Get off the courts!

Discussion in 'Adult League & Tournament Talk' started by TTMR, Feb 17, 2013.

?

Did I deal with this so-called 'coach' properly?

  1. Yes. Adult matches take priority over lessons on public courts.

    20 vote(s)
    18.5%
  2. Yes, but you should have gone further and called the police on him.

    11 vote(s)
    10.2%
  3. No, he had the courts: You should have waited until 11, found other courts or gone home.

    64 vote(s)
    59.3%
  4. No, he should have called the police on you. He had the courts and you forced him off.

    13 vote(s)
    12.0%
  1. tenniscasey

    tenniscasey Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2012
    Messages:
    426
    This is, without question, the dumbest thing I will read today. At this point it's clear you're just looking for a reaction from people.
     
    #51
  2. Cindysphinx

    Cindysphinx G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2006
    Messages:
    15,070
    Exactly.

    Kids need to learn that there are people in the world who behave like huge tools.
     
    #52
  3. maggmaster

    maggmaster Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2010
    Messages:
    1,750
    Yea I don't know about this. I have definitely driven around town to find a court without lessons or a team practice on it. I belong to an indoor club precisely so that I can kick people off when my time starts. I don't like the fact that this guy sent kids down to take a court from adults after they were already on it but I also think this whole thing should have been handled with just the coach leaving the kids out of it.
     
    #53
  4. SteveI

    SteveI Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2004
    Messages:
    5,357
    I have been on both sides of this issue. As a player looking for courts to use and I see an organzied class, I inquire with the person in charge about using free courts or when his class is done. No need to get nuts. I also run summer tennis classes that use public (High School) courts and have never had a problem explaining to players that I have these courts from time a to time B.. these days of the week. I also have to explain because of insurance reasons I can't allow them to play next to my little 5-6 year olds. Most folks get that. The only major issue I have ever had.... (of course USTA players).. trying play league matches on courts at the same time I am having High School Team practice. They try to claim the courts..and I ask them for a building use permit... I get what??? These are public courts!!! Of course they are when the High School Team is not using them. So.. it goes.. just because you think they are for public use.. you better check with the HS or the parks department before you get all worked up and make an Ahole of yourself in front of a bunch of young adults and parents.

    If I was giving a private lesson on a public court.. and players asked to use the court I would give it up as in most cases, giving private lessons on public courts is very much only allowed when there is an open court.
     
    #54
  5. gplracer

    gplracer Professional

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2004
    Messages:
    1,149
    Did you ever find out if the parks department allows this guy to reserve courts or not?
     
    #55
  6. goober

    goober Legend

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2004
    Messages:
    8,491
    Public courts are used by tennis coaches to give lessons. But this is not allowed everywhere. In my area public community courts cannot be reserved and tennis coaches cannot use them for giving private lessons. Tennis lessons are only at public tennis centers and private community courts and clubs.

    This of course doesn't stop them from trying to do so. I have had some coaches giving private lessons kicked off community courts over the years. I usually get challenged. I simply point to signs if that are usually posted "No private lessons" . If they make some BS claim they have a contract with the city. I say I know you are lying to me because I know what the laws are. I have the phone numbers of the local rec office in my cell phone. I offer to call and verify that the coach has the courts reserved and they are allowed to give private lessons on public courts. So far 100% of them leave after that.
     
    #56
  7. Say Chi Sin Lo

    Say Chi Sin Lo Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2005
    Messages:
    9,199
    Whether the courts can be used or not for coaching, one can still handle the situation with class.
     
    #57
  8. dcdoorknob

    dcdoorknob Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2010
    Messages:
    3,560
    Heh, exactly the same thing I was thinking as I was reading it. (well, except if I had typed out exactly what I was thinking, the board filters would have certainly been activated in some way. :D)
     
    #58
  9. OrangePower

    OrangePower Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2007
    Messages:
    4,059
    Location:
    NorCal Bay Area
    ^^^^^ Really it all boils down to that, doesn't it?

    Regardless of whether the OP had the right to claim the court or not, the OP isn't exactly making himself sympathetic by describing the coach in such a derogatory way. The guy's physical appearance has nothing to do with it. And neither does his coaching style.
     
    #59
  10. SteveI

    SteveI Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2004
    Messages:
    5,357
    The OP has a bit to learn about common sense and good manners. Pushing all those kids off the courts was a real class act. Guess he really wanted play tennis. The instuctor being 300 lbs had nothing to do with anything. The OP then went home and kicked his dog..
     
    #60
  11. Say Chi Sin Lo

    Say Chi Sin Lo Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2005
    Messages:
    9,199
    Then screamed "but I dont want to clean my room!" down the hallway.
     
    #61
  12. Cindysphinx

    Cindysphinx G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2006
    Messages:
    15,070
    The dog was fat. He deserved it.
     
    #62
  13. TTMR

    TTMR Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2009
    Messages:
    1,943
    As I stated, there were four courts at this facility. At the time, it appeared he and his class were only using two. When we began to set up on the most distant court, the coach intervened and claimed all of the courts were reserved and in use/to be used until 11.

    We most certainly did not prevent any children from playing tennis nor did we remove them from the courts.

    Perhaps the situation could have been handled more delicately. No doubt a sandwich would have gone a long way towards assuaging the corpulent pedagogue.
     
    #63
  14. Dave M

    Dave M Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2007
    Messages:
    1,941
    Location:
    England
    You say in the OP that he wasn't using the courts as he was gving a drill before sending the kids back out to hit again.Not sure if you have ever taught a class of children to play tennis but i t is much easier to have them all gather around one court watch what you want them to do then send them off to have a go. they were not on the court when you walked on but if you stopped to talk to someone mid match or went to the toilet would you expect to loose your court? (that is a question we don't have any park courts where i live, all must be paid for)
     
    #64
  15. usta2050

    usta2050 Rookie

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2010
    Messages:
    373
    over here, you have to post the schedule 1 week in advance too.
     
    #65
  16. bosssauce

    bosssauce Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2013
    Messages:
    355
    You should try and learn some courtesy it is part of the game:mad:
     
    #66
  17. omega4

    omega4 Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2013
    Messages:
    274
    Location:
    Atlanta GA
    Yes, I agree, but the coach DID send 2 CHILDREN onto the court where the OP staked his claim in an attempt to run interference with the OP.

    It was VERY IRRESPONSIBLE of the coach to do so. If the children had been hurt, the coach would and should have been held completely responsible for the welfare of children under his care.

    Personally, I think many are ganging up on the OP because of his demeanor in this thread and how he described the situation (mentioning the coach's weight, etc.), rather than ignoring all these pretexts and focusing on the issue at hand.
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2013
    #67
  18. floridatennisdude

    floridatennisdude Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2012
    Messages:
    1,972
    I think it's BS that 1 pro was claiming more than 1 court. A proper clinic would have a pro per court, or possibly 2 hitting on an off court and the others drilling.

    I also think that two wrongs don't make a right. And OP was very immature.

    Proper decision would probably have been to find another place to play and file a complaint with Parks and Rec afterwards. Our police have more pressing things to do than decide who gets a tennis court.
     
    #68
  19. tennis_ocd

    tennis_ocd Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2011
    Messages:
    2,002
    Can't tell who was/is right but it sounds as though the two of them deserve each other. Coach should have some paperwork to show he has courts reserved - tape it to the fence or be prepared to present when others come. If he was bluffing, good on the OP. If it turns out he really did have the courts reserved, not so good....
     
    #69
  20. tennis tom

    tennis tom Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2007
    Messages:
    2,739
    Yep, this typing exercise could have been avoided if the OP had made a simple phone call to the rec dept and asked if the kids coach had approval to use the courts. Let's see if we get closure to this thread from the OP with some facts. It's in his court, not much more to be said at this point.
     
    #70
  21. jaybear1909

    jaybear1909 Rookie

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2011
    Messages:
    354
    Location:
    Georgia
    I've ran into the same situation a few times. The coach was rather skinny though. We came out to play and saw he was coaching some children. The court adjacent to him was empty however. As we reached the fence, we saw that a sign had been posted about the reservation. So we went on our merry way.

    Second time was the same courts, except this time it was a ladies doubles match. We went to walk in after one of their points, and they were like "Um, excuse me, these are reserved..." Had to do a double take. I didn't realize rec. players could reserve courts here. Not to mention there was no sign this time. We were nice though and left. I didn't want to deal with them. Luckily for me, there's about 3 other location by my house that we can hit at.
     
    #71
  22. IA-SteveB

    IA-SteveB Professional

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2012
    Messages:
    1,053
    Location:
    Iowa
    It's a good thing you left. Those ladies might have opened a can of whoop-ass on you. ;) The OP would probably have beaten them with their own racquets and swept them in the corner because their lifeless bodies would be "in the way."
     
    #72
  23. SteveI

    SteveI Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2004
    Messages:
    5,357
    In my case when I run my summer tennis camp and use 5 courts.. there can be no adults near my players. Only members of the camp can be on the courts.. no adults other than my staff. It is for insurance reasons. Easy to see why right? When adults and other non-camp members show up and inquire about court use, I (without being a jerk) explain and tell them our reserved times. I have never had a person go crazy like the OP. If they gave me a problem.. I would just dial the Town Supervisors office and he would send a town rep to explain. The next step would (not me) to call the town police to move the folks. I have never had this come up... but other supervisors in my town have. Some common sense goes a long way.. as does good manners. I never really get into it with anyone. I stay calm.. talk nice.. and then go up the ladder to a higher level if needed.

    So.. In general.. make sure before you go nuts trying to storm a court..please inquire nicely and get your facts in order. Sometimes it appears that the person in charge is being inflexible.. when in fact her/she is just following a policy to protect his charges/ him/herself from harm. I follow all rules that are in place to keep my camp members/HS players and staff safe and from me being sued. Hope that helps.

    Try to enjoy the tennis and just chill...:)
     
    #73
  24. slowfox

    slowfox Professional

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2011
    Messages:
    1,110
    Whales like shrimp. So yeah, a shrimp salad sandwich would've been good. Yum. :)

    This coach probably needs a sandwich too.
     
    #74
  25. canuckfan

    canuckfan Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2007
    Messages:
    750
    The situation wasn't handled as well as it could have been, by either side. But it all boils down to one thing: were the courts officially reserved by that coach according to a legitimate signup system? If the courts were not reservable, then the coach is simply trying to bully other people off the court for his own benefit. In that case the OP has every right to stand up for himself and take a court. If there was a real reservation system, wouldn't that be one of the first things the coach said to the OP? If the transcript of the conversation is accurate it seems like there was no reservation and so any open court is fair game.
     
    #75
  26. Taxvictim

    Taxvictim Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2007
    Messages:
    506
    Location:
    Wake County, NC
    If the story is true, and if the Coach had no genuine reservation, then I side more with the OP than with the coach.

    By now, OP has had a chance to call Winnipeg Parks and Rec to find out if someone can reserve public courts, or if Parks and Rec has their own lesson program.

    Well?
     
    #76
  27. Say Chi Sin Lo

    Say Chi Sin Lo Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2005
    Messages:
    9,199
    To go to out of his way to find out whether or not he was in the right (or wrong)? No way, that's not in the d-bag manual.
     
    #77
  28. OrangePower

    OrangePower Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2007
    Messages:
    4,059
    Location:
    NorCal Bay Area
    If the OP really is in Winnipeg as his profile says, then this whole thread is made up and BS.

    Ever been to Winnipeg in Feb?

    http://www.winnipegweather.com/

    Not a whole lot of tennis being played on public park courts...
     
    #78
  29. Say Chi Sin Lo

    Say Chi Sin Lo Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2005
    Messages:
    9,199
    Maybe he's playing on his imaginary indoor public courts?
     
    #79
  30. OrangePower

    OrangePower Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2007
    Messages:
    4,059
    Location:
    NorCal Bay Area
    LOL, remember this is the place where "95% of the public courts in my city are unplayable; they usually have fixed "nets" made of wire mesh, fading boundary lines, potholes galore (much like the roads) and holes and openings in the back and side fences."

    But ya, the other 5% of the public courts are indoor, with heating, and with a full bar where everything is free, and the waitresses are like Hooters girls only completely topless.
     
    #80
  31. Say Chi Sin Lo

    Say Chi Sin Lo Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2005
    Messages:
    9,199
    Remember he wanted to "play the coach for the court"? I'm sure he'll beat just about anyone on his imaginary indoor public courts.
     
    #81
  32. omega4

    omega4 Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2013
    Messages:
    274
    Location:
    Atlanta GA
    Whether the OP's story is real or fictional, it served up great discussion and debate about what to do in a situation like that.
     
    #82
  33. Say Chi Sin Lo

    Say Chi Sin Lo Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2005
    Messages:
    9,199
    There is no debate, you handle it with class
     
    #83
  34. TTMR

    TTMR Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2009
    Messages:
    1,943
    Today, I called the Parks Deparment and described the incident. I had to be transferred a couple of times before reaching anyone who knew anything about tennis court rules. An older woman told me that the rules are posted at each court. I inquired about reservations and as far as she knew, she was not aware of any reservation system. When I explained that courts were supposedly reserved but not being used, she said that people usually resolve these problems on their own. She said, as far as she knew, no one had ever called the Parks Department about a dispute over courts before and that usually if the courts are full people either wait or go to other courts.

    At this point I mentioned that nearly all the courts in this city are in a state of disrepair and are not safe and/or are not playable for semi-competitive recreational players. I asked if there were any plans to commence repairs on some of these courts and she said there were no plans, as far as she knew. The city's main priorities vis-a-vis Parks and Recreation are improving community centre skating rinks, pools and basketball courts, especially in "youth at high risk" neighbourhoods. She recommended I join a club and that public courts are "mainly for kids and beginners". She said I was also welcome to book a squash court at any one of the city's community centres.

    When did I ever say I 'challenged the coach for the court'? You may feel derisive towards my character, but please do not resort to outright fabrication. Thanks.
     
    #84
  35. IA-SteveB

    IA-SteveB Professional

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2012
    Messages:
    1,053
    Location:
    Iowa
    Did you ask the lady on the phone if she was overweight?
     
    #85
  36. OrangePower

    OrangePower Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2007
    Messages:
    4,059
    Location:
    NorCal Bay Area
    Do you actually live in Winnipeg? Can you tell us which courts we're talking about here? Do you often play in sub-zero temps?
     
    #86
  37. Hi I'm Ray

    Hi I'm Ray Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2010
    Messages:
    1,504
    One of the very few times I agree with SCSL.

    It could be just another one of the OP's made up troll threads, but I do agree with the above quote.
     
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2013
    #87
  38. omega4

    omega4 Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2013
    Messages:
    274
    Location:
    Atlanta GA
    There's always debate. People don't always agree on what to do nor should they.

    Who are you or I to define what constitutes "class"?

    There you have it: debate.
     
    #88
  39. Say Chi Sin Lo

    Say Chi Sin Lo Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2005
    Messages:
    9,199
    My definition of class is: whatever the action one carries out, it should leave a lasting positive image/feeling of the person.
     
    #89
  40. omega4

    omega4 Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2013
    Messages:
    274
    Location:
    Atlanta GA
    And how do you define "lasting positive image/feeling of the person"?

    I think your definition might differ from others (e.g. a racists).

    Based on your definition of class, a racist would say that those who act in a racially discriminatory manner are acting with "class".

    More debate.

    Sorry but it's a pet peeve of mine when I hear that "there is no debate" in dilemmas such as the OP stated in this thread. I think it intones that there is only ONE correct way to see things or to do something. It's a belief that I don't subscribe to.
     
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2013
    #90
  41. comeback

    comeback Professional

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2010
    Messages:
    1,184
    I am a teaching pro and i've had similar circumstances..If i have 4 or more kids and no one is on the court next to me , i try to spread out to another court. BUT if any adults come to play, i will pull my kids back to one court and let the adults play..Most coaches have plan B ie: drills or exercises kids can do on the side or pick up balls etc...As an ambassador for tennis i want everyone to play and get along..But i would take control as the other coach should have
     
    #91
  42. Joeyg

    Joeyg Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2004
    Messages:
    748
    Location:
    Sarcasm, USA
    In almost every municipality it is illegal for a "coach" to use a public court to run a private enterprise. Where I live, you need to be a contractor with the city (business license, insurance, etc) in order to teach on public courts.

    This is actually quite a problem where I live. There are several "coaches" that use courts for their personal gain and then try and tell the public that they have the courts "reserved".
     
    #92
  43. floridatennisdude

    floridatennisdude Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2012
    Messages:
    1,972
    Say Chi: 1

    Omega4: 0
     
    #93
  44. spot

    spot Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2005
    Messages:
    2,438
    Location:
    Atlanta
    Just because you might want to argue that a cat has 5 legs because you consider the tail to be an extra leg doesn't mean there is a debate. It simply means that you are using the term wrong.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2013
    #94
  45. omega4

    omega4 Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2013
    Messages:
    274
    Location:
    Atlanta GA
    I completely agree when it comes to "simple" definitions like a tail vs. a leg.

    But when it comes to a situation as the OP described, where both parties might be in the wrong (and the right), things are rarely that simple.

    Just because you may think your solution is the "right" one does NOT mean that it necessarily is, despite your insistence that "there is no debate".
     
    #95
  46. Taxvictim

    Taxvictim Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2007
    Messages:
    506
    Location:
    Wake County, NC
    Then I think you handled the situation alright, and were okay to start playing on the empty court. I'm actually kind of surprised by how many people disagree with what you did.
     
    #96
  47. spot

    spot Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2005
    Messages:
    2,438
    Location:
    Atlanta
    I think its more that people think he is a total D-bag.
     
    #97
  48. tennis_ocd

    tennis_ocd Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2011
    Messages:
    2,002
    Even without reservations, coach could break up the drill when he sees another arrive.... Rotate three kids on three courts practicing serves while doing drills on the fourth. ;)
     
    #98
  49. Cindysphinx

    Cindysphinx G.O.A.T.

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2006
    Messages:
    15,070
    Yes, true.

    Next time, there are a few things OP could do that would be more productive.

    Ask the guy his name. If he gives it, great. If not, it makes him look bad.

    Go outside the fence, whip out your cell phone and take pics of him coaching. Get some close-ups, get some of the kids, get some of the signage to establish location. This might enrage him, but he can't do anything about it on account of all those witnesses, erm, I mean kids.

    Then if you need to file a complaint, you are all set.

    Much better than making snide remarks about the guy's technique or weight . . . .
     
    #99
  50. stapletonj

    stapletonj Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2009
    Messages:
    457
    Location:
    Lavalette, WV
    Confront, but in a very factual way.

    whip out your own cell phone, call parks and rec right then, right there, telling him, "if they confirm your reservation, I will apologize in front of your kids and vacate right away, if not, I'm goign to play tennis on this court."

    If parks and rec doesn't answer, then ask to see the receipt where he paid for the reservation. Ask to see his insurance proof so the city would have allowed him to do this activity only if he was insured. Ask to see his business permit. Ask to see his USPTA certification. Ask where he played collegiately and what was his record that qualifies him to teach anybody at all.



    Watch him blubber and stand your ground in front of the kids if he produces none of these. There were 4 courts. You wanted one. He can make do with three.

    Is OP a troll? I dunno. don't really care. kinda like class in law school where hypotheticals are debated.
     

Share This Page