Foreigners in College Tennis

Discussion in 'College Tennis Talk' started by tennis5, May 3, 2012.

  1. andfor

    andfor Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2004
    Messages:
    4,862
    This boarders on a Xenophobic view.

    Memphis lost to Tulsa 3-4 in the Semi's. I believe Memphis is better than Rice, but they never played and I'm biased. Memphis #1 singles player made the NCAA's.
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2012
  2. Misterbill

    Misterbill Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2011
    Messages:
    671
    Tip o' the cap.

    Good luck to you in the Big East in 2013, right?
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2012
  3. andfor

    andfor Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2004
    Messages:
    4,862
    That's right. Thanks.
     
  4. JLyon

    JLyon Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2007
    Messages:
    3,341
    Location:
    AR
    Was more of a 4 team race, Tulsa was much better than the other 3, but Rice, Tulane, and Memphis were all very close together.
    Memphis played the match of their season against Tulsa, but lost #1-2 which hurt them, but I understand they have a solid Ukranian coming in next year and a 4* American.

    The #1 at Rice is pretty solid, she upset the #9 player 1,3 last weekend in Oxford.
     
  5. Misterbill

    Misterbill Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2011
    Messages:
    671
    Tulane is in the mix too. Interesting. Just took a look and there are lots of foreigners in CUSA, and a lot of domestic 4-stars and above also.
     
  6. JLyon

    JLyon Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2007
    Messages:
    3,341
    Location:
    AR
    There was a pretty good mix, Tulsa was the only team I noticed with no American players. 2013-14 season will be interesting with the Sun Belt #1-2 Teams coming in as SMU, UH, and Memphis leave.
     
  7. bubba maroon

    bubba maroon New User

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2012
    Messages:
    15
    Can't understand why a school like SUNY Binghampton

    refuses to allow any men on their men's tennis team.. the team is supported by taxpayer dollars....therefore, you would figure at least one player should be from new york state...seems to me that this is a form of discrimination
     
  8. TeflonTom

    TeflonTom Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2012
    Messages:
    920
    seems to me u have nfi what ur talkin bout
     
  9. bubba maroon

    bubba maroon New User

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2012
    Messages:
    15
    sorry I forgot the word American in my previous post

    The point I am making is how can a state school like SUNY Binghamton not have at least one American on the team
     
  10. andfor

    andfor Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2004
    Messages:
    4,862
    Ask the coach? Ask him how many Americans tennis players he has beating down his door that can actually play and contribute to his team. Then ask him what reaction he typically gets when he approaches American tennis players he's identified as players he wants on his team.
     
  11. bubba maroon

    bubba maroon New User

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2012
    Messages:
    15
    apparently an american guy who wanted to be on the team

    was given the cold shoulder, transferred to wake forrest in january and started for wake forrest
     
  12. andfor

    andfor Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2004
    Messages:
    4,862
    Wake Forrest? Must be a new school. Haha

    Maybe this is the case for this player. Looks like he played #6 and had a 11-18 record. Not exactly stellar. Here's the deal with Wake. They lost their coach and 2 or 3 starters before last season began. They had a big 2012 recruiting year and your player will likely not see the court in a dual again.

    There's always two sides to every story. What was the reason from the Binghampton coach for giving this kid the "cold shoulder"? Did the kid ever really intend to play there? Really?
     
  13. Clemson_tennis

    Clemson_tennis Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2011
    Messages:
    5,435
    Location:
    San Antonio/Austin
    Who are we talking about? Alex Tsai? He isn't very good. He won't see the court for Wake ever again because of the new recruits.



    Also just as a general heads up to the forum. Can we please stop mocking people for typos and minor misspellings? It's really snobbish and very annoying. Several posters on here do it all the time and sometimes its their only response.
     
  14. andfor

    andfor Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2004
    Messages:
    4,862
    Yes. However I would like Bubba Maroon to confirm. It's not fair to the kid to use him as an example when neither he nor the Binghampton coach can tell their side of the story.

    Regarding the typos my joking was not intended to be hurtful in any way. I agree though and will cease and desist as inflection is not done well over the Internet.

    Btw. Saw Chip Cox in the Kalamazoo draw. Will that guy ever turn 19?
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2012
  15. JLyon

    JLyon Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2007
    Messages:
    3,341
    Location:
    AR
    Their #1 is very good, I chaired her match in NCAA's where she beat Krisit Boxx. She is only a Freshman at that. As for CUSA they have Good Top 5 in Tulsa, Rice, Tulane, Memphis, and Marshall.
    They add UNT and FIU next year, but lose UH who just made a great hire in Patrick Sullivan
     
  16. bubba maroon

    bubba maroon New User

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2012
    Messages:
    15
    recently meaning how many years ago?

    certainly not from the 2011-12 roster...you probably mean some guy from deer park...
     
  17. dennis10is

    dennis10is Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2005
    Messages:
    2,033
    Location:
    Long Island, NY
    No, Foreigners are anyone who were not born and raised in Binghamton. The school in question is SUNY Binghamton so anyone not from there are foreigners. I'm sick and tire of out of towners using our roads, drinking our water, breather our air. My taxes should be spent only on those who are my peeps and have shared in our tax burden.

    On Long Island, every few blocks has at least one Fire Dept, a school district, library and churches. Only then can we control the runaway cost of government. We also have our own militia to defend ourselves against invaders. We stand our ground. Somebody walks or drive into our block, we ask for their block issue ID (not that crap State Driver License). If they can't prove they live in our block we escort them out. This is America not some communist country where free loaders can just kick back and spend tax payers' money.
     
  18. Misterbill

    Misterbill Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2011
    Messages:
    671
    Right on, Dennis!

    Some posters may not be focusing on the fact, however, that NY State, and Binghamton, have sales taxes. So "the foreigners"............at least the ones who have purchased taxable goods in NY and Binghamton.......have shared the tax burden.

    Maybe these posters are proposing that tennis scholarships to State schools should be based on who has paid the most tax?

    Viva la 1%!!
     
  19. floridatennisdude

    floridatennisdude Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2012
    Messages:
    1,969
    Wow, your interpretation of the Binghamton hoops scandal being the one foreign players fight is pretty amazing. It didn't have anything to do with the domestic players arrests for stealing condoms from WalMart and subsequently running over a 66 y/o woman? Another American dealing crack on campus? The coach pressuring faculty to change players grades? The athletic department pressuring admissions to lower academic requirements? The wide spread recruiting of players from a Philly diploma mill?

    Dude, the one incident by the foreign kid (tragic as it was) was just one incident amongst many. You cannot be serious that the bball program's scandal was that one foreigners fault?

    http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Binghamton_University_basketball_scandal#section_5

    And frankly, I don't think there is enough interest among quality American recruits to keep Binghamton respectable in tennis. That program would fizzle without the use of foreign recruits. It's not exactly a dream school for 5-star recruits.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2012
  20. bubba maroon

    bubba maroon New User

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2012
    Messages:
    15
    I did not say the foreigner caused the basketball scandal

    I said he turned some innocent brooklyn kid into a vegetable...I would not summarily dismiss it as one tragic instance....

    you guys dismiss a program if they are not loaded with five star players...granted five star players would rather go ivy...winning isn't everything

    btw I hear wake is getting a guy who attended cornell and had to leave after he was charged with felonies as a result of a hazing death
     
  21. andfor

    andfor Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2004
    Messages:
    4,862
    Uhhh, you still have not stated the coaches position on the kid he "cold shouldered" and you have not stated the kids story on why he supposedly went to Binghamton a semester only to end up at WF as a contributor as #6 singles and #3 dubs, for 2012.

    BTW, I'm sure the guy who WF is getting from Cornell is American so that makes it...............now if this kid was an international I'm sure it would be an outrage.

    Hypocrisy to be continued.
     
  22. bubba maroon

    bubba maroon New User

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2012
    Messages:
    15
    either way it is an outrage

    american or foreign...I would not want a guy like that on my team
     
  23. andfor

    andfor Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2004
    Messages:
    4,862
    True. Sad to hear.
     
  24. Clemson_tennis

    Clemson_tennis Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2011
    Messages:
    5,435
    Location:
    San Antonio/Austin
    haha I know. Seems like I have been hearing about him forever.
     
  25. Tennisstringz

    Tennisstringz New User

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2011
    Messages:
    43
    Limit D-1 teams to two foreign players per team. What's wrong with that?
     
  26. andfor

    andfor Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2004
    Messages:
    4,862
    Nothing. Go get that rule in place. Let us know how it goes.
     
  27. floridatennisdude

    floridatennisdude Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2012
    Messages:
    1,969
    Yea, what could go wrong with a little socialism in a "free" country?
     
  28. TennisFan2Day

    TennisFan2Day Rookie

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2008
    Messages:
    174
    It's funny how some schools work the system. Tsvetan Mihov signing a "Financial Aid Agreement" at South Carolina. This means he is getting a financial aid scholarship rather than using an athletic scholarship. It's one thing when a foreign student gets financial aid from a private school but it shouldn't happen at a public school.

    http://www.gamecocksonline.com/sports/m-tennis/spec-rel/082812aaa.html
     
  29. Mitch Bridge

    Mitch Bridge Rookie

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2012
    Messages:
    145
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
     
  30. ClarkC

    ClarkC Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2008
    Messages:
    3,767
    Location:
    Charlottesville, VA
    Need-based financial aid counts towards the 4.5 scholarship limit. I would not read much into the wording of the press release.
     
  31. andfor

    andfor Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2004
    Messages:
    4,862
    It's funny how folks who don't know the rules make **** up to place others unfairly in a bad light. Is this some sort of Liberal smear tactic?
     
  32. Costagirl

    Costagirl Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2013
    Messages:
    186
    Location:
    USA
    I just did an interview with a senior from UMass Amherst - Barcelona girl and we talk about their desire to come to the states from elsewhere. In Spain without providing college sports they opt to come to the states to continue and education along with their sport. It's a touchy subject i know this... but well, to each their own. She's a great girl who's had fantastic experiences at Amherst.

    http://www.costa-del-tennis.com/tennis-interview-umass-amherst-julia-comas-espona/
     
  33. bluetrain4

    bluetrain4 Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2007
    Messages:
    8,845
    It can be a touchy subject, but I don't think any blame should be placed on the foreign athletes. They're just taking advantage of a legitimate and permissible opportunity.
     
  34. PhxRacket

    PhxRacket Rookie

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2011
    Messages:
    234
    If the USTA and others are truly committed to growing tennis in the United States, action would replace words. Until then, we can watch the world rule the Slams and get excited when an American reaches the quarters. If they can force a 12 year old into playing with a green dot ball, they can use their influence to change this trend.
     
  35. bluetrain4

    bluetrain4 Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2007
    Messages:
    8,845
    When did foreign athletes become the huge industry in college tennis that it is today. What was the turning point? I remember following college tennis back in in the 80s when I started playing and the number of foreign athletes was much smaller. It kind of grew steadily over the years.

    What schools were at the head of the trend?

    And really, what led to it? Was there some change in the law regarding student visas, was there an NCAA rule change? Or, was it always technically permissible, but simply not expolited yet?

    I've never really cared one way or the other. But, it's an interesting topic.
     
  36. PhxRacket

    PhxRacket Rookie

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2011
    Messages:
    234
    Suppose you have a very capable 19 year old daughter who could play at the D1 level. Would she possess the same level of game maturity as a 26 year old foreign player with professional experience and training? The question answers itself. Here is another interesting point to ponder-What would the reaction be if D1 and D2 football, basketball and baseball were flooded with foreign players?
     
  37. ClarkC

    ClarkC Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2008
    Messages:
    3,767
    Location:
    Charlottesville, VA
    Here is another interesting point to ponder: Why not read the thread, and similar threads, before pontificating about nonsense like hypothetical 26-year-old foreign players in D1 college tennis?

    We've been over this stupid subject a million times, and some self-promoting interviewer revives a dead thread, and here we go again.
     
  38. Court_Gamecocks

    Court_Gamecocks New User

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2013
    Messages:
    78
    a KU Singh situation is what can happen if you rely on international players.
     
  39. bluetrain4

    bluetrain4 Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2007
    Messages:
    8,845
    Nothing about his situation seems like it couldn't happen with a non-foreign player. He quit the team at the end of the season. Couldn't any player do that?
     
  40. PhxRacket

    PhxRacket Rookie

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2011
    Messages:
    234
    Thanks for contributing to the dead thread with your 2 cents. It was helpful and illuminating.
     
  41. andfor

    andfor Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2004
    Messages:
    4,862
    What would be illuminating is more folks actually reading and understanding the rules of college tennis. It would prevent making statements that would be true back only in the 80s and 90s.
     
  42. ClarkC

    ClarkC Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2008
    Messages:
    3,767
    Location:
    Charlottesville, VA
    Thanks for contributing your time-wasting ignorance to the thread.
     
  43. rww

    rww New User

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2011
    Messages:
    12
  44. Court_Gamecocks

    Court_Gamecocks New User

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2013
    Messages:
    78
    no because from what I understand, cultural differences led to that decision by Manny Diaz.
     
  45. andfor

    andfor Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2004
    Messages:
    4,862
    Hmmm. Love to hear more on this. Was the cultural difference something to do with his so called need to study instead of practice tennis?
     
  46. phinstennis

    phinstennis New User

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2014
    Messages:
    12
    lots of pasionate people on this subject

    its a tough one. One of the biggest drawbacks to the international is they do not tend to give back to their programs after they are done as alumni.
    many people on this thread have stated they are taking away scholarship money from American kids. On the women's side this is not true. there are a lot of average female players on scholarships at so many schools.
    On the men's side money can be hard to come by.
    I would like to hear from sane people how they determine who is deserving of scholarship money. Is It 3,4,5 star or blue chips?
    i"m curious the criteria that people have on who actually deserves this precious money
    It would be informative to hear from current and or past college coaches.
     
  47. sureshs

    sureshs Bionic Poster

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2005
    Messages:
    35,057
    Someone told me that athletic scholarships are awarded on the basis of merit, not financial need. Is that true?
     
  48. phinstennis

    phinstennis New User

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2014
    Messages:
    12
    merit or percieved tennis ability?

    Coaches are trying to get the best players they can get for the least amount of scholarship money. Many school give generous academic money for high level grades and test scores. This allows some programs to create lucrative packages awarding high level student athletes.
     
  49. JW10S

    JW10S Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2006
    Messages:
    1,896
    I admit I have not read this whole thread. I will say to begin with that I played for an NCAA championship tennis team where 4 out of the 6 top players (starters) were foreign. I won't say whether I was one of those foreign players or not, but I will say we would not have won without them. Tennis, unlike American football for example, is a global sport. College coaches, in any sport, are hired to win. There may be some programs where a coach is brought in and told 'we want you to play US players, regardless of where the team finishes', but I imagine those circumstances are very rare, if they exist at all. The inclusion of foreign players has improved the level of play of college tennis in the US. I was given a tennis scholarship based on my ability to play tennis, not my nationality. Sure my grades going in were a consideration but only to show that I'd be able to remain academically eligible to play. If college tennis in the US were to be confined to only playing US players the overall level of play would suffer, and winning the team or individual NCAA titles would mean less.
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2014
  50. red rook

    red rook Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2010
    Messages:
    208
    Yes, but I think eventually American tennis would benefit in the long run.

    I was watching tennis on espn yesterday. Fsu vs lsu. Fsu had players on the singles court from England Guatemala Germany Jamaica etc. Come to find out there is not one American on the roster!!!! What a joke
     

Share This Page