Forehand question

Discussion in 'Tennis Tips/Instruction' started by TennisBoy, Feb 8, 2005.

  1. TennisBoy

    TennisBoy Rookie

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    I have a question in regards to the forehand motion. I was wondering how the elbow is like during the entire process. Is it more in a "tucked" position and as you swing, it extrends through?? Or does it more begin at a stretched (slightly crooked) position and through? I was wondering how to apply the best leverage and most efficient in hitting a forehand.

    thanks
     
  2. Marius_Hancu

    Marius_Hancu G.O.A.T.

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    it really depends on your grip.
    but check the pro videos at
    http://www.tenniscruz.com/photo.htm
    esp in step-by-step mode and you'll have an answer.

    this is also quite well discussed at easitennis.com, but you need to be a member.
     
  3. Marius_Hancu

    Marius_Hancu G.O.A.T.

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  4. paulfreda

    paulfreda Hall of Fame

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    Bent elbow

    I think that it depends on the grip and stance you are using.
    One can it effective shots either with the elbow tucked well inside near the body or extended almost like you are pulling a rope.
    I think you will discover a great deal of controlled power if you practice with the elbow tucked in though as it forces you to use the forward motion of your arm and body more than a swinging door/pulling rope type swing. It is almost like punching someone in the face with your fist exploding from you shoulder straight ahead.
    At first it may feel weak and awkward, but once you get it you will have a wonderful technique for generating controlled power.
    You can also set up very quickly as all you need do is draw your elbow back; so it is good against pace. The disadvantage is that you need the ball coming right at you because the elbow and arm are close to your body, so you need fast feet to get you to those balls not hit near you.

    Much of what I have said applies to the SW and Full Western grips, not Eastern like Sampras' swing where his bent elbow allows him to have a little higher strike zone.
     
  5. Thomas Bird-Itch

    Thomas Bird-Itch Semi-Pro

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    Back from the dead. ;)

    Anyone have some better links about this? I keep messing with my grip, but I think my elbow is flying and causing inconsistency.
     
  6. JCo872

    JCo872 Professional

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    Once the elbow locks into its angle, it must stay at the angle through contact! Some players have big bends in the elbow (Djokovic, Ginepri, Grosjean) some have almost straight arms (Safin, Federer, Nadal, Verdasco). But whatever your style, that elbow angle must remain the same before, into, and through contact.

    By keeping the elbow constant coming into and through the ball, you transfer the power of your core and of your entire arm, through the ball. One of the biggest problems I see among players is the "swinging" at the elbow joint. It disconnects your body's core mass from driving through the ball.

    [​IMG]
     
  7. Thomas Bird-Itch

    Thomas Bird-Itch Semi-Pro

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    Thanks Jeffrey. I understand what you're saying about the angle staying the same. I guess more the problem I have is keeping the racquet at a consistent angle.

    What I mean is my elbow stays at the same angle, but where it points is not the same every stroke. Sometimes the racquet face may begin too open or closed because I lead late or early with the elbow. Because of that, I'm questioning my grip, but I really believe it's the position of my elbow o rhow the arm is pivoting at my shoulder. Does that make sense? Do you have any suggestions?
     
  8. habib

    habib Professional

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    Do you lay your wrist back intentionally prior to the forward swing, or do you relax your wrist and allow it to lay back on its own as the swing begins? I'm thinking if you do the latter it may account for the racquet face being at different angles on contact.
     
  9. Thomas Bird-Itch

    Thomas Bird-Itch Semi-Pro

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    THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU!!! I allow it to lay back as I begin to swing forward!! I can see how that would be BAD for a lot of reasons - timing being the first. Years ago I heard an instructor say "keep your wrist relaxed when you swing" to a girl he was teaching. I never thought that little hitch would cause a problem. Now it makes complete sense! :grin:

    Ironically, I preach using a stiff wrist on a 2H BH to people who are learning one (b/c mine is very good), but the FH side is really no different. I don't know why I didn't think to change my own forehand. This explains so much... inconsistent depth, directional control, being late/early, etc. My forehand has been solid with sitters b/c I've never had time to make that loopy whip into the ball. Now I realize I've been doing it all along from deep in the court! Wow... ;)
     
  10. EricW

    EricW Professional

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    The way you are doing it is right, every pro relaxes their wrist and lets it lay back with the force generated during the swing. That's why when you see a pro hit a forehand from right behind them, it looks like they are "slapping" at the ball with their wrist. Watch someone hit a forehand who just lays it back at 90 degrees before their swing. It looks really weird, just stick with the way your doing it now

    And yes, that instructor was right, your wrist should be relaxed during your forehand. Watch a slow motion vid of a pro, you can clearly see the wrist starts at an angle around 135 degrees, and then the force of the swing makes the wrist lay back to 90 degrees, and then moves forward again to ~135 degrees
     
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2007
  11. Thomas Bird-Itch

    Thomas Bird-Itch Semi-Pro

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    I see what you're saying. I think my problem is that I've only been doing it partly right. For most short balls, I fix my wrist quickly, as soon as I begin to go forward. Behind the baseline though, my wrist may be bending throughout the stroke, slapping at it, instead of drive through. That can't be good.

    EDIT:Adding...
    I don't see that the wrist moves/pushes forward from the "90 degree" point, or wherever it was once the racquet started moving, until after contact. I don't think the wrist "snaps" moves forward during/at contact. Is that what you're suggesting I do? This has been discussed here quite a bit and I don't think that's the case.
     
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2007
  12. EricW

    EricW Professional

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    In every good player, during the swing, the wrist becomes laid back at 90 degrees at one point, right? Now pick up a racquet and see what it would be like to maintain that angle all the way through contact. It wouldn't work.

    When you make contact your wrist will have moved about 45 degrees forward (to around 135 degrees) from when it was laid back the most (90 degrees)

    And yes, you do do that, unless your forehand is terrible. Watch a slow motion vid of any pro, and you'll see that theres a lot of wrist movement during the swing (before contact), and the most wrist movement you'll see will come from Roger Federer and Rafael Nadal

    Remember: This is not active wrist movement! The wrist movement in a forehand comes from the force of the swing coupled with a relaxed wrist! (And to promote the relaxed wrist and make your forehand more natural, you shouldn't lay the racquet back to 90 degrees before the swing, you should let it fall back naturally from the force of the swing)
     
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2007
  13. sharpy

    sharpy Banned

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    your absolutely correct, the wrist doesnt push forward from the "90 degree point" it's just the wrist release is a passive element and you shouldnt even think about it.
     
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2007
  14. EricW

    EricW Professional

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    Are you joking? You start out your post saying the wrist doesnt go forward from the 90 degree point into contact, and then the next sentence you mention the wrist release? What the hell?

    If he lays his racquet back to 90 degrees before the swing, and doesn't let it fall back due to the force of the swing, then the wrist release will be much less natural, and might become forced, resulting in injury.

    By the way did you read what I wrote in italics:

     
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2007
  15. Thomas Bird-Itch

    Thomas Bird-Itch Semi-Pro

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    Maybe I've been doing it actively, but subconsiously? lol. [I also think my shoulders are opening too soon.] I guess "snapping" it forward purposely was the myth, where allowing it to naturally whip forward is ok? In some videos, it does look like the wrist whips the racquet forward slightly, but on others it looks like it stays laid back as it was once the swing began forward. Now I'm confused.

    [EDIT] Adding: FWIW, Guga is the player who appeared to whip the racquet forward slightly, but maybe he was late on the shot or something. The others who didn't appear to change the wrist angle were Djokovic, Hewitt, and Mathieu.
     
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2007
  16. EricW

    EricW Professional

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    Exactly, actively "snapping" it forward will kill your ability to hit a high level forehand, also leading to injuries, but in every good forehand, there is inactive wrist movement, which is just natural if you have a relaxed wrist and clean contact.

    Watch slow motion videos of Nadal and Federer to see the most apparent wrist movement, but every other player along with Nadal and Federer has the inactive wrist movement.

    Sometimes it's not as apparent as others, sometimes just because of the angle of the vid, but it's definitely there. Every pro, when hitting a topspin forehand, has their wrist lay back to 90 degrees during the swing. Now pick up a racquet and put the racquet where you would make contact, and put your wrist at 90 degrees, no way could you make contact like that.
     
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2007
  17. habib

    habib Professional

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    His usual faults aside, Sharpy is actually right here. The wrist lays back, but doesn't actually 'release' until after contact is made. The forearm will at times pronate during contact, but the angle of the wrist remains constant throughout contact. Yes, even those pros who lay it back 90 degrees (and the angle will actually vary from one to the other) make contact with the wrist that far back. Look at the sequence of Hewitt posted above - his wrist maintains the exact same angle to the forearm, and the forearm to the upper arm, throughout the swing, and releases only after contact.
     
  18. habib

    habib Professional

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    Well, don't overreact. :) Maintaing a relaxed wrist and allowing it to lay back as a function of the arm accelerating is not necessarily wrong or bad. It simply complicates the timing aspect - as you've noted - and can play tricks with your racquet alignment. Mind you, I should add that a relaxed wrist and a loose wrist aren't the same thing. You should still have a relaxed wrist even if you lay it back intentionally prior to the swing - that way the wrist-release which Eric mentioned (though not exactly like he described) can still take place (after contact).
     
  19. Lendl's Forehand

    Lendl's Forehand New User

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    I tend to agree with habib. I try to reinforce to not break the wrist whatsoever until contact is made. I don't like the idea of changing the angle of the forearm/racquet (90 to 135 for instance). Especially in less experienced players, this is a recipe for disaster.
    What so many people need to remember is that none of us are either Federer or Nadal, and most of us are not even close.
    If you are having consistency issues with the forehand, lay the wrist back, do not release it until contact.

    Also, this thread was originally about elbow. Do not lose control of your elbow if you are having consistency issues! If that means "tucking it into your side", do so (as best as you can). Your shoulders, torso, and forearm should be doing the brunt of the work, a flying elbow just adds another variable to the mix.
     
  20. mrcalon

    mrcalon Rookie

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    If you want to maximize that topspin let that wrist go freely when you do the windshield wiping motion.

    You don't keep your wrist firm when you hit a kick serve , do you?
     
  21. habib

    habib Professional

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    The wrist releasing freely on a WW finish occurs after contact and during follow-through.

    Why would you even compare these two strokes??
     
  22. mrcalon

    mrcalon Rookie

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    So you fix your wrist before contact, and right after contact release it? Why not just relax it the whole way so you don't have to think about it and just let your big muscles control the swing?

    The mechanics of hitting topspin is pretty much the same for both strokes. Racquet follows a windshield wiper path. The get the most speed (and subsequently topspin) you need to relax that wrist.
     
  23. Thomas Bird-Itch

    Thomas Bird-Itch Semi-Pro

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    It seems logical to me that the wrist would stay firm for normal groundstrokes. Maybe if you wanted to take away some power then you could relax it?

    One of my problems is that I've been changing the angle, of course unintentionally. This may have been to compensate for opening my shoulders too soon or something else. I looked for this thread b/c I thought my elbow was getting away, but I don't think that has as much of an effect as the other two.
     
  24. habib

    habib Professional

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    No, you don't 'fix' your wrist. You lay it back. Two completely different things. Even with a relaxed wrist, you have two options: lay it back prior to starting the forward swing, or allow the momentum of the forward swing lay it back for you. The latter often causes timing problems and is really for more advanced players who have grooved strokes. The former is a steadier stroke, and may be a fix to the OP's problem. There's no "thinking about it" involved. In either case, it's as automatic as bringing your racquet back. The 'mechanics of topspin' are nigh irrelevant here.
     
  25. habib

    habib Professional

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    Exactly why I asked about the laying back of the wrist. Laying your wrist back prior to the swing eliminates another variable. Allowing it to lay back on its own is fine, but if you're finding that the angle of your racquet face is inconsistent, it may well be the culprit. Least of all because when your wrist lays back from the pull of the body, the angle it lays back at can vary drastically depending on how you set yourself up for the shot and how much of a turn you get etc...
     
  26. Lendl's Forehand

    Lendl's Forehand New User

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    Actually they are different. For the most part, hardly anyone uses a wiper on the backhand - yet. On the forehand, only advanced more modern forehand strokes use the wiper. A standard low-to-high path with no wiper will also generate plenty of topspin, it's just not the optimal swing for today's game.

    Habib - you touched briefly on the differences in the wrist of advanced and recreational players. That needs to by more emphasized to make your point. You are exctly correct that for most rec. players, breaking the wrist through contact on the forehand is a recipe for disaster. With a firm wrist, you at least know what you are getting with each swing. But indeed the pro's can do it, and people who are very grooved, but not the common schmoe.

    I wonder how many threads/posts have been spent on this subject alone. 10,000?
     
  27. EricW

    EricW Professional

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    The only disagreement in this thread is that some of the posters are saying there shouldn't be any wrist movement in a forehand, but that's completely wrong [for the modern forehand].

    The sequence of images of hewitt in the beginning of this thread shows no wrist movement, but that's because it leaves out some important images(you never see him have his wrist laid bakc to a 90 degree angle, but you can see the 135 degree angle where he would have made contact although you can't see the ball), he showed that sequence for a different aspect of the stroke, so he wasn't careful to leave some other parts (the wrist movement).

    I wish I could post links to the vids on hi-techtennis.com proving my case, that there in fact is wrist movement in the forehand before contact, but most of you aren't members.

    Here's a vid of Nadals exagerating wrist release before contact(you can see this without being a member):

    http://www.hi-techtennis.com/video_sample/index.php?movie=nadal_front.swf&size=normal

    Every other pro has the wrist movement before contact when hitting a topspin stroke though, even if it's less than nadals
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2007
  28. EricW

    EricW Professional

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    It depends what your goals are, all of the technical things I discuss on this board is mechanics that you need to develop a forehand into the highest levels, but if you're willing to say: "Nah, I'll never get to 5.0+, ill just take the easy way out, with no wrist movement before contact, which will handicap me if I ever reach 5.0+.." then whatever..

    Bottom line, the modern topspin forehand has wrist movement before contact, and anyone who disagrees hasn't studied the modern game well enough

    Remember, we're discussing topspin forehands here, completely flat strokes don't have wrist movement.
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2007
  29. mrcalon

    mrcalon Rookie

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    Nor is a loose wrist forehand hard to learn, like most say.
    It's just that there's no widely available info (ie - free) info out there which easily describes it. There seems to be lots of conflicting info out there.

    I for one spent last season learning the easi tennis way of hitting because of the great reviews here from some of the big shots.

    I also spent a lot of time hitting with a stiff double bend forehand. It never felt right to me but i kept fighting through the frustration because based on reading things on these boards, it appeared to be the "right way" of hitting. I could never get it right.

    Unfortunately after a year of horrible incosistency I decided to try a month of each of the other top paysites (a month is all you need really).
    After studying video of the top MALE forehands you see that there's a very loose wrist being whipped through the ball. i incorporated the technique within weeks into my own shot (without a coach -just home video) and learned it rather easy. By no means do i have pro level talent either.

    i echo ericw's sentiments above. join a paysite,even for just a month and watch the videos. then try and think for yourself if what you see jives with what you're hearing on these boards.
     
  30. mrcalon

    mrcalon Rookie

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    Nothing difficult at all - relax the wrist, pull hard from right to left using body rotation and your chest muscle while maintaining a windshield wiping path. Sure you the shot may not feel as precise, but at least it will go in 90% of the time. Anyways that's how i do it.

    I won't push the point too hard though. If it becomes common knowledge of how easy it is to hit the modern forehand i'll lose my edge on all the other talentless Joe's. I hope they all keep hitting stiff double bend Landsdorp forehands!
     
  31. mrcalon

    mrcalon Rookie

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    Had to add one more note on "wrist" since i don't seem to have an edit button available.

    See this this video of arguably the meanest forehand on the men's tour. Check the cue he gives himself at :25. That's not a "firm" layed back wrist he's reminding himself to do..

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zPNnU0sCQaM
     
  32. Thomas Bird-Itch

    Thomas Bird-Itch Semi-Pro

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    Guys, I think the reason for the stiff wrist is consistent power. If your wrist is too loose, you risk weaker, mistimed shots. It seems like this might also cause people to "arm" the stroke.

    I think I've figured out my problem. I'm either straightening my arm too soon and/or letting it get too straight, which makes it harder to maintain the elbow angle.
     
  33. EricW

    EricW Professional

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    There is no reason for a stiff wrist on a topspin forehand.. All you're doing is handicapping yourself by learning the wrong mechanics
     
  34. habib

    habib Professional

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    I don't want to spend a lot of time on this, but it's true that many pros (many, not all) have a wrist release INTO contact. However, most pros also have 4+ hours a day every day to practice and work on their shots and fine tune them, and have in most cases been doing it for 85% of their lives. Comments about "hurr i guess I never will be 5.0+ and I'll take the easy way out" aside, people who haven't been playing tennis all their lives and who haven't developed the same consistency and sense of timing are generally going to hurt themselves more than help themselves by releasing their wrist prior to or during (using that word loosely) contact.

    Does a wrist release into contact generate additional racquet speed, and therefore power and spin? Of course. But it also introduces another variable into the equation (one more moving joint), and complicates the timing and setup for clean contact. Mrcalon says he can hit a forehand this way and get it in 90% of the time. Great. I can hit a forehand with a laid back wrist and get it in 100% of the time. You know what? At any level below 5-6, the player getting 10% balls in is going to win. I won't even touch the whole "sure it feels imprecise" comment he made. If you want to hit the ball like Courier - ie: as hard as you can with no thought for where it goes - that's up to you.

    Your comments about the Hewitt sequence, in addition, are mind-boggling. The first image in the sequence is as he's just pulling the racquet forward - at this point there's going to be just about the maximum amount of laying back the wrist. The last sequence looks like it's just before or right after contact, and the angle of his wrist and racquet to his forearm hasn't changed at all. I'm not sure which images you're looking at, but in the ones posted by Marius, there is no change of angle whatsoever. Take his arm from the first shot, rotate it to line up with the racquet of the last, and I can guarantee that it will be identical.

    Here's a slowmo of Haas' forehand: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_jLn6zN3cA
    Haas forehand not good enough? How about Gonzalez? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVTmGJ7pFzU

    Both times, it's pretty clear no wrist release into contact is being made and contact is occurring with the racquet at basically a 90 degree angle to the forehand. Your video of Nadal is nice, but an essentially actively wristy forehand like his (and like Federer's) is the exception in the ATP. Not the rule.

    Hell, here's even a video of the original Fed slow-mo forehand:
    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1273724609613333533

    Notice the angle at contact - sure looks 90 degrees to me. How you can say that it's "impossible" to make contact like this (as you claimed earlier) is beyond me. And then you have the gal to claim that people who don't understand your point of view "haven't studied the modern game enough."

    Right.

    Edit: A slow-mo video of Blake making contact with, GASP, a 90 degree angle of the wrist. With very few exceptions, I think you are seriously overestimating the amount of wrist usage into contact that takes place on the professional level.
     
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2007
  35. habib

    habib Professional

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    You people need to stop calling it a stiff wrist. But slightly off-topic, here's an interesting thought which just occurred to me: just about everyone is often taught to pull the racquet through contact, and to hit through the ball. However, if you think about it, if your wrist is releasing into contact, it means your arm is decelerating prior to contact, which means you're probably not getting as much of your weight into the shot. In fact, from a physics standpoint, there's really no way for your wrist to release into contact without deceleration of the arm unless your wrist is being actively employed (Federer, Nadal). Just something to consider.
     
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2007
  36. kimizz

    kimizz Rookie

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    I thought I post my problem here since its kinda similar to this topic. Well at least it relates to the quote above(from Thomas)

    I was testing all kinds of stuff today with my FH after a long break from tennis.And today I seemed to have one huge problem...when I had my arm bent I lost a lot of power in my shots. Then when I tried to straighten the arm(during the backswing) I was hitting fairly flat, powerful and consistent FH to the baseline. I use sw grip and Ive read that in this grip bent arm seems to come naturally. Also before the break I remember using a more bent arm. But for some reason today I had to straighten the arm to get some power to the shot...what has changed? I know I still use the same grip.

    Of course this isnt a big problem, it just seems my mechanics changed automatically during the break...and this is weird.
     
  37. mrcalon

    mrcalon Rookie

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    Comparing you to I is apples to oranges. I hit mine 90%, but someone more talented than I will hit with the same technique 100% and make you miss in the process.

    I know hitting layed back wrist for a year sent all my balls into the fence, whereas a loose wrist keeps the balls in.

    Do I prefer to hit as hard as I can like Courier? Absolutley, especially when the balls go in. Feels way better than hitting soft and still overshooting the baseline. Also funner to copy Fed, Nadal and Verdasco instead of Sherapova and the Williams sisters. But that's just my personal preference.
     
  38. mrcalon

    mrcalon Rookie

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    Interesting thought, but you're not decelrating with the windshield wiper. Arm pulls forward then to the left, causing the wrist to break and racquet to slingshot forward. Result is racquet speed.
     
  39. mrcalon

    mrcalon Rookie

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    It's a way easier shot to do than the firm wrist, mainly because the "free" topspin imparted by the wrist release will put everything in, whereas a flatter shot requires greater timing and concentration. From my experience the lack of topspin magnifies the smallest errors in technique .

    Learning the loose wrist (ie-"wrist release") is just as easy if not easier to learn than the pre-lay back technique. Again, the hardest part is finding someone to show you how to do it which is why i recommend signing up for a month on a paysite - a picture is worth a million TW quick tips.
     
  40. habib

    habib Professional

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    Of course it's comparing two totally different people, but it's in the same vein as you broadcasting your success rate.

    And you talk about comparing apples to oranges? I hit with great consistency when I relax my wrist but lay it back prior to the swing. If I allow my wrist to be totally loose, I can get extra power, but it costs consistency. It costs everyone consistency - Federer's extremely wristy strokes are one reason why he shanks balls more than any other pro.

    That "especially when the balls go in" is what loses guys like Gonzalez matches. Moreover, for those of us who are college level and below, as tricky has pointed out, the WTA approach is usually more successful than the ATP approach.
     
  41. habib

    habib Professional

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    By the time the arm pulls to the left, you've already made contact. Further more, whether the arm pulls left or forward, the only way the wrist will slingshoot forward is if the arm decelerates first. It's like a whip. When you crack a whip, it's the deceleration of your arm when you pull back that sends the tip out. Were you to accelerate your arm forward and not decelerate it, the whip would never shoot out in front. This is why I've been trying to explain why the 'wrist release' we've heard so much about generally occurs only after contact.

    I could even make a wager with you that your loose-wrist forehand doesn't actually involve the wrist releasing into contact, but releasing after, and the improvement you are experiencing from using a loose wrist is simply that which everyone can benefit from by relaxing their wrist because, again, you don't stiffen your wrist, you keep it relaxed, you just lay it back prior to swinging rather than allowing the swing to lay it back.
     
  42. habib

    habib Professional

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    I've been signed up on Tennisone for the better part of a year, in fact. Moreover, I again think you're confusing the meaning of a laid back wrist vs that of a stiff wrist. A stiff wrist will hinder your technique. A laid back wrist can stil be kept relaxed, all you're doing is laying it back ahead of time and eliminating certain timing issues which can develop when you let it lay back on its own, instead. Further, I'm baffled as to why you're associating a loose wrist with topspin and a non-loose wrist with flat shots.

    TO end, I think the videos I linked show that there's not much of a wrist release of any kind INTO contact inthe pro game. The videos I've seen on Tennisone generally support that fact. The vast majority of pro players make contact with the same 90 degree angle of the racquet that they start the swing with, whether they lay the wrist back first or not.
     
  43. mrcalon

    mrcalon Rookie

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    "When balls go in" also gets them in the top 10.

    I'm willing to trade an occasional shank for improved topspin, which leads to better consistency as a whole.
     
  44. habib

    habib Professional

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    Sure, I won't argue that. However, I also think that a shift in such mentality would lead to better rankings, which is only supported by Gonzo's rise since hooking up with Stefanki and calming his game down. Though, now he's gone too far in the opposite direction.

    In any case, none of the above really does much to advance your point.
     
  45. mrcalon

    mrcalon Rookie

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    That's actually not the feeling i get when i WW. I accelerate hard to the left immediately before contact. Possibly the stretch reflex that occurs from the late layback of the wrist helps whip it across.

    I could even make a wager with you that your loose-wrist forehand doesn't actually involve the wrist releasing into contact, but releasing after, and the improvement you are experiencing from using a loose wrist is simply that which everyone can benefit from by relaxing their wrist because, again, you don't stiffen your wrist, you keep it relaxed, you just lay it back prior to swinging rather than allowing the swing to lay it back.[/QUOTE]

    Nope. I know for sure I'm not laying it back early like Sharapova.
     
  46. mrcalon

    mrcalon Rookie

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    No confusion here on wrist getting layed back. I'm saying it's better not to think about laying it back and letting the forward motion do it for you.
     
  47. mrcalon

    mrcalon Rookie

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    My post infers that hitting a wristy type stroke leads to improved consistency, despite an occasional shank.
     
  48. habib

    habib Professional

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    By any definition, this is patently untrue. Consistency is a function of set, repeatable technique. A "wristy" forehand adds yet another variable element to the equation. This doesn't help consistency, it hinders it. You appear to define consistency by the amount of topspin you can put on the ball - which will aid you in keeping it in the court, yes. But don't confuse keeping the ball simply in the court with consistency, as such.
     
  49. habib

    habib Professional

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    Nope. I know for sure I'm not laying it back early like Sharapova.[/QUOTE]

    You are completely missing what I'm trying to say. I never asserted that you were laying it back intentionally prior to the forward momentum. Rather that you are imagining the wrist release into contact. It's quite obvious from analysis of super slow-mo video that this doesn't actually happen.
     
  50. habib

    habib Professional

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    What you are confusing is the terminology used, and the effect of the actions so described. You seem to see laying back the wrist early as "stiff"ening the wrist, and fail to realize that you can have an early lay back and a relaxed wrist, concordantly.
     

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