Hanging from bar for shoulder health

Discussion in 'Health & Fitness' started by WildVolley, Nov 4, 2013.

  1. Chas Tennis

    Chas Tennis Hall of Fame

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    For the shoulder orientation recommended in the Ellenbecker video, there is a strong case for it being a safe technique for serving -

    1) Ellenbecker video recommends and Ellenbecker is a qualified researcher with a long record of publications.

    2) The ATP pro servers tend to use the recommended shoulder orientation as can be seen by everyone in high speed videos. Most have a small angle, some a little more and none have the shoulders level and upper arm up. See high speed videos at impact viewed from behind.

    3) The recommended shoulder orientation for the serve makes sense regarding the descriptions of what causes impingement. It does not squeeze the humerus against the acromion.

    I tried to work through the forces on the hanging arm and shoulder earlier. The forces are definitely very different between hanging and serving. Does the scapula turn up enough when hanging to make hanging similar to serving? Hanging from two arms, the trunk can't tilt the shoulders as in the serve. With one arm? It does not appear from the videos and descriptions on the Kirsh website that impingement is avoided in hanging. ? One hand or two?

    The videos talk about pressing against, bending and remodeling the Acromion. See Arm Raising Animation and Acromion Bending Animation.
    http://www.kirschshoulder.com/Kirsch_Shoulder/Shoulder_Imaging/Shoulder_Imaging.html

    Does anything on the Kirsh site talk about hanging by one arm and rotating as Posture Guy does?

    Why is pressing the Acromion while rotating OK? Maybe it is not pressed hanging by one arm. ?

    Also, some of you guys have shoulder injuries and some are undiagnosed injuries. Injuries always bring in unknowns for exercises.

    Hanging by a bar seems to be doing some good for some of the posters. Interesting issue.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2013
    #51
  2. beernutz

    beernutz Hall of Fame

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    This post is worthless without pictures.
     
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  3. WildVolley

    WildVolley Legend

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    I suggest relaxing the shoulder entirely if you can do so without pain. Though I believe that you can also get benefit with the shoulder muscles activated. The difference would be one between a passive and active stretch. They are going to be similar in results though target the area slightly differently.

    I found that I was getting benefit to my shoulder from doing pull-ups even though I was hesitant to relax the muscles or drop into a full dead hang. That was what led me to experiment with the full dead hang, after I read about it online. I was worried that it would damage my shoulder but found I could adopt the position without pain and it seemed to do good things for my shoulder. I side-sleep and found that the shoulder pain at night was basically eliminated after doing the hanging.
     
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  4. Chas Tennis

    Chas Tennis Hall of Fame

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    Night pain, ischemia?

    I tore my non-tennis rotator cuff some years ago, mild tears supraspinatus. I would get night pain, an ache. Two Drs did not have any answer. The physical therapist said that perhaps it was ischemia, pain from lack of blood flow. I believe that he was correct, because no matter how I moved around to get comfortable in bed, the pain continued. But if I got up and walked around, moving my shoulder, the pain would go away in a few minutes.

    Next time that you have night pains get up and move around to see if it has any effect.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2013
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  5. WildVolley

    WildVolley Legend

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    I'll definitely try that. I normally just flip to the other side and massage the shoulder a little bit and the ache diminishes.

    The shoulder exercises have made a difference with respect to my overall shoulder health, but it has been a long recovery with some setbacks when playing a lot.
     
    #55
  6. Chas Tennis

    Chas Tennis Hall of Fame

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    Blackburn Exercises

    Search internet: blackburn exercises

    These exercises, with very light 2-3 lb dumbbells, work on shoulder posture. For example, they tighten and strengthen the rhomboids to pull the scapulas back and in. Hold 6 seconds and tighten rhomboids. These make my shoulders feel good.

    I don't believe in exercises or stretches when injured, tennis included. And you should have a diagnosis from a Dr.
     
    #56
  7. Posture Guy

    Posture Guy Professional

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    Chas....thanks for the reference to Blackburn exercises. I wasn't familiar with them by that name, but we have something very similar in our library that we called the Table Sequence.

    I searched for them and found a nice PDF from an ortho that in one doc shows a number of stretches, the Blackburn exercises, and then the Thrower's 10. Thought I'd pass it on for reference:

    http://www.ioshospital.com/orthopae...bility/nonoperativeThrowersRehabilitation.pdf
     
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  8. Chas Tennis

    Chas Tennis Hall of Fame

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    Posture Guy, Great reference, thanks.

    A physical therapist examined my shoulder posture. He then picked some of the Blackburn exercises. I did them with very light weights. If you do these exercises with a 6 second hold for 20 reps you will respect 2 lb pink dumbbells a lot more. The physical therapist said that baseball pitchers often have injuries because their scapulas are not properly positioned.

    I have felt that my shoulders should be back more and still that is a issue. I do the one Blackburn exercise regularly at this time but usually I have done them only occasionally after the 2006 rotator cuff injury.

    You will find this excerpt from a 1906 book titled Muscular Activity to be very interesting. I think that many of the common posture issues are clearly discussed, maybe more clearly discussed.
    http://www.exrx.net/ExInfo/History/Prescription.html#anchor978409

    The full 1906 book is also included.
    http://www.exrx.net/ExInfo/1906ExRx.html

    Another reference illustrating posture issues well, from a person with neck pain. Double check the advice but the coverage of common posture issues looks excellent.
    http://fixtheneck.com/posture.html
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2013
    #58
  9. RogueFLIP

    RogueFLIP Semi-Pro

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    With the hanging there's a DISTRACTION component of the joint that can aid in impingement symptoms.

    You can vary angles and planes of "hangs" so to speak. It doesn't always have to be at 180 degrees of shoulder flexion.

    IE holding onto a bannister with your shoulder in adduction (across your chest) and leaning sideways can open up the posterior shoulder.

    Again the key is relaxing the shoulder as much as possible, allowing areas to soften.

    As for the hanging with straps, I've just used like belt straps from like cable columns. For myself, it was more comfortable around the meaty part of my forearm just below the elbow. Hanging by my wrists was very uncomfortable and I couldn't hold the stretch long enough to get any benefit.

    Also, I could do them on children's jungle gyms hanging because then I could kneel and the straps wouldn't slip as much.
     
    #59
  10. comeback

    comeback Professional

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    i/ve been "hanging" recently and am getting a good stretch in my lower back too. Do you guys think "hanging" elongates your whole spine to prevent getting shorter as one gets older? or at least prevent the dreaded hunched over syndrome?
     
    #60
  11. RogueFLIP

    RogueFLIP Semi-Pro

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    While hanging can decompress the spine to a certain extent, I'm not sure if it'll prevent you from getting shorter as you age.

    And the "hunched over syndrome" starts along the anterior chain, so you'll need to incorporate things to address that...."hanging" alone won't do that IMO.
     
    #61
  12. Posture Guy

    Posture Guy Professional

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    what RF said.
     
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  13. SystemicAnomaly

    SystemicAnomaly G.O.A.T.

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    Just saw this. Thanks for the great feedback.
     
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