Federer: The Darkhorse For The French

Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by BigT, Apr 17, 2008.

  1. BigT

    BigT Professional

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Messages:
    1,220
    You Saw It Here First...now That He's Got A Good Coach In His Corner, Just Wait And See. Everyone Is Looking Past Him...he'll Be There When It's All Done.....
     
    #1
  2. 0range

    0range Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2007
    Messages:
    1,706
    Not exactly a "dark horse" as he made it to the final twice in the last two years. People should expect him to do well.
     
    #2
  3. vndesu

    vndesu Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2007
    Messages:
    1,706
    a dark horse is when someone unseeded comes and beat all the seeded players.
    ...
    this thread made me laugh.
     
    #3
  4. rafan

    rafan Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2006
    Messages:
    4,212
    He HAD a good coach before -and before that - and before that- and before that.............
     
    #4
  5. Vision84

    Vision84 Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2007
    Messages:
    1,655
    Location:
    Cambridge, UK
    There are good reasons no one else has described him as a darkhorse. He reached the last 2 RG finals and is world number one.
     
    #5
  6. OrangeOne

    OrangeOne Legend

    Joined:
    May 31, 2006
    Messages:
    6,297
    Comical. People simply fail to understand that players lose sometimes, although admittedly Federer is to be blamed for part of this confusion given he won so often for so long....
     
    #6
  7. Defcon

    Defcon Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2004
    Messages:
    3,708
    I hereby nominate BigT the president of all gambling! I will then get 1000:1 odds on TMF making the finals/winning and shall win......... one meeeeellliiioooon dollars !!!

    My plan is foolprof and I shall succeed :D
     
    #7
  8. BigT

    BigT Professional

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Messages:
    1,220
    darkhorse meaning that not too many folks out there think he will win the French, especially given his results so far this year....
     
    #8
  9. vndesu

    vndesu Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2007
    Messages:
    1,706
    so that means i can consider djoko, roddick davey for a darkhorse?

    to be honest i dont think nadal will make finals...
     
    #9
  10. Feña14

    Feña14 Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2004
    Messages:
    5,377
    Location:
    England
    Gulbis is my dark horse.

    All great players have a break through tournament, who's to say Gulbis won't do what Guga did in 1997!
     
    #10
  11. Alexandros

    Alexandros Professional

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2006
    Messages:
    1,400
    The number 1 player in the world who has reached the past two French Open finals can not be considered a dark horse.
     
    #11
  12. flyer

    flyer Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2007
    Messages:
    2,065
    your a new user so i'll give you a pass, but i've seen it a million times already which means hes no dark horse
     
    #12
  13. Buuurnz

    Buuurnz Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2006
    Messages:
    310
    Location:
    Hamburg / Germany
    roddick on this one can definitely be considered a s a darkhorse on clay in the French!
     
    #13
  14. Otherside

    Otherside Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2008
    Messages:
    697
    what now? 90% of the Fed threads since AO has said that he's finished so at this board he's definitely a darkhorse!
     
    #14
  15. IvanYentl

    IvanYentl Rookie

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2004
    Messages:
    393
    One word: pringles
     
    #15
  16. jorel

    jorel Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2004
    Messages:
    2,488
    i agree that he is a darkhorse

    a darkhorse not to win the Dang thing
     
    #16
  17. flyer

    flyer Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2007
    Messages:
    2,065
    who ever says hes a darkhorse is delusional, your not a dark horse when your the number one seed
     
    #17
  18. Babb

    Babb Professional

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2007
    Messages:
    1,447
    Location:
    Now down to 4 feet behind the baseline.
    Nadal will still win.




    :)
     
    #18
  19. anointedone

    anointedone Banned

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2006
    Messages:
    4,655
    Location:
    Ottawa, Ontario
    I agree. He could be a darkhorse for the French. He certainly is not one of the frontrunners but if he gets his game back on track he could be one of the outsiders.
     
    #19
  20. illkhiboy

    illkhiboy Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2006
    Messages:
    1,968
    Location:
    Karachi
    People act like Federer is not in contention for the French at all. Same thing they were saying last year when Nadal won a lopsided final in Monte Carlo and Volandri beat him in Rome. Yet he was back on track soon, and got to the Final of the French again where a few points could have turned the match around, or atleast made it closer.

    This guy hasn't lost before the Semis of a Slam since, French Open '04. So I still consider him the number two player on clay, come the French. Would be funny (but not shocking) if a Davydenko/Nalbandian beat Nadal and Federer cruised to the title. Think Kafelnikov in '96.
     
    #20
  21. The balls in your court.

    The balls in your court. Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2008
    Messages:
    798
    actually I believ he has had 10 good chances. He has been trying for a decade and has only even made it to I think 2 or 3 finals.
     
    #21
  22. Turning Pro

    Turning Pro Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2005
    Messages:
    1,430
    OK, he may not be a dark horse but i don't think he is even in the Top 3 in contention this year based on current form. Djokovic is second favourite at this point. People like Ferrer, Davydenko and Nalbandian and many other clay court specialists will take Federer on his current form. I don't think Fed will have a great clay court season this year to be honest, let alone make the RG final.

    I do, however think he'll be back to somewhere near his best in the grass season and after.
     
    #22
  23. anointedone

    anointedone Banned

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2006
    Messages:
    4,655
    Location:
    Ottawa, Ontario
    Djokovic second favorite on clay. When hell freezes over. What is his big achievement on clay, making the semis last year with the most farcial draw to the semis in history almost (not even a top 50 opponent). What is his biggest ever head to head win on clay as well. Even in current form Federer is over him on clay easily. My order would be something like:

    1. Nadal
    2. Davydenko
    3. Federer
    4. Ferrer
    5. who cares, neither Nalbandian or Djokovic probably though

    Nalbandian a clay court specialist? Ok he can play on clay but calling him a specialist makes me laugh. His best surface is indoors, clay is probably his worst even though he can play well on it.
     
    #23
  24. Leelord337

    Leelord337 Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2006
    Messages:
    3,911
    Location:
    univ houston courts
    The definition of "dark horse":
    someone in a race that is considered very unlikely to win (especially a political race); political candidate who is nominated unexpectedly; racehorse in respect of which little is known
     
    #24
  25. Lendl and Federer Fan

    Lendl and Federer Fan Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2008
    Messages:
    2,326
    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Finalist few years in a row, and people still consider him a darkhorse???
     
    #25
  26. BigT

    BigT Professional

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Messages:
    1,220
    that's exactly my point...
     
    #26
  27. el sergento

    el sergento Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2008
    Messages:
    2,198
    Location:
    Montreal
    Agree 100%. Fed's been the 2'nd best player on clay for a good 3 years now. Djoker's good, but I still think, despite his results, that he's too physically weak to take the French. All it would take is one tough hot mid afternoon 5 setter against a tenacious European or South American to emtpy his tank. Plus he relies on his serve much more than people think.

    Nalbandian is by no means a clay court specialist and fares terribly under tough conditions and can't serve in the wind. His best surface is a quick indoor court and lets not forget his Wimbledon final.
     
    #27
  28. Nadal_Freak

    Nadal_Freak Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2006
    Messages:
    10,625
    Location:
    Harker Heights, Texas
    Federer will NOT win the French Open this year. If anyone else wins it, it might be Djokovic due to his 2 hand backhand and great all-around game.
     
    #28
  29. el sergento

    el sergento Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2008
    Messages:
    2,198
    Location:
    Montreal
    What does a 2HBH have to do with anything??? Then I suppose Santoro is a contender?? Djoker's biggest strengths are his serve his movement and his ground game (off both wings). If he didn't win the AUSO by playing all court tennis he's certainly not going to win the French that way.

    I still think that all it would take is a tough 4-5 setter in the first couple of rounds to deplete him. Unless the courts are playing super fast and he can beat everyone in straight sets I think Djoker's not physically strong enough yet for RG.
     
    #29
  30. Pushmaster

    Pushmaster Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2004
    Messages:
    1,768
    Location:
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Federer is about as far from a darkhorse as you can possibly get other than Nadal. Moya would be my darkhorse even though he won it in 98.
     
    #30
  31. el sergento

    el sergento Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2008
    Messages:
    2,198
    Location:
    Montreal
    That would be awesome. Moya wins the French and retires. Yeah.......I don't think so.
     
    #31
  32. Nadal_Freak

    Nadal_Freak Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2006
    Messages:
    10,625
    Location:
    Harker Heights, Texas
    Federer can't handle all the high topspin to his backhand. A 2 hand backhand is much more equipped to handle that. Djokovic's improving rate is much higher as proved by him beating Federer at the Aussie Open. Nadal's biggest threat on red clay this year is Djokovic.
     
    #32
  33. Pushmaster

    Pushmaster Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2004
    Messages:
    1,768
    Location:
    Pittsburgh, PA
    ^^^ el, that would be awesome. Highly unlikely of course, but not impossible.
     
    #33
  34. illkhiboy

    illkhiboy Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2006
    Messages:
    1,968
    Location:
    Karachi
    It was Federer's forehand that let him down last time, not his backhand. And, what are you smoking? Federer has won a set each everytime he's played Nadal at RG. That's a lot better than going 0-5 in sets as has Djokovic. So your post is, as usual, fairly retarded. But that's what's expected of you. Now go be as unpredictable and childish as you always are, and call me a '*******.'
     
    #34
  35. el sergento

    el sergento Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2008
    Messages:
    2,198
    Location:
    Montreal
    I love it how everything is based on playing Nadal. Both Fed and Djokovic can loose to a number of players before even getting the chance to play Rafa. Novak couldn't defend his Miami title and going down in the first round speaks volumes to his conditioning.

    Let's let a couple of clay tournaments go bye before seeing who comes in the hottest of the two.
     
    #35
  36. illkhiboy

    illkhiboy Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2006
    Messages:
    1,968
    Location:
    Karachi
    Your post is slightly misleading. True, Djokovic didn't play a top-50 player at Roland Garros, but he did beat Andreev (ranked 125 cause of injury) and Verdasco (why was he so low I wonder). He also beat Gasquet earlier in the season. So he's definitely in the mix with everyone but Nadal on clay. I wouldn't be completely surprised if he manages to beat Federer either.
     
    #36
  37. illkhiboy

    illkhiboy Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2006
    Messages:
    1,968
    Location:
    Karachi
    Novak fitter than Nadal?

    I don't know why people keep bringing Djokovic's conditioning up. His retirement at Wimbledon's been brought up before but that was an insane schedule. He played Hewitt, Kiefer and Baghdatis on consecutive days if I 'm not mistaken, and spent atleast 11 hours on court if not more. C'mon without a day in between, that's crazy. Even Nadal was out of steam in Chennai after playing for nearly four hours the day before? Does that mean Novak is fitter than Nadal? I don't think so...but it's not a bad question IMO.
     
    #37
  38. lambielspins

    lambielspins Banned

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2006
    Messages:
    2,715
    Gasquet isnt even a top 10 clay courter, in fact the only reason he has a top 10 ranking for now is his fluke run at Wimbledon last year. Once Wimbledon is done this year he will be back out of the top 10 where he belongs. Djokovic has no really big wins on clay up to now, period. He has really proven nothing other then he can get to the semis with a dream draw that atleast 20 players could have made it there with.
     
    #38
  39. dh003i

    dh003i Legend

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2006
    Messages:
    5,114
    Federer is the 2nd choice to win the FO. Nadal of course having won it for 3 years is the favorite, but his knees are more and more a problem.

    Yea, Federer has been in a slump. So what? Many players have.

    The idea that he's somehow going to drop like a rock -- the most talented tennis player ever -- but that a mediocre player like Roddick is going to stay where he is, is nuts. So of course you get stupid threads with morons saying Federer is in "decline" and will never win anything again.
     
    #39
  40. fastdunn

    fastdunn Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2004
    Messages:
    6,294
    1. Nadal
    2. Federer
    3. Djokovic
    4. Ferrer
    5. Davydenko
     
    #40
  41. Andres

    Andres G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2005
    Messages:
    12,541
    Location:
    Mar del Plata, Argentina
    Why is everyone so eager to place Ferrer as a darkhorse for the French?

    Ferrer, with López, is the least claycourter of the spanish armada. He's more of a hardcourt player to my eyes.

    He looks to be a perennial R32 guy at the French. The only time he went past R32 was 2005, where he got to QF and lost to Nadal 5-7, 2-6, 0-6

    Robredo is a far better claycourter than Ferrer.
     
    #41
  42. lambielspins

    lambielspins Banned

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2006
    Messages:
    2,715
    Wishful thinking at best.
     
    #42
  43. lambielspins

    lambielspins Banned

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2006
    Messages:
    2,715
    I would never pick Robredo over Ferrer on any surface right now. Ferrer would have to have a majorly off day to lose to Robredo anywhere right now. Robredo has nothing to hurt him with really.
     
    #43
  44. Richie Rich

    Richie Rich Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2004
    Messages:
    5,274
    there are probably 10 guys with a good chance to win. rebredo isn't one of them. if he gets to the semis it will be a miracle
     
    #44
  45. fastdunn

    fastdunn Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2004
    Messages:
    6,294
    Actually, let me drop Davydenko and group everybody in top 50 into #5 spot up there.
     
    #45
  46. KFactor27

    KFactor27 New User

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2007
    Messages:
    92
    Location:
    Las Vegas
    Federer is definitely not a darkhorse by any means. I think he'll finally win it this year.
     
    #46
  47. Nadal_Freak

    Nadal_Freak Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2006
    Messages:
    10,625
    Location:
    Harker Heights, Texas
    You are expecting to see the same Federer as of the last 3 years? Those are his prime years. Clay is a young players surface. Nadal and Djokovic have a much bigger upside and game style more suited to clay. Djokovic losing a lot in the indoor season didn't stop him from straight setting Federer at the Aussie Open. Yes you are a ******* as you know you are. I would even say Federer was the closest to winning the French Open in 2005. Last year was Nadal's easiest matches against Federer in Monte Carlo and Roland Garros. Hamburg didn't count since Nadal was exhausted. Federer always has trouble generating pace on his backhand up high. He was taking a conservative root with it and Nadal made him pay the price that way as well. Fed still can't change the direction of the ball or take the ball early like some 2 handers can. Davydenko most notably. Djokovic is learning to do it as well.
    Like mentioned already, Novak bounced back just fine after his rough indoor season to take the Aussie Open and Indian Wells. Yeah it is probably not to his best interest to play a lot of tournaments before the French Open.
     
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2008
    #47
  48. illkhiboy

    illkhiboy Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2006
    Messages:
    1,968
    Location:
    Karachi
    Well, I 'd say Gasquet is a top-20 on clay at the moment and top 10 when he's on - okay I know that's not often. However, I think since he played the final at Estoril, he must have been playing well.
    Btw, I don't consider Wimbledon a fluke. Yeah Gasquet hasn't really impressed me and I don't really consider him a top 10 player at the moment but I won't be too harsh on him. He's still pretty young and he might turn out to be a bit of a late bloomer like Davydenko. Or more like, that's when he will be more consistent.
    Remember the 2005 clay season? Gasquet was destroying players back then! He even got a win over Federer, and was pretty close to beating Nadal the following day. Give him credit, he can play on the surface. Too bad he's got mental issues at the moment.

    20 players? Hmm I don't know. Andreev is no joke on clay. Djokovic has beaten him twice on the surface. I remember the first time I saw Djokovic was back at the 2005 French Open. He was playing Coria and I immeaditely saw potential in him. He played pretty damn good for 2 sets (1-1, back when Coria was top 3 on clay) but had to retire cause of breathing problems. I think Coria was a bit lucky to get off so easy. And no, I 'm not speaking from hindsight. Djokovic was just that good.
    He also took a set off Federer in Monte Carlo a couple years back. I don't know if that means much considering that it was Federer's first match of the season but I think it means that the Serb is not bad on the surface at all.

    I just checked his 2006 record, and in reaching the quarter-final he beat Gonzalez, Monfils, Haas and Horna (retirement in set 2).

    So he doesn't quite have the big wins on clay, but then he's only lost to the best players on the surface (Nadal, Ferrer, Moya - 7-5 in the third).

    Tell me something, who do you think Djokovic can't beat on clay? Or who would you bet money on to beat him this season?
     
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2008
    #48
  49. illkhiboy

    illkhiboy Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2006
    Messages:
    1,968
    Location:
    Karachi
    So suddenly Federer is old now? And what do you mean Djokovic's game suits clay more? How is it better than Federer's? Federer has a better kick serve. He has a better forehand, more variety on the top spin backhand though not as steady, he hits better angles, moves better on the surface especially at the net where the slippery surface can be tricky and hits a very effective slice.
    Btw I wasn't even talking about who will be a bigger challenge to Nadal in the upcoming years. Federer's certainly in a bit of a decline and he may not continue his excellent form this year. I was disputing your assertion that Djokovic's two-handed backhand and all-court game automatically makes him a better contender for Roland Garros. Ofcourse, that's an unbelievably stupid statement. Federer is more of an all-courter than Djokovic as I explained above. And not every one-hander has problems with Nadal's high topspins. Kohlschrieber, Gasquet, Gaudio to name a couple.
    *******? Sure, like that means anything coming from a 25-year old who's emotional health depends on the results of a young Spaniard man he has wet dreams about.
     
    #49
  50. BigT

    BigT Professional

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Messages:
    1,220
    not too many guys thinking Ferrer is a threat anymore.....
     
    #50

Share This Page