Djokovic is a wise guy

Discussion in 'Pro Match Results and Discussion' started by Fiji, May 17, 2013.

  1. veroniquem

    veroniquem Bionic Poster

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2008
    Messages:
    30,970
    Location:
    New York
    I disagree. Masters and WTF are to best of 3 what slams are to best of 5. What matters is to win titles and accumulate confidence. What matters is to combine success with consistency. This year, success has worked (Djoko has won all 3 finals he's played) but consistency has gone out the window big time. And this can have far reaching implications in terms of near future confidence. If you don't see that, then you're in denial.
     
    #51
  2. cc0509

    cc0509 G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2010
    Messages:
    14,756
    No you are misunderstanding what I mean. I agree with you that Djokovic's results in Madrid and Rome may have a negative effect on him for his RG chances and for his confidence moving forward. What I am saying is, at the end of the day, all people will care about are the slam wins for the most part. That is what these players are judged primarily on, let's not kid ourselves. If Djokovic wins the FO this year, nobody will care that he lost in Madrid and Rome and if Nadal loses the FO he will be seen as a failure this year.
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2013
    #52
  3. veroniquem

    veroniquem Bionic Poster

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2008
    Messages:
    30,970
    Location:
    New York
    Ah sure. 2+ slams in a season trumps 4+ masters. Of course, if Djoko won RG, then he would become the best player of the 2013 clay season (even with Nadal's better consistency). I was only reacting to the fact that Djoko is not going into RG with optimal momentum or confidence (obviously).
     
    #53
  4. cc0509

    cc0509 G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2010
    Messages:
    14,756
    And I agree with you.
     
    #54
  5. Clarky21

    Clarky21 Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2011
    Messages:
    12,686
    You are clearly a resurrected troll, and you also don't know what you're talking about. I wasn't banned for that long, and the ban I got was for using the "T" word just like everybody else does. If anyone needs to be permanently figured out it's you.

    And I also plan to start reporting anyone who uses the "T" word in any capacity.
     
    #55
  6. cc0509

    cc0509 G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2010
    Messages:
    14,756
    You can't use the word "tr-ll" on here now? :confused:
     
    #56
  7. Clarky21

    Clarky21 Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2011
    Messages:
    12,686
    No, the other "T" word.
     
    #57
  8. cc0509

    cc0509 G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2010
    Messages:
    14,756
    I must be dumb, what other "t" word? Give me a hint. What does it rhyme with? I did not read through whole thread you may have mentioned it.
     
    #58
  9. beast of mallorca

    beast of mallorca Legend

    Joined:
    May 19, 2010
    Messages:
    7,763
    Tiramisu ? Tennis ? What is it Clarky ? ...............:twisted::lol:
     
    #59
  10. Clarky21

    Clarky21 Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2011
    Messages:
    12,686
    It rhymes with card.
     
    #60
  11. veroniquem

    veroniquem Bionic Poster

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2008
    Messages:
    30,970
    Location:
    New York
    It's tilapia. Out of respect for Fish :)
     
    #61
  12. cc0509

    cc0509 G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2010
    Messages:
    14,756
    LOL, people are getting banned for using that word now? What is going on? :shock:
     
    #62
  13. Clarky21

    Clarky21 Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2011
    Messages:
    12,686
    I don't know, and I don't want to question the mods because bans get handed out for that as well(I've been there).
     
    #63
  14. cc0509

    cc0509 G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2010
    Messages:
    14,756
    :lol::lol::lol:
     
    #64
  15. zagor

    zagor Talk Tennis Guru

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2007
    Messages:
    26,018
    Location:
    Weak era
    Wow, nice regime we got here it seems.

    I may disagree with you on many things, but for the record I believe there are far, far worse posters who I'm perplexed are allowed to roam free.
     
    #65
  16. tusharlovesrafa

    tusharlovesrafa Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    May 21, 2011
    Messages:
    2,396
    Location:
    Lucknow to kolkata
    Enough of freedom and democratic values,now it's the time for "Communism"..All these annoying troll will be in for a ride..I have even heard TTw have sifted there servers from US to Russia!!:shock:
     
    #66
  17. cc0509

    cc0509 G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2010
    Messages:
    14,756
    Definitely!
     
    #67
  18. tusharlovesrafa

    tusharlovesrafa Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    May 21, 2011
    Messages:
    2,396
    Location:
    Lucknow to kolkata
    if a person has 2 accounts here and his posting style is clearly indicating the same,he still can't be banned.As dire mentioned is of the post,"Burden Of Proof" lies with them(moderators) and just banning them one on any suspicion is not a good practice while it comes to moderating.:)
     
    #68
  19. Clarky21

    Clarky21 Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2011
    Messages:
    12,686
    Awww, thanks, Zagor. :)
     
    #69
  20. sdont

    sdont Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2009
    Messages:
    6,986
    Location:
    Paris, France
    And that makes you happy?
     
    #70
  21. tusharlovesrafa

    tusharlovesrafa Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    May 21, 2011
    Messages:
    2,396
    Location:
    Lucknow to kolkata
    why would it make me happy?? i think mods are very nice people,after they gave me a reprieve i am all praise for them..:)
     
    #71
  22. CDNguy87

    CDNguy87 Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2009
    Messages:
    1,570

    I agree with most of your points. I think most people on this forum are delusional in thinking that the top players go all-out in every single match at every single tournament because they're just so competitive and want to win everything.

    The clear fact is the tennis season is ridiculously long and, as a result, adopting the "exert 100% energy for every tournament" strategy would lead to rapid burn-out and ultimately non-peak form for the Slams and biggest M1000 events. It makes absolutely no sense to devote the same level of energy to the early rounds of a meaningless 250 event (or even a somewhat meaningful M1000) as to a Slam final. The Big 4 have been around long enough to know this and have adapted their scheduling and physical commitments accordingly.

    I think the point from your post that needs to be emphasized is that it's not necessarily tanking, but rather just not giving 100% energy for a particular match. If a top player can win a match at a lesser tournament while exerting substantially less than their full physical potential, they'll take it in most cases. However, if it's a relatively small tournament in the grand scheme of things and the only way they can have a chance is by playing at their absolute peak form, they'll probably take the loss rather than risk injury or burn-out. This is especially so if the current tournament is not long before a Slam or other bigger tournament that the player really wants. Given his age and experience, this is most relevant and often applicable for Federer, although Djoker and Murray have started doing this more often IMO in the past couple of years. As you mentioned, Rafa is an exception because of the nature of his game.

    I actually made a post exactly one year ago arguing that Fed should and probably would give far less than 100% against Djoker in the Rome Semis (which on clay against Djoker is analogous to tanking) largely based on these arguments (keeping in mind he had also just won Madrid). Most people responded in the same way they did to your post, but Fed looked completely lethargic until late in the 2nd set when it was really too late to change the outcome of the match. He may not have intentionally walked into the match with the desire to lose, but he obviously realized based on the circumstances that going full throttle in that match was not worth it when RG and, more importantly, Wimbledon were not far off.

    But many people here will still cling to the insane belief that the top players give 100% throughout all 10 months of the season.
     
    #72
  23. bilboa

    bilboa New User

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2013
    Messages:
    44
    Its all mental w him. With exception of Haas he had the other matches just went into Alice in Wonderland mode at closing time. I think he knows he can beat anybody and it has become attitude problem.

    Watch the 5:3 service game yest...playing wirh balls, complaining about turf, looking at crowd..
     
    #73
  24. West Coast Ace

    West Coast Ace G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2005
    Messages:
    13,503
    Location:
    So Cal
    +1. A good barometer of who actually plays the game and who doesn't. The latter has no comprehension of how quickly momentum can change; how quickly someone who's hitting the ball great can miss a few shots and go into a funk. There's no way Djokovic would want Berdych having any hope or belief by gifting him a win. Ditto Dimitrov.
     
    #74
  25. FreeBird

    FreeBird Legend

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2013
    Messages:
    8,453
    Location:
    Avatar in memory of TheF1Bob
    Seeing your GOAT status of enduring the highest number of bans in TW history, you should be bestowed with the title Dame. What say 'Dame Clarky' ?
     
    #75
  26. MaiDee

    MaiDee Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2009
    Messages:
    739
    Location:
    Sabai Land
    100% agree.
     
    #76
  27. bullfan

    bullfan Legend

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2011
    Messages:
    7,792
    First, Novak tanked Madrid to win Rome and FO. Now he tanked Rome to win FO.
     
    #77
  28. dunlop_fort_knox

    dunlop_fort_knox Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2012
    Messages:
    568
    I think djok wants his ankle at 100%. I think he tanked the dimitrov match. he didn't like the Madrid crowd. He was pretty much disgusted. He had just won MC. And I don't think there was any benefit of playing Nadal in the semi finals of Rome and then Fed in the final. As it stands he can say he won his last match against Nadal on clay. If he would have lost in Rome Nadal would have the mental edge going into Paris. Djok looked at the draw carefully. He could play three tough sets and make it look good since he knew he would not have another match until Paris.
     
    #78
  29. monfed

    monfed Guest

    Yea it's puzzling.
     
    #79
  30. sbengte

    sbengte Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2010
    Messages:
    8,700
    What about a similar T word that rhymes with "curd" ? Is that allowed ? No wonder I thought I saw a sudden rise in the usage of this word since the first one lead to bans.
     
    #80
  31. Clarky21

    Clarky21 Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2011
    Messages:
    12,686
    If he tanked Madrid, why didn't he just do it in the second set tiebreaker instead of pushing it to a 3rd? Why did he keep fighting out there if he never had any intentions of winning? Makes zero sense at all to me.

    He did not tank Madrid and he did not tank Rome. He was the favorite for both tournaments and had absolutely no reason to quit on them. This "tanking" excuse was played out a long time ago.
     
    #81
  32. TennisFan3

    TennisFan3 Legend

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2009
    Messages:
    5,426
    Djokovic got exactly what he wanted in Monte Carlo. I'm sure he'll raise his game in Paris.
    Nadal may be a bigger favorite in RG, by virtue of his abilities against the rest of the field. However, he is definitely NOT the favorite when he faces Djokovic.

    Djokovic's task then is NOT to get tripped before he meets Nadal in Paris. And unless Nadal reaches his clay peaks, I do think he has a better than 50% chance of taking down the king of clay.

    In short: Setbacks in Madrid, Rome notwithstanding, Djokovic will NOT lack the motivation or game in Paris.
    I do believe he has a VERY good chance of winning his maiden RG crown.
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2013
    #82
  33. Clarky21

    Clarky21 Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2011
    Messages:
    12,686
    He sure did. He got a rusty Nadal coming off of an 8 month injury break, and playing one of the worst matches he has ever played on clay, yet he still nearly took a set and pushed Cvac to a 3rd. You do realize that Nadal made 35 unforced errors and barely won 20% of his second serve points in that match right? All Cvac had to do was show up and keep the ball in play to win it with Nadal playing like that.

    Having said that, I still think Cvac is the favorite for RG and will win it. I don't think him losing in Madrid and Rome will make any difference to him at all.
     
    #83
  34. TennisFan3

    TennisFan3 Legend

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2009
    Messages:
    5,426
    Didn't Djokovic win in straight sets? And in set 1 he was close to bageling Rafa?

    But yes, Nadal was not playing well. I agree with that. But then I thought the best Rafa played since his injury was in IW. He hasn't looked good on clay, by his own standards. The more he plays, it seems his knees start acting up or something. But his footwork and shotmaking is not what it usually is on clay. Definitely not even at the 2012 level - forget about the earlier peaks.
     
    #84
  35. Clarky21

    Clarky21 Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2011
    Messages:
    12,686
    Gulbis was close to bagelling Nadal too. Ferrer also had his chance as well. He has been starting slowly against everyone, not just Cvac.

    And yes, Cvac won in straights but you're forgetting that Nadal broke for 6-5 and served for the second set. He just didn't seem ready to beat someone of the caliber of Cvac yet, and it showed. He was playing a horrible match yet still broke multiple times and Cvac still needed a tie breaker to beat him in the second set. It's not like Nadal did not have his chances because he most certainly did. If he had played just a little bit better that match could have had a very different outcome.

    Again, I still think Cvac will win RG and that Nadal will go slamless this year. I don't even think Nadal will make the final. I also don't think the losses in Madrid or Rome mean much to Cvac and that he will be just fine.
     
    #85
  36. WhiskeyEE

    WhiskeyEE Legend

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2008
    Messages:
    5,310
    he's been playing like he played against rosol ever since he came back. poor movement, just gimping shots to middle court playing percentage tennis and letting his opponents choke. He only looked decent in 1 or 2 matches at IW.

    i honestly don't see how he's still winning. he isn't half the player he was and he wasn't that good to begin with. ferrer is a better player now.
     
    #86
  37. Clarky21

    Clarky21 Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2011
    Messages:
    12,686
    You're just butthurt because I don't like your foul mouthed hero. Suck it up, buttercup.
     
    #87
  38. JackReacher

    JackReacher Guest

    Dj was a wise guy. And then came the 2013 Roland Garros :D
     
    #88
  39. JackReacher

    JackReacher Guest

    Too bad Dj doesn't know how to play Nadal at Roland Garros. We saw that last year, when it rained on both days of the final but still Dj couldn't win :lol:

    Nadal in a straight sets beatdown over Dj this year if no rain. If rain, maybe Dj will win another set....
     
    #89
  40. djokovicisananimal

    djokovicisananimal Professional

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2012
    Messages:
    1,140
    As good as Djokovic is, it's hard to see anyone else but Nadal winning the FO.
     
    #90
  41. batz

    batz G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2009
    Messages:
    14,579
    10 EDits and then some more
     
    #91
  42. Topspin_80

    Topspin_80 Rookie

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2012
    Messages:
    163
    The op is pretty ludicrous , but your post takes the cake .
     
    #92
  43. ViscaB

    ViscaB Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    May 27, 2010
    Messages:
    2,203
    Location:
    Singapore
    And if he loses in Paris he will be saving himself for Wimbledon.

    Don Corleone Djokovic, the wise guy from the East;).
     
    #93
  44. bullfan

    bullfan Legend

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2011
    Messages:
    7,792
    And if he loses in Wimbledon, he's saving himself for USO!
     
    #94
  45. Tennis_Hands

    Tennis_Hands Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2009
    Messages:
    3,803
    Location:
    Inside the service box - the business end
    Well, we will see, won't we?
     
    #95
  46. veroniquem

    veroniquem Bionic Poster

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2008
    Messages:
    30,970
    Location:
    New York
    This. Djoko may win RG one day but it doesn't look like it will be this year. No one is gonna beat a healthy confident Rafa at RG.
     
    #96
  47. TheF1Bob

    TheF1Bob Banned

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2011
    Messages:
    9,473
    Location:
    NON-Pigeon City
    Typical Nadal fan, always think they know right from wrong.

    You will be wrong as you where at Monte Carlo.

    Deal with it.

    8)
     
    #97
  48. Tennis_Hands

    Tennis_Hands Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2009
    Messages:
    3,803
    Location:
    Inside the service box - the business end
    You can bet on that.

    :lol:
     
    #98
  49. bullfan

    bullfan Legend

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2011
    Messages:
    7,792
    There's a difference between beating Rafa in 3 outta 5 than 2 outta 3 when he was still fairly rusty. I tend to think IW was a fluke win for Nadal. He did play well, but I also think the stars aligned in a good way for him there. Rafa's in beasting form on clay at the moment. He's strategically winning. Sure Gulbis and Ferrer gave him some fits, but that just made the beast more determined.
     
    #99
  50. veroniquem

    veroniquem Bionic Poster

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2008
    Messages:
    30,970
    Location:
    New York
    Djoko had already beaten Nadal in a best of 3 on clay. RG is another animal altogether. Djoko would have to play out of his mind to beat Rafa there and since AO, he has not shown that kind of level.
     

Share This Page