.
     
    #50

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