Do you fake your return position?

Discussion in 'Tennis Tips/Instruction' started by AnaMc, Jan 16, 2014.

  1. AnaMc

    AnaMc Banned

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    To fool the server.

    How often?
     
    #1
  2. arche3

    arche3 Banned

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    Ana.... you sound very young. How old are you? Are you a high school girls varsity team player? Keep in mind ttw has a lot of bad posters with suspect technique.
     
    #2
  3. SouthboundAgain

    SouthboundAgain Rookie

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    Fake the return position? As in start in one position and as the server tosses the ball move to a completely other direction? Not sure if it is worth the effort, and you may be more easily off-balance. I also doubt it bothers a competent server.

    If you want to tinker with your returning position, figure out where the server likes to serve, and force him to prove that he can hit it somewhere else with the same success. Most people have a preferred serve location.
     
    #3
  4. mightyrick

    mightyrick Hall of Fame

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    There's really no value in faking a return position. Until you split step, people generally don't know where the ball is going anyways. You could actually fake yourself into a worse receiving position.
     
    #4
  5. Dimcorner

    Dimcorner Professional

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    There was a guy who would just pace the base line while I was preparing my serve. Didn't bother me one bit since I didn't care where he stood for my serve. In fact he almost took one to the chest because I short-tossed one and hit a good flat serve and he was mid step when I hit the shot.

    You could be doing jumping jacks for all I cared, I already made up my mind where my serve is going regardless if you change position.
     
    #5
  6. gameboy

    gameboy Hall of Fame

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    Do it all the time.

    If I see that the server is better with one side over the other, say a wicked slice out wide, I may stand well out to the right before the serve to encourage the server to serve down the middle. When the server tosses the ball, I takes few steps back to the middle to center myself.

    it usually works pretty well.
     
    #6
  7. Manus Domini

    Manus Domini Hall of Fame

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    Don't do it. You may position yourself badly (and if I notice you're doing it, I'll just hit it towards where you were).
     
    #7
  8. AnaMc

    AnaMc Banned

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    Hi Arche3, nice to meet you.

    I am 17. Yes I am playing for my varsity team.

    Why do you say there are bad posters?
     
    #8
  9. Ballinbob

    Ballinbob Hall of Fame

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    I have the same return position regardless of the server. If I'm facing a lefty with a good slice out wide Ill cheat over to that serve, but that's the only exception I can think of
     
    #9
  10. dman72

    dman72 Hall of Fame

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    I only do it when I'm looking to run around a forehand and crush a serve return. I anticipate is going to go wide to my backhand. Of course, if you guess wrong you're toast, so I reserve it for times when I'm up 0-40 or 15-40...which isn't often. :(
     
    #10
  11. AnaMc

    AnaMc Banned

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    Pros actually do it all the time - fake tight, then step back, or fake far back and step in.
     
    #11
  12. arche3

    arche3 Banned

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    Glad you enjoy tennis enough to try to better your tennis. I say bad posters because you know the thread with the guy serving? If you follow some of the advice here that will be your serve. And then there are the trolls.
     
    #12
  13. tennis_hack

    tennis_hack Banned

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    Yep, I fake and double bluff as well - i.e. they think I'm faking and hit to where I'm standing, thinking I'll move back to the middle, but then I just stay there out wide and am in the perfect position.

    Then we get into multiple levels of bluff and it gets complicated.

    Do the same thing with poaching at the net.
     
    #13
  14. dominikk1985

    dominikk1985 Legend

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    I'm rarely faking but I will cheat occasionally.
     
    #14
  15. Cheetah

    Cheetah Hall of Fame

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    Hmm.. So Ana.., you're 17? And female?
    You play with a 1hbh?
    How did you hear of Oscar Wegner?
     
    #15
  16. arche3

    arche3 Banned

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    When did she say she knows about oscar?
     
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  17. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    In another thread
     
    #17
  18. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    Wonder if this is MMI
     
    #18
  19. arche3

    arche3 Banned

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    Oh.... interesting. She probably has been a lurker. And we just discussed oscar stuff recently. Nothing wrong with learning from wegner.
     
    #19
  20. Cheetah

    Cheetah Hall of Fame

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    You don't see too many 17 year old females here commenting in 1hbh threads and mentioning wegner and talking about hitting zones and faking on returns so it set off a warning bell.

    Could be legit though. Time will tell.
     
    #20
  21. arche3

    arche3 Banned

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    Probably mrknoitall.
     
    #21
  22. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    Where is LeeD these days? Haven't seen him post in a while.
     
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  23. arche3

    arche3 Banned

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    Been shamed into silence. He is lying on windsurf forums now.
     
    #23
  24. Cheetah

    Cheetah Hall of Fame

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    lol. that's harsh. Yea that last episode was tough..
     
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  25. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    Any links? Was it over the Christmas break? I seem to have missed a lot.
     
    #25
  26. Avles

    Avles Hall of Fame

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    Posting behavior means it's obviously someone who's been here before. Not sure who "she" actually is yet (have a hunch though).

    This AnaMc post smelled the fakest of all:

    "Us girls", right.
     
    #26
  27. arche3

    arche3 Banned

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    Yeah over xmas. I forget what it was over. I was home on vacation for 2 weeks so I was dissecting his lies from years ago and comparing it to his recent posts. Confronting him on it. Tons of inconsistencies. So he went away.
     
    #27
  28. arche3

    arche3 Banned

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    I see what you mean. She is probably mmi. Maybe even the vegas guy.
     
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  29. Cheetah

    Cheetah Hall of Fame

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    Yea. and the 'contrary to popular belief' statement seemed a little too idk.. assured? aggressive?

    Maybe fauxZoo?
     
    #29
  30. Cheetah

    Cheetah Hall of Fame

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    you missed a doozy
     
    #30
  31. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

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    His last post was on 1/7 and I remember that.

    So what you are saying cannot be the reason.
     
    #31
  32. Cheetah

    Cheetah Hall of Fame

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    wasn't it regarding him obtaining positive results over wta pros or something?
     
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  33. arche3

    arche3 Banned

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    Oh yeah. He claimed as a 3.5 he beat ranked wta pros in matches. Its in my signature. I forgot I put it there.
     
    #33
  34. dominikk1985

    dominikk1985 Legend

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    certainly not. if that happened it would have happened decades ago:).
     
    #34
  35. Topspin Shot

    Topspin Shot Legend

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    Almost certainly knowitall. Same posting style, inflection, etc. Creepy that he's pretending to be a girl.
     
    #35
  36. movdqa

    movdqa Legend

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    > There was a guy who would just pace the base line while
    > I was preparing my serve. Didn't bother me one bit since
    > I didn't care where he stood for my serve.

    That's what the mature server does.

    I decide where I'm going to hit the serve and the kind of serve I will hit and it doesn't depend on the other person. At some level, moving around or leaving a huge amount of space on one side could be distracting if the server can't deliver to a particular place reliably.

    When I return, I generally stand in the same place and make adjustments based on what the server can deliver. There are times when I will try to move about half-way between the baseline and service line to chip or block a serve if the server's pattern leads me to believe that I can get away with that.
     
    #36
  37. AnaMc

    AnaMc Banned

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    Our coach follows Wegner's methodology, that why I know about him.

    please educate me, who is 'knowitall' ?
     
    #37
  38. user92626

    user92626 Legend

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    I don't think so. Mrknowital had this annoying aura around him and he always posted lengthy stuff, pretty sure of himself. I do not detect it from AnaMc.
     
    #38
  39. Ballinbob

    Ballinbob Hall of Fame

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    Andddd she's banned
     
    #39
  40. user92626

    user92626 Legend

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    My bet is she's MMI.
     
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  41. arche3

    arche3 Banned

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    your good. I think your right. fast ban
     
    #41
  42. Jay_The_Nomad

    Jay_The_Nomad Professional

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    Fake poster regardless, I think this is a pretty interesting topic.

    My 5 cents is that it's worth faking as a last resort if you absolutely cannot get any read on your opponent's serve. The hope is you play a little bit of mind games and get into their head.

    I've done it occasionally and have had mixed success. Some people just ignore and continue trying to serve to their spots in which case ur back to square one. But once in a while it actually pays off.
     
    #42
  43. Jay_The_Nomad

    Jay_The_Nomad Professional

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    It's kind of like a goal keeper in football penalty kick. They have to fake to try to put the other player off. But the truth is, if the penalty taker hits it cleanly to the corner, even if the keeper guesses correctly, the ball is going in.

    With returns, the server has the advantage, but the advantage is not as great as that which the penalty taker has over the goalkeeper. So you should not need to fake as much.
     
    #43
  44. Cheetah

    Cheetah Hall of Fame

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    wow. that was a fast one. haha.
     
    #44
  45. andreh

    andreh Professional

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    They're not "faking". They are just moving around to be on their toes for the return. One of the most common amateur mistakes is to stand with your feet planted on the return.
     
    #45
  46. corbind

    corbind Professional

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    You guys are super in knowing who is a banned poster trying to pose as a legit new poster. Yet I'm glad you guys call it out so the mods may look at it.
     
    #46
  47. PhrygianDominant

    PhrygianDominant Hall of Fame

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    this is a pretty funny thread.

    I once tried it on Maximagq. Didn't help. LOL
     
    #47
  48. GoudX

    GoudX Professional

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    If an opponent is hitting lots of wide seconds serves to the backhand from the ad side, I will sometimes move wide as the opponent starts their toss so that I can hit an I/O forehand.

    Often this allows me to dictate off of their serve, and is worth the risk of opening up the T serve - as long as they don't predict the move or have an aggresive second serve.

    Recently, I was playing against my brother and he was hitting second serves consistently to my backhand. 6:1 3:3 0-30 up I decided to take a risk and moved at the last second into the tram lines to hit a heavy topspin I/O forehand. Naturally he didn't realise, but he had hit a really good second serve up the T as a variation. The only way I could get the ball back was by basically leaping sideways at the ball and blocking a forehand slice! Ironically I won the point because he wasn't expecting a floating sliced forehand and gave me a sitter off of his response :D.

    Unexpectedly moving your return position forward is also a great way of getting the opponent to attempt a less powerful wider serve, which you can step into to get an easier to return serve.
     
    #48
  49. LuckyR

    LuckyR Legend

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    Against the majority of servers, if you are not faking you are not taking full advantage as a returner. That is, the majority of players do not notice patterns of play. They can be influenced to go to a side if they detect that you have lined up off center. So line up towards your FH and you can almost guarantee they will be going to your BH, so set up for it and rip it.

    Secondly, if they have grooved a serve, such as hitting wide on the second serve to the ad side, by lining way over on the second serve you can add a level of mental exercise to their serve "do I go even farther wide? What if he goes inside out on my second serve? should I go up the middle (which I almost never do)?"

    Many doubles players will line up very close to the service line on second serves on break points. Sounds pretty pathetic on paper, but does, in reality increase the number of DFs.
     
    #49
  50. jussumman

    jussumman Semi-Pro

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    I notice more and more trend to hit everything to the opponents backhand (including serve). On pro level, watching Nadal recently every match seems like he just serves to the backhand 100% of the time. On rec level, I guess all depends on the quality of the server. But if he's going in the same spot everytime as well, bluffing your stance then moving over might throw them off or think again. This is something I'd like to try upcoming season if opportunity presents itself. Tennis is more and more intriguing the longer I play.
     
    #50

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