Going Full Time at Tennis

Discussion in 'Adult League & Tournament Talk' started by Moz, Jan 23, 2008.

  1. BounceHitBounceHit

    BounceHitBounceHit Legend

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    Hey Pal,

    How's the 'bow? Haven't heard from you in a while. Would love to say 'hello' in person, even if you aren't ready to hit again.

    Best,

    BHBH
     
  2. Sup2Dresq

    Sup2Dresq Hall of Fame

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    Hey Moz!!!!

    Is this your long lost brother?

    I saw this pic and did a double take.. well before the full tattoo face after picture.

    [​IMG]
     
  3. Moz

    Moz Hall of Fame

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    And to think that some claim that prison doesn't rehabilitate!
     
  4. Moz

    Moz Hall of Fame

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    Quick update. Ran an open 1500m tonight after a few days off with a knee injury.

    Ran a 4:14.10 (equiv to 4:32 mile) after going off a bit too conservatively. Fairly pleased with that as I haven't even started on VO2max or anaerobic training yet.
     
  5. Devilito

    Devilito Hall of Fame

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    great thread and read. Very motivational. Wish we could get it back on track to tennis though :)
     
  6. Moz

    Moz Hall of Fame

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    Ha ha, don't tell me, tell my elbow.
     
  7. BounceHitBounceHit

    BounceHitBounceHit Legend

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    Sorry to hear the elbow is still not right. If you can rehab it, will you return to tennis? Best wishes for a full recovery AND for success in your latest pursuits! :) BHBH
     
  8. Moz

    Moz Hall of Fame

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    Thanks very much. If it ever gets better I'll consider playing again, but I have no idea how seriously.
     
  9. BounceHitBounceHit

    BounceHitBounceHit Legend

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    Absolutely. I wish I had found your thread earlier. Good fun! BHBH
     
  10. Moz

    Moz Hall of Fame

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    Ran the British Nationals Vets Track Championships this weekend. The field sizes were farcical and I thought over 35s tennis was low profile!

    Anyway, I had a disaster in the 1500m on saturday. Struggled throughout and took the foot of the gas in the last lap and finished in 4:29 - 15 seconds slower than last month!

    Sunday was better - I ran the 800m in 2:00.70 despite a slow first lap (61+ seconds).

    I now start my Vo2 max phase and will start with the anaerobic work so should be getting much quicker - in theory.
     
  11. J011yroger

    J011yroger G.O.A.T.

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    Hey Moz,

    This may seem like an odd question (don't get nervous) but I was never a good enough (fast enough, serious enough, or competitive enough) runner to find out.

    Can you compare the camraderie differences and interactions between the competitive runners and competitive tennis players?

    I when I ran for a school team, it was just like any other school team. But with adult competitive tennis it seems like a very small world, where everybody knows everybody, and people hang out together and BS with each other. Everybody hangs out and trains at the same places, or knows who works at which club and so forth.

    Is it similar with runners or do they basically do their own thing while training and just see each other for the events, or is it more like tennis?

    Does each sport have the same wide cast of characters?

    Just interested in your view of the different personalities of each sport, and how they get along (or don't).

    I figure you have been serious enough about both, and traveled and done enough of both to be the guy to ask.

    Just curious, thanks.

    J
     
  12. Moz

    Moz Hall of Fame

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    Interesting question actually.

    If you play open tournaments I don’t find people particularly friendly as a general rule. It may be that my opponents are usually half my age, or that they are young, but they tend to keep to themselves. When you’re waiting to go on it’s more furtive glances and checking out the competition. Personally I don’t want to make friends with my opponents before or during a match. It’s not that common to see the same people at the same time because of the differing match times and many players don’t hang about at the venue all day. e.g. in a two match a day event I warm-up, play, cool down, shower, eat, warm-up, play etc. Veterans play is a bit different as you see the same faces and as most are mature adults they are able to separate the rivalry on court with the social side off court.

    Let’s face it – youngsters trying to make it in the sport aren’t there to make friends and they have so much at stake on each result in the UK because of the way the NTRP system works that it’s all dead serious.

    I have also found there is very little chat about the nuts and bolts of training, zero talk about equipment (that just happens on this forum, not in real life) and any chat is social and talking about tournament gossip (defaults, etc).

    The fundamental difference between runners and tennis players is that tennis players are competing against each other whereas, in the vast majority of cases, runners are competing against the clock, even in the same race.

    Runners are generally more friendly, more encouraging, are genuinely pleased when you do well in the same race against them and are very open about injury, training etc. I honestly think runners are well balanced and tend to be more humble than tennis players. Let’s face it – most competitive tennis players can be real jerks – unless their on your team. In which case you accept their jerkiness and have a few beers with them because they are alright off court and you don’t have to deal with them on court.

    Runners have their idiosyncracies – I always train alone and don’t like to be talked to during runs. Others love the camaraderie of group runs. But this can be separate and you can still maintain a good group situation by participating in other things and on race day.

    You get weirdos in both sports, but the nature of tennis means that you have to interact with the weirdos and deal with them, in running you don’t.


    The single biggest observable difference between the two sports is the way people train. In running people tend to be open to ideas and will change training to achieve improvement. They are also willing “to do what it takes” and understand that there is a direct correlation between work put in and success.

    Tennis players generally train like idiots. Repeating the same mistakes, never focusing on the important things (the boring things like fitness, footwork and consistency), not practicing effectively, only playing sets, never drilling.

    There’s a lot of bullcrap in tennis. In running you have your times which define your level of achievement exactly – tennis isn’t like that so you get a lot more dreamers. Nothing like the hard reality of the clock to put you in your place! For me, it’s been a relief.
     
  13. J011yroger

    J011yroger G.O.A.T.

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    Great responce, thanks for putting the time and thought into it.

    Surprised to hear that players are so standoffish in the UK. Did you find that it was different when you were playing leagues/tourneys in the states?

    Because here in NY, all the guys basically hang out together and is willing to BS about whatever before and after matches. And we go out to movies, or for beers and food after practices.

    There are a some guys who are more loners, and some jackasses that nobody talks to, but for the most part they are the minority.

    While here the women act more like you describe, show up, play, go home.

    J
     
  14. Moz

    Moz Hall of Fame

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    Depends what you mean. In the US our team was very sociable; before, after and during. Didn't socialise with the other teams much although it wasn't unheard of.

    In the UK our league stuff is nearly all doubles, you represent your physical club and it's traditional for the home team to provide feed afterwards. Perfectly sociable.

    I assumed you meant tournaments. In the UK this usually means juniors or high ranked players in their late teens. In the UK your rating (NTRP) is everything - it enables you to get into restricted tournaments, determines your seeding, can determine your LTA funding and your access to academy squads. Ratings are calculated for singles only and every win and loss goes into the formula to decide the change of your rating. There is no such thing as an inconsequential loss.

    This is unlike the US where the best (and most tournament) players couldn't care less about their NTRP rating and you have the ridiculous situation where your doubles results count towards a rating used for singles. The lack of visibility on NTRP (and lack of importance) means that overall there is less at stake in a result. I think perhaps changes the attitude a bit.

    Either that or I don't have an approachable demeanour and I'm often old enough to be their father. If I lose I'm out of there - if I win I'm preparing for the next round. You also have to travel a lot for singles tournaments so there's no such thing as a pool of local regulars.

    What is your experience from? It sounds like you're describing the camaraderie of hitting partners?

    That's different of course as most tennis is club based here with a fairly close-knit community within it. Your team is fellow club members. I also found US clubs a bit more commercialised and transient.
     
  15. J011yroger

    J011yroger G.O.A.T.

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    That makes sense.

    I was talking about tournament players, and training partners as a whole.

    But with tournament players I bs before during after. Collect e-mails and phone numbers of people I play and meet to practice, or set up dubs.

    When you really look at it, the people who play Opens here are.

    1. Has beens.
    2. Never weres.
    3. Also Rans.
    4. Not Yets.
    5. On break from school.

    The Has been/Never were/Also ran crew is basically out to have some fun and avoid doing yard work.

    The not yets are 16-18yo kids looking for more matchplay experience, but they don't care about their open ranking, only their 16's or 18's rankings.

    And the on break from school are just looking to play when not at school doing their main thing.

    I consider myself a "Never Was" who is trying to transition himself into an "Also Ran" in the hopes of some day being a "Has Been" before it is too late.

    J
     
  16. J011yroger

    J011yroger G.O.A.T.

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    I would probably be a lot more serious about matchplay if I was under the UK system.

    But I would probably enjoy it a lot less.

    J
     
  17. jrod

    jrod Hall of Fame

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    training?

    I tend to agree, at least from what I've seen of the local juniors. Why is this? Is attending an academy the only place where one can learn to train properly?
     
  18. Moz

    Moz Hall of Fame

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    Some of this would probably be explained by both the different systems and our different mentalities! If I play someone and we are from the same area I might arrange some further hitting if I have sufficient respect for their game and them as a person.

    But as most tournaments are at least 80 miles away the pool of convenient hitting partners is pretty dry.

    We have rankings here also but the ratings are where the rubber meets the road.

    Btw - I don't disagree with your description of the open "types" but I totally disagree with your interpretation of their motivations. In the past I think we have established that we don't necessarily agree in this area!

    Quite possibly. But how do you get an objective measure of your progress at tennis without an accurate playing standard barometer?

    IMO the method of teaching is where it starts, because the teaching has to overcome players' natural tendencies.

    Just take a look at the scorn poured on pushers everywhere. They are doing what is necessary to win at tennis - getting the ball in last on every point. Judging by peoples' attitudes to them you'd think they were cheating.

    Tennis is not about hitting hard, it's not about hitting winners - it's about consistency, repeatable technique under duress (fitness), using the %'s and every now and again pressing the explode button.

    Juniors don't want to hear that a low backhand slice hit deep 20 times in a point will win it every time, when they can win a 3rd of the points by hitting a topspin winner. They'll lose the match in the latter but they'll die like a hero.

    IMO coaching doesn't emphasise enough what it takes to win, partly because it's not glamorous, partly because it's not perceived as "fun" and also because it's bloody hard work.

    What's best for your tennis game?:

    1) 15 mins warm-up, 15 minutes of footwork drills, 30 minutes of quality drilling, 15 minutes of serving target practice, 30 minutes of matchplay drills or a set, 15 minutes of cool down.

    or

    2) 2 hours of playing sets.

    Obviously the former, most prefer the latter. Drilling is very intensive mentally and physically - it's bloody hard work. Footwork drills not hitting the ball isn't good fun - just damn hard work.

    How many players out there have assessed their game on paper and come up with a comprehensive short, medium and long term plan for developing their game - with workouts and training sessions scheduled appropriately. How many people take ownership of the development of their game?

    How many players are getting coaching and you don't know what they are doing at their next session or leave the session and the coach hasn't given them homework? How many people schedule the next lesson without scheduling anything in between to develop the themes of the last lesson?

    Again it's being willing to do whatever it takes, having like minded people around you and the right sort of person planning and overlooking your training.

    That's what I reckon anyway?!!! What do you think?

    Incidentally, I suspect this is where the Spanish way of teaching is much stronger although that is purely conjecture.

    (and I've made all of the above mistakes by the way, apart from getting carried away with hitting winners and hitting hard strangely enough)
     
  19. Moz

    Moz Hall of Fame

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    jrod - sorry, that post wasn't meant to be directed AT you! Just a stream of consciousness on the topic you raised!!!
     
  20. jrod

    jrod Hall of Fame

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    Actually, it should be directed at everyone here, including me! I have to agree with everyhing you've stated. Good coaching and decent summer tennis programs for the juniors are few and far between. Nike tennis camp is a joke, for the most part. No focus.

    The training at my age (52) is less intense, but I try to focus. I usually have 3 focused drill sessions a week, 1-1.5 hours each doing much of what you outlined in step 1. The other 2-3 times consists of match play, singles and doubles. I also crosstrain 3 times a week with focus on core, flexibility, balance footwork. I am about to start yoga as well, to aid in focus, and flexibility.

    Moz- Do you employ yoga in any of your workouts? I've heard great things about the value it can bring to ones game.
     
  21. rfprse

    rfprse Professional

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    Moz,
    What kind of footwork drills do/did you do?
    It would be great if you could give some details of them.
    Thanks.
     
  22. Moz

    Moz Hall of Fame

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    Sounds like a good plan - shame it's easier to work these things out when we are getting a bit ripe age-wise!

    I have done the odd yoga session in the past, but don't particularly enjoy them. Not a good excuse of course, I do a lot of post workout stretching. I have no doubt they are very good for tennis.

    I cobbled together a program based on some on the tennisone website, a Jez Green movement dvd and some I made up. So a full footwork sessions would be:

    1) Warm-up - run, dynamic flexibility drills
    2) Etcheberry first step drill - open stance (3 * 8 each side with 20 seconds recovery).
    3) Etcheberry first step drill - neutral stance (3 * 8 each side with 20 seconds recovery).
    4) Jez Green first step and balance steps drill. (3 * 8 each side with 20 seconds recovery).
    5) Baseline netural groundstrokes drill, focusing on split step, first step and aggressive side step recovery. (3 * 6 each side with 20 seconds recovery).
    6) Baseline open groundstrokes drill, focusing on split step, first step, crossover step and aggressive side step recovery. (3 * 6 each side with 20 seconds recovery).
    7) 4 point groundstrokes drill. 4 cones in a large square around the centre hash mark. Short netural forehand, deep open forehand, deep open backhand, short neutral backhand. (4 circuits per set)*3 sets with 20 seconds recovery)
    8) 2 volley, smash drill. Fh volley, recover, backhand recovery then jab step and corssovers back for smash (4 circuits per set)*3 sets with 20 seconds recovery)
    9) Combination drill - I make this up - stringing together different shots with correct footwork. e.g. serve w / aggressive recovery, deep backhand, baseline forehand short forehand, backhand volley, smash, repeat.

    It's hard to communicate each drill via this format. If you want any more explanation let me know. Once you get the principles under control you can create your own drills.

    Do you split step correctly? This is where everything starts. Whenever you practice or play try and ensure you recover aggressively in your footwork. Unless you're extremely fit your legs should be tired after playing.
     
  23. J011yroger

    J011yroger G.O.A.T.

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    Curious, what gives out in your legs.

    Lately I find that my quads are the first thing to throw up the white flag.

    Also, did you drink protein shakes after playing?

    J
     
  24. Moz

    Moz Hall of Fame

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    I don't drink protein shakes, I try and eat a protein / carb combination within 30 minutes of a match finishing.

    Weirdly I notice fatigue in my feet before anything else. It's conceivable that this is because I don't bend my knees as much as I would like because my knees hurt so much. The day after my glutes are often a bit sore though - that's the crap thing about getting old, the recovery.
     
  25. J011yroger

    J011yroger G.O.A.T.

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    I am getting there, but not without a fight. I am going down kicking and screaming.

    J
     
  26. rfprse

    rfprse Professional

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    Thanks, Moz. I'll try those (assuming that I can figure them out).

    I tried to search Etcheberry's and Green's drills, but got a few questions.
    About Etcheberry's first step drills, do you take 3 steps for a stroke (e.g., in case of a right-handed open stance forehand, right, left, right) or just one first step for the stroke?
    About Green's, what's meant by "balance step(s)"?
    What do you think are the principles to keep in mind for those drills (and footwork in general)?

    I think I do split steps but never felt like those are as effective as I would like them to be.
    Any tips on the correct way of doing them would be appreciated.

    I agree with your emphasis on the aggressive recovery, which seems to give more time than I thought before I actually paid attention to it. (But too tiring.... I need shortcuts.:))

    Thanks.
     
  27. Moz

    Moz Hall of Fame

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    Regarding the split step, my take is:
    1) Split step at opponents contact
    2) Land first on the leg opposite to the direction of the ball
    3) When landing on the second foot the foot points outwards towards the direction you will be travelling - this opens your hips.

    Watch this video with etcheberry, this is essentially what he's doing:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zbzmme6A8gQ

    You always open your hips by pointing the closest foot to where you will be contacting the ball. Therefore if you have to go deep to hit a ball, your split step will open your hips at an angle towards the back fence.

    His first step drills:

    For forehand, land on left leg, open up right foot and land, do low swing over cone, push up into a split step for the backhand which entails landing on your right foot and opening out your left foot and then swinging. Essentially 2 footfalls for each stroke. Sorry - this is difficult to explain using words and I'm knackered!

    The green drill question. Put a ball can diagonally on to the court about 5 yards from the T on the forehand and backhand side. Split step in the direction of the can, drive with your first step and then go round the cone facing forwards with as many tiny, quick steps as possible and repeat. This means you will patter step forwards, to the right and backwards while circumnavigating the can.

    General Principles:

    1. The lower you are the quicker you can move around the court in a balanced fashion.
    2. To stay low your legs must be bent - while moving you never want to be at full height.
    3. Have a clear picture in your mind how you will move to each area of the court. E.g. for a wide open stance forehand my first recovery step will be a crossover step and then side step. On low approaches I always hit a neutral stance shot etc, etc.
    4. Good footwork is a habit, but habits require repetition and practice.
    5. Your footwork has to be aggressive and powerful - but this is tiring.
    6. It's possible you will get more tired than your opponents at first - but this is because you are moving better. You may lost the battle but eventually you will win the war!!!

    ...and sorry, there are no shortcuts!!! :)

    I keep saying I will put all these drills onto a youtube video. You never know....
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2009
  28. Moz

    Moz Hall of Fame

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    Update

    I've been prescribed some inhalers as I have asthma. I can think of a few matches in the heat where that might have helped!

    Off to see the surgeon about my hand next month and I'll ask him about the elbow.

    I am really missing playing singles - the coaching I'm doing is making it worse!!! I didn't think I'd be bothered...
     
  29. Topaz

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    Sometimes it is when something is taken away, that we realize how much we value it. I know that sounds corny, but you know what I'm getting at.

    Good luck with the surgeon...I hope he comes up with some kind of treatment plan. Barring that, you could always play lefthanded and switch to a OHBH, right? :)
     
  30. rfprse

    rfprse Professional

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    Thanks a lot, Moz. I hope there will be good news from the surgeon.

    No, I think I got what you were trying to say. Your explanation was clear enough.
    You should do this.
     
  31. Moz

    Moz Hall of Fame

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    Very true! I hope the surgeon offers to take the damn thing out.

    Cheers
     
  32. Moz

    Moz Hall of Fame

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    By the way. As of last night I am now my county (UK equivalent of state) mile champion (open category).

    Won the race in 4:34.5. Not too happy with the time but it was windy and I slotted in behind and focused on the win.
     
  33. Moz

    Moz Hall of Fame

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    Since the last post I have run a 400m in 52.0 and tonight a 200m in 24.0. Feel as though the speed is coming back and I am recovering better. Good job as I'm 37 in december - where did the years all go??!!

    On the tennis front the elbow is worse than ever. Although I can't serve my forehand is better than ever and somehow, through not playing and doing some coaching, I seem to have improved. I have a new appreciation of what I have to do to become a much better player and have started doing it.

    So, now I'm getting frustrated and want to get back into it again. I will have to do some serious rest / rehab over winter and maybe try one of these blood injections.
     
  34. Topaz

    Topaz Legend

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    ^^^Did you have the appointment with surgeon yet? If so, did they have anything useful to say regarding the elbow?
     
  35. Moz

    Moz Hall of Fame

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    Ah yes. He is a hand specialist and hasn't done any of the elbow surgery. However he did say it is quite a controversial topic and seems to have a low success rate for golfers elbow which you wouldn't realise from reading the literature. It was left as: "check with an expert" but with the suggestion it's a bad idea.

    I will be having surgery on my left hand in the next 3 months which will be a good time to practice my slice I suppose...
     
  36. Moz

    Moz Hall of Fame

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    My running season is nearly over and ran a 1:57.12 800m, good enough for a ranking of 6th in the UK for over 35's.

    I entered my club tournament and won my first round. My elbow has been burning for 4 days afterwards!
     
  37. Topaz

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    ^^^I would suggest playing left handed entirely, if it weren't for the fact that it is getting mangled soon itself.

    Great job on the running. I actually had a bunch of running questions for you that popped into my head on my last couple of runs, but I can never seem to remember them afterward. Senility I guess!
     
  38. Xisbum

    Xisbum Semi-Pro

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    Ha. You are still a young man, with your best days in front of you.

    You need to embrace that thought, because those best days that are behind you? Just like that great shot you hit to win a tournament, they are gone forever.

    Like your plan of keeping other parts of your body in tip-top shape while your tennis-related joints and parts recuperate. If you're lucky, you'll reach my advanced age one day - and still be wondering where the years went. There will just be more of them to remember, or not. :)
     
  39. Moz

    Moz Hall of Fame

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    Bump!

    Just started playing again - how's everyone's tennis going?
     
  40. maggmaster

    maggmaster Hall of Fame

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    Ha I have read through your whole blog twice, very inspirational and well written. Glad to see you back. Are you going back to playing tournaments?
     
  41. forthegame

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    Wow! I first read bits of this thread and your blog a wee while ago before joining the forum.

    I thought it was all over for you tennis wise, how have you fared? Did the rest and rehab (+/- surgery) get you fit to play again or are you just playing casually.
     
  42. Moz

    Moz Hall of Fame

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    Thanks maggmaster, nice of you to say so.

    forthegame - just started playing casually, but I must admit I have thought about taking it a bit more seriously. It's really nice to be able to serve without the agony!

    Unfortunately I've had ME for the past year or so, meaning I've not been able to do a lot of anything.
     
  43. Topaz

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    Moz! So your arm didn't fall off then? Good to hear!
     
  44. Topaz

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    Messages:
    6,782
    ME???

    I should know what that means, but I don't.
     
  45. Moz

    Moz Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2007
    Messages:
    2,761
    Location:
    Mallorca.
    It's still attached.

    ME = myalgic encephalomyelitis
     
  46. Dags

    Dags Professional

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2008
    Messages:
    920
    Do you still have the RAB? I slapped a Wise electronic tension head on mine, though mainly because I'm a tart than because I needed it.

    If you're still playing with multis because of the arm, my favourite that has come out in the past few years is Mantis Comfort Synthetic. I'm a big fan of their balls too, and they're based in the UK so it's pretty easy to get hold of their stuff.
     
  47. Setmatch45

    Setmatch45 Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2007
    Messages:
    271
    Good Luck! You're living what I would like to be doing. I was a pro jock many years ago (not tennis) and started playing tennis 5 yrs. ago I would love to give it much more time than I do get in shape and see where I can take it but life is not being that nice to me on this one.
     
  48. Moz

    Moz Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2007
    Messages:
    2,761
    Location:
    Mallorca.
    Dags - yes, still got it. I'll try some of that string, although still got a couple of reels of Gosen to get through that I use with a signum pro co-poly.

    Cheers setmatch.
     
  49. forthegame

    forthegame Hall of Fame

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2009
    Messages:
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    Location:
    Intercontinental
    Moz,
    Sorry to hear about the ME.
    You've got fight as this thread shows.
    Chin up.
    FTG
     
  50. nickynu

    nickynu Semi-Pro

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2007
    Messages:
    767
    Moz good to see you have swung aracket again in anger mate. Used to love the old man on tour blog and miss it.

    I had a pal who was diagnosed with ME, 7or 8 years ago, its ****, and for about two and a half years he couldnt do anything much. They also called it chronic fatigue syndrome and said it might have come from glandular fever. They caught everything else going and was even sent to have CBT. They also were suseptible to every disease/cold/infection going. This went on and on and despite several false starts they didnt really recover although they managed it better as time went on.

    Anyway because they got tonsillitis all the time they went to the docs/specialists who said it was a consequence of a weakened immune system from ME and not to worry, perfectly understandable, happens all the time apparently.

    Anyway a couple more bouts and they were fed up and went back to the docs and asked they to remove the tonsils. Doc refused, said didnt do it in adults now, but his tonsils were sort of pitted and undulating permanently so he pestered the doc who after a lot of hassle sent him back to a different specialist who agreed to whip em out. Anyway after two or three weeks of agony from the operation (apparently a tonsilectomy much more painful when your an adult), the pain went from the op.

    The weird thing though was that not only were the tonsils gone, but he realised that he was practically 100% better from the ME. Instantly

    It turned out that the knackered tonsils had been the cause of the illness NOT the other way round. They were without him knowing it slowly poisoning him from the inside, no wonder he felt permanently ill and tired, and this despite countless checks for everything under the sun for a cause and batteries of tests of a couple of years where they couldnt find anything that was causing the fatigue and other symptoms .

    Anyway it may have no relevance, but I just wanted to pass it on as he was literally like a new person overnight after a few years of zombiefication as soon as he had had the tonsils out, so if youve already had yours out apologies for duff info, but if not and you have had bouts of tonsillitis or yours are in any way swollen, mis-shapen, or pitted, could be worth a think about. I have no scientific evidence to back this up though mate, but the rapidity of the recovery from years of illness was unbelievable and he has been fine for about 5 years since. Just a thought
     
    Last edited: Aug 31, 2012

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