Djokovic

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by janipyt05, Jun 4, 2008.

  1. janipyt05

    janipyt05 Professional

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    I looked where to add this but can't find a place

    Your thoughts on this people thank you

    Gael Monfils, Novak Djokovic and the Point of Divergence

    May 31, 2008

    Gael Monfils is in the midst of his 3rd round match at this year’s French Open against Jurgen Melzer. The two are tied one set apiece with Melzer leading 3-2 in the third set.

    Who would have guessed four year ago when Monfils won the first three junior Grand Slam events, Australian, French, and Wimbledon, that today in 2008, Monfils would be ranked behind countrymen #9 Richard Gasquet, #11 Jo-Wilfred Tsonga, #19 Paul-Henri Mathieu, #29 Gilles Simon, Michel Llorda (#41), Nicolas Mahut, #50 Fabrice Santoro, #55 Julian Benneteau, #56 Marc Giquel, and #57 Sebatien Grosjean.

    Monfils is #59.

    Who could have guessed three years ago, when he played his best friend at the time, Novak Djokovic, in the first round of the U.S. Open, that Monfils would lose that match after winning the fourth set, 6-0. And who would have guessed that that match would be the point of divergence between the two players.

    Djokovic is #3.

    Both players, age 21, are charismatic off the court and young talents on it. But while Monfils was marked for stardom, especially when he reached the round of 16 at the French Open just two years ago, Djokovic was a relatively unknown as a junior and began 2006 at #78 in the world. Monfils began 2006 at #30. Monfils reached #23 in the world after that French Open but took a precipitous fall and finished the season #46. Meantime Djokovic left the French #40, but ended his 2006 season all the way up to #16.

    (Monfils lost the third set, 6-4, but is leading 2-0 early in the fourth set.)

    What was the point of divergence between the two? After the French, Monfils dealt with some nagging injuries which forced him to miss much of the summer U.S. hardcourt season. But he came into the U.S. Open healthy and ready to make a splash in America. That first round U.S. Open match against Djokovic was expected to be tough, as matches against friends, especially when the players grew up together in the junior ranks always are. But Gael was slotted to win and move on.

    But the fifth and final set between the two, which ended 7-5 for Djokovic, told a sad tale of the nature of the game today.

    Djokovic began that final set by taking a “bathroom” break which most often in tennis circles means a player is losing and is hoping to break the momentum of his or her opponent. And on his way to finally winning, Djokovic would ask for the trainer or stall and reduce the match to a drawn out crawl a grand total of a dozen times. Six times he asked for the trainer. Six times on the court Djokovic limped around the court with “cramps” or some other alleged ailment.

    Because of their friendship, Monfils was more than gracious toward his friend, allowing him to take more than the allotted time to gather himself so that Djokovic might have the opportunity to finish the match honorably in what ever fashion he chose.

    But while Monfils acted the gentlemen, even the casual observer could see that Djokovic was taking advantage of the largesse his friend afforded him. Whenever the Serbian won points, he seemed miraculously energized. When he lost a point, he acted as if he was about to enter into the dangerous physical realm of a full body cramp. After his serve was broken in the fifth, which was repeatedly, he would call for the trainer on change-overs. Dutifully the employee of the men’s tour would trot out and massage Djokovic’s legs, or shoulder, or back, or all three. After some massages the Serb would stand, take a step, stop, and slump back into his chair, apparently needing yet another round of rubbing.

    (Monfils won the fourth set, 6-0.)

    As the final set wore on, the pauses became more pronounced, the massages longer, the stalling between points more often. The New York crowd sensed Djokovic was faking and began to jeer him. The average opponent would have complained to the chair umpire after the third or fourth play stoppage, after Djokovic held his hand in the air to stop Monfils from serving just before the Frenchman was about to toss the ball into the air.

    At one point the crowd broke out into full booing after Djokovic won a drawn out point in which each player executed at least a dozen groundstrokes apiece and then, when he lost the following point, the stalling for time began anew. But Monfils implored the spectators to refrain from booing his brother in arms - and only at his behest did they stop.

    When the final point was played, Djokovic acted as if he had just won the Grand slam event instead of winning a first round match. Monfils was understandably disappointed. His promising spring had turned into a lost summer of discontent and failure.

    Yet in his post-match interview Monfils was gracious. He gave credit to his friend for making it through the match and fully took the blame for failing to maintain his concentration during the fifth set. He said he hoped Djokovic went far in the tournament and said he would be rooting for him.

    When Djokovic was interviewed in his press conference he admitted with a sheepish grin that he cheated his friend and opponent; that he stalled without being injured in any way; that he called for the trainer when he had no need for the trainer; the he felt he needed to do anything possible to break the momentum of his friend because he felt it was more important to do anything possible, including cheat, to win and advance. When asked what he would stoop to such tactics against someone who rated him the closest of friends, Djokovic went from relieved but beaming winner to thoroughly embarrassed and busted cheat. His sudden change in demeanor was accompanied by a change in speech. He became brusque, angry with the press corps for challenging him and tearing him down after he freely admitted he cheated.

    Djokovic ended the press conference as quickly as possible and scampered off the stage, looking not very injured at all.

    When Gael Monfils was informed of his opponent’s tactics in a later one-on-one interview, the young man looked crestfallen. He intimated that in no way would he ever thought his “best friend” as he called Djokovic, would cheat him, would lower himself to do anything other than play a match with honor. At one point Monfils bowed his head, fighting back tears with the sudden understanding that in the world of tennis a player might well, in reality, have no friends in tennis at all.

    That match marked the point where Novak Djokovic began his quick climb to #3 in the world. It also sped the fall of Gael Monfils to his present rank of #59. Today as Monfils plays commentators talk about that match, but no one seems to remember the manner in which Djokovic won. It is called a hard-fought match, a long match, and a match that everyone expected Monfils to win. They talk as if Monfils cannot win a five-set match and that on against Djokovic signaled his inability to gut out a victory. Monfils’ conditioning is questioned, his heart is questioned, his commitment to the game of tennis is questioned.

    The commentators also fail to mention that many other players have complained about Djokovic’s gamesmanship, his cheating through extra-long breaks when losing, his penchant for bouncing the ball up to 24 times, then failing to pause to let his opponent know he is about to serve. Roger Federer, who never complains about opponents has levies the cheating charge at Djokovic. Both he and Rafael Nadal have commented about Djokovic and complained that his parents and their friends shout at his opponents during points to break their concentration just before they hit a shot when playing their son.

    Many lesser players have done the same.

    But Gael Monfils has defeated Jurgen Melzer, 4-6, 7-5, 4-6, 6-0, 6-2. In the final two sets Monfils makes only seven unforced errors, an incredibly clean way to play the final two sets of a long clay court match.

    And despite the description of Monfils by the commentators, the young French player has a stellar 5-1 record in five set matches.

    5-1.

    Hopefully fate and fairness will have a way of catching up to Novak Djokovic.
     
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  2. Defcon

    Defcon Hall of Fame

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    I am sure the legions of Djoker fans will be along soon enough to call you a hater and the article a bunch of lies.
     
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  3. kalika

    kalika Semi-Pro

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    I'll start. This is not an article. It's a blog. There's a huge difference and I hate that it's getting harder and harder to tell the difference nowadays. The writer is way over the topic, even for a blog.
     
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  4. zagor

    zagor Talk Tennis Guru

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    I would hardly call 2 or 3 posters a "legion"(Djokovic has very few fans in this forum)but I remember this match and it is because of actions like this that I'll never be his fan(even though some people think I am).I can respect his talent but I cannot respect him as much as a person and a sportsman.There are too many incidents like this from Novak for this to be a coincidence
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2008
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  5. gj011

    gj011 Banned

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    OP is a hater and this article is a bunch of lies.
     
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  6. janipyt05

    janipyt05 Professional

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    These fans must have seen this match the only lies going on where coming from Djokovic.

    oh dear me, i can take it... I watched this match in utter shock that the umpire could not see what djokovic was doing, i mean really does it take rocket science and this goes on, bouncing the ball and then even stopping to start again if the crowd get restless, then all those retirements. Should Djokovic get to number one he will have to curb this kind of thing. Yes tennis is a competition but he shouldn't treat tennis with such disregard.

    So all who want to bash and call me names just for a second be realistic and fair do you think its ok for Djokovic to act such in this way when he clearly is so talented.

    I would really like to debate this article so any thought would be great.

    Wow you guys are quick
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2008
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  7. Defcon

    Defcon Hall of Fame

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    In what way is this blog/article inaccurate? Its quite amazing that Djokovic flat out admits to cheating.
     
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  8. Z-Man

    Z-Man Professional

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    Actually, I remember the match. Joker behaved poorly and later admitted it. I really liked him up until that point, and I wasn't sure about him for a while after that match, but the guy does have a great game and lots personality. He's good for tennis, and he deserves all of the success he's had. We all make mistakes.
     
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  9. hoodjem

    hoodjem G.O.A.T.

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    Let's title this "A Sad Tale of the Nature of the Game Today"
    Stop it, stop it. I can't take any more, you've got me in tears. Boo hoo, boo hoo, boo hoo, boo hoo, boo hoo, boo hoo, boo hoo, boo hoo, boo hoo, boo hoo, boo hoo, boo hoo, boo hoo, boo hoo.

    Now let's go out and get Djokovic and string him up, like real tennis-men should.

    P.S. Are you a journalism major?
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2008
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  10. Mansewerz

    Mansewerz Legend

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    Wow that article really saddens me. I like Djokovic, especially that talent that he's got. I've heard lots of things about the guy. A lot of my opinion of him comes from these boards because I can't watch every match of his and focus on his antics. I began to see, especially against Federer, how obnoxious his parents acted. So I thought fine, he's just got annoying parents. Now I see this. Actions like this make me hope even more for Federer and Nadal to put beatdowns on Djoker on the tennis court.

    Honestly, this is the most controversial top player in recent years. Everything about him is questioned and truthfully, I have nothing against questioning this guy. His game is questionable. Many people that love him love him because he's the **** right now. He's hot stuff and they just want to root for the guy on top. I like Federer because of his talent, his class, the whole shebang, and I for one refuse to jump on the Djokovic bandwagon. Do I respect his game and enjoy watching him play? yes. But I do not hope that he gets to the number one with this type of sportsmanship.
     
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  11. janipyt05

    janipyt05 Professional

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    Only thing is Djokovic continues to do some strange things, French Open last year he retired losing 6-4, 6-4 and famously said in the intervew after the match that "he was on control of the match", then again at Wimbledon last year he retired in the semi finals then recently did so against Federer. :confused: Please don't say his young and will grow up because they are plenty of young players around not pulling the stunts Djokovic does.
     
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  12. gj011

    gj011 Banned

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    As I said, you are a hater and you are telling a bunch of lies.

    Djokovic retired in RG in 2006 not last year. Also you forgot to mention all the rain in Wimbledon last year and that he had to play third day in a row in SF after two over 4 and 5 hour matches in 4th round and QF. This was not a normal situation and retirement was quite justified. He was barely walking after two sets.

    It is funny how these threads start suddenly popping up every time Novak makes SF or F on any big tournament, with stories more than two years old, that were already told many times here.
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2008
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  13. Mansewerz

    Mansewerz Legend

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    Do you mind explaining his recent retirement in Monte Carlo?

    :D
     
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  14. gj011

    gj011 Banned

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    Sure, why not. He was sick and had a strep throat. He was on antibiotics between MC and Rome. This is really the truth. Anyway, he should have finished the match, but he was sick and far from OK.

    My point was not to justify his every retirement, but to say that OP is malicious and is not telling the whole truth.
     
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  15. BkK_b0y14

    BkK_b0y14 Semi-Pro

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    ^^ Fanboy Alert!!!!!!!!
     
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  16. sillymonkey

    sillymonkey Hall of Fame

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    Why do you think it is so many people/fans don't get behind Djoko? He's got no soul.
    As far as the commentators or media, they always go with whatever direction the wind is blowing. No guts.
     
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  17. gj011

    gj011 Banned

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    Sure why not. Is there anybody here who is not a funboy of one player or another? I haven't met anyone like that here so far.

    Beside that, I am just telling the truth, contrary to OP.
     
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  18. justsomeecho

    justsomeecho Banned

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    OP is absolutely right. Djokovic needs to take things like a man and stop with this nonsense. People at the club level don't do this sort of thing.
     
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  19. oy vey

    oy vey Semi-Pro

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    The author is unknown but I suspect Monfils' uncle wrote it.
     
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  20. Tshooter

    Tshooter Hall of Fame

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    I'm a Djokovic fan (obvious from my other posts) but I was at that match and there is no question that Djokovic did everything but crap on the umpire to win that match. The general feeling of those in the small crowd was that he cheated his way to the win a la JMac who similarly abused the rules back in his day.

    But they were 18 I think. Djokovic has come a long way since then. Which is more then you can say about JMac who continued his abuse of the rules throughout his career.
     
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  21. 5263

    5263 G.O.A.T.

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    If there was cheating, put the blame where it belongs, with the chair. If he had no reason to act, then it wasn't cheating. Maybe some questionable sportsmanship, but we have seen poor and great sportsmanship out of these players in every event.
     
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  22. FedForGOAT

    FedForGOAT Professional

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    It really doesn't make too much of a difference who wrote it. There are certain facts in it that can be verified or disproven. Did Djokovic actually admit to cheating? I'm sure a copy of that interview is available somewhere. Can someone please find it and post it here?
     
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  23. gj011

    gj011 Banned

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    #23
  24. Tshooter

    Tshooter Hall of Fame

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    5263, I think if you were there you would agree he bent the rules out of shape.

    Anyway, here is one of my fav shots from the infamous match:

    http://www.protennisphotos.com//?directimage=content/pro tennis photos/Other_/Gone-109.jpg

    Yes, it was 2005. Court 10, round one. Djokovic went on to play Verdasco in round three on Armstrong court a a terrific 5 setter, which Djokovic lost.
     
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  25. Tshooter

    Tshooter Hall of Fame

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    Sorry I messed up the link. It's shot 11 under gallery "other". :shock:
     
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  26. FedForGOAT

    FedForGOAT Professional

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    It says "three years ago". 3 years before 2008 is clearly 2005.
     
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  27. gj011

    gj011 Banned

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    It is also talking about 2006 and this match. So it is completely messed up.
     
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  28. Defcon

    Defcon Hall of Fame

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    It doesn't matter about the year, the facts is his behavior is shameful. Its obvious he has a pattern of cheating and poor sportsmanship from the beginning. I find it hard to imagine how his fans defend such lack of character.
     
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  29. Mansewerz

    Mansewerz Legend

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    Do you got any sources saying he had strep? I've heard this before too, but didn't get a source.
     
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  30. FedForGOAT

    FedForGOAT Professional

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    Wimbledon last year was justified. The rest of his behavior was not.
     
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  31. Hidious

    Hidious Professional

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    Like someone mentioned, he was 18 at the time. He's maturing and i think he's going to become a real classy player in the future. He'll find his own way and tell his mom to shut up.
     
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  32. gj011

    gj011 Banned

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    For example:

    http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/05/08/sports/tennisatp8.php

    http://www.sportsline.com/tennis/story/10812524

     
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  33. janipyt05

    janipyt05 Professional

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    Bo Ho his throat hurt, not his leg, his back nothing that physically would hinder his movement. Nadal played and lost in Rome did you see the blister, he never used that as an execuse, Aus Open Fed had an infection, did he use that as an execuse for losing no. So Novak need to grow up. He uses lame excuse to retire and his fans use lame execues for his retirements. Come with something a little stronger to refute these claims.

    Sorry i got the years wrong my mistake, fact is he did do these things. If you watched this match you shouldn't be supporting these antics at all, that's a nasty way of winning any match. You would have plenty to say had the shoe been on the other foot.

    Rafa Nadal suffered the same fate as Djokovic playing a match over a period of 3-4 days at Wimbledon, in fact many players suffered that fate. Rafa again suffered in French Open this year, you just get on with it.

    You Novak supporters can't call this article made up because they happened, don't give me he is young and immature that doesn't give him the licence to be stupid, Novak is not the only young tennis player out there but seems to be happy to retire and make excuses for them.

    Novak is a great player but that crap has to stop, i found i posted it, we debate we move in. There is nothing wrong in debating this issuse so suck it up and convince me that Novak is not a cheat. Just because i got the dates wrong does not negate the fact that he has done these things

    It would be nice if Novak fans brought something constructive to say what Novak did was justified but instead you defend his cheating shame on you.

    http://sportsonmymind.com/2008/05/31/gael-monfils-novak-djokovic-and-the-point-of-divergence/

    There is the link for those that think i wrote this myself, i didn't and the date that article was written.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2008
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  34. babbette

    babbette Legend

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    I am speechless. I need to see that match. Wonder how his and Monfil's relationship has been since then.
    I personally don't see why anyone would be a fan of Djokovic. He started out funny but now i can't stand him. He's too arrogant, not humble at all, just nasty. It would be a huge disapointment if he was number 1 to represent our already unpopular favorite game.
    Oh well, let's see what happens. The 3 man race has been dramatic this year. Not to mention the rest of goings on in the ATP.
     
    #34
  35. Lendl and Federer Fan

    Lendl and Federer Fan Hall of Fame

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    From the match with Ferrer, Monfils clearly has the game to be at least a top 10 player if not more. Give it enough of time, life will reconverge. :)
     
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  36. crawl4

    crawl4 Rookie

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    if you say your a fanboy then why do you say you are telling the truth?.. its just another opinion
     
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  37. gj011

    gj011 Banned

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    I was not voicing opinion, I was just stating the facts, i.e. Wimbledon schedule, match years, strep throat, ...
     
    #37
  38. cueboyzn

    cueboyzn Professional

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    I agree. I-Love-Myselfovic should be his name rather. He tries to act funny but when he has to face real adversity (i.e. an opponent that does not fall over just because he is playing the so-called Great One (Djokovic), he comes up with all kind of reasons to quit. He has got no heart, no guts, no balls. Where is Mats Wilander when you need him? Instead of Wilander making stupid comments like Roger (12 GS Titles) has no balls, Maybe he should tell us where he thinks Djoker's balls are and how they shrink when he plays Roger or Rafa on their game? Fact is: Joker is a Fair Weather Tennis Player. He cant handle adversity against guys he knows can beat him. If it starts to look unpromising for him against Roger or Rafa and he feels he cannot find his way back to win, he will do what people with no balls do: Just quit.

    LOL Tiger Woods, Roger Federer, Rafael nadal, Nike (Just Do it).

    Djokovic, Adidas (Just quit)

    Hardly good brand management. LOL.

    Jokes aside, I am a Roger fan because he is such a admirable guy and gentleman, and I never had ANY time for Nadal, but when I saw what a utter gentleman Rafa is I began to like him a lot and admire him. I use to think Djokovic was a nice guy but after seeing all his unsporting antics and hearing all the stuff he talks about himself how he is so great etc etc and how his so-called greatness is affecting the tennis landscape. And his stupid parents who act like they are following their son around to Junior events (not the Pinnacle of the Sport the ATP and Grand Slams) and have got no class or manners or respect for other professionals. I would rather see Rafa at No. 1 because in my opinion he would be a better ambassador for Tennis.


    gj011.. I see you are a Djoko-lover. One of the people who look past all his unsportsmanlike conduct and see only what they want to see. Seems the reason you blow so much smoke up Djoker's behind and can't see his faults, is because you've got your entire head plus that pipe of yours so far up there already that you are stuck. :)
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2008
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  39. gj011

    gj011 Banned

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    Oh my. So much hatred. It's not healthy for you.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2008
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  40. Thor

    Thor Professional

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    If you like being Djovovic's "funboy" thats your business - dont pull other posters into it...
     
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  41. gj011

    gj011 Banned

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    No, I was called funboy for just stating the truth. If that is the case I am fine with it.

    Most people here go much further for their favorite players. It looks like it is only a problem when that player name is not Federer or Nadal.
     
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  42. Tarsier

    Tarsier Professional

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    Actually you were called a "fanboy". "Funboy" is what you admitted to being yourself. :):)
     
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  43. gj011

    gj011 Banned

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    Lol that is a bad spelling mistake. Oh well. I will never learn. I gave up long time ago on my perfect English.
     
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  44. Leublu tennis

    Leublu tennis Legend

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    You liked him until he admitted his mistake? Sounds backwards to me.
     
    #44
  45. Leublu tennis

    Leublu tennis Legend

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    You don't know where to stick this? Well, you could file it under "I hate Djokovic, I hate his parents, I hate his dog, I hate....".

    Interesting piece, somewhat typical for a high school paper. Starts on a high note and quickly falls into irrational drivel. Grow up.
     
    #45
  46. moonbat

    moonbat Semi-Pro

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    I read clips from the NY Times on the match, and I did not get the impression that Djokovic admitted that he cheated, only that he knew he couldn't get through the match physically without continuing to request treatment, which is iffy, but legal if allowed by the umpire. I also think he has come a long way since 2005, and is continuing to mature, though he still has some cringeworthy moments on the court. I must say that some of you just really hate him with a pulsating purple passion. It's as if Novak broke into your mom's house, stole your Second Life girlfriend and ate all your Captain Crunch. Lighten up a little! ;)
     
    #46
  47. moonbat

    moonbat Semi-Pro

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    A Monfils/Djokovic final would be interesting, to say the least.
     
    #47
  48. gj011

    gj011 Banned

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    #48
  49. cueboyzn

    cueboyzn Professional

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    On the original page where this article/post/blog was taken from, there is a post which is interesting:

    http://sportsonmymind.com/2008/05/31/gael-monfils-novak-djokovic-and-the-point-of-divergence/

    --
    # dwil on June 3rd, 2008 9:15 pm

    krisps-
    This has nothing to do with “villains” and everything to do with illustrating how one match can send careers in two different directions. And in the case of Djokovic and Monfils and the match that, to this point, has marked the divergence in their paths, the facts of the match are the facts of the match - period.

    Hewitt was and is correctly “demonized” in America for his incident with James Blake and the black line judge at the U.S. Open. In Australia, he is hated because he’s not the quintessential “good guy” Australian - which I find ridiculous.

    The criticisms of Roddick, from my viewpoint, deal with his limited game rather than anything else.

    So, your opinion is yours and I certainly don’t care about how you or anyone else feels about “Nole.” He did what he did to Monfils, that cannot be disputed. And what he continues to do is well-known on the tour. That players complain about his calling trainers for no reason during tight matches - like so many other players - and for bouncing the ball 18 to 20-something times and then serving without pausing first, which is a “quick-serve” and illegal can also not be disputed.

    EVERYONE-
    Tennis is a game where you are out there alone for everyone to see - in singles - and who and what you are as a person will ultimately be revealed, always. I do not appreciate players who bend the rules or break them.

    Just look at the difference in perception by players and writers alike between Djokovic versus Federer and Jankovic versus Ana Ivanovic. Two are known to do anything including bend rules or cheat their opponents to win (the win at all costs syndrome), while Federer and Ivanovic are known as the fairest players on their respective tours.

    These perceptions don’t arise out of thin air.
    --

    This is true.

    These perceptions don’t arise out of thin air.
     
    #49
  50. gj011

    gj011 Banned

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    Dwil is a hater that wrote the article. There are much better comments there to quote.
     
    #50

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