Federer 2006/2007 vs Nadal 2013

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by SuperHead, Sep 24, 2013.

?

Who would win?

  1. Federer 2006/2007

    54.7%
  2. Nadal 2013

    45.3%
  1. bullfan

    bullfan Legend

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    nadal has never has a losing h2h with Fed. It was even at 1-1, after Nadal beat Fed first. Fed never closed the gap.
     
    #51
  2. TMF

    TMF Talk Tennis Guru

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    Bring Nadal back to 2006 how do you know for sure if he can make the final when the hard courts were faster? You don't know.
     
    #52
  3. abmk

    abmk G.O.A.T.

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    Yes, his 5th set vs djokovic at this year's RG was certainly one of the best he's played, ( I'd take 2008 RG in general over that ) , but I was talking about a whole match. So what I said stands.

    Like I've said before nadal's win at RG this year vs djokovic was clearly more impressive to me than his win vs him at the USO because djokovic played better there and his fight was light years better in that match. Nadal raised his level considerably with djokovic still playing well.

    Inspite of the fact that djokovic is in general, quite clearly better on HC than he is on clay and vice versa for nadal .
     
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2013
    #53
  4. abmk

    abmk G.O.A.T.

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    Actually federer reduced the deficit from 1-6 at RG 2006 to 6-8 at the end of 2007.
     
    #54
  5. The_Order

    The_Order Legend

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    Nadal was losing to everybody in top 10 apart from Tsonga in late 09-early 2010.

    Fed never had this sort of patch until this year.

    Nadal wasn't playing his best against Fed. Nadal always finds a way against him though. Once he worked Fed out, He didn't even face a BP iirc. You never learn your lesson from that do you? Fed has learned, that's why he tanked against Robredo to avoid being Rafa slammed :lol:

    Also, that was one of Fed's best matches all year.
     
    #55
  6. abmk

    abmk G.O.A.T.

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    except he'd probably have lost in YEC 2009 to davydenko anyways ( davydenko won that tourney ) and he was close to his best level in doha 10 and still lost ...

    federer's level this year has been considerably worse, he's been losing to many non top 10 players as well ....


    so nadal was at his best vs isner in the final, when he had a grand total of wait for it , zero break points in 2 sets ? :oops:

    vs dimitrov ?

    federer's returning was well below par as well in the match.

    There's no time at cincy that rafa has played better at. There are plenty of times when federer has played considerably better at cincy. Prime to prime , rafa would at max win 2 matches out of 10 at cincy.

    yes, it was, but still much below his level at his prime.
     
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2013
    #56
  7. The_Order

    The_Order Legend

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    Nadal wasn't at his best at Cincy this year. Just that he was playing with that winning feeling since he hadn't lost on HC all year. He did what he had to do and when pushed, he responded.

    Sure he hasn't played better at Cincy before, but you are using 1 tournament to justify Federer of 06/07 getting the upperhand over Nadal 13 on outdoor HC overall which is stupid.

    Here's who would win the majority of let's say best of 10 matches at each event:

    IW: Nadal
    Miami: Nadal
    AO: Nadal
    MC: Nadal
    Madrid: Nadal
    Rome: Nadal
    RG: Nadal
    WIM: Federer
    Canada: Nadal
    Cincy: Federer
    USO: Nadal
    Shanghai: Federer
    Paris: Federer
    WTF: Federer

    There's more events there where Nadal would come out on top more often than not, so the sensible conclusion is Nadal 2013 would beat Fed 06/07 more often than not.
     
    #57
  8. abmk

    abmk G.O.A.T.

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    and here's what I think :

    AO: Federer
    IW : Federer
    Miami : Nadal
    MC : Nadal*
    Rome : Nadal*
    Madrid : Nadal*
    RG : Nadal*
    Wimbledon : Federer
    Canada : tie
    Cincy : Federer*
    USO : Federer*
    Shanghai : Federer
    Paris : Federer*
    YEC : Federer*


    * for events where I think it would be 7-3 or even more lopsided in favor of the named - peak to peak ....

    I pointed out cincy 13 because you pointed out dubai 06.

    My conclusion was based on seeing them both player over the years on HC, not just that one match.
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2013
    #58
  9. Backspin1183

    Backspin1183 Legend

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    We are yet to see the indoor HC form of 2013 Nadal, so the verdict on this surface needs to wait a little more.

    Fed of 2006/7 wins on grass vs Nadal of 2013 but loses on clay and outdoor HCs.

    Nadal wins - AO, FO and USO

    Fed wins - Wimbledon

    WTF? - we'll see, Fed's the favorite though.
     
    #59
  10. The_Order

    The_Order Legend

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    That's cool, you're entitled to your opinion, I based mine on more than the Dubai and Cinci matches as well though.

    Interesting how you have Fed on top in every HC event apart from Miami (where Nadal has never won). Whereas at the AO, Nadal has defeated Federer twice and never lost to him before.

    Fed nearly lost two sets to Novak in USO07 final and you think he'd beat 2013 Nadal? Can you explain how you would come to such a conclusion? I would've thought Nadal's form at US13 (being broken only 4 times in the whole tournament + the amount of FH winners he was hitting) would be a lot tougher for Fed to handle than Novak 07. Also, Nadal would not mentally collapse when he has SP like the way Novak did.
     
    #60
  11. Backspin1183

    Backspin1183 Legend

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    Australian Open - Nadal def Federer 6-4, 5-7, 7-5, 4-6, 6-1

    Indian Wells - Nadal def Federer 6-4, 5-7, 7-6 (2)

    Miami - Federer def Nadal 7-6 (5), 1-6, 7-6 (3)

    Monte Carlo - Nadal def Federer 6-1, 6-3

    Madrid - Federer def Nadal 6-4, 4-6, 7-5

    Rome - Nadal def Federer 7-6 (4), 6-1

    French Open - Nadal def Federer 6-4, 7-6 (4), 4-6, 6-2

    Wimbledon - Federer def Nadal 7-6 (11), 7-5, 2-6, 6-4

    Toronto/Montreal - Nadal def Federer 7-5, 4-6, 7-6 (4)

    Cincinnati - Federer def Nadal 6-2, 5-7, 6-4

    US Open - Nadal def Federer 4-6, 7-6 (2), 7-5, 2-6, 6-2
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2013
    #61
  12. abmk

    abmk G.O.A.T.

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    Because miami somehow seems to bring out the worst of federer as far as HC goes and nadal has played well enough multiple times to win it atleast once. ( even if he hasn't actually won it ) .

    AO - like I've said before, without a proper serve vs nadal at his best, federer was the better player for first 4 sets combined in AO 09. With decent enough serving, he'd have enough to win it more times than not.


    Because game-wise on HC, novak of USO 07 was not lesser than nadal of this year, actually I'd say he was actually a bit better. The main difference is the mental strength part , which of course is significant. But federer was also pretty clutch for most part in 2007 , especially in the slams.

    Djokovic only blew set 1 , but not set 2.

    Not losing a set vs 3 very good in-form HCers in roddick, davydenko and djokovic is evidence enough that federer was pretty good in that event.
     
    #62
  13. mike danny

    mike danny Hall of Fame

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    well he skipped the AO where he almost certainly have lost and miami. federer rarely skipped big tournaments in his prime.
     
    #63
  14. ripitup

    ripitup Banned

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    Almost certainly would have lost, lol! Nadal playing anything like he has the rest of this year would not have lost the Australian Open had he been healthy enough yet to play it. Djokovic played much poorer tennis to win there (and got incredibly lucky Wawrinka was screwed with a bad line call, and an injured Murray flaked out the last 2.5 sets of the final) than he did at the U.S Open where he lost to Nadal.
     
    #64
  15. Chico

    Chico Banned

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    So according to this Djokovic should have won FO 2013 since Nadal was incredibly lucky and Djokovic was screwed in the SF by several bad line calls by Pascal Maria.
     
    #65
  16. The_Order

    The_Order Legend

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    Fed didn't serve great in AO06 or AO07 final...

    Even when Fed serves well, Nadal usually beats him.

    LOL Novak 07 better than Nadal this year. Tell me how long was Novak's HC winning streak in 07?

    Did he get beat before the 07USO? How many times did he lose his serve? LOL.

    Nadal only lost one set vs Novak, Fed 07 would've lost a set, probably even 2 against Novak 13.

    Your reason of Fed beating Roddick, Davydenko and Novak is completely irrelevant. Fed always struggles with Nadal and when Nadal is in form like he was in US13, Fed has very little chance no matter how well he's playing.
     
    #66
  17. mike danny

    mike danny Hall of Fame

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    than how do you explain the MC loss then? nadal lost to novak on his favorite turf after he played 3 tournaments and 2 on clay. what makes you think he would not have lost to djokovic in his first tournament since his return?
     
    #67
  18. ripitup

    ripitup Banned

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    Check out the match stats at the French Open site. More winners, less unfroced errors, and many more points won by Nadal. The only one who was lucky was Djokovic to even be in a 5th set due to several huge chokes by Nadal who badly outplayed Djokovic that day.

    My only point on the Australian Open is Djokovic was in no way amazing there and it is foolish to discredit Nadal's unbeaten year on hard courts thus far by claiming he would have "almost certainly" lost in Australia, which is BS. I am not saying Nadal should be handed the Australian Open title or anything, he didnt play so of course he didnt deserve to win, but his unbeaten year on hard courts which includes 3 Masters and a Slam title thus far is fully legitimate.
     
    #68
  19. ripitup

    ripitup Banned

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    Nadal actually played much better on hard courts than clay this year. Along with 2011 it was his worst clay court tennis ever. Since he is the best clay courter in history by far he still won most events, with far from his best. Just look at his loss to some mug you will never hear of again. How do you explain how Novak played Nadal tougher on clay than hard courts this year. Since Nadal was in fact playing much better on hard courts this year than clay. This year was some of his best ever hard court tennis, and by far some of his worst ever clay tennis.

    I am sure next year you will see the real Nadal on clay again though (and hopefully on grass too but less sure on that).
     
    #69
  20. Clarky21

    Clarky21 Banned

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    Nadal had not played since IW when MC started. He had also only practiced for less than a week as before MC started because he had treatment done on his knees.. He was rusty, and was struggling with everybody in MC this year. Him losing to Cvac there was not that big of a surprise considering the circumstances.
     
    #70
  21. ForLoveOfTheGame

    ForLoveOfTheGame Semi-Pro

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    Probably Rafa, he's got his number, after all.
     
    #71
  22. crazyups

    crazyups Semi-Pro

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    The comparison should have been with 2010 Nadal. That was his peak(serving in the 130's at US Open).
     
    #72
  23. Graf=GOAT

    Graf=GOAT Professional

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    Nadal's serve and FH are significantly better right now than in 2009. FH is flatter and more deep. Serve is faster and more varied.

    2008/09 Nadal destroys current Nadal in terms of speed/athleticism/backhand though.
     
    #73

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