Gamma 602FC with a Wise 2086 tension head

Discussion in 'Stringing Techniques / Stringing Machines' started by rich s, Oct 28, 2005.

  1. rich s

    rich s Hall of Fame

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    I have just successfully mounted a Wise 2086 tension head to a Gamma Progression II 602 FC.

    The links are below.

    It wasn't as difficult as I thought. Two pieces of aluminum and some stainless hardware from Lowe's and 2 hours later I have an electronic stringer.


    http://tinypic.com/f2lwmf.jpg

    http://tinypic.com/f2lwtd.jpg
     
    #1
  2. jj300

    jj300 Semi-Pro

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    looks great. you may have saved people some money now cuz they can get a dropweight and mold this like you did. Great work.
     
    #2
  3. dancraig

    dancraig Hall of Fame

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    Great idea!
     
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  4. Mike Cottrill

    Mike Cottrill Hall of Fame

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    Looks Good. Were you able to do the mod without any permanent modifications? Looks like a nice finish too.
    Mike
     
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  5. rich s

    rich s Hall of Fame

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    Mike-
    the only permanent mod I had to do to retain the stock 602 appearance was cutting a rectangular hole in the plastic tray for the mount to extend thru. Everything else is unmodified.

    I used a 6" length of 1/4"x2" aluminum strap and a 6" length of 1.5"x1.5"x 1/8" aluminum angle and some Stainless steel screws, nuts and washers from Lowe's.

    If any body wants dimensions plans and material list for the bracket I will be more than happy to share them.

    rich
     
    #5
  6. mellofelow

    mellofelow Semi-Pro

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    Awesome!!! What a great idea. Thanks for sharing.
     
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  7. barry

    barry Hall of Fame

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    Dimensions plans and material list would be great! Also looks like you have 360 rotation or close to 360.

    Thanks
     
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  8. rich s

    rich s Hall of Fame

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    Barry, give me a couple days and I will get some halfway decent looking sketches and all the hardware I bought.

    I have full 360 rotation with my thinest frames that have 4 5/8 grips. The 602FC does not have a turn table brake and I didn't want the handle pressing up against the gripper when pulling the first few mains at the throat so I opted to mount the tensioner a little lower than I think would be ideal. I looked at pictures of the new Gamma 5800 and it looked like it has 360 deg rot so I just went with it.

    To compensate for the added friction thru the grommets I plan to string about a pound or two higher tension than I normally do.

    rich
     
    #8
  9. barry

    barry Hall of Fame

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    I think I can figure it out from here using your description, Lowe’s has everything needed. My implementation would be a little different since the base plate is solid 3/8 inch steel. I would use 2 inch angle and drill to holes in the base, connect it, and position the 2 inch flat stock (with the Wise connected) to the height of the frame mount. Like you I would make sure I have 360 rotation before the final drilling, which to me is the biggest draw back of a drop weight machine.

    Overall is the Wise an improvement over the drop weight system? And was it worth your time and effort?

    Thanks
     
    #9
  10. rich s

    rich s Hall of Fame

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    Barry do you have a 602FC also? If you do I can save you the time of measuring everything

    It was definitely worth the time and effort. It took me more time to track down the aluminum stock I wanted than it did to measure and fabricate and my 3 1/2 year old son insisted he had to "help" measure, layout and fabricate.

    I didn't keep track of my time too closely but the Wise easily shaved 7-10 minutes off a racquet that used to take me 35 miuntes to string with the drop wt and that was the first time using the Wise. I'm sure I will be able to shave more time off once I get used to it.
     
    #10
  11. barry

    barry Hall of Fame

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    Great to hear it was worth while.
    I have an older (5 year old) drop weight machine with fixed clamps; it is an Eagnas star Y12-3 unit (http://www.eagnas.com/gif/y123.gif). Very heavy made, 6 point mounting system, spring assisted clamps. It weighs 85 pounds and I am debating to modify it or buy an Aria machine.

    The drop weight assembly can be un-bolted, and I think it is simply a matter of drilling two holes centered with the angle brace. Securing it and installing the flat 2 inch stock for the Wise on the angle brace.

    The only measurement I am missing is the Wise head measurement from the 2 inch stock to the gripper. My machine is low, only has 8 ½ inches from the base plate to the racket mounts. I could not find measurements on the Wise site.
     
    #11
  12. Mike Cottrill

    Mike Cottrill Hall of Fame

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    Rich,
    The parts list and procedure will be nice for those visiting the board. Fit looks nice and is nice alternative to upgrading.
    Thanks
    Mike
     
    #12
  13. Steve Huff

    Steve Huff Legend

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    Who said racquet stringers weren't rocket scientists!!!
     
    #13
  14. rich s

    rich s Hall of Fame

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    The dimension from the top of the 2" stock to the top of the linear gripper is 8.5 inches.

    Hope this helps.

    rich
     
    #14
  15. barry

    barry Hall of Fame

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    Thanks for the info; I sent an email to Wise and Herb is mailing a template with all the measurements. Found the parts at Lowe’s might double the bar thickness the Wise attaches too.

    Also in Herbs Email:

    “It is important that the gripper of the Wise lineup with the string coming through the frame.
    We have a template which gives the dimensions of our machine and the height of the
    Gripper. It is Free and if you send your full name and address we'll gladly send one
    On to you.”
    Wise USA
    (Herb)
     
    #15
  16. rich s

    rich s Hall of Fame

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    In which direction? Vertically or Laterally?
     
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  17. barry

    barry Hall of Fame

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    Rich s

    I am not sure, when I receive the template drawing, will post it on the web, it should be here by Saturday.

    He also sent me a picture of your implementation, small world!

    I may have a problem with my implementation if the Wise unit is 8 1/2 high (base to gripper), my frame mount height is 8 1/2 so it might be two inches to high.
     
    #17
  18. rich s

    rich s Hall of Fame

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    Barry-
    The base of the Wise that accepts the tension bar on crank machines is bolted to the bottom of the Wise unit with three cap screws and is ~1/2" thick. You could remove the base that accepts the tension bar and make an adapter to bolt up to the three cap screws that hold the original base. That would shorten the unit at least 2 1/2 inches.

    Let me know if you want to see pictures if your drawings don't show what I am trying to describe.

    rich
     
    #18
  19. barry

    barry Hall of Fame

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    Rich

    I ordered the Wise 2086, plus foot padel, and it should be here in 2 weeks. Wise is back ordered. I think you are right about removing the crank attachment. A picture would be a big help.
    Guy Perez built a piece of angle iron, which I now have which works if I mount it on the bottom. Only issue is I have to raise the base 4 inches to still fit on the table top. I think I can mount the angle iron on the top, use you idea of removing the Wise attachment, and it will come out the correct height. Plus my machine has adjustments for heights, can extend it 1 inch in if necessary.

    Thanks

    Here is a couple of pictures of the brace Guy had built.

    http://img467.imageshack.us/img467/8215/dsc020771ag.jpg
    http://img467.imageshack.us/img467/9611/dsc020789ks.jpg
     
    #19
  20. rich s

    rich s Hall of Fame

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    Barry-

    For clarification-

    You want pictures of the Tension head without the base that accepts the tension bar?
     
    #20
  21. barry

    barry Hall of Fame

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    Just a picture of the bottom of the Wise will do. No reason to take it apart. Just curious how the flange looks, and the screws, maybe how large the brackets would have to be.

    Thanks
     
    #21
  22. Gaines Hillix

    Gaines Hillix Hall of Fame

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    I corresponded with Herb about a few mods I was considering and one of them was lowering the tension head arm so I could get 360o rotation. Herb warned me off of this. Apparently the Wise head is designed so that the string gripper is inline with the grommet holes, which produces a force which is also in-line with the load cells in the electronics of the tension head. If the string comes into the gripper at an angle the load cells will not detect tension as accurately as they should.
     
    #22
  23. sharkey10s

    sharkey10s New User

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    barry

    congratulations on your Wise tension head purchase. Let us know what you think.
     
    #23
  24. barry

    barry Hall of Fame

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    Gaines

    Herb sent me a template with instructions on how the 2086 should mounted in relation to the gripper. I posted it at http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=74791

    I am kind of lucky, on my stringer you can raise and lower the racket mounting system about 1 inch up or down, so I will be able to line it up.

    http://www.eagnas.com/lilylee/y123.html

    Not sure what scale Eagnas used, but my machine weighs 76 pounds, they list it at 61 pounds. Maybe gold inside!

    Will post some pictures and a review when it comes in (2 weeks), they are currently back ordered a week or so.
     
    #24
  25. barry

    barry Hall of Fame

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    Thanks, I am looking forward to getting it. It was a difficult decision to buy a new machine, or retrofit my old one.
    My old machine has every feature I need but does not have an electronic tensioner, and I will have a back up, the old drop weight system.
     
    #25
  26. barry

    barry Hall of Fame

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    Rich

    On the video they show a good view of the bolts. I will wait for the unit to arrive to do the measurements.

    Thanks anyway

    Barry
     
    #26
  27. gokou703

    gokou703 Rookie

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    thats it!!! i'm modifying a klippermate asap!!!!! =)
     
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  28. T3nn15dud5

    T3nn15dud5 New User

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    Will i be able to put Wise Head on 6-FC?
     
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  29. bridge

    bridge New User

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    Spoke with Herb Wise a few weeks back. He is planning to produce an adapter for dropweight machines. Someone with a 602fc still needed to get back to him with a design and dimensions to make it work. We can only assume a degree of modularity will be built into this adapter to accomodate various hole patterns and height requirements. Plans can change, so its best to check with him.
     
    #29
  30. Xanataos

    Xanataos Rookie

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    hey Rich S. I have a Regression 600. After reading this, i am interested in converting mine to an electronic one too. Can you tell me how you did it? The pictures dont work. Can you send yours to wellington.lam@gmail.com? thx!
     
    #30
  31. rich s

    rich s Hall of Fame

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    I made an adapter out of aluminium so that it bolted to the aluminum base of the stringing machine after it was installed into the reciever for the tension track arm of the Wise tension head.

    The unfortunate thing is that the bases of the 600 and 602 are different and my adapter will not accomdate the base of the progression 600..

    http://i3.tinypic.com/w0mic5.jpg

    http://i3.tinypic.com/w0mik4.jpg
     
    #31
  32. Xanataos

    Xanataos Rookie

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    ic. How does your adapter look like? do you need welding tools?
     
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  33. rich s

    rich s Hall of Fame

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    I didn't weld. aluminum is difficult to weld. I used machine screws to screw it together and I used the existing bolts that hold the support for the drop arm to the base to attach the adapter to the base.
     
    #33
  34. Wondertoy

    Wondertoy Professional

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    Barry and GuyPerez, did you ever modify your Eagnas Star Y12-3 drop machine to accept the Wise tensioning head, I have the same Eagnas machine and wonder about the feasibility. Thanks.
     
    #34
  35. barry

    barry Hall of Fame

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    I was able to implement a Wise on my drop weight system. Here is my write up! Since then I donated the drop weight and purchased a crank machine.

    After a year of research, I finally decided to upgrade my Eagnas Star Y12-3 with a Wise 2086 electronic tensioning system http://img391.imageshack.us/img391/8840/dsc020517fq.jpg . The Y12-3 comes with a 6 point mounting system; spring assisted clamps, solid mounting system, and has performed well for the last 6 years. The decision to upgrade verses buy a new one was decided based on the lack of quality electronic machines in the $1000 price range. Most had either rotational grippers or did not perform a true constant pull function.

    My goal was to use the counterweight system for backup, and the Wise 2086 as the primary tensioner. After receiving the mounting bracket from Guy Perez (Thanks again), I installed it by drilling 4, ½ inch holes into the ¼ inch steel plate (recommend if you do it, use a drill press). Also to compensate for the height of the flange, I used 2 ¼ inch wood, mitered the corners, and installed it on the steel plate. I use the machine on a table. Also I had to drill 2 holes into the back side of the wood riser, allowing for mounting of the old drop weight system if ever needed http://img391.imageshack.us/img391/2422/dsc020920my.jpg. Spray painted all of the parts black, and waited for the Wise delivery. After I installed the Wise 2086, the linear gripper was to low, so I removed the wooden base and mounted the unit on bracket on top. The mounting piece I had looked like this http://img467.imageshack.us/img467/8215/dsc020771ag.jpg and http://img467.imageshack.us/img467/9611/dsc020789ks.jpg . I found it easier to mount it in the center. I think you could do it either way, and you do not need 1/4 inch steel for the mount since you are pulling less than 80 pounds. This was overkill, but worked very well. I wanted to make sure I could go back and forth with the drop weight which was another reason to mount it in the center. So to implement the brace on the Star machine, all you need to do is drill 4 holes, and bolt it on. In reality you could drill 2 holes and the unit would work just as well. As you know the machine is built like a tank, and the mounting bracket is so strong, the 2 holes would more than hold the bracket in place.

    The Wise 2086, foot pedal, and shipping came to $554.95. It was packaged well, clear documentation, and took 2 weeks to arrive over the Thanksgiving holidays. Once received, it took about 5 minutes to unpack, and hook up http://img391.imageshack.us/img391/3100/dsc020882iq.jpg. I was impressed with the new designed linear griper; it grabs the string as well as my old drop weight system. Once the unit was powered up, it self calibrates and you are ready to string. I mounted a racket and begin stringing. The unit is much quieter than previously reported. I thought it might wake up the neighbors, but my Wise unit is quiet. Second, the foot pedal is a little awkward. I found it just as easy to push the long bar at the center of the machine to set and release the tension, but it may take a little more time to get use too.

    I use hybrid strings, poly mains with synthetic gut crosses. The mains were as easy as using the drop weight system. Poly does not stretch, so it is ideal for a drop weight system (no repositioning of the drop weight). The crosses were much easier to string using the Wise unit. You could see the string stretching and no repositioning of bars.

    Playability, the rackets have more of a consistent feel, not sure why, but the sweet spot seem larger and the tension more even. I did use the pre-stretch feature, it takes a second or two longer, but pulls to the +10%, then releases back to the set tension. Two beeps and you know it is ready.

    Overall, I am impressed with the unit, and will give Wise an A on design. To get an A+ the next generation should allow for 360 rotations. Wise 2086 and my machine exceeded my expectations, and hopefully will serve me well for another 6 years. One thing for sure, I am not sure I will ever go back to a mechanical tensioner, the electronic unit spoiled me.
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2007
    #35
  36. tennis-skater

    tennis-skater Semi-Pro

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    You know whats funny is that he has been saying this for 2 years
     
    #36
  37. Wondertoy

    Wondertoy Professional

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    Thanks for thw write up, barry, very interesting. So I see you placed your bracket underneath the Eagnas faceplate so you could align the gripper in the racquet plane. I have dispensed with the drop weight mechanism so I think I will fashion the Wise tension on the existing holes in the Eagnas faceplate. I will have to fine tune a bracket using aluminum, steel or wood whatever is easier, (or maybe wood wouldn't work). Do you have the dimesions of the Wise unit so I can plan ahead? I use natural gut mains with poly plasma crosses on my O3 Tour MP. Thank you so much.
     
    #37
  38. barry

    barry Hall of Fame

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    Actually on my first attempt, I mounted the bracket on the bottom and built the wood frame. After stringing for a while, I remounted the bracket on top, removed the wood frame, and it was matched up better. Your best bet is to order a template from http://www.**********.com or talk with Rich about his setup. I think he got the parts at Lowe's not sure. Also you can get a motor from Eagnas which says constant pull, someone posted a picture of it couple of years ago. It bolts right on where the existing drop weight is. It might be an easier solution than building a bracket. The Wise is $565 with the foot pedal and shipping.

    I thought the Wise 2086 was pretty nice, but now own a crank machine which so far is getting the job done. The Star y12-3 I owned is still being used, and it is very well made machine. I did over a 1000 rackets on it, best $400 I ever spent.

    Keep in mind, I found the drop weight just as accurate as the Wise, only the Wise was a lot easier.

    I still have the mounting piece somewhere around here, if I locate it will send you some deminsions or if you need it will be glad to ship it to you (with the bolts). It is heavy so it would be $20 including UPS shipping. You could us it as is, or use it as a template for your machine.
     
    #38
  39. Wondertoy

    Wondertoy Professional

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    Thanks, barry, that is very gracious of you. I'll get back to you on that, I am currently away at a tournamnet. I have to decide whether to pick up the Wise, Gamma ES upgrade or an DC electric (or electronic) tensioner from Eagnas that would already fit into the Eagnas faceplate. I am on a budget. Thanks.
     
    #39
  40. barry

    barry Hall of Fame

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    There is an ES for sale at http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=111342&highlight=gamma+stringer

    Might save you some money. I did find out the Gamma warranty is not transferable.
     
    #40
  41. tennis-skater

    tennis-skater Semi-Pro

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    I would be interested in buying it
     
    #41
  42. barry

    barry Hall of Fame

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    Just send me an Email and we can discuss shipment.

    Thanks
    Barry
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2008
    #42
  43. schap02

    schap02 Semi-Pro

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    Hey Rich -
    COUld you fill me in on some details about the plans for how you made the assembly?
    Tutors9@verizon.net...

    Thanks a million
     
    #43
  44. ewberner

    ewberner Rookie

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    I know you did that set up with the Wise and the 602 quite a while ago. Did this happen to be before Wise started to produce the drop weight adapter? I am currently looking into the same set up that you had with the Gamma and the Wise, but saw you had to add some of your own fabrications. Was just curious if it happened to be before the adapter was made by Wise...
     
    #44
  45. rich s

    rich s Hall of Fame

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    I did this before Wise offered their adapter.
     
    #45
  46. ewberner

    ewberner Rookie

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    Thanks for the answer. Were you pretty happy with this machine once you added the Wise? Consistent? Durable?
     
    #46
  47. rich s

    rich s Hall of Fame

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    yes to all of your questions..... I only upgraded to the 6004 with the Wise on it for the added speed of the quick action clamps and self centering turntable mounting system
     
    #47

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